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Serebii
29th April 2006, 10:59 AM
http://www.serebii.net/anime/NextOn/S20.jpgThe Mastermind of Mirage Pokémon!

On their travels through Kanto, Ash & co. are invited to a special Lab where Dr. Yung has created a machine which ressurrects extinct or legendary Pokémon as Mirage Pokémon. When they arrive, they meet up with Prof. Oak & Misty and decide to investigate these Mirage Pokémon. However, when Dr. Yung gets kidnapped by the Mirage Master, Ash & Co. have to find him, but first they need to stop a Mirage Mewtwo. Can they find Dr. Yung?

Visit The Episode Guide (http://www.serebii.net/anime/epiguide/specials/020.shtml)

Discuss

Serebii
29th April 2006, 11:02 AM
Just before you all start, dont use this thread, but use This Thread (http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?p=3152504#post3152504) for discussion of the New Voices

This thread is just for discussion of the special as it is plot wise and so forth.

Thank You

V Faction
29th April 2006, 4:12 PM
Just something to add for the first break.

They mention that Aggron can't learn Bullet Seed. That's correct. But it also used Thunder Wave (an attack it's capable of getting through move tutoring in Emerald). I certainly hope they didn't mean that for T-Bolt.

Staryu with Bubblebeam!

V Faction
29th April 2006, 4:41 PM
*Mirage Master stands there*

MM: Do you thinking running will some how save you?!

-_-

Sachiko
29th April 2006, 4:56 PM
I think that the plot's pretty interesting. Not exceptionally good, but interesting. You know how dub plots are. Kinda corny. Like YGO the Movie...!!
WHAT?! DR. YOUNG IS MIRAGE MASTER?!?! (spoiler for those who have taped it and are planning to watch it later.)
Volt Tackle is so pretty...
I'm done.

Torkoal Stu
29th April 2006, 4:57 PM
Ok ok ok now the Special is over (or a few minutes away from that) did they reveal any spoilers that haven't been already shown through regular episodes yet? Minus Volt Tacke.

Like certain Pokemon characters have ect? Also what's this about Oak and a Dragonite O_O

And anyone want to tell me whats so wrong with the intro?

Thanks in advance ^_^

Sachiko
29th April 2006, 5:02 PM
The intro is okay. I don't mind it.

It was so refreshing to hear the old voices on theat commercial!!!

They were saying that Mew was not data. It had a soul. That means it died?!? Awwww... *cries*

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 5:05 PM
Professor Yung's apperance reminds of that one teacher or whatever on Yu-Gi-Oh GX.

But yeah. Oak. Dragonite. Just plain random.

WaterDragon trainer
29th April 2006, 5:08 PM
This episode was not as good as I thought it was. IMO, it was a bit bad. The new voices sounded terrible, especially Ash, Brock, May (bascially all the characters). I prefer the old voices. They were much better. I thought Dr. YUng being the Mirage Master was such an unoriginal idea, IMO. Also, after Mewtwo absorbed all the mirage pokemon, I thought it was really freaky when all those pokemon heads were popping all over Mewtwo's body. Just one question, though.
When Mewtwo used Hyper Beam, its hand turned into a Rayquaza head. Could anyone tell me which pokemon head Mewtwo's arms turned into to land the fiinal shot on Mew?

Judai Yuki
29th April 2006, 5:10 PM
Professor Yung's apperance reminds of that one teacher or whatever on Yu-Gi-Oh GX.

But yeah. Oak. Dragonite. Just plain random.
Crowler?
Anyways people spoke of Bayleef!We only saw like 1 pokemon from each person we didnt even see Brocks.

Kabuto
29th April 2006, 5:12 PM
Well Great Butlers theory is right. Dr. Yung is Mirage Master. I still think that the plot sounded like a child wrote it. It was catering to all the young n00bs that don't know anything about Hoenn. Oh Mewtwos strongest Pokemon EVER! Lets give Prof Oak a Dragonite!!. Mew saves that day!!! The only Hoenn Pokemon there were Corphish, Combusken, Mightyena, and Absol, most of which got 2 seconds of screentime.

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
29th April 2006, 5:12 PM
THey pratcicly Avoided ALL of Ash's pokemon except Pikachu and Corphish. The story line was OK. Once again, an overpowered Super Pokemon only to be done inb/stoped by a cute pokemon.

Note how wacked out Mirage Mew looked

Flamez
29th April 2006, 5:14 PM
Saw it and well it was pretty good. I wont talk about the voices here. Oak with dragonite was surprising, it caught me offguard. The whole story felt really rushed at the end for some reason. Mirage mewtwo was pretty cool, still i like the real mewtwo alot more. This special was not what i expected it to be i was thinking it would be amazingly great but it was just good, IMO.

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 5:14 PM
Crowler?
Anyways people spoke of Bayleef!We only saw like 1 pokemon from each person we didnt even see Brocks.

No that dude with that cat. xD

V Faction
29th April 2006, 5:16 PM
I remember when I was excited for this special. Y'know, suspending disbelief n' all?

I take it all back. In heaps.

I'll tell you right now, the voices were bad, but in a 'taken for granted' kind of way. We know that changes are always hard. We know that these people aren't exactly experienced in their roles as these characters. As such, I'll be ignoring the voices as Con of the special.

The Opening: Horrible. I'll give them credit for trying to tie in all three regions, but Rap and Pokemon do not mix. This isn't like the One Piece rap, where it's so bad it's funny. No, this is just BAD.

The Plot: We knew from the get-go that it was convoluted. But they barely did anything with what was left to work with. As I alluded to in the voice thread, the entire special was a glorified Scooby Doo episode, splashed with some clichéd anime goodness. You thought Pokemon plots were basic enough? Get out your shovel and start digging.

The Characters: "Paykachu, Thunderbolt!"

Ash apparently has resorted back to firing off attack after attack. May gets turned into a doofus, Brock runs off to find Jenny and is gone for the whole damn thing, and Max has to play guard duty (not to bad actually). Mirage Master is all of the Pokemon villains wrapped up into one without any of the substance.

The Pokemon: Burly, brutish, and brainless.

The Animation: Slightly off. I can't really fault them since this was contracted under unusual means. The attack animations were funny to look at though.

This special... kinda blew up on itself.

Neko Godot
29th April 2006, 5:16 PM
Wow! I was amazed that Charizard didn't show up and that Mirage Master isn't Ash's father.

Lil Brother
29th April 2006, 5:18 PM
Ash didn't seem to care at all when Misty fell to her death. :O

And ha, May saved her. She had a huge role after all.

Grumble... Mewtwo being public knowledge is bad..

Oh, come on! Team Rocket could have done something important!

Anyone else call Dr. Yung a "GameSharker" aloud about a million times? XD

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 5:19 PM
Anyone else call Dr. Yung a "GameSharker" aloud about a million times? XD

That's what I thought. Then I wondered if the secret message in this if you cheat you become a crazy guy that ends up walking straight into a burning building.

Kabuto
29th April 2006, 5:20 PM
Oh yeah I forgot about that AWFUL opening song. Misty didn't really have much of a purpose though prof Oak had interaction with professor Yung.

And I know many May fans will be ticked off from this line.

May: At least I'm useful for something.

Aldrius
29th April 2006, 5:21 PM
The Dragonite was totally random. The Elite Four should have shown up to fight them. ;___;

Judai Yuki
29th April 2006, 5:21 PM
Oh Prof.Banner lolz well i'm still mad they ignored like every owned pokemon.

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 5:22 PM
Oh yeah I forgot about that AWFUL opening song. Misty didn't really have much of a purpose though prof Oak had interaction with professor Yung.

And I know many May fans will be ticked off from this line.

May: At least I'm useful for something.

Lol.

I missed the opening. Was it that bad?

Kabuto
29th April 2006, 5:23 PM
The Dragonite was totally random. The Elite Four should have shown up to fight them. ;___;


Sure cater to even more Kanto fans who do not know anything about what Pokemon is now. I'm surprised Gary or Charizard didn't show up.


I missed the opening. Was it that bad?

Lets just say I barely lived through it.

Torkoal Stu
29th April 2006, 5:27 PM
No that dude with that cat. xD
Banner XP Phew when Crowler got mentioned I got scared D:

I bet someone posts the opening on Youtube *waits for said person* I wanna get my ears majorly hurt :P

Alopec
29th April 2006, 5:28 PM
Well, that was certainly... interesting. There didn't seem to be any added Pokeshipping hints, which is probably a relief to some people. Ash was more concered about Pikachu, even after Misty fell down that thing, whatever it was. I was actually very happy to see it was May who saved her, that was a surprising twist. ^^ But I didn't like May's line right after that - "There, you see? Sometimes I can do the right thing." That was completely out of character and ticked me off a bit.

I might have to watch it again to really get the plot, because I was paying more attention to the new voices than anything.

Poor Mew. Even though it looked/sounded nothing like the Mew I remember, it was still really adorable.

Oh, and I'm just going to pretend that opening song doesn't exist. -_-

≈*Virulent Tsunami*≈
29th April 2006, 5:29 PM
Could anyone tell me which pokemon head Mewtwo's arms turned into to land the fiinal shot on Mew?

Looked like a Tropius head using Solarbeam.

Anyhow, this Special disappointed me. Yes, May was here, but she really didn't do anything except save Misty. Her voice was horrendous, the worst one by far, and she seemed very OOC throughout the whole Special with her strange calmness.

Anyhow, the only voices I even liked were Jessie's and Jenny's. Both sounded quite good, and Jenny's new one was actually better than the old one. However, two good voices don't make up for a plethora of terrible ones.

I'm glad Mew and Mewtwo weren't real. The plot really wasn't anywhere near good enough for either of them.

Mirage Mewtwo was kinda cool, though. Its dead silence made it seem very menacing, which was surprising. When it opened its mouth, though, I was pretty disappointed ._.

The Mirage Master being Dr. Yung.....Saw it coming a mile off. Notice how Dr. Yung was never heard from after the Aerodactyl carried him off. They should've shown him a couple of times afterwards. Or, better yet, they could've had him alongside the Mirage Master to throw us off. But, no such luck. They made it overly-obvious.

I was sorta hoping that Volt Tackle may have been some hybrid of Quick Attack and Thunder, but that was a slim hope. Continuity goes out the window.

Speaking of continuity, there was actually a lot more of it in this episode than I had expected. I can't name specific instances(the Special really is that forgettable >>), but I'm pretty sure every characters' reactions to Mewtwo were the way they should be(May didn't recognize it, Misty did, etc.).

That Professor Elm cameo was actually the best part of this mess, I think. Since Johto ended, Elm basically stopped existing. Seeing him again was excellent, but it wasn't enough to save this.

Dr. Yung's exit was a bit cool, even if it is a pretty obvious excuse for a sequel ._.

lol Oak's Dragonite. Shameless showcasing of a big, powerful Pokémon ftw. Watch the orange bloke never even appear again after this :rolleyes:

This actually was sorta violent. Mewtwo beat the sense out of Mew with its own hands before slaying it with Solarbeam. And Mewtwo slammed Dragonite to the ground with its tail after slugging it in the face. To me, that's a lot cooler than a bunch of big explosions spawned by colliding attacks.

Oh yeah, and lol at 263 people viewing this Section xD

Overall rating:
7.5 out of 10

It wasn't as bad as it could've been, luckily. But it wasn't even close to being a proper anniversary special. As I've said before, this isn't the sort of payoff I'd want after 10 years of Pokémon.

~*CB*~
The 8th Champion

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
29th April 2006, 5:31 PM
Whats with all the opening hate?I thought It was pretty good. While be it, I was adjusting the Antena the whole time, so maybe the Fuzz coverdf up the bad partd

Aldrius
29th April 2006, 5:33 PM
Sure cater to even more Kanto fans who do not know anything about what Pokemon is now. I'm surprised Gary or Charizard didn't show up.

Well, it does take place in Kanto... =S Theoretically there shouldn't even be any Johto/Hoenn pokemon.

Oh well.

PDL
29th April 2006, 5:34 PM
well, this special can be desrcibed with one word: Craptacular

well, I was expecting cream of corn, but I got cream of crap.

okay, enough with the simpsons references, the special's plot is about as corny as Pokemon Live's plot. Though thankfully they didn't break out into song, although the intro made up for the missing lameness.

Judai Yuki
29th April 2006, 5:34 PM
I'm gonna try to get a quote from the song
"Yo Pokemon Master Your Heart Beats Faster!But dont let it get to your head young trainer!The road is long and filled with Danger!First You Kick in Kanto!Then you head to Johto!Dont know where to go try to go with the flow.Everybody knows how the fever is growing.Watch out next stop might be Houen!

Judai Yuki
29th April 2006, 5:35 PM
Well, it does take place in Kanto... =S Theoretically there shouldn't even be any Johto/Hoenn pokemon.

Oh well.
One word.Migration.

Kabuto
29th April 2006, 5:36 PM
Well, it does take place in Kanto... =S Theoretically there shouldn't even be any Johto/Hoenn pokemon.

Oh well.


Thats not the point it is still Advanced Generation and should be showcasing Advanced Pokemon like the rest of the battle frontier.


I'm gonna try to get a quote from the song
"Yo Pokemon Master Your Heart Beats Faster!But dont let it get to your head young trainer!The road is long and filled with Danger!First You Kick in Kanto!Then you head to Johto!Dont know where to go try to go with the flow.Everybody knows how the fever is growing.Watch out next stop might be Houen!

Picture that sung by a crappy Sean Paul imitador.

The Big Al
29th April 2006, 5:39 PM
Joe was right, the write was Japanese.

On to business. The idea of fighting holographic Pokemon sounds kind of interesting. However, the making them know odd attacks kind of defeats the purpose because you're trying to form a strategy against the real life version.

The Great Butler
29th April 2006, 5:41 PM
OK, I know I'll get my head shot off for this, but besides the voices I loved it.

Dr. Yung/Mirage Master was a good character. They gave him a bit of a backstory to develop his personality more, very good.

The Mirage Pokémon were amazing, especially Mewtwo. That thing it did with the heads popping out of its body to fire off attacks was freaky in a cool way.

I had to chuckle at May's line when she helped Misty in the tower inside Yung's castle. "See, I can do the right thing sometimes".......heh.

Oak having a Dragonite was weird, but so what? I'd rather see a Dragonite over his Charmeleon/Charizard from 4Ever or his Pidgey from "Will the Real Oak Please Stand Up." Did anyone catch the password he gave Mirage Master for his computer system? It was "REDGREEN." Cameos from Tracey, Elm and Birch were nice touches too. And especially the clips from The Power of One, Spell of the Unown, 4Ever, and Heroes---those were surprising to see.

The ending was a sort of tear-jerker in Pokémon's way, with Mew being sucked back into the Mirage System. I think that Dr. Yung killed himself by jumping into the fire at the end, that would explain why Officer Jenny couldn't find him---his body burned.

Overall, while not perfect, this definitely topped the last movie---Destiny Deoxys---and while it doesn't top Jirachi Wish Maker as my favorite movie, it is an easy second or third.

Korobooshi Kojiro
29th April 2006, 5:46 PM
At least they used a ton of BGM's from the Japanese episodes.

The Doctor
29th April 2006, 5:46 PM
Oookay; judging by what I've read, this special was, to quote PDL quoting Bart Simpson, craptacular. Well, as I'm in the UK, I obviously haven't seen this and I'll see for myself how bad this thing is.

I'll see if it comes out on DVD later on and order it of Amazon. But I will say this: Oak with a Dragonite?! Is that random or what?

Squid Rooster
29th April 2006, 5:46 PM
One word.Migration.
One other word: indigenous. :-p Really though, it doesn't bother me. We've seen Kanto/Johto/Hoenn Pokemon out of their respective regions before, and the majority of these Pokemon were mirages (i.e. not actually real and thus not actually from the region) anyway.

The plot wasn't very good, but I wasn't expecting much anyway.

I missed the credits, so I don't know who animated it. Throughout the special there had been some faces and whatnot drawn a little awkwardly (Mew being an exception--they clearly missed a mark, or at least took a new direction, with it), but overall... it wasn't THAT bad. If this was an American animation department attempting to emulate Pokemon style, I think they actually did a good job, and wouldn't object to seeing them again... as long as they don't replace the original team. Something about their coloring and outlines didn't match the original, though, and said "I was done on a computer!" too much.

If it was a Japanese animation studio, though, I'm a little disappointed that they'd farm out a 10th anniversary special to a studio less capable than the usual studio.

The background music was noticably improved. Unless it went over my head, I didn't hear any generic synth that our dub series usually gets. I hope this trend continues and we get all the original BGM in the next dub series.

The opening was pretty bad, sorry to say.

It was cool to see a quick Elm appearance!

Wes
29th April 2006, 5:47 PM
Overall, while not perfect, this definitely topped the last movie---Destiny Deoxys---and while it doesn't top Jirachi Wish Maker as my favorite movie, it is an easy second or third.


It's not a movie....it's a a special....meh whatever. Anyway it was...okay. I mean it has some minor flaws but it waass ind of worth it in the end. The fact the original music is used is good as well.

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
29th April 2006, 5:47 PM
One word.Migration.
And Besides that, any pokemon featured were Mirages for the most part.

Did anyone else find the ending... bad?
I mean, Pikachu pulls VT out of nowhere, and just Leaps through Mewtwo?

On the other hand, all the unedited Pokemon on Pokemon Violence was awsome



Did anyone catch the password he gave Mirage Master for his computer system? It was "REDGREEN."
Yeah, I forgot about that. I guess that works and all, but, Kids wont know what Green Version was!

Judai Yuki
29th April 2006, 5:47 PM
I found it cool with Mewtwo having Rayquaza hands.Also with the 3-D fire.

WaterKrystal
29th April 2006, 5:48 PM
I actually liked the Pokemon rap, it was a change of pace.

I honestly thought, that when Mirage Master shot those things out of the castle, I was thinking of Megaman Axcess's dimesion area (or whatever it was).

I kinda liked the special, even though it's not all the way over. Though it kinda felt like a Megaman Axcess type thing.

The Phantom Thief
29th April 2006, 5:53 PM
I liked the special actually. I've already commented on the voices in that thread so I won't say anything about them.

Dr. Yung/Mirage Master was a good character. I don't really understand why he killed himself in the fire but whatever.

Oh, and May's line after saving Misty: "See, sometimes I can do the right thing". lol...just lol

Where the hell did Oak get Dragonite from? Can someone PLEASE explain that to me!!!!!

We could've had more Pokemon voices such as Ash's Swellow, Jessie's Sevpier, James's Cacnea, etc.

I liked the background music they used from the movies. That was cool I thought.

Overall, I'd give the special a 6.8/10.

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 5:53 PM
Storywise, why must PokemonUSA/4kids/whoever made this constantly glorify Misty?

She's the one who gets a full battle against Aggron, gets to go with Ash inside the castle (while May and Max have to wait outside...wtf?), and is essentially the best battler.

Also, what in the world was May's, "Looks like I can do something right," line about when rescuing Misty?

Does PokemonUSA really think Misty must be constantly glorified and that May isn't as important as her, when the actual series says the exact opposite? This Misty glorification is highly irritating, thank god the Japanese writers don't do things like this.

Bliksem
29th April 2006, 5:53 PM
I loved the thought of Mirage Pokemon. Personally, I liked Dr. Yung.

However, I swear that Ash and gang lost ALL sense of strategy. Seriously, Iron Tail against an Entei's Flamethrower?

Mew's death was alarmingly Digimon-esque. But Dr. Yung's comment afterwards was priceless. I was thoroughly impressed with that.

Wes
29th April 2006, 5:55 PM
Dr. Yung/Mirage Master was a good character. I don't really understand why he killed himself in the fire but whatever.

To go down with all the hard work you made? To simply give up because your ideas are not accpted and you're pride and honor is hurt? Went insane?

I just wonder when the Japanese will show this special....

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 5:55 PM
From what I hear not many people seem to like it, I havn't seen it yet myself so I can't really give my opinion. As for the complaints about the theme song, how bad can it be? After all when anime shows have rap its actually much better than that rubbish in the charts, at least in Pokemon rap theres no mindless swearing every sentence.

PDL
29th April 2006, 5:56 PM
Yeah, I forgot about that. I guess that works and all, but, Kids wont know what Green Version was!

Fire Red and Leaf Green ring a bell?

Wes
29th April 2006, 5:57 PM
What happened to that classic pokemon rap about the original one hundred and fifty one....that rap beats the rap of a company who conrols Pokemon in the United States of all things...



Fire Red and Leaf Green ring a bell?

Oh that password was a nice reference!

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 5:59 PM
Banner XP Phew when Crowler got mentioned I got scared D:

I bet someone posts the opening on Youtube *waits for said person* I wanna get my ears majorly hurt :P


Ah. Okay. Thanks. I have a strange urge to do a parody 'fic of this episode/special.

WaterKrystal
29th April 2006, 6:00 PM
Mew's death was alarmingly Digimon-esque.
Yeah, it did remind of a Digimon type thing, like when Patamon's first time digivovling into Angemon, and it got defeated...it dissappeared like Mew, looking back, everyone sad.

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
29th April 2006, 6:01 PM
Fire Red and Leaf Green ring a bell?
*Looks in his gameboy* Well, if that was for that refrence Wouldnt "FireRLeafG" Be better?

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 6:01 PM
Yeah, it did remind of a Digimon type thing, like when Patamon's first time digivovling into Angemon, and it got defeated...it dissappeared like Mew, looking back, everyone sad.

Oh yeah. I was like "OMG DIGIMON" and then blinking. I'm a huge Digimon geek.

BTW, what did the password spell out?

PDL
29th April 2006, 6:02 PM
*Looks in his gameboy* Well, if that wawss for that refrence Wouldnt "FireRLeafG" Be better?

no, I was getting at that kids would know about Green's existence.

Dummy.

Wes
29th April 2006, 6:03 PM
R-E-D-G-R-E-E-N

That was the password basically.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 6:03 PM
Yeah, it did remind of a Digimon type thing, like when Patamon's first time digivovling into Angemon, and it got defeated...it dissappeared like Mew, looking back, everyone sad.
I guess when anything is data is has to break up into thousands of little bits of information whenever the life line reaches its end.

Mew: 011101001 1001 100001 0100101000 10011110100

Bloody Skull
29th April 2006, 6:04 PM
I thought it was alright. Nice to see Professor Oak receive a good amount of screentime (is a fan of the professor, yes she is). I also thought Dr. Yung was an interesting character and loved the interaction he had with Oak.

Now, onto what I hated:

1. JJ&M were utterly useless. Really, they could've been given something important to do >_>

3. The intro. Man, was it cheesy.

3. The voices. They were all horrible.

Overall, 7/10. Not great, but certainly not awful.

ArrEmmDee
29th April 2006, 6:04 PM
Hey kids!

Professor Oak is a leading Pokémon professor who is allowed to have his own Pokémon for research, training, and perhaps one of the Pokémon he had in his youth was a Dratini! Why are you all so astounded and furious he had a Dragonite?


I liked it.
Misty was unneeded, but she didn't necessarily intrude, so I don't have a real problem with it, aside from the principle of having had to put her into it unnecessarily. Dr. Yung had no real reason to bring Misty and Ash there, since all he needed was the password from Oak, and could've just tortured some other Pokémon so he'd give it up. TR was plot shafted, and a lot of characters ended up being assigned into unusual positions so they'd stay out of the way for most of the episode, apparently.

Theme song is terrible--that was just for this episode, right? o.O

Ralts Master
29th April 2006, 6:04 PM
thank god the Japanese writers don't do things like this.
No, they're too busy forgetting the first Kanto arc ever happened...

≈*Virulent Tsunami*≈
29th April 2006, 6:05 PM
Oh yeah, forgot to say, I liked Dr. Yung's reaction to Mew's first death. "Good riddance.....Flawed specimen." Very cool, probably the best dialogue in this entire episode. Shame Ash had to ruin it with a cliché, "You've got a lot of nerve talking about Mew like that :@"

Speaking of dialogue, I openly cringed when Misty called Ash, "Mr. Smartypants." OK, I realize the show panders to the children a lot, but can we at least have some more mature insults? -_- Especially as the rest of the Special had some surprisingly big words for Pokémon, like specimen and extract.

I was actually glad to see Oak do something here, rather than having his hair shafted off like the rest of the cast. Still, it would've been so much cooler to see Elm instead of Oak. Ah, beggars can't be choosers. Oak was good enough for me. Better than having Misty interacting with Yung(which I strongly suspected from the beginning. So I'm glad they didn't, especially as Misty would probably get some cliché line about Pokémon being our friends and such), anyhow ._.


~*CB*~
The 8th Champion

The Great Butler
29th April 2006, 6:06 PM
Storywise, why must PokemonUSA/4kids/whoever made this constantly glorify Misty?

She's the one who gets a full battle against Aggron, gets to go with Ash inside the castle (while May and Max have to wait outside...wtf?), and is essentially the best battler.

Also, what in the world was May's, "Looks like I can do something right," line about when rescuing Misty?

Does PokemonUSA really think Misty must be constantly glorified and that May isn't as important as her, when the actual series says the exact opposite? This Misty glorification is highly irritating, thank god the Japanese writers don't do things like this.

I don't see how Misty was exactly 'glorified.' Sure she got a full battle versus Aggron, but Yung ate her alive. That's not exactly glorification.

And sure, May didn't go into the castle right away. But she did, and even saved Misty. Unless, of course, you would have rather seen Misty killed off for good in this special.......

Noone ever implied in this that Misty was better than May, I think you're just looking for things to complain about that don't exist.....

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:07 PM
No, they're too busy forgetting the first Kanto arc ever happened...
What just because theres no episodes where they meet characters from the first series, big deal it was obvious they wouldn't.

PDL
29th April 2006, 6:10 PM
I kinda found it unbeleiveable how Mew was able to float around the mirage pokemon and not be attacked, you think that someone with complete control of the system would not do a thing about it.

oh yeah, and the bit about how a soul cannot be converted into data, pure corn :p

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:10 PM
Noone ever implied in this that Misty was better than May, I think you're just looking for things to complain about that don't exist.....
But she was there for the sake of being there (Like I said when this special was revieled)

Pika Hikari KT
29th April 2006, 6:10 PM
BTW, what did the password spell out?
REDGREEN...as in the first two Pokémon games!

I thought the special was rather cool. Really great looking battles(Volt Tackle looked especially awesome), and Mew was so awesome(adorable, too~)! Mewtwo was pretty cool...though I was almost expecting the Mirage Master to be him(remember when he told Mew to get out?)!>_>

Yung being the Master would've came out of left field...but it seemed so obvious afterwards it seemed like something straight out of Scooby-Doo!>_<

I recorded the episode, and will watch it again to get a feel for the new VAs.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 6:11 PM
I kinda found it unbeleiveable how Mew was able to float around the mirage pokemon and not be attacked, you think that someone with complete control of the system would not do a thing about it.
Just one other way to dance around the plotholes and have Mew be super cute! ^_^

Phosphate
29th April 2006, 6:11 PM
This episode was terrible. I did not like the plot at all, and the voiceovers were awful. It seemed superficial that mirages were so powerful and had many different attacks. Just, a bad plot idea.

Gazmof
29th April 2006, 6:12 PM
Can someone please clarify why May said "Looks like I can do something right"?

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:12 PM
Yung being the Master would've came out of left field...but it seemed so obvious afterwards it seemed like something straight out of Scooby-Doo!>_<
Yung: I would have gotten away with it to, if it wern't for you meddling kids
Ash: Didn't you invite us?

Crystamon
29th April 2006, 6:13 PM
I think it was pretty okay. It wasn't like a real movie, and they had to fit it all into a one hour time-slot. So it wasn't that bad. I think the bit about Mew having a soul was neat. That's probably why Dr. Yung kept calling him a "flawed specimen." He probably would have been like all the others except for something that caused him to become "flawed."

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 6:15 PM
Can someone please clarify why May said "Looks like I can do something right"?

Misty was hanging on a ledge about to fall to her death, and May grabs her arm and saves her. Misty looks up and May says, "See? Looks like I can do something right."

Absolute BS. The scumbags at Pokemon USA/4kids constantly glorify Misty and make May look like a nobody. Disgusting.

YoshiAngemon
29th April 2006, 6:16 PM
Well, I managed to survive the US Exclusive special, and it made me think this: It's almost as if Janice Kawaye, the voice of Ami and her cat Tekirai, from Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi, is the voice of Mew.

RK454
29th April 2006, 6:16 PM
This episode was terrible. I did not like the plot at all, and the voiceovers were awful. It seemed superficial that mirages were so powerful and had many different attacks. Just, a bad plot idea.

I just saw It as using legendaries to boost ratings.... Yeah It was bad....

Wes
29th April 2006, 6:16 PM
Absolute BS. The scumbags at Pokemon USA/4kids constantly glorify Misty and make May look like a nobody. Disgusting.


Easy there buddy. Misty after all was the one who needed the saving and not May. That and she was the one who lost to Dr. Yung badly in the regular battle.

Konoko_Hasano
29th April 2006, 6:16 PM
The only voice that I hated was James' voice. It just sounded odd. All the other voices didn't bother me too much.


Although, I kept on thinking about Monkey D. Luffy when I heard Ash's voice. Even though the two voices don't sound exactly the same, I still expected to hear Ash do Luffy's laugh XD

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:16 PM
Can someone please clarify why May said "Looks like I can do something right"?
They might be trying to make cirtain Misty fans shut up with their bashing of May souly because she is a female lead character (Which would also explain why May saved Misty)

V Faction
29th April 2006, 6:18 PM
They might be trying to make cirtain Misty fans shut up with their bashing of May souly because she is a female lead character (Which would also explain why May saved Misty)
OR it could be the other way around. A play on words to piss other fans off.

OR it could be nothing at all--just some stupid dialogue that people are going to get all huffy-puffy about.

I'm betting on the latter.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:20 PM
OR it could be the other way around. A play on words to piss other fans off.
Exactly, I mean why would she really need to say that, unless they had an arguement which I doubt.

PDL
29th April 2006, 6:22 PM
and suddenly it becomes a Misty/May debate, fan-freakin-tastic.

jolteonjak
29th April 2006, 6:22 PM
OR it could be nothing at all--just some stupid dialogue that people are going to get all huffy-puffy about.


Judging by CC's reaction, I'd say it served its purpose.

I think I'll start to become pissy because characters I like (Adan/Noland) are no longer in the anime, or because Noland was the first Brain defeated and Brandon is being played up to be something to special.

See how pointless that is? GET OVER IT. MISTY WAS IN THIS SPECIAL ALONG SIDE MAY!

Gazmof
29th April 2006, 6:22 PM
Misty was hanging on a ledge about to fall to her death, and May grabs her arm and saves her. Misty looks up and May says, "See? Looks like I can do something right."

Absolute BS. The scumbags at Pokemon USA/4kids constantly glorify Misty and make May look like a nobody. Disgusting.

Thanks for the explanation. So I take it there was a lot of animosity between the two in the Special? Otherwise I really don't understand why May would say that. Unless PUSA believes that your average American Pokemon viewer just hates the girl and needs an excuse to reinforce that hate.

Wes
29th April 2006, 6:23 PM
Looks like it. Maybe we should focus on a different character now like....Dr Yong! He seemed pretty good as he had a back story and pretty clever with his whole plan.

Jo-Jo
29th April 2006, 6:24 PM
Storywise, why must PokemonUSA/4kids/whoever made this constantly glorify Misty?

She's the one who gets a full battle against Aggron, gets to go with Ash inside the castle (while May and Max have to wait outside...wtf?), and is essentially the best battler.

Also, what in the world was May's, "Looks like I can do something right," line about when rescuing Misty?

Does PokemonUSA really think Misty must be constantly glorified and that May isn't as important as her, when the actual series says the exact opposite? This Misty glorification is highly irritating, thank god the Japanese writers don't do things like this.
:D I'll kill myself laughing if it turns out the Japanese wrote the special.

I haven't seen it yet, but maybe May's line was simply a reference to her slight 'airhead' personality (not that she's really an airhead, but she can be a bit dizzy sometimes).

May saving Misty sounds far more like MAY-glorification to me. But hey, I'm sure a little thing like logic isn't going to prevent the Mayniacs from pissing and moaning. ;) *gets popcorn*

Wes
29th April 2006, 6:25 PM
Well didn't anybody notice the beginning that the Japanese did have a hand in the special?

V Faction
29th April 2006, 6:27 PM
I didn't read anything past Satoshi Tajiri. Was it more than just the standard 'Created by' credits for the Pocket Monsters series?

Serebii
29th April 2006, 6:27 PM
According to The Big Al, I was right and the Japanese did write it so nuh :p

Denjuu
29th April 2006, 6:28 PM
I missed it on purpose! I recoreded it!
:D

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 6:29 PM
:D I'll kill myself laughing if it turns out the Japanese wrote the special.


Either way, why would May have a line saying, "See? Looks like I can do something right."

It makes it sound as if May is a bumbling idiot, who is always messing up and is not as good as Misty. I mean, if this was very early Hoenn I can see a line like that working...but in the Battle Frontier saga?

May *always* does things right, that's why she keeps winning so many Contests as well as battles. To hear May play second fiddle to Misty as if she were "below" her, is absurd.

On the bright side, there were no Pokeshipping hints in this special. ^_^ Thank god.

The Great Butler
29th April 2006, 6:29 PM
I don't want to sound pushy, but do you think you'll have pics for the special up quickly, Serebii? I'm asking because looking at pictures often helps me get inspiration for my fanfics and I think those pics will help me greatly.

The Great Butler
29th April 2006, 6:30 PM
I don't want to sound pushy, but do you think you'll have pics for the special up quickly, Serebii? I'm asking because looking at pictures often helps me get inspiration for my fanfics and I think those pics will help me greatly.

Gazmof
29th April 2006, 6:32 PM
According to The Big Al, I was right and the Japanese did write it so nuh :p

Oh the irony.


May *always* does things right, that's why she keeps winning so many Contests as well as battles. To hear May play second fiddle to Misty as if she were "below" her, is absurd.

But it's not as if Misty is a slouch in battle herself. She is a Gym leader and, as much as I love May, my money would be on Misty winning a 1-on-1 battle. Now, a contest, on the other hand...

But I definitely understand your anger at that line. It sounds like something May would've said in the first five Hoenn episodes, not after competing in a Grand Festival.

Serebii
29th April 2006, 6:32 PM
Chances are they'll be up by tomorrow morning my time

RaikousThunder
29th April 2006, 6:33 PM
I was looking forward to this special but it really wasnt that great in my opinion and im not usually one to complain about Pokemon episodes. Right from the start i was disappointed. The animation looked really weird. Did the Japanese artists do this or was it some american trying to copy it? The professor was cool but him being the master mind was kinda obvious after a little while. The mirage pokemon were cool and im glad Houndoom, Mightyena and Absol were amungst them. Machoke and Machamp i could have done without. They appear so much its annoying. Mewtwo as another main pokemon for a special, eh its getting old. Mewtwo is awesome yes but is it really the strongest of all pokemon? The cool thing about this Mewtwo is how other pokemons heads appeared on its hands to do attacks. Reminded me of Apocylamon in Digimon season 1. I did like seeing Mew, its so darn cute. Cant wait for the 9th movie. All in all it was an ok special, not great or good just ok.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:34 PM
Either way, why would May have a line saying, "See? Looks like I can do something right."
One can only HOPE it was supposed to mean something different but they used the wrong words


It makes it sound as if May is a bumbling idiot, who is always messing up and is not as good as Misty. I mean, if this was very early Hoenn I can see a line like that working...but in the Battle Frontier saga?
What bothers me is its not the kind of thing you'd say to someone unless you've had an arguement which means the line is obviously supposed to mean something.


May *always* does things right, that's why she keeps winning so many Contests as well as battles. To hear May play second fiddle to Misty as if she were "below" her, is absurd.
Quoted for truth


On the bright side, there were no Pokeshipping hints in this special. ^_^ Thank god.
Thank God

♥Princess Ketchum♥
29th April 2006, 6:35 PM
i cant wait to see it though xD

Jo-Jo
29th April 2006, 6:36 PM
Either way, why would May have a line saying, "See? Looks like I can do something right."
:D Dunno. Ask the Japanese writers. (if they did indeed write it... eheh. ^^;; )

Sounds to me like the two girls were quite nicely balanced out. Misty got to go in with Ash and battle Yung; May saved Misty from a squishy death. Nobody was glorified or bashed. Exactly as expected.


May *always* does things right
No, she doesn't. She does some things right, some things wrong, and some things she lucks out on. Just like all the other characters. I swear you want May to be a Mary-Sue.

Pika Hikari KT
29th April 2006, 6:38 PM
Yung: I would have gotten away with it to, if it wern't for you meddling kids
Ash: Didn't you invite us?
I could've sworn Yung DID pull out the 'meddling kids' quote!>_<;

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 6:39 PM
No, but it's nice to see May not play second fiddle whenever Misty happens to show up. In the Mirage Kingdom episodes it was fine, since the entire storyline was centered around Togepi, so it made sense. Misty was the heroine in that 2-parter.

The Cleffa episode was also great, because both Misty and May bonded/showed concern for darling little Max. Excellent.

In this special though, Misty took center stage for most of the episode. It wouldn't be as bad if they didn't give May that horrible line that degrades her character.

In any case, even in an U.S. produced special does Brock get the shaft! Heck, the guy was written out for most of the episode.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:39 PM
No, she doesn't. She does some things right, some things wrong, and some things she lucks out on. Just like all the other characters. I swear you want May to be a Mary-Sue.
Buts its not sometimes is it?

V Faction
29th April 2006, 6:41 PM
In this special though, Misty took center stage for most of the episode. It wouldn't be as bad if they didn't give May that horrible line that degrades her character.
Professor Oak had the most speaking lines in the special.

Oh CRAP! Could he be taking potential away from May and degrading her as a character?

Quick! We need to act!! Make May a Professor of Pokemon right this instant! We can call her Professor Pussywillow!

Jo-Jo
29th April 2006, 6:41 PM
It was just a self-deprecating little joke. I don't see what the big deal is.


Professor Oak had the most speaking lines in the special.

Oh CRAP! Could he be taking potential away from May and degrading her as a character?

Quick! We need to act!! Make May a Professor of Pokemon right this instant! We can call her Professor Pussywillow!
lol

Gazmof
29th April 2006, 6:42 PM
In any case, even in an U.S. produced special does Brock get the shaft! Heck, the guy was written out for most of the episode.

Maybe Tracey will rejoin the main group. El oh el.

EDIT:


It was just a self-deprecating little joke. I don't see what the big deal is.

The point is it's not the kind of thing May would normally say.

As I requested earlier, can someone please post some instances of an argument or some kind of animosity between Misty and May in the special? Because then the line would make sense.

Feity
29th April 2006, 6:43 PM
I absolutely loved use of the word 'Johto' and half second clip of Elm, and of Tracy. That was probably my favorite part. I only wish they had squeezed in the Orange Islands in that horrific rap. I also liked the clips from the movies.

The story was okay, and the ending where Mew died was *gasp* actually sad. Violence was a lot more... intense, and you really actually felt for the Pokemon. Especially when Mew got shocked by Magnemite and Pikachu got slammed headfirst into a wall.

The story was a bit rubbish, and the ending didn't feel like the ending. Ash shoulda atleast said bye to Misty and Oak.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but has Pikachu even learned Volt Tackle yet?

Heracross
29th April 2006, 6:43 PM
On the bright side, there were no Pokeshipping hints in this special. ^_^ Thank god.
I could've predicted that. I laugh at everyone who acted as if that was the only reason Kasumi was in this and it was the end of the world.

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 6:45 PM
I'm just pleased there wasn't any shipping in this, aside from Brock/Officer Jenny. :p

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:52 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but has Pikachu even learned Volt Tackle yet?
I have no idea when this is set, apparently the only Pokemon of Ash's are Pikachu and Corphish and he has them with him now.

If people hate the theme for the lyrics, please do post them up because I'm dieing to know what is the problem with this song (I may note I like the One Piece theme and the Digi-Rap)

zonic the hedgehog
29th April 2006, 6:52 PM
I thought the special wasn't that great plot-wise or from the VAs (except Misty, Dr. Yung and Mew).

What did stand out was that this seemed more violent that Pokemon usually is in the dub.

The original BGM was great, because it was quiet when it was SUPPOSED to be, instead of how 4kids would let some sort of music run during a sad moment.

Man, and I also thought this is the gosh-darnest most cutest Mew ever. It beats both movie Mews HANDS-DOWN.
I actually was a bit sad when Mew went away... ;_;

Oh, and Misty and Ash seemed to have been groped by Machoke and Machamp. :O

It pretty much sucked, though. Even the filler-est of fillers in Pokemon have better stuff than this. e_e

PDL
29th April 2006, 6:53 PM
I'm kinda surprized that nothing was mentioned about the 4th generation or Pokemon Ranger XD

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 6:56 PM
I'm kinda surprized that nothing was mentioned about the 4th generation or Pokemon Ranger XD
Well I don't think they expect people to know about that in the US (They lack knolage of SPPs existance)

OverClockedZero
29th April 2006, 6:58 PM
What the hell was Oak saying, when he sent out the Dragonite, to block Mewtwo's attack? The first time. It sounded like Whisper. XDD

It looked like Whirlwind, though.

gymleadermya19
29th April 2006, 6:58 PM
if this was not posted but spoiler bolt tackle being use by pikachu!! he is going to learn it later after ash joins frontier

V Faction
29th April 2006, 7:05 PM
What the hell was Oak saying, when he sent out the Dragonite, to block Mewtwo's attack? The first time. It sounded like Whisper. XDD

It looked like Whirlwind, though.
Twister.

And this begs the question: Should this special be canonical or not?

OverClockedZero
29th April 2006, 7:08 PM
Twister.

And this begs the question: Should this special be canonical or not?
Ohh. Thanks. No wonder it sounded like "Whisper". XDD

The Big Al
29th April 2006, 7:09 PM
According to The Big Al, I was right and the Japanese did write it so nuh :p
The credits state the writer as one Shinzo Fujita. It's also under the "Japanese Production" part of the credits. So yeah, it was written in Japan.

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 7:12 PM
Twister.

And this begs the question: Should this special be canonical or not?

After watching it, it should be considered canon. Obviously this takes place after movie 8, so that's how everyone recognizes Mew.

The only thing off is Pikachu with Volt Tackle, but then again since Squirtle wasn't a crybaby, this probably does take place after Eevee's egg hatches.

There's nothing much too contradict it.

Gravy
29th April 2006, 7:13 PM
Any word on the animation director, Al?

Serebii
29th April 2006, 7:13 PM
Twister.

And this begs the question: Should this special be canonical or not?
Yes it is Canonical. There is nothing to put it out of Canon and many references to keep it in...they just aired it at a screwy time, and should have aired it after Pikachu learned Volt Tackle

So Japanese written, Japanese produced...I believe a mod here owes me an apology?

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 7:13 PM
Ok...It just started here on the west coast...and all I have to say is one thing: Eww.

I HATE The new voices they are HORRIBLE (well, I like Misty, Max, and Jessie) I now fear to hear some of the main pokemon's voice...>< God help us all....

Edit: I thought people were supposed to go through puberty...not reverse through it...*coughcoughAshcoughcough* does anyone else think he kinda sounds like Luffy from One Piece?

and what is with the sudden new pronounciation(sp?) of pokemon? (pokamon??)

V Faction
29th April 2006, 7:18 PM
After watching it, it should be considered canon. Obviously this takes place after movie 8, so that's how everyone recognizes Mew.

The only thing off is Pikachu with Volt Tackle, but then again since Squirtle wasn't a crybaby, this probably does take place after Eevee's egg hatches.

There's nothing much too contradict it.

Yes it is Canonical. There is nothing to put it out of Canon and many references to keep it in...they just aired it at a screwy time, and should have aired it after Pikachu learned Volt Tackle
I'm too tired to give a crap about the time placement any more.

I was speaking more on the attack and Pokemon roster side of things. Oak now has a Dragonite, Misty's Staryu has Bubblebeam, and should we even bother with making Dr. Yung/Mirage Master his own list of Pokemon? That's what I'm curious about and want to see what other people think.

Alastor DMc
29th April 2006, 7:24 PM
Did anyone else feel that, even though this special was made for American audiences, it still felt like a dub? Some lines were forced, or said bizzarly. Even though it was animated for America, they still felt the need to match up the mouths?

As for the episode itself... it seemed like a nice start to a bigger plot. The evil Doctor gets away in the end, etc. It's too bad we'll probably never see him again (maybe the 20th anniversary) because he could make an interesting reoccuring villian. While we're not aloud to speak about the voices, I felt that they actually took away from the episode itself.

I wished we could have seen some more legendary pokemon. If they were going to go that route, they may as well have thrown in the whole kaboodle, instead of just Raquazza's head, have the dragon himself show up. I did love seeing Dragonite vs. Mewtwo though, that was an anime fight I've wanted for quite awhile.

♥~Darkness Within~♥
29th April 2006, 7:25 PM
I watching it right now you want my opinon, ****ing Corny They don't even pronouce the name correctly I'm about ready to Blow it off, it's just ****, May voice sounds like she's an adult just wrong, Ash's voice is just horrible, So is
Professor Oak's voice, Overall horrible so far

The Phantom Thief
29th April 2006, 7:25 PM
they just aired it at a screwy time, and should have aired it after Pikachu learned Volt Tackle

I wonder how they'll explain Pkachu learning Volt Tackle in the actual episode its supposed to learn it in :rolleyes:

Hercule
29th April 2006, 7:26 PM
Isn’t it a little selfish to say that May should have a larger role?
Here Roll will be big enough in the up coming episodes


Professor Oak had the most speaking lines in the special.

Oh CRAP! Could he be taking potential away from May and degrading her as a character?

Quick! We need to act!! Make May a Professor of Pokemon right this instant! We can call her Professor Pussywillow!
Look out May fans...
Be careful May fans everyone knows that Tracey will replace May (not to mention Elm)

The Point is This topic isn’t a May VS Misty topic.

It’s an Topic about the latest Pokémon special which wasn’t bad.
I’m glad that not the real mew died.
I'm also a little worried about the intro song.
Wouldn’t be really lame if the new intro song would be something like that

zonic the hedgehog
29th April 2006, 7:28 PM
and what is with the sudden new pronounciation(sp?) of pokemon? (pokamon??)

Ah, the sweet memories of the very first season.
I can almost remember when they said that, and I would think, "hey, isn't that supposed to be "Pok-eh-mon?"

It seems that PUSA didn't get the memo.

Storm_Dragoon
29th April 2006, 7:28 PM
Like the words of Comic Book Guy in The Simpsons, worst voices ever. If those are the new voice actors, I am never watching Pokemon again.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 7:30 PM
Like the words of Comic Book Guy in The Simpsons, worst voices ever. If those are the new voice actors, I am never watching Pokemon again.
Don't you mean the dub? Because the Japanese havn't changed their voices.

zonic the hedgehog
29th April 2006, 7:31 PM
Well, this special actually made me regain my interest in the dub.

Now I have something to point and laugh at every Saturday morning. =P

PAYKACHU, USE THUNDERBOLT!

gymleadermya19
29th April 2006, 7:32 PM
I wonder how they'll explain Pkachu learning Volt Tackle in the actual episode its supposed to learn it in :rolleyes:

wow some one agrees with me!!

Serebii
29th April 2006, 7:33 PM
Well V Faction, as soon as I've got the pics sorted, I am going to create BIOs for Oak and Dr. Yung/Mirage Master.

The entire special is canonical and thats that. It was made by the Japanese Writers & Producers...it just aired in the US first. Simple as that

The Big Al
29th April 2006, 7:33 PM
Any word on the animation director, Al?
Good thing I recorded this.

The Art Director was Masatoshi Muto.

Champion Jared 14
29th April 2006, 7:36 PM
Well V Faction, as soon as I've got the pics sorted, I am going to create BIOs for Oak and Dr. Yung/Mirage Master.

The entire special is canonical and thats that. It was made by the Japanese Writers & Producers...it just aired in the US first. Simple as that
Yeah, I was wondering when, where, and how prof. oak got that dragonite? I knew he had a pidgey from johto, but a dragonite? Maybe he's still been training...

Serebii
29th April 2006, 7:38 PM
Well Oak has been around for like 60 years...you really think all he had ever caught was a Pidgey & a Charmeleon?

Medea
29th April 2006, 7:38 PM
I taped this episode (commercial free I may add) and I've decided to keep it as a cruel reminder. Well onto the episode in and of itself (since I b*tched about the voices in the other thread) it was okay. I say that because of a couple of things...

1.) Most and/or all new voices sucked
2.) I really can't stand Mewtwo (and hated the 1st movie)
3.) There were just so many stupid pun related lines said through out the episode.

But one good thing (and it's a good thing to me in any episode with this in it) was that I got to see 1 SECOND OF TRACEY. And even better is that I didn't have to hear him. It would really break my heart to hear his new dub voice.

With that, I was also shocked to see 1 second of Professor Elm. I mean come on, when was the last time, we've actually seen him in the anime?

So there you go...*Medea is hauled off to the nut house*

EDIT: OMG, I forgot Dragonite (one of my favorites). Anytime seeing Dragonite is a treat for me!

Bliksem
29th April 2006, 7:38 PM
Thinking back, I'm adoring how wonderful it was that Dr. Yung/Yong probbed Pikachu's mind for memories.

The animation was violent. I like that. But Pokemon battles played out like YuGiOh or something.

"I sacrifice Articuno, Zapdos, and Entei to bring out... Ultimate Mirage Mewtwo!"

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 7:39 PM
Well V Faction, as soon as I've got the pics sorted, I am going to create BIOs for Oak and Dr. Yung/Mirage Master.

The entire special is canonical and thats that. It was made by the Japanese Writers & Producers...it just aired in the US first. Simple as that
Actually from what I've seen it can be either. For example no one knows what Pokemon Oak owns and which hes borrowing from a Pokemon trainer that left it at his lab, thus Dragonite isn't non-canon since it may not even be his.

Jikkle
29th April 2006, 7:40 PM
I can live with the new voices though I have some gripes with them. The special would've been better if they had written a better script. The whole script just felt corny and it didn't feel like the natural things the characters would say. Overall it wasn't too bad though.

Wes
29th April 2006, 7:42 PM
PAYKACHU, USE THUNDERBOLT!

.......You had to remind me of that didn't you...heck even the finding the computer room was better then that!

V Faction
29th April 2006, 7:43 PM
Dragonite was pure fan fodder. Oak can have any Pokemon, technically, there by excusing him from having such a high level Pokemon.

But the reason it was out of character is because Oak seemed like a down to Earth trainer. He was skilled with a Pidgey and required not more than that to do what was needed.

Dragonite's purpose to was purely to fight off Mewtwo and show a... I dunno, a badass side to Oak.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 7:44 PM
With that, I was also shocked to see 1 second of Professor Elm. I mean come on, when was the last time, we've actually seen him in the anime?
The right place and the right mime

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 7:44 PM
It's weird hearing TR say "Holy Cripes"...>_> well, I have to say the dialogue is...slightly bett- No, No wait, Not it's not. I can't believe i'm about to say this but "4KIDS!! COME BACK!!!" *gets slapped*

During the commercial I went back to an old episode that I have recorded..and I kissed the TV

and if they wanted to "mimic" the voices, They should have hired me to do Ash cause I can do his English voice perfectly...Or I could have at least done Meowth's voice to sound like an english speaking Japanese version of him..

Combusken also sounds like Towelie(sp?) from southpark...

Serebii
29th April 2006, 7:44 PM
Actually from what I've seen it can be either. For example no one knows what Pokemon Oak owns and which hes borrowing from a Pokemon trainer that left it at his lab, thus Dragonite isn't non-canon since it may not even be his.
Sorry but no, why on earth would Oak be carrying someone else's Pokemon...you're just tryin to make excuses. It is Canon, it is his. The End

MagicBox
29th April 2006, 7:47 PM
Absolute BS. The scumbags at Pokemon USA/4kids constantly glorify Misty and make May look like a nobody. Disgusting."Constantly?" Misty got one battle in this special, which she lost, and then she did nothing for the rest of the special. May did basically nothing for the entire special either, so one battle and one measly little line doesn't make Misty "glorified" and May a "nobody". Nobody is even going to take this hour-long disaster seriously anyway, so there's no point in getting upset.

At least your favorite character got to appear in the special for more than 10 minutes. "I'll go find Officer Jenny!" What a joke.

Since I didn't even care what was going to happen in this special anyway, I'm not too upset about it. That's not to say I don't think this special was sh*t, though. Believe me, it was. The only parts that interested me were the Volt Tackle scene and the parts where Combusken & Gyarados were on screen.

The script was filled with cliche, corny lines, and the voices didn't help either.

At least we got to hear a piece of music that dub-fans have never heard before. In the scene where Mew is restraining Mewtwo, music from the Japanese version of the first movie played.

So aside from one or two cool scenes, the special sucked. Well, at least it lived up to everyone's expectations.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 7:47 PM
Sorry but no, why on earth would Oak be carrying someone else's Pokemon...you're just tryin to make excuses. It is Canon, it is his. The End
excuses? I was agreeing with you. And as for why he had someone elses Pokemon, well who knows I didn't write this episode (If I did it would be very different)

Ashy Boy
29th April 2006, 7:49 PM
I only saw a clip of it and I was shocked to see (and heard about) Team Rocket and Brock appearing in the special although there were no mentions in the summary about them.

*$hinydragonite*
29th April 2006, 7:52 PM
The new voices suck :( . And where'd Professor Oak get the Dragonite?

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
29th April 2006, 7:53 PM
I dont know, thinking about it, doesnt it get anyone that we got to see Elm and Birch for about three seconds, then Joy and not Ivy, the woman who set up the excuse for Jhoto? Poor shafted woman.

Serebii
29th April 2006, 7:53 PM
Where did Professor Oak get the Pidgey?

Where did Professor Oak get the Charmeleon?

He isn't a main character...you dont have to see everything he does...jeez

Storm_Dragoon
29th April 2006, 7:53 PM
Don't you mean the dub? Because the Japanese havn't changed their voices.


Yeah I mean the dub, can't get Japanese episodes anyway.

raticatelover
29th April 2006, 7:54 PM
I watching it right now you want my opinon, ****ing Corny They don't even pronouce the name correctly I'm about ready to Blow it off, it's just ****, May voice sounds like she's an adult just wrong, Ash's voice is just horrible, So is
Professor Oak's voice, Overall horrible so far
Preach it brother!

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 7:55 PM
Where did Professor Oak get the Pidgey?

Where did Professor Oak get the Charmeleon?

He isn't a main character...you dont have to see everything he does...jeez
Actually both Pidgey and Charmeleon were explained in the episode or movie that they were in..

Darkstorm16
29th April 2006, 7:56 PM
The voice actors for Max and Jessie where atleast close. The voice actors for the other characters were bad but the one for Brock just scared the crap out of me -_-' Why didn't they get data on Deoxys or Lucaro through Pikachu's memory? I can tell this would take place after the 8th movie though. I don't know why I taped it.....oh yeah to make fun of it now. The part with Mew is the only part that made me sad.

Serebii
29th April 2006, 8:00 PM
Actually both Pidgey and Charmeleon were explained in the episode or movie that they were in..
Where did Richie get his Butterfree?

Where did Harrison get his Steelix?

Where did Tracey get his Marill?

See what I'm getting at, Secondary Characters dont need everything explained

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 8:02 PM
Where did Professor Oak get the Pidgey?

Where did Professor Oak get the Charmeleon?

He isn't a main character...you dont have to see everything he does...jeez
That kinda what I was trying to explai but my explaining can be terrible.

Squid Rooster
29th April 2006, 8:08 PM
See what I'm getting at, Secondary Characters dont need everything explained
Did you read his text, or are you just stubborn?

"Actually both Pidgey and Charmeleon were explained in the episode or movie that they were in..

Mumage
29th April 2006, 8:10 PM
Made me cry at the end. Poor Mew, why did it have to sacrifice it's self. >_<

TheTurquoiseTauros!
29th April 2006, 8:11 PM
yah and another thing is have you ever heard TR say "ohh ratatta"before?? let me tell you it wasnt pretty!

PDL
29th April 2006, 8:12 PM
frankly, I'm not surprized at all that Oak would have pokemon like Dragonite at his disposal. If his grandson, who's only as old as Ash can capture over 200 pokemon, then it's very likely that Oak can have alot of pokemon at his disposal as well.

just be glad it wasn't a Charizard :p

Silver Ryu
29th April 2006, 8:14 PM
'Kay, here's my notes.

~ASH'S VOICE IS HORRIBLE!!!!
~SO'S BROCK'S!!!
~Ack! Crappy rap!
~May's is OK. So's Misty's.
~OAK'S SUCKS!!!
~Max's kinda sucks.
~What's up with Ash being so cocky all of a sudden?
~ACK! MEOWTH & JAMES' VOICES?
~Jessie's is OK.
~This is good so far. Except for the voices. Otherwise, it's OK.
~The Mirage Master is a lame villan. And he looks familiar somehow...
~Everyone seems kind of out of character for some reason.
~Ummm....if he wants a weaknessless Pokemon, why not make a Sableye?
~Cheesy...
~"Oh, Ratatta"? Ugh...>_<
~Mew is SO CUTE!!!
~PUSA better change their minds. I don't think I could stand to hear these voices from now on.
~The animation kinda sucks.
~Pikachu! ;_;
~Ehh...this is OK. I give it 3/5 so far.
~There better not be an evil Latias&Latios. That would be sad.
~Joy & Jenny's voices are OK.
~It...killed them?
~Yay, Dragonite! =D
~The missles and fields and stuff kinda reminds me of Megaman. The show, I mean.
~The controller looks like a gun.
~Whoa, didn't see that coming. So he's Doctor Young?
~Oh god, CLICHE!!! "They rejected my work, so I'll take over the world for revenge!"
~I'd say 5/10 right now.
~Why is Mew so dang helpless? Can't it fight?
~Seriously lame villan...
~Shapeshifting hand?
~Lots of CGI here...
~Yay, Mew!
~Why was Mew's bubble green instead of pink?
~MEW! ;_;
~Eww! Too many Pokemon heads!
~What the!?!
~Mew's back! =D
~Is it overloading?
~Mew's back, but not for long...;_;
~Volt Tackle!
~Oh crap, sunset scene!
~WTF?
~CHEEESYYY
~This is like a bad fanfic...


Anyway, it was pretty good at the beginning, but after a while, it sucked. They kind of rushed it at the end. I think the idea had potential, but...it just didn't work. The voices were just plain awful, though. >_< They make my ears bleed. Poor Mew, though. That was sad. And yeah, the part with Mewtwo and all the Pokemon heads was just nasty. 0_o You know, most of the characters were just kind of there, they didn't do anything.

-_-

Anyway, I give it a 4/10.

Addydo
29th April 2006, 8:15 PM
I did not like the new voices! :@ They ALL sounded terrible!

PDL
29th April 2006, 8:16 PM
the only voice I'm genuinely pleased with was Meowth's, it sounded like a mixture of Maddie's work and the guy who voiced him way back in the first 12 or 13 episodes :)

Emma Iveli
29th April 2006, 8:19 PM
I thought people were supposed to go through puberty...not reverse through it...*coughcoughAshcoughcough* does anyone else think he kinda sounds like Luffy from One Piece?



No... I think he sounds more like Koby from One Piece... in fact I kept thinking Ash was going to say something about joining the navy... the sotry was pretty good, thoguh appeantlly Mirage Master how no idea how tell a real Entei from a dreamed up one... here's what I thoguht about the voices.

Misty: Was okay... but sounded al ittle too femeine

May: Was okay but sounded a little too tomboyish

Max: Sounded too much like Ash's new voice

Brock: A little too deep

Pro. Oak: Sounded a like Gary as an old man...

Nurse Joy: The only voice that I really liked.

Officer Jenny: Sounded too like Ash's new voice...

Ash: See above...

Puffs
29th April 2006, 8:22 PM
despite proffesional speculations, it appears that pocket monsters CAN be converted into digital monsters

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 8:22 PM
Anyone else find May's new voice kind of sexy? She didn't have that many lines so its hard to tell, but it went well with her figure at any rate.

Tiffany
29th April 2006, 8:23 PM
I cried at the end because of Mew. Poor little thing ;_;. The Pokémon heads coming out of Mewtwo's body kinda creeped me out though. The whole Mew/Mewtwo thing kinda disappointed me though because the whole thing has been done before *cough*firstmovie*cough*.

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 8:23 PM
Anyone else find May's new voice kind of sexy? She didn't have that many lines so its hard to tell, but it went well with her figure at any rate.

Not at all...she sounds like my mom did when I was a toddler....

MagicBox
29th April 2006, 8:24 PM
Anyone else find May's new voice kind of sexy? She didn't have that many lines so its hard to tell, but it went well with her figure at any rate.Hate to admit it, but I thought so too. It's funny, that's actually the first thing I thought when I first heard her voice. Now, if only she could learn how to act and show emotion, she'd be great.

Wes
29th April 2006, 8:28 PM
......I just wonder what was the flaw about Mew? The fact it had as Prof Oak put it....a soul?

S.Suikun
29th April 2006, 8:30 PM
There's a voice thread in the main anime forum, people.

My thoughts on this whole thing?
THIS. WAS. DISGUSTING.

This special did a grand total of 3 things right:
A) Giving Oak a Dragonite. Bout damn time we see him with something not from his lab.
B) The background music. Many pieces not usually found in the dub, including the Movie 7 battle theme, which is one of my favorite non-vocal pieces (That and Movie 8's "Retaliate").
C) The password. REDGREEN. That's the kind of Easter Egg that we need to see more often.

My God, this thing was predictable as hell. The Mirage Master being Dr. Yung was already called by many people before this even aired. Not to mention the battle scenes were awfully coreographed. Straight-up charge attacks, zero strategy, and pathetic animations. I would have laughed if Sceptile, Donphan, Marshtomp, Manene, or Eevee was shown, however. That woulda confused a lot of little kiddies.

The supposting cast was equally horrible in this. When you think about it, Misty was pointless in this. She did nothing useful whatsoever. As predicted, she was only in this for the fan appeasement. Come to think of it, May wasn't necessary either, but at least she's part of the current group. brock...did about as much as he usually does. We didn't even see him battle, for crying out loud.

Volt Tackle might perplex a few young'uns. Or they'll just assume he learned it automatically. The fact that Ash remembers Mew should guide you to the fact that this takes place after Movie 8, which also might confuse some kiddies. (Remember that he has no recollection of Movie 1)

Oh, and for the record, if you want to create a powerful Pokemon with no weaknesses, all you have to do is create a Sableye that can actually battle worth jack.

Wes
29th April 2006, 8:31 PM
Well....at least Prof Oak of all people had a good role......

Akerin
29th April 2006, 8:35 PM
I was... severely disappointed. I knew it wouldn't be all THAT spectacular, but at first I was at least excited to know Mew would be in it. But after watching it I realised this Mew was completely different from the one I know and love. It was fat, had babyish eyes, and small feet.. not to mention that voice. Ugh.. What happened to the Mew that sounded like a real kitten? This one sounds like a toddler trying to mimic the sound of a dying cat. :B

What upsets me even more is the fact that Mew is going to sound the same in the 8th movie. *been watching spoilers* ._.;;

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 8:38 PM
^ Movie 8 is dubbed by 4kids.

Wes
29th April 2006, 8:42 PM
Yeah the irony of it all. Pokemon (voice wise) was better with 4KIDS. Who would've thought?

Akerin
29th April 2006, 8:42 PM
^ Movie 8 is dubbed by 4kids.
Buuut, if you go and watch the spoilers (which are still in Japanese for now) Mews voice sounds the same as it did in this movie. ;P
I really doubt they'd bother to change it, since it's not like Mew's name is different in the US or anything.

Edit:
And another thing.. when the first movie was dubbed they didn't change Mews (CUTE) voice from the original either.

Ralts Master
29th April 2006, 8:43 PM
~Ummm....if he wants a weaknessless Pokemon, why not make a Sableye?
Because Sableye's weakness is that it sucks.

Alakazam
29th April 2006, 8:46 PM
New voices=stink much. I liked the special and new Mirage Master=Proffessor Young within 20 minutes of the movie.

Emma Iveli
29th April 2006, 8:46 PM
I fogot my reveiw of Mew's new voice... was it just me was Mew wasn't saying "Mew" but "Meru Meru Mei"? For those who don't know what "Meru Meru Mei" means it's what Ponygon says in Zatch Bell. I wonder if anyelse ntoiced that as well...

Akerin
29th April 2006, 8:50 PM
I fogot my reveiw of Mew's new voice... was it just me was Mew wasn't saying "Mew" but "Meru Meru Mei"? For those who don't know what "Meru Meru Mei" means it's what Ponygon says in Zatch Bell. I wonder if anyelse ntoiced that as well...
I don't watch Zatch Bell, but I agree it definitly sounded more like what you said than "mew." :/

Wes
29th April 2006, 8:53 PM
You know if 4kids dubbed this special I wonder how different this thread be....

◘Ins0mnIac◘
29th April 2006, 8:54 PM
*Ash watches Misty fall to her death and Pikachu being carried away unconsciously*
What happened: "haha hi again Mew. How's it going?"
What should of happened "Swellow, Go! save Misty! Now we need to find Pikachu...."

Oy, awfully written. And ok how about everybody uses one Pokemon against Mewtwo and make sure to push them as far as you can!

I'm sure all the little Japanese kids are laughing at us....

S.Suikun
29th April 2006, 8:55 PM
I fogot my reveiw of Mew's new voice... was it just me was Mew wasn't saying "Mew" but "Meru Meru Mei"? For those who don't know what "Meru Meru Mei" means it's what Ponygon says in Zatch Bell. I wonder if anyelse ntoiced that as well...
It was actually strikingly similar to Mew's Movie 8 voice.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 8:55 PM
You know if 4kids dubbed this special I wonder how different this thread be....


"4Kids! is so stupid! They can't make a special to save their hides. Long live Japanese music!"

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 9:03 PM
"4Kids! is so stupid! They can't make a special to save their hides. Long live Japanese music!"
4kids planned this all along..They knew they were gonna lose the licence and this was their final revenge..

Wes
29th April 2006, 9:04 PM
4kids planned this all along..They knew they were gonna lose the licence and this was their final revenge..

.....Except they still didn't dub it! Don't be so paronoid!

V Faction
29th April 2006, 9:05 PM
4kids planned this all along..They knew they were gonna lose the licence and this was their final revenge..
See? Even when it's not their fault, it's their fault!

ZeoViolet
29th April 2006, 9:08 PM
All right, my brain is in total burnout so my rambling may not make much sense....forgive me if you have no idea what I'm talking about because I am not sure I do myself right now....I'm too tired!^^

*twitches* My...virgin....ears. Dub...voices.....arrrgh!

How the HFIL did not only this Mirage guy but Professor Oak know of Mewtwo in the first place? My guess for the Mirage professor I suspect he may have been a TR malcontent who left Team Rocket before Mewtwo's memory wipe of them, but that does not explain Professor Oak's knowledge. He of course also attended the Pokemon Institute, so maybe both?....

Then again....Professor Oak seems to know everything no matter anyone's secrets. Ash couldn't have blabbed to him. He gave his word to Mewtwo about keeping his trap shut the last time they met.

*Tries to figure out mirage system* It wasn't quite cloning but used their DNA to create their forms...I can't help but think what the 'real' Mew and Mewtwo would have thought if they'd known about this and saw how they'd been used....especially Mewtwo. I really doubt he'd be thrilled to see himself, in any form, used in such a fashion.

Why was that Mew different? How did the spirit of a Mew get caught in a mirage matrix....I know those aren't questions with definete answers but my brain is wandering where it shouldn't and I'm too tired to care^^ Maybe Mew had trapped it's very essence into the DNA sequence that the machine did originally copy from wherever the DNA came from (The machine does seem to work from copied DNA sequences). Mew is quite a special pokemon after all.

Animation....laughable. The end.

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 9:10 PM
.....Except they still didn't dub it! Don't be so paronoid!
They planned fro PUSA to get the licence..they wanted payback for the hate mail and hell we've given them since Jhoto..

Blazken
29th April 2006, 9:12 PM
This was not a pokemon show the plot wast somthing from yu-gi-oh not pokemon the only thing that had to do with the plot was the name.

The Big Al
29th April 2006, 9:14 PM
I'm sure all the little Japanese kids are laughing at us....
Accept it was a Japanese writer who wrote this.

Bling King
29th April 2006, 9:16 PM
I knew people would hate this from the second it was announced.

ijea4444
29th April 2006, 9:18 PM
Crowler?
Anyways people spoke of Bayleef!We only saw like 1 pokemon from each person we didnt even see Brocks.

wrong ash took out pikachu and corphish.
May combusken adn squirtle
Misty Gyrados and staryu

Brocksketchum
29th April 2006, 9:20 PM
I was hoping the special would find some way to make every Pokemon appear. But that was small fish. Now what was Brock doing all this time? ;)

Now I'm obsessed with that one scene where the rubble fell in front of Prof. Oak just as he was running towards Dr. Yung. Maybe the coincidence of the falling rubble appealed to my personality.

It was a relief to see the Japanese BGM used instead of the dub BGM. That was all I was looking for, pretty much.

The special could've shown more of Ash's, Misty's, May's, and Brock's Pokemon. Ash could've made a better attempt to save Misty. The explainations felt dumbed down.

I'm starting to notice May's been working out. Anyways, it would've been funny if the plot was resolved by one of the characters accidentally tripping on the power cord. :D

Shigeru-kun
29th April 2006, 9:37 PM
I don't know about anyone else, but I was really surprised (and rather happy) they actually talked about Myuu's soul at the end. Granted it wasn't a long conversation or anything, but had this been 4Kids, I'm sure it would have been tweaked to something else. Yanno, being a little too religious for their tastes and all...*rolls eyes*

Anywho though, the special wasn't bad, but I think a lot of that was due to the new voices. Change them back to the 4Kids cast though? Pft. You got a REALLY boring special then people. Or at least in my opinion you do.

One thing I did like about this special though was how Kasumi and Haruka interacted. They spent a little more time together, and it almost reminded me of two sisters. Sort of like when Yung comands Myuutwo to blast the other mirage pokemon and Kasumi shields Haruka from the blast.

ghost master
29th April 2006, 9:51 PM
How the HFIL did not only this Mirage guy but Professor Oak know of Mewtwo in the first place? My guess for the Mirage professor I suspect he may have been a TR malcontent who left Team Rocket before Mewtwo's memory wipe of them, but that does not explain Professor Oak's knowledge. He of course also attended the Pokemon Institute, so maybe both?.... Well the mirage guy most likely found out about since he was able to get info from all databses in the world I'm sure one of them wouldve seen mewtwo. Profesor oak who knows that guy is seen as the all knowing god in there anyway.

I think the special went pretty good for a 10 year anniversary. The only thing people could really complain about was the dub voices. It also went well especially for people dooming it to crud stating misty would wear pre ag clothes and there would be pokeshipping galor and may, max or brock wouldnt be there. I expected and saw what I expected dub errors and voice issues with an overall good idea to involve integral characters for a 10nth anniversary. I thought Misty and May got near equal roles. Misty may've got more screentime but if you look overall Misty has been around in the series for longer than May has.

ハルカ and ゴンベ
29th April 2006, 10:01 PM
I just noiced something that goes along with Ash's new Luffy voice...If you listen to the theme song (i don't know why you would though...>_>) It has turned into a lame *** rap like the One piece theme song o_o;

One Piece: "Yo! Gotta Go, Gotta go, gotta go..."

Pokemon:" Yo! Pokemon masters your hearts beat faster.."

Omg..I wanna puke..Pokemon is the new one piece..

Misty-chan
29th April 2006, 10:01 PM
Someone knows when gonna appears the guide of episode with pics? I don´t see this episode, but I´m very crazy to see it.

Why some people are made here a fight of Misty x May??? The both act like friends not like adversary... o.ő . I don´t understand.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 10:04 PM
Someone knows when gonna appears the guide of episode with pics? I don´t see this episode, but I´m very crazy to see it.

Why some people are made here a fight of Misty x May??? The both act like friends not like adversary... o.ő . I don´t understand.
Theres a line May says that makes it sound like they have had an arguement

Mirai Mirai
29th April 2006, 10:30 PM
I just noiced something that goes along with Ash's new Luffy voice...If you listen to the theme song (i don't know why you would though...>_>) It has turned into a lame *** rap like the One piece theme song o_o;

One Piece: "Yo! Gotta Go, Gotta go, gotta go..."

Pokemon:" Yo! Pokemon masters your hearts beat faster.."

Omg..I wanna puke..Pokemon is the new one piece..

Oh God. My brain twitched at the thought of that.

Dreamcoat
29th April 2006, 10:38 PM
WHAT?! DR. YOUNG IS MIRAGE MASTER?!?! (spoiler for those who have taped it and are planning to watch it later.).

It kinda makes sense when you think about it since it was him who created the Mirage System and 'went crazy due to it' .

Literate
29th April 2006, 10:43 PM
It's playing now, and I ditched it within two minutes. Ash acted like a weirdo by saying someone said that he had good training skills. I thought he already knew that. Conceited. Then there was May with the weird voice. O_o I couldn't even hear what she was even saying. Max's line was OCC, I think. And Brock was the only one I ever heard. Something about Ash repeating the letter a ton of times.

I was disappointed. I saw the commecial, got all excited, and then, it was poo. No offence to who actually liked it.

~PEACE~

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 10:43 PM
It kinda makes sense when you think about it since it was him who created the Mirage System and 'went crazy due to it' .
How very Monkey Fist

By that I mean the fact He invites the very people who foil his plans to witniss his evil plan, just like Monkey Fist did when he first appeared in Kim Possible

MewMaster
29th April 2006, 10:45 PM
I hated the new dub. It was so distracting because of how unused to it I was. Now I'm joining the cause to save the dub and an going to put 110% into it!

Denjuu
29th April 2006, 10:47 PM
I thought it was gonna be a movie, but it's like a Pokemon episode, just 30 minutes longer...

MagicBox
29th April 2006, 10:47 PM
I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but did anyone else notice how mature this special was as far as content goes? I mean, Dr. Yung just calmly walked back into that burning building when it collapsed; it can only be assumed that he's dead now. Jenny even said she looked everywhere and couldn't figure out his location in all the debris.

That's pretty mature for a Pokemon related special, don't you think? Death doesn't normally happen in their world, especially when it resembles a suicide like that.

MewMaster
29th April 2006, 10:53 PM
This episode was not as good as I thought it was. IMO, it was a bit bad. The new voices sounded terrible, especially Ash, Brock, May (bascially all the characters). I prefer the old voices. They were much better. I thought Dr. YUng being the Mirage Master was such an unoriginal idea, IMO.

I agree 100%. The Prof. Yung being the MM was really stupid. It was sooooo Scooby Doo.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 10:53 PM
don't think this has been mentioned yet, but did anyone else notice how mature this special was as far as content goes? I mean, Dr. Yung just calmly walked back into that burning building when it collapsed; it can only be assumed that he's dead now. Jenny even said she looked everywhere and couldn't figure out his location in all the debris.

That's pretty mature for a Pokemon related special, don't you think? Death doesn't normally happen in their world, especially when it resembles a suicide like that.
It's nice but it doesn't cut the mustard. Or at least to the level you are insinuating.

Until they out right mention DEATH or use some form of the word DEAD (dead, deading, deader, pushing up daisys) their efforts to act mature will go unappreciated. To actually be mature about they have to acknowledge death.

Cloud Strife
29th April 2006, 10:55 PM
I can't believe that V Faction. How much MORE do you need? (I am by no means defending the special, just this one part) Tell you what, if you walk into a BURNING COLLAPSING building, than we will just not say you are dead, because apparently if we don't agknowledge it it never happened right? CLEARLY he is dead.

MewMaster
29th April 2006, 10:56 PM
The end was so stupid. When the M field things spread out over the it was like a Megaman serries. They are such copy cats

johnnyd2
29th April 2006, 11:04 PM
blegh, i was personally a little dissapointed, virtually no pokeshipping (if any hints, at least there were may x misty hints for us yuri supporters ^_^) hints AT ALL, Mewtwo getting Dues ex machina'd. Oh and about that, mewtwo took a bunch of other attacks but dies to VOLT TACKLE?!?!??!?!? DA F***? meh, and the voices were bad too, i was hoping for misty to get a little more screentime but im partially satisfied. overall, 5.5/10 (had a LOT of potential, but just didnt live up to it).

TheTurquoiseTauros!
29th April 2006, 11:09 PM
i couldnt watch because of the voices!!OMG make them stop.make them stop!!!
im going to hear them in my dreams!!! HELPPPP!!

jolteonjak
29th April 2006, 11:16 PM
Uggh...that was just tedious. The basic idea was great to me. The way it was implemented just sucked.

-I don't care that Misty was there. I don't think she's any more or less important than May because of this.

-Mew sounded like a child.

-Did Mewtwo talk in the other special? I never saw it.

-TR's only role was to show off their new voices...(see other thread). They could have just talked to Ash on the phone if they wanted them to have a minimal role.

-Same goes for Max.

~*Myuu the Ryuu*~
29th April 2006, 11:20 PM
The plot was really good. Personally, the best part was when Mewtwo's hand transformed into Rayquaza! Of course, this was expected since Hyper beam is it's signature move after all :D

The worst part was Volt tackle. They shouldn't have shown it in the first place, and in the anime Pokemon don't just learn moves with a snap of the finger like in the games.

Diljabar
29th April 2006, 11:24 PM
They were ALL new voices (even Wobbuffet) except, surprise, surprise, MISTY! Yes, our favorite (?) Pokégirl, who, I have noticed, had actually been played by someone else with an EXTREMELY similar voice, but today it was the original actress! (Yes I have a very good ear.) Mew's voice was abominable! The original was soooo cute (no offense Zerodius; I like Mew & Mewtwo a lot) but this one was SICKENING! Mewtwo didn't speak (it's only a mirage anyway) but I don't mind. Basically, the special was specifically designed as a launching pad for the new actors since is was not aired in Japan (yet). They were scary!

Please, we must petition vehemently for Pokémon USA to use the classic actors (except that Misty) or lose our love and support for it!

EDIT: Yes, since when DID Pikachu know Volt Tackle??? At least it IS the über Electric attack!

jolteonjak
29th April 2006, 11:29 PM
Oh, and for the record, if you want to create a powerful Pokemon with no weaknesses, all you have to do is create a Sableye that can actually battle worth jack.


Again, I have my Machamp use Foresight followed by Focus Punch. There's Sableye's weakness...Foresight/Odor Sleuth.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 11:32 PM
Again, I have my Machamp use Foresight followed by Focus Punch. There's Sableye's weakness...Foresight/Odor Sleuth.
Y'know jak, most people don't have Foresight on their Machamp...

Then again, most people don't train Sableye either, but what the heck!

MewMaster
29th April 2006, 11:33 PM
*Ash watches Misty fall to her death and Pikachu being carried away unconsciously*
What happened: "haha hi again Mew. How's it going?"
What should of happened "Swellow, Go! save Misty! Now we need to find Pikachu...."

Oy, awfully written. And ok how about everybody uses one Pokemon against Mewtwo and make sure to push them as far as you can! .

I know that was bad. I thought ash kida LIke liked liked Misty. PKMN.com mad eall those songs about it and then trashed it when Ash didn't give crap about Misty falling to her death. AGAIN AWFULLY written.

Neko Godot
29th April 2006, 11:33 PM
Yung didn't die. If he did, there would go the plans of the 20th anniversary special.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 11:33 PM
Yes, since when DID Pikachu know Volt Tackle??? At least it IS the über Electric attack!
It learnt it during the Battle Frontier saga.

Wes
29th April 2006, 11:37 PM
Yung didn't die. If he did, there would go the plans of the 20th anniversary special.

He's dead. He did suicide you can't deny. I mean....you can honestly thibnk they can't come up with something else for another special?

Anon e Mouse Jr.
29th April 2006, 11:37 PM
I watched this one, and though some of the voices were kind of "eh" at the beginning, by the end of it I think I was used to them. They grow on you. Seeing Volt Tackle for the first time in the U.S. was cool. I was also pleasently surprised by seeing the clips from the old movies. But I do have two complaints, both plot related:

First, only ONE of Ash's Pokémon (Corphish) appears besides Pikachu, and then only briefly. I kept wondering when he'd pull out the big guns. (And by "big guns", I mean Sceptile.)

Second, how come none of the real Legendaries showed up? Mewtwo Vs. the Mirage Mewtwo... now THAT would have been an awesome battle. But no, it was Pikachu and the Mirage Mew that won the battle after getting smacked around for most of the special.

All in all, it was okay. Could have been better, but for an hour-long special, it was definately interesting to watch. I give it a seven out of ten.

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 11:39 PM
I know that was bad. I thought ash kida LIke liked liked Misty. PKMN.com mad eall those songs about it and then trashed it when Ash didn't give crap about Misty falling to her death. AGAIN AWFULLY written.
The DUB made those songs. I find the fact there was no Pokeshipping a GOOD thing and thats not just because I'm an Advanceshipper but because it would drag too far from the plot (and from what I've heard there were enough things dragging away from the plot as it was)

S.Suikun
29th April 2006, 11:41 PM
Come to think of it, it was pretty damn stupid of Dr. Yung to invite Misty and Ash and co. to his laboratory. Prof. Oak was really the only one he needed. There was no point in inviting the others. And since Prof. Oak has seen many rare Pokemon in his lifetime (Celebi, Entei, and the birds at least), he could have just extracted the data from his memory.

jolteonjak
29th April 2006, 11:41 PM
Y'know jak, most people don't have Foresight on their Machamp...

Then again, most people don't train Sableye either, but what the heck!


heh...because it isn't a threat.

Diljabar
29th April 2006, 11:41 PM
I give it a 3. 1 for being Pokémon, 1 for being in English, and 1 for have the original Misty actress. That's it.

Flame Haze SnS
29th April 2006, 11:42 PM
This special is okay, I even recorded it to keep watching this one. VAs? Sound a bit different from others. Misty's Gyarados return once again, but all it use was Hydro Pump. Why it couldn't use some attacks like FlameThrower or Hyper Beam? You know that on monitor where Dr. Yung extract Pikachu's memory into the computer from the past like Lati@s, Entei, Legendary Birds, Lugia, Celebi, but why didn't they show Suicune and Jirachi?

Gaiash
29th April 2006, 11:43 PM
So thats why there was a Mirage Mewtwo, from Ash and co's memories.

Wes
29th April 2006, 11:44 PM
Well one thing's for sure. Despite the wackey voices the special was kind of emotional.....I mean there were moments were it was pretty sad....that I can't deny.

S.Suikun
29th April 2006, 11:45 PM
I give it a 3. 1 for being Pokémon, 1 for being in English, and 1 for have the original Misty actress. That's it.
...There was no original Misty actress. Her new VA simply did the best job. Which is a shame considering how we won't be seeing her again for a long time.

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 11:46 PM
Ash really sucked when he called out to Pikachu, ugh. How could they turn Ash into Richie? They should have made Ash's voice deeper like Veronica was doing, not higher and Richie-like.

Now it sounds like May is older than him. Boy, next season will be interesting, 20 year old May taking advice from 10 year old Ash. -_-

Wes
29th April 2006, 11:46 PM
...There was no original Misty actress. Her new VA simply did the best job. Which is a shame considering how we won't be seeing her again for a long time.

Once again irony sucks.....well whatever.

^^Yoshinichi^^
29th April 2006, 11:48 PM
I really liked some of the new voice's a lot. Meowth's was kinda annoying to me. And Team Rocket acted like they act in the regular episode's. I kinda had a weird feeling they'd bring back the Masked Marauder, and I'm glad I'm wrong.

The plot was kinda stale and it remind's me too much of the 4th movie.
The opening "song" was stupid.

V Faction
29th April 2006, 11:50 PM
Come to think of it, it was pretty damn stupid of Dr. Yung to invite Misty and Ash and co. to his laboratory. Prof. Oak was really the only one he needed. There was no point in inviting the others. And since Prof. Oak has seen many rare Pokemon in his lifetime (Celebi, Entei, and the birds at least), he could have just extracted the data from his memory.
You could argue the others were used as bargaining chips. If it had just been Oak, there's no telling what extremes he may have gone to in order to prevent the knowledge from being taken. Invite Ash and Misty and suddenly you have not only extra options to extracting the data but negotiatable hostages, too.

Wes
29th April 2006, 11:52 PM
Well anyone have a guess when this will air in Japan? I just want to see if they took anything out of the US version to be saved for the Japanese version.

CyberCubed
29th April 2006, 11:53 PM
There's probably no extra footage if this ever airs in Japan.

Wes
29th April 2006, 11:54 PM
True.....but you never know. I mean they could always add more into the Japan version seeing how that country is more....feasible with things in Televsion then our country.

S.Suikun
30th April 2006, 12:00 AM
Was the exact length of this the eqivalent of two normal episodes, though? (44 minutes) because the Deoxys special that aired in Japan recently was only 42 minutes, and even with the 9th Movie preview slapped on at the end, it was still only 43 (This does not include the credits and such). If this was that length or longer, I'd wager nothing would be added.

chosen_one386
30th April 2006, 12:02 AM
Anyways, it would've been funny if the plot was resolved by one of the characters accidentally tripping on the power cord. :D

LOLOLOL!!! Ah, the simpleness of electronic Pokemon...

I really liked Professor Yung/Mirage Master. The suicide at the end though, was uncalled for. Didn't he say before then, "There is much work for me to do"?

That Mew dying almost make me burst into tears (so did Ash's dub voice..."

I've already expressed my viewd on the dub voices on the thread...

Final point before I get to my rating: P.Yung's disguise was too Phantom of the Opera for me. My dad watches that movie at 11:00 at night with the sterio speakers on when I am trying to sleep! I've memorised it by now!

Overall plot and animation:10/10 Dub voices: *goes into crumbling building in attempt of suicide like Yung*

Wes
30th April 2006, 12:03 AM
Well I guess your right......well I guess this special was particularly nice. Not the best but was a nice break from the regular episodes. That and the emotion....well ....sniff sniff....

Gaiash
30th April 2006, 12:04 AM
My dad watches that movie at 11:00 at night with the sterio speakers on when I am trying to sleep! I've memorised it by now!
Kinda like me and The Jimmy Timmy Power Hour 2 not that long ago (except it was headphones)

Mimori Kiryu
30th April 2006, 12:07 AM
Did anyone else realize how when Mirage Master extracted the memories from Pikachu that he didn't see Moltres, Suicune or Jirachi? :/ Why not? They showed Latios and Latias and both Moltres and Suicune appeared before that and Jirachi right after...>>;

Anywho, my thoughts on the movie:

~ I like the plot, pretty good actually.
~ I like the Mirage thing. Pretty interesting.
~ The intro SUCKED. I hated that stupid thing. Pokemon no equal Rap. :/
~ I liked it that Mew had a soul. Cute. ^^
~ I was glad that Brock was still lovesick Brock. ;D
~ The animation was pretty good.
~ Wow, I didn't even realize that Dr Yung was Mirage Master. I must be losing my anime touch...:/ And aw, damn. He was really cute too.
~ Interesting that there was actually physical fighting seen. o_O That surprised me that they showed that....
~ I was surprised that Dr. Yung actually did commit suicide. I didn't think he would do that. :/ Damn. Like I said earlier. He's hot.


I'm done.

CyberCubed
30th April 2006, 12:09 AM
A lot of Pokemon were...silent here.

Corphish didn't say anything. Magnemite didn't either have it shocked Mew. Did Machamp/Machoke even say their names? Lots of Pokemon were...quiet.

Gaiash
30th April 2006, 12:11 AM
I think once I watch this I'm going to make a parody comic starring the GCD vertions of Ash and May making jabs towards cirtain things (Which is what Ash does in my comics anyway)

Aptenodytes
30th April 2006, 12:13 AM
This special was okay I guess. The fact the Mirage Master was Dr. Yung was a little obvious though. I liked the animations, but the plot wasn't all that great. Although, I wondered why he used Pokemon like Machamp and Machoke when he had acess to a Lugia, Celebi, and even Deoxys o.O

Wes
30th April 2006, 12:15 AM
This special was okay I guess. The fact the Mirage Master was Dr. Yung was a little obvious though. I liked the animations, but the plot wasn't all that great. Although, I wondered why he used Pokemon like Machamp and Machoke when he had acess to a Lugia, Celebi, and even Deoxys o.O

Perhaps he likes fighting types. I mean maybe he just doesn't want to use them and prefers the other legendaries instead.

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
30th April 2006, 12:15 AM
I think Machamp/choke only grunted.
PS: We need an Ash/Machamp SHip name XD

Mimory: Lots of Pokemon from Ash's memories wernt seen: Rukario, the Regi's, Suicune, the Unown. Hell, some of the more powerful pokemon they met period wernt shown, like Tyranatar.

Anyone else, though, find it stange the view of Lugia from Pikachu's memories showed Pikachu running? How?

V Faction
30th April 2006, 12:16 AM
Anyone else, though, find it stange the view of Lugia from Pikachu's memories showed Pikachu running? How?
A neglect to actually inspect the clips?

Wandering Rhythmical Phoenix
30th April 2006, 12:20 AM
A neglect to actually inspect the clips?
Damn Lazy animators

Flame Haze SnS
30th April 2006, 12:26 AM
Lol, yeah, animators are lazy...Looks like that most people said that death of Mew (technically not) was the saddest they ever watch in special. When Ash said the he'l meet Mew again, this could be the hint that Mew will return to meet Ash and co.

Wes
30th April 2006, 12:28 AM
The real Mew or the Mirage Mew? i'm going to say the former.

Flame Haze SnS
30th April 2006, 12:33 AM
Mirage Mew. It's made up of data extracted from the memories of each pokemon. But it has mind of its own and have soul.

Gaiash
30th April 2006, 12:47 AM
Imagine if Ho-oh had shown up in the memory thingy (Did it?) and Ash said "I told you" to Oak.

Wes
30th April 2006, 12:47 AM
Yeah......I have to admit.....that part toward the end....was sad....but the wya I see it in the world of Pokemon anything can happen so I do have faith for Ash and pals!