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JohtoMaster
21st February 2006, 8:51 PM
(I made this post on Nsider also)

Ash, one of the few who inspired me and was a awesome role model to me when I was a kid. I wanted to dress like him, I wanted to get his hat(which I did), I wanted to think and breath like Ash. It seems Ash has touched the lives of many during his journey to becoming a Pokemon Master. But has Ash even come close to reaching that Plateau?

Ash has competed in 3 big leagues (Kanto, Johto, Hoeon) and smaller competitions such as the Orange League and Battle Frontier. Out of those 5, Ash has only won one Tournament, which is the Orange League. The results have yet to come for the BF though. But after spending basically the whole series trying to be number one, it seems that Ash has fallen short just by a trainer or two and misses the finals. I always wondered what it would be like when Ash faced the Elite 4, but it seems that When has yet to wait once more.

I would have liked to see Ash's journey come to a end or a hault after the Johto league. The series was not getting any better, but more of a downfall. In the Johto League, Ash made some historic marks in his life. Things such as encountering Entei, Suicune, Celibi, etc, including encountering Mewtwo for a second time. Ash also saw Lugia, which led him to see one of his greatest rival and friend Richie. Ash met one of the best trainers of them all, Lance. Ash finally discovers the legendary Pokemon that he encountered in the first episode with the help of Mort (4th gym leader) At the end of the Johto league, Ash faces his rival Gary, the one who was always better than Ash, and Ash beats him.

I know that this may seem like a Grocery list, because it is. Ash has done so much and all of that resulted in 3 seasons of Pokemon and as a result, Ash came up empty. Who knows, maybe these three seasons were to get more journeys and things to remember with before Misty split up and the show went down hill. I heard that during the Johto league, Ash was suppose to kiss Misty. I was actually waiting for that to happen, but it was just a silly rumor

Now with Hoeon, it seems like there is no excitement with Ash. Sure he has a new look and he gets all new Pokemon, but is this the first time that it has happened? I give Ash alot of credit for doing what he has done. Raising all of those Pokemon, especially those who gave him problems (Charizard) I consider Ash to be one of the greatest trainers, but why would one of those lose all the time, and seeing what could be improved on for next time.

I think Ash has come a long way. I would love to see him stay, but only if he could become better than what he has been. When the Kanto saga ended, my friends rumored that the new G/S/C character would be taking his place. I found this kid to be even color than Ash at one point and it would have been awesome if there is a spin-off with this guy and the red haired rival. It could have had alot of drama with Team Rocket coming back after three years, just like the games. This all possibly could have changed the way of the look of the anime, besides these repeats of Ash losing and team rocket blasting off again.

So what do you think?

nekusagi
21st February 2006, 9:00 PM
Ash will never leave the show. It would be nice, but it's not gonna happen.

JohtoMaster
21st February 2006, 9:09 PM
That's what alot of people said about Yugi leaving Yugioh, that it would never happen. He was the star of his own show and look what happened. Now the show is much more interesting, even if you are not a yugioh fan :P

Kabuto
21st February 2006, 9:13 PM
Ok, listen carefully. Ash is named after the creator of Pokemon Satoshi. He is based on the creator himself. We've had him for 9 years. Why watch a new kid do the same things Ash has been doing anyway.

KuwabaraTheMan
21st February 2006, 9:15 PM
That's what alot of people said about Yugi leaving Yugioh, that it would never happen. He was the star of his own show and look what happened. Now the show is much more interesting, even if you are not a yugioh fan :P
What? GX is universally loathed by everyone, and has nothing to do with the original creator.

I don't want Satoshi to leave Pocket Monsters. He's still interesting, and it just wouldn't be the same show without him.

CyberCubed
21st February 2006, 9:16 PM
Hmmm...


It seems Ash has touched the lives of many during his journey to becoming a Pokemon Master. But has Ash even come close to reaching that Plateau?

Ash's journey is not a short one, that much is certain. Each and every region he's become a much better trainer than the previous one, so he's certainly getting there.


Ash has competed in 3 big leagues (Kanto, Johto, Hoeon) and smaller competitions such as the Orange League and Battle Frontier.

I'd place the Battle Frontier above any of the others, as the Brains seem stronger than your average Gym leader and this apparently is an invite-only thing.


Out of those 5, Ash has only won one Tournament, which is the Orange League. The results have yet to come for the BF though. But after spending basically the whole series trying to be number one, it seems that Ash has fallen short just by a trainer or two and misses the finals.

That's because he still has a long way to go. If he won a league, that's great, but he'd still travel to the next region to compete in the following leagues. Winning a single league does not make you the greatest trainer in the world, the writers have made that much an obvious point.


I would have liked to see Ash's journey come to a end or a hault after the Johto league. The series was not getting any better, but more of a downfall.

Luckily AG reversed the downfall completely, and now the show is in its prime for the most part.


I know that this may seem like a Grocery list, because it is. Ash has done so much and all of that resulted in 3 seasons of Pokemon and as a result, Ash came up empty.

I wouldn't consider coming in the Top 16, winning the Orange Islands, and coming in the Top 8th twice to be "coming up empty." He doesn't need to win the entire thing to show that he's improving. He's caught, trained and evolved a lot of his Pokemon. He's met many friends and has saved the world a half dozen times from legendary Pokemon. It's a success story more or less.


Who knows, maybe these three seasons were to get more journeys and things to remember with before Misty split up and the show went down hill.

The show got better when Misty left, the show didn't go downhill. AG for the most part, has been critically acclaimed because it's on par with the 1st season. They got rid of the dead weight (Misty), brought in a female lead (May), and revived a stale series.

I don't see how you can say anything of AG is worse than either Johto or the Orange Islands.


I heard that during the Johto league, Ash was suppose to kiss Misty. I was actually waiting for that to happen, but it was just a silly rumor

You shouldn't listen to silly rumours then...that was never going to happen.


Sure he has a new look and he gets all new Pokemon, but is this the first time that it has happened?

He is also a mentor now and has taken May under his wing, along with her little brother who learns from him. AG is to show how much an improvement Ash has made over his old Kanto/Johto days.


I think Ash has come a long way. I would love to see him stay, but only if he could become better than what he has been.

Um, he has.

It doesn't take a genius to see that AG Ash > Kanto/Johto Ash in terms of training and battling ability.


When the Kanto saga ended, my friends rumored that the new G/S/C character would be taking his place. I found this kid to be even color than Ash at one point and it would have been awesome if there is a spin-off with this guy and the red haired rival. It could have had alot of drama with Team Rocket coming back after three years, just like the games. This all possibly could have changed the way of the look of the anime, besides these repeats of Ash losing and team rocket blasting off again.

It's the same writers. No matter what they do, the show will be the same.

I'm trying to figure out why "getting rid of Ash and co." would magically change the way the show is written.

All we'd get is some new dumb 10 year old kid starting his journey and doing all the same crap Ash did anyway.

Kenta in the Raikou special acting more or less the same as Ash. It's the same thing.


So what do you think?

Considering you don't seem to like AG, we disagee completely.

Kamex
21st February 2006, 9:43 PM
That's what alot of people said about Yugi leaving Yugioh, that it would never happen. He was the star of his own show and look what happened. Now the show is much more interesting, even if you are not a yugioh fan :P
Yeah, even Yugi's name the name of the show. But unlike many other series, Kazuki Takahashi decided to end the main Yugioh story while it was still somewhat fresh, instead of dragging it on too far. As for GX, I think it was a nice way to continue the series without extending the original story too much, but I don't for a second think the show is much more interesting than it was before.

As for Advanced Generation, I don't think having a new main character would do much good, unless the writers were to alter the main idea of the story quite a bit.

BTW, is there an anime version of the any Pokemon manga? Like Pokemon Special? If not, it'd be interesting to see how that went... although it might be a little too much like our current Pokemon anime.

ChaosMage
21st February 2006, 9:47 PM
It seems almost as if you think that being in the top 8 in the Hoenn League, which had several hundred contestents, all of which were capable of defeating 8 Hoenn gym leaders (and they were a fair bit tougher in Hoenn than they'd been in previous regions), and coming very close to defeating the trainer who eventually won the league with a team of pokemon which you haven't been training for all that long isn't very impressive. And another Kanto-Ash rip-off? I wouldn't watch it, I'll tell you that!

JohtoMaster
21st February 2006, 10:28 PM
It's funny how you all are trying to bring me down with your posts. You see I stopped watching the show after Team Rocket blasted off for the 109234u02q3u40q348u019348012480124801293480ew98r02 384203802385023948 time and such. Ash really has done well, coming near the finals for everything. I am not just talking about Advanced Generation or whatever it is called, I am talking about the franchise of Pokemon. I would like to see a new trainer start out much fresh and experiences instead of seeing the same thing happen over and over. Ash beating the leaders/trainers, team rocket blasting off, and Ash coming up short.

CyberCubed
21st February 2006, 10:30 PM
You asked what we thought, I replied. If you weren't looking for a debate, why bother making this thread?

New trainers = May. She's a new beginning trainer with a fresh experience and her own unique goal. You got what you wanted, so what are you complaining about?

Likewise if you aren't watching AG then how can you have an opinion on what Ash is doing, how good the show is, and what's going on? If you haven't watched any of Pokemon Advanced, you don't really have a good point to base your argument on. Besides, new characters WOULD be the same thing. It's the same writers, what are you expecting?

Ralts Master
21st February 2006, 10:31 PM
I'm sure my position of "Ash should never have been in Hoenn" is well-known by now...

nameless
21st February 2006, 10:51 PM
It's funny how you all are trying to bring me down with your posts.
So what do you think?

They gave you their thoughts on it which you asked for.

And besides kid, I'm not so sure how to explain this to you but the whole point of the franchise is to sell. They make games, they base the anime on it and advertise the pokemon from that region. It's the Pokemon and games that sell, not the main characters.

As Cybercube said, even if they change the character, which again would be pointless, it's still the same thing which you said your already annoyed with.


You see I stopped watching the show after Team Rocket blasted off for the 109234u02q3u40q348u019348012480124801293480ew98r02 384203802385023948 time and such.


Ash really has done well, coming near the finals for everything. I am not just talking about Advanced Generation or whatever it is called, I am talking about the franchise of Pokemon. I would like to see a new trainer start out much fresh and experiences instead of seeing the same thing happen over and over. Ash beating the leaders/trainers, team rocket blasting off, and Ash coming up short.

You complain about reptitiveness, yet even with a new rookie character we'll still end up seeing him/her more or less going through the same trials that Ash went through. Go to new region, see and capture new pokemon, meet powerful trainers, blast TR off, beat gym leaders and compete in league, repeat cycle.

I don't understand how you cannot see that. Even with May in AG, a new character, she's more or less running through a similar gauntlet. Go to new region, blast off TR, see new and capture pokemon, compete in contests, and then leagues, repeat cycle.

That and Pikachu is the established identity of pokemon, ask anyone these days about pokemon and they'll quickly reply, "the show with the yellow rat?"

And you'll probably say, "then give the new character a pikachu," then again, it'll be the same thing all over again.

ChaosMage
21st February 2006, 10:53 PM
Reasons Ash SHOULD have been in Hoenn-

-To mentor May, something we haven't seen any trainer do full-time
-His pokemon rox yo sox
-Because he still needs to win a league at some point
-Because n00b trainers like Kanto-Ash suck, and are pretty redundant
-Pikachu, everyone's fifth favourite electric mouse pokemon, will always need to be in the series

And many, many more...

pikachu!
22nd February 2006, 12:59 AM
Ash will never leave ash is like the main char if ash left the show wuould be stuipd. Yugioh change but pokemon wont!

Raevell
22nd February 2006, 2:52 AM
Wow, I can't imagine Ash leaving. Considering he's one of my favorite characters I would be pretty upset if he left. Luckily I don't see this happening, Ash the entire show is based on following Ash around. The Japanese public still likes Satoshi as well from what I can gather.

I do have to say, it's hard to base an opinion on something you've never seen. I don't understand how you can complain about a season that you haven't watched.

I don't see them doing to Pokemon and Ash what they did to Yugi-Oh. The show is doing well, especially in Japan (the movie was 2nd in box office sales concerning Japanese produced movies in Japan) I think it would be a very stupid move to drop a main character simply because they want to do something different. You can't and shouldn't do that when the show is doing well.

They have made changes, to say AG is like Johto only goes to prove you certainly haven't watch it. They brought in a new character, they've done tons of character development with Ash, and he continues to improve as a trainer. Yes, the show can be redundant, but so are a ton of other shows.

Take a look at the shows we in America produce; they're all law shows and crime shows and it's continuously the same exact thing. Someone murdered, find bad guy, DNA, prosecute, win or lose. Week after week after week this is what we watch.

Either way the shows are remaining interesting enough that they are bringing in an audience week after week. Pokemon is a prime time show in Tokyo.

I can see exactly where you're coming from though. I would love to see a few changes here and there but at the time it just isn't going to happen.

Excuse me for making a judgment on you, but it sounds like you're also a bit agitated with AG simply because Misty left and you didn't get the pokeshipping you expected at the end of Johto.

Anyway, as of now, Ash isn't going anywhere. And I wouldn't want him to.

JohtoMaster
22nd February 2006, 4:42 AM
I did watch most of the Advanced Generation and I was pretty amazed on how the changes occured. With updated graphics and new looks, I was pretty impressed. But what I am trying to say is that I wish that the show could explore more darker things, like encountering shadow Pokemon, that would be really neat.

Sure you have the movies and you have Team Magma and Aqua, but I am not much into the series anymore and I am just no longer interested.

Geki
22nd February 2006, 4:58 AM
Ash is by far my favorite character, and if they writers removed him, I would stop watching the anime. I'll never have to worry though, they'll never remove Ash and Pikachu.

ViNe WhIp
22nd February 2006, 5:35 AM
That would be the best thing to ever happen to Pokémon. Theres other changes I'd like to see like Jessie and James being fired and Meowth being assigned to a new couple, and for the love of god quit with the blasting off thing it was funny for what? The first 20 eps? If that but not anymore, have the new lead character start with a new pokemon something common like the Pokémon that appear on the first route in each game, have the chosen three from the beginning town stay together on their journy so the spotlight can be shifted around and isn't always on one character.

sweethart_772002
22nd February 2006, 6:37 AM
Oh...I love this. 8D

After watching Pokemon for years now, I have come to a conclusion that Ash is pretty much a static (is that the right word for it?), non-dynamic, character, who get ALL the credit, and now has lost all appeal to me ever since the end of the Jhoto seasons, and the beginning of the Hoenn season.

The Hoenn season, seemed too redundant for me. Everything Ash was going through was too predictable, and a lot of old stuff were being recycled. Like Ash's encounterment with May; In my opinion, it should have been more original, than having Ash destroy ANOTHER bike. =P

During the entire Pokemon series, Ash, in my opinion (once again), got too much credit for himself, and the spotlight was shined on him, just a bit much, for my taste. The Celebi movie, for one, I thought Sam should have gotten his chance to save Celebi, and revive Celebi in his arms, but no, Ash did it. =P

It also feels pretty cliche to see "the strong, young hero, reach the finals, but then loses for some stupid reason, even though you know he's strong enough to get through it" kinda thing. IMO it's like a official Mary-Sue, trying to be an underdog.

Also being on the subject of Mary-Sues, Ash has encountered pretty much ALL the Legendary Pokemon. Those pokemon, having some kind of connection/predicament with him.

I've always been eager to see the R/S/E characters, like Wally,and Brendan, star in at least ONE episode. Felt to me, that Ash is just taking over yet another region...filled with mishaps...adventure...yada-yada...doing the same ol'... (Though I'm happy May came in. =D There's one thing I'm happy about.)

The Pokemon World doesn't revolve around one young trainer, and his glories. It's about a community of people and thier bonds with thier Pokemon.
I want to see another trainer star taking his/her own journey through thier own region, and seeing how he/she reacts in given situations, maybe similar to Ash's--what ever!

I ask myself this a lot from time to time, which I really must get out of my head, and let someone else answer it >_<!

-Why hasn't any of the other major characters (Like Brock, Misty, etc.)gotten a bit more recognition like Ash has? You know, like his achiements in the movies and stuff like that.

And that's why I'm sick of Ash...=P (Though I still love him =] but, he needs to let someone else shine in his place every once in a while.)

I agree on your opinion. Ash NEEDS to step down. At least for a bit. (Something like how the Pokemon Special manga has it...yeah.) Pokemon wouldn't be the same without him.

[Edit]


That would be the best thing to ever happen to Pokémon. Theres other changes I'd like to see like Jessie and James being fired and Meowth being assigned to a new couple, and for the love of god quit with the blasting off thing it was funny for what? The first 20 eps?

Heh...I agree with you.

We need to rotate the villains around from region to region as well. It'd be fun to see a Team Aqua/Magma members hunting Ash and Co. down. xD; Then, if Ash goes back to Kanto, or whatever, Team Rocket would be back >:D and so on and so forth...(Catch my drift?)


If that but not anymore, start with a new pokemon, have the chosen three from the beginning town stay togeter on their journy

I'm all for that too! ~_~!
(Would be nice, for a change.)

ViNe WhIp
22nd February 2006, 7:05 AM
I totally agree with sweehart_772002's post. Btw I changed some things in my post around a bit to be a little more clear.

Seiryu
22nd February 2006, 7:19 AM
I also admit that I find Ash to be a rather tired character. I would like for him to step down even for just a little bit (even a small/medium-sized story arc based around one of the lesser characters would be nice! And one of the more one-episode-after-another arcs, not a collection quest spanning 100+ episodes), but unfortunately, the writers wouldn't allow it to happen. Aside from being named after the franchise's creator (Satoshi Tajiri) he's become almost as much of a staple to this anime series as that darn yellow rat. Plus, think of all the rabid fans that would jump down everyone's throats! For every May or Misty or Brock fan, there's probably one (or more) for little Ash.

Even if he didn't step down from the current anime, I think that making an anime series of the Special manga could jumpstart the series even more than AG did; it could very well bring back fans who lost interest in the old series. I mean, it doesn't stick with the same characters for more than one or two full series, it's got a bunch of different (and I mean completely different) plots and not the old collection quests that have become the staple of Pokémon/AG, and it would satisfy those of us who want something darker from the franchise. I doubt the creator would object to it happening, either; he did say that the Special manga "most resembles the world that [he] was trying to convey." Plus, since it has so many chapters in Japan, it would be a long time before we received any significant amount of pointless filler. =p

Only problem I could see with it being brought over here would be the dumbing-down it would likely get to make it more "suitable" for American audiences; there are a couple of scenes that wouldn't go down well with most children's dubbing companies. If it ever happens though, I just hope it doesn't get the dreaded "4Kids treatment"--you know, where Japan is apparently evil and showing anything with Japanese references would apparently corrupt our children? Yeah, that.

However, I'm not too confident about that happening either. So I'll just resign myself to waiting until the D/P region appears to see if they give us a new character. (which they probably will; as much as I hate to admit it, Brock's pretty much become dead weight, just like Misty, and he could very well be booted before it starts)

Eeveelution
25th February 2006, 1:06 AM
I see where you all are comming from, but thats what the main series is based around a character striving to be the best, from the beginning i remember ash a that cool character, who never gave up and wasn't the best pokemon trainer, which is realistic otherwise there would be like 50 pokemon masters at the same time.

but over the series Kanto, Jotho, Orange Islands & Hoen i see him slow change besides becomming a better trainer he seems to be dimming if i could put it that way, hes just not that good anymore, maybe its because i'm gettimg old and don't see him as a role model or maybe the writers wanted to change his values but hes just different.

But in respect he is still ash and with out him in the show it wouldn't be the same, but also i would like to add in that i liked misty, she was surly very moody with tempor etc, but also over the anime she has calmed down, befor she and ash would fight/augue alot and since togepi and the orange island she was just mellowed being calm, where i would be expecting her to lash out she also just be calm.

And lastly for what i have to say is anout brock, he use to be the expert the gym leader, i would think even though he isnt into that stuff about battling anymore but that doesn't mean he doesn't have the skill anymore, over the series ash slowly took over and became the expert even out doing brock with intel. and for one more point what ever happened to him with Prof. Felina Ivy and what happened to the GS ball.

Kabuto
25th February 2006, 1:51 AM
and for one more point what ever happened to him with Prof. Felina Ivy and what happened to the GS ball.


Ivy was trapped inside the GS ball hence why Brock cannot bare to speak of her tragic fate. Seriously, some mysteries are better left unsolved. Anyway, Brock and Misty were side characters who can step down but Ash is the main character with the main goal.

Magus
25th February 2006, 2:12 AM
Anyway, Brock and Misty were side characters who can step down but Ash is the main character with the main goal.
That doesn't mean Ash can't accomplish his goal at some point.

But if the writers were going to do that and still have the series continue without Ash, the end of Johto would've been the time to do it. Since they were "restarting" the series as AG, that would've been the time to replace Ash as the main character if it were ever going to happen. Since they didn't do it then, there's no reason they'd do it now. When Ash achieves his goal is when the anime ends altogether.

intergalactic platypus
25th February 2006, 2:21 AM
I think it would have been nice to see a new main in every reigon, but since it hasn't happened before it won;t happen now. Instead they'll drag in another new character (please make them likable instead of another May or Max), and that'll be the shows refreshment whenever it gets stale. Thats just how it works. It'll always be Ash and co

Champion Jared 14
25th February 2006, 3:13 AM
Hmn. I like Ash, though I agree that he is getting far too much spotlight for many people's tastes. Back in past seasons, with only brock and misty, the main plot was ebtirely about Ash's next gym battle, all the time. I liked it whenever there would be an episode where it would influence Misty or Brock. The whirl cup series was awesome to me IMO, because it didn't focus entirely on Ash. It was more focused on Misty, and she deserved it too. Misty is a water pokemon trainer, and she deserved to beat Ash and go farther than he did. She probably should've win anyway. If Ash won that competition, it would show that Ash would be a better water pokemon trainer than she was, and that's not right, for it was her goal, not his. May, has done a slightly better job of recieving spotlight. i'm glad the writers gave her something to do that would take an entire episode, more than once. What would be the point of May if she would become a new Misty, boring to millionth power! Team Rocket does give some decent comic relief, but they really aren't that evil like they were in the first ten episodes or something. Now, Team Rocket is kind of pathetic. Let butch and Cassidy, no they would blast off too, get some really threatening villains, and it would be bettet. And another thing. Team Rocket have been shocked over what, five hundred times? In reality, they would be dead. They are so weak, that they don't deserve to blast off every day. Every time a new person is introduced, Team Rocket has to try to steal their pokemon. And after they are retrieved from them, Ash has to shock them. Come on! You got your stuff back, so let them run like cowards if they want! We've all heard this before,"Ash, Team Rocket is getting away!" By this quote, nearly all the trainers would've got back whatever was stolen from them. "Pikachu, use Thunderbolt/Thunder!" It would be interesting if he would let May blast them off, or Brock. Let someone else do it! I'm sure pikachu's tired of it anyway, and wouldn't mind.

Anyone 4 Buttons?
16th March 2006, 1:27 AM
Ash shoudn't leave. Although I haven't really watched any episodes since JOHTO (I loved the Orange League), the films wouldn't be the same without him (I've seen all of those, except 8).
Pokémon Chronicles is fun - but it's not the same without him. Tracey & Misty do make up for him a little though...

Gily
16th March 2006, 1:52 AM
i dont think lots of the ppl would watch it if he did that... i used to like the yugioh show but i dont like the new one w/ that one guy as the main characer

UberSorcerer
16th March 2006, 11:39 AM
What? GX is universally loathed by everyone, and has nothing to do with the original creator.


You don't speak for me, or my friends who like subGX nearly as much as the subDM, and the characters were designed by Kazuki Takahashi you know, now let be get back to worshiping satan, casting evil spells, and summoning demon's to do my bidding in battle as a nice priest put it ^_^

Alphonse Elric
16th March 2006, 12:17 PM
But what I am trying to say is that I wish that the show could explore more darker things, like encountering shadow Pokemon
If shadow Pokemon are gonna be added to the show, then they should have added Rui and Wes from Pokemon Colosseum or something, I dunno. Anyway, I believe that Anime =/= Games.
On Topic:
Ash? Step down? Nah, don't think so. Yeah, it would have been cool if Kenta or Brendan had been the main characters or something, but, as somebody else has already said before, Ash is named after the dude who created Pokemon in the first place. The writers aren't gonna remove him for crap.
But I do agree that Ash has indeed exhausted the lime light or something. But it's also a good thing that he's matured, being May and Max'z mentor and all, and I appreciate that. At least he isn't that immature rookie trainer anymore, right?

YoshiAngemon
16th March 2006, 12:32 PM
Ash might end up accomplishing his goal in the league of the new region in Diamond/Pearl! Besides, If I've learned anything, it's that Ash only made it through 1 round in the Kanto League Tournament, and he made it to 4th Place in Johto, and he'll nail Second Place in the EverGrande Championship! If you follow this logic, then that means Ash is gonna become the Champion of the new Region's league, and that will be the Finale of the show!

And as for GX, Yugi's name was in it, but Yugi made a brief cameo, when he gave Winged Kuriboh to Jaden Yuki. So, in a way, he was also passing the Torch over to him.

frodo
16th March 2006, 4:01 PM
first of all , the creator does what he wants because it is his show and we r just watchers , and i am against the idea of changing ash . because if that happen , all old episodes will be of no meaning .
for example , if buffy from buffy the vampire slayer series was replaced by another hero , the show would failed because it was going to be anew series , the same with pokemon .
the reason why ash loses leagues is that the show is showing us the truth , i mean how can ash become the best trainer if he is just akid in aworld full of trainer and every one wants to be the best ?
i think that team rocket r very important in the show because many episodes depend on them , for example (claydol , big and tall) and (A Poached Ego).
at last , it will be acceptable to change any character but not ash

Magus
16th March 2006, 10:19 PM
Buffy the Vampire Slayer also had a spin-off that some fans thought was superior to the original. Star Trek's had 4 different series that didn't follow Captain Kirk and his crew. Gundam has I don't even remember how many series that don't involve anyone from the original series. Digimon has a different cast for each season.

There are plenty of examples of successful franchises having instalments where the original main character is nothing but a recurring guest star, or even not present at all. Pokémon has so far been about Ash's journey, but that doesn't mean a new series can't be made about another trainer's journey.

Kabuto
17th March 2006, 1:04 AM
Ash might end up accomplishing his goal in the league of the new region in Diamond/Pearl! Besides, If I've learned anything, it's that Ash only made it through 1 round in the Kanto League Tournament, and he made it to 4th Place in Johto, and he'll nail Second Place in the EverGrande Championship!

Unless I'm reading this wrong, know your facts. Ash was top 8 in Johto and top 8 in Hoenn as well

Kutie Pie
17th March 2006, 2:59 AM
I don't care for Ash.

And he can't leave the show. He's the known Chosen One as mentioned in the second movie. And besides, Ash is like the only person who is so totally nice to Pokemon (Though he tried to punch Mewtwo. POKE-ABUSE!) and has helped with many problems.

Besides, if he left, we'd have to deal with Misty and *shudders* Brock. And we haven't heard anything about his dad. So...HE STAYS!

pikachu_rocks19
17th March 2006, 3:02 AM
The show is still great











Trainer card made by d-man

CyberCubed
17th March 2006, 3:02 AM
Misty and Brock can't carry a series by themselves, they're just secondary characters with a loose goal and no real story arc.

Ash will continue to be the main character because of his popularity as well as being the shonen character for the series.

Magus
17th March 2006, 4:13 AM
If they ever did make a spin-off starring somebody other than Ash, it wouldn't be Misty or Brock. Probably not any character we've seen so far at all. If it were to happen, it would probably be a character based on one of the playable characters from whatever game comes after D/P. Of course, even that's not likely. Pokémon will probably simply end whenever Ash achieves his goal. If they were going to shift to a new main character, it would've happened when AG started.

Silver Ryu
17th March 2006, 4:31 AM
That's what alot of people said about Yugi leaving Yugioh, that it would never happen. He was the star of his own show and look what happened. Now the show is much more interesting, even if you are not a yugioh fan :P

Nooo....it's not. I say the first one was much better than GX. And seriously, Yugi >>>>>>>>>> Jaden. No questions asked. Personally, I think they should have just let it be and not continued it.

Anyhow, I like Ash, he's a good character, and he's changed and grown up a lot since the show started. But at some point, maybe it would be good to bring in someone else. I doubt it'll happen, though...

Deathborn_606
17th March 2006, 4:40 AM
There is no way that the creator is going to remove Ash from this show even though I would love another trainer from the GB and the GBA games to at least make a important appearence. But here are my thoughts.

1. Team Rocket- In the video games Team rocket was more so evil as taking over Saffron city and selling pokemon. Now in the anime we've got Jessie and James, Meowth, Wobbuffet, Dustox, Cancea and soon Manene. Now in basically every episode we see team rocket appear in a stealing plot for Pikachu who or another pokemon just blasts them off again. Now that's getting pretty darn old plus they should be dead.

2. In some cases espically the team rocket cases I don't see Ash and is pokemon that powerful to literally blast them off with a thunderbolt or overheat plus Team Rocket's pokemon should be somewhat more powerful.

3. Now we've got the leagues he's competed in. And in every one that was in the video games he comes in 8th place. And one of the friends he's made in those leauges always seem to beat him. Plus my opinion Ash is never going to be the pokemon master of the world for there are too many tougher trainers out there and some of his pokemon he doesn't seem to evolve. If I we're him I would even dump Pikachu for Manectric consider it's more powerful and remember when Bulbasaur did not evolve. We'll that's just crapp and also in all those other cases doesn't Ash get that evolved pokemon are more powerful
but doesn't for they don't wan't to and the creator's aren't going to change that.

4. And as for this cycle it had better not go like this. Ash starts a league beats gyms and doesn't get Tm's. Me makes friends and travels with them which if I we're on a journey I would go solo with just my pokemon. THen he gets to a league and loses to one of his friends he's made and just goes on another one which as we've seen always comes out with the same outcome. One can only hope that the 4th generation anime has something else that we'll apreciate.

Alphonse Elric
17th March 2006, 12:42 PM
There is no way that the creator is going to remove Ash from this show even though I would love another trainer from the GB and the GBA games to at least make a important appearence. But here are my thoughts.

1. Team Rocket- In the video games Team rocket was more so evil as taking over Saffron city and selling pokemon. Now in the anime we've got Jessie and James, Meowth, Wobbuffet, Dustox, Cancea and soon Manene. Now in basically every episode we see team rocket appear in a stealing plot for Pikachu who or another pokemon just blasts them off again. Now that's getting pretty darn old plus they should be dead.

2. In some cases espically the team rocket cases I don't see Ash and is pokemon that powerful to literally blast them off with a thunderbolt or overheat plus Team Rocket's pokemon should be somewhat more powerful.

3. Now we've got the leagues he's competed in. And in every one that was in the video games he comes in 8th place. And one of the friends he's made in those leauges always seem to beat him. Plus my opinion Ash is never going to be the pokemon master of the world for there are too many tougher trainers out there and some of his pokemon he doesn't seem to evolve. If I we're him I would even dump Pikachu for Manectric consider it's more powerful and remember when Bulbasaur did not evolve. We'll that's just crapp and also in all those other cases doesn't Ash get that evolved pokemon are more powerful
but doesn't for they don't wan't to and the creator's aren't going to change that.

4. And as for this cycle it had better not go like this. Ash starts a league beats gyms and doesn't get Tm's. Me makes friends and travels with them which if I we're on a journey I would go solo with just my pokemon. THen he gets to a league and loses to one of his friends he's made and just goes on another one which as we've seen always comes out with the same outcome. One can only hope that the 4th generation anime has something else that we'll apreciate.
Okay... Not totally getting your point, though. Yeah, first of all, that whole "Team Rocket taking over Saffron" = Game. And the Manectric thing, yeah if you're talking about Base Stat or something, then you are obviously talking about the GAME. And the whole "evolved Pokemon are waaaay stronger" is also, once again, GAME LOGIC. And as for the TMs, I'm not even sure if they exist in the anime world.
Summarization, Anime=/=Games.
And don't give any of that crap that Ash is a weakling who always loses or ends up in 8th place. I believe that he and his Pokemon have grown stronger for the past 9 years or whatever time it is in the Pokemon World.
If Ash steps down, and gets replaced with some rookie trainer, well, it'd just be deja vu all over again man. That trainer would most likely create the same mistakes Ash did. And that would just be like a re-run or something. Now THAT would be a really boring cycle.

Caithyra
17th March 2006, 2:02 PM
What I'm going to say is pretty much a moot point since some events have already happened.

I think that Ash should have been kept confined in Kanto. That for every new region and league there should have been a new lead. Ash is a very static character at the moment, since he is practically the star of hundreds of episodes he evolves too slowly so that the creators can say that "he does evolve, it just takes about fifty episodes for him to get it". Instead he is a pseudo-static character that has evolved a lot in the beginning and now have to do several things over again. Jessie, James and Meowth should have also been kept in Kanto with Ash, as their blasting off again and again and again etc. gets on my nerves.

In Jotho they should have concentrated on Jimmy, Marina and the red haired rival. They wouldn't have to have Jimmy being like Ash, Jimmy could be an easy-going guy who likes to tease a lot, and who is not clumsy but rather must learn to concentrate on the battles and actually show some spirit. Marina I think is fine with her Lance obsession. (Plus, Jimmy teasing Marina could have been the stuff of many humorous interactions.) Bashou and Buson were fine in the special, ruthless and evil enough to be a change to Jessie and James' juvenile attempts to catch one Pikachu.

In Hoenn, May was fine, but they should have put Brendan there, as in a serious Brendan who gets conned by his Professor father to "baby-sit" the flighty daughter of Birch's friend. Wally would also appear, and May would find herself desperately wanting to help him.

Battle Frontier could have been a story about Green, and to interest the younger male viewers they could have Bill following her.

What I suggested above is simple story-telling:

Ash would grow up much faster if it happened during one league only. Also, when they watch Ash grow up, Team Rocket will also start to grow up in response. If Ash was alone through the Kanto League with only Gary being a constant precense he'd have learned basic survival skills such as packing extra food in case someone would forget. He would also have learned pokémon training much faster. Either way, he would have grown up instead of making the same mistakes over and over again.

The Jotho arc would have been very character driven with Jimmy learning to be enthusiastic about something, and to feel strongly instead of the easy-going attitude at the beginning. Marina would learn that fame and appearance isn't everything. We would learn why Bashou and Buson is so ruthless, and they in turn would become less and less so when they start finding out that brute force and deception isn't always the key to success. The red haired rival, if he is truly Giovanni's son, would have to deal with that as well as evolve as he did during GSC.

In the Hoenn arc, Brendan would learn to lighten up, Wally would learn to stand up for himself, May would learn to be more independent and responsible while Team Aqua and Magma would both seem like really good guys doing the wrong things, and in the end the rise of Kyogre and Groudon would make both teams having to deal with what they have done.

Green could be a really conceited, pompous trainer who thinks she is the best because of being such a spoiled brat and powerful trainer. Her journey through the Battle Frontier could make her less and less so, to teach her compassion and grace.

I think I've forgotten what I was trying to say, but I think it runs along the lines of "No matter how the character looks, if they behave the same, all the time, it gets really old really quickly." Which is why I suggested a variety of characters above, with different problems to overcome. For some reason, I think I forgot to type something somewhere, please tell me if I'm not making sense.

frodo
17th March 2006, 3:54 PM
it will be adisaster if we have ahero for every season (my opinion)
look at digimon that has adifferent hero for every season , its seasons are not connected to each other and we have 4 seasons till now , and i think that nobody waits the 5th as we waited the 5th season of pokemon to see the rest of unendable pokemon story

Seijiro Mafuné
17th March 2006, 7:40 PM
...to the big Kyogre.

That is a good idea... badly executed. (Besides the fact that Jimmy is a poor name for Gold.) I mean, sure, it could work... but if we went with exactly your basis, I dunno if it would be that good.

As I said, good idea, but not that well done.

megakevinexe
18th March 2006, 1:03 AM
Nah, I think Ash should stay until the very end, because Pokemon might have it's downfall soon, and we've known Ash for too long to have someone replace him. It may be too late to have a new main character replace Ash in the series. It would be cool to see the trainer with the white hair in the show though... :)

Caithyra
18th March 2006, 9:02 AM
...to the big Kyogre.

That is a good idea... badly executed. (Besides the fact that Jimmy is a poor name for Gold.) I mean, sure, it could work... but if we went with exactly your basis, I dunno if it would be that good.

As I said, good idea, but not that well done.

Well, I just wanted to say that variety is the spice of life. That and I wanted the GSC story to be an anime. ^_^;

Alphonse Elric
18th March 2006, 10:53 AM
It would be cool to see the trainer with the white hair in the show though... :)
Trainer with white hair? Are you talking about Brendan from Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald or Wes from Colosseum? Maybe Ruby from Pokemon Special?

Seijiro Mafuné
18th March 2006, 1:59 PM
*Twitch*

You misworded it. You should have said 'Brendan from Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald|Ruby from Special or Wes from Colosseum?'

halloweenghost
18th March 2006, 5:07 PM
I think it is posible that pokemon could get a new main charecter and a new story but I guarentee you it qwill not happen until AFTER Ash becomes a pokemon master winning one of the leagues... since the series is Ash's story.

Kanto Trio
19th March 2006, 3:18 AM
I don't think Ash is going to leave the show when he still has a huge fan base. Maybe if we get a completely new Pokemon series then we may see a new hero.

As for my personal opinion I do hope that Ash still stays since I still like him. I personally don't find him boring or anything.

IrkenAdolescent
19th March 2006, 5:22 AM
Once Ash becomes a Pokémon Master, the series will end. He will probably end up winning a league after the BF, then going off into the mountains or another mysterious journey.

However, the DP series would soon come up, with a new hero, new villians, and new Pokémon. The series might have cameos and clues to past characters like in other shows.

For example, the new hero with his companion/s learn about a Pokémon Master from long ago who mysteriously disapeared into the mountains. then, in a beginning to a movie, or the premise for a special, or whatever, the new hero would encounter Ash, and challenge him to a battle. Ash would have a shade over his eyes, so all you would see is his his mouth smirking. He would send out Pikachu, also with a shade over its eyes, makign them both mysterious. Ash would win, and leave again, never to be heard from again.

Another cameo could be Gary being a Professor after the death of Oak. Misty would be a lot older (Maybe in her late twenties, early thirties), and completely runs the Cerulean Gym. Brock would be older as well, running the Pewter Gym. Tracey would still work at Oak's (Now Gary's) Lab. May and Max would probably take over their father's gym after he retires. These cameos probably won't show up, but some. might.

Anyway, the new hero would encounter villians, probably based on Team Rocket, if not still being Team Rocket, or a new aged TR with two new members. They may even give a clue abotu Jessie and James, saying they wish to follow in their footsteps (Don't ask me why anyone would). They might have a talking DP Pokémon as well. Their boss would either be a very old Giovanni (Much like The God Father), or Jessie, James, and Persian (Meowth would've evolved, making him more evil, and losing his human abilities).

The team would go around stopping New TR, wining gym battles, and so fourth. The show might even take a new branch, and not include gyms or leagues, and might go in the sole direction of fighting evil cooperations like TR. Of course, the new TR wouldn't have the same 2 people attacking them all the time, they would hire new villians every once in a while, who would re-encounter the team.

Wow, I had a LOt of ideas for this one :P.

Alphonse Elric
19th March 2006, 8:21 AM
Once Ash becomes a Pokémon Master, the series will end. He will probably end up winning a league after the BF, then going off into the mountains or another mysterious journey.

However, the DP series would soon come up, with a new hero, new villians, and new Pokémon. The series might have cameos and clues to past characters like in other shows.
;142; shade over his eyes, so all you would see is his his mouth smirking. He would send out Pikachu, also with a shade over its eyes, makign them both mysterious. Ash would win, and leave again, never to be heard from again.

Another cameo could be Gary being a Professor after the death of Oak. Misty would be a lot older (Maybe in her late twenties, early thirties), and completely runs the Cerulean Gym. Brock would be older as well, running the Pewter Gym. Tracey would still work at Oak's (Now Gary's) Lab. May and Max would probably take over their father's gym after he retires. These cameos probably won't show up, but some. might.

Anyway, the new hero would encounter villians, probably based on Team Rocket, if not still being Team Rocket, or a new aged TR with two new members. They may even give a clue abotu Jessie and James, saying they wish to follow in their footsteps (Don't ask me why anyone would). They might have a talking DP Pokémon as well. Their boss would either be a very old Giovanni (Much like The God Father), or Jessie, James, and Persian (Meowth would've evolved, making him more evil, and losing his human abilities).

The team would go around stopping New TR, wining gym battles, and so fourth. The show might even take a new branch, and not include gyms or leagues, and might go in the sole direction of fighting evil cooperations like TR. Of course, the new TR wouldn't have the same 2 people attacking them all the time, they would hire new villians every once in a while, who would re-encounter the team.

Wow, I had a LOt of ideas for this one :P.
Not bad at all. But do you really think THAT MUCH time will pass by when introducing the D/P Series? I mean, it's 20+ years already! And about TR being an evil corporation, they were only evil in the games, taking over Saffron and Goldenrod and all that, but they are really just, in my opinion, a cowardly corporation interested only in money. Now Cipher on the other hand, now that's an evil corporation, turning Pokemon into Shadow Pokemon and all...
Wait a minute! This kind of discussion is for games! Excuse me while I try to clear the topic...

Okay, so about Ash stepping down, again I say NO. It's possible that he may win a league someday, since his win stats are basically 1/8, then most likely 1/4 for the BF, the new league, maybe he's already in 2nd Place, making the stats 1/2...
Just a little bit more until Ash REALLY is the Champ.

Magus
20th March 2006, 9:00 AM
And about TR being an evil corporation, they were only evil in the games, taking over Saffron and Goldenrod and all that, but they are really just, in my opinion, a cowardly corporation interested only in money.
Don't let JJ&M's joke status color your perception of the entire Team Rocket organization. The real Team Rocket, people like Giovanni, Iron Masked Marauder, and Domino, are quite evil.

Yoshida Amane
20th March 2006, 6:34 PM
Even if people want him to leave, Ash/Satoshi probably won't.
As for his crappy skill in tournaments, he probably won't win until the end of the show. We already know he loses to Tetsuya in the Hoenn League, and there are still more episodes to come. For now, he's here to stay, and we can't do much about it. :)

Baby_Biyomon
21st March 2006, 3:42 AM
it will be adisaster if we have ahero for every season (my opinion)
look at digimon that has adifferent hero for every season , its seasons are not connected to each other and we have 4 seasons till now , and i think that nobody waits the 5th as we waited the 5th season of pokemon to see the rest of unendable pokemon story

Well to be honest seasons 1 and 2 of Digimon are connected, season 1 Taichi lead the digidestined and in 02 (despite Daisuke having Taichi's goggles) Takeru and Hikari lead the 02 digidestined against the Digimon Kaiser and later on against Arukenimon and Mummymon (Digimon's answer to Jessie and James) and later after that against Oikawa and then Belial Vamdemon.

03 Tamers was good and dark

04 Frontier was a disaster, the only good things were Patamon and Seraphimon, and Salamon and Ophanimon

05 should be interesting when it comes stateside soon.

Alphonse Elric
21st March 2006, 6:07 AM
Even if people want him to leave, Ash/Satoshi probably won't.
As for his crappy skill in tournaments, he probably won't win until the end of the show. We already know he loses to Tetsuya in the Hoenn League, and there are still more episodes to come. For now, he's here to stay, and we can't do much about it. :)
Yeah, there is still the Battle Frontier.
Besides, how the heck is Ash supposed to just leave, when he has become the icon of Pokemon (along with Pikachu)? Unless the writers decide to kill him off, WHICH WILL NOT HAPPEN.
Let's face it. Ash is here to stay until Pokemon itself is over.

Baby_Biyomon
21st March 2006, 12:32 PM
Or it slumps so bad they pull something desperate and have Satoshi killed for good (not like the cheap way he was killed in Mewtwo strikes back and revived)

Caseydia
21st March 2006, 9:26 PM
I'm too much in love with Ash for him too stop his pokemon master dread just yet. He still has a long way to go. With or without the same old friends.

Yoshida Amane
23rd March 2006, 12:13 AM
I'm too much in love with Ash for him too stop his pokemon master dread just yet. He still has a long way to go. With or without the same old friends.

-_-' xD

We all have to admit, Pokemon's been on for ten years. We don't know how soon it could end.

And I've heard a rumor about (I'm not sure this is a spoiler coz I don't think it's true) Satoshi being eaten by Squirtles at the end of the series. This would obviously not be televised in America.

◘Ins0mnIac◘
23rd March 2006, 12:23 AM
it will be adisaster if we have ahero for every season (my opinion)
look at digimon that has adifferent hero for every season , its seasons are not connected to each other and we have 4 seasons till now , and i think that nobody waits the 5th as we waited the 5th season of pokemon to see the rest of unendable pokemon story
Hard to say it any better than that.....except the typos. :P

Magma Grunt Alex
23rd March 2006, 12:30 AM
I think Ash should Step down:

Hes been too popular on TV lately and I am waiting for a New trainer to come and not take his place, but Like a new trainer that lives in a huge city and he or she does not travel. Though, my idea sound pretty dumb saying "who is he gonna battle" and stuff. Like, there could be contests and other stuff he/she can enter in this big city or somethin.

But overall, I think ash had a little too much fame.

POKErUsAm
23rd March 2006, 12:37 AM
to me ash leaving is pretty sad but i dont care to much.
what i really want to see ash do before he leaves(if he does which wont happen :p)is to battle someone like red from g/s/c on mnt silver.
someone who could totally kill him but surprise the adiance with some amazing comeback and actually become #1.not that it would happen but it be very cool for him to leave that way...

goldfly2005
23rd March 2006, 12:54 AM
Ash is by far my favorite character, and if they writers removed him, I would stop watching the anime. I'll never have to worry though, they'll never remove Ash and Pikachu.
everyone would stop watching tha anime.
they should never get rid of ash;they should replace brock and give max some pokemon, and age them though..

Alphonse Elric
23rd March 2006, 1:10 AM
Or it slumps so bad they pull something desperate and have Satoshi killed for good (not like the cheap way he was killed in Mewtwo strikes back and revived)
How low would the writers go to actually get Ash killed off?

Alastor DMc
23rd March 2006, 7:06 AM
everyone would stop watching tha anime.
they should never get rid of ash;they should replace brock and give max some pokemon, and age them though..


I think it's rather presumptuous to speak for everyone, Goldfly. I for one would have loved to see a new trainer introduced, but since it didn’t happen back in Johto or Hoenn, I doubt it’ll happen in D/P. A new series staring the new hero would be rather interesting though. The show focuses on him, with May and Ash appearing here and there, not just as rivals, but to teach him and help him improve. He’d go on a badge quest, obviously, but they could give him something else to shoot for… like maybe actually filling up his Pokedex. Each episode could focus on him trying to, and eventually catching a different D/P pokemon, with a few eluding him till the very end, or maybe all together. This could also be a cool way to introduce the different types of pokeballs into the anime. It’ll never happen, but I’d like it to.

Astinus
24th March 2006, 9:26 AM
You know, Ash's original goal was to become a Pokémon Master and fill up his Pokédex. That never happened. If Ash's quest hasn't been resolved in ten years, what makes you think that all of a sudden it will be?

I'll still watch it if Ash leaves. I mean, I still watched Digimon when Tamers came out, so...nah. It's not really the characters some people get attached to. It's really just the franchise as a whole.

Alphonse Elric
24th March 2006, 9:38 AM
You know, Ash's original goal was to become a Pokémon Master and fill up his Pokédex. That never happened. If Ash's quest hasn't been resolved in ten years, what makes you think that all of a sudden it will be?

I'll still watch it if Ash leaves. I mean, I still watched Digimon when Tamers came out, so...nah. It's not really the characters some people get attached to. It's really just the franchise as a whole.
That's because Digimon didn't have 400+ straight episodes with only Taichi as the main character.
Ash has been around since the very first episode till now. It would be quite a shock if the writers suddenly just throw in a new guy *coughYu-Gi-Oh Gxcough* when the audiences are already used to Ash. Kinda like the whole Misty- May thing. Just goes to show some of us aren't open to change.

Californian_DJ
24th March 2006, 10:00 AM
Come on, get real, getting rid of Ash is like...killing the show. the show has followed ash since the first day he became a trainer, it has followed him as he tried to reach the indigo plateau, and joined up with misty and brock, including many episodes that I even downloaded to see them again, like: Pikachu's goodbye (that's one of the better kanto episodes imo), Pokémon, I choose you (the spearow part where ash tries to protect Pikachu is so touching) and the whole ash/richie storyline from the Indoge league has always been one of my favourites.

then ash moved on to the range islands, and I must admit, I thought it sucked Brock left the show. and Tracy just didn't fill in that space. the orange series where good though, they showed some interresting places, although I think the gymleaders should have had those tropical colored Pokémon, that would've been more interesting. (but that's just an opinion). the battle against Drake was awesome, and we finaly had a 6 on 6 battle. it even got better when Ash won in the end.

then it was on to Johto. Tracy stayed with prof. Oak, and brock came back. the show seemed to become better, but could I have been further from the truth. don't get me wrong, the legends thing, like meeting suicune, hearing about Ho-oh, and even some of the gymbattles, like Clair and Whitney, where great. but they seemed to focus so much on introducing new Pokémon after new Pokémon, that they forgot that the bond between the characters was important too. for a moment I thought this would be the end of Pokémon, yet the Silver conference restored my confidence in the show. Ash finaly beats Gary in a match likie he has never had before. okay, so he gets beaten by Harrison, but he still made to top 8, which is better then top 16.
Then Misty left, and I was sad. I was at least hoping for a goodbye kiss, or for Misty to leave Ash a letter to explain her feelings, but that didn't happen...although I love her song (in gotta catch you later). brock left too, but the departure of Misty got to me mor then Brock's did.

and then it was of to Hoenn, with only Pikachu by his side. the moment May got introduced I was afraid she would be a tracy clone, never able to fill in for misty, but I was proven wrong. May plays the part better then Misty ould've ever done. she's refreshing, and it's great to see each being the expetiënced trainer. okay, I only started to really like her after Rustburo city, when she diced that contest where hert hing, which made the story better then having 2 trainers win badges. okay, brock came back, but I wish he would've stayed. it's more like..Brock light, okay, so the old jokes are still there, but these jokes don't work anymore, they're old, and without Misty it's just not as funny anymore. then there's Max, and I swear, I wish that kid ended as a Gyarados meal or something. apart from that little brat the show is taken to a whole new level. the battles are better then ever, the Pokémon Ash catches seriousley rock, and the Hoenn league was/is fantastic. okay, so he end up being in the top 8 once again. but let's not forget, last time he lost to harrison, who only made it to the last 4, thi time he lost to Tyson, who won the whole championship, so in fact it is somewhat better then losing to a losing trainer.

and then the battle frontier. I have watched some of the episodes ion Japanese, and I really like it. the frontiers make more of a challenge then the gym leaders, and the Pokémon on the characters teams are better then ever.

Ash should stay, and make his journey through ???, perhaps even ending up being in the top 4, I mean, if Ash wins, then there's nothing left to do for him, he would've achieved his goal, and he still has to travel through the new regions, nd meet all these new POkémon (and it makes good advertising for the games).

my Opinion: Ash still rocks, and taking him away would be suicide to the show.

Alphonse Elric
24th March 2006, 10:15 AM
Come on, get real, getting rid of Ash is like...killing the show. the show has followed ash since the first day he became a trainer, it has followed him as he tried to reach the indigo plateau, and joined up with misty and brock, including many episodes that I even downloaded to see them again, like: Pikachu's goodbye (that's one of the better kanto episodes imo), Pokémon, I choose you (the spearow part where ash tries to protect Pikachu is so touching) and the whole ash/richie storyline from the Indoge league has always been one of my favourites.

then ash moved on to the range islands, and I must admit, I thought it sucked Brock left the show. and Tracy just didn't fill in that space. the orange series where good though, they showed some interresting places, although I think the gymleaders should have had those tropical colored Pokémon, that would've been more interesting. (but that's just an opinion). the battle against Drake was awesome, and we finaly had a 6 on 6 battle. it even got better when Ash won in the end.

then it was on to Johto. Tracy stayed with prof. Oak, and brock came back. the show seemed to become better, but could I have been further from the truth. don't get me wrong, the legends thing, like meeting suicune, hearing about Ho-oh, and even some of the gymbattles, like Clair and Whitney, where great. but they seemed to focus so much on introducing new Pokémon after new Pokémon, that they forgot that the bond between the characters was important too. for a moment I thought this would be the end of Pokémon, yet the Silver conference restored my confidence in the show. Ash finaly beats Gary in a match likie he has never had before. okay, so he gets beaten by Harrison, but he still made to top 8, which is better then top 16.
Then Misty left, and I was sad. I was at least hoping for a goodbye kiss, or for Misty to leave Ash a letter to explain her feelings, but that didn't happen...although I love her song (in gotta catch you later). brock left too, but the departure of Misty got to me mor then Brock's did.

and then it was of to Hoenn, with only Pikachu by his side. the moment May got introduced I was afraid she would be a tracy clone, never able to fill in for misty, but I was proven wrong. May plays the part better then Misty ould've ever done. she's refreshing, and it's great to see each being the expetiënced trainer. okay, I only started to really like her after Rustburo city, when she diced that contest where hert hing, which made the story better then having 2 trainers win badges. okay, brock came back, but I wish he would've stayed. it's more like..Brock light, okay, so the old jokes are still there, but these jokes don't work anymore, they're old, and without Misty it's just not as funny anymore. then there's Max, and I swear, I wish that kid ended as a Gyarados meal or something. apart from that little brat the show is taken to a whole new level. the battles are better then ever, the Pokémon Ash catches seriousley rock, and the Hoenn league was/is fantastic. okay, so he end up being in the top 8 once again. but let's not forget, last time he lost to harrison, who only made it to the last 4, thi time he lost to Tyson, who won the whole championship, so in fact it is somewhat better then losing to a losing trainer.

and then the battle frontier. I have watched some of the episodes ion Japanese, and I really like it. the frontiers make more of a challenge then the gym leaders, and the Pokémon on the characters teams are better then ever.

Ash should stay, and make his journey through ???, perhaps even ending up being in the top 4, I mean, if Ash wins, then there's nothing left to do for him, he would've achieved his goal, and he still has to travel through the new regions, nd meet all these new POkémon (and it makes good advertising for the games).

my Opinion: Ash still rocks, and taking him away would be suicide to the show.
But the question is, "Will Ash actually achieve hs goal?"
I think that's the whole point why the writers have no intention of removing Ash.

Omega Pirate
24th March 2006, 10:43 AM
He should've stepped down a long time ago. It's probably too late now.

MechaBulba
24th March 2006, 11:16 AM
Ash should never go! Thats stupid if they got read of him after all his been throught i mean his the whole focus of the show!
If u remove Ash u remove everything the show has been.
May and Max will be no more and it will be intresting 2 see them grow in D/P.
All the backstory chjaracthers like, oak, his mum, tracy, misty, gary etc will be no more.
No more Jessie, James and Meowth
All the cool pokemon his has captured over the years will be gone bye bye charizard, bye bye kinglar, bye bye scepentile, snorlax, swellow, torus etc....
Ash still needs 2 bevelpe as a trainner becoming strong and capturing more pokemon 2 interacte with the Oaks lab group.

If u remove Ash then you remove the shows history.

Alphonse Elric
24th March 2006, 11:23 AM
Ash still needs 2 bevelpe as a trainner becoming strong and capturing more pokemon 2 interacte with the Oaks lab group.

Ash needs to what? Bevelpe?
Yeah, Ash needs to develop as a trainer. He has matured a lot, now serving as a mentor for May and Max. Maybe someday when he's mature enough, he'll actually win at a league.

He should've stepped down a long time ago. It's probably too late now.
What's your reason for saying so? If you're just going to state, "He's always in 8th place, he lost to Tyson at the Hoenn League.", that's true, but asking him to step down? Eh, we won't be seeing any new main characters until Ash becomes PokeMaster.

Californian_DJ
24th March 2006, 11:35 AM
will ash achieve his goal...well, I guess it'ssafe to say he won't. as I allready wrote, if ash achieves his goal, it means he finaly is a Pokémon master, and there's no need for him to participate in new leagues. and that means no extra focus on new games. Ash will only achieve his goal when there will be no more new Pokémon games.

but let's keep ash on the show, shall we, he's come a long way, and I really don't want another kid doing the same stuff....unless it's some sort of future spin-off...

Captain Brain
25th March 2006, 2:44 AM
Ash as you recal won the Orange league. Not to mention the fact that they already made spin-offs of pokemon, not very succesful. Then again, there'll probally won't be another pokemon anime that'll be succesful while the origonal is out.;025;

Crimson Kitsune
25th March 2006, 4:18 AM
I say forget trying to pull Ash out of the series, because Ash is the series!! You pull Ash, and the rest of the show goes right along with him.

On another note, I would like to see some of the manga characters, maybe even shadow pokemon and Cipher!

S_P
25th March 2006, 8:59 AM
How low would the writers go to actually get Ash killed off?

I'm under the impression that "the chosen one risking his life to save the world" is actually a rather honorable end. It would be overly depressing, but it would be perfectly along his character to do so. Dying isn't the best ending or the way to step down, especially for pokemon, however I do believe risk to save a life or the world is actually a rather common trend. This is apparent throughout the anime and definitely displayed in movies. It goes well with his character, so it would make sense to a certain degree.

That doesn't mean I would want him to die, but there were very many instances where he puts himself at great risk to do a good deed like save a life.

In terms of a real ending to the series, that would be rather finishing. I won't say it would be fitting, however, if there's some "certain route to become a pokemon master", completing the tasks or components to be one would become increasingly more predictable.

A death on the other hand, may be extremely sudden (yes, Satoshi wanting to stop the fight was obvious in the first movie, but going inbetween the fireballs and turning into stone was probably not as obvious. Actually, I didn't even know turning into stone was possible.) Whereas if he has to beat a certain sequence of requirements like gyms or qualified trainers that reward for a victory would force a must win situation.

You can lose and always continue to aspire towards a pokemon master, but a death is a complete stop. Even after being a pokemon master, technically it can still continue. If Satoshi did step down, the series could technically still continue.

I would say have different context of episodes and progression, and overtime that has occured, so I see no reason to step down, though I suppose repetition in certain regards should lessen, or be different enough to be less obvious.

A transition like from Jouto to Houen I thought was good because of "critical condition". It was more dangerous. (Though the "suicidal music" or the "extremely depressing music" of pokemon is actually one of my favourites, probably due to the emotional feel. And yes, it can cause one to try if the content was that emotional).

As much as I like Kenta, the main guy of G/S/C, I would find it highly awkward if he were the new hero. He was great as a chronicles side storyline, however I would have absolutely no idea how he would span a long series of episodes. The content and criterion would be completely different, because his side of the story utilizes more incorporation. It's more like straight down to business. He seems to have more pokemon battles (and a more depressing or serious backstory, having a more aggressive rival and two childhood friends with limitless possibilities. Satoshi has more home mystery, but less identified neighbours, like how you don't know the other two trainers from Pallet whatsoever.)

So basically Kenta works for a movie, or a short series, though Satoshi is key on a long series. Sure Kenta has relatively tons of backstory, but it wouldn't be explained either, like how you also know nothing about Satoshi before he was 10 aside from the fact that he worked hard to get his hat and basically aspired to be the best trainer ever. Otherwise, there's basically no information, but maybe that's also because there's nothing in it, but it can generate mystery speculations. Kenta's straightforward approach is so singular direction that if he goes to a gym battle, he goes in, wins the badge, then comes out. Unlike Satoshi, he has no interruption from the Rocket Gang in general. The encounter in the Raikou Special was due to Raikou. However, it seems like only Kenta's personality complex is closest to matching with Satoshi's, though really it's actually extremely different. Kenta is merely a solid trainer, since the Raikou's case was more of pokemon understanding and had absolutely nothing with saving the world. It's basically like Satoshi's encounter with the baby Lugia. Different fashion, but similar trouble, though still completely different.

Pokemon just happens to be virtually the longest continuous anime, if not the longest already. It easily looks like it can surpass the length of any anime, and still have enough room to have spin-offs and other short stories, because you can generate virtually infinite things from it.

I guess it's only due to duration that Satoshi seems old. I personally think it is long and draggy, of course that's probably due to all the fillers (I basically stopped watching as soon as fillerific Jouto section started, and ended up missing the gym battles I wanted to see because I felt it took too long to get to Olivine City lol.)

Though apparently a lot of my favourite episodes are the progressive ones, where Satoshi resolves something that goes along with his goal.

So sure while it's too much Satoshi, even Kenta would appear unfitting. Sure Kenta isn't as strictly pokemon, but based on what it seems like what he does, is in fact that. He battles a trainer, hi nice to meet you I will beat you, he wins, comments, exchanges numbers, then moves on and grooms his pokemon. Satoshi's travels is more like adventuring and learning, Kenta's feels more like work and aspiration to grow stronger. So it's like exploration versus goal orientation. If both goals were to become a pokemon master, Kenta's would be structurally correct, though Satoshi's would get the full view because his learning is with a group. Kenta, though he works well with Marina and Jun'ichi, clearly travels alone.

Yeah, so Satoshi is better on marketing, or rather I should say displaying interest in almost every single pokemon. Kenta's seems more incorporated, where they go along with it, but unless it's like a Legendary, it doesn't seem like specific attention.

Just like the anime and the specials, Satoshi's is a daily (or rather, weekly) effect, and Kenta's is a one shot thing (or once in a while, if he ever appears again).

And yes, although it's still pokemon, Kenta I am quite sure, would have a COMPLETELY different feel. Despite similarities, the differences are too great.

In terms of the anime, I was rather surprised that Haruka became a main character, though that's also because of the Kanto separation. Anyhow, my point there was sure Haruka could hold the spotlight, but also due to the contest aspect, you don't apply the training agenda. Thus, this makes her much more complementary to join Satoshi, rather than be the main focus. On the contest that works fine, but if it was just Haruka alone, there would probably be several limitations. It would feel just as goal oriented as Kenta's straightforward approach.

Now if you apply Marina, I don't think I'm even interested in the full details about becoming an Idol Trainer, even if she was my favourite character in general, until the introduction of Haruka in 2001 or so(2003/2004 by anime means). To that regards, since it is less pokemon oriented, is harder to apply pokemon directly. It's great in character context, but aside from the usage of pokemon to represent the character, there seems to be basically no need to focus on the pokemon presented. And thus, the same problem goes for Kenta. Only Satoshi really fits this characteristic, though that's probably also due to the fact that he already was the main character, so of course minor characters wouldn't seem to fit the bill.

Kenta, despite being a "main character", never seemed to come close to have appeared in the anime at all, thus not only would it make him not only minor, but actually less important than minor characters because he literally has no existance in Satoshi's storyline, aside from brief mentions by Jun'ichi and Elm (and for Elm's case, it doesn't even show up in the dub! I don't even think the word Kenta was even said in all my years of watching the dub, come to think of it).

So yeah, not even Kenta could maintain that magnitude that Satoshi presents. If a step down happened, it would be totally different, or have a completely different feel. Even the Hosos feel rather unique, and while are definitely nice in their own regards, is indeed highly unusual with no sign of Satoshi. Even Pikachu specials can have that feel (aside from the fact that it's usually friendship, lots of fun and games in a large environment, saving pokemon from troubles, resolving issues, and the fact that you don't know a think they're literally saying).

Yes, bring something new, but taking out Satoshi isn't it. If that were the case, it would have to be a Hoso, or not related to the continuity of the anime. And yet, Hoso's are side stories that go along with the anime, since technically they do all exist along with the regular storyline. Yeah, taking him out in that regards wouldn't work.

Sure the other characters have interesting storylines, but how do you incorporate the adventures is beyond me. It feels overly structured, and if it were to be displayed, it would be too short, and thus again, it would work better as a Hoso. However, this probably is only due to the non-main character effect or being a minor character.

Actually come to think of it, Haruka as a main charactre probably would work better than say, Kenta. Though again, that's probably due to the daily effect.

It's strange though, since you can easily think of Kenta alone, but I personally find it highly unusual to think of just Satoshi or just Haruka, in the context of a full episode if just one of them with their pokemon. There always needs to be some form of companionship, or it doesn't seem fitting. (Of course if Haruka was alone, it's possible there probably would have been no Masato, or it would also seem highly awkward).

In terms of continuity, it seems like conditions in episodes where Satoshi was without his companions, he ran into the most trouble (okay so that can go for anyone, really). The first episode, and the transition into Houen include cases like these, and Pikachu undergoes rather extreme conditions, both extremely close to dying. Although I don't like torment in pokemon, pokemon in extreme conditions also somewhat increase the value of life in that context, and thus I feel scenes with those are more emotional and important.

So even if it's awkward to have a step down, having pokemon just about Satoshi is equally awkward, because he is about friendship and such.

I would say no to the question, but at the same time, I want a continuity with new adventures (if it's going to be filler, at least it should be a more unique context. Incorporate a new pokemon, don't showcase it like it's a supernatural powerful pokemon all about it.). Like, incorporating Bashaamo was nice (though a bit too powerful with it's unbeatable sort of condition), because the episode didn't focus on it. It was a clear showoff, though (and yes I personally dislike Satoshi's tournament losses, because he wasn't any weaker than the opposing trainer. In Kanto, TR severely weakened him, in Jouto Bayleef could have been retreated and have Lizardon first because he knows Grass has the disadvantage or that having Bayleef against TWO fire pokemon in a row is a bit much, and Houen well I was under the impression that Pikachu's Thunderbolt should have been stronger that Nyasu's, though I guess that super Metagross was reasonable enough, but in that context throw in a Lizardon and voila but no, only Houen pokemon and Pikachu. Yes I know it's not that simple but an element Satoshi usually thrives on is in fact, Fire, which goes perfectly against Steel.).

Shrug, I'm more in interest of character composition, while incorporating pokemon, rather than having the main focus on the pokemon. It is Satoshi's adventure, afterall.

Captain Brain
26th March 2006, 12:30 AM
Another point is if Ash died and Pikachu lived on. What would be pikachu's fate. Like Pokemon the First Movie, but Ash dosen't come back. Would Pikachu go with Max?

Awnser: No, this probaly never happen. 99.9999999999%. ;025;

ShoOCha0tic
26th March 2006, 12:42 AM
i could careless for ash to leave or not. but i want the repetitivness(sp?) to stop! make team rocket WIN FOR ONCE!!!! and STOP MAKING THEM BLAST OFF -.-

Alphonse Elric
26th March 2006, 1:24 AM
Another point is if Ash died and Pikachu lived on. What would be pikachu's fate. Like Pokemon the First Movie, but Ash dosen't come back. Would Pikachu go with Max?

Awnser: No, this probaly never happen. 99.9999999999%. ;025;
Again, I say:
Why on earth would Ash die? Would he suddenly get a heart attack so the writers can make an excuse to make a new main character?

shervin
13th April 2006, 7:39 PM
i think max should be the main character, goes back and gets the ralts and ash would still be in it. and because sometimes, the show relates a bit to the games it should do with the manga. and ash could be like red, presumed dead and max and pikachu could go off looking for him.

charmanderandswampertguy
17th April 2006, 8:28 PM
pokemon would not be the same though at one point when i first got gold i imagined the gsc boy taking his place and he had
feraligatr
pikachu
charmander
noctowl
espeon
heracross i only imagined this and i made it the guy with the red hair had
meganium
sneasel
gengar
alakazam
skarmory
kingdra

Aptenodytes
18th April 2006, 6:20 PM
Umm, no. Ash is basically the whole point of Pokemon, so why would he step down? If they were going to do this, they would've done it on the 2nd season.

HarleyScarow
21st April 2006, 7:46 AM
I think that this should be how it works:
1. Kanto- Ash wins Kanto League against Gary in the final round.
2. Orange Islands- Ash wins Orange Cup.
2. Johto- New characters; Gold, Silver, and Kris. Gold wins Johto League when battling Silver in the final and Kris is like, everything else.
3. Hoenn- May enters 8 Pokemon Contests (loses 3) and wins the Grand Festival. Brendan beats Tetsuya in final round of Hoenn League and wins.
4. Battle Frontier (Not Kanto Battle Frontier!)- Brendan enters Battle Frontier Facilities and wins. May enters 8 Pokemon Contests (loses 3) and wins Battle Grand Festival, which is something that I made up.
5. Kanto- The characters of FireRed and LeafGreen are here and they win Kanto League and the Grand Festival in Sevii Islands.

Pokemon should be more original and drop the characters every season to keep the show fresh, even though I think that it's good right now because of May and Max in it. This is just my opinion, though.

sam_h12
21st April 2006, 2:20 PM
yeah. any former digimon fans? digon was great because of different characters every season.

ASH SUCKS. he is a crap trainer. he never battles unless it's against gym leaders or the odd pidgey/rattata trainer (hehe). he's never heard of moves like light screen, water pulse, protect or any other great moves which i cant think of right now...he just uses the obvious moves repeatedly. pikachu's thunderwave wouldve come in handy. Donphan's sandstorm/earthquake?

get rid of him. NOW

npdargy312
22nd April 2006, 11:42 PM
I think, there shud b a spinoff w/ Ash's son/daughter and his/her adventure

Phantom_Bugsy
23rd April 2006, 12:22 AM
^Really, if you want that, go read some poorly written fanfiction.

Captain Brain
23rd April 2006, 12:38 AM
It's funny how you all are trying to bring me down with your posts. You see I stopped watching the show after Team Rocket blasted off for the 109234u02q3u40q348u019348012480124801293480ew98r02 384203802385023948 time and such.

If you have been watching Battle Frontier you would have noticed that even though TR has so far been blasted off in every episode, they have thought things through a lot better and will probably even succeed sometime in the future or at least try and catch a Pokemon illegal only once in awhile. ;025;

S.Suikun
23rd April 2006, 1:03 AM
yeah. any former digimon fans? digon was great because of different characters every season.

ASH SUCKS. he is a crap trainer. he never battles unless it's against gym leaders or the odd pidgey/rattata trainer (hehe). he's never heard of moves like light screen, water pulse, protect or any other great moves which i cant think of right now...he just uses the obvious moves repeatedly. pikachu's thunderwave wouldve come in handy. Donphan's sandstorm/earthquake?

get rid of him. NOW
This is the perfect example of the casual anime fan. Hasn't bothered watching past the first 10 episodes of Indigo or simply doesn't pay attention.

Payne
23rd April 2006, 5:18 PM
i like ash and I think hes doing a great job, theres no way they would just replace him, its ash thats keeps the series going. But i do think he needs way better pokemon and to quit using stage 1 pokemon, also they could have him win a league champion ship and not have the story end. Its going to take more then him just wining a championship for him to become the worlds greatest pokemon trainer. Also i just cant see may taking over for ash because as good as her contests are i could not imagine every episode with her doing contests and prefer battling

npdargy312
24th April 2006, 9:08 PM
i think that in a new Season Ash's son/daughter should take over the role of main character, i think that would be prety cool.

Kabuto
24th April 2006, 9:10 PM
i think that in a new Season Ash's son/daughter should take over the role of main character, i think that would be prety cool.


You already mentioned that. It is an idiotic idea. Ash is an ambitious kid who wants to be pokemon master who just wouldn't settle down with May to be some father. Besides, we have seen 10 years of build up with Ash.

Agustus
25th April 2006, 3:04 AM
Pokemon has gone down a bit, but it's not that bad. AG is still preety good, and I guess Ash will learn more on his journies.


You already mentioned that. It is an idiotic idea. Ash is an ambitious kid who wants to be pokemon master who just wouldn't settle down with May to be some father. Besides, we have seen 10 years of build up with Ash.

And who said it will be May? You're right, but it could possibly be someone else.

PokemonTrainerLisa
25th April 2006, 4:26 AM
What in the world?

Why is there even a thread like this in the first place?


I'm sorry, but I am new to the forums here, and I don't really have time to read this whole thread. But, I definitely will, when I get the chance.


First of all, Ash is the main character of the show, they would never replace him.

And second, Ash is supposed to achieve his ultimate goal and finally achieve his dream of becoming a Pokemon Master. Also, I'm hoping they give us more story on that soon, because as of now we know next to nothing about how Ash will go about becoming a Pokemon Master, and we don't even know the anime's definition of a Pokemon Master either (it's obviously not the same as the game's definition).

So anyway, there is no way that they would either take Ash out of the show or replace him, because he's the main character.

And to put it more simply, Pokemon just wouldn't be Pokemon without Ash.




ASH SUCKS. he is a crap trainer. he never battles unless it's against gym leaders or the odd pidgey/rattata trainer (hehe). he's never heard of moves like light screen, water pulse, protect or any other great moves which i cant think of right now...he just uses the obvious moves repeatedly. pikachu's thunderwave wouldve come in handy. Donphan's sandstorm/earthquake?

Um, let's see, how should I explain this to you, sam_h12......

Oh yeah!

NEWS FLASH: The Pokemon anime is different from the games! Therefore, the Pokemon anime doesn't soley rely on the rules of the games, such as type (type can be used effectively in battle depending on your strategy). And the anime has only mentioned the word 'levels' a few times. Apparently, levels aren't referred to much at all, and therefore probably don't matter much in the anime. Also, in the anime, your Pokemon can learn more than 4 moves.

So basically, what it all comes down to is that in the anime, Ash in particular comes up with amazing and miraculous strategies to win his battles. He works together with his Pokemon as a team. That is the way he battles. And in my opinion, I LOVE the way he battles.



It seems Ash has touched the lives of many during his journey to becoming a Pokemon Master. But has Ash even come close to reaching that Plateau?
Well, here's what I say to this, JohtoMaster:

We don't even know the anime's definition of a Pokemon Master is yet. They have never even defined that term. You can't just go by the games, because like I said earlier, the anime is not like the games and it doesn't do everything like they do it in the games.



But after spending basically the whole series trying to be number one, it seems that Ash has fallen short just by a trainer or two and misses the finals. I always wondered what it would be like when Ash faced the Elite 4, but it seems that When has yet to wait once more.
We don't know the requirements that Ash needs to meet in order for him to become a Pokemon Master. Obviously, these requirements are different from the games. And even though Ash met many members of the Elite Four, (if you include the Elite Four from Kanto, Johto, and Hoenn) and even battled with some of them, it's clear that beating any of them isn't a requirement to become a Pokemon Master in the anime.



I heard that during the Johto league, Ash was suppose to kiss Misty. I was actually waiting for that to happen, but it was just a silly rumor

Um, since when has Pokemon been a romance anime?

I mean, come on, if you don't know it by now, the Pokemon anime is obviously an action anime, with comedy in it (where the action comes in the form of Pokemon battles).

And besides that, if the writers wanted Ash to kiss Misty, or if they wanted him to kiss anyone for that matter, I'm sure they would've already done that by now.



Ok, listen carefully. Ash is named after the creator of Pokemon Satoshi. He is based on the creator himself. We've had him for 9 years.
You are exactly right, Rancid Meat! And I completely agree with you! ^^



Ash beating the leaders/trainers, team rocket blasting off, and Ash coming up short.
JohtoMaster, did you ever think that Ash might actually beat a league sometime? And not only that, if you don't watch the show, you won't get to see Ash become a Pokemon Master which is sure to happen at some point or another. Don't you want to see him achieve his dream?



Hmn. I like Ash, though I agree that he is getting far too much spotlight for many people's tastes.
Okay.

I don't get what you mean by that, Champion Jared 14......


Ash is the main character! He can't have too much spotlight!

And since he's the main character, the show is supposed to be all about him, and the things he does, the places he goes to, the people he meets, the trainers he battles, and things like that.

Captain Brain
25th April 2006, 6:46 AM
Why is there even a thread like this in the first place?


So people can get a higher rank banner.



First of all, Ash is the main character of the show, they would never replace him.

And second, Ash is supposed to achieve his ultimate goal and finally achieve his dream of becoming a Pokemon Master. Also, I'm hoping they give us more story on that soon, because as of now we know next to nothing about how Ash will go about becoming a Pokemon Master, and we don't even know the anime's definition of a Pokemon Master either (it's obviously not the same as the game's definition).

So anyway, there is no way that they would either take Ash out of the show or replace him, because he's the main character.

And to put it more simply, Pokemon just wouldn't be Pokemon without Ash.

The only way they would get rid of Ash is by doing it so slow that nobody wouldn't even notice and there is same chance as you getting hit twice by lightning in the same place and same time.


Um, let's see, how should I explain this to you, sam_h12......

Oh yeah!

NEWS FLASH: The Pokemon anime is different from the games! Therefore, the Pokemon anime doesn't soley rely on the rules of the games, such as type (type can be used effectively in battle depending on your strategy). And the anime has only mentioned the word 'levels' a few times. Apparently, levels aren't referred to much at all, and therefore probably don't matter much in the anime. Also, in the anime, your Pokemon can learn more than 4 moves.

So basically, what it all comes down to is that in the anime, Ash in particular comes up with amazing and miraculous strategies to win his battles. He works together with his Pokemon as a team. That is the way he battles. And in my opinion, I LOVE the way he battles.


Just remember this, the anime writers had to spend hundreds of hours playing the games before they could even start writing the episodes. That said the games and the anime are and always will be parallel to each other in content. ;025;

Seiryu
25th April 2006, 8:57 AM
The only way they would get rid of Ash is by doing it so slow that nobody wouldn't even notice and there is same chance as you getting hit twice by lightning in the same place and same time.

Agreed. There was a big stink about Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters GX having a different set of main characters than the original series, and I know many people who refused to watch it altogether for that reason alone. Unless Ash being written off was handled extremely slowly and carefully, there would be a similar fuss and similar results. In fact, I don't doubt that the hardcore Ash fans would still raise a lot of hell because their beloved main character wouldn't be a main part of the series.

All in all, it'd be a really huge risk to take. The goal of the writers and those other people is to keep viewers, not push them away. Writing Ash off and starting fresh would probably bring in a number of new viewers, but they don't know how many people would also stop watching, and I feel that it's a risk they're not exactly willing to take. Only when Ash starts to show a drastic amount of unpopularity would they even begin to consider getting rid of him.


Just remember this, the anime writers had to spend hundreds of hours playing the games before they could even start writing the episodes. That said the games and the anime are and always will be parallel to each other in content. ;025;

Content, yes. Things like major locations and character names, yes. Mechanics, like how the battles play out? Not so much. For instance, in the games, you can easily send out a Charmeleon or other fire-type to battle while surfing, but you'd never see anything of the sort in the anime because, put simply, it'd put the poor creature's life in some serious danger. And as far as I can see, attacks like Iron Tail, Quick Attack, and Rock Slide, while essentially being of different types (and thus having different strengths and weaknesses in the games), essentially are all impact-based attacks in the anime and so damage is calculated more by the speed of the attack and where it hits than by the type.

Astinus
25th April 2006, 8:18 PM
(Knew PTL was going to post!)

Ash is staying for a long time now. Pokémon was the second most popular animé in Japan a few years ago, don't know about it now. The writers are not going to risk losing that popularity just because Ash/Satoshi has been here for ten years.

A lot of people over here in America like Ash. To them, the loss of Ash equals the loss of Pokémon. It wouldn't be the same. Remember all the Digimon fans who rabidly rabbled because the Chosen Children were replaced by the Tamers? Or even now, the Yu-Gi-Oh! fans who complain that Yugi was replaced by Jayden. (I, for one, like GX better than the original.)

Ash is staying. Get used to it.

And the animé does not equal the games. That's been stated millions of times before. I mean, think about it. In the games, the trainer can listen to a Sing attack and stay awake. That does not happen in the show.

Phantom_Bugsy
27th April 2006, 12:51 AM
BUT it doesn't mean that Ash isn't getting boring. Kanto Ash had personality, because we didn't know what he was like and he was just starting out. He's not LIKE that anymore. Ash has become BORING.

And yes, main characters CAN get too much spotlight. I'm sick of Ash already and I wish the writers would like....send him away for at least a few episodes if they're not going to get rid of him.

That's why a lot of people like the Hosos, after all. <3

Added note: I still don't see how you Ash fangirls can stand him, really. :/ Kanto Ash, MAYBE. Hoenn Ash, no. :<

~Flareon~
27th April 2006, 9:06 AM
No. I don't want Ash to leave the show.

Silent Conversation
27th April 2006, 10:57 PM
Ash won't leave the show. It just won't happen.

Ash is the main character. He's the only character who's been in every episode. I'll prove it:

Misty - Left after Johto

May - only came in Hoenn

Max - only came in Hoenn

Brock - took a break in the Orange Islands.

Now, Ash might leave, but i highly doubt it'll happen.

Comis Patronus
27th April 2006, 11:01 PM
Ash won't leave the show. It just won't happen.

Ash is the main character. He's the only character who's been in every episode. I'll prove it:

Misty - Left after Johto

May - only came in Hoenn

Max - only came in Hoenn

Brock - took a break in the Orange Islands.

Now, Ash might leave, but i highly doubt it'll happen.

If Ash leaves then the whole journey will have to fall to someone we already know or Ash will pass his experiences to someone with the ability to go farther just as Yu-Gi-Oh started to fade into GX(which I don't like BTW).

Katsu Koneko
28th April 2006, 5:59 AM
Wow..I can't believe there's a thread about this.

Satoshi is the main character and main characters don't leave. Besides, maybe the writers might make a special that will tell us about Sato's past? Maybe it will be kind of sad, depends on their ideas.

I don't want Sato-kun to leave the show, the one's I want to leave are: Haruka and Masato. Then I would like Kasumi to come back. xD It would be back to normal like in the first season. xD Except with different clothing and pokemon.

I don't think Sato has too much spotlight.

@Ratiosu381 - I agree with you; if he leaves then the next thing you know there will be: Pokemon GX. *shudders* Even though I like YGO GX, it's not better than the original series.

SiLeNtDuDe
29th April 2006, 7:57 PM
ash will mostly likely stay as the main character of the show, afterall it wouldnt be the same without him but i am getting tired of him. I would prefer an anime of the Pokemon Special manga rather than the current one only because IMO the story is better and there are more main charcters to share the spotlight.

and im also really sick and tired of the blasting-off thing..

PokemonTrainerLisa
30th April 2006, 11:58 AM
Added note: I still don't see how you Ash fangirls can stand him, really. :/ Kanto Ash, MAYBE. Hoenn Ash, no. :<
What!?

What do you mean?


Phantom_Bugsy, I don't see what you have against Hoenn Ash.


I mean, other than the new outfit, and the fact that he has indeed aged by a few years (in MY opinion), he's still the same exact guy he was when he started his journey.

Of course, I'd also like to mention the fact that ever since then, Ash has matured and grown very much, both as a person and as a trainer. He's also gained much more experience in battling, and is always trying to do as good as he can. Remember, he's still reaching for his number one goal and dream of becoming a Pokemon Master someday.



But, anyway, seriously though. Getting back to the topic, I don't think I've seen any anime (or any show for that matter) where the fans don't like the main character. And if there are fans who don't like the main character, wouldn't that just make them stop watching the show anyway?

I swear, people who watch Pokemon all the time, yet don't like Ash (or even worse, hate him), don't make any sense to me at all.


Oh, and another thing, I'm not sure if this has been mentioned already or not, because I still haven't read the whole thread yet (but I will finish reading it though). So, one interesting thing I'd like to point out to everyone is that, when you get right down to it, they couldn't just take Ash - the main character - away from Pokemon. He is the whole reason the show exists in the first place, and in the Japanese version he's named Satoshi, after the amazing creator of Pokemon, Satoshi Tajiri.

And also, people probably don't think of this when they think about Ash, but the truth is that the show centers around him and all of his friends. So, for example, if Ash ever left that would also mean all of his friends would have to leave too. Because, by doing that, it would mean there would have to be a new main character with new friends. And I don't know about anyone else, but I would DEFINITELY hate that. X_X

Now do you see where I'm going with this?

Sharp
30th April 2006, 4:51 PM
I'm not really fussed, don't really care if they get rid of him or not.

crobatconey/leafeon lunatic
30th April 2006, 6:01 PM
this will never ever ever happen.