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IceKing
31st December 2005, 6:54 PM
Where do you guys to post fanfiction the best? I personally like to post my fanfictions here in Serebii the best because Serebii is always active, has a good deal of authors that can write well, has good reviewers, and an overall active community where you fic will be bumped to the second page within a day unlike in most forums where it remains on page one for a few weeks with no new posts. Although Serebii has a lot of n00b fics coming in lately, the mods and users are good at slaying them whereas the infect other places. I tried fanfiction.net out, but I didn't like their upload system and it wasn't really a community like most forums are. As for teh other forums, they flat out tend to be not as active as Serebii. What about you guys? Where do you like to post your fanfictions the most?

Eternal Daydreamer
31st December 2005, 6:56 PM
I only post fics at Seribii. I just like posting here, although it's currently going through a "Dark Age" of noob fics. But we settle that out fairly quickly.

xXSaberXx
31st December 2005, 6:57 PM
D: Here is good.

I am actually starting to hate FF.net, mainly because it somehow screws up my uploads and then it never pops up and I have to reload it again. I really hate it right now.....so I'm kinda giving it the cold shoulder. :P

Serebii is good because we have a lot of guests who give you views, and then members that give you posts. It's kinda a good system, though, sometimes it sucks because you have spam and the like. D: But that's a small price to pay. I like these forums because of all the people that I have made freinds with here. ^.^b

Plus, they give good critisim too. :P

+Chaos Blade+
31st December 2005, 7:02 PM
When I first started out, I posted in the Pokemon Tower two years ago. First of all, I have no idea how I got there [nor do I remember how I got here, either. XP], but I placed my fics there. I got much kudos, until I went here, and got un-kudos, and was disgraced, and started posting my Fanfictions here. I liked the reviews more, so I post here and only here now.

Dilasc
31st December 2005, 7:48 PM
I post my work all over the place, but I seem to stick to here. Even if I do stand out amongst the crowd about as good as a blade of grass in a huge lawn, I still enjoy it here.

Quackerdrill
31st December 2005, 8:24 PM
Welp, I have only posted here and FF.net, and honestly I agree with the latter being a broken system. The whole review procedure is odd, and fics are easily ignored... even the very good ones. I prefer forum communities, but have not tried any others besides Serebii. Maybe I should pay some others a visit... but for now, this is a great place. The "newer people" can't spoil that, no matter how hard they try. ^_^

Elemental Charizam
31st December 2005, 9:05 PM
FF.net is just a squalid ocean of mediocrity in any case - most of the good authors give up posting there half way through, and its very hard to find the good authors in any. The reviewing and posting system is just plain annoying.

Serebii is the place for me. I do most of my reading here (of fanfictions, anyway) so it kills two birds with one stone. I'm familliar with the people and the formatting, and Serebii just seems more homely than other forums. I just can't be bothered to post in the stale fanfictions sections of forums like UPN, or GHPD. It just seems to be a waste of effort.

The 'newer people' aren't actually the problem IMO, its usually those that have been about a bit, but still annoy the hell out of everybody. Those annoying people who are new generally get themselves banned very quickly, aren't trying to do anybody harm, or just grow out of it. Its the members that never do enough to warrant banning, but just breach the rules in minor ways, like double/triple posting consistently, seem to be the main thing wrong. But even with a few annoying people, Serebii seems the best there is, dor its FF section in any case.

Kiyohime
31st December 2005, 9:14 PM
I drifted around fanfiction locations on the Web for a long time and this is the first one I've latched onto to for so long AND as a member, because of all the abovementioned benefits. Active community, talented authors, good reviewers...it's a really good spot.

Sempris
31st December 2005, 11:14 PM
Well, I don't have any fics up here yet, but I really am starting to like this place. Other than here though, I post at Fanfiction (dot) net (God, that account is almost three years old I think.), Lunaescence, FictionZone, Mediaminer, and Anime Spiral. All under different pen names, of course. I can't seem to find one I really like. And I tend to migrate with some authors... :sweatdrop:

Serebii seems nice though, lots of reviews and cool authors. I'm already started on my fanfiction for this archive. ^^

Burnt Flower
1st January 2006, 12:09 AM
I think I might be one of the few people here who is a bit fond of ff.net. :p

However, this forum is definitely my favorite place to post all my fanfiction - for all the reasons above. Afterall, my first horror fic was given good reviews here while in fanfiction.net it was completely ignored. xP

Sky Titan
1st January 2006, 12:20 AM
Well, I usually post my fics at Fanfiction.net...before I lost my password -_-.

For my next fanfiction which is currently undecided as of yet, I am going to post it here on Serebii because since my time here, I have discovered this place has a wonderful selection of authors from Scrap to +Chaos Blade+. There is also high standards here for quality work which I like. You dont know how many fics I have read and put down after the first page because of terrible grammar and non-exsistent paragraphs.

purple_drake
1st January 2006, 2:16 AM
I post here, ff.net and Pokecommunity. Well, I did... Pokecommunity didn't strike me as being as warm as Serebii - or maybe that's 'cause I didn't find as many friends. Whatever the reason, I didn't post there much. Here is still my pokemon source for... well, everything.

I think I will join Burnt Flower in being one of the few that likes ff.net, though. I've never really had a problem with it, and once I worked out all the kinks in uploading and stuff like that, it's nice. Maybe not as much a community, but I'm not very social anyway... plus, most of what I'm posting now aren't pokemon fics, so the area I currently live in is pretty friendly.

Dragonfree
1st January 2006, 2:56 AM
Well, in my opinion this is the best place I've found. The main plus is that you get a LOT of readers, a LOT of reviews, and when it comes right down to it, even though some of them are just "great chapter kthx bye", there is an awful lot of good reviewers here too.

At most other places where I post, I tend to have extremely bad luck with reviews - taking for example The Pokémon Tower, I've gotten three or four reviews EVER from it, and that's after posting my stuff there for like two years. (And no, I'm not exaggerating, it really IS just three or four.) It also happens at Pokémonelite2000, etc.; everybody seems to reply to everybody's fics except mine. (Really, I've often looked at a page of a fanfiction forum where the only one with no replies was mine.)

I don't mind FanFiction.net, even despite some annoying things such as how until very recently they removed all hyphens from my fics. A plus is that you get a lot of reviews, but on the downside you can't expect more than maybe one review per chapter at the very most that has anything constructive to say. =/

Negrek
2nd January 2006, 3:46 AM
Me? FF.net, hands down. It's not that I don't like the community aspect of the boards, but I do dislike the fact that it's so easy to shove out 'fics by the practice of constant bumping. On FF.net, each 'fic has an equal chance of sinking or swimming. Because there's less of a "community" aspect, there are fewer 'fics that manage to get buoyed up simply by virtue of the fact that they have so many friends among the reviewers who are willing to bump the thread back from oblivion.

In addition, I like the cleaner presentation. Don't get me wrong, I love signatures as much as anybody, but sometimes I find dancing little animations and the like slightly irritating and distracting. The review system is, again, much more fair--no carrying on extended conversations with reviewers in order to boost your review count, because unless they post anonymously, it's one review/chapter, and that's it.

In addition, I'd say that, while there's lots of tripe there, that's also where I've found the very best stuff. While I can name four excellent 'fics completely exclusive to FF.net, I can name only one of similar calibur exclusive to any forum or board that I've been to. It happens to be here, but there you are. And given the fact that FF.net doesn't roll over like crazy as do the boards here, it's a much higher good stuff to crap ratio. Though do note that I'm leaving out the fact that there are good 'fics posted multiple places, but FF.net has the best exclusives, IMO.

In addition, FF.net is the place where I've met some of my best fandom friends. I also have to admit a nostalgic connection, as it's the place where I first entered fandom. I've gotten some of my best reviews at FF.net; to be honest, it's the place where I've gotten the most reviews, as well.

So, yes, I hate the fact that it strips the special symbols. Yes, it has its share of problems and imbeciles. But overall, I prefer it to the forum system in general, Serebii and all others considered.

Willow's Tara
2nd January 2006, 6:10 AM
Even thought I post half of my fanfics on FF.net I still think this place is better (Despite it seems like non-pokemon fics seems sometimes ignored, I put a Lost fanfic and a story on here but either weren't reviewed), and also another good thing is you have mostlycan put anything here, even stories with real actors in it..

Zerodius
2nd January 2006, 6:39 AM
This thread sounds like self-publicity for the board...

Anyway, I agree with Negrek.

The "community" aspect basically means that unless you are one of the very few ultra overated "uber authors", you can basically forget this board ; you'll be mercilessly bashed by reviewers who I won't name but are nearly as harsh as the legendary Kyouji Kraw from ACMLM (and when you are compared to such an user, then it is that you are harsh to the point of insanity).

Still, if you have a rock-solid confidence and don't mind being ignored/getting stupid "look at advice for aspiring authors" posts shoved at you every second, then this board is a good place to go if you think that your fic is perfect but could be improved. The people here WILL find the flaws you overlooked, exhagerate it by 2000 times, and then flame you with it. Good stuff, really.

Anyway, now that my rant is over... I will admit that despite the overated uber authors, the uber authors' fanboys, and the newbie killer reviewers, this is an excellent place to post fanfictions... but since people here have very, very low tolerance, I'd suggest other sites if you're just beginning in fanfiction.

Oh and... if you feel like having a good laugh, you can always go through the fanfiction section and watch the newbie killer reviewers flame poor newbies while the fanboys keep bumping and praising fics with 2000 lines of description and two or three lines of overused, cliched, boring plot.

Yes, I am harsh... but well, whatever. People will probably hate me for this post... but whatever.

One thing I do like about this board is that as long as you put the rating in the title, you can pretty much max out the mature themes if you want... but the best is that not only can you post mature stuff, but your stuff can actually be REALLY mature (as in: mature themes used to enhance story AKA no mature themes just for the sake of mature themes) and not be ignored! In short, that means that the R-rated fic readers here aren't all hentai-crazy/violence obsessed hormone-driven freaks!

Finding sites that allow R-rated stuff AND aren't plagued with people who rate 5 everything that has one or two lines of sex/violence is very hard which makes this site, despite it's flaws, a rare gem.

Also, while I do bash the uber authors and their legions of fanboys a lot, the average, silent and non-reviewing masses are there, reading quietly... and as such, even if you don't get many reviews, it is nice to know that your fics are read and (probably) appreciated.

Well, that's all. That was my opinion.

Yes, I am hypocritical for saying that the site is bad in the first part, good in the second.

Have a nice day.

mindripper
2nd January 2006, 5:46 PM
Hey Zerodius, I realise that some of your points are actually pretty valid. However, it is a social place after all, and some of what you named is bound to come into play. Lamentable perhaps, but unavoidable.

I have no idea who you consider to be the "overrated, ubder authors" with their legions of fanboys and the like, but I sincerely hope that I am not one of them, and I am sure no one else would as well.

indigestible_wad
2nd January 2006, 6:13 PM
This forum is a good place to post fics, yes, but when you post a non pokemon fic, all it does is sink down to the bottom. I don't generally enjoy that. I post my stuff on a small forum where nobody ever replies to them. A bit hypocritical I know, but the thing is, I only post these small one shots to upload them, not to show people. And I don't want to have to go through the many complications of fanfiction.net. I don't want random n00bs looking at my stuff and saying random nothings about it. I would prefer it to just be in the dark so that I can show it to the people who want to see it.

This place is good for reviewers like myself. The many good authors along with the many newb authors make this place great for training a new reviewer or even with practice or something like that. But really, you get all the good stuff here, so you don't have to go really anywhere else.

GoGoTenda
2nd January 2006, 6:27 PM
This forum is a terrible, terrible place for getting reviews if you aren't already well known. If the fic is bad, you'll get flamed. If it's good, but you're unknown, it gets ignored. If people know who you are....you can write whatever the hell you want. Now, yes, most of the well known people are very good writers, but I don't like the idea of a Fanfic Hollywood. When you can post three chapters over the span of a month and not get a single review, there are certainly some issues. When you're only semi-regular reviewer is a good friend even after people have 'promised' to keep reviewing...that's just horrible. Serebii is a good place for those authors that have been actively posting stories for a year or more. Anyone new to the buisness just fails.

Eternal Daydreamer
2nd January 2006, 6:51 PM
This forum is a terrible, terrible place for getting reviews if you aren't already well known. If the fic is bad, you'll get flamed. If it's good, but you're unknown, it gets ignored. If people know who you are....you can write whatever the hell you want. Now, yes, most of the well known people are very good writers, but I don't like the idea of a Fanfic Hollywood. When you can post three chapters over the span of a month and not get a single review, there are certainly some issues. When you're only semi-regular reviewer is a good friend even after people have 'promised' to keep reviewing...that's just horrible. Serebii is a good place for those authors that have been actively posting stories for a year or more. Anyone new to the buisness just fails.
True, true. In a year I'll probably still be unknown. Although reccently, some new faces have been reading my stories so I don't know. But anyways, for Pokemon fics I would have to say here. But for Non I would have to say, fanfiction.net. Although, I have no idea how to post new stories...

Dragonfree
2nd January 2006, 8:01 PM
This forum is a terrible, terrible place for getting reviews if you aren't already well known. If the fic is bad, you'll get flamed. If it's good, but you're unknown, it gets ignored.
Now, that is not entirely true. On the first five pages of the fanfiction forum, there is one thread with no replies to it. I'd call that good. Taking for example FanFiction.Net's first five pages, there are fourteen fics with no reviews, and additionally I'll bet you anything that half of the ones that do have reviews there have maybe one or two reviews that both consist of "thats good write more". No luck at Pokécommunity; twelve fics with no replies there on the first five pages. 22 on TPM. At Pokémon Fan Universe, there are only two with no replies, but twelve with exactly one (admittedly, they have a mod who reviews almost everything that gets posted there in thorough detail). Fics are not ignored here, good or bad; they used to a while ago, but not anymore.

indigestible_wad
2nd January 2006, 8:12 PM
You know GoGo, all you have to do is ask a reviewer. All you have do is go to the thread and ask. It's not too hard. That's what the thread's for. I'll even give you a link there.
http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?t=38431

I admit htat I haven't read your story yet GoGo, but I've been a bit busy. That and I forgot.

Nylf
2nd January 2006, 8:16 PM
I have only posted on two sites. A site my friend ran on s9.invisionfree, and this one. There I never really improved, my chapters were hardly more than a paragraph, and my story would be called n00bish here. Here, I get constructive critiscm(I've been fortunate enough to never run into 'psycho' reviewers, though admittedly I haven't really seen that reviewer much), constructive encouragement(ie what's good, really helped my confidence when it came to writing romance), all round help(don't critisize the rules and help threads, their good things believe me) and access to fics far better than mine so I know what the next bar to aim for is. Admittedly I doubt that I'll ever be more than an average writer, but Serebii I find helps them just as much as uber authors.

Quackerdrill
2nd January 2006, 8:44 PM
This forum is a terrible, terrible place for getting reviews if you aren't already well known. If the fic is bad, you'll get flamed. If it's good, but you're unknown, it gets ignored. If people know who you are....you can write whatever the hell you want. Now, yes, most of the well known people are very good writers, but I don't like the idea of a Fanfic Hollywood. When you can post three chapters over the span of a month and not get a single review, there are certainly some issues. When you're only semi-regular reviewer is a good friend even after people have 'promised' to keep reviewing...that's just horrible. Serebii is a good place for those authors that have been actively posting stories for a year or more. Anyone new to the buisness just fails.Okay, this bugged me right here. I am living proof that some of this is not true. When I first started, yes, my fic did have a slow start review-wise, but the resulting reviews were not that harsh and I enjoyed the criticism. And to let you know, my record is seven chapters without replies. But I'm okay with that, I understand how sometimes, people just don't want to reply. XD But my most recent fic has been surprisingly appreciated, and- get this- I'm not a year old until Wednesday.

Just thought you would want a counterpoint. ^_^

Elemental Charizam
2nd January 2006, 9:06 PM
The "community" aspect basically means that unless you are one of the very few ultra overated "uber authors", you can basically forget this board ; you'll be mercilessly bashed by reviewers who I won't name but are nearly as harsh as the legendary Kyouji Kraw from ACMLM (and when you are compared to such an user, then it is that you are harsh to the point of insanity).
What the? If anything, I thought these forums were generally pretty soft reviewers, and even the harsh reviewrers are civil when they review. There are a few exceptions (AKA Renegade :P ), but generally its a nice place. If you are getting mercilessly bashed as you say, consider the fact that you may just suck. No offense intended, and it doesn't excuse being nasty to you, but I haven't seen any good authors 'bashed' here except by trolls.

All the ultra-authors are 'ultra' because they are good, they ask people like their freinds to review (anybody can bo that, albeit with total strangers if you have no freinds here), and most people know and love their writing style. Scrap is still fairly new, and she got lots of reviewers because her fic was enjoyed bylots of people, and it was spread by word of mouth. Such a system assures you can find good fics, though some are ignored simply because they are on the front page at the wrong time and suchlike. I prefer it to FF nwt personally, though I can see why others might disagree.

OT I know, but I found it funny the way you talked about being an overrated, almost sounded like the confession of a guilty conscience ;P

What Quackerdrill says is true. Every system has its flaws, and somebody always ends up with a bitter taste in their mouths. If you persist though, it usually turns out fine.

Nylf
2nd January 2006, 9:36 PM
Yeah, forgot to say that in my earlier thing. There is a reason a thread with fic reviewers exists. It takes three minutes or less to flick through there, find a reviewer who will read your type of fic and PM them. Most of my reviewers were total strangers I PM'd(well when I started) and now with their help I;ve got a fic people voluntarily read. nd try reviewing fics with the following phrase in your sig:

If I review your fic, please review mine if you can.

One sentence, goodness only knows how many reviews. That's the advantage to Serebii being a community. If you ask politely you can get help with ease.

Kiyohime
2nd January 2006, 10:06 PM
Yes, I'm still a newbie. I'm still not even a year old, but Nylf is correct-- I was a reviewer when I joined, and because I reviewed everyone's work, people reviewed mine out of courtesy at first. ;P It's a fair exchange, and I intend to get back in the reviewing loop when summer starts up again because free time provides. The phrase Nylf's suggested also can work wonders....a "please" works better than anything else.

mindripper
2nd January 2006, 10:35 PM
What the? If anything, I thought these forums were generally pretty soft reviewers, and even the harsh reviewrers are civil when they review. There are a few exceptions (AKA Renegade :P ), but generally its a nice place.

Firstly, Zerodius is probably just making his opinions heard. It does not mean that he is correct or wrong by default. It just means that he thinks that way, and that is the end of story. Also, about reviewers, I do not speak for others but I myself choose to be nicer because criticism layered with praise is better accepted. I also do not bother nitpicking on spelling errors, because anyone with a spell check can correct those. Does that make me an absolutely nice reviewer? The correct answer is "when I choose to be". About Renegade, I could not care less about the way she portrays herself, because while she chews up the people who make zero effort, she comes across as hypocritical to me. Renegade, if you see this, it could be because I am an idiot who cannot discern, but in all probability where there is smoke, there is fire.

About what Zerodius said, I interpreted that as pertaining to a certain trend here, in which reviewers, myself included, sometimes confuse what we want to see with what we actually believe is good. IE horror lovers can be sympathetic towards other horror fics, etc. Again, it may not apply to the majority of people, but then and again it is the minority that people take notice of, is it not. Like people remember the sole black sheep in the herd.

I think what he also meant about "the uber authors" is that some people do deem it below themselves to review, or seem to give off that particular vibe. Bringing us back to Renegade. How often do we see her reviewing fics which deserve to be reviewed, instead of hammering some random noob fic and then complaining that she does not encounter any good fics around here? When the favour is returned, she cannot take it. Get the trend? Some authors hardly even review at all. Perhaps they do not have the time, and perhaps they just stick to a few fics. The point is that writers are nothing without reviewers, and when you take something from the community, you should try to give some back. Going with that point, if you have the time to write a fic, you should have the time to review. If someone is kind enough to review, then try to return the favour, especially if said person requests for it. Again, people do not get reputations as good authors if they are poor, but then and again people are not labelled "uber authors" unless there is at least some element of truth. Me? I cannot care less about politics and intricate social circles on these boards. I review for people, and people do the same for me. End of my story. I just call this the way I see it, and that I see points on both sides. I am now preparing for Renegade's assault.

Kiyohime
3rd January 2006, 12:24 AM
I think it'd be best if people didn't use names in debates, as it will lead to flame wars, though about the horror comment, I both agree and disagree with your comment (wow, paradox. :P) If people love horror or AshMisty shipping, of course they'll be biased. But I've also had readers who tell me they hate horror, but enjoy reading my fiction. There's no black and white to it. People read whatever they like. I'm also not sure about the "below themselves to review" thing vibe...I haven't noticed that, though I don't really talk to anyone a lot (as in everyday) except for Syra and Saber. ^^;; I'm also wondering about the comments in the start of the thread, where people said this place was getting overloaded with n00b stories....has it really been? Either they disappear fast or I'm just blind. XD

Breezy
3rd January 2006, 12:24 AM
If we had to review back for each reviewer that reviewed our fic, Mindripper, then I believe I am 1,345 reviews behind. And that'd underexaggerating if we're including my reviews at ff.net.

If you review just to get people to review back, then don't even write. Just don't. It's their choice if they want to review or not. I know some writers play the "you scratch my back, I scratch yours" card, but the majority of reviewers review because they want to. Even that little reviewer thread that asks for review. Just because someone wants to you to review doesn't mean you have to.

...Yeah, I'm working on reviewing too. >>;

Yes, we do have great reviewers here, but one thing I love about Renegade's reviews is that it's generally different from everyone else's reviews. It's one hard slap to the face. She doesn't have to offer any advice. You better know if she critique's your fic, you better get your arse working hard to bring your standards up.

There's those reviewers that care and help you get better. And then there are those that you that can just stare at you and push you to get better. Or else.

Anyways... I'm one of the ones fond of ff.net. It was one of my first main fanfiction sites for Pokémon, and I'm doing pretty well over there considering, as I've heard from here, it's such a hard place to get reviews.

It also helped build my reputation so I have to love it. :rolleyes:

This place is good too. I get a lot of feedback and opinions on what to do for my fics instead of waiting for emails from my ff.net reviewers.

Kasumi Christie
3rd January 2006, 1:05 AM
I prefer Fanfiction.net because I've been posting up my fanfiction there for years and have recieved my fair share of wonderful reviews, not to mention some really stupid flames. I'm no newbie when it comes to writing fanfiction, but based of some of the critisism I've seen here, I've decided not to post anything up on SNF and take a step back for reasons such as I fear some of the more negative reviews which I may recieve, and posting on a message board rather than a site made specifically for fanfiction, just seems a bit too diverse for me.

intergalactic platypus
3rd January 2006, 2:33 AM
I posted a shipping tragedy back here when my account was newer, and I got some reviews since nothings really buried in shipping fics. However, I tried two standard fics, one was a one shot that got good reviews from those who bothered to read it but was quickly buried by the well known fics of the time, and the other was unfinished because I got so few reviewers. The only thing I wish is that it was easier to have your fic stay afloat instead of getting buried

Tezza
3rd January 2006, 2:57 AM
Personally, my favourite place on the internet is the Pokemon Tower Library. http://www.thepokemontower.com/tpt.shtml but not because of the reviews. While I've gotten more than my share, very little was critical. However good the 'I love your fic' reviews are, they didn't do much for me as an author. I love it because it's a good place to read.

This place I have posted fanfiction in a long time so I can't say much for my personal expiriences but through my reading, I have to agree with Zerodius. I like hanging around forums to help out new writers, but to go for decent reading, I go to the TPL.

Don't confuse how I used the term decent. There absolutely brilliant writers here but the thing is, it's like coming into a library with grumpy librarians. Every day you come in they've changed the order of the books. Every book you read has a new chapter and you may be reading three or four books at a time.

If you're like me I have little time on the internet so I save a bunch onto my disk and read it off line.... but when I come back to copy and paste my reviews I may have to scrawl through five or six pages and by the time I paste them, I see a new chapter is up that I have to read and review. It's so easy to get behind and it may disappear into the back pages any day.

That's why I prefer the TPL. There's a week between updates, plus they're there perminently. You have your share of your good and your bad, but it's a nice little place.

http://www.thepokemontower.com/tpt.shtml

IceKing
3rd January 2006, 3:15 AM
Wow, I think it's time I finally posted back after all these messages appeared. Well, it appears SPPf is the most liked place with a few exceptions of FF.net and Tezza liking TPL (which I'm gonna check out). Apparently, some people feel that only great people get reviewers, so I wanna make a few comments on that.

When I first came to SPPf last August, I posted a sucky fic which got like 10 reviews in one day (all saying ZOMG YOU SUCK) and I was proud, knowing how much feedback I would get. I listened to their advice and I produced a pretty ok chapter of a new fic called Whirl Island Quest. Next day, no reviews. Luckily, there were a few people whose sig said "PM me for a review" So I got a few reviews from that and then ever since I got 4-7 regular reviews at the peak of the fic, and even won a couple of awards and slowly assimilated myself more and more into the fanfiction community, including making friends with several of the members. I posted a few other fics as well, reviewed a lot of fics, posted a lot on the A/C, basically trying to get myself known a bit more. Then, to my complete and udder surprise, got 15 reviews a chapter for my newest version of WIQ. You're not completely hopeless if you're a complete newbie, you still will get reviews eventually (especially if its a n00b fic). If you're still not getting reviews, it's probbaly because people don't know you well enough or your fic just flat out sucks. Go to the fanfic reviewer thread, review a few fics, post a lot in A/C, MAKE YOURSELF KNOWN!!! But don't pull a mindripper and PM everyone who's online to review (is teaching you a lesson on why naming names isn't very nice). A good example of a newbie rising quickly is Thyplogirl. Do you see how many reviews that freaking girl has!?!??!

And also, don't review with the PURE intent of hoping that person would review back. You should review because you want to share your advice or be more active. Though courtesy reviews back aren't too bad.

Edit-Hmm, here's a list of how I know my reviewers. Maybe it will help out somehow

People whose fic I have reviewed-4
Former readers (many who were closet)-5
Friends-2
Other (musta been famaliar with me or just randomly look, most are prominent members of SPPf)-6

mindripper
3rd January 2006, 9:26 AM
I think it'd be best if people didn't use names in debates, as it will lead to flame wars, though about the horror comment, I both agree and disagree with your comment (wow, paradox. :P) If people love horror or AshMisty shipping, of course they'll be biased. But I've also had readers who tell me they hate horror, but enjoy reading my fiction. There's no black and white to it.

As I said, I call it the way I see it. If anyone wants to get sparky because of something which is blatantly obvious, it is too bad then. Up to each individual's basic mentality to accept truths.

Anyway, about the genre part, I did say in my post that there is that trend, although I did not have you in mind. However much in the minority that trend is, it is often these tiny trends that stick out more obviously than the obvious ones.


If we had to review back for each reviewer that reviewed our fic, Mindripper, then I believe I am 1,345 reviews behind. And that'd underexaggerating if we're including my reviews at ff.net.

If you review just to get people to review back, then don't even write. Just don't. It's their choice if they want to review or not. I know some writers play the "you scratch my back, I scratch yours" card, but the majority of reviewers review because they want to. Even that little reviewer thread that asks for review. Just because someone wants to you to review doesn't mean you have to.

I believe you are perhaps barking up the wrong tree here. The idea is to review for those who have been kind enough to review for you wherever possible, and to apply this to people who have NOT reviewed for you as well. It seems that you missed the latter half of the argument completely.

To accept reviews from people without the notion of repayment at all is pretty elitist thinking. Gratitude on your thread is one thing, actually putting that gratitude into action is another. The correct phrasing should be "if you can spare the time to write but cannot spare the time to review, then don't bother writing at all". Perhaps it sounds harsh and exaggerated, but this applies to everyone, and I am not targeting you with that. It applies to me as well.

Iceking, I could not care less whose name you pull. You speak the truth, and I have been over that. Learnt my lesson, and move on with life. I still get reviews, and I am still doing pretty ok, thanks very much for the concern.

pisces_beedrill
3rd January 2006, 10:50 AM
This forum is a terrible, terrible place for getting reviews if you aren't already well known. If the fic is bad, you'll get flamed. If it's good, but you're unknown, it gets ignored. If people know who you are....you can write whatever the hell you want. Now, yes, most of the well known people are very good writers, but I don't like the idea of a Fanfic Hollywood. When you can post three chapters over the span of a month and not get a single review, there are certainly some issues. When you're only semi-regular reviewer is a good friend even after people have 'promised' to keep reviewing...that's just horrible. Serebii is a good place for those authors that have been actively posting stories for a year or more. Anyone new to the buisness just fails.
i thoroughly agree! it is so annoying the way some fics are completey ignored yet they are brilliant and this happens only cause the writer is new

i post my fics on 3 places, here cause i got some friends to read it, jetx's forums and earth forums.

Elemental Charizam
3rd January 2006, 6:34 PM
Firstly, Zerodius is probably just making his opinions heard. It does not mean that he is correct or wrong by default. It just means that he thinks that way, and that is the end of story.
I never said he didn't have the right to think that, just pointing things out to him, which he is not obliged to read or take notice of. I wasn't the first in the thred, and as there were no complaints to people who acted in the same way, I figured it was OK.


where there is smoke, there is fire.
No offence or anything, but has the irony of you using that phrase struck you?

In my opinion, writing a fic that people enjoy and putting it up IS a service to the community, and I'm sure most reviewers would rather you posted that fic they enjoy and don't review rather than not come at all because of time constraints. Of course, it might not be the same if theauthor is simply trying to get help out of people who don't care less, but even still, if you're trying to write well you still add to the community. Sure, whenever possible you should try and do nice things like review people, but sometimes you just can't. End of story, as you would so eloquently put it.

GoGoTenda
3rd January 2006, 7:20 PM
Yes, I know there is a reviewer thread. However, I don't see any reason why I should have to ask people to read/review my fic. I want people to be wholeheartedly interested in my fic and not just doing it because they feel 'obligated'. If you have to panhandle reviews to be respected...isn't that a wee bit backwards? I understand that I could find reviews if I wanted to, but I'd much rather have people find me because of the story.

mindripper
3rd January 2006, 7:40 PM
No offence or anything, but has the irony of you using that phrase struck you?

No, but does your using it strike you? No offence, of course. My advice is to stick to the matter at hand.


In my opinion, writing a fic that people enjoy and putting it up IS a service to the community, and I'm sure most reviewers would rather you posted that fic they enjoy and don't review rather than not come at all because of time constraints.

I think you misunderstood. What I mean is that lack of time is not an excuse not to review. It really just is not. Unless you do not have the internet at home or something, time is a commodity which can be spared especially when we all take hours to write anything. When you elect a mayor, you do so in hope of him being able to do the community a service, but does it ever strike anyone why candidates treat their voters like they have done a service? Same thing here.


Sure, whenever possible you should try and do nice things like review people, but sometimes you just can't.

You see, therein lies the problem. When is it "whenever possible"? You cannot blame people for saying what they do. People's fics have replies, yes. But how many of them only have one or two reviews, with the rest of the replies being latter posted chapters? Contrary to whatever you may think, I have defended the "uber authors" in the previous discussion on another thread, and while I can reason that they have done nothing wrong and it is difficult to change others' perceptions of them, your questioning of peoples' opinions on them is not going to solve anything. What solves problems is the bringing up of issues. If Renegade thinks I wronged her, she is free to defend herself. On that train of thought, if anyone has a problem, the key is to solve it by attacking the root of the problem, not by vehemently defending yourselves. I volunteered to review for Zerodius, and I wait to see if he wants me to. I also review for people who have reviewed for me, as well as people who do not review for me. I don't think it can be counted as a waste of time. Why would helping another the same way everyone would want to be helped when put in that situation be a waste of time?


I never said he didn't have the right to think that, just pointing things out to him, which he is not obliged to read or take notice of.

No you did not, and what I said was that he was just voicing his opinions. I never said that those opinions were correct or otherwise by default, and neither did I blame you for what you said. Stop being so defensive. :p. However, you might want to change your opinion on the latter part of abovementioned quote. When you quote him and write something in relation to what he said, referring explicitly to him at the same time, you meant for him to read it, whether of not you figure it is ok, just like you meant for me to read what you wrote, and vice versa.

That said, I suddenly have this feeling that I have been made out to be of those who want to hammer the "uber authors". Truth is that I believe that both sides do have points, that people are not where they are because they suck at writing but are great at making contacts, but that people who feel that they are ignored have points as well. Whether or not a person wants to review his his/her own problem, and I just point out what I think should be done. If people want to listen, great! Things get better for everyone and we do not need to waste time discussing this. If people do not listen and think that I am just being stupid and thick, great! Things remain the same for me. I still review, I still get on with my currently great life, I still write what I want, and people still review for me. The only difference is that those who complained about these boards get their greivances justified by default ignorance.

Dragonfree
4th January 2006, 12:20 AM
To accept reviews from people without the notion of repayment at all is pretty elitist thinking.

Frankly, I find it a very messed-up philosophy to say that you're 'obliged' to review a person's fic if they have reviewed yours. Sure, it's polite, but I do not like the idea of anybody being able to force me to read something I have no interest in reading just by reading my work.

I don't expect anybody whose fics I review to feel obliged to review mine back, and therefore I don't feel that I should be obliged to review my readers' fics. I expect people to read and review my fics if they are interested in doing so, and if they are not doing it out of any interest, I feel it defeats the purpose.

indigestible_wad
4th January 2006, 12:29 AM
In my opinion, writing a fic that people enjoy and putting it up IS a service to the community, and I'm sure most reviewers would rather you posted that fic they enjoy and don't review rather than not come at all because of time constraints. Yes, I can see your point, but if people never read it, then how are they going to like it? If you get people to review, then some may start to like it and keep reading and reviewing. Saying that you don't want people to do it just because they're not being nudged into it is sort of selfish thinking. A more apropriate answer would be because you're shy, but I know that you're not shy.

purple_drake
4th January 2006, 2:52 AM
Yes, I know there is a reviewer thread. However, I don't see any reason why I should have to ask people to read/review my fic. I want people to be wholeheartedly interested in my fic and not just doing it because they feel 'obligated'. If you have to panhandle reviews to be respected...isn't that a wee bit backwards? I understand that I could find reviews if I wanted to, but I'd much rather have people find me because of the story.

Okay, you say you don't want to ask people to review, yet no one is reviewing anyway; maybe that says something about the quality of the story. Reviews are only a mark of respect because it's generally acccepted that 'the better the story, the more reviews'. If no one wants to read your story, don't blame them. Maybe there's something lacking; maybe you haven't put out enough publicity. Don't complain about it; do something.

The reviewer thread isn't a matter of obligation, nor is it a matter of getting reviews for the sake of reviews. It's a list of people willing to review to help you improve. Asking for reviews shouldn't be - and as far as I'm concerned, never has been - a way of 'getting respect'; it's a way of getting some honest feedback when you're lacking.

Negrek
4th January 2006, 3:44 AM
Reviews are only a mark of respect because it's generally acccepted that 'the better the story, the more reviews'.
*shakes head* If only that were true. It would make searching for good 'fics a lot easier. Fact is, people have different styles about how they go about getting reviews. People without connections, let's face it, tend to get bumped from the front page pretty quickly. There are those who don't have the time on the internet to establish a community of people willing to read and review their 'fic, or do not choose to, as GoGoTenda mentioned. Like it or not, general popularity with other members of the forum influences your review count.

Personally, I'm with him in general. I don't mind asking for reviews from people whom I know are going to give me good feedback and will probably help me improve; I have PM'd people to review based upon reviews that they have given others, namely those that I liked or thought were thorough. However, I'm not going to go flipping through the Reviewer thread and tossing PM's every which way in the interest of getting a wider reader base. I am also of the opinion that, if my 'fic cannot stand on its own and get reviewers without me having to beg for them, then clearly something is wrong with it that I need to address.

Dragonfree
4th January 2006, 11:10 AM
Generally, the worst get the most reviews for the first chapters, because there is a certain group of people (mods and the known 'newbie reviewers') who flock to any thread with spelling errors in the title or that are rated one star. However, their job is done as soon as the author is not breaking any rules anymore and getting a bit better. They never become regular reviewers; they're just there to push you a bit ahead. To get real readers, you need to be good enough for the readers who read stuff for entertainment to like you, and be patient.

Yes, the fact is that a forum like this has threads go down to the second page very quickly. However, the fact is also that the number of readers who stumble upon your fic, if it is good enough to get regular reviewers at all, is in direct relation to the time it has been around and the time it has had on the first page. Maybe I get more reviews for being a mod or whatever (I never tell or ask anybody to read or review my fic, at least, and I don't talk regularly with anybody from here, so it's not any consciously-made "connections"), but the main reason I have a lot of regular reviewers is simply that the thread is 29 chapters in and has been around since April 2004. That's more than 19 months of potential stumbling and probably more than 40 (thanks to the extras and late reviewers) bumps to the front page. Really, GoGoTenda, you honestly can't complain that you're not getting readers because you're not well known if your thread is three months old. You haven't had any time to become well known. Somebody will read your fic eventually, bump it to the front page, somebody else will notice it then, bump it again, and before you know it you'll have a fanbase. It's not the forums' fault, period. You're just being too impatient.

It might also, just as a tip, be driving potential readers away how fast you update, because some people have a hard time catching up with something that's already fifteen chapters in.

Elemental Charizam
4th January 2006, 5:28 PM
No, but does your using it strike you? No offence, of course. My advice is to stick to the matter at hand.
Well, you began this tangent by saying something offhand about Renegade, and I just was struck by the fact that you would use that phrase whilst denying all the rumours surrounding yourself. But fine, on topic for the whole post from now on...


I think you misunderstood. What I mean is that lack of time is not an excuse not to review. It really just is not. Unless you do not have the internet at home or something, time is a commodity which can be spared especially when we all take hours to write anything.
What a convincing argument. 'It just really is no'. Wow, that's up there with 'I'm just right, okay?’ So where do you take the time from? You could slow your writing down to a trickle, I suppose, cutting time from that. But then the reviewers complain, at least if it’s a popular fic, notice however, they don't complain if you don't return their reviews? This seems to show where their prorities lie.


Yes, I can see your point, but if people never read it, then how are they going to like it? If you get people to review, then some may start to like it and keep reading and reviewing. Saying that you don't want people to do it just because they're not being nudged into it is sort of selfish thinking. A more apropriate answer would be because you're shy, but I know that you're not shy.
I wasn't actually talking about myself; I do review people who review me, and lots that don't as well :P Anyway, I think you might be getting what i was saying mixed up with somebody else. All I was saying is that some people only have the time to write (and I'm talking specifically about enjoyed authors here) and that as people are asking them to write, then they should write, even if they can't review their reviewers and other people themselves.


You see, therein lies the problem. When is it "whenever possible"?
Whenever possible is whenever you have the time to spare, bearing in mind work, eating, bathing, and other activities humans engage in. It is hardly a shocking concept.


Why would helping another the same way everyone would want to be helped when put in that situation be a waste of time?
I never implied that, I'm afraid. It isn't a waste of time, but if you really get 50 replies a Chapter or something, and you have a busy life, you might simply be unable to review them all. I don't even feel that there's a duty for you too, or I'd be annoyed at the huge volumes of people who have failed to review me back, including yourself. The hypocrisy obviously does not lie solely with Renegade. In fact, you're double hypocritical for accusing somebody else of being hypocritical and not reviewing me back :P


Stop being so defensive.
OMG! You strayed from the topic! I didn't realize I was being defensive; I was just trying to phrase things as formally as possible so I wasn't misunderstood. I was anyway, twice XD


That said, I suddenly have this feeling that I have been made out to be of those who want to hammer the "uber authors".
Not really, just a pretentious person that demands everybody to subscribe to his view of reviewing, and uses 'End of story' after every point he makes. In terms of reviewers at least, I'd say you were an 'Uber author'.

To sum up my views, I think that if you have time to write but not enough time to do much reviewing as well, you should still write, especially if loads of people enjoy your fic. You aren't obligated to review those that review you, but its a nice thing to do to help them out if you have the time. I pretty much always do this myself.* I suppose that, in general at least, I pretty much agree with Dragonfree, and Iceking too.

*Exceptoions to this rule are when people leave crappy reviews, and then take longer than the actual review (which doesn't show that they actually read the fic) asking me to review them back.

mindripper
4th January 2006, 5:56 PM
and I just was struck by the fact that you would use that phrase whilst denying all the rumours surrounding yourself. But fine, on topic for the whole post from now on...

My my, gossipmongers are we not? Right, on topic.




What a convincing argument. 'It just really is no'. Wow, that's up there with 'I'm just right, okay?’ So where do you take the time from? You could slow your writing down to a trickle, I suppose, cutting time from that. But then the reviewers complain, at least if it’s a popular fic, notice however, they don't complain if you don't return their reviews? This seems to show where their prorities lie.

Extremely gripping rebuttal. No one asks for a sacrifice of one aspect for the fulfillment of another. Saying that increased reviewing, and we are only talking about slight increases, like perhaps an extra two reviews a week is equivalent to "slowing down writing to a trickle" is just dramatising your point. It is not a one for one exchange.


Whenever possible is whenever you have the time to spare, bearing in mind work, eating, bathing, and other activities humans engage in. It is hardly a shocking concept.

Thanks for further explaining my point. Whenever possible just means that. Shocking that too many people fail to grasp that.


I never implied that, I'm afraid. It isn't a waste of time, but if you really get 50 replies a Chapter or something, and you have a busy life, you might simply be unable to review them all. I don't even feel that there's a duty for you too, or I'd be annoyed at the huge volumes of people who have failed to review me back, including yourself. The hypocrisy obviously does not lie solely with Renegade. In fact, you're double hypocritical for accusing somebody else of being hypocritical and not reviewing me back :P

You do not have anything for me to review in return. In my previous contact with you, I already promised a review for "clinic" or whatever horror one-shot you wanted to come up with, something which I have not forgotten about, and something which I hope you have not forgotten about either. Funny how people have selective memories at times, but since I myself am guilty, meh. Just think about the issues at hand first before being quick with conclusions.


Not really, just a pretentious person that demands everybody to subscribe to his view of reviewing, and uses 'End of story' after every point he makes. In terms of reviewers at least, I'd say you were an 'Uber author'.

Of course, fromwhat you have said previously, opinions are accepted in any form. I say "should", and I refer to what I feel can solve the current situation. Listen or not, your choice. What exactly did I voice? My opinions, end of story. You really have a bone to pick with that? Perhaps on the topic of "pretentious" people, we could discuss the notion of you wanting to rebutt Zerodius but then not intending at all for him to read your reply. Totally unpretentious, right there.

Yup, I get reviews. I am not going to feel guilty about that, and I review for others frequently enough. "Uber authors", the way I interpret it, are those who have an elitist view. Perhaps your viewpoint would be more justified if I did not review for people. I have fics on my hands which I WILL review, but chaptered fics take a long time. Ledian_X's fic is one I have been reading, as are several others, inclusing Zerodius', and I assure them they will get their reviews. So unless you are intending to define "uber authors" by your own definition, try a different tune.


To sum up my views, I think that if you have time to write but not enough time to do much reviewing as well, you should still write, especially if loads of people enjoy your fic. You aren't obligated to review those that review you, but its a nice thing to do to help them out if you have the time. I pretty much always do this myself

I never singled out anybody, and neither did GogoTenda or anybody else on this thread. That, right there, says that people do not actually differ so much in opinions. I do not impose the need to review for other, especially newer, authors, even though I believe it is a practice that should occur more often than current situations would have it. What I posted were my opinions, which when you read a little more carefully, just encourages people to be a little nicer at times. Not obligational, but a good thing to do nonetheless. Reviewing does not take too much time, and people appreciate reviews. Perhaps a little more time can be taken in this aspect. It is not a situation which demands sacrificing one's own work, but a situation which basically demands people to be nicer to the authors who need it.

Elemental Charizam
4th January 2006, 6:40 PM
Extremely gripping rebuttal. No one asks for a sacrifice of one aspect for the fulfillment of another. Saying that increased reviewing, and we are only talking about slight increases, like perhaps an extra two reviews a week is equivalent to "slowing down writing to a trickle" is just dramatising your point. It is not a one for one exchange.
Fair enough, but you said before that if you didn't return all your reviews, you might as well not write. Much more than two, for lots of people. and you must sacrifice something from your schedule to spend more time reviewing, even if it isn't writing. For me, it takes at least five minues for a review, and I've taken over thirty minutes once.


Thanks for further explaining my point. Whenever possible just means that. Shocking that too many people fail to grasp that.
But that's not what you said, at least not at first. You said you shouldn't write unless you returned reviews. Its quite a shift in viewpoint to then relagate your stance to 'whenever possible', which was pretty much mine from the start.


You do not have anything for me to review in return. In my previous contact with you, I already promised a review for "clinic" or whatever horror one-shot you wanted to come up with, something which I have not forgotten about, and something which I hope you have not forgotten about either. Funny how people have selective memories at times, but since I myself am guilty, meh. Just think about the issues at hand first before being quick with conclusions.
Actually, I had several chapters of ITF, but perhaps your selective memory bleeped them out. And I remember perfectly well what you said, Ripper.


You really have a bone to pick with that? Perhaps on the topic of "pretentious" people, we could discuss the notion of you wanting to rebutt Zerodius but then not intending at all for him to read your reply. Totally unpretentious, right there
Not nearly in your league, but you could take it that way. I did intend for him to read my reply, I just said nobody was forcing him to take any notice, and that he hada right to an opinion, however invalid I thought it was.


Yup, I get reviews. I am not going to feel guilty about that, and I review for others frequently enough. "Uber authors", the way I interpret it, are those who have an elitist view. Perhaps your viewpoint would be more justified if I did not review for people. I have fics on my hands which I WILL review, but chaptered fics take a long time. Ledian_X's fic is one I have been reading, as are several others, inclusing Zerodius', and I assure them they will get their reviews. So unless you are intending to define "uber authors" by your own definition, try a different tune.
I was actually just trying to say that you didn't seem to be picking at the popular (in terms of reviews) authors, seeing as you wrere one yourself. I didn't realise that was your definition of the term at all.


I never singled out anybody, and neither did GogoTenda or anybody else on this thread. That, right there, says that people do not actually differ so much in opinions. I do not impose the need to review for other, especially newer, authors, even though I believe it is a practice that should occur more often than current situations would have it. What I posted were my opinions, which when you read a little more carefully, just encourages people to be a little nicer at times. Not obligational, but a good thing to do nonetheless. Reviewing does not take too much time, and people appreciate reviews. Perhaps a little more time can be taken in this aspect. It is not a situation which demands sacrificing one's own work, but a situation which basically demands people to be nicer to the authors who need it.
Perfectly valid viewpoint, and more or less I'm inclined to agree; it was pretty much my stance anyway. But it wasn't the message you gave across earlier at all.

mindripper
4th January 2006, 7:07 PM
Fair enough, but you said before that if you didn't return all your reviews, you might as well not write. Much more than two, for lots of people. and you must sacrifice something from your schedule to spend more time reviewing, even if it isn't writing. For me, it takes at least five minues for a review, and I've taken over thirty minutes once.


The correct phrasing should be "if you can spare the time to write but cannot spare the time to review, then don't bother writing at all". Perhaps it sounds harsh and exaggerated, but this applies to everyone, and I am not targeting you with that. It applies to me as well.


It is not a one for one exchange.

Two quotes from what I have said. What I said was that if someone can spend hours on writing, as I am sure you all do, then perhaps ten minutes here, and perhaps even half an hour there sometimes is not a huge sacrifice, and does not hinder the writing. Saying you do not review because you have no time, and yet being able to spend hours on a fiction is a poor excuse. Again, my opinions. I fail to see where I explicitly demanded authors to review, beyond voicing my thoughts that they "should" review. Of course, any help an other gives you should be repaid, and is that not what I said earlier? It is not so much a must, but a pointing to the fact that thinking reviews are what an author deserves, with no obligation whatsoever to repay the reviewer when possible is elitist. People sing different tunes when they are on top compared to when they are below.


But that's not what you said, at least not at first. You said you shouldn't write unless you returned reviews. Its quite a shift in viewpoint to then relagate your stance to 'whenever possible', which was pretty much mine from the start.

Perhaps you could quote my demanding authors to review and enlighten me. Saying someone "should" review is a matter of opinion, as is what I have made clear previously, and is very different from what you are insinuating. Perhaps you fail to realise that I had the stance as well, with more emphasis on an idealistic situation. Another matter for another day.


Actually, I had several chapters of ITF, but perhaps your selective memory bleeped them out. And I remember perfectly well what you said, Ripper.

I have reviewed it before. T&T also has had new chapters. You have reviewed my prologue, and came up with one questioning comment on my latest fic, the latter not counting as a review per se. My selective memory, as deferred upon myself by you, fails to grip whether your next work will be a chaptered fic or not, and in my book I am already going to review that, just like I am going to review for Ledian_X, Zerodius and others. Your review is already as good as given, unless you choose to question the validity of my point, and my personal integrity. Or perhaps you assumed prematurely that I would suffer from selective memory again? The point is that you began this prattle with an accusation. Either back it up, perhaps by harping on my "selective memory", or by questioning my honesty, or stop flogging a dead horse. Does no one any good, yourself included.


Not nearly in your league, but you could take it that way. I did intend for him to read my reply, I just said nobody was forcing him to take any notice, and that he hada right to an opinion, however invalid I thought it was.

So a comment is made, but everything is fine just because no one forced Zerodius to take any notice, and because you thought it was invalid. If you did not want Zerodius to take notice,and do not bother if he does, then why reply? Why not keep the opinion to yourself and avoid a potential debate with him? Of course, the invalidity that you place upon your comments makes everything alright. Compared to my comments and my willingness to have Renegade hit out in whatever way she wants to, I would say you overestimate me. You are a cut above me. However, let us move on, unless you want to continue with this instead of your more pressing debates.


I was actually just trying to say that you didn't seem to be picking at the popular (in terms of reviews) authors, seeing as you wrere one yourself. I didn't realise that was your definition of the term at all.


I think what he also meant about "the uber authors" is that some people do deem it below themselves to review, or seem to give off that particular vibe.

I cannot personally say I care much about whether I am labelled as a "popular author" or not, because the main thing for me is I write, I review, hope people review for me, try to improve, and try to help others improve. Of course, my definition was posted for all to see, something which you have clearly missed. Which leads me to question how much you actually missed, and how valid that makes your opinions, or otherwise. I will give you the benefit of the doubt, of course.


Perfectly valid viewpoint, and more or less I'm inclined to agree; it was pretty much my stance anyway. But it wasn't the message you gave across earlier at all.

Nope, it was the message you refused to accept, seeing only the supposed impositions and the way I supposedly wanted to deem it necessary for authors to review.

Elemental Charizam
4th January 2006, 8:01 PM
Two quotes from what I have said. What I said was that if someone can spend hours on writing, as I am sure you all do, then perhaps ten minutes here, and perhaps even half an hour there sometimes is not a huge sacrifice, and does not hinder the writing. Saying you do not review because you have no time, and yet being able to spend hours on a fiction is a poor excuse. Again, my opinions. I fail to see where I explicitly demanded authors to review, beyond voicing my thoughts that they "should" review.
See I thought "if you can spare the time to write but cannot spare the time to review, then don't bother writing at all". Meant that you shouldn't write unless you could reply to all you reviews. And that's still what it looks like to me. It sounds like a demand when you put 'End of story' at the end, Ripper.


I have reviewed it before. T&T also has had new chapters. You have reviewed my prologue, and came up with one questioning comment on my latest fic, the latter not counting as a review per se. My selective memory, as deferred upon myself by you, fails to grip whether your next work will be a chaptered fic or not, and in my book I am already going to review that, just like I am going to review for Ledian_X, Zerodius and others. Your review is already as good as given, unless you choose to question the validity of my point, and my personal integrity. Or perhaps you assumed prematurely that I would suffer from selective memory again? The point is that you began this prattle with an accusation. Either back it up, perhaps by harping on my "selective memory", or by questioning my honesty, or stop flogging a dead horse. Does no one any good, yourself included.
You reviewed ITF less times than I reviewed T&T :P I would also mention that since then I have reviewed 'No Man Is An Island' far more thorougfhly than lots of your other reviewers. That alone proves you are wrong. And hypocritical.


So a comment is made, but everything is fine just because no one forced Zerodius to take any notice, and because you thought it was invalid. If you did not want Zerodius to take notice,and do not bother if he does, then why reply? Why not keep the opinion to yourself and avoid a potential debate with him? Of course, the invalidity that you place upon your comments makes everything alright. Compared to my comments and my willingness to have Renegade hit out in whatever way she wants to, I would say you overestimate me. You are a cut above me. However, let us move on, unless you want to continue with this instead of your more pressing debates.
You are either being purposefully dense, or you are just incredibly stupid. Which is it, Ripper? It was clear I was saying that however invalid I thought his point, he had a right to it.


I cannot personally say I care much about whether I am labelled as a "popular author" or not, because the main thing for me is I write, I review, hope people review for me, try to improve, and try to help others improve. Of course, my definition was posted for all to see, something which you have clearly missed. Which leads me to question how much you actually missed, and how valid that makes your opinions, or otherwise. I will give you the benefit of the doubt, of course.
Yeah, I missed it the first time around. It wasn't relevant at the time I read it, so I forgot. Popular strictly in the review sense, Ripper. And that does matter, because as I'd already said, I thought you were a member of the 'Uber author' group because you got so many reviews (admittedly by gross breach of courtesy of rules in many occasions), so I would not think you were a basher of the group.


That said, I suddenly have this feeling that I have been made out to be of those who want to hammer the "uber authors".

I was just saying that ^ was not true in my opinion.


Nope, it was the message you refused to accept, seeing only the supposed impositions and the way I supposedly wanted to deem it necessary for authors to review.
I didn't refuse to accept it, I simply took what you said literally. As it was what made me disagree with you, it did stick in the mind more than anything else. I found your post confusing, but I often do, so I thought nothing of it. The way you phrase things often makes me go 'WTF?' possibly because of comments like:


"if you can spare the time to write but cannot spare the time to review, then don't bother writing at all".
I take co,mments like those literally, and take that to be your viewpoint. Perhaps the reason I failed to understand your position is because you make comments that sound like they summarise you view, and I see the rest of your post in that context >>

From what you're saying, I take it your view isn't that far from my own?

mindripper
4th January 2006, 8:33 PM
See I thought "if you can spare the time to write but cannot spare the time to review, then don't bother writing at all". Meant that you shouldn't write unless you could reply to all you reviews. And that's still what it looks like to me. It sounds like a demand when you put 'End of story' at the end, Ripper.

I have already told you what it is. Either accept it or not. notice that I did say an increased number of reviews, to the tune of a couple each week. An extra two reviews per week is still reviewing, and if you cannot even spare that time out of your writing, then why bother writing, especially if your writing is partially to garner reviews which you do not intend to return, reviews which others have the COURTESY to extend. Writing a fiction and claiming to not have time to review is a poor excuse. What you choose to interpret is your problem, not mine. However, do not misquote me, as I fail to see myself adding the end of story part to abovementioned quote. Of course, if you feel the need to misinterpret, then go ahead. I promise to try and not take notice.


I would also mention that since then I have reviewed 'No Man Is An Island' far more thorougfhly than lots of your other reviewers.

You reviewed "A Dish Best Served Cold." Unless you count a direct reply to one of my posts questioning me as a review for my fic. As I said, your review is as soon as your work is posted. I have upheld my end. I review for those who review for me. I have already told you what I will review, and you do seem to remember that. I fail to understand which part of that you fail to understand. Stop whining, and clutching at straws.


You are either being purposefully dense, or you are just incredibly stupid. Which is it, Ripper? It was clear I was saying that however invalid I thought his point, he had a right to it.


and that he hada right to an opinion, however invalid I thought it was

Yup, your quote right there. So he had an invalid notion. Even though it was invalid, and thus of no value to you, you had to point out that there was a possibility that he plain sucked. A reply to an invalid notion is an invalid reply, like the notion of fire being dangerous, and that the concept of playing with fire is by default dangerous. Your reply is by default invalid, as it deals with an invalid notion. How is "invalid" defined? "Falsely based or reasoned".


which he is not obliged to read or take notice of

Of course, there is also that. Why bother replying to an invalid notion, thus making the whole discussion invalid, including your brilliant replies, and state that he is not obliged to read it? If someone flames you on your thread, your fic, and says that you are not obliged to take notice or to read it, logic dictates that you deem it pretty illogical, right? Exactly what I was pointing out. Why point out something To Zerodius when his point is invalid, and when the point is not made for him to take notice of? You either do not understand English, or perhaps I should s-p-e-l-l it out slowly.



Yeah, I missed it the first time around. It wasn't relevant at the time I read it, so I forgot. Popular strictly in the review sense, Ripper. And that does matter, because as I'd already said, I thought you were a member of the 'Uber author' group because you got so many reviews (admittedly by gross breach of courtesy of rules in many occasions), so I would not think you were a basher of the group.

Of course you forgot. I tell you what. Why not take a trip down to my thread, take a look at whoever reviewed, and ask them whether I breached any rules? Of course, contact them on your own behalf, and avoid spamming my thread. What you think and what you think you know is pretty irrelevant to me. try not to overestimate yourself in my eyes.


I didn't refuse to accept it, I simply took what you said literally.

So, would someone blame Tolkien for being difficult to interpret, or would someone blame the reader for not looking hard enough?


I take co,mments like those literally, and take that to be your viewpoint

That comment is my viewpoint, although I exagerrated, as I said when I originally posted that. The main point Iw anted to make is that not reviewing because of writing time constraints is a poor excuse. Just like if you do not work your bloody socks off, you do not belong in given soccer team. Something coaches say all the time. They exaggerate, but people are expected to derive their meanings. I am no great coach, but I do not assume you are a great soccer player either.


From what you're saying, I take it your view isn't that far from my own?

No, except that I want to improve things, and I think that people SHOULD attempt to do the same, instead of half-baked excuses, it seems at times. Anyone who can spend 10 hours on a fic can spend fifteen minutes on a review, so that is a pretty poor excuse. Don't want to review, then don't. Just don't say something like that. Does not sit down well with the authors who need reviews. In a nutshell, I hope people change, but you seem to believe in status quo. We are different enough already.

indigestible_wad
5th January 2006, 12:31 AM
I wasn't actually talking about myself; I do review people who review me, and lots that don't as well :P Anyway, I think you might be getting what i was saying mixed up with somebody else. All I was saying is that some people only have the time to write (and I'm talking specifically about enjoyed authors here) and that as people are asking them to write, then they should write, even if they can't review their reviewers and other people themselvesOh no, I was trying to reply to GoGoTenda's post. I guess I did get mixed up.

pisces_beedrill
6th January 2006, 2:08 PM
*shakes head* If only that were true. It would make searching for good 'fics a lot easier. Fact is, people have different styles about how they go about getting reviews. People without connections, let's face it, tend to get bumped from the front page pretty quickly. There are those who don't have the time on the internet to establish a community of people willing to read and review their 'fic, or do not choose to, as GoGoTenda mentioned. Like it or not, general popularity with other members of the forum influences your review count.

that is very true. when you have no connections, or your new, your fic begins to die

Elemental Charizam
6th January 2006, 5:23 PM
Not really; Scrap's fic had a great deal of reviewers right away because it was avery good fic. Still, you will usually get (a lot) less reviews if you are unknown, because people don't know at a glance wether they'll enjoy the fic. In that respect, larger communities like FF.net may be better, because people are less likely to know who is good or not anyway, and have an equal chance of looking at a newer authors FF as they do of looking at a more established authors work. Provided the description and title are as catching, anyway...

Personally, I think it's a blend of luck and skill that makes some fics instantly loved and others banished to the cursed second page.

Jetx
6th January 2006, 5:32 PM
I like to post my fics here and in my forums (breloom woods) Because I'm used to this place and in breloom woods everybody reviews my fic because they feel they should because I'm thier admin. But reviewing my fics won't make me turn them into mods, they wish! ;)

mindripper
6th January 2006, 9:21 PM
In my first truly on topic post, I do think that this place is a mixed bucket. I think it is sometimes hit and miss, as in certain factors beyond one's control can lead to success or failure independantly of author's own abilities. That said, there is a great chance that everyone gets reviews at least, although perhaps not the kind we all want at times. This is a good place to post, probably as good as anywhere else for Pokemon fiction, but it is not the be all end all of fiction, just a good place with its pros and cons.

I would also like to extend an apology for seeming to greatly digress at times from the topic. What Zerodius meant I do understand, and further discussing that would merely lead to a larger debate. To Charizam, I just wanted to partially apologise if some of my words were taken to be a personal insult to you, as I did feel that I had perhaps overstepped the line at times upon re-reading what I wrote. I did mean what I say, even though that is another story for another time. What I mean is that even though I may disagree with your thoughts, and try to do justice to myself in any discussion, I do realise the mistake made by insulting a person personally. I hope that you accepted the relevant points instead of focusing on the slanging match which we often are involved in. Also, whether you may or may not have believed me then, your review is forthcoming as and when you post. I certainly do not apologise because I am embarking on some popularity campaign (which I despise, btw), but simply because it is within myself to do so. In a nutshell, I should not have said several things, and I admit it. End of story, so to quote myself.