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Serebii
4th May 2006, 3:30 PM
http://www.serebii.net/anime/NextOn/451.jpgGoing For Choke

After just getting through the preliminaries, May gets ready for the finals of her 5th Pokémon Contest. However her rival Harley, still trying to stop May from getting through lends his Cacturne & Banette to Jessie who also got through the preliminaries. However, May & Jessie wind up having to battle eachother in order to get the ribbon. Will May win?

Visit The Episode Guide (http://www.serebii.net/anime/epiguide/kanto/451.shtml)

Discuss

Neko Godot
4th May 2006, 9:37 PM
So, did May win this contest, or was it a loss?

CyberCubed
4th May 2006, 9:42 PM
She won (of course), Squirtle beats Banette and May gets the ribbon. She now has all five and can enter the Grand Festival next month.

erizibang
4th May 2006, 10:05 PM
oh my! have you seen it?? *-*... what happened to Ash and co.?? Did Drew saved them?? o.o??

The Great Butler
4th May 2006, 11:25 PM
Squirtle beat Banette? Pssh, chalk up yet another 'Mary-Sue' moment for May.

I was looking forward to this episode until I found that out........

Gravy
4th May 2006, 11:34 PM
I was looking forward to this episode until I found that out........
...and it wasn't totally obvious from the get-go?!

And jesus. You should at least see how the battle played out before bringing up the whole 'Mary-Sue' garb. For all we know, this could have been a postive turning point for Squirtle, in terms of how it battles.

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 12:24 AM
Squirtle beat Banette? Pssh, chalk up yet another 'Mary-Sue' moment for May.

Let's wait till we see the battle first. At least this time Squirtle already knows Ice Beam, so it didn't pull an attack out of nowhere! :p


I was looking forward to this episode until I found that out........

I take it you didn't watch the preview then? It showed Squirtle and Banette battling each other right in the preview clip.

The Great Butler
5th May 2006, 12:27 AM
Let's wait till we see the battle first. At least this time Squirtle already knows Ice Beam, so it didn't pull an attack out of nowhere! :p



I take it you didn't watch the preview then? It showed Squirtle and Banette battling each other right in the preview clip.

It was Squirtle actually beating Banette which disappointed me. May needs a dose of humility rather badly, that would make me like her a lot more. It's long overdue for someone in this series to not make it to the League or Festival and decide it isn't the end of the world.

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 12:28 AM
It would also be the biggest cop out to build up to a tournament and then not deliver. If May didn't get to enter the Grand Festival, I'd wonder why the writers wasted time making Contest episodes with no payoff at the end.

Korobooshi Kojiro
5th May 2006, 12:28 AM
Is Squirtle winning suprising at all? I mean, I went in to this with "Squirtle will win". It might not be cheap, Squirtle may barely win, or Squirtle could use Hydro Pump. You should wait till you see it.

So, my question is, whose Skarmory was it?

The Great Butler
5th May 2006, 12:36 AM
Eh. I guess I've been bittered by May's numerous other 00ber-fied wins.

And what would stop her from attending the Grand Festival anyway and rooting for Drew? It would be a nice change to see normally supporting characters get to star for once.

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 12:41 AM
And what would stop her from attending the Grand Festival anyway and rooting for Drew? It would be a nice change to see normally supporting characters get to star for once.

The fact that she's not competing would still make it a cop out. I'm not going into the Kanto GF for the sake of seeing the spotlight on Drew, I want to watch the Kanto GF with the focus on May, you know, the character we actually watched working toward this goal all season.

Just like how watching Morrison battle in the Hoenn league was fun, but if they didn't focus on Ash, I would have been pissed.

Mawile XD
5th May 2006, 12:42 AM
It was Squirtle actually beating Banette which disappointed me. May needs a dose of humility rather badly, that would make me like her a lot more. It's long overdue for someone in this series to not make it to the League or Festival and decide it isn't the end of the world.
Don't forget about Munchlax versus Octillery. ^_~ Harley beating her humiliated her. Still, I agree.

MagicBox
5th May 2006, 2:48 AM
Let's wait till we see the battle first. At least this time Squirtle already knows Ice Beam, so it didn't pull an attack out of nowhere! :p"Zenigame! Use Iron Tail! WHOAMG, it worked!"

Ewwww......


It would also be the biggest cop out to build up to a tournament and then not deliver. If May didn't get to enter the Grand Festival, I'd wonder why the writers wasted time making Contest episodes with no payoff at the end.Well, it would make the anime more realistic, but I guess that's not really all that fun.

Jo-Jo
5th May 2006, 2:57 AM
Squirtle winning = no-brainer.

Weird how little information is out for this ep. :/ People seemed more interested in last week's.

Saraform
5th May 2006, 2:24 PM
Weird how little information is out for this ep. :/ People seemed more interested in last week's.
Trust no one; learn Japanese and become independent.

The only event of importance is the revelation of the Grand Festival's location - Indigo Plateau.

Jo-Jo
5th May 2006, 3:37 PM
Trust no one; learn Japanese and become independent.
*g* I've filed 'learn Japanese' on my life-list just under 'learn quantum physics'. :p


The only event of importance is the revelation of the Grand Festival's location - Indigo Plateau.
Ooooh, The Big Al's not going to like that. :D

Seriously, though, that is interesting news. Does that mean the GF will be held in the stadium itself? If so, that might decrease the odds that Ash will redo the Indigo League. Then again, perhaps the IL is going to run immediately after the GF. Hmm.

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 4:49 PM
That's pretty cool actually. Ash re-entering the Indigo league just got a hell of a lot more likely.

JazzJazz
5th May 2006, 10:53 PM
That's pretty cool actually. Ash re-entering the Indigo league just got a hell of a lot more likely.

I'm sure that there'll be some big challenge awaiting Ash at the end of his Battle Frontier journey, but I really don't see it being the Indigo League... surely there would've been mention of it by now.

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 10:54 PM
So far there's still no mention of Ash doing anything after the Battle Pyramid, so it can go either way. It's not as if we know where he's headed after he gets the 7th symbol. (aside from traveling to the Indigo Plateau for May's Grand Festival)

The Great Butler
5th May 2006, 11:15 PM
I can honestly see the Battle Frontier ending with a whimper for Ash with a pathetic Legendary-fest versus Brandon and nothing more while May gets a second Grand Festival. I'm getting rather sick of all the over-glorification of May lately.....the even bill from Hoenn worked fine.

GreenKirby
5th May 2006, 11:19 PM
What attacks does Bannette use here?

CyberCubed
5th May 2006, 11:22 PM
I can honestly see the Battle Frontier ending with a whimper for Ash with a pathetic Legendary-fest versus Brandon and nothing more while May gets a second Grand Festival. I'm getting rather sick of all the over-glorification of May lately.....the even bill from Hoenn worked fine.

Ash gets to battle an Elite 4 member, 7 Brains, and at least two legendaries in the BF saga. May just competed in 6 more Contests and a Grand Festival.

If anything, the BF saga is all Ash glorification. Not that there's anything wrong with that, because it shows how strong Ash is now. May hasn't been able to beat a legendary yet, and she probably never will, so I don't see how she's being glorified just because she can get 5 ribbons.

The Great Butler
5th May 2006, 11:28 PM
Ash gets to battle an Elite 4 member, 7 Brains, and at least two legendaries in the BF saga. May just competed in 6 more Contests and a Grand Festival.

How many Pokémon has Ash caught this saga. None. May meanwhile gets a Squirtle that is made 00ber (did it really use Iron Tail? >_<) an Eevee made equally more 00ber (Brock won that match. I'll keep saying it until I keel over dead.) Ash also hasn't been given very many plots outside "Battle the brain, win a symbol" while May has:

-traveled through time
-actually had decent rivals in the form of Harley and Drew
-chased that Arcanine

Not to mention her habit of demanding to stop at food stands without a care to what anyone else thinks.

And she's going to be the star of "Pokémon Ranger and the Prince of the Sea Manafi?" Yuck.

The Great Butler
6th May 2006, 12:29 AM
May's legitimate wins (which is, like, ALL OF THEM), yet, no one complains about Ash's illegitimate wins? (which is like, ALL OF THEM!)

Dusclops vs. Skitty. Houndoom vs. Skitty. Jynx vs. Skitty. Marshtomp vs. Eevee. All four completely illogical wins for her, especially the Dusclops and Marshtomp ones. Even CyberCubed has said the Dusclops one was crap.


Squirtle beating a Bannete being used by TEAM ROCKET

Squirtle is a baby, as you'd know if you saw May get it, while Banette has been being trained obsessively by Harley for who knows how long. Not to mention at its most basic, Banette is simply stronger than Squirtle.


Squirtle using Ice Beam is so horribly wrong, yet Charizard taking an Ice Beam to the back, and having no effect is fine?

Charizard = heat. Heat + ice = melt.


Eevee that has been training beating a pathetic excuse of a former Gym Leader's Swampert that got like, NO battle experience throughout the entire series

Brock outplayed May to an unbelieveable degree. Eevee didn't land a single hit on it for a majority of the battle.


Bulbasaur and Beautifly PWNING a Bannete and Cacturne owned by a trainer that OBVIOUSLY SUCKS AND HAS TO CHEAT TO WIN

Harley cheats because he's a villain. Haven't you heard that he beat May legitimately?


THAT ****ING THUNDER ARMOR THING GETS NO COMPLAINTS?!


Where did you get that from? Many people complained about it.


they really should give May her own spin-off, and get a better cast of writers for it, she is too good for this show, and the hypocritical idiots that watch it.....

I don't think I'm the idiot here.

Korobooshi Kojiro
6th May 2006, 12:39 AM
Gawd, the only reason I hate May-centric episodes is because of stuff like this.

Anyway, anyone see any pictures yet?

Almighty Zard
6th May 2006, 12:55 AM
How many Pokémon has Ash caught this saga. None. May meanwhile gets a Squirtle that is made 00ber (did it really use Iron Tail? >_<) an Eevee made equally more 00ber (Brock won that match. I'll keep saying it until I keel over dead.)

Ah but, Ash has had 2 evolutions to cancel that out, and you have to remember it's only natural for May to be catching pokemon in this saga as this is her first time in Kanto, and i'm gonna go get my earmuffs ready in case the writers decided to po all the Banette fans out there.

The Great Butler
6th May 2006, 1:08 AM
Ah but, Ash has had 2 evolutions to cancel that out, and you have to remember it's only natural for May to be catching pokemon in this saga as this is her first time in Kanto, and i'm gonna go get my earmuffs ready in case the writers decided to po all the Banette fans out there.

It doesn't matter. Every main character (except Max, obviously) has caught at least one new Pokémon this saga except Ash and Jessie. Brock caught Bonsly, May Eevee and Squirtle, James Manene (albeit he lost Chimecho in its place)

And just because it's Kanto means nothing. New Pokémon have appeared there in this saga, it's not all stuff Ash has already caught.

CyberCubed
6th May 2006, 1:10 AM
Does Ash really need a new Pokemon? He's using his best team ever as well as his strongest Pokemon on Oaks, what does he need a new capture at the moment for?

As for Jessie, I guess that's because she already has 3 Pokemon, (Seviper, Dustox, Wobbufett) and that's about the limit for TR Pokemon.

The Great Butler
6th May 2006, 1:13 AM
Does Ash really need a new Pokemon? He's using his best team ever as well as his strongest Pokemon on Oaks, what does he need a new capture at the moment for?

As for Jessie, I guess that's because she already has 3 Pokemon, (Seviper, Dustox, Wobbufett) and that's about the limit for TR Pokemon.

They could have given him a D/P Pokémon---he's the only one without one now out of the big three.

Alfonso
6th May 2006, 1:16 AM
Come on people, take discussion of Ash's battles or Pokemon to another thread. XDDD Sorry for butting in on an interesting discussion, but I had to step in otherwise someone else would have.

So, uh.

That May eh? Battling against Jessie. Yup.

Korobooshi Kojiro
6th May 2006, 1:20 AM
Anyone...uh...actually seen pics of this episode?

I wanna know what happened to Harley's and Jessie's alliance.

Thriller
6th May 2006, 1:46 AM
Hold on... the GF is gonna be at Indigo? :D X 1,000.

Remember what Harrison said at the end of the Silver Conference? Its all possible he will make an appearance, obviosly not as a coordinator but as a Kanto League battler, you know, Ash bumping into him.

Korobooshi Kojiro
6th May 2006, 1:55 AM
What exactly did Harrison say?

CyberCubed
6th May 2006, 1:57 AM
What exactly did Harrison say?

That he was going to compete in Kanto after Johto ended. Of course Harrison was in Kanto while Ash was in Hoenn, so Harrison may have been done here and is somewhere else now.

Korobooshi Kojiro
6th May 2006, 1:59 AM
You know who would be cool to appear if Ash did enter...Casey. I mean, they made here seem like a big rival, and then she didn't appear in the Johto League.


Or Ritchie, he needs to meet up with Ash again. And have a Sceptile. And have the two Sceptile's fight it out.

S.Suikun
6th May 2006, 3:39 AM
All right, this ep was a bit late in coming, and many sites probably won't have pics up until late tonight or tomorrow, so here are some quick notes I'm jotting down as I watch:

- While I'm waiting for this thing, I'm currently listening to the ballad version of Battle Frontier. It's a really nice song, especially in its full version. If you ask me, it would have been a better ending theme than Haruka's Theme.

- Damn, Drew's Roselia is almost as tall as he is, now. He's the only one who has any clue as to the arena's suspicions, it seems.

- Jessie takes the stage with Banette as James and Meowth lead Ash and co into a red room, which is really a trap.

- Banette zaps a Noctowl. When did we last wee one of those? I mean a normal, non-shiny one?

- Drew's Flygon saves Ash and co with Sandstorm.

- And Squirtle destroys some random trainer's Skarmory. Can't wait to see the reactions to this one.

- More random TR pitfall and cage fun. This time they've got Drew as well.

- OMIGOD! IT'S FORETRESS! AND IT'S ACTUALLY DOING SOMETHING! *world implodes*

- LOL, Harley's strutting his *** as he storms off.

- Squirtle vs. Banette - Moment of reckoning. Oh, did I ever mention that Mr. Sukizo is one of my favorite recurring characters? He just is.

- Okay, someone HAS to make an animation of Banette repeatedly ramming its crotch against Squirtle's face.

- What is this attack, anyways? Torment?

- It ended in a tie? SUDDEN DEATH, BABY!

- Ha, this battle is finally getting good! Banette can't attack anymore for some reason, though.

- May wins in Sudden Death.

- No worries, people. This was far better than Squirtle vs. Ariados.

- Harley cries over Banette's Pokeball. He swears his revenge in the Grand Festival.

- And here's where the Contestshippers go nuts again...

No, there was no Harley vs. Drew battle as some of you were anticipating. Good contest, though.

MoonDoggie
6th May 2006, 3:54 AM
Thank you so much, S.Suikun! I was getting worried because there wasn't any episode information, especially because there was a lot of info for the last one. Thanks again^^

Lil Brother
6th May 2006, 4:42 AM
May watches Drew walk away... yet again... XD

Squirtle beating Banette wasn't too bad actually. Sure, it would rather have say, Combusken beat it but meh. Although it would be better if little Squirtle was a Wartortle by now. >>

The episode was nothing special. It felt like the half of an episode after the commercial break rather then a complete episode.

At least we got to see what happens in case of a tie!

The judges watching Squirtle bouncing side to side was hilarious to me. No idea why.

The Kanto Grand Festival is at Indigo Plateau?! ZOMGWTFBBQHIV! That's so awesome!

When Ash, Max, and Brock all yelled "Shuu" I cracked up. It is too hard to take Drew seriously in the original with that name. XD

Twerps, why did you let James and Meowth lead you into a dark room?

Harley's "angry walk" is amazing.

TR used a metal "protector" over the pitfall instead of rope! When was the last time that happened?

Not much to say really. Boring old episode, which is sad for a contest.

Alopec
6th May 2006, 4:46 AM
You know, I'm a huge Roselia fan... but I miss when it used to be little. T_T It's just not as cute when it's more than half the size of Drew.

Well, aside from that, I loved the episode. It was actually unpredictable, which was nice. I also liked the whole sudden death thing; I've been waiting for that to happen one day.

Too bad there was no Drew/Harley fight... in fact, I don't remember Harley doing all that much in this episode at all. X_x; Well, he seems to have something cooked up for the GF, so I'm sure that'll be good. His walk cracked me up, though. XD That's a new one.

Not sure what else to say. I'm very tired, so I'll watch it again tommorow and get a better opinion.


- And here's where the Contestshippers go nuts again...
*innocent look* :D

CyberCubed
6th May 2006, 5:04 AM
May watches Drew walk away... yet again... XD

Ash used to watch Gary when he walked away too, you know. ;) Gary even used to do the same thing with the hand wave as he was walking, and Ash would watch while smiling.

Anyway, I really liked this episode. So we finally see what happens when a Contest ends in a tie, sudden death mode is awesome!

Squirtle Vs. Banette was a good battle. No cheap wins, no cop outs, just a straight out brawl with Squirtle winning. No complaints here, it was well done.

I'm really dying to know the dialouge between Harley and Ash/Drew/Brock/Max while they were backstage. Harley sure looked evil, what in the world was he saying?

Not much else to say since I can't understand Japanese, but it was good. :p

Fizban
6th May 2006, 5:30 AM
I think Harley was saying that there is no rule that says he can't lend his pokemon to another person, so Jessie isn't breaking any rules.

This was a pretty awesome contest. Banette and Squirtle both did some impressive stuff. If Jessie knew about Torment she probably could have won the battle.

sCiZoR_2006
6th May 2006, 8:43 AM
Hmm. The animators goofed on a part of the episode. When Brock called Forretress after Ash and Co. fell into TR's trap, Brock threw a normal Pokeball to call it...


http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d41/aj_jerzee_fiyah/AG_175_goof.jpg




If memory serves right, isn't Brock's Forretress in a Fast Ball?

Torkoal Stu
6th May 2006, 8:46 AM
If memory serves right, isn't Brock's Forretress in a Fast Ball?
Yeah, but it hasn't been used in so long the writters must of forgotten, but the last time we saw it, it was in a Fast Ball.

Heck i'm just happy its out of its Pokeball.

~*Mudkip Fantastic*~
6th May 2006, 9:25 AM
Yeah I just saw this ep and I hate the uber Squirt. And Shuu's Miracle-Gro Roselia was half his size. I wonder what plant food he uses ^_^. Anyways Harly and Shuu should have fought it out then. Everyone I talked to thought that they would fight. Shuu would have won cause Masquerain owns Cacturne.

Yamato-san
6th May 2006, 11:01 AM
Squirtle Vs. Banette was a good battle. No cheap wins, no cop outs, just a straight out brawl with Squirtle winning. No complaints here, it was well done.

I don't know.... Zenigame plowing through a Thunder with Bubble seemed like bulls***. I think there were a couple other things off there, but I can't remember them at the moment. In any case, as S. Suikun said, it was a helluva lot better than Zenigame vs. Ariados. They didn't add insult to injury by making the little f*** KO Jupetta, then arrogantly flex its god damn arms while standing on top of him. Nope, Jupetta was still battle-capable, but Musashi just lost all her points. For that matter, Zenigame didn't KO Airmudo, neither, but won on a time-out. It seems the writers are taking great measures to not seriously p*ss me off this time around.... though they should've opted to just not use the friggin' thing in the first place.

While the contest battles turned out slightly better than I expected, I was really let down by the side-plot. I was hoping for Harley vs. Shuu, dammit. They'd have an aerial battle (which usually kick a**), in which Harley had that Airmudo and it went against Flygon. Instead, that preview clip of Flygon turned out to just be saving Satoshi-tachi. -_- Well, I hope Harley's got something damn good in store for the Grand Festival.

The Big Al
6th May 2006, 12:05 PM
So if they tie at the time out they basically have a gunslinger-esque duel?

vaporeon89
6th May 2006, 12:09 PM
Wich physical attack used Banette against Squirtle?

;134;89

Swifty
6th May 2006, 12:14 PM
This episode felt like 24.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v436/Swifti/pokemon_24.jpg

skarmachild
6th May 2006, 1:18 PM
Dissapointing :>(

Dreamcoat
6th May 2006, 1:20 PM
Guess that Skarmory didn't belong to D..

*shot*

Chatsy
6th May 2006, 3:07 PM
Oh, how I LOVED to see them boys work together so they all could watch May battle.

She sure knows how to get boys around her, I'll give her that XD

Yeah, while the females battle, the males duke it out, out back. Oh yes <3

In other words, I liked this episode. And the animation was much better than the last one.

S.Suikun
6th May 2006, 3:13 PM
In other words, I liked this episode. And the animation was much better than the last one.
Looked the same dismal quality to me. 0_o

Jikkle
6th May 2006, 3:40 PM
So what was the point of James and Meowth trapping Ash, Brock, and Max anyways? Just so they couldn't watch the contest? Seems like a pointless filler sidequest to me. The battle between May and Jessie was alright and for the most point sensical besides bubble beating out thunder that is. The GF being at the Indigo leads me to believe that Ash may re enter the Indigo league or at least have something significant happen there.

Water Master David
6th May 2006, 4:03 PM
Very awesome episode! Extremely epic. May gets through SO much challenges and still ends up winning. And of course that awesome Squirtle.

skarmachild
6th May 2006, 4:38 PM
And of course that awesome Squirtle.

Ban request.

Gravy
6th May 2006, 4:48 PM
Looked the same dismal quality to me. 0_o
It definately wasn't the best I've seen, but it certainly wasn't as bad as last weeks garbage. Hell, at least the characters were on-model this time around. Artwork was pretty decent, the animation itself was mediocre.
But anyway...

This episode...something about it didn't click well with me. It was a decent attempt overall, but it didn't grab my attention as much as last week's effort.

Squirtle's battle against Banette was fine, though none of it's tactics really impressed me. I can only take so many Rapid Spin and Ice Beam attacks until they become dull and redundant. And considering we've already seen enough of these moves already...
There were one or few little touches that weren't exactly ideal, such as Bubble plowing through a Thunder. But we've seen weedy attacks plow through full-force moves on numerous occassions already. Grovyle, Corphish and even Charizard have done the same thing.
Honestly, I think the only real problem I had with it's battling was the way it deflected Skarmory's Steel Wing. I'm sorry, but I for one find it hard to believe an on the spot Rapid Spin would be enough to knock that huge metallic bird for a loop. Otherwise, everything else was fine.

The highlight of this episode, imo, was Banette going totally nutso on Squirtle with it's FRUSTRATION (bolded for silly members who ask repetative questions) attack. Both satisfying and amusing. I can only imagine how pleased our friend Yamato-san was after witnessing Squirtle taking a series of kicks, smacks and headbutts to the cranium.
And this? (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/Gravyyy/totally_gy.jpg) Priceless.

Korobooshi Kojiro
6th May 2006, 5:05 PM
Someone needs to make a gif of Bannette pelvic thrusting Squirtle. That was lol hillarious!

Anyway, in that pic you posted Gravy, I think James is imitating Harley.

skarmachild
6th May 2006, 5:27 PM
Squirtle vs Banette was really taking the cake.

Numerous Thunderbolts? Bubble overpowered Thunderbolt?

Fizban
6th May 2006, 5:40 PM
Banette never once used Thunderbolt during that battle. Thunder probably doesn't work so well with Banette because it isn't an electric type.

NoDot
6th May 2006, 6:28 PM
This episode felt like 24.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v436/Swifti/pokemon_24.jpg
LOL! OK, did you make that!? That's pretty good. I'm feeling like this deserves a caption (in the proper thread...).

BrokenDreams
6th May 2006, 7:48 PM
WHAT! GF in Indigo Platue, so original -_-

Plus the battle suck, bad animation and uber squirtle.

Geodude
6th May 2006, 8:38 PM
Ash's reaction to the news of the GF's location was interesting. I wonder if that's foreshadowing something...

Nice to finally see Frustration in the anime. Now to see what Return would look like. Never did like the English name of that attack, it's far too vague. Frustration is more descriptive.

CyberCubed
6th May 2006, 9:02 PM
Plus the battle suck, bad animation and uber squirtle.

Sigh.

You know, it's starting to get annoying that people bash Squirtle EVERY SINGLE TIME it battles. (Can't believe I'm defending it in the first place)

Honestly.

What the HELL was uber about Squirtle in this episode? It didn't do a single thing that was uncalled for or magical that made it win. It took a good deal of damage from Banette, and they even had to go into sudden death because they had the same number of points.

Granted, Banette is one of Harley's Pokemon and very experienced, but the way the battle played out was fine for both sides.

erizibang
6th May 2006, 11:11 PM
hahaha yey i can't believe how strong is may's squirtle... haha i love zenigame!! *-*

Yamato-san
6th May 2006, 11:15 PM
aw, why must you be such a kill-joy, Cyber? T_T Even if they are bashing, it's music to my ears (seriously though, I'm aware such behavior's intolerable and needs to be stopped.... unfortunately).


There were one or few little touches that weren't exactly ideal, such as Bubble plowing through a Thunder. But we've seen weedy attacks plow through full-force moves on numerous occassions already. Grovyle, Corphish and even Charizard have done the same thing.

I don't know... considering how many times the anime has made it a point that water conducts electricity (if any brainiac wants to state that it's actually the minerals in water that are conducted, then let me say that either A. this is anime physics we're talking about, and with the way it's constantly brought up, this is how the anime's physics work, or B. water Pokemon clearly have minerals in their water attacks), you'd expect it to be pretty much be a given that an electric attack would go straight through a water projectile to directly strike the user, not be countered by said water attack, or worse, be overcome by it. At least with Eneko's Blizzard against a Hellger's Flamethrower, the two evened out (and logically, that could make sense... fire melts ice, the ice then becomes water, water puts out fire).


The highlight of this episode, imo, was Banette going totally nutso on Squirtle with it's FRUSTRATION (bolded for silly members who ask repetative questions) attack. Both satisfying and amusing. I can only imagine how pleased our friend Yamato-san was after witnessing Squirtle taking a series of kicks, smacks and headbutts to the cranium.
And this? (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/Gravyyy/totally_gy.jpg) Priceless.

Damn straight. ^^ And dude, I totally forgot to mention Kojirou acting like Harley. XD

TeddiUrsa
7th May 2006, 2:28 AM
I don´t know...I´ve waited so long to get this episode..but in the end..I didn´t actually like it...

What´s the big deal of keeping Ash-tachi way fomr the contest? It´s not like May was nervous that her friends wasn´t with her during the battle phase this time...a bit lame...Foretress was a plus, tough

The battle was anit-climatic at best...it would have been better if both of them would have got a ribbon...
Why acted Banette so fuzzy in the sudden death mode? A few attacks and it (nya, the points) was down...even the music were boring

I was never a squritle basher and I the bashing/whining after the first BF contest episodes was getting on my nerves, but this time, squirtle really got on MY nerves....

It was always emphazied in the anime that water conducts electricity and yet that bubble attack could beat a thunder? At least it wasn´t water gun...

And, I know this is the anime, but I still wonder why nobody has said this yet:
why could squirtle tackle banette? Skitty wasn´t able to tackle Duscopls...

Yamato-san
7th May 2006, 2:39 AM
I was gonna say that too, but I think I recall Eneko was able to hit Samayouru with a physical attack at least once (contradicting what Masato told Satoshi the previous episode about using normal attacks). Come to think of it, maybe I should have brought it up afterall. Though ghosts rarely appear, AG seems to have done a good job in bringing up the fact that normal attacks are ineffective against them (Kimimaro's Samayouru, Kikuko's Gengar), and yet, all the sudden, that little bas****'s able to constantly pummel Jupetta with Tackle and Rapid Spin.

CyberCubed
7th May 2006, 2:42 AM
Glalie also used Headbutt against Katie's Misdreavous in the Hoenn league and it connected. So no, Squirtle is not the first Pokemon to do a physical attack against a ghost poke.

Fizban
7th May 2006, 2:47 AM
CyberCubed beat me to it. Alas.

It seems like ghost pokemon need some reaction time to phase through attacks. Agatha's Gengar was able to avoid Pikachu's Quick Attack, but was unable to dodge Iron Tail moments later because of the pace of the battle. Jessie was keeping Banette in a very aggressive state, and the creative use of Rapid Spin left it unprepared for a tackle.

Geodude
7th May 2006, 2:57 AM
It also depends on the ghost. From what we've seen in the anime, it seems that the Gastly line is almost always in at least a somewhat gaseous form, making it easier for them to phase through Normal attacks. Some other ghosts may have to make a conscious effort to go intangible, so Normal attacks could work against them given the right circumstances.

Just an educated theory.

Thriller
7th May 2006, 2:59 AM
Comments for this episode.

Wow, great seeing a normal coloured Noctowl. Thats rare.

Whats even more rare is Brock using Foretress, see you in another 20 episodes :D

I wish they'd stop using different animators with Harley. Sometimes he looks like a woman, sometimes he looks like an evil man which is what he is.

So tell me, what was Harley up to by setting Ash and Brock and Max up by trapping them in the Baloon? How would that prevent May from winning?

What was the attack Bannete was using on Squirtle? Yanno, when it was just bashing it aimlessly?

Woah, wierd win. First time their was a tie. But May pulled it off.

What? No Harley roaring in anger about Mays win?

Nice Episode, no Tanne though T_T, always the GF though.

ghost master
7th May 2006, 3:10 AM
Numerous Thunderbolts? Bubble overpowered Thunderbolt?
As stated before there have been numerous of other times that characters pokemon pull threw. Grovyle and Charizard have even done it a couple times. Remember in the pacifidlog contest when Skitty overpowered Houndooms flamethrower with blizzard. I didnt hear many complaints about that. This episode was kinda fun.

Geodude
7th May 2006, 3:15 AM
What was the attack Bannete was using on Squirtle? Yanno, when it was just bashing it aimlessly?
If you'd bothered to read the quote just a few posts above yours, you would have seen that it was Frustration.

Thriller
7th May 2006, 3:18 AM
If you'd bothered to read the quote just a few posts above yours, you would have seen that it was Frustration.

I try not to read the whole thread before watching the episode. I don't want everything spoiled.

Medea
7th May 2006, 5:27 AM
Well, I saw this episode a couple of hours ago and for the most part, it was pretty cool. There was Harley and there was Drew, so I'm pretty easy to satisfy here. Now onto the big battle, as much as I despise that Squirtle of May's to the pit of my core, it put up one good fight (what the hell did I just say). But, I was just happy to see Banette again. I just wish it didn't have to lose.

Korobooshi Kojiro
7th May 2006, 2:28 PM
I agree with Geodude, it seems Bannete is more solid then other ghosts, thus normal attacks should hit it. However, I'm sure it can go intangable if it chooses.

I'm sure people will like my new sig, thanks to V-Faction.

---Kyogre007---
7th May 2006, 9:00 PM
At first, i liked the idea of "Pokemon Contest". But when Skitty appeared with its magic wins AND THEN SQUIRTLE APPEARED WITH MUCH MORE MAGIC WINS... Now i`m thinking pokemon contests are pathetic and watching them is just a waste of time. Plus, this episode represented Banette as a really weak, you know, "usual enemy" pokemon with no special abilities being a ghost. Thats my thoughts. I m absolutely frustrated.

CyberCubed
7th May 2006, 9:04 PM
Ok, so now Contests are a waste of time because Skitty had ONE annoying win, (against Dusclops) and Squirtle had ONE annoying win, (against Ariados)

Honestly, you're completely ignoring the fact that the Contests are shoujo oriented and it's about the interactions between the humans more than the Pokemon battling.

---Kyogre007---
7th May 2006, 9:11 PM
And the win against Banette is not annoyng, isn't it?

CyberCubed
7th May 2006, 9:12 PM
And the win against Banette is not annoyng, isn't it?

Explain to me what was annoying about it, and then we'll talk.

---Kyogre007---
7th May 2006, 9:34 PM
Well...
1) I like Banette and I hate Zenigame
2) How come Zenigame dodged every single will-o-wisp?
3) Why was Banette affected by Zenigame`s normal attacks
4) Banette`s Shock Wave didn`t have much effect - that`s cheap and unreal
5) All Zenigame did was using withdraw and sometimes showing its happy face to use ice beam.
6) Zenigame got 2 shock waves, frustration - dont you think its too much for such a little pokemon?..

skarmachild
7th May 2006, 9:37 PM
Banette never once used Thunderbolt during that battle. Thunder probably doesn't work so well with Banette because it isn't an electric type.

Was it Thunder that came out of his hand, I can't understand Japanese so someone please fill me in.

Faerie
8th May 2006, 1:53 AM
All around this was a pretty good episode. The animation team for this episode was really good, and it was a great change from the horrible one in the previous episode. They did a good job of making Haarii look...really scary...Almost too good. *slowly backs away*

I know, this was at the END of the episode but...Was that Maemuki Roketto-Dan I heard at the next episode preview? I LOVE that song! It's so funny. I would be so happy if they played that during the episode or, better, as the ending theme. But I doubt they'd put it as the ending.

The contest was a little unlikley. I thought that Jupetta should have won, but heck. That would've been against the writer's beliefs. Villains never win in kid's shows. But the Thunder/Thunderbolt thingy was odd - it didn't do much damage to li'l Zenigame, but when Pikachuu uses it against any water-types it practically OHKOs them. Somehow the good guys are better than the villains, even though the goodies are often much less experienced...Now, I'm not complaining that it got a magic win like a bunch of other people are, I just think that Jupetta was a little stronger than it. The extra battle thing was cool though. I know, everyone's calling it "sudden death," but Bibian-san called it an extra battle.

And speaking of the Bibian...Did anyone notice how many times she shouted her slogan during the episode? It was like, five times. O__o; And if you didn't know, her slogan is "Hya...Ui...Gooo!" (Here...We...Go!) It's cool how the audience always shouts along with her. Although they're still no match for football fans. xP

Did anyone notice that, during Haruka's contest battle with Musashi, Haarii was acting like a traditonal sit-around-and-watch-the-good-guys-fight-all-the-time-and-let-the-subordinates-do-all-the-work villain? It was hilarious. Kojirou was standing next to him and getting all riled up and shouting, but Haarii was just sitting there and looking cool, collected and bored. Just like a proper villain should. :3 But he freaked when Musa-ch - I mean Musashi lost. And it was even funnier when Musashi didn't realize she lost until Bibian walked up to her and told her she lost. xD It was so funny.

Masato acts more like a classic anime little brother in the Japanese version than he does in the dub. In the dub he's always calling his sister by name and just acting like they're traveling parnters rather than siblings, but in the Japanese version he always calls her 'oneechan' and stuff.

I need to see this episode subbed. >__>;

Geodude
8th May 2006, 2:08 AM
Well...
1) I like Banette and I hate Zenigame
2) How come Zenigame dodged every single will-o-wisp?
3) Why was Banette affected by Zenigame`s normal attacks
4) Banette`s Shock Wave didn`t have much effect - that`s cheap and unreal
5) All Zenigame did was using withdraw and sometimes showing its happy face to use ice beam.
6) Zenigame got 2 shock waves, frustration - dont you think its too much for such a little pokemon?..
1) Opinions are fine, but you can come across as annoying and borderline bashing if you go around spouting them off without any reasons whatsoever to back them up.
2) Cause it did.
3) Already discussed.
4) Thunder, not Shock Wave. I think it only hit once, and that hit did indeed have effect. Did you even watch the episode?
5) Uh, no. Watching episode >>> looking at pictures. It did more than that.
6) No. It has enough experience now, it can handle it. It amazes me how it's been 41 episodes since May got it and people still think it's a "baby".

Was it Thunder that came out of his hand, I can't understand Japanese so someone please fill me in.
Yes, as was stated already, if you had bothered to read the topic.

kaminari = Thunder
joo mam boruto = Thunderbolt

Was that Maemuki Roketto-Dan I heard at the next episode preview?
Yes.

But the Thunder/Thunderbolt thingy was odd - it didn't do much damage to li'l Zenigame, but when Pikachuu uses it against any water-types it practically OHKOs them.
For the last time, it was Thunder. And it was a solid hit, did you even watch it?

In the dub he's always calling his sister by name and just acting like they're traveling parnters rather than siblings, but in the Japanese version he always calls her 'oneechan' and stuff.
Don't you think that would have something to do with the fact that there's no real English equivalent to "onee-chan"? The best option is "sis", but nobody says that anymore.

CyberCubed
8th May 2006, 2:41 AM
Max sometimes calls her, "My big sister" but that's only rarely.

The Great Butler
8th May 2006, 10:46 PM
Ok, so now Contests are a waste of time because Skitty had ONE annoying win, (against Dusclops) and Squirtle had ONE annoying win, (against Ariados)

I'd call vs. Houndoom and vs. Jynx 00ber wins for Skitty too, and one can't (unfortunately) forget 00ber Eevee either.

Faerie
9th May 2006, 12:12 AM
For the last time, it was Thunder. And it was a solid hit, did you even watch it?All right, all right, sorry. All I said was that I wasn't sure if it was Thunder. I really don't care about that, so I didn't read the whole thread - what, is that a crime now or something? >__<; And I know it was a solid hit. I never said it wasn't. No need to get so angry at me like that.

Geodude
9th May 2006, 12:25 AM
And I know it was a solid hit. I never said it wasn't. No need to get so angry at me like that.
No, you specifically said you thought it didn't do much damage. That's not the same as a solid hit. If you don't want what you say picked apart, don't say it.

ghost master
9th May 2006, 12:56 AM
I'd call vs. Houndoom and vs. Jynx 00ber wins for Skitty too, and one can't (unfortunately) forget 00ber Eevee either. How is Eevee uber? It had training prior to the contest and watched a contest to understand what happened. Eevee was trained we had never seen marshtomp ever be trained in its life cycle. Before that contest it has never had a full battle. The fact that May trained her Eevee and earned it's position. Besides Eevee just barely won.

Anyway I thought this episode was good.


No, you specifically said you thought it didn't do much damage. That's not the same as a solid hit. If you don't want what you say picked apart, don't say it. I know its not my part to intrude on other people's argument but what are you saying? Faerie said it didnt seem to do much damage to squirtle then you started talking about it being a solid hit.

Faerie
9th May 2006, 12:59 AM
Well, you said:
And it was a solid hitAnd then, you said that it wasn't a solid hit.

The Great Butler
9th May 2006, 1:17 AM
How is Eevee uber? It had training prior to the contest and watched a contest to understand what happened. Eevee was trained we had never seen marshtomp ever be trained in its life cycle. Before that contest it has never had a full battle. The fact that May trained her Eevee and earned it's position. Besides Eevee just barely won.

That's just the thing, Marshtomp wasn't even hit by a number of Eevee's attacks yet it lost points. That just doesn't seem right.

jolteonjak
9th May 2006, 1:47 AM
I agree with you about Marshtomp TGB, but in reality contest battles are a different animal compared to gym battles. Marshtomp's point deductions were because it didn't look good doing whatever it was doing. Personally I would have liked to see another battler of May's beat Marshtomp like Combusken or Munchlax. Seriously...people whine about Squirtle pulling Ice Beam out of its arse, and in reality, Eevee learned Dig the same way...right before its debut contest. That's the only thing I did not like about the May vs. Brock contest.

Faerie
9th May 2006, 11:11 PM
Marshtomp's point deductions were because it didn't look good doing whatever it was doing.Uh-huh. Even if a Pokemon doesn't take any damage, it can lose points if its opponent deflects its attack.

You are right, Zenigame's Ice Beam just came out of nowhere. But the same thing happened with Yukiwarashi's Ice Beam. It's just the attack, I think.

Geodude
10th May 2006, 12:24 AM
And then, you said that it wasn't a solid hit.
Where'd I say that??

ghost master
10th May 2006, 3:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faerie
And then, you said that it wasn't a solid hit.

Where'd I say that??



Quote:
Originally Posted by Faerie
But the Thunder/Thunderbolt thingy was odd - it didn't do much damage to li'l Zenigame, but when Pikachuu uses it against any water-types it practically OHKOs them.

For the last time, it was Thunder. And it was a solid hit, did you even watch it?
10 character limit.

Yamato-san
10th May 2006, 6:34 PM
I say this a lot, but there was really nothing wrong with Eneko and Eievui. They got several episodes dedicated to them training and preparing for future contests. The problem was how the battles themselves were written, but otherwise, they were in a perfect position to get a win.


You are right, Zenigame's Ice Beam just came out of nowhere. But the same thing happened with Yukiwarashi's Ice Beam. It's just the attack, I think.

Um.... no. Yukiwarashi is different because it learns Ice Beam naturally (and being a friggin Ice-type, it's more suitable towards the attack). Even if it didn't learn in naturally, there's no way in hell it was pulled-out-the-a** as much as Zenigame's. When Yukiwarashi first used Ice Beam, it was at a totally random moment on that island with Donphan, AND it had to take several episodes of training just to get it down right. Zenigame, though, suddenly uses it to help stop Rocket Dan (plot convenience... suddenly showed up when it was needed to help save the day unlike Yukiwarashi's), and has it down pretty much perfectly with the exception of a recoil affect that appears the next episode, and seemingly disappears afterwards. Now try and explain to me how the hell the same thing happened with Yukiwarashi.

And Eievui suddenly learning Dig was nowhere near as bad. Sure, it's a TM, but it's hardly a powerful attack like Ice Beam is. Besides, assuming genetic mastery works the same way it does in the games, anything's possible since that Eievui came from an egg on some random farm (Orchid, on the other hand, should be specializing in the starters' breeding to make sure they don't inherit cheap attacks, if such is the case). Dig was also different from Ice Beam in that it wasn't the one attack it gained that made or broke the battle it was in. As a matter of fact, it seemed to be at a total disadvantage using Dig against Numacraw. Nope, it was hardly powerful, and just seemed to be some random, weak-to-average-strength attack to add to its arsenal and expand its battle capabilities just a bit, whilst Ice Beam seems to have grown to be that terrapin a**hole's signature attack.

Faerie
10th May 2006, 7:21 PM
Um.... no. Yukiwarashi is different because it learns Ice Beam naturally (and being a friggin Ice-type, it's more suitable towards the attack). Even if it didn't learn in naturally, there's no way in hell it was pulled-out-the-a** as much as Zenigame's. When Yukiwarashi first used Ice Beam, it was at a totally random moment on that island with Donphan, AND it had to take several episodes of training just to get it down right. Zenigame, though, suddenly uses it to help stop Rocket Dan (plot convenience... suddenly showed up when it was needed to help save the day unlike Yukiwarashi's), and has it down pretty much perfectly with the exception of a recoil affect that appears the next episode, and seemingly disappears afterwards. Now try and explain to me how the hell the same thing happened with Yukiwarashi.I know all that, I was just trying to make a point about the fact that attacks come out of nowhere all the time. Satoshi's Pokemon come out with random attacks all the time - sometimes they take training, but sometimes they don't. I'm talking about before Houen, of course, because he trains furiously then and it's a little more realistic as far as learning moves. But in the older series Pokemon had all sorts of silly moves up their sleeves when they shouldn't; don't forget that kid in the Jouto Leauge whose Popokko (or it could have been a Watakko, I can't remember) just suddenly was able to use Solarbeam right when it needed to win and at the toughest spot in the battle. Zenigame wasn't the first Pokemon to have that sort of thing happen to it. The writers just feel they need to have people win somehow, no matter how unlikely it is.

Squirtle_007
12th May 2006, 4:35 AM
OK, finally saw the episode:
*What was Wobbuffet doing with Kojirou and Meowth? It´s not supposed to be with Musashi since she has it´s pokéball?
*I missed Cacnea, it was good to see it again
*"Him" and his revenge argument got sooooooooo lame
*Squirtle 2 - "Him" 0
*Hmmm ... maybe Kojirou and Meowth trapped Satoshi and co. to ask Haruka her ribbon as a ransom, don´t you think?
*I think Shuu´s new Pokémon will be a Miltank or a Tauros, maybe he created some kind of Poké-manure to make his Roselia grow

Pikachu
20th May 2006, 12:14 AM
The music in the episode pretty much made the pisode great.

gamefreak5034
25th May 2006, 3:55 PM
squirtle takes away half of skarmory's health in one bubble atack and banette thnuder attacks do little on squirtle

pokemon can make no sense sometimes

Contest Fan
26th May 2006, 3:29 PM
My favourite episode so far. I am glad that Jessie finally made it to the finals and it was an extremly close match. I felt sad for Jessie losing though. I liked seeing what happened in a draw. I really admire Jessie's determination, she keeps getting defeated but she still continues. I can't wait to the GF. Harley rocks and I wan't to see Harley with two new pokemon to complete his team.

fraternity
14th August 2006, 1:56 AM
I'm willing to see this episode. Anyways, I have a quick question:

I saw this picture:
http://www.serebiiforums.com/images/avatars/anime/AAMayL.PNG
And wondered if Ash and May have a romantic relationship? Or if it is real?

eonteam123456
17th November 2006, 8:15 AM
Banette was a lot funnier than I thought.

WaterDragon trainer
1st December 2006, 1:32 AM
This episode was pretty good. The beginning was cool. Good to see Frustration in the anime. The contest was awesome. It was great to see May win after everything that happened.

chosen_one386
1st December 2006, 1:58 AM
This episode was AWESOME. Harley was gayer than usual, DREW was in it, and the contest kept me on the edge of my seat!

swampsperts
1st December 2006, 2:02 AM
This episode aired 30 minutes ago. May gets her fifth ribbon so she can now go to the Intigo Pleatu!!!

Mandi.
1st December 2006, 2:05 AM
I loved how Harley called Drew, "Drew Darling." That was awesome. But it's Harley, what do you expect? xD

The battle was great. I loved the music it was making when Banette was using frustration on Squirtle. I don't know why. And I loved how they had to have an overtime battle.

And of course I loved the ending. x3 Drew was ...NICER. How wonderful. PUSA did a great job with this episode. =]

Darkness Angel
1st December 2006, 2:52 AM
was pretty good and a close match

Mythic Mist
1st December 2006, 4:46 AM
Good episode, but I would have liked it more if the battle had better animation :(

And WTF?! How did Tackle and Rapid Spin connect on a ghost type?

Freya
1st December 2006, 4:52 AM
Drew is so dreamy...and he was nice and I saw his roselia!!!!! i love that cute little thing when Bannette used Frustaration before it danced on squirtle it looked like it was humping it kinda

Blue_Lightning8
1st December 2006, 5:05 AM
This episode was AWESOME. Harley was gayer than usual, DREW was in it, and the contest kept me on the edge of my seat!

Agree with you about Harley, i have no idea why people are in love with this freaking gay stalking pedophile with clothes that are the resemblance of his Cacturne. O well, those are your opinions and these are mines. Anyway the episode kinda bored me. They used the same move repetitively. It was kind of annoying. May has had better battles. Well I'm glad she won and is heading towards the Grand Festival with the rest of them. Can't wait.

Medea
1st December 2006, 11:46 AM
Awsomeness!

Cool episode like the one before. It had Harley and Drew. It was all good. I just love the way Drew cares about May. It's there dammit! I don't care who the hell you are, he likes her *winkwink*. The Harley/Drew moment pretty cool. And of course that little puke bucket Squirtle...Even though I really hate that thing, it was still a good fight and it didn't just get lucky like with the other battles that I get piss'd about. I'm just mad because we barely see Harley's Banette and the two times it gets used, it's abused by one of May's pokemon. And of course, I don't blame Banette's attitude with Jessie during the match. Jessie brings out the worst in people.

Well, tis all!

S.Suikun
1st December 2006, 10:05 PM
LMAO, Harley called Drew both "Darling" and "Hon". And he called Ash "hon" also.

So we're what? 28 episodes behind Japan now? That gap is only going to grow narrower...

Pokemon__
1st December 2006, 10:38 PM
Harley gets more feminine in every appearance. I mean seriously, Darling?

Geodude
2nd December 2006, 4:20 AM
And WTF?! How did Tackle and Rapid Spin connect on a ghost type?

Big deal, you act as if that's the first time it's ever happened. -_- Short memory?

Short answer: It's a Ghost, but a solid Ghost. Some can turn transparent, some either can't or don't. We've seen it happen before.

I saw this picture:
http://www.serebiiforums.com/images/avatars/anime/AAMayL.PNG
And wondered if Ash and May have a romantic relationship? Or if it is real?
1. That has exactly what to do with this thread?

2. It's fake. Enough said.

And May's Squirtle is still to Uber.
Ok, so explain exactly how a completely fair win makes it an "uber", or else lay off the ridiculously unjustified complaining.

squirtle takes away half of skarmory's health in one bubble atack and banette thnuder attacks do little on squirtle
There is a difference between points and health. The points meter is not a health meter. Is this the first contest you've ever watched or something? -_-

...

Why do I even keep coming here?

RageKaiser
2nd December 2006, 5:45 AM
LMAO, Harley called Drew both "Darling" and "Hon". And he called Ash "hon" also.


Don't forget May's "boytoys"

ShinyManafi
2nd December 2006, 5:52 AM
LOL, Frustration was wierd, but funny

Slick
2nd December 2006, 6:03 AM
Don't forget May's "boytoys"

Boytoys? You guys are old o.0

Knight_Ram
2nd December 2006, 10:03 AM
One word, FLUKE!

How does may do it?! She does it juts about 4/5 of the contest's she enters!
She should have lost...Because she would have got a free ribbon given to her anyway! Thats what had pretty much happend in this contest! She hit a Ghost type with a normal attack! if she never had that then she would have lost... She deserved to lose! Jeeezzzzz she should of just used her Combusken. Would have been a better match up. I really dislike May now.. Shes a total fluke girl! lol I got to calm down but doesnt anyone else agree with me?! Please atleast be one... 8/10 for the battle, 5/10 for the lack of thinking during the episode...

Garbo
2nd December 2006, 4:43 PM
Not gonna read the entire thread to find out the answer:

Banette is a ghost pokemon right? How did Squirtle tackle it?

Knight_Ram
3rd December 2006, 2:16 AM
Not gonna read the entire thread to find out the answer:

Banette is a ghost pokemon right? How did Squirtle tackle it?

By a total fluke! It was such a stupid match really...

And those stupid random explosion are just so lame! And stupid! lol! How can a water move and a will-o-wisp make an explosion?! Stupid as!

Geodude
3rd December 2006, 2:19 AM
I make a post dealing with the Ghost thing, and practically immediately two more people complain! This is absolutely ridiculous. Can you people at least read what's on the current page before replying?

CyberCubed
3rd December 2006, 2:30 AM
One word, FLUKE!

How does may do it?! She does it juts about 4/5 of the contest's she enters!
She should have lost...Because she would have got a free ribbon given to her anyway! Thats what had pretty much happend in this contest! She hit a Ghost type with a normal attack! if she never had that then she would have lost... She deserved to lose! Jeeezzzzz she should of just used her Combusken. Would have been a better match up. I really dislike May now.. Shes a total fluke girl! lol I got to calm down but doesnt anyone else agree with me?! Please atleast be one... 8/10 for the battle, 5/10 for the lack of thinking during the episode...

Or you're pretty foolish for not realizing that ghost Pokemon have been hit by normal attacks plenty of times in the past.

Geodude said it all, really.

Yamato-san
3rd December 2006, 3:53 AM
people, people, if you wanna rag on Zenigame for winning ANOTHER battle, an act which I fully support, I think something like the Bubble deflecting Thunder like it was nothing is a better example of what to bring up.

Mello
3rd December 2006, 4:44 AM
While this was an okay episode, I'm wondering what the point of having Drew in it was? May didn't even see him, and the only thing he said throughout the entire thing was "Mmm" and "Mhmm". Don't get me wrong, I love Drew, but why exactly was he in it?

Horn Drill
3rd December 2006, 5:31 AM
Big deal, you act as if that's the first time it's ever happened. -_- Short memory?

Actually, I can't really remember the last time a blatantly physical Normal type attack hit a Ghost Pokemon. You're probably right about it happening before, but I really can't think of an example right now.


Short answer: It's a Ghost, but a solid Ghost. Some can turn transparent, some either can't or don't. We've seen it happen before.

A solid Ghost? It's okay to admit that the anime has flawed logic every once and a while. You don't have to defend it to the death. :(

I actually think this was one of Squirtle's better battles. It deserved this win more than a lot of other ones IMO, even if it survived waaaaaay too many attacks.

Garbo
3rd December 2006, 9:15 AM
Sure, some ghosts can turn solid, as evidenced by ghost pokemon being hit by special attacks of a physical nature. However, by the law of the Pokemon world, pokemon classified as ghost type cannot be hit by normal attacks. There's no defending this. I don't recall it ever happening during a battle, and I don't see why it's excusable even if it did happen in the past.

Geodude
3rd December 2006, 3:11 PM
We've seen a Misdreavus take a Headbutt before and get caught in a net that it should have been able to phase through if it could. And we've seen Pikachu's Quick Attack bounce off of Dusclops, as the gang claimed that that didn't hurt it. So if Banette wasn't hurt by being hit physically with a Normal attack, surely the ensuing fall would've hurt it.

Garbo
3rd December 2006, 3:20 PM
Well, some special attacks are of a physical nature, so I'm going to assume that they can only phase through normal and fighting pokemon "attacks", leaving real world objects out of the picture. I don't recall Misdreavus taking a headbutt, nor Dusclops being hit by a normal attack, but like I said - I would consider those errors as well, since I don't see how that justifies certain Ghost types as being vulnerable to normal and fighting type attacks. A Ghost type is a Ghost type, and they have certain attributes, and one major one is that they cannot be hit my Fighting or Normal attacks. I don't think it's possible in the game to hit a Ghost type with those attacks, and yes, you can claim that the anime has taken many unorthodox liberties with a lot of the rules, such as Starmie being able to use Thunderbolt, but I'm pretty sure you can teach it in the game as well.

Korobooshi Kojiro
3rd December 2006, 3:37 PM
Ghost Pokemon in the Anime seem to have to "activate" their intangibility.

Gravy
3rd December 2006, 3:53 PM
I don't see what the big deal is anyway. Banette is a stuffed doll thing, so of course a physical contact move is going to hit it. So what, was Squirtle supposed to just bounce off the creature in comical fashion or something? It's like saying Shadow Ball shouldn't be able to do anything to a normal type, despite the fact it's a honking great ball of energy.

If people in this show are able to touch these pokémon without slipping through them, I don't see why a barge or a punch should be any different.

Nathan Madien
3rd December 2006, 3:56 PM
I thought this was a great episode to end May's ribbon collecting on. It was great to see PUSA get Drew's character right, and the battle with Jessie was genuinely on-the-edge-of-your-seat exciting. I did think that it was odd for Squirtle to beat up Banette, but long ago I had accepted the fact that Pokemon does not use the same logic we in the real world use. That is why things we consider to be odd (like May not being able to see through Jessie's disguise or people just standing around in pitch black caves) take place almost unquestioned.

Jorah
3rd December 2006, 4:52 PM
I liked this episode, except from Bubble deflecting Thunder, which I thought was odd. But it was a brilliant episode anyway. Nice to know they'll be going to Indigo Plateau again.

Pokemon Fan
6th December 2006, 4:02 AM
Ghost Pokemon in the Anime seem to have to "activate" their intangibility.
Indeed, and it seems to be something some of them don't know how to do (in addition to being trapped in a net we've seen a Misdreavus trapped under a tree).

Even that Dusclops owned by Brandon was effected by the Seismic Toss right up until the last second when it decided to make use of its Ghost type.

Really, throughout the series only the Gengar family has been consistently shown to phase through things like we imagine all the Ghost types can do. And even they have the ability to turn it on and off (i.e. whenever they make physical contact with someone on the show and effect them).

The trouble comes in that the anime only ever explains it in the simple game terms of "normal attacks don't work on Ghost types."

I fully believe that some of these events are simple mistakes on the part of the writers, but to those that balk at solid ghosts, Ghost type pokemon are NOT literal dead spirits, but simply a type of pokemon that can shift their bodies' dimensional planes, enabling their phasing, communication with the dead etc.


It's like saying Shadow Ball shouldn't be able to do anything to a normal type, despite the fact it's a honking great ball of energy.
Indeed, though to be fair the anime has never said Ghost type moves don't effect Normal types (and I hope it never does as it is one of the type things that makes the least sense to me).

That being said, it wasn't that great of a battle as far as entertainment goes, but then again Jessie was doing the commanding and a poor job of it so what could we expect? At least the stuff occuring outside of the battle was well done enough.

As a last thing, did they really have to choose to have that attack be Thunder? It just looked so incredibly weak compared to any other Thunder in the series that I recall. Even if we assumed the anime decided to incorporate STAB the move still looked way too weak. It might have been acceptable as a Thunderbolt (which as I recall Banette can learn) but not as a Thunder, unless it could be said to have been using some kind of "partial Thunder."

Geodude
6th December 2006, 4:22 AM
Before anyone asks, the translation was done correctly. It was Thunder in the original as well.

CyberCubed
9th December 2006, 3:46 PM
LMAO @ Meowth's, "Don't let anyone see you walking like that!" to Harley.

My god, do the Contest eps have the best dialouge in the show or what?

wobbanut
12th December 2006, 3:07 AM
This episode didn't help me like Harley any better, especially the way he blames Team Rocket for everything at the end. Jessie's battle against May was pretty good, though. I really think that that frustration attack on Squirtle should have done a whole lot more damage than it did. I know Brock was right about frustration being more effective since banette was working with a trainer that it wasn't used to, but then Squirtle should have been looking pretty beat up afterward. Even better, like I said with part one, Jessie should have used cacturne in the second half. I like May's Squirtle, unlike some people, but I really think Jessie should have gotten a win. I've got my hopes up for the Sinnou region, at least a little, but the way Jessie has improved with her contests she should have really gotten in a win.

I loved Drew in this episode, it was great that he came to the rescue for the twerps. :) I'm also glad that James finally called Ash by name for the first time in this episode, joining May in the group of twerps who've been called by name by all three members of Team Rocket. I'm also glad Harley finally confirmed that it's not against the rules to use others' pokemon in the contests. Glad to know that Jessie using Cacnea, Mime Jr., and Chimecho wasn't against the rules. :)

Overall, 8/10.

Ashy Boy
21st April 2007, 1:41 PM
I really enjoyed Harley dissing Team Rocket (especially Jessie) for their incompetence.

BTW, is it me or did Squirtle have a different voice? If so it sounded somewhat similar?

Rebeccag
28th June 2007, 7:22 PM
this episode made me laugh espically the line when Meouth went to Harley "Dont let anybody see you walking like that". also when Drew said i only did it so May would have somebody watching her*raises eyebrow* yeah right Drew

Rebeccag
28th June 2007, 7:22 PM
this episode made me laugh espically the line when Meouth went to Harley "Dont let anybody see you walking like that". also when Drew said i only did it so May would have somebody watching her*raises eyebrow* yeah right Drew

lugia100
25th July 2007, 9:26 AM
this episode made me laugh espically the line when Meouth went to Harley "Dont let anybody see you walking like that". also when Drew said i only did it so May would have somebody watching her*raises eyebrow* yeah right DrewWhat about when they said this.

Drew: You think you are so clever
Harley: The cleverest

Igottapoo
19th January 2009, 10:02 PM
I'm glad she won. I was getting sick of her getting ready and participating in contests. Hate em hate em hate em.

Blue Snover
9th March 2009, 3:17 PM
I'm glad that May won, it just shows that even when he gets someone else to battle for him, Harley can't beat May.

(s.i.e)
10th March 2009, 11:04 AM
wait didn't squirtle managed to tackle a bannete in this episode?

Ash-kid
8th December 2009, 10:02 AM
Squirtle was brave, it was able to battle vs Banette.
Jessie had to use her pokemon, not Harley's, but she cheated.
And i loved how Ash stopped James in time.

Lorde
8th December 2009, 10:31 AM
It was too strange for my tastes, since Jessie was fighting with Harley's Pokemon. That's a new one but I guess he really wanted vengence against May. I would have liked to see Jessie fighting May with her own team, but all we got was Harley 2.0, which is why I dislike this episode. It wasn't a good last contest as I had expected since Jessie was a character we'd seen a lot of before. Banette versus Squirtle was entertaining though. 4/10.

V Faction
22nd December 2009, 10:22 AM
Ahhh... Memories. Busy with my re-watching of the series. I had to go diggin' for this old gif, I can't believe it still existed!:

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/9792/banettebash35ft.gif

Willow's Tara
30th May 2010, 5:43 AM
One of the reasons I watch the anime is because I like the battles and how the character throws the pokeballs, I liked how that Skarmory trainer threw his pokeball.

Anyways not a bad episode, it was nice to see Frustration and Banette obviously didn't like Jessie that much (Although Cacturne did).

Of course Ash and Co are so clueless to not know Jessilna is Jessie. She used all of hers and James Pokemon and her hair is still the same yet they are clueless. Nice for May to win, I am glad the contests didn't take too long in this season.

saar
28th June 2010, 1:10 PM
This episode was good. Jessie and May battled a few times in the past, this this one was just fantastic. I don't remember many contest battles that ended in a draw, at least not until this episode. After the original 5 minutes, I think Squirtle's power has been revealed, it was tired but strong enough.

Jesse will try again in the next opportunity.

Lance The Champ
17th December 2010, 10:21 AM
Harley is so desperae to beat May he hands his pokemon to Jessie... who has never won a ribbon

Painkiller2001
4th January 2011, 5:59 PM
Seems like a prediction I made in the last episode might come true.
It looks like Harley may plan something to sabotage May in the Grand Festival.

I would of thought that when it came to a sudden death overtime in a contest it would be the first effective direct hit against the other that would break the tie.

It's funny how AshnCo. realize that Jessibella is Jessie in this episode, but they still haven't figured out that she's Jessibelle in Diamond & Pearl yet. Maybe they will towards the end of DP.

G50
27th April 2011, 12:30 AM
This episode was cool. Squirtle vs Bannette was a very cool battle. Jessie definitely did terrible trying to command Bannette and that cost her against Squirtle. Boy was Harley furious when Jessie lost to May. It was cool to see a tie and Sudden Death for the 1st time in a contest. It was cool to see Frustration attack used for the 1st time. I'm glad May won the Contest Ribbon.

79/100

Littlemyuu
14th June 2011, 1:48 AM
Squirtle is cute...and strong too! Bannete was kinda cool too =D

Vernikova
21st September 2012, 7:42 PM
An enjoyable battle. For some reason, I can't take Squirtle seriously as a battler, at least until May returns in Sinnoh, but suspending that disbelief it was a pretty good episode. Team Rocket and Harley weren't annoying and May and Jessie had a chance to shine in the final battle.

CyberCubed
22nd September 2012, 4:21 AM
An enjoyable battle. For some reason, I can't take Squirtle seriously as a battler, at least until May returns in Sinnoh, but suspending that disbelief it was a pretty good episode. Team Rocket and Harley weren't annoying and May and Jessie had a chance to shine in the final battle.

I think the problem is they made it so tiny.

Anyway I think this was a well done battle, certainly better than Squirtle learning icebeam out of nowhere in its first contest fight.

Vernikova
22nd September 2012, 2:33 PM
Actually, that might be the reason. Its small size even compared to other small Pokemon doesn't give it the appearance of a battler. It looks like it should be in a Togepi role or something.

PokemontrainerY
2nd August 2013, 7:13 PM
This episode was pretty good, I liked the Contest battle between Jessiebella(Jessie) and May. Harley looked really furios when Jessie lost and his plan failed.
The only thing I disliked about this episode was Drew's appearance .... Ash and the others should've gotten out of that box themselves.