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LightningMaster95
8th August 2014, 6:06 PM
Kakashi himself said after the Gokage Summit arc that he wasn't suited for the position of Hokage and I doubt that Obito's wish for him will affect him, especially since Kakashi wants Naruto to fulfill his dream.
he said it doesnt suit him but would take the job if he has to or is nominated so it wouldnt be weird if did take the job

Lorde
8th August 2014, 8:29 PM
he said it doesnt suit him but would take the job if he has to or is nominated so it wouldnt be weird if did take the job

And why would he be offered the job again now? Even if Tsunade did retire, wouldn't her replacement choice be Naruto based on his heroic actions throughout the story?

Kamex
9th August 2014, 2:47 AM
That was being useful. Not exactly being a leader. Naruto didn't command anyone from Konoha to do this or that. It was his clones doing all the work. Naruto's useful but being useful doesn't make a leader. Sharing his chakra with everyone was helpful, but how does that make him anymore a leader then anyone else? He's got the power for Hokage. He's beyond all the other Gokage, but is he a leader? I still haven't seen it yet. He's a great solider, but not a leader.

As far as Tsunade goes, that's kinda unfair. Tsunade was only introduced into the story to become the new Hokage. She never appeared in the manga outside a flashback as a unnamed kunoichi. You could say she bossed around Shizune, I suppose. But we don't know how much of a leader she was during her time as a active Konoha shinobi. The war arc really didn't show Naruto off as a leader and I think they really should have done that if he is aiming to be Hokage and if that is still the desired goal. He inspires many, but is he a true leader ready to lead a nation?
Well he wouldn't be leading a nation, just the shinobi of the Village Hidden in the Leaves. But points taken.


And why would he be offered the job again now? Even if Tsunade did retire, wouldn't her replacement choice be Naruto based on his heroic actions throughout the story?
Maybe, but Kakashi seems to be more well-rounded than Naruto, so I wouldn't be surprised if Naruto wasn't given the job immediately. But more importantly, I find it hard to believe Kishimoto would interject Obito's dying wish for Kakashi to be that he becomes a Hokage that looks after the next generation, just for that sentiment to be ignored. That is, unless there's a good reason for it to be ignored, but as of now it seems to me that Kakashi becoming Hokage was foreshadowed by Obito. Maybe even the fact that Kakashi gets to live on foreshadows that he'll move on to greater things (namely, becoming Hokage) as well.

Nodame
9th August 2014, 3:36 PM
I like Sakura a lot and it amazes me how vastly my opnions differs from the fandom well some of them are always too harsh and unfair when it comes to Sakura's character, but whatever I got used to it tbh. The only flaw she has imo is her lack of action. This is why Sakura's suffers from having so little action its because Sasuke and Naruto took all of her spotlight. The minute Kishi cut this balance, he threw everything out. Now that Kakashi was given a powerup in order to fight against Kaguya I have the feeling that there's a good chance Sakura might get one next. It would be awkward for Sakura to just stand there while the guys do the fighting, especially after how much of a big deal she keeps making of not wanting to be left behind by Naruto and Sasuke.


I'm pretty sure that the whole "sixth Hokage" thing was just Obito's wish for Kakashi; that doesn't mean that Kakashi will actually become a Hokage. It's too late for that anyway.

I don't like this idea that much. Kakashi was about to become one if it isn't for Tsunade surviving after that incident. The momentum of him becoming hokage is gone imo.

Tsunade can still fill up that role well until Naruto is ready imo.

LightningMaster95
9th August 2014, 4:00 PM
And why would he be offered the job again now? Even if Tsunade did retire, wouldn't her replacement choice be Naruto based on his heroic actions throughout the story?

and kakashi hasnt done anything heroic in the story????? just because naruto's actions are bigger that does discredit anything kakashi has done and if its between naruto sasuke and kakashi the one who will fill the position better will be kakashi since he has the attributes both naruto and sasuke are missing

Lorde
9th August 2014, 7:35 PM
and kakashi hasnt done anything heroic in the story????? just because naruto's actions are bigger that does discredit anything kakashi has done and if its between naruto sasuke and kakashi the one who will fill the position better will be kakashi since he has the attributes both naruto and sasuke are missing

The fact that Naruto is stronger and has shown that he's a rallying point for the alliance during this war makes him a better candidate than someone like Kakashi, who needed Obito's Sharingan just to make a name for himself imo. The whole scenario seems excessive right now anyway until we find out whether Tsunade will retire or not soon, so I digress.

Nodame
9th August 2014, 7:48 PM
and kakashi hasnt done anything heroic in the story????? just because naruto's actions are bigger that does discredit anything kakashi has done and if its between naruto sasuke and kakashi the one who will fill the position better will be kakashi since he has the attributes both naruto and sasuke are missing

Mmm I don't think so. Kakashi doesn't WANT to be the Hokage, Obito shouldn't make him be one just because he couldn't do it. Plus it so OOC for him to be a hokage anyway. Why should Tsunade step down from the Hokage position for Kakashi? it makes no sense in my humble opinion.

Platinum fan.
9th August 2014, 8:23 PM
Kakashi IMO would have made a good Hokage in the series. He's a brilliant leader, fighter, and all around well balanced shinobi. Probably the best well balanced shinobi that was not a Super Freak Club member. He's only second rate when comparing to a Super Freak Club member. However I feel the time to have made Kakashi a Hokage would have been after the Danzo incident when they were going to name him Hokage. I know he said he wasn't suited for Hokage, but I think he's been one of the greatest leaders in the Naruto series. And I'm not just saying that because he's one of my favorite characters in the series. It's because of his skills that he became a favorite of mine.

But still. It's too late now. Just let Naruto and Sasuke fight over the Hokage seat now. Kakashi along with Shikamaru would make great righthand men to the Hokage. So while I think Kakashi is more then worthy for the title, it's just not his time anymore.

Nodame
9th August 2014, 8:39 PM
Kakashi IMO would have made a good Hokage in the series. He's a brilliant leader, fighter, and all around well balanced shinobi. Probably the best well balanced shinobi that was not a Super Freak Club member. He's only second rate when comparing to a Super Freak Club member. However I feel the time to have made Kakashi a Hokage would have been after the Danzo incident when they were going to name him Hokage. I know he said he wasn't suited for Hokage, but I think he's been one of the greatest leaders in the Naruto series. And I'm not just saying that because he's one of my favorite characters in the series. It's because of his skills that he became a favorite of mine.

But still. It's too late now. Just let Naruto and Sasuke fight over the Hokage seat now. Kakashi along with Shikamaru would make great righthand men to the Hokage. So while I think Kakashi is more then worthy for the title, it's just not his time anymore.

Hmm.. now that I think about it. It makes sense to me. Its alright I guess. Let Naruto grow up and mature some more. As long as we get Naruto's face on the Hokage mountain at the end, doesn't matter when he becomes..

Lorde
9th August 2014, 8:43 PM
My ideal scenario would be for Tsunade to keep her title for a few years and for Naruto and Sasuke to fight each other for that position after a short timeskip once they've grown and matured, which would conclude the manga.

LightningMaster95
9th August 2014, 9:35 PM
The fact that Naruto is stronger and has shown that he's a rallying point for the alliance during this war makes him a better candidate than someone like Kakashi, who needed Obito's Sharingan just to make a name for himself imo. The whole scenario seems excessive right now anyway until we find out whether Tsunade will retire or not soon, so I digress.
of course naruto is going to be stronger he is the main character....everything naruto has to become hokage kakashi has it as well and more

Mmm I don't think so. Kakashi doesn't WANT to be the Hokage, Obito shouldn't make him be one just because he couldn't do it. Plus it so OOC for him to be a hokage anyway. Why should Tsunade step down from the Hokage position for Kakashi? it makes no sense in my humble opinion.
if i remember correctly hashirama and tsunade didnt want to become hokage either but both accepted the job.she realizes she is no longer able to lead the village and wants to pass down the title to someone who is able to lead care and protect the village but to someone who is mature and older than naruto

-+

Kamex
10th August 2014, 12:47 AM
The fact that Naruto is stronger and has shown that he's a rallying point for the alliance during this war makes him a better candidate than someone like Kakashi, who needed Obito's Sharingan just to make a name for himself imo. The whole scenario seems excessive right now anyway until we find out whether Tsunade will retire or not soon, so I digress.
Kakashi was a prodigy before he received the Sharingan, and he's certainly accomplished a lot even if he has that asset to give him a boost. He may not be as powerful as Naruto is right now, but I think Kakashi fares fine when compared to the typical Kage. And that's just considering power and influence, he has other qualities that make him outshine Naruto.


Mmm I don't think so. Kakashi doesn't WANT to be the Hokage, Obito shouldn't make him be one just because he couldn't do it. Plus it so OOC for him to be a hokage anyway. Why should Tsunade step down from the Hokage position for Kakashi? it makes no sense in my humble opinion.
Kakashi can change his mind you know, why does he have to be held to whatever he said before the war. And I don't think it's any more out of character for him than it seemed like it would be for say Tsunade and Gaara, who both seem to fit the role just fine now that we've gotten used to them.


My ideal scenario would be for Tsunade to keep her title for a few years and for Naruto and Sasuke to fight each other for that position after a short timeskip once they've grown and matured, which would conclude the manga.
Even though it will happen in theory, I'm having a hard time imagining Naruto and Sasuke maturing in power anymore, they seem to have reached the sky already (unless their borrowed powers really do disappear completely after this arc). But if you mean maturing in other ways, then sure.

Nodame
10th August 2014, 3:04 AM
Kakashi can change his mind you know, why does he have to be held to whatever he said before the war. And I don't think it's any more out of character for him than it seemed like it would be for say Tsunade and Gaara, who both seem to fit the role just fine now that we've gotten used to them.
To be fair, yes you're right, as I said, I'm fine with him being Hokage. I mean I'm not crazy in love with the idea, but it does make sense to me.

Anyway Kishi seems to want to delay Naruto becoming Hokage until the very last chapters, and make Kakashi the Hokage, which I don't mind because this delay will lead to a part 3 which I want and I'm 80% sure its happening. Its impossible for Kishi to wrap the NaruSasu fight before the movie even airs imo. We already know there's going to be another timeskip because of the new movie and the manga is going to go even further than that by this winter. I hope Kishimoto would tie the war arc through the new movie, then continue the manga with a part 3 (post war arc) where he fights Sasuke and become Hokage. That's a possibility..

pwnswitchclik
13th August 2014, 9:33 PM
Is Naruto on a break this week?

Lorde
13th August 2014, 9:34 PM
Is Naruto on a break this week?

WSJ is on break this week, so there's no chapter.

Platinum fan.
14th August 2014, 3:33 AM
Yeah, no new chapter for Naruto I guess. Well we don't want this place to be all dusty for a week do we? I'll ask a question for anyone to answer. Just to make this place a little lively while we wait for any Naruto news. Here's a question. Of all the characters still alive in the Naruto world name one you would not care about if they just suddenly died randomly for no reason at all.

For me that's a easy one. I didn't have to think hard on this one. Kiba. Kiba is a character who has added nothing important to the Naruto series. I think his biggest moment was being beaten by Naruto in the Chunin Exams. Waste of a character really. He's got two very popular teammates in Shino and of course Hinata, and with Choji, Rock Lee, and now Sakura as physical powerhouses, Kiba feels useless. Even Kakashi has Pakkun and his ninja dog squad. Kiba is useless, pointless, and if they killed him off I don't know who would even care.

Kinda random topic eh?

Platinum fan.
14th August 2014, 4:00 AM
sakura to me she is pointless now...immense strength is pointless since most ninjas in the naruto world know how to evade punches her healing is rendered useless because of narujesus and tsunade still participating in fights so to me i wouldnt mind sakura if she died

Sakura's nowhere near as bad as Kiba though. At least Sakura has a real fanbase, and tries to add to the story. What has Kiba done? Nothing. I mean Tenten does nothing and she gained a following for it. Kiba does nothing, adds nothing, and is pointless. Why did this character last so long in Naruto? If Kiba and Sakura were to fight, Sakura would slaughter him by just flexing her bicep. Same with Lee or Choji. He's done nothing! That is why Kiba has earned my "Most Useless Character in Naruto" award. Yes I'm making that a award.

Lorde
14th August 2014, 4:04 AM
I'd still pick Kiba over Sakura any day of the week. At least his personality is appealing, to me at least. I still rank him low compared to his teammates though.

Platinum fan.
14th August 2014, 4:10 AM
I'd still pick Kiba over Sakura any day of the week. At least his personality is appealing, to me at least. I still rank him low compared to his teammates though.

Kiba was only entertaining for me in the first chapters when he was bossing Shino and Hinata around during the Chunin Exam. That Kiba was fun. After that he became a bland, generic, guy who says random stuff every once in awhile. Kiba, to me is pointless. I've said this many times now. In this war if they killed Kiba nobody would care. That's why they didn't do it. He's the obvious choice for a death. Adds nothing. All of his expertise can be performed by someone else, and he's not entertaining to follow up on. I can honestly say if Kiba were to be killed off right now in the next chapter I would not care a single bit. With everyone else, Shikamaru, Lee, Ino, Sakura, Choji, Hinata, Shino, I'd care if one of them got killed, but Kiba? Not a single care in the world.

I'm telling you, he's holding the "Most Useless Character in Naruto" award right now.

Red and Blue
14th August 2014, 5:44 AM
Tenten. She sucks.


She the least memorable female character in the entire series. No development at all. Kishimoto just doesn't give a crap about her. If she were to be killed off in the next chapter I would feel nothing.

Kamex
14th August 2014, 6:09 PM
What has Kiba done? Nothing. I mean Tenten does nothing and she gained a following for it. Kiba does nothing, adds nothing, and is pointless. Why did this character last so long in Naruto?
I was going to say Tenten myself. Does she really have a following for doing nothing? Well that makes sense to me, because I feel that she easily has the least developed personality and plot focus of any of the Genin 12. She's literally nothing but a foil for the rest of her team's craziness/antics (which Neji sort of doubles as amongst his other roles in the story, so even this aspect of Tenten is unnecessary). Kiba at least participated in the Sasuke Retrieval arc. Even Shino didn't (which he humorously sulked about multiple times since). And then in Part II, a majority of the 12 had very little participation, so you can't really blame him there. I feel like most of them are more or less in the same boat, with Tenten trailing behind (hopefully she has some sort of role to play in saving the world with those artifacts she found).

I do remember Kiba saying during the Chuunin Exams that he would become Hokage. I think he was mostly teasing Naruto though, since they were about to fight. Haha.

But Neji was my personal favorite of the 12, so it's lame that he died!! Lol.

Anyways, I'm kind of assuming you meant of the Genin 12 who would you not care about dying, because there are a lot of background characters that I would assume you'd care less about dying than Kiba. But in any case, I'd rather no one died without a good reason.

EDIT: Also, I agree with whoever said Kiba at least has an interesting personality (loudmouth, arrogant, outspoken, whatever). Tenten barely has one to begin with, and she participated in fewer arcs than Kiba (and the ones she did participate in, she did little to distinguish herself). Not sure why you pick Kiba over Tenten.

Lorde
14th August 2014, 7:46 PM
Tenten is kind of lame imho, but I still think she may have more importance than Sakura in terms of Kaguya's demise since she has Hagoromo's treasures in her scroll.

Platinum fan.
14th August 2014, 8:16 PM
I was going to say Tenten myself. Does she really have a following for doing nothing? Well that makes sense to me, because I feel that she easily has the least developed personality and plot focus of any of the Genin 12. She's literally nothing but a foil for the rest of her team's craziness/antics (which Neji sort of doubles as amongst his other roles in the story, so even this aspect of Tenten is unnecessary). Kiba at least participated in the Sasuke Retrieval arc. Even Shino didn't (which he humorously sulked about multiple times since). And then in Part II, a majority of the 12 had very little participation, so you can't really blame him there. I feel like most of them are more or less in the same boat, with Tenten trailing behind (hopefully she has some sort of role to play in saving the world with those artifacts she found).

I do remember Kiba saying during the Chuunin Exams that he would become Hokage. I think he was mostly teasing Naruto though, since they were about to fight. Haha.

But Neji was my personal favorite of the 12, so it's lame that he died!! Lol.

Anyways, I'm kind of assuming you meant of the Genin 12 who would you not care about dying, because there are a lot of background characters that I would assume you'd care less about dying than Kiba. But in any case, I'd rather no one died without a good reason.

EDIT: Also, I agree with whoever said Kiba at least has an interesting personality (loudmouth, arrogant, outspoken, whatever). Tenten barely has one to begin with, and she participated in fewer arcs than Kiba (and the ones she did participate in, she did little to distinguish herself). Not sure why you pick Kiba over Tenten.

I meant anyone. Doesn't have to be Genin 12. And yes, I picked Kiba over Tenten. I wouldn't care if Kiba dropped dead. The reason I'd pick Kiba over Tenten as a character I don't care if they died, is unlike Tenten, Kiba has been given plenty of chances to be a character you can care about. Tenten has never been given a fair chance, mission, screentime, whatever to become a popular well liked character. Kiba has and frankly I think the character failed and sucks. He's one of the most pointless characters to ever be in this series as everyone one of his skills can be performed by a better character. His personality traits are all owned by characters far better then him, like Naruto being as loudmouth, and several other characters are arrogant but far better then Kiba.

When Tenten gets screentime and a actual speaking role and fails at it, then I'll say I wouldn't care if she died or not. If Tenten died, I'd only shake my head at kishi for making a girl shinobi and never giving her a chance to do anything. Kiba's had plenty of chances and I think the character flat out sucks. He's failed to ever impress me, ever and if the character died I wouldn't care one single bit. Shino and Hinata should have had a better teammate. The idea of Kiba was fine, but the character itself? A failure IMO.

Kamex
14th August 2014, 10:59 PM
I meant anyone. Doesn't have to be Genin 12.
Wait, really? So if say Mizuki (yes, from the first chapter/episode) just randomly died in one of the Ten Tails' bomb blasts a while back, you'd have cared more than if Kiba died? There are a lot of obscure characters that you'll probably never think about ever again that I would trade for Kiba... What about this guy (http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Bekk%C5%8D) (no I don't remember him at all, just trying to make a point)?


And yes, I picked Kiba over Tenten. I wouldn't care if Kiba dropped dead. The reason I'd pick Kiba over Tenten as a character I don't care if they died, is unlike Tenten, Kiba has been given plenty of chances to be a character you can care about. Tenten has never been given a fair chance, mission, screentime, whatever to become a popular well liked character. Kiba has and frankly I think the character failed and sucks. He's one of the most pointless characters to ever be in this series as everyone one of his skills can be performed by a better character. His personality traits are all owned by characters far better then him, like Naruto being as loudmouth, and several other characters are arrogant but far better then Kiba.

When Tenten gets screentime and a actual speaking role and fails at it, then I'll say I wouldn't care if she died or not. If Tenten died, I'd only shake my head at kishi for making a girl shinobi and never giving her a chance to do anything. Kiba's had plenty of chances and I think the character flat out sucks. He's failed to ever impress me, ever and if the character died I wouldn't care one single bit. Shino and Hinata should have had a better teammate. The idea of Kiba was fine, but the character itself? A failure IMO.
I dunno, I feel like the reason Tenten hasn't done anything is because if she did, it would be boring and useless. She has a lot of potential with her abilities, but her personality and background is empty. But I guess it's difficult to make so many characters and have each of them be interesting and likable.

Shneak
15th August 2014, 1:56 AM
She the least memorable female character in the entire series. No development at all. Kishimoto just doesn't give a crap about her.

She's actually Kishi's favourite female character.

Lorde
15th August 2014, 1:59 AM
She's actually Kishi's favourite female character.

So he says, but his treatment of her since the manga started has been sad tbh. Then again, the same goes for most female characters in this series (especially Karin).

Platinum fan.
15th August 2014, 4:03 AM
Wait, really? So if say Mizuki (yes, from the first chapter/episode) just randomly died in one of the Ten Tails' bomb blasts a while back, you'd have cared more than if Kiba died? There are a lot of obscure characters that you'll probably never think about ever again that I would trade for Kiba... What about this guy (http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Bekk%C5%8D) (no I don't remember him at all, just trying to make a point)?


I dunno, I feel like the reason Tenten hasn't done anything is because if she did, it would be boring and useless. She has a lot of potential with her abilities, but her personality and background is empty. But I guess it's difficult to make so many characters and have each of them be interesting and likable.

I mean main characters. Any main character that's actually a main character in the story, still doesn't have to be limited to Genin 12 because they are not the only main characters in the series still alive. Nobody even knows if Mizuki is even still alive today. He was only in one chapter and was a villain of the day. I mean a character that actually is part of the main series, not a throw away one appearance like Mizuki. A character that was actually treated like a main character. Nobody cares about Mizuki or random storm trooper background figures.

I fail to see why Tenten would be boring and useless. A weapons master being useless in a shinobi world? Tenten has never been given a chance. Nothing about her is expanded upon, the only thing that we know about her is she wanted to be a strong Kunoichi like Tsunade. That easily makes her desires better then Sakura and Ino, yet ironically it's Sakura who becomes her student. Sakura should have had Tenten's determination to be a strong female kunoichi from the start. Still better then Kiba and his bland self. Nothing about him stands out other then him owning a dog that he takes everywhere. Still wouldn't care if Kiba died, because unlike Tenten, Kishi tried to make something of Kiba, and it's nothing at all special. When Tenten gets a real chance to have a real canon fight and mission and she fails at impressing, then I'll count her among characters I wouldn't cared if they died. If Tenten died now I'd only shake my head that she never was given a chance to do anything. Kiba's had plenty of chances at least.

Kamex
15th August 2014, 7:22 AM
I fail to see why Tenten would be boring and useless. A weapons master being useless in a shinobi world? Tenten has never been given a chance. Nothing about her is expanded upon, the only thing that we know about her is she wanted to be a strong Kunoichi like Tsunade. That easily makes her desires better then Sakura and Ino, yet ironically it's Sakura who becomes her student. Sakura should have had Tenten's determination to be a strong female kunoichi from the start. Still better then Kiba and his bland self. Nothing about him stands out other then him owning a dog that he takes everywhere. Still wouldn't care if Kiba died, because unlike Tenten, Kishi tried to make something of Kiba, and it's nothing at all special. When Tenten gets a real chance to have a real canon fight and mission and she fails at impressing, then I'll count her among characters I wouldn't cared if they died. If Tenten died now I'd only shake my head that she never was given a chance to do anything. Kiba's had plenty of chances at least.
I meant she'd be useless from a story perspective. I said her abilities had a lot of potential. But as far as I can recall her only memorable, consistent personality trait is to be turned off by Guy and Lee's personality traits. If that even counts. I guess that makes her "down to Earth" at best. And we know nothing about her background at all, other than wanting to be like Tsunade (lame and done multiple times already) and apparently she wanted to be a medical nin as well (even more unoriginal).

Don't get me wrong, I WANT to like Tenten. And I guess what you're trying to say is that if Kishi DID give her a personality and background, then she could be more interesting than Kiba, but because he didn't give her anything you don't want to hold it against her since you already know you dislike Kiba. But for me, the fact that Tenten is just kind of a part of the scenery being a part of Team Guy just to fill the slot automatically makes me put her below Kiba, who has a clan and family and dog and opinions, etc. Even if I didn't like Kiba, I think I'd rather a character be unlikable than invisible.

And at the very least, Akamaru's loss of its owner and best friend would make me care more about Kiba's life than Tenten's (as characters of course... I don't think Kiba inherently deserves life more than Tenten just because he owns a dog or any other reason).

Platinum fan.
15th August 2014, 2:58 PM
I meant she'd be useless from a story perspective. I said her abilities had a lot of potential. But as far as I can recall her only memorable, consistent personality trait is to be turned off by Guy and Lee's personality traits. If that even counts. I guess that makes her "down to Earth" at best. And we know nothing about her background at all, other than wanting to be like Tsunade (lame and done multiple times already) and apparently she wanted to be a medical nin as well (even more unoriginal).

Don't get me wrong, I WANT to like Tenten. And I guess what you're trying to say is that if Kishi DID give her a personality and background, then she could be more interesting than Kiba, but because he didn't give her anything you don't want to hold it against her since you already know you dislike Kiba. But for me, the fact that Tenten is just kind of a part of the scenery being a part of Team Guy just to fill the slot automatically makes me put her below Kiba, who has a clan and family and dog and opinions, etc. Even if I didn't like Kiba, I think I'd rather a character be unlikable than invisible.

And at the very least, Akamaru's loss of its owner and best friend would make me care more about Kiba's life than Tenten's (as characters of course... I don't think Kiba inherently deserves life more than Tenten just because he owns a dog or any other reason).

I don't dislike Kiba. I'm pretty neutral on the character. I just don't think Kishi did a good job in making me care at all for the character in the series if he lived or died. Nothing about him stands out despite all the roles he's been given in the series. Kiba's had plenty of chances to impress me and so far the only time I liked him was during the Chunin exam. But I don't dislike or hate the guy. I just think if kishi killed him off it would be no big loss at all, for me anyway.

How is wanting to be like Tsunade lame and done multiple times? Sakura is the only female to follow in Tsunade's footsteps, so how does that qualify as "multiple" times? And how is that lame? Tsunade is the only successful legendary female shinobi. I would think many young kunoichi's would want to be like her. Tenten wanting to be a medical nin must be a anime only thing, cause I've never seen Tenten mention it and she does have speaking roles in the manga. I don't see how that's unoriginal either. In part 1, Tsunade, Kabuto, and Shizune are the only medical ninjas we ever see, so it's not like there's a bunch of them. Before Shizune came to Konoha, the village didn't even have in the field medical shinobi. How is that anymore unoriginal then any other shinobi job?

If anything I wish Sakura had Tenten's ambition to be a strong kunoichi instead of being a lame Sasuke groupie. Tenten, along with Hinata, had the best original kunoichi goals in the series instead of just being over a guy. It's a shame Tenten was so overlooked. I suppose her death wouldn't mean anything either, but again the difference between Kiba and Tenten is Tenten never got a chance to prove herself, and Kiba has.

Edit: I'll give you the Akamaru thing. But that would be more sad about Akamaru being sad, not exactly for Kiba himself though.

Lorde
15th August 2014, 9:14 PM
I really hope that Naruto, Sasuke and Kakashi just one-shot Kaguya in the next chapter, but things will probably be dragged out longer. I almost expect Zetsu to backstab Kaguya and take over as the final villain.

Jb
15th August 2014, 10:54 PM
i caught up and i wasn't too surprised to see kakashi get a powerup. at least his made more since than the other two i guess.

i'm just waiting for the spirit bomb powered by the konoha12 or w/e just to one shot everyone.

Kamex
15th August 2014, 11:50 PM
How is wanting to be like Tsunade lame and done multiple times? Sakura is the only female to follow in Tsunade's footsteps, so how does that qualify as "multiple" times? And how is that lame? Tsunade is the only successful legendary female shinobi. I would think many young kunoichi's would want to be like her.
I don't know if it was only the anime, but Ino also wanted to be a medical nin and I think she may have wanted to train under Tsunade at one point as well. In any case I'm glad she didn't go that route. Being a medical nin to me is like playing Pokemon Contests instead of battling gyms... just seems kind of inferior or at least not as interesting.


Tenten wanting to be a medical nin must be a anime only thing, cause I've never seen Tenten mention it and she does have speaking roles in the manga. I don't see how that's unoriginal either. In part 1, Tsunade, Kabuto, and Shizune are the only medical ninjas we ever see, so it's not like there's a bunch of them. Before Shizune came to Konoha, the village didn't even have in the field medical shinobi. How is that anymore unoriginal then any other shinobi job?
Mainly the fact that she's a girl. I feel like (at least) every other important kunoichi has aspired to become a medical nin after Tsunade was introduced into the story. And many of them did become medical nin: Chiyo, Shizune, Sakura, Karin, Ino, Rin, Kiba's sister and other minor and/or anime-only characters as well. Do we really need to add Tenten to this list?


If anything I wish Sakura had Tenten's ambition to be a strong kunoichi instead of being a lame Sasuke groupie. Tenten, along with Hinata, had the best original kunoichi goals in the series instead of just being over a guy.
Well, I already disagreed with you about Tenten... but wait, wasn't Hinata's ninja way a direct copy of Naruto's? To never give up. Not sure how that's original. Or do you mean that she wanted to live up to her role in the main branch or keep up with Neji or something like that. Those still sound pretty unoriginal and un-creative to me. But maybe I just don't remember her main goal.

I could be biased though, because I have little hope that Kishimoto truly cares what happens with kunoichi. Most of them fall behind their peers or are given weak storylines in my opinion... not sure why they even become shinobi in the first place? Kaguya doesn't really make up for it.


I really hope that Naruto, Sasuke and Kakashi just one-shot Kaguya in the next chapter, but things will probably be dragged out longer. I almost expect Zetsu to backstab Kaguya and take over as the final villain.
Zetsu's whole role in everything still seems a bit out of place to me. Anyways I don't think I want yet another backstabbing at this point haha.

Platinum fan.
16th August 2014, 3:56 AM
I don't know if it was only the anime, but Ino also wanted to be a medical nin and I think she may have wanted to train under Tsunade at one point as well. In any case I'm glad she didn't go that route. Being a medical nin to me is like playing Pokemon Contests instead of battling gyms... just seems kind of inferior or at least not as interesting.


Mainly the fact that she's a girl. I feel like (at least) every other important kunoichi has aspired to become a medical nin after Tsunade was introduced into the story. And many of them did become medical nin: Chiyo, Shizune, Sakura, Karin, Ino, Rin, Kiba's sister and other minor and/or anime-only characters as well. Do we really need to add Tenten to this list?


Well, I already disagreed with you about Tenten... but wait, wasn't Hinata's ninja way a direct copy of Naruto's? To never give up. Not sure how that's original. Or do you mean that she wanted to live up to her role in the main branch or keep up with Neji or something like that. Those still sound pretty unoriginal and un-creative to me. But maybe I just don't remember her main goal.

I could be biased though, because I have little hope that Kishimoto truly cares what happens with kunoichi. Most of them fall behind their peers or are given weak storylines in my opinion... not sure why they even become shinobi in the first place? Kaguya doesn't really make up for it.


Zetsu's whole role in everything still seems a bit out of place to me. Anyways I don't think I want yet another backstabbing at this point haha.

Hinata's goal was to prove her worth to her family and that alone separates her from Naruto. Naruto doesn't have a family. The difference between Hinata and Naruto, is Hinata was a quitter and according to all her mentors and seniors, she would already doomed herself as a failure and didn't even try to change. It was not until she started watching Naruto that she got inspired to try and change herself and this is where her crush came from. Hinata copies Naruto's sayings, but she and Naruto do not have the same path. Hinata is not trying to become Hokage or draw a big crowd to herself like Naruto does. There is a big difference between Naruto and Hinata. Just because Naruto inspired her, doesn't mean she's a copy of him. Almost everyone in the series is inspired by Naruto.

As for this medical shinobi thing, this all must be anime only. And I don't count it as canon. Unless the manga tells me to watch the episode I don't consider any of it canon. Neither Ino or Tenten have said anything about wanting to be medical shinobi. As for why Ino is a medic, at the end of part 1 Shikamaru and Tsunade were already making plans to have every regular shinobi team have at least one medic ninja on their team to increase the success of missions. For all we know Ino could have been forced into being a medic in the manga because of this. I'm sure she didn't mind, but at no point is she ever associated with Tsunade. Neither is Tenten.

Not that this has nothing to do with my indifference to Kiba living or dying LOL.

Nodame
17th August 2014, 10:38 PM
Speaking of Hinata, the most overrated character. I think she's my least favourite female from Naruto. Don't get me wrong, I like her as an individual who thought for herself, whereas now most of her thinking is done for her by Naruto :x Not to mention how bland she is in terms of personality and she's one dimensional too. However, There was a time when she appealed to me back in the days I was a Hinata fan, however, given the canon characterization, it’s hard to me to do so nowadays. Back in Part 1, I really liked how Hinata took inspiration from Naruto and strived to be better and all that. In Part 2, all we saw is Hinata being all Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun which up to a certain extent it was okay, but after a while, for me, personally, it became let’s say, hard to bear...there would be so many things to talk about Hinata’s potential as a character like the Hyuga clan, but sadly, all we get from her is nothing but her Naruto-centric view.

Lorde
17th August 2014, 10:49 PM
I'm glad that Hinata grew and matured as a character, although like Sakura and Karin, she suffers from a crush that has held her back from being truly great and independent imo.

Nodame
17th August 2014, 11:01 PM
Karin is not any better, but between Hinata and Karin, I prefer Karin any day because of her hilarious personality. I have a thing for tsundere characters. Hinata is just too shy for my tastes.

To be fair, the whole crush thing that is constantly been used in the manga is super annoying, and sadly other female characters are suffering from that curse as well, but at least, the others aren't one dimensional like Hinata, there is a lot to their character than just romance. Even Hinata's shining moments and fights is done for Naruto :x ... imo she needs to be more aware of her surroundings and live a life outside of the "Naruto kun" world. Now I can't wait for her to be the leader of the Hyuga clan!! Kishi please make it happen..

Platinum fan.
18th August 2014, 1:41 AM
I forgot about Karin and Team Baka. I take back what I said about Kiba being the character I'd care the least about if he died. That honor goes to Karin and/or Jugo.

That being said, Hinata was much better in part 1. What hurt the character IMO is her popularity and her shipping with Naruto. It became her definition in the future and now she's basically almost to Naruto what Sakura/Karin are to Sasuke. That really hurt the character, because she wasn't always just about the shipping. You can't tell nowadays because everything about her is the shipping. I've lost interest in Hinata, but I certainly don't dislike her for it. She's just a victim of a popular shipping that ultimately became what she is, if that makes any sense.

LightningMaster95
18th August 2014, 2:44 AM
Speaking of Hinata, the most overrated character. I think she's my least favourite female from Naruto. Don't get me wrong, I like her as an individual who thought for herself, whereas now most of her thinking is done for her by Naruto :x Not to mention how bland she is in terms of personality and she's one dimensional too. However, There was a time when she appealed to me back in the days I was a Hinata fan, however, given the canon characterization, it’s hard to me to do so nowadays. Back in Part 1, I really liked how Hinata took inspiration from Naruto and strived to be better and all that. In Part 2, all we saw is Hinata being all Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun, Naruto-kun which up to a certain extent it was okay, but after a while, for me, personally, it became let’s say, hard to bear...there would be so many things to talk about Hinata’s potential as a character like the Hyuga clan, but sadly, all we get from her is nothing but her Naruto-centric view.

same can be said about sakura most of her thinking is about sasuke....she has a bland personality with no background....also sakura is the same when it comes to sasuke-kun(even worse than hinata)...sasuke kun is that you...naruto please save sasuke...thank you sasuke...we must save sasuke so sakura has a sasuke-centric view

Lorde
18th August 2014, 3:13 AM
Tbh, as much as shipping hurt Hinata, I still think that she's been a good character in Part 2. Her rescue attempt during the Pain arc only got her hurt, but I liked that she finally had the guts to confess her feelings to Naruto as well as challenge a high class ninja like Pain.

Shneak
18th August 2014, 3:47 AM
It's sad that that does qualify as a good character moment during part 2. The Konoha 11 minus Naruto, Sakura and Team Asuma got the shaft. Even Neji's death didn't have a strong impact considering he wasn't relevant in quite a few arcs.

Nodame
18th August 2014, 4:03 AM
same can be said about sakura most of her thinking is about sasuke....she has a bland personality with no background....also sakura is the same when it comes to sasuke-kun(even worse than hinata)...sasuke kun is that you...naruto please save sasuke...thank you sasuke...we must save sasuke so sakura has a sasuke-centric view

Did Sakura have a "Sasuke-centric" view when she told Naruto to forget about Sasuke when Naruto transformed into his four tails state? Did Sakura have a "Sasuke-centric" view when she attempted to bear Naruto's hatred and anger in the Land of Iron by attempting to kill Sasuke herself, thereby choosing Naruto's safety over Sasuke? Did Sakura have a "Sasuke-centric" view when she told off Sasuke at the bridge for bad mouthing Naruto? Did Sakura have a "Sasuke-centric" view when, after hearing Sasuke's declaration of becoming hokage, she hovered over Naruto while he was dying, and by her words, chose Naruto's dream over Sasuke's ambition? Did Sakura have a "Sasuke-centric" view when she admitted to Obito that she wasn't going to waste Naruto's efforts, and it was because of Naruto that she was giving her all to get Sasuke back to Naruto?

Funny enough, Sakura and her "Sasuke-centric" self has chosen Naruto over Sasuke every time after the timeskip. Your hatred is too extreme to notice that.

Lorde
18th August 2014, 4:35 AM
Even Neji's death didn't have a strong impact considering he wasn't relevant in quite a few arcs.

I still firmly believe that he'll be revived via Naruto's new sage powers or via Madara's Rinne Tensei after his redemption or some other plot device. :x

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
18th August 2014, 11:06 AM
same can be said about sakura most of her thinking is about sasuke....she has a bland personality with no background....also sakura is the same when it comes to sasuke-kun(even worse than hinata)...sasuke kun is that you...naruto please save sasuke...thank you sasuke...we must save sasuke so sakura has a sasuke-centric view

That's false, most of Sakura's thinking is not about Sasuke, she doesn't have a one tracked mind like Hinata does. If anything, Hinata is the one with the bland personality, Sakura's a tsundere, which are not bland, Hinata is a character who typically stays in the background. And it seems as if you're speaking of Part 1 Sakura, because Part 2 Sakura is nothing like that. She thinks of both Naruto and Sasuke, saying she's worse than Hinata is a lie because Naruto is all what Hinata thinks about. Sakura has developed pass her fangirl/admiration phase, Hinata has not.

Kamex
18th August 2014, 5:44 PM
It's sad that that does qualify as a good character moment during part 2. The Konoha 11 minus Naruto, Sakura and Team Asuma got the shaft. Even Neji's death didn't have a strong impact considering he wasn't relevant in quite a few arcs.
I agree, especially about Neji... I loved his character before but after he had his change of heart in Part I he had so much potential as a gifted shinobi with a fresh new attitude. But all that potential was wasted... even though he became a Jounin, he didn't shine amongst his team at all during that first "save Gaara" arc, and after that he didn't really show up in the story at all. Then I have to see one of my favorite characters finally jump into the spotlight just to be the one who dies for the cause? I know it was supposed to have a positive impact on Naruto and Hinata's resolve and story lines, but it's not fair to Neji because like you said he wasn't relevant for a long time so it didn't have a strong impact.

Just ranting since I like Neji so much. Honestly, most stories don't handle deaths very well during long, dragged-out, epic, final war scenes. Kind of like what happened in Harry Potter (in my opinion). Whenever there are mass random deaths, since the character didn't have the focus it just seems like a waste, even though it's more realistic I guess. I think Attack on Titan handled deaths better than most.


I still firmly believe that he'll be revived via Naruto's new sage powers or via Madara's Rinne Tensei after his redemption or some other plot device. :x
As lame as this sounds, I don't think I'd mind because of the aforementioned points. But speaking of Madara, it's very hard to imagine him being redeemed, because he seemed like such a strong-willed character after he left the Leaf village. But then again, I think Kaguya (or more like Zetsu) will be the one that never agrees with Naruto up through defeat. Madara on the other hand will probably change considering his relationship with Hashirama. So Madara is kind of like the ultimate opponent for Naruto... not in terms of power (though he was close), but in terms of his lack of susceptibility to Talk no Jutsu. Although it might be Hashirama who uses that on Madara.

Still not sure if he'd pull a Nagato and just revive people left and right, but I do think he'll be the last character in the story to have a change of heart.

TsukiMirage
19th August 2014, 10:26 AM
No offense, but now it just sounds like your in denial. Why do I think Sasuke was telling Obito the truth? Well he tells Kakashi, Sakura, and Naruto the exact same thing that he's going to kill everyone in Konoha including them. And your question of Sasuke lying to Obito. Well if he was lying to Obito why would Kishi even bother to show that? If Sasuke was lying then wouldn't it make more sense to first show him lying to Obito and then going behind his back and telling Taka the truth? The opposite happened. As to why Sasuke lied to them. Sasuke already explained that himself in the chapter. He wants to slaughter Konoha by himself. When it comes to revenge Sasuke has always worked alone. Taka is just there to make sure nobody gets in the way of his revenge, but he's always taking revenge on his own and takes great pleasure in it. See killing Danzo.

Again, no offense, but I'm starting to wonder how much of this manga you've actually read. Please don't take that the wrong way though. Sorry for the late response, my laptop got corrupted.

Anyway, Sasuke didn't talk to team Seven until after he had started killing innocent people. There was a clear difference between Sasuke before the summit, avoiding killing people and risking his life for Team Taka, and after, killing with no regard and not caring about Team Taka. And most importantly, he called out Naruto and set up a fight between them over that exact thing. He had no trouble putting that off, as oppose to trying his hardest to achieve his revenge against Itachi and Danzo. Not when it was showing the connection between Sasuke and Obito, and their attempts to use each other. Sasuke's actions right after that was leaving Obito's side and then attempting to kill him.

So he had to lie to them? All he would have had to do was tell them not to interfere. You know, like he did with Itachi previously. It's not as if they didn't already know the score when it came to Sasuke and his revenge. So again, what reason did he need to lie to them for? None of them had problem with killing, and they already knew not to interfere with his revenge.

Sasuke has an established history already of telling a villain one thing while he used them, and then betraying them as soon as they were of no more use. That combined with the fact that the whole Kirabi fight was suppose to show Sasuke actually caring for his teammates along with the previous mentioned issue about him having no reason to lie to them makes it far more liekly he was lying to Obito, especially given how he tried to and did betray Obito every chance he got.


And yet there's still the matter of Sasuke wanting to be Hokage too and how that conflicts with Naruto's dream. How else will that get resolved without a fight? Well setting aside the fact that Naruto's goal of bring peace would mean the elimination of the villages therefore meaning there wouldn't be any position of Hokage, ever since he arrived on the battlefield, Sasuke has been pushing to work together. So it's quite possible that such a belief would continue.

Platinum fan.
19th August 2014, 3:25 PM
Sorry for the late response, my laptop got corrupted.

Anyway, Sasuke didn't talk to team Seven until after he had started killing innocent people. There was a clear difference between Sasuke before the summit, avoiding killing people and risking his life for Team Taka, and after, killing with no regard and not caring about Team Taka. And most importantly, he called out Naruto and set up a fight between them over that exact thing. He had no trouble putting that off, as oppose to trying his hardest to achieve his revenge against Itachi and Danzo. Not when it was showing the connection between Sasuke and Obito, and their attempts to use each other. Sasuke's actions right after that was leaving Obito's side and then attempting to kill him.

So he had to lie to them? All he would have had to do was tell them not to interfere. You know, like he did with Itachi previously. It's not as if they didn't already know the score when it came to Sasuke and his revenge. So again, what reason did he need to lie to them for? None of them had problem with killing, and they already knew not to interfere with his revenge.

Sasuke has an established history already of telling a villain one thing while he used them, and then betraying them as soon as they were of no more use. That combined with the fact that the whole Kirabi fight was suppose to show Sasuke actually caring for his teammates along with the previous mentioned issue about him having no reason to lie to them makes it far more liekly he was lying to Obito, especially given how he tried to and did betray Obito every chance he got.

Well setting aside the fact that Naruto's goal of bring peace would mean the elimination of the villages therefore meaning there wouldn't be any position of Hokage, ever since he arrived on the battlefield, Sasuke has been pushing to work together. So it's quite possible that such a belief would continue.

Sorry to hear about your laptop. I know the feeling. Hope you got it fixed.

Anyway, I'm done with this debate. I have nothing more to add beyond what I've already stated. Sasuke planned to kill everyone in the village. That's not my opinion, it's a FACT. It was proven several times in the manga by Sasuke himself and that makes him a villain for that time. Not a anti-hero, a straight up villain. If you don't want to believe that then just read the volumes. They finish my arguments for me, because you're pretty much arguing against what the volumes set up. So I'm done. I have nothing new to add because I'll just be saying the same thing over and over again.

Now to everyone on Sakura vs Hinata. How did we get to this point? Now we're arguing who was more clinging to Naruto or Sasuke. They both are. The difference is Hinata did not start off as so Naruto centric as she is now. In part 1 Hinata actually had a life and Naruto just inspired her to be better at it and this is where the crush came in. Somewhere along the lines in part 2, Hinata simply became a Naruto groupie and whatever story she had beyond that was lost in her popularity and shipping. Hinata's the most popular female in the Naruto series so I'm not surprised it bit her in the butt in the end. To everyone who says all she ever thinks about is Naruto...well yeah. I have to agree with that. The only thing I'll argue is she wasn't always like that. Popularity and her shipping did her in.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 5:43 PM
Now to everyone on Sakura vs Hinata. How did we get to this point? Now we're arguing who was more clinging to Naruto or Sasuke. They both are. The difference is Hinata did not start off as so Naruto centric as she is now. In part 1 Hinata actually had a life and Naruto just inspired her to be better at it and this is where the crush came in. Somewhere along the lines in part 2, Hinata simply became a Naruto groupie and whatever story she had beyond that was lost in her popularity and shipping. Hinata's the most popular female in the Naruto series so I'm not surprised it bit her in the butt in the end. To everyone who says all she ever thinks about is Naruto...well yeah. I have to agree with that. The only thing I'll argue is she wasn't always like that. Popularity and her shipping did her in.
Sakura isn't clinging to Sasuke like she was in the past, I don't know why people still say this if there is nothing to prove it. Yes, about 300 chapters ago this would be valid, but no, it isn't now. And Hinata had a crush on him since she debuted. Naruto's thoughts of her in Part 1 were "A weirdo who looks away when I look at her. A shy and dark girl." Sakura also told Naruto "Oh yeah, she was always watching you." when Hinata was fighting Neji, so she liked Naruto before she even appeared. And her life is pretty much the same as it was in Part 1, the only thing that seems different is that she trained with Neji rather than train with Hanabi and she gained some self confidence.

Nodame
19th August 2014, 6:12 PM
Sakura has developed pass her fangirl/admiration phase, Hinata has not.

Statement of the year.


Now we're arguing who was more clinging to Naruto or Sasuke. They both are.
You seem to easily forget Sakura's false smile and all the distrust she has in Sasuke. You are misguided if you can't see that Sakura places Naruto above Sasuke constantly. She's matured and no longer a fangirl.

Jb
19th August 2014, 7:37 PM
Sakura is way more of a fangirl than Hinata. The fact that she has more screen time makes this a fact that can't be disputed.

Liking someone that hasn't done anything wrong to you isn't a fangirl. Liking someone, that had constantly told you to **** off, they don't care for you and even tried to kill you is. Anyone who disagrees is simply wrong.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 7:41 PM
Sakura is way more of a fangirl than Hinata. The fact that she has more screen time makes this a fake that can't be disputed.

Liking someone that hasn't done anything wrong to you isn't a fangirl. Liking someone, that had constantly told you to **** off, they don't care for you and even tried to kill you is. Anyone who disagrees is simply wrong.

Give me the chapter and page of Sakura fangirling over Sasuke in the recent 100 chapters. Without that, Hinata will remain as top fangirl.

Jb
19th August 2014, 7:48 PM
Recent length of time is irrelevant. If I compared all the chapters of the manga that had fangirling, Sakura would beat out Hinata 78 to 1.

Lorde
19th August 2014, 7:49 PM
Sakura isn't clinging to Sasuke like she was in the past, I don't know why people still say this if there is nothing to prove it. Yes, about 300 chapters ago this would be valid, but no, it isn't now. And Hinata had a crush on him since she debuted. Naruto's thoughts of her in Part 1 were "A weirdo who looks away when I look at her. A shy and dark girl." Sakura also told Naruto "Oh yeah, she was always watching you." when Hinata was fighting Neji, so she liked Naruto before she even appeared. And her life is pretty much the same as it was in Part 1, the only thing that seems different is that she trained with Neji rather than train with Hanabi and she gained some self confidence.

Imo, Sakura has improved a bit in the "fangirl" department lately, but the fact that she still cared about Sasuke even after he tried to kill her is what rankles me tbh. Same goes for Karin, who is even worse in the regard.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 7:58 PM
Recent length of time is irrelevant. If I compared all the chapters of the manga that had fangirling, Sakura would beat out Hinata 78 to 1.
Going by logic such as that, it seems as if you don't believe in development, which Sakura has plenty of. Like besho said, Sakura's matured, she isn't the same fangirl she used to be in Part 1 going gaga over everything Sasuke did calling him cool and cute.

Imo, Sakura has improved a bit in the "fangirl" department lately, but the fact that she still cared about Sasuke even after he tried to kill her is what rankles me tbh. Same goes for Karin, who is even worse in the regard.

And Tsunade still cared for Orochimaru. People in Konoha care for their comrades regardless of what they've done. Kakashi and Obito rings a bell, after everything Obito's done in the war and in the past, Kakashi still cared for him and wanted to bring him back. And I can see Sakura being no different.

Platinum fan.
19th August 2014, 8:32 PM
Sakura isn't clinging to Sasuke like she was in the past, I don't know why people still say this if there is nothing to prove it. Yes, about 300 chapters ago this would be valid, but no, it isn't now. And Hinata had a crush on him since she debuted. Naruto's thoughts of her in Part 1 were "A weirdo who looks away when I look at her. A shy and dark girl." Sakura also told Naruto "Oh yeah, she was always watching you." when Hinata was fighting Neji, so she liked Naruto before she even appeared. And her life is pretty much the same as it was in Part 1, the only thing that seems different is that she trained with Neji rather than train with Hanabi and she gained some self confidence.

I never said Hinata didn't have the crush on Naruto in part 1. I said she had a life outside in part 1. Hinata's crush on Naruto stems from her being inspired by him because he's in the same boat as her. Labeled as a failure. But unlike her, Naruto worked to overcome it and become great. This inspired Hinata in part 1 to really try and change herself which was the entire point of her not giving up to Neji in their fight. This is a major reason why Hinata seems to be better received as a character then Sakura ever was. I've already dissected the Sakura/Sasuke thing.

In part 2 however, kishi ignores all this and basically makes Hinata a Naruto groupie whenever she appears and suddenly her life is more about crushing on Naruto then changing the bad qualities she had in part 1. There's a difference between Sakura and Hinata. Sakura has always been about Sasuke. Not one thing doesn't involve Sasuke in her life, even when Naruto's involved. I don't hate Sakura for it or anything, but this is probably why Hinata has always been more popular then Sakura.

p96822
19th August 2014, 8:50 PM
Are we really not getting the message that Naruto is trying to give us. Stop looking at the past and look toward the future.

Really Hinata isn't that great of a charter because she is mostly one note. She doesn't has anything about her that is interesting or her personally is bland as a chalkboard. I think she shouldn't gotten all the populated in this manga. Hinata had something interesting, but Kishi didn't expand it and keep it in one spot of her having a crush/love on Naruto. I feel there could been more talked about her, but Kishi didn't do it. Also I think that Sakura was the better charter for have so much range of emotion and charter development. It her being a fangirl then becoming a stronger person at the end of it. I'm not saying that Hinata is weak I mean that the charter was just not explored enough for me to like her as a charter in this manga.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 8:51 PM
I never said Hinata didn't have the crush on Naruto in part 1. I said she had a life outside in part 1. Hinata's crush on Naruto stems from her being inspired by him because he's in the same boat as her. Labeled as a failure. But unlike her, Naruto worked to overcome it and become great. This inspired Hinata in part 1 to really try and change herself which was the entire point of her not giving up to Neji in their fight. This is a major reason why Hinata seems to be better received as a character then Sakura ever was. I've already dissected the Sakura/Sasuke thing.

In part 2 however, kishi ignores all this and basically makes Hinata a Naruto groupie whenever she appears and suddenly her life is more about crushing on Naruto then changing the bad qualities she had in part 1.
Hinata's not the only one who's been inspired by Naruto, Sakura, Shikamaru and Sai have as well. Sakura's also inherited the will of not giving up.

There's a difference between Sakura and Hinata. Sakura has always been about Sasuke. Not one thing doesn't involve Sasuke in her life, even when Naruto's involved. I don't hate Sakura for it or anything, but this is probably why Hinata has always been more popular then Sakura.
Wouldn't this apply for Naruto as well as Sakura? Naruto's just as bad as Sakura since most of his actions were about Sasuke since he left the village. Going back to things Hinata's done, Hinata's actions were all about Naruto.

Lorde
19th August 2014, 8:54 PM
Are we really not getting the message that Naruto is trying to give us. Stop looking at the past and look toward the future.

The "messages" in this series contradict each other though; first Naruto didn't believe in destiny in Part 1, and now his entire character revolves around being the one destined to change the world in Part 2.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 8:57 PM
The "messages" in this series contradict each other though; first Naruto didn't believe in destiny in Part 1, and now his entire character revolves around being the one destined to change the world in Part 2.

I'm drawing a blank, where was this from? Because I thought Naruto said destiny is something that can't be decided. :/

Platinum fan.
19th August 2014, 9:07 PM
Hinata's not the only one who's been inspired by Naruto, Sakura, Shikamaru and Sai have as well. Sakura's also inherited the will of not giving up.

Wouldn't this apply for Naruto as well as Sakura? Naruto's just as bad as Sakura since most of his actions were about Sasuke since he left the village. Going back to things Hinata's done, Hinata's actions were all about Naruto.

Yes, Naruto's actions are just as bad in part 2. I've complained about it several times and even called this manga "Sasuke" at one point. As far as Hinata, I already explained what Hinata's storyline was and how Naruto inspired her to work at it in part 1. But her entire existence didn't revolve around Naruto. Not like it does now in part 2.

I don't know what your point is for saying Shikamaru and the others are inspired by Naruto too. Nearly everyone is inspired by Naruto in this series.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 9:26 PM
Yes, Naruto's actions are just as bad in part 2. I've complained about it several times and even called this manga "Sasuke" at one point. As far as Hinata, I already explained what Hinata's storyline was and how Naruto inspired her to work at it in part 1. But her entire existence didn't revolve around Naruto. Not like it does now in part 2.

I don't know what your point is for saying Shikamaru and the others are inspired by Naruto too. Nearly everyone is inspired by Naruto in this series.

See, that's where you're confusing me. What sets apart Part 1 Hinata and Part 2 Hinata? Her fight against Neji is the only thing I can think of....

And I said that because Hinata wasn't the only one to be inspired by Naruto. There was no trick to it. The way how you said it was like Hinata was the one and only to be inspired, which I had to call out.

p96822
19th August 2014, 9:31 PM
The "messages" in this series contradict each other though; first Naruto didn't believe in destiny in Part 1, and now his entire character revolves around being the one destined to change the world in Part 2.

Hello there can more then one message in a series.

Platinum fan.
19th August 2014, 9:38 PM
See, that's where you're confusing me. What sets apart Part 1 Hinata and Part 2 Hinata? Her fight against Neji is the only thing I can think of....

And I said that because Hinata wasn't the only one to be inspired by Naruto. There was no trick to it. The way how you said it was like Hinata was the one and only to be inspired, which I had to call out.

I thought I explained this, but I can do it again. Part 2 Hinata is basically just a Naruto groupie. Her storyline of improving herself has apparently been either dropped or forgotten. Because it's never brought up. Whenever she shows up in part 2 it's Naruto related, and the only time it wasn't is when they were hunting Sasuke and found Kabuto. In part 1, Hinata's crush was actually secondary to her wanting to improve herself. Her crush came as a result of Naruto inspiring her to improve herself so it was actually secondary in part 1. But as she got more popular, this story is seemingly dropped in exchange for her swooning over Naruto or simply doing everything based around him. Hinata was always in love with Naruto, but in part 1 she had a life outside it.

As for everyone else inspired by Naruto, when did I ever say she was the only one inspired by Naruto? I never said that. Which is why I didn't get why you brought this up. Hinata's not even the biggest changed person Naruto's made in the series.

Lorde
19th August 2014, 9:45 PM
I'm drawing a blank, where was this from? Because I thought Naruto said destiny is something that can't be decided. :/

My point is that Kishi changed the direction of the story by relying on prophecies and destiny, which has gone on to affect Naruto's purpose, with or without being explicitly stated.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
19th August 2014, 9:47 PM
I thought I explained this, but I can do it again. Part 2 Hinata is basically just a Naruto groupie. Her storyline of improving herself has apparently been either dropped or forgotten. Because it's never brought up. Whenever she shows up in part 2 it's Naruto related, and the only time it wasn't is when they were hunting Sasuke and found Kabuto. In part 1, Hinata's crush was actually secondary to her wanting to improve herself. Her crush came as a result of Naruto inspiring her to improve herself so it was actually secondary in part 1. But as she got more popular, this story is seemingly dropped in exchange for her swooning over Naruto or simply doing everything based around him. Hinata was always in love with Naruto, but in part 1 she had a life outside it.

As for everyone else inspired by Naruto, when did I ever say she was the only one inspired by Naruto? I never said that. Which is why I didn't get why you brought this up. Hinata's not even the biggest changed person Naruto's made in the series.
Thank you for explaining, I didn't have the slightest clue of what you were talking about, but you make a valid point about her character. Though it doesn't surprise me, she isn't the only character with potential to go to waste in a way, Neji's a great example.

No, you're misunderstanding, I said "the way how you said it" it only seemed as if you were saying Hinata was the only one. That is what I meant.

p96822
19th August 2014, 9:47 PM
I thought I explained this, but I can do it again. Part 2 Hinata is basically just a Naruto groupie. Her storyline of improving herself has apparently been either dropped or forgotten. Because it's never brought up. Whenever she shows up in part 2 it's Naruto related, and the only time it wasn't is when they were hunting Sasuke and found Kabuto. In part 1, Hinata's crush was actually secondary to her wanting to improve herself. Her crush came as a result of Naruto inspiring her to improve herself so it was actually secondary in part 1. But as she got more popular, this story is seemingly dropped in exchange for her swooning over Naruto or simply doing everything based around him. Hinata was always in love with Naruto, but in part 1 she had a life outside it.

As for everyone else inspired by Naruto, when did I ever say she was the only one inspired by Naruto? I never said that. Which is why I didn't get why you brought this up. Hinata's not even the biggest changed person Naruto's made in the series.

Yes that what I think about the same thing here. Also to put a rail in the spike that Hinata always get crap on alot like tripping on her feet and not getting back up. Hey I can say Karin did a better job at that then Hinata.

Platinum fan.
19th August 2014, 9:51 PM
Thank you for explaining, I didn't have the slightest clue of what you were talking about, but you make a valid point about her character.

No, you're misunderstanding, I said "the way how you said it" it only seemed as if you were saying Hinata was the only one. That is what I meant.


Well she's certainly not the only one. And again, Hinata IMO is a character who's popularity just makes her come off as overrated. I still really like the character, but the fanbase gives her way to much credit sometimes. Interestingly I think Hinata is the only female in Naruto who can ever say they reached a somewhat "overrated" status. All the other kunoichi are severely underrated. But it's not all their fault. It's how the manga series used them or lack of using them.

Nodame
19th August 2014, 10:31 PM
Imo, Sakura has improved a bit in the "fangirl" department lately, but the fact that she still cared about Sasuke even after he tried to kill her is what rankles me tbh. Same goes for Karin, who is even worse in the regard.

Its not in Sakura's personality not to care for her comrades. She's a "kind" girl. What I know so far. Sakura only view Sasuke as a friend. After all the crimes he committed, after all the times he hurt her. She still forgave him because she wants Team 7 together again. :)

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 2:55 AM
Its not in Sakura's personality not to care for her comrades. She's a "kind" girl. What I know so far. Sakura only view Sasuke as a friend. After all the crimes he committed, after all the times he hurt her. She still forgave him because she wants Team 7 together again. :)

Tell that to part 1 Naruto, when Sakura started as a shallow bully to him like the rest of Konoha. You'd think someone who was bullied herself wouldn't be so quick to pick on someone else, but Sakura was just as nasty as the other Naruto haters in Konoha. Nothing "kind" about that. Just saying :P

Nodame
20th August 2014, 4:35 AM
Tell that to part 1 Naruto, when Sakura started as a shallow bully to him like the rest of Konoha. You'd think someone who was bullied herself wouldn't be so quick to pick on someone else, but Sakura was just as nasty as the other Naruto haters in Konoha. Nothing "kind" about that. Just saying :P

“And Sakura… ... You're a kind girl”- by Kakashi xP

I don't remember her ever bullying him. She was just really annoyed by him. If you seriously think that Sakura abuses Naruto then go read different anime, you'll be surprised at how common tsunderes smacks the hero. Its a thing in Japan. There's an expression called "played for laughs" "comic relief" .. gotta love the NaruSaku dynamic.

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 5:21 AM
“And Sakura… ... You're a kind girl”- by Kakashi xP

I don't remember her ever bullying him. She was just really annoyed by him. If you seriously think that Sakura abuses Naruto then go read different anime, you'll be surprised at how common tsunderes smacks the hero. Its a thing in Japan. There's an expression called "played for laughs" "comic relief" .. gotta love the NaruSaku dynamic.

Oh I can name a few instances. Sakura beat up Naruto in her introduction after he kissed Sasuke, told him to his face she hated him and he makes her sick, rooted for Sasuke to "give Naruto what he deserves" in their sparring, that means a beating, and was just as nasty as all the other Konoha jerks. She got nicer of course once she got to actually know Naruto, but she started off like every other jerk to Naruto. Sakura herself admitted she was mean to Naruto at first during his Kiba fight. So Sakura's no angel. At least she didn't start off as one.

Lorde
20th August 2014, 7:57 AM
Kakashi's Kamui Shuriken and Kamui Raikiri techniques were pretty cool, but Sakura attacking Kaguya and proving herself useful was the new chapter's highlight imo.

Joltik-Kid
20th August 2014, 8:08 AM
Oh I can name a few instances. Sakura beat up Naruto in her introduction after he kissed Sasuke, told him to his face she hated him and he makes her sick, rooted for Sasuke to "give Naruto what he deserves" in their sparring, that means a beating, and was just as nasty as all the other Konoha jerks. She got nicer of course once she got to actually know Naruto, but she started off like every other jerk to Naruto. Sakura herself admitted she was mean to Naruto at first during his Kiba fight. So Sakura's no angel. At least she didn't start off as one.
Normally I don't try to butt in... but neither was Kushina. She straight up told Naruto she use to think of his father as totally unreliable when they were kids and we know she was quite violent. We also know she was likely strict with Minato too as we learn when he compares that personality to Sakura. And just for the heck of it, those "Sakura Beating" never really leave a permanent effect on Naruto, it's just used for Slap Stick. Kinda like the NaruSasu kiss was just for humor's sake.

lolipiece
20th August 2014, 8:14 AM
Sakura does something!...for once!

...Is it over? Is she finally gone? I doubt it.

Kamex
20th August 2014, 9:22 AM
I like Kamui Raikiri. The parallels between now and Obito's first "death" are pretty awe-inspiring (for example, this is the second time Kakashi received Obito's Sharingan as a gift, and the second time it improved his signature move). It's cool that after everything that's happened, Obito went back to helping Kakashi and in turn the world.

I might be the only one to say this, but I think Sakura's help at the end there was forced and extremely unsatisfying. She spends the entire series attempting to catch up, kind of accomplishing it but usually in a half-assed way plot-wise, then falling seriously behind again, rinse and repeat ad nauseam. And now finally at the end of the series, Kishimoto has to sort of throw her into the mix despite the obvious discrepancy between her and the rest of them (even Kakashi now), just because he has to go full circle and get Team 7 back to form so he can prove his whole teamwork motif. I don't mind teamwork being the moral of the Naruto series, but I'm not gonna lie, seeing Sakura mention being a woman and then pretending to help (okay fine she did help... I guess) was cringe-worthy for me. Pretty sad. Sigh.

Other than that, I'm excited to see how the series ends (if this really is the end).

justinjiaxinghu
20th August 2014, 10:10 AM
oh my finally we're getting somewhere.

is this really the end of naruto oml I kinda doubt it but you never know

X Drake
20th August 2014, 10:13 AM
Kamui Raikiri looks great,can't wait to see that in the anime.

And the last panel was just awesome,although I wonder who Kakashi said "I likes you" to?

lolipiece
20th August 2014, 10:24 AM
Kamui Raikiri looks great,can't wait to see that in the anime.

And the last panel was just awesome,although I wonder who Kakashi said "I likes you" to?

It's a call back to when he first met Team 7.

X Drake
20th August 2014, 10:53 AM
It's a call back to when he first met Team 7.

Ah that makes sense,thanks for the info.

Nodame
20th August 2014, 12:30 PM
Anyway, the chapter slayed. Sakura punched that Kaguya. She did it without any hax powerups. It finally come. This is my girl guys, the girl who used to be weak, who had to rely on her teammates to protect her. I’m proud to have supported her all these years. SAKURA CHAAAAAAN! <3 *faints from fangirling too much*

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 3:35 PM
Please tell me this crappy war arc is over now. Please tell me Kaguya is going to be sealed. Please tell me we are done. Anyway this chapter basically set up what I've been saying all along. Team Seven are about to become legends. All of them. I bet Sasuke's crimes are just going to be swept under the rug like all human emotions apparently can be, after this. You were wrong, Nagato. Human emotions can be swept under the rug.

Kakashi was the only one who really busted out anything new, which disappointed me. Don't get me wrong, I love Kakashi, but I expected some new stuff from Naruto to dish out. But I won't complain if this is the end of the war. And please don't bring Madara back. But wait, if this is the end then what's left for those old dead Hokage. Whatever. This was just a okay chapter. I wasn't thrilled at all. I'll only be happy to see the war end. Now we need Naruto vs Sasuke to complete the series. Winner becomes the undisputed president of the Super Freak Club. I guess Kakashi's a member of that now with his BS Sharingan enhancement.

That's the theme of this final fight. BS powerups all around. Remember when the series was about ninjas and a boy simply trying to become the best ninja in his village? I really miss that story.

Blue Saturday
20th August 2014, 3:55 PM
That's the theme of this final fight. BS powerups all around. Remember when the series was about ninjas and a boy simply trying to become the best ninja in his village? I really miss that story.
Nice job making me not wanna catch up on this. I miss old Naruto.

nuzamaki90
20th August 2014, 3:55 PM
This chapter was so hype. I read it at like 4 in the morning so I woke up hype. I was like "WTF woah!" when Kakashi used Kamui Shurikens, that was slick.

Hopefully Kaguya is done for now, can't stand her lol. I think Kishimoto flopped when he made it so Kaguya was final villain, Madara was already perfect and Kaguya's so boring. Her entire intent for wanting to takeover is really "What's your chakra is mine and what's my chakra is also mine".

Shneak
20th August 2014, 4:01 PM
I don't know what happened in this chapter. Kakashi got more broken. Kaguya turned the Bijuu into a dimension for some reason.

At least Team 7 is all on the same level for one moment.

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 4:15 PM
I don't know what happened in this chapter. Kakashi got more broken. Kaguya turned the Bijuu into a dimension for some reason.

At least Team 7 is all on the same level for one moment.

That's basically it. If nothing else came out of it, at least Team 7 had their moment. Better Kaguya then Madara. This entire thing was to make Team Seven the new Sannin. Which is funny, because Naruto and Sasuke are beyond the Sannin level. Far beyond it. But let Team Seven have their moment of awesomeness, if that is what this is suppose to be.

Profesco
20th August 2014, 5:15 PM
I'm not gonna lie, seeing Sakura mention being a woman and then pretending to help (okay fine she did help... I guess) was cringe-worthy for me. Pretty sad. Sigh.

I don't know what that "We're both women" was doing in there. If I was about to land the final punch on the greatest villain in the world, my penultimate thought would not be about our respective genders. That was so weird and out of place. It's probably just cynicism, but to my best guess the purpose of that phrase was the author indelicately and inartfully sending the message that, after hundreds of chapters of female characters consistently being shafted compared to the males, here at the end(?) both the final(?) villain and the last-puncher of that villain are women. Which is much-needed for this series, but the awkward sledgehammer delivery reads more like, "Here! Jeez! Are you happy now? Strong wimmin!" than like actual respect.

That said, I am very glad that Sakura played a crucial role there. Maybe it was sort of lame (Kaguya: "Hm, I guess I'll just float upwards to avoid the two strongest ninja in the world"; Sakura: "Nope. Smack."), but it is certainly worth noting that she performed that move with her plain old human ninja strength instead of any inconceivable, ridiculous magic powers.

Because I do not understand how Kakashi is doing the things he is doing. Asking questions at this point will just ruin the huge illusion that this series has itself become.

Locormus
20th August 2014, 5:17 PM
I don't know what happened in this chapter. Kakashi got more broken. Kaguya turned the Bijuu into a dimension for some reason.

At least Team 7 is all on the same level for one moment.

I think if Kaguya had actually used that massive Bijuu-dama, or whatever it was, then the blast would've created a new dimension.. And what I still don't get is whether Naruto lost all the Bijuu's he had when he did that 9-fold Bijuufide Rasenshuriken, or that the connection between the remainder chakra in Kaguya and theirs caused that bunnification..

I'm still quite confused why Kaguya suddenly went bunny.. -.-

p96822
20th August 2014, 5:25 PM
I'm still quite confused why Kaguya suddenly went bunny.. -.-

It a Japaness refence to the rabbit of the moon.

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 6:17 PM
This chapter was so hype. I read it at like 4 in the morning so I woke up hype. I was like "WTF woah!" when Kakashi used Kamui Shurikens, that was slick.

Hopefully Kaguya is done for now, can't stand her lol. I think Kishimoto flopped when he made it so Kaguya was final villain, Madara was already perfect and Kaguya's so boring. Her entire intent for wanting to takeover is really "What's your chakra is mine and what's my chakra is also mine".

I forgot about those Kamui Shurikens. Those were pretty cool weren't they? I also like the part where Naruto told Sasuke it was more then his own abilities. At least I think that's what he said. Let the Sasuke/Kakashi rivalry begin. No, there's no time for that.

I still want my Naruto vs Sasuke match. I know I've been off and on about whether or not they even still need a match, but darn it, the series cannot end without one more clash between Naruto and Sasuke. It just has to happen. I put up with this rotten war arc for years. A war that ruined Obito forever! Throw me a bone already! Give me Naruto vs Sasuke. The Super Freak Club clash for leadership.

Kamex
20th August 2014, 7:33 PM
I don't know what that "We're both women" was doing in there. If I was about to land the final punch on the greatest villain in the world, my penultimate thought would not be about our respective genders. That was so weird and out of place. It's probably just cynicism, but to my best guess the purpose of that phrase was the author indelicately and inartfully sending the message that, after hundreds of chapters of female characters consistently being shafted compared to the males, here at the end(?) both the final(?) villain and the last-puncher of that villain are women. Which is much-needed for this series, but the awkward sledgehammer delivery reads more like, "Here! Jeez! Are you happy now? Strong wimmin!" than like actual respect.
I don't know if it's cynicism, but that's exactly how I saw it as well.


I still want my Naruto vs Sasuke match. I know I've been off and on about whether or not they even still need a match, but darn it, the series cannot end without one more clash between Naruto and Sasuke. It just has to happen. I put up with this rotten war arc for years. A war that ruined Obito forever! Throw me a bone already! Give me Naruto vs Sasuke. The Super Freak Club clash for leadership.
I used to want a Naruto vs. Sasuke match really badly, because it seemed like that's where the story was going for most of the series after Part I ended. And I admit, the openings and endings of the anime seemed to hint at it as well, but I guess that shouldn't count. Anyway after Sasuke found his new "answer" and the whole teamwork-is-the-solution thing started to prevail in this war arc (especially now with Team 7), it makes it hard for me to see a purpose for a Naruto vs. Sasuke battle. The only reasons I can see for them battling are lame now anyway. Either to see who becomes Hokage or just to spar or something. Not because Sasuke is a force that needs to be stopped. And there isn't much time left since the story is obviously rushing to an end this year. Oh well.

Lorde
20th August 2014, 8:06 PM
I'm a little disappointed that Sakura didn't get a last-minute power up like the others (not counting the Byakugo seal), but at least she managed to finally take action in this fight.

Platinum fan.
20th August 2014, 8:19 PM
I'm a little disappointed that Sakura didn't get a last-minute power up like the others (not counting the Byakugo seal), but at least she managed to finally take action in this fight.

They gave her the forehead thing which magically made everyone put her on the same pedestal as Naruto and Sasuke. What more can you ask for? Unless they turned Inner Sakura into a powerup...which would have been a thousand times better then that terrible forehead crap. Whatever happened to Inner Sakura?

To Kamex, that might all be true but after years of buildup I wanted the Naruto vs Sasuke battle I was promised. When Sasuke turned "good" that pretty much ruined the massive threat they were turning him into. Which is the fight I was looking most forward to and now it's been taken from me and I am angry. I wanted to see Naruto beat down Sasuke at long last! That Uchiha has had it coming since 2008 and you mean to tell me it might not happen? I refuse to accept it. I demand the epic Naruto vs Sasuke battle that was getting built up. I demand it!

p96822
20th August 2014, 8:23 PM
Sakura doesn't need a power up she is strong as she is and I think that what Kishi is doing with her

Lorde
20th August 2014, 8:47 PM
They gave her the forehead thing which magically made everyone put her on the same pedestal as Naruto and Sasuke. What more can you ask for? Unless they turned Inner Sakura into a powerup...which would have been a thousand times better then that terrible forehead crap. Whatever happened to Inner Sakura

Well Kakashi got Susano'o with enhanced Kamui abilities that make him almost invincible while Sakura just has super strength and healing. Yawn. She deserved a ridiculous power up like everyone else imho.

Shneak
20th August 2014, 10:40 PM
It a Japaness refence to the rabbit of the moon.

Yeah but why? It seemed like she just started molting into a chakra creature and morphed out of it for no reason.

Nodame
20th August 2014, 11:59 PM
Hopefully Sakura contributes more in this battle in some way.

p96822
21st August 2014, 4:11 AM
Why do you guy want Sakura to get a power up. She is strong enough as it is so I don't think a power up is needed

X Drake
21st August 2014, 5:27 AM
Why do you guy want Sakura to get a power up. She is strong enough as it is so I don't think a power up is needed

She is not that strong for a main character,I don't think she is even in the top 30 strongest characters.

Nodame
21st August 2014, 2:21 PM
She is not that strong for a main character,I don't think she is even in the top 30 strongest characters.
She's already stronger than everybody in k11(except for Sasuke and Naruto of course) I would love to see a power up, but a good one, not an asspull.

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 2:52 PM
I'd still take Shikamaru, Shino, and Rock Lee over Sakura. And Hinata can still be just as deadly as any brute strength fighter being a Hyuga with Gentle Fist. The only thing Sakura has over anyone is her Tsunade regeneration, but in terms of being a actual shinobi/fighter? I hate to say this, but you could have put almost anyone in that Kaguya fight along with Naruto and Sasuke and they could have done that sneak attack from above just as well. However I don't want to rain on Sakura's parade so let's all just enjoy her moment of doing something really cool, and she got her participation credits for the fight, so she can get her legendary Sannin status. So cheers.

p96822
21st August 2014, 5:21 PM
I don't think that Shamaru, Shino, or Hinata has the strength to hit Kaguya has hard as Sakura did. The only charter I think the could equal that strenght is Rock Lee and the inter eight gates. Also Sakura has the abilty to heal herself from battle damage if she took any from the enemy. I'm not saying that Hinata is weak or that she is strong, but I saying that I don't she the gentle fist being able to send mulilple foes flying to there doom. Rock Lee is the only charter that could match team 7 in power and skill. And Sakura doesn't need any power up at all so stop wishing and be thankful that the writer give these powers in the first place.

Jb
21st August 2014, 6:05 PM
I'm pretty sure that Shikamaru could come up with a plan to match the power of team 7. He's done it plenty of times already. As for Sakura, nothing she's doing is really impressive. "Oh, i can hit hard" Ok, so can Lee, Guy, and Tsunade. That's the main thing, Naruto/Sasuke has surpassed their teachers buy a noticeable margin. Sakura is just doing stuff Tsunade has been doing since Part 1. Even Kakashi who's been irrelevant since Guy vs Madara is doing way more than Sakura.

She's simply unimpressive. I'm not going to be grateful that she gets powers that someone else had for the longest time.

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 6:07 PM
I don't think that Shamaru, Shino, or Hinata has the strength to hit Kaguya has hard as Sakura did. The only charter I think the could equal that strenght is Rock Lee and the inter eight gates. Also Sakura has the abilty to heal herself from battle damage if she took any from the enemy. I'm not saying that Hinata is weak or that she is strong, but I saying that I don't she the gentle fist being able to send mulilple foes flying to there doom. Rock Lee is the only charter that could match team 7 in power and skill. And Sakura doesn't need any power up at all so stop wishing and be thankful that the writer give these powers in the first place.

Who said they need super strength? They are ninjas. They could have just stabbed Kaguya in the head with a kunai knife while she was focused on trying to escape Naruto and Sasuke. The entire point I'm trying to make here is you could have put almost anyone in that spot with Naruto and Sasuke and they could have done the job as well. Sakura hitting Kaguya doesn't magically make her superior to everyone all of a sudden. Let's be real here. Also Choji has super strength as well. Probably as strong as Lee. He can grow in size. He could have done that surprise hit too.

I'm really not trying to take this away from Sakura. I'm glad she got to help defeat Kaguya, but let's not start going around saying this makes Sakura superior to the other Konoha 11.

X Drake
21st August 2014, 6:47 PM
I'd still take Shikamaru, Shino, and Rock Lee over Sakura. And Hinata can still be just as deadly as any brute strength fighter being a Hyuga with Gentle Fist. The only thing Sakura has over anyone is her Tsunade regeneration, but in terms of being a actual shinobi/fighter? I hate to say this, but you could have put almost anyone in that Kaguya fight along with Naruto and Sasuke and they could have done that sneak attack from above just as well. However I don't want to rain on Sakura's parade so let's all just enjoy her moment of doing something really cool, and she got her participation credits for the fight, so she can get her legendary Sannin status. So cheers.

Shikamaru and Shino would need prep to take down Sakura.Without it they won't be able to do much.Only Rock Lee(only because he can outspeed her by a lot) can defeat Sakura and he needs to go at least 7 gates or 8 gates to do that.Hinata is definitely not in the same league as Sakura if she has her Yin Seal and Summon with her,base Sakura had better stats(with the databook)than Hinata in Speed,Strength(this is not counting her chakra strength),Intelligence and Stamina.Just because someone has the gentle fist doesn't mean that they are very strong.


A normal Sneak attack wouldn't have done anything,you really think that a normal Kunai would be able to puncture Kaguya's Skull?Her durability is basically better than any of the previous villains and their durability is nothing to laugh at.

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 6:54 PM
Shikamaru and Shino would need prep to take down Sakura.Without it they won't be able to do much.Only Rock Lee(only because he can outspeed her by a lot) can defeat Sakura and he needs to go at least 7 gates or 8 gates to do that.Hinata is definitely not in the same league as Sakura if she has her Yin Seal and Summon with her,base Sakura had better stats(with the databook)than Hinata in Speed,Strength(this is not counting her chakra strength),Intelligence and Stamina.


A normal Sneak attack wouldn't have done anything,you really think that a normal Kunai would be able to puncture Kaguya's Skull?Her durability is basically better than any of the previous villains and their durability is nothing to laugh at.

It doesn't have to puncture her skull or even badly damage her. Kaguya already showed she can be caught off guard with even the most simple attacks. Remember Naruto's secret weapon justu that allowed him to score a regular hit off Kaguya? This is the same thing really. Again I'm not trying to take this away from Sakura, but this doesn't raise her level above everyone else.

X Drake
21st August 2014, 7:04 PM
It doesn't have to puncture her skull or even badly damage her. Kaguya already showed she can be caught off guard with even the most simple attacks. Remember Naruto's secret weapon justu that allowed him to score a regular hit off Kaguya? This is the same thing really. Again I'm not trying to take this away from Sakura, but this doesn't raise her level above everyone else.
She can get caught of guard,but that doesn't mean that the attacks would hurt her,for example a very small normal ant can catch me of guard and bite me but I won't feel a thing,but if something like a Bullet Ant or Black Bulldog Ant bites me than that would hurt a lot.You get what I'm saying.

Sure they would have landed the hit,but would it have hurt?Because if that was the problem than Madara and Obito(bought whose durability was lesser than Kaguya since they were basically the weaker version of her)should not have been that much trouble if something like a regular Kunai could hurt them that much.Because the Juubi tanked it's own Bijuudama and that was near country-continental level .


The Bolded,You mean the Shadow Clone thing?That works on everybody apparently.I wonder why Naruto never used a Hashirama version on Madara,it would have worked wonders

True it doesn't raise her much since we knew that she could do that since she got the seal,shewas already above the other members the moment she had the seal except for 7th gate Rock lee,and Shikamaru and Shino if they have prep.

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 7:14 PM
She can get caught of guard,but that doesn't mean that the attacks would hurt her,for example a very small normal ant can catch me of guard and bite me but I won't feel a thing,but if something like a Bullet Ant or Black Bulldog Ant bites me than that would hurt a lot.You get what I'm saying.

Sure they would have landed the hit,but would it have hurt?Because if that was the problem than Madara and Obito(bought whose durability was lesser than Kaguya since they were basically the weaker version of her)should not have been that much trouble if something like a regular Kunai could hurt them that much.Because the Juubi tanked it's own Bijuudama and that was near country-continental level .


The Bolded,You mean the Shadow Clone thing?That works on everybody apparently.I wonder why Naruto never used a Hashirama version on Madara,it would have worked wonders

True it doesn't raise her much since we knew that she could do that since she got the seal,shewas already above the other members the moment she had the seal except for 7th gate Rock lee,and Shikamaru and Shino if they have prep.

It was the reverse Harem jutsu. The only thing Sakura has over everyone is regeneration. Super strength is useless if she can't hit her target. You really think Sakura could land a blow on someone like Rock Lee, a Taijutsu specialist? Or Shino, who would fight at a distance with his bugs eating her chakra? Or Shikamaru and his shadow, not to mention one of Konoha's greatest minds, who could probably neutralize her with several different plans? I'm not saying Sakura is weak. But she's certainly not the 3rd strongest shinobi in Konoha like you guys are trying to make her out to be. She got her moment in the fight and that is outstanding. But I'm not going to just sit hear and say she's better then the other Konoha 11, when some of them have done more impressive feats then her. Just because her teammates are Naruto and Sasuke, Kishi had to boost her up even though it was done in a way that made Sasuke's powerups look legit.

Do we know if Kaguya was even hurt from Sakura's blow? Like really hurt like you're saying? Kaguya could still be fighting in the next chapter. If Sakura's blow somehow takes the fight out of Kaguya, then I'll agree with you.

Jb
21st August 2014, 7:22 PM
7th gate Rock lee,and Shikamaru and Shino if they have prep.

Sakura couldn't even keep up with Lee during the exams, he wouldn't even need unlock any gates to beat her. That's like saying she's as tough as Kisame

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 7:39 PM
Before this gets too out of hand, let me just say that I am glad Sakura had her moment to shine last chapter. Really, I am. I'm not trying to be little Sakura here, I'm glad she got to help. All I'm saying is her playing sidekick to Naruto and Sasuke doesn't elevate her beyond everyone else in Konoha. She's skilled in her own right but she's not the 3rd best Konoha shinobi that some are trying to make her out to be.

X Drake
21st August 2014, 7:39 PM
It was the reverse Harem jutsu. The only thing Sakura has over everyone is regeneration. Super strength is useless if she can't hit her target. You really think Sakura could land a blow on someone like Rock Lee, a Taijutsu specialist? Or Shino, who would fight at a distance with his bugs eating her chakra? Or Shikamaru and his shadow, not to mention one of Konoha's greatest minds, who could probably neutralize her with several different plans? I'm not saying Sakura is weak. But she's certainly not the 3rd strongest shinobi in Konoha like you guys are trying to make her out to be. She got her moment in the fight and that is outstanding. But I'm not going to just sit hear and say she's better then the other Konoha 11, when some of them have done more impressive feats then her. Just because her teammates are Naruto and Sasuke, Kishi had to boost her up even though it was done in a way that made Sasuke's powerups look legit.

Do we know if Kaguya was even hurt from Sakura's blow? Like really hurt like you're saying? Kaguya could still be fighting in the next chapter. If Sakura's blow somehow takes the fight out of Kaguya, then I'll agree with you.She can tank his basic attacks all day with the Seal,heck she got stabbed by the same thing that took away Minato's arm and she was fine,he needs to go into gates to defeat her.Plus she can destroy the ground to make him lose his footing,plus Summon with Acid can help.

Shikamaru's shadow attacks has shown to not work on people who can outpower him,and if they can outpower him he will have to struggle and use a lot of chakra to hold them in place.And you saw how fast Sakura moved when she fought the Juubi clones and how high she jumped?That's how fast she can get to the distance between either Shino and Shikamaru.

And like I said before,in a random meeting between Shino/Shikamaru and Sakura in which both Shino and Shikamaru has no time to prep,Sakura wins.Give Shikamaru and Shino time to prep and they win.


Sakura couldn't even keep up with Lee during the exams, he wouldn't even need unlock any gates to beat her. That's like saying she's as tough as Kisame

Sakura got a much bigger boost from her exam days compared to Lee.Even Sasuke and Naruto couldn't keep up with Lee and look what happen now,they can outspeed him easily.

Kisame was strong enough to fight a tail beast(4 tails at that) alone and win and was also doing damn well against Killer Bee in Version 2 mode,even Lee can't do that unless he goes 8 gates.I never said she was as tough as Kisame,unless you think that Lee can defeat Kisame with 7 gates because it took Gai 7 gates to defeat Kisame,and Lee is weaker than Gai.

Sakura has healed from attacks that stopped Edos from regrowing,she should be able to tank basic Lee's attacks easily until she runs out,he would need to go into gates to deal more permanent damage.

I'm guessing you think that Rock Lee in 1 gate can defeat Tsunade?

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 7:42 PM
Whatever. I'm done trying to argue this point. Sakura fans as just like Hinata ones. I'm dropping out of this one.

Jb
21st August 2014, 7:44 PM
I don't think time prep matters in this case. Sakura is a konoha shinobi, one Shikamaru and Shino are both familiar with. He probably already knows her strengths and weaknesses. Just like Asuma.

X Drake
21st August 2014, 7:49 PM
I don't think time prep matters in this case. Sakura is a konoha shinobi, one Shikamaru and Shino are both familiar with. He probably already knows her strengths and weaknesses. Just like Asuma.

.Have you been to the Naruto or any other fighting type manga forums/comic book forums and seen the Vs matches?That's what I'm getting at here.

Lorde
21st August 2014, 7:54 PM
I'd still take Shikamaru, Shino, and Rock Lee over Sakura.

I agree about Shikamaru, but I haven't liked Rock Lee since Part 1 and Shino has always lacked personality imo, so I could care less about him. He isn't even that strong of a ninja.

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 8:00 PM
I agree about Shikamaru, but I haven't liked Rock Lee since Part 1 and Shino has always lacked personality imo, so I could care less about him. He isn't even that strong of a ninja.

What does Shino's personality have to do with how good of a shinobi he is? Shino has always been viewed as one of the best among the Konoha 11. Rock Lee is the best taijutsu fighter among the group. If ever becomes as great as Might Guy, he'd be legendary. The Konoha 11's problems are they didn't get to battle much in part 2. Thankfully Team 10 got a glory spot in the war. But Kiba and Shino didn't. Hinata had her moment with Naruto. But If they got more powerful I'd consider Shikamaru, Shino, and Lee among the strongest. I would say Neji was the best behind Naruto and Sasuke...but he's dead now.

Lorde
21st August 2014, 8:08 PM
What does Shino's personality have to do with how good of a shinobi he is? Shino has always been viewed as one of the best among the Konoha 11.

And what big achievements does Shino have? Because him failing to trap Tobi in his insect sphere and failing to beat Konan during the invasion seem like negatives imo.

p96822
21st August 2014, 8:11 PM
I wouldn't call shakamu the strongest but the smartest in the konaha 11 or 10 because Neji is now dead

Platinum fan.
21st August 2014, 8:19 PM
And what big achievements does Shino have? Because him failing to trap Tobi in his insect sphere and failing to beat Konan during the invasion seem like negatives imo.

Shino only has one of the coolest abilities in Konoha. Failing to trap Tobi and failing to beat Konan hasn't seem to hurt him. The Konan fight happened off screen so who knows how that fight went, unless you watch the anime. I bet they made a filler out of it. And failing to trap Tobi, well you didn't really think the good guys were going to catch the guy they were presenting as the big bad back then, right? Shino is still really well praised among the fanbase and in the Naruto universe the teams usually think highly of him. I can see Shino being one of the top Jonin elite in the future where Naruto is Hokage.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
22nd August 2014, 3:04 AM
I would dissect every last Sakura post, but I honestly don't think it's worth it anymore...

I bet they made a filler out of it.
There was nothing made.

teams usually think highly of him.
What teams think highly of Shino? Shino's underrated in the series and is hardly spoken of. The only team I've seen praise him was his own and Shikamaru if I remember correctly.

Platinum fan.
22nd August 2014, 3:20 AM
Anyone who watched Shino's matches were always impressed by him...or grossed out. Even Neji and Lee were taking note on Shino's bug jutsu during the Chunin Exam. Naruto was bummed that Shino wouldn't be able to join them to hunt Sasuke, because he considered him one of the more reliable bunch of the Konoha 11. Shino's only underrated in that kishi rarely uses him. Which is too bad. I found his battle with Kankuro one of the most original shinobi battles of part 1. That fight is highly underrated, but it was a fight you'd never seen before in Naruto. A lot of the Konoha Gennin had good fights in part 1. The Sound 4 battles were some of the most thrilling battles in the series.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
22nd August 2014, 3:34 AM
Anyone who watched Shino's matches were always impressed by him...or grossed out. Even Neji and Lee were taking note on Shino's bug jutsu during the Chunin Exam. Naruto was bummed that Shino wouldn't be able to join them to hunt Sasuke, because he considered him one of the more reliable bunch of the Konoha 11. Shino's only underrated in that kishi rarely uses him. Which is too bad. I found his battle with Kankuro one of the most original shinobi battles of part 1. That fight is highly underrated, but it was a fight you'd never seen before in Naruto. A lot of the Konoha Gennin had good fights in part 1. The Sound 4 battles were some of the most thrilling battles in the series.
And that is the reason why, it took place in Part 1. Not everyone remembers the events in Part 1, Shino could be an awesome asset, but like you said, Kishimoto rarely uses him just like Tenten who's considered his favorite of the four girls.

Lorde
22nd August 2014, 3:38 AM
Shino only had two fights in Part 1 anyway didn't he? Against Zaku and Kankuro, the latter of which was basically a draw since he fainted from Kankuro's puppet's poison gas after Kankuro lost. So even during the series' prime, he was barely glorified. :x

Platinum fan.
22nd August 2014, 3:43 AM
Shino only had two fights in Part 1 anyway didn't he? Against Zaku and Kankuro, the latter of which was basically a draw since he fainted from Kankuro's puppet's poison gas after Kankuro lost. So even during the series' prime, he was barely glorified. :x

I never said Shino was glorified. I said he's considered one of the best from the Konoha 11 both by the fanbase and from the Naruto universe. If Shino isn't one then who is, besides Naruto and Sasuke?

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
22nd August 2014, 4:08 AM
I never said Shino was glorified. I said he's considered one of the best from the Konoha 11 both by the fanbase and from the Naruto universe. If Shino isn't one then who is, besides Naruto and Sasuke?

The best? None of us can say there is a best excluding Naruto and Sasuke because we'll most likely I can't stress that enough be relaying on our opinions with someone ready to disagree when they feel as if someone should/shouldn't be a higher or lower ranking. All of them were praised, but it's best to just go by the stats Kishimoto had wrote in the databooks.

Platinum fan.
22nd August 2014, 4:22 AM
The best? None of us can say there is a best excluding Naruto and Sasuke because we'll most likely I can't stress that enough be relaying on our opinions with someone ready to disagree when they feel as if someone should/shouldn't be a higher or lower ranking. All of them were praised, but it's best to just go by the stats Kishimoto had wrote in the databooks.

While it's true you can't really say who's the best, you can say which ones have done the most impressive feats for people to say that this guy or girl is a good ninja. At one point or another all the Gennin did something good, minus like Tenten, who had a moment of glory off panel...there is no greater disrespect then that. I'm not trying to sit here and say Shino is the next Hokage or anything. Only that he's been viewed as a strong shinobi whenever he's used.

Jb
22nd August 2014, 5:16 AM
what date the last databook even published

Lorde
22nd August 2014, 5:21 AM
what date the last databook even published

The last one was released in September 2008 iirc.

Red and Blue
22nd August 2014, 6:05 AM
I'm curious what exaclty is the "Start of the new era project" that will begin with the upcoming Naruto movie. If it's not part three, then I wonder what else the project could be?

Void Ventus
22nd August 2014, 8:14 AM
I'm curious what exaclty is the "Start of the new era project" that will begin with the upcoming Naruto movie. If it's not part three, then I wonder what else the project could be?

Naruto GT.

Re-watched the Hidan and Kakazu arc earlier today. The feels still got me good. Doesn't help that "Closer" and "Long Kiss Goodbye" are so fitting. Just hits you like a truck when you know what's going to Asuma, and Kurenai will be left a widow. When Shikamaru does the final blow to Hidan, that was such an awesome character development. Everything about this whole arc was perfect. Well, the manga was better, but the anime portrayal wasn't that bad. Kakashi and Yamato teaching Naruto Rasen Shuriken, character development for one of the best Konoha 11, and you even cared for Asuma and Kurenai, even if they were side characters. When the manga/anime actually focuses on trying to create character development, that's what the story gets so good, IMO, and why I've been following the series for over a decade now.

Platinum fan.
22nd August 2014, 3:16 PM
Naruto GT.

Re-watched the Hidan and Kakazu arc earlier today. The feels still got me good. Doesn't help that "Closer" and "Long Kiss Goodbye" are so fitting. Just hits you like a truck when you know what's going to Asuma, and Kurenai will be left a widow. When Shikamaru does the final blow to Hidan, that was such an awesome character development. Everything about this whole arc was perfect. Well, the manga was better, but the anime portrayal wasn't that bad. Kakashi and Yamato teaching Naruto Rasen Shuriken, character development for one of the best Konoha 11, and you even cared for Asuma and Kurenai, even if they were side characters. When the manga/anime actually focuses on trying to create character development, that's what the story gets so good, IMO, and why I've been following the series for over a decade now.

It's a funny thing about that arc. I didn't care much for Asuma, still kinda don't but it was sad that Kurenai lost her husband and the father of their child. That's pretty sad. I'm glad Shikamaru got to avenge him. If anyone ever doubted Shikamaru as one of Konoha's best just remember this. He beat Hidan, a Akatsuki member, all by himself. Not many besides Naruto and Sasuke can say they've done that. I'm glad Shikamaru had his awesome moment in the series. It showed he came a really long way from that lazy bum from the Chunnin Exams. I always wished Choji and Ino got to help, because they were really starting to become irrelevant to Team 10. But the thing about the Hidan/Kakazu arc, it had little sequel during the war arc. And this is one of the few times I'll praise the war arc. Team 10 vs Asuma is without a doubt one of the best things to come out of the war. We got to see Choji and Ino growth as shinobi. And I never expected Ino Yamanaka to be anything more then a lame Sasuke groupie. I had a slice of humble pie seeing the things Ino did in this war. Choji as well. Team 10 imo got one of best deals among the Konoha 11, minus Naruto creating Narutoism.

Kamex
22nd August 2014, 5:53 PM
While it's true you can't really say who's the best, you can say which ones have done the most impressive feats for people to say that this guy or girl is a good ninja.
Actually, I think that's the main reason why it's hard to give Shino credit; he's done very little in the series to outshine the rest of the Genin 12, regardless of what they may have said/thought about him during his few battles.


Naruto GT.
That's essentially a Part III.

Lorde
22nd August 2014, 8:51 PM
Actually, I think that's the main reason why it's hard to give Shino credit; he's done very little in the series to outshine the rest of the Genin 12, regardless of what they may have said/thought about him during his few battles.

Agreed. His lack of screen-time and fights in general make any hype he's received from other characters during the series seem insignificant imo. :x

Kamex
23rd August 2014, 6:54 AM
Here's a random question: Aesthetically speaking, which character(s) do you think has the most interesting or likable design?

I actually think character designs are one of Masashi Kishimoto's strong points. Well, I guess some would say he isn't great at drawing girls per se, but still. I think the guy who came up with the idea/design of the Sharingan, Kage outfits, symbolic piercings of Nagato's Six Paths of Pain, simple yet somehow badass-looking Itachi Uchiha, etc. is pretty good at character designs.

One of my personal favorites (if not best, pretty close) is Madara Uchiha. Whatever you might say about the character himself, I always thought as the infamous leader/traitor of the Uchiha clan, he definitely looked the part. Everything from his armor to his gloves to his under-eye bags to his Sharingan to - especially - his trademark hair.

Weird, I sound like a fangirl haha (I'm a guy though).

Platinum fan.
23rd August 2014, 5:58 PM
Favorite designs? Not a bad question. I have a bunch of characters who's designs I like. The funny thing is, not all of them are important characters at all, but their designs somtimes stick out to me more then major characters.

Among the males in no order.
Zabuza: His design is forever in my memory no matter how old a character he is.
Haku: Same as Zabuza. Though I still think Haku is secretly a girl :P
Pain: Those eyes and piercings are hard to forget and it really gives off the intimidating look he's trying to be presented as.
Shino: Truly a mystery character and both his designs in part 1 and 2 reflect it.
Kankuro: Might be a minor character but I love his design when he first appeared.
Dosu and Zaku: Like Zabuza, I will always remember their looks.
Madara: Same reasons you said.
Fakedara/Tobi: Same reasons for Shino. A true mystery.
Sasori: Really cool designed with his puppets.

Among the girls in no order.
Rin Nohara: Might be a overall forgettable plot device but I love her design. It stands out for me more then any other female in Naruto for some reason.
Tenten: Pretty much the same as Rin. Does nothing but her design is memorable.
Konan: Has that rare brooding look on females that most Naruto girls don't have.
Sakura: Pink hair. She stands out among a crowd.
Ino: I like her look in part 2 much better. She looked like a veteran shinobi.
Shizune: Yeah...I don't know why I love her design so much. I just do.

I have a lot more designs I love, but these ones pop up into my head first.
Edit: I'll also add Kin from Team Dosu. Her design is also good in color scheme.

-Raiga-
23rd August 2014, 7:03 PM
Kishimoto has got to be one of the most underrated character designers in history. I feel one of his biggest upsides is his ability to make memorable themes for groups of ninja's/people. For instance, the headband with the village marking, something you never really saw in depictions of ninja's pre-naruto. Same with the akatsuki cloak, it makes no sense to have a coat with red clouds, but he makes it work.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
23rd August 2014, 7:55 PM
Little things get my attention, I love Tsunade's heels, Sakura's boots, Hinata's and Kakashi's sandals. I prefer Ino's design the most of anyone in Konoha, blondes are awesome and Kamex pretty much feels the same way I do about Madara. He has the best design of all the Uchiha in my opinion.

Lorde
23rd August 2014, 8:28 PM
When are the Hokage gonna arrive? They were shown chatting a while ago and talking about reviving Madara, but with Team 7 holding their own against Kaguya, are the Hokage even needed?

Void Ventus
24th August 2014, 4:06 AM
Same with the akatsuki cloak, it makes no sense to have a coat with red clouds, but he makes it work.

If you think about it, it kinda does. Akatsuki when translated to English is Red Dawn. I don't remember if they did explain why they are called that, but typically a Dawn means the beginning of light in the morning. However it also means like the development or the rise of something greater. Like when people say "Dawn of a New Age" or "Dawn of an Empire". Red could mean love or anger or aggression (Itachi joined Akatsuki to protect his beloved little brother, Obito was a member because he hated Kakashi for letting Rin die, Kisame just wanted to kill people, etc), which is what the members of Akatsuki are all about. The black cloak and red clouds could mean the night when Obito attacked Konoha and unleashed Kurama on them, taking the life of both Minato and Kushina, Hiruzen's wife, Iruka's parents, and many others. The Madara vs Hashirama fight also started at night, and led to Madara's death. Or even the black doesn't matter. The red clouds could just mean a bloody day is coming, and someone will most likely die.

Kamex
24th August 2014, 7:34 AM
I also like Naruto's Sage Mode design. Jiraiya looked strange yet powerful, but Naruto mastering it made his eyes look cooler than I could have imagined myself.


If you think about it, it kinda does. Akatsuki when translated to English is Red Dawn. I don't remember if they did explain why they are called that, but typically a Dawn means the beginning of light in the morning. However it also means like the development or the rise of something greater. Like when people say "Dawn of a New Age" or "Dawn of an Empire". Red could mean love or anger or aggression (Itachi joined Akatsuki to protect his beloved little brother, Obito was a member because he hated Kakashi for letting Rin die, Kisame just wanted to kill people, etc), which is what the members of Akatsuki are all about. The black cloak and red clouds could mean the night when Obito attacked Konoha and unleashed Kurama on them, taking the life of both Minato and Kushina, Hiruzen's wife, Iruka's parents, and many others. The Madara vs Hashirama fight also started at night, and led to Madara's death. Or even the black doesn't matter. The red clouds could just mean a bloody day is coming, and someone will most likely die.
-Raiga- might have just been suggesting that it red clouds don't sound like they would look appealing on a black cloud even though they do in this case. But to add to what you said, before her death Konan told Obito that the red clouds "are a symbol of the wars that rained blood down on the Hidden Rain village." Although that could have been added much later, so I don't know if it was Kishi's original reason. But it makes sense because the original Akatsuki were fighting for "the rise of something greater," like you said.

TsukiMirage
24th August 2014, 11:59 PM
I find it hilarious that Sakura was shoehorned into the final conflict.And how exactly did Obito get the Rikudou Sennin's chakra? The set-up made no sense, but honestly, it this is the end of Kaguya and this arc, I'll take it. Would be kind of sad if Kakashi's words were suppose to imply he's dying.


Anyway, I'm done with this debate. I have nothing more to add beyond what I've already stated. Sasuke planned to kill everyone in the village. That's not my opinion, it's a FACT. It was proven several times in the manga by Sasuke himself and that makes him a villain for that time. Not a anti-hero, a straight up villain. If you don't want to believe that then just read the volumes. They finish my arguments for me, because you're pretty much arguing against what the volumes set up. So I'm done. I have nothing new to add because I'll just be saying the same thing over and over again. Except the whole reason for this debate was that the first time wasn't proven anything more then him just telling Obito what he wanted to hear: Sasuke didn't like Obito, and wanted little to do with him beyond what he could gain. Sasuke also had a history of lying to villains he partnered with. More importantly, Sasuke had no reason to lie to Team Taka. The entire fight with Kirabi was to show that Sasuke did actually care for his teammates at that point in time. And not only would they not have cared about him killing innocent people (heck, they wouldn't have had any problem joining in), but they would have listened to him had he told them not to interfere, as they had already proven in the past. Throw in the fact that every chance he got, he choose to do something else instead of going after the village, and it's clear he was just feeding Obito a line in order to get what he could out of him.


Now to everyone on Sakura vs Hinata. How did we get to this point? Now we're arguing who was more clinging to Naruto or Sasuke. They both are. The difference is Hinata did not start off as so Naruto centric as she is now. In part 1 Hinata actually had a life and Naruto just inspired her to be better at it and this is where the crush came in. Somewhere along the lines in part 2, Hinata simply became a Naruto groupie and whatever story she had beyond that was lost in her popularity and shipping. Hinata's the most popular female in the Naruto series so I'm not surprised it bit her in the butt in the end. To everyone who says all she ever thinks about is Naruto...well yeah. I have to agree with that. The only thing I'll argue is she wasn't always like that. Popularity and her shipping did her in. Pretty sure Hinata was always treated as a Naruto fan-girl. The only difference was that Hinata had more going on then just that, unlike Sakura who's sole focus was her crush.

Nodame
25th August 2014, 1:10 AM
.....

Speaking of designs. I like Sakura, Hinata and Konan's designs the best among the girls.

-Sakura: She has the prettiest face imo. With her big gorgeous emerald eyes and her pink hair. She gets more and more beautiful..
-Konan: Her eyes are very pretty. I like her overall design a lot.
-Hinata: I like her design as well. She has such as an angelic, cute face. She is unique.

As for boys: Sasuke, Hidan, Diedara, Sasori.

Lorde
25th August 2014, 1:23 AM
I didn't like Hidan's design because of how oddly Kishi drew his chest/torso several times, but Deidara's design slayed (minus his limbs after they got sown back on).

Platinum fan.
25th August 2014, 1:26 AM
I also like Naruto's Sage Mode design. Jiraiya looked strange yet powerful, but Naruto mastering it made his eyes look cooler than I could have imagined myself.


-Raiga- might have just been suggesting that it red clouds don't sound like they would look appealing on a black cloud even though they do in this case. But to add to what you said, before her death Konan told Obito that the red clouds "are a symbol of the wars that rained blood down on the Hidden Rain village." Although that could have been added much later, so I don't know if it was Kishi's original reason. But it makes sense because the original Akatsuki were fighting for "the rise of something greater," like you said.

I forgot Naruto's Sage Mode design! It's very cool. The red and black robes made him look like a legendary shinobi to watch out for. I think that is my favorite Naruto design.

Other designs I can add.
Of the males.
Kimimaro: I have always liked his design. Like Shino, pretty mysterious. But to be honest I wasn't crazy about his transformed state. But regular Kimimaro had a cool design.
Sakon and Ukon: I'm probably going to name all the sound 4. But unlike Kimimaro, I really like his transformed look.
Kidomaru: Unique design with his many arms. I think he has my favorite transformed state design wise.
The 2nd Mizukage: I love this troll Mizukage's design and his expressions. I think he was one of my all time favorite dead Kages both in personality and design. I wish more characters had expressions like the 2nd Mizukage.
A/Raikage: What can I say about A? His design really shows him as the powerhouse Kishi wrote him as.

Of the females.
Tayuya: Same as the other Sound 4. Cool design. But like Kimimaro and unlike Sakon/Ukon and Kidomaru, I didn't like her transformed look very much.
Kurenai: Love her eyes. Kurenai's eyes have got to be the...third best eyes among the girls. Behind Sakura and Rin. Sakura's eyes are still top notch.

I also really love the Konoha 11 in their war gear. While you all know my beef with the war arc itself, Sakura, Shikamaru, Kiba, Shino, Hinata, Choji, Ino, Tenten, Lee, and Neji looked truly amazing in their war outfits. They truly looked like the future of Konoha, defending their village from the bad guys. I love their outfits. I wanted to see Naruto wear one just once, but he's got his Sage Robes. And there are still more designs I like. I'll save them for my next post :P

Void Ventus
25th August 2014, 11:13 AM
^ loving their outfits would just mean you love the war outfits, since everyone, except Naruto, Sasuke, and the enemy are wearing the same exact outfit. Like, no difference at all. Not even different colors.

Anyways, I like RTN Hinata. She's the exact opposite of canon Hinata. She's wearing lipstick and makeup, she's feisty and approaches Naruto like he's hers, wearing short shorts, zipping down her jacket, and just showing off to everyone her stomach and fishnet bra. I still like shy Hinata more though. Tobirama Senju is also great. I've always liked characters with jackets that have the fur by the neck. He specializes in Suiton, so it makes sense for him too. If only he didn't die young, he could have created so many more jutsus and might have even perfected Edo Tensei and Space-Time jutsus. And wouldn't want to leave out the Akatsuki cloak. So simple, yet so effective.

Platinum fan.
25th August 2014, 2:20 PM
^ loving their outfits would just mean you love the war outfits, since everyone, except Naruto, Sasuke, and the enemy are wearing the same exact outfit. Like, no difference at all. Not even different colors.

Anyways, I like RTN Hinata. She's the exact opposite of canon Hinata. She's wearing lipstick and makeup, she's feisty and approaches Naruto like he's hers, wearing short shorts, zipping down her jacket, and just showing off to everyone her stomach and fishnet bra. I still like shy Hinata more though. Tobirama Senju is also great. I've always liked characters with jackets that have the fur by the neck. He specializes in Suiton, so it makes sense for him too. If only he didn't die young, he could have created so many more jutsus and might have even perfected Edo Tensei and Space-Time jutsus. And wouldn't want to leave out the Akatsuki cloak. So simple, yet so effective.

I do like the war outfits. I just stated the reasons why I liked them. It's not one of my favorite designs but I liked seeing the Konoha 11 get to wear them.

Lorde
25th August 2014, 8:01 PM
I can't wait for the war to finally be over so that everyone gets their original village headbands back; I seriously dislike the alliance ones.

nuzamaki90
25th August 2014, 11:40 PM
I can't wait for the war to finally be over so that everyone gets their original village headbands back; I seriously dislike the alliance ones.

I can't wait to see more The Last redesigns even though I'm still not too keen on Naruto's hair

Platinum fan.
26th August 2014, 6:40 AM
I can't wait for the war to finally be over so that everyone gets their original village headbands back; I seriously dislike the alliance ones.

What's wrong with the alliance ones? I don't think they are anything special, but they aren't terrible either. I just want the war arc over in general. I think the bad moments of this war arc totally outshine the good. I cannot pick what was truly the worst aspect of this war. It must have been Sasuke announcing he wants to become Hokage. One of the biggest fail moments of the series.

Nodame
26th August 2014, 5:31 PM
I cannot pick what was truly the worst aspect of this war. It must have been Sasuke announcing he wants to become Hokage. One of the biggest fail moments of the series.

Is it weird that I actually don't mind Sasuke's new goal? That way, Naruto and Sasuke would be actual rivals and both compete even more which would make for interesting character development imo. Many people are saying that Sasuke becoming hokage is absurd. I felt that way before, but I changed my mind. It could have said the same about Gaara in part 1. This is the same exact type of change Sasuke is going through, and as we have seen Gaara's case, it is not impossible. Compared to Gaara, Sasuke's crimes are child's play.

Lorde
26th August 2014, 9:08 PM
What's wrong with the alliance ones?

They're all the same. I would've preferred seeing each of the five main villages keep their original headbands during the war for variety's sake despite their alliance.

Platinum fan.
26th August 2014, 9:17 PM
Is it weird that I actually don't mind Sasuke's new goal? That way, Naruto and Sasuke would be actual rivals and both compete even more which would make for interesting character development imo. Many people are saying that Sasuke becoming hokage is absurd. I felt that way before, but I changed my mind. It could have said the same about Gaara in part 1. This is the same exact type of change Sasuke is going through, and as we have seen Gaara's case, it is not impossible. Compared to Gaara, Sasuke's crimes are child's play.

Gaara's crimes? All the people Gaara killed were ninjas that attacked him first. The only real person Gaara seemed out to kill and actually tried to carry out that death sentence is Rock Lee in the hospital. Sasuke and Gaara's situations are different as it took Gaara actual time to change, where is Sasuke, being the tool that he is, is changed instantly. This was at a time when Sasuke was plotting the deaths of everyone in Konoha starting with Naruto and Team 7, the only three people that put up with his crap. I'm not going to say Sasuke's a bad leader. I think he's a decent leader. I'm not going to say great because like Danzo, apparently he'll kill his teammates or leave them for dead. Just ask Team Baka.

Naruto and Sasuke being rivals for the Hokage seat is beyond forced and doesn't even have half the tension that Sasuke wanting to kill Konoha had. Kishi really screwed up Sasuke's story. It's a mess now.

Now that I think about it, I wonder how many people Gaara killed that we don't know about offscreen?
Edit: And another thing if we're going to compare Sasuke and Gaara. Gaara tried and eventually did become more friendly of a character. Sasuke is still a ***

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
26th August 2014, 9:52 PM
Gaara's crimes? All the people Gaara killed were ninjas that attacked him first. The only real person Gaara seemed out to kill and actually tried to carry out that death sentence is Rock Lee in the hospital.

Not entirely true, during the Chunin Exams in the Forest of Death, Gaara killed three ninja from the Rain village. Gaara went to them.

Lorde
26th August 2014, 10:14 PM
I don't particularly like Gaara anymore, mostly because his bloodthirsty side in Part 1 was more enjoyable in my opinion and his 180 after the Chunin Exam arc felt a bit forced; he went from a psychopath to basically a harmless kitten in my view. :x

Red and Blue
26th August 2014, 10:29 PM
I don't particularly like Gaara anymore, mostly because his bloodthirsty side in Part 1 was more enjoyable in my opinion and his 180 after the Chunin Exam arc felt a bit forced; he went from a psychopath to basically a harmless kitten in my view. :x

Harmless kitten? While yes Gaara did loose his psychotic side after the Chuunin Exam arc, he didn't suddenly become a harmless kitten. He was still ruthless in battle as shown in the fights against Kimimaro and Deidara.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 1:01 AM
Not entirely true, during the Chunin Exams in the Forest of Death, Gaara killed three ninja from the Rain village. Gaara went to them.

We don't know who ran into who first. Gaara, Temari, and Kankuro were already shown having met them when we got the scene. So it's impossible to determine who was after who. And the rain ninjas attacked first. Gaara defended and then killed them. I'm not defending Gaara here, because he could have let them live but he rarely let people survive back then. So the rain ninjas still provoked their deaths by attacking first. To be fair Gaara might have killed them regardless, but they still attacked first.

LOL, Lorde, who do you like? You don't seem to like anyone in Naruto anymore.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 1:13 AM
We don't know who ran into who first. Gaara, Temari, and Kankuro were already shown having met them when we got the scene. So it's impossible to determine who was after who. And the rain ninjas attacked first. Gaara defended and then killed them. I'm not defending Gaara here, because he could have let them live but he rarely let people survive back then. So the rain ninjas still provoked their deaths by attacking first. To be fair Gaara might have killed them regardless, but they still attacked first.

LOL, Lorde, who do you like? You don't seem to like anyone in Naruto anymore.
http://i16.mangapanda.com/naruto/58/naruto-1269.jpgGaara went to them. It is true that Gaara defended himself, but he killed the other two just because he wanted to. They asked to be spared, regardless Gaara would have killed them, he said "Those who meet my eyes. All must die"

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 1:19 AM
http://i16.mangapanda.com/naruto/58/naruto-1269.jpgGaara went to them. It is true that Gaara defended himself, but he killed the other two just because he wanted to. They asked to be spared, regardless Gaara would have killed them, he said "Those who meet my eyes. All must die"

There's another line in there where it Gaara says "Anyone who crosses me is dead meat." Which implies the two teams just ran into each other. So we still don't fully know if Gaara's team was after them. Especially since Kankuro and Temari were against fighting without a profit. I will agree with you that he killed the other two without a second thought for simply being there.

Lorde
27th August 2014, 1:25 AM
LOL, Lorde, who do you like? You don't seem to like anyone in Naruto anymore.

I like Tsunade despite her unpopularity as Hokage, Kurotsuchi even though I lost track of her a while back, and Orochimaru because he was actually a good villain during Part 1 and is one of the few villains who isn't completely redeemed yet.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 1:28 AM
I like Tsunade despite her unpopularity as Hokage, Kurotsuchi even though I lost track of her a while back, and Orochimaru because he was actually a good villain during Part 1 and is one of the few villains who isn't completely redeemed yet.

This might sound stupid, but who is Kurotsuchi?

Lorde
27th August 2014, 1:30 AM
This might sound stupid, but who is Kurotsuchi?

She was one of Onoki's bodyguards. (http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kurotsuchi)

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 1:35 AM
She was one of Onoki's bodyguards. (http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kurotsuchi)

Hmm! I didn't even know she had a name! I shall try and remember it. She had such few moments in the Naruto series. By the way, if Orochimaru sticks around long enough they might try and redeem the character. Right now I think he and Team Baka are all irrelevant and better off dead...minus Suigetsu. He's still got a purpose unlike Karin and Jugo. The fangirl and the sheep.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 2:58 AM
The fangirl and the sheep kept Sasuke alive. Killing off a character would be pointless, giving them a sendoff where they walk off happily towards the sunset would be much more desirable than an unnecessary death. Though that is just my opinion.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 4:22 AM
They add nothing now. Karen basically loves Sasuke even when he tries to murder her in cold blood. Not healthy at all. And Jugo is and always has been a mindless sheep who can't think for himself and has angry burst of randomness that wasn't interesting at all. Suigetsu and his swordsman quest was the only good thing to come out of Team Baka, and it's largely ignored anyway. Karen had potential to do something after Sasuke betrayed her, but no. She's right back into Sasuke groupie mode, making it worse then Sakura's, and that one wasn't exactly brimming with positivity either.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 4:39 AM
They add nothing now. Karen basically loves Sasuke even when he tries to murder her in cold blood. Not healthy at all. And Jugo is and always has been a mindless sheep who can't think for himself and has angry burst of randomness that wasn't interesting at all. Suigetsu and his swordsman quest was the only good thing to come out of Team Baka, and it's largely ignored anyway. Karen had potential to do something after Sasuke betrayed her, but no. She's right back into Sasuke groupie mode, making it worse then Sakura's, and that one wasn't exactly brimming with positivity either.

And Naruto's no different than Karin? Jugo can in fact think for himself, he made the decision to follow Sasuke because of Kimimaro and to keep him in check, he's not to blame since Kimimaro was his only friend after he tried to lock himself away from the world. Though it's your opinion whether you find it interesting or not, I found his urges fascinating due to him being able to pose a danger to Taka even though he is an ally. What exactly would Karin have done if she didn't go back to Sasuke? The hideout she looked after is now empty, and she seems quite fine standing by Sasuke's side like the other two. Sakura as a Sasuke 'groupie'? Part 1 or 2?

Akashin
27th August 2014, 5:48 AM
And Naruto's no different than Karin? Jugo can in fact think for himself, he made the decision to follow Sasuke because of Kimimaro and to keep him in check, he's not to blame since Kimimaro was his only friend after he tried to lock himself away from the world. Though it's your opinion whether you find it interesting or not, I found his urges fascinating due to him being able to pose a danger to Taka even though he is an ally. What exactly would Karin have done if she didn't go back to Sasuke? The hideout she looked after is now empty, and she seems quite fine standing by Sasuke's side like the other two. Sakura as a Sasuke 'groupie'? Part 1 or 2?

My problem with Karin going back to Sasuke is that she actually did completely give up on him at the Summit, and for a time it seemed like Kishimoto had other plans for her in Konoha. That went nowhere, of course.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 5:53 AM
And Naruto's no different than Karin? Jugo can in fact think for himself, he made the decision to follow Sasuke because of Kimimaro and to keep him in check, he's not to blame since Kimimaro was his only friend after he tried to lock himself away from the world. Though it's your opinion whether you find it interesting or not, I found his urges fascinating due to him being able to pose a danger to Taka even though he is an ally. What exactly would Karin have done if she didn't go back to Sasuke? The hideout she looked after is now empty, and she seems quite fine standing by Sasuke's side like the other two. Sakura as a Sasuke 'groupie'? Part 1 or 2?

Jugo's rage burst happen like two times and they were boring. It felt like a very poorly done Gaara when he's in bloodlust mode to kill someone. Jugo is just a boring sheep of a character with no personality. With Karin being a Uzumaki, they could have had her be the one to expand on the Uzumaki background. Actually make a reason why they made Karin a Uzumaki. And instead of giving Naruto sensing powers through powerups, maybe they could have had Karin try and teach Naruto some Uzumaki chakra sensing abilities, since she can do it without Kyuubi. They certainly made sure Karin took note on how Naruto's chakra was different then Sasuke's. Have Karin play a role in Naruto vs Sasuke. There were things Karin could have done instead of crawling back to Sasuke, basically saying she'll be in a abusive relationship. Karin is a waste of a character that should have amounted to something. Now she's just there and I cringe everytime I see her cry over the man that almost killed her without a second thought. It's disgusting.

Void Ventus
27th August 2014, 9:50 AM
IIRC Kurotsuchi was initially mistaken as boy when she first appeared in the manga.

Orochimaru is still a mystery. Is he still waiting for Sasuke to reach his full potential? He does have half of the SO6P's powers and the Rinnegan now, so he might go all crazy when Infinite Tsukiyomi is lifted. Kaguya really should be the last enemy left, and then a private fight between Naruto and Sasuke. Is Oro going to reform, or be the menace once again? They're already fighting God, so it's better to just leave it at that.

^Platinum fan
Jugo is shy and calm when in his normal form. However, he will transform should he or his friends be at risk. If he fully transforms, he'll turn extremely violent and not be able to control himself. And Tuskie explained that it's because of Kimimaro that Jugo still follows Sasuke around. He actually has a reason for doing it, thus he is not a mindless sheep.

As for Karin, expand on the Uzumaki background? Their village was destroyed sometime after Kushina moved to Konoha, meaning the Uzumaki clan were long dispersed before Naruto and Kushina were even born. She probably knows just a bit more than Naruto does, which isn't all that much. Even Nagato didn't have much to share with regarding the village. Heck, Naruto didn't even know Nagato was an Uzumaki. Also, have Naruto and Karin even met properly? Talked to each other? Maybe when IT is finally lifted, there will be a scene where they meet eye-to-eye, and Karin tells him that they are similar, and even get to know each other's names. But as for now and then, there really was and still is no way to establish a relationship since they haven't even been in the same manga panel together yet. And for the going back to Sasuke thing, remember that we don't know if her parents are still alive, meaning she most likely doesn't have a single relative livig right now (well, except for Naruto, but they don't know each other). In Part 1, Naruto did his best to make friends. Even if he was getting bullied, he still did his best just so he can have a "family". Maybe this is Karin's version. She doesn't care that Sasuke left her fatally wounded. She's still madly in love with him, and she might make a family with him to restore the Uzumaki clan (like Sasuke's goal of restoring the Uchiha clan).

Akashin
27th August 2014, 1:47 PM
As for Karin, expand on the Uzumaki background? Their village was destroyed sometime after Kushina moved to Konoha, meaning the Uzumaki clan were long dispersed before Naruto and Kushina were even born. She probably knows just a bit more than Naruto does, which isn't all that much. Even Nagato didn't have much to share with regarding the village. Heck, Naruto didn't even know Nagato was an Uzumaki. Also, have Naruto and Karin even met properly? Talked to each other? Maybe when IT is finally lifted, there will be a scene where they meet eye-to-eye, and Karin tells him that they are similar, and even get to know each other's names. But as for now and then, there really was and still is no way to establish a relationship since they haven't even been in the same manga panel together yet. And for the going back to Sasuke thing, remember that we don't know if her parents are still alive, meaning she most likely doesn't have a single relative livig right now (well, except for Naruto, but they don't know each other). In Part 1, Naruto did his best to make friends. Even if he was getting bullied, he still did his best just so he can have a "family". Maybe this is Karin's version. She doesn't care that Sasuke left her fatally wounded. She's still madly in love with him, and she might make a family with him to restore the Uzumaki clan (like Sasuke's goal of restoring the Uchiha clan).

They were together while en route back to Konoha after the Summit, for the record. They didn't say a word directly to each other though, if I recall.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 2:45 PM
IIRC Kurotsuchi was initially mistaken as boy when she first appeared in the manga.

Orochimaru is still a mystery. Is he still waiting for Sasuke to reach his full potential? He does have half of the SO6P's powers and the Rinnegan now, so he might go all crazy when Infinite Tsukiyomi is lifted. Kaguya really should be the last enemy left, and then a private fight between Naruto and Sasuke. Is Oro going to reform, or be the menace once again? They're already fighting God, so it's better to just leave it at that.

^Platinum fan
Jugo is shy and calm when in his normal form. However, he will transform should he or his friends be at risk. If he fully transforms, he'll turn extremely violent and not be able to control himself. And Tuskie explained that it's because of Kimimaro that Jugo still follows Sasuke around. He actually has a reason for doing it, thus he is not a mindless sheep.

As for Karin, expand on the Uzumaki background? Their village was destroyed sometime after Kushina moved to Konoha, meaning the Uzumaki clan were long dispersed before Naruto and Kushina were even born. She probably knows just a bit more than Naruto does, which isn't all that much. Even Nagato didn't have much to share with regarding the village. Heck, Naruto didn't even know Nagato was an Uzumaki. Also, have Naruto and Karin even met properly? Talked to each other? Maybe when IT is finally lifted, there will be a scene where they meet eye-to-eye, and Karin tells him that they are similar, and even get to know each other's names. But as for now and then, there really was and still is no way to establish a relationship since they haven't even been in the same manga panel together yet. And for the going back to Sasuke thing, remember that we don't know if her parents are still alive, meaning she most likely doesn't have a single relative livig right now (well, except for Naruto, but they don't know each other). In Part 1, Naruto did his best to make friends. Even if he was getting bullied, he still did his best just so he can have a "family". Maybe this is Karin's version. She doesn't care that Sasuke left her fatally wounded. She's still madly in love with him, and she might make a family with him to restore the Uzumaki clan (like Sasuke's goal of restoring the Uchiha clan).

Jugo still never thinks for himself. Even in the rare events where he does question Sasuke, he just follows his orders anyway, without hesitation like a sheep. He adds nearly nothing to the story and was the most useless of Team Baka. He's not even useful in combat. The only useful thing he did was heal Sasuke during the Killer Bee fight. Even if he has a reason for following Sasuke, he never contributes to anything Team Baka did and just blindly followed orders without question. Suigetsu was the only one with something of a backbone, even if he followed orders too.

As for Karin, I can't believe this forum is actually defending her and Sasuke's actions. Karin running back to Sasuke trying to play off the fact that he almost killed her like some comic relief moment was stupid. Especially since kishi really played up Karin leaving Sasuke after he almost killed her. No, she goes right back to the would be woman beater. Karin's basically telling Sasuke she's okay with him abusing her. And yes Karin and Naruto have been in the same panel. As I mentioned above she took a great interest in his chakra. If you were going to make Karin a Uzumaki, take advantage of one of Naruto's only possible clan members and do something with them. Not romantic. Again, she could have shown Naruto some kind of Uzumaki jutsu before the war started to help bring down the man that almost took her life. But instead she goes right back to square one. Karin is wasted potential and I'll never understand her going back to Sasuke. Like I said it was disgusting.

JD
27th August 2014, 5:09 PM
Chapter should be at by Friday from this point on.

Nodame
27th August 2014, 5:23 PM
Karin is a waste of a character that should have amounted to something. Now she's just there and I cringe everytime I see her cry over the man that almost killed her without a second thought. It's disgusting.

You don’t have to like Karin and I’m not going to fault you for it. But I don’t think describing her as disgusting and obsessive is a very good way to criticize her. If she were obsessive, as you claim, she would put her feelings about Sasuke before everything else and probably be that character getting into unnecessary trouble on the battlefield because she can’t act maturely. But that has never once happened. Most of her displays of affection are kept strictly to her private thoughts. There is a huge difference between a guy like Jiraiya who is an active voyeur (which can absolutely pass for sexual harassment in the real world) and a girl like Karin, who merely fantasizes about the dude she likes and never actually acts upon it in offensive manner.

Taka has always been a combination of humorous antics ( the SuiKa bickering, Karin’s tsundere personality, Sasuke being oblivious to Karin’s feelings, etc.) I like Taka in large part because it’s got all these elements. To me, they seem closer to real people than just characters in a story.


I like Tsunade despite her unpopularity as Hokage

Sakura has pretty much the same personality as Tsunade imo.

Red and Blue
27th August 2014, 5:44 PM
I'm with Platinum Fan. I can't believe there are people defending Karin. Seriously, I truly believe she is one of the worst characters in the series. If she left Sasuke for good after his betrayal, then maybe I would have a little respect for her. But the fact that she went back to him speaks volumes about what type of person she is. She's pathetic and there is no justification for her actions.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 5:47 PM
He adds nearly nothing to the story
Yet, Orochimaru developed the Curse Mark from Jugo.

and was the most useless of Team Baka. He's not even useful in combat. The only useful thing he did was heal Sasuke during the Killer Bee fight.
I loathe how the Naruto fandom throw around this word. All of them have fulfilled their duties in assisting Sasuke, did the fight against Ay, Darui, and Cee never happen?

Suigetsu was the only one with something of a backbone, even if he followed orders too.
That's where you're wrong, Karin has stood up to Sasuke and has insulted him times before. All of them have a backbone.


As for Karin, I can't believe this forum is actually defending her and Sasuke's actions.
So we're supposed to hate/dislike her like you?

No, she goes right back to the would be woman beater. Karin's basically telling Sasuke she's okay with him abusing her.
Orochimaru is to blame as well if we're going by your logic. He's the one who told Karin to come.

Again, she could have shown Naruto some kind of Uzumaki jutsu before the war started to help bring down the man that almost took her life.
How in the world could she if she was sent to questioning once they arrived at the village, and she had sensed Kurama's chakra inside him which probably made her want to avoid him.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 6:23 PM
You don’t have to like Karin and I’m not going to fault you for it. But I don’t think describing her as disgusting and obsessive is a very good way to criticize her. If she were obsessive, as you claim, she would put her feelings about Sasuke before everything else and probably be that character getting into unnecessary trouble on the battlefield because she can’t act maturely. But that has never once happened. Most of her displays of affection are kept strictly to her private thoughts. There is a huge difference between a guy like Jiraiya who is an active voyeur (which can absolutely pass for sexual harassment in the real world) and a girl like Karin, who merely fantasizes about the dude she likes and never actually acts upon it in offensive manner.

Taka has always been a combination of humorous antics ( the SuiKa bickering, Karin’s tsundere personality, Sasuke being oblivious to Karin’s feelings, etc.) I like Taka in large part because it’s got all these elements. To me, they seem closer to real people than just characters in a story.



Sakura has pretty much the same personality as Tsunade imo.

I find Karin's actions disgusting, not so much the character. But she is obsessed with Sasuke. I don't know how anyone can argue that. He's all she ever thinks about. And clearly she puts Sasuke before everything else, she went right back to being his lackey even after he tried to kill her. I'm not going to say Karin was always a terrible character. I liked her reasoning for having a crush on Sasuke way more then Sakura's reason. And she proved useful in the field. Probably the only Team Baka member Sasuke really truly needed was Karin.

What annoys me is how this was written. They have Sasuke pretty much sacrifice Karin to kill Danzo and rather then help her after dealing with Danzo, Obito goads Sasuke into killing her. And like the tool he is, Sasuke tries to carry it out. This was one of the more darker moments of part 2 as Sasuke betrays Karin and tries to kill her. Karin is only saved because Sakura and the others got there. So Karin is taken to Konoha and this opened up a new door for the character to actually develop into a good character. Besides Naruto she could have bonded with Sakura since the same guy they love tried to kill them both. Instead she goes right back to being the Sasuke lover and what happened before is just swept under the rug.

I don't find that good story telling at all. What was the point of Sasuke trying to kill Karin if she's just going to go back to him? Why is she still so obsessed with a man that tried to murder her in cold blood? I understand what you said about Team Taka and they are suppose to be comical. Karin and Suigetsu have their moments. Jugo not so much. But even with that, why should anyone root for a character like Karin who's basically trying to get into a abusive relationship? I don't get it. I don't understand how fans are okay with Karin going right back to Sasuke like the attempt murder never happened. Clearly that's how Kishi wants it.

lolipiece
27th August 2014, 6:49 PM
Thank god, someone tells it like it is.

That act made me hate Karin. I didn't like her before, but I had hoped the stabbing was going to set up her to stop being so terrible, but I guess not.

Kishi is no expert on writing females, but that just disgusted me.

Nodame
27th August 2014, 7:02 PM
I find Karin's actions disgusting, not so much the character. But she is obsessed with Sasuke. I don't know how anyone can argue that

I know she's not the best written character and she has so many waisted potential. She's more of a comic relief character imo. My problem is that the people like to harp on scenes like the tongue scene or whatever. People start to forget the context of those scenes and assume they actually happened, when in fact they were merely Karin’s private thoughts. That’s why a lot of people view her as “obsessive” and “creepy”. Jiraya is even worse, yet he's over glorified by fans, so why on earth should we treat Karin any differently? That was my point.


why should anyone root for a character like Karin who's basically trying to get into a abusive relationship? I don't get it. I don't understand how fans are okay with Karin going right back to Sasuke like the attempt murder never happened. Clearly that's how Kishi wants it.


I understand what you mean. I agree with you that she shouldn't go easy on Sasuke who's basically tried to kill her. I believe that she has a hard time reconciling his actions despite his sincere apology. That's what I think. I have hope for their relationship to improve which is why I root for SasuKarin.

Kamex
27th August 2014, 7:06 PM
I think I agree with Platinum fan here. In my opinion, Karin going back to Sasuke was one of the consequences of Kishi's disorganization and urgency to finish the story. It did seem like he had special plans with Karin and maybe even Sasuke himself. But in the end, after pushing Sasuke to decide to join the heroes' effort against Madara, I think he scrapped whatever he was planning and reassembled Taka for the war. It seems pretty clear to me that he had built up Sasuke vs. Karin mostly for Sasuke's sake, to build him up into more of a villain, and probably to give Karin a different storyline in Konoha. What I'm wondering is why he wanted Taka together again at the battlefield. My guess is that he wanted everyone important to the story to be a part of the end, since he no longer had special plans for Karin. Hence bringing her to the front line and having that Naruto/Sasuke - Sakura/Karin scene.

I also think Kishi's just effing with everyone with all the ridiculous love triangles all over the place just to keep things "interesting." So we probably shouldn't take any of this too seriously.

lolipiece
27th August 2014, 8:04 PM
I know she's not the best written character and she has so many waisted potential. She's more of a comic relief character imo. My problem is that the people like to harp on scenes like the tongue scene or whatever. People start to forget the context of those scenes and assume they actually happened, when in fact they were merely Karin’s private thoughts. That’s why a lot of people view her as “obsessive” and “creepy”.



That does not justify her disgusting act of keeping Sasuke's sweaty clothes or planning on "attacking him" while he was asleep.

It's gross and reeks of rape-y undertones.

Lorde
27th August 2014, 8:10 PM
I used to root for Karin back when she served a comedic relief role along with Suigetsu, but now she's just a bad character with a sad crush on her would-be murderer. She's basically like Sakura, except that Sakura can at least do stuff other than fawn over Sasuke occasionally.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 8:24 PM
I used to root for Karin back when she served a comedic relief role along with Suigetsu, but now she's just a bad character with a sad crush on her would-be murderer. She's basically like Sakura, except that Sakura can at least do stuff other than fawn over Sasuke occasionally.
Sakura doesn't fawn over Sasuke though...

Lorde
27th August 2014, 8:29 PM
Sakura doesn't fawn over Sasuke though...

She's done it since Part 1 and we've only gotten a break from that recently because she and the others have bigger problems at the moment than romantic yearning.

Nodame
27th August 2014, 8:33 PM
I used to root for Karin back when she served a comedic relief role along with Suigetsu, but now she's just a bad character with a sad crush on her would-be murderer. She's basically like Sakura, except that Sakura can at least do stuff other than fawn over Sasuke occasionally.

Sometimes I wonder if people read the same manga. Do you honestly think Sakura still fawn over Sasuke? It seems that you don't understand Sakura at all. Sakura is such a complex character and only few people can understand her. Also, Hinata is just like Karin. Only thing different is that Hinata has an innocent personality which prevents her from getting criticized.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 8:35 PM
She's done it since Part 1 and we've only gotten a break from that recently because she and the others have bigger problems at the moment than romantic yearning. :rolleyes:

We've only gotten it in Part 1. In Part 2, she hasn't done it. I seriously don't know why you're saying she has when she hasn't. :/

Lorde
27th August 2014, 8:39 PM
Sometimes I wonder if people read the same manga. Do you honestly think Sakura still fawn over Sasuke? It seems that you don't understand Sakura at all. Sakura is such a complex character and only few people can understand her. Also, Hinata is just like Karin. Only thing different is that Hinata has an innocent personality which prevents her from getting criticized.

I don't see how she's "complex." She still has feelings for the guy who tried to kill her, making her just like Karin, and Karin is as basic as they come. Sakura's only redeeming quality is her healing abilities in my opinion and her super strength which is useful in combat, even if she's essentially a mini-Tsunade with much less charm as a result.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 8:42 PM
I don't see how she's "complex." She still has feelings for the guy who tried to kill her, making her just like Karin, and Karin is as basic as they come. Sakura's only redeeming quality is her healing abilities in my opinion and her super strength which is useful in combat, even if she's essentially a mini-Tsunade with much less charm as a result.

Please provide the chapter and its page number where it proves that Sakura is still in love with Sasuke.

Lorde
27th August 2014, 9:13 PM
Please provide the chapter and its page number where it proves that Sakura is still in love with Sasuke.

Likewise, can you provide the chapter where it proves that Sakura made the conscious decision that she isn't still in love with Sasuke? Because she's had feelings for him from the start and unless I missed her life-changing decision to give up on her crush for good, I don't see why her love for him would suddenly disappear altogether. :x

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 9:18 PM
Please provide the chapter and its page number where it proves that Sakura is still in love with Sasuke.

I hate to butt in on this but if you want a chapter it's chapter 540. Random ninja hits on Sakura, she says she has someone else. The ninja says he must be a good guy if Sakura loves him, and Sakura thinks of Sasuke. This is during the war and after he attempted to kill her. Not trying to get on this between you guys, but there is a chapter on it.

p96822
27th August 2014, 9:22 PM
But don't forget that Sakura is not happy being in love with Sasuke so it not to bad

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 9:48 PM
Likewise, can you provide the chapter where it proves that Sakura made the conscious decision that she isn't still in love with Sasuke? Because she's had feelings for him from the start and unless I missed her life-changing decision to give up on her crush for good, I don't see why her love for him would suddenly disappear altogether. :x

That's impossible since there is no chapter. Saying she still is/isn't when we have no solid proof can backfire, which is why even I didn't say she fell out of love with him. I'm also going by with what Kishimoto said in the databooks, Kishimoto states that Sakura is currently in the process of sorting out her feelings between Naruto who has always been there for her and the Uchiha who abandoned her and her childhood friend has matured faster than she ever expected. It causes her heart to beat faster. Yep, it's out-dated, but no where in it says she loves Sasuke, unless I skipped something and going by the recent chapters, it's not looking like she is.


I hate to butt in on this but if you want a chapter it's chapter 540. Random ninja hits on Sakura, she says she has someone else. The ninja says he must be a good guy if Sakura loves him, and Sakura thinks of Sasuke. This is during the war and after he attempted to kill her. Not trying to get on this between you guys, but there is a chapter on it.
Yes, I'm aware of that chapter. One could see that as she is still in love with him, but when Kakashi told Sakura in chapter 675 that her feelings for him may have been different and still wants to save him from the darkness it says otherwise, but Kakashi isn't Sakura, so he can't speak for her. So, it's still up for debated.

Nodame
27th August 2014, 9:52 PM
The fact that she's starting to realize her feelings for Naruto is a proof that she isn't in love with Sasuke anymore. Kishi is setting that up in the background. Sometimes people have to read between the lines.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 10:13 PM
That's impossible since there is no chapter. Saying she still is/isn't when we have no solid proof can backfire, which is why even I didn't say she fell out of love with him. I'm also going by with what Kishimoto said in the databooks, Kishimoto states that Sakura is currently in the process of sorting out her feelings between Naruto who has always been there for her and the Uchiha who abandoned her and her childhood friend has matured faster than she ever expected. It causes her heart to beat faster. Yep, it's out-dated, but no where in it says she loves Sasuke, unless I skipped something and going by the recent chapters, it's not looking like she is.


Yes, I'm aware of that chapter. One could see that as she is still in love with him, but when Kakashi told Sakura in chapter 675 that her feelings for him may have been different and still wants to save him from the darkness it says otherwise, but Kakashi isn't Sakura, so he can't speak for her. So, it's still up for debated.

Until we get 100% proof of Sakura no longer in love with Sasuke, I'm going to assume she still is. What I just told you in chapter 540 is a hint. She was also upset that Sasuke didn't care that she got stabbed or something. Not really a love hint, but Kishi bothered to put that in the Kaguya fight. I'll never understand why Sakura loves Sasuke. It's not like they were even that great of friends. Whatever.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 10:32 PM
Until we get 100% proof of Sakura no longer in love with Sasuke, I'm going to assume she still is. What I just told you in chapter 540 is a hint. She was also upset that Sasuke didn't care that she got stabbed or something. Not really a love hint, but Kishi bothered to put that in the Kaguya fight. I'll never understand why Sakura loves Sasuke. It's not like they were even that great of friends. Whatever.

That's fine by me, I'm not forcing you to believe she's not. I just dislike how people claim she is and the recent chapters are going all different directions with these ships.

Lorde
27th August 2014, 10:40 PM
Until we get 100% proof of Sakura no longer in love with Sasuke, I'm going to assume she still is.

That's how I see it as well. I really loathe the shipping aspect of the manga though; I could care less about who Sakura's love interest will be when the series ends; it doesn't change the fact that she's been practically useless for the majority of Part 2 and only had moments of glory against Sasori (who she had help with) and parts of the war imo.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
27th August 2014, 10:53 PM
That's how I see it as well. I really loathe the shipping aspect of the manga though; I could care less about who Sakura's love interest will be when the series ends; it doesn't change the fact that she's been practically useless for the majority of Part 2 and only had moments of glory against Sasori (who she had help with) and parts of the war imo.

B'ah. Sakura useless? That's madness, are you trying to stir things up, because it seems like you are. :)

Nodame
27th August 2014, 11:07 PM
That's how I see it as well. I really loathe the shipping aspect of the manga though; I could care less about who Sakura's love interest will be when the series ends; it doesn't change the fact that she's been practically useless for the majority of Part 2 and only had moments of glory against Sasori (who she had help with) and parts of the war imo.


Useless? I'm so done. She's the only member of team 7 without some form of power from an outside source. She trained her a** off to become powerful and now look at her. By her own devices, she's now at the level where she can help save the world. This makes her far more superior than Tsunade. If she never does anything else in the series, you've got to hand it to Sakura that she never wallowed in self pity and sat around waiting for a bull sh*t power up to contribute. But that doesn’t mean you have to like Sakura, in any case. I’m not trying to convince you that you should. I just hope you’ll think about how you choose to criticize her, but no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power.

Platinum fan.
27th August 2014, 11:21 PM
Useless? I'm so done. She's the only member of team 7 without some form of power from an outside source. She trained her a** off to become powerful and now look at her. By her own devices, she's now at the level where she can help save the world. This makes her far more superior than Tsunade. If she never does anything else in the series, you've got to hand it to Sakura that she never wallowed in self pity and sat around waiting for a bull sh*t power up to contribute. But that doesn’t mean you have to like Sakura, in any case. I’m not trying to convince you that you should. I just hope you’ll think about how you choose to criticize her, but no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power.

I won't argue about how useful Sakura is. But your last statement is very debatable. Naruto had to overcome chakra handicaps because of how Kyuubi meshed with his system. Sakura was a natural born chakra user. Naruto worked way harder then Sakura ever did to become the shinobi he is today. The only cheap power up Naruto got was through the Sage of Six paths. Sage Mode he worked hard to obtain. Summoning the toads. He worked hard to obtain. Rasengan took a entire arc. And another arc to learn how to wind change it. Even his Kyuubi/Biju Mode, he had to battle Kyuubi inside himself to gain that power. Naruto's not perfect, but he has earned his spot as one of the strongest shinobi of his era.

Lorde
27th August 2014, 11:26 PM
Useless? I'm so done. She's the only member of team 7 without some form of power from an outside source. She trained her a** off to become powerful and now look at her. By her own devices, she's now at the level where she can help save the world. This makes her far more superior than Tsunade. If she never does anything else in the series, you've got to hand it to Sakura that she never wallowed in self pity and sat around waiting for a bull sh*t power up to contribute. But that doesn’t mean you have to like Sakura, in any case. I’m not trying to convince you that you should. I just hope you’ll think about how you choose to criticize her, but no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power.

She trained off-screen while Naruto has been the only member of Team 7 who has done a sufficient amount of on-screen training throughout the series. Naruto's power-ups up until he got The Sage of Six Paths' powers were at least somewhat realistic given the fact that he was shown working hard to perfect his new jutsu, which is something that Sakura has never been shown doing on a regular basis with her Tsunade abilities. :x

Kamex
28th August 2014, 1:42 AM
Useless? I'm so done. She's the only member of team 7 without some form of power from an outside source.
That's part of why she's so useless lol. It may not be fair, but sometimes when everyone around you is a Super Saiyan or crazy new alien threat, there's nothing you can do but stand by being Yamcha (so to speak). Or at least, that's how it was most of the series until Sakura's final punch which came out of nowhere.


She trained her a** off to become powerful and now look at her. By her own devices, she's now at the level where she can help save the world. This makes her far more superior than Tsunade. If she never does anything else in the series, you've got to hand it to Sakura that she never wallowed in self pity and sat around waiting for a bull sh*t power up to contribute. But that doesn’t mean you have to like Sakura, in any case. I’m not trying to convince you that you should. I just hope you’ll think about how you choose to criticize her, but no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power.
She's not at Kaguya's level at all though, other than her healing thingy she's pretty much the same as she's been for most of Part II. Not sure how the story can justify her still being around for this final battle, at least Kakashi has his new, gifted, hax eyes. I'm not saying that everyone deserves a power-up every other arc to keep things interesting without much back-story/context or hard work, but you can't deny the principles and facts that the series has created and held up, so that sucks for Sakura. Also, people already covered this, but there's absolutely no way Sakura's worked harder than Naruto with her training. Maybe not even as hard as Sasuke, despite his natural talents.

Nodame
28th August 2014, 2:07 AM
I won't argue about how useful Sakura is. But your last statement is very debatable. Naruto had to overcome chakra handicaps because of how Kyuubi meshed with his system. Sakura was a natural born chakra user. Naruto worked way harder then Sakura ever did to become the shinobi he is today. The only cheap power up Naruto got was through the Sage of Six paths. Sage Mode he worked hard to obtain. Summoning the toads. He worked hard to obtain. Rasengan took a entire arc. And another arc to learn how to wind change it. Even his Kyuubi/Biju Mode, he had to battle Kyuubi inside himself to gain that power. Naruto's not perfect, but he has earned his spot as one of the strongest shinobi of his era.
Omg. Why did this argument turned into a Sakura vs Naruto now?? I wouldn't dare to compare anyone to Naruto's development. He's the strongest and the most developed character in Naruto and nobody can argue that. The show is called Naruto after all. My point is that She is just a normal girl, who has grown so much. And one of the main points of her character is being powerful without being born into a powerful clan or have any special abilities of her own. She didn't need that to be all that she can be. She killed an akatsuki and punched Kaguya WITHOUTany haxed powers. Unlike Naruto and Sasuke whom had to rely on their natural talents.




She trained off-screen while Naruto has been the only member of Team 7 who has done a sufficient amount of on-screen training throughout the series. Naruto's power-ups up until he got The Sage of Six Paths' powers were at least somewhat realistic given the fact that he was shown working hard to perfect his new jutsu, which is something that Sakura has never been shown doing on a regular basis with her Tsunade abilities. :x

She trained off-screen, so what? it doesn't change the fact that Sakura by now has fully mastered the skills Tsunade imparted to her. This indicates that Sakura is indeed superior or equal to Tsunade at this point. Having similar skills doesn't make her a "clone". Going by your logic, Hinata is also a Niji clone. Naruto is a Jiraya clone because he can master the rasengan just like him? Sorry but this doesn't make any sense.

Lorde
28th August 2014, 2:14 AM
She trained off-screen, so what? it doesn't change the fact that Sakura by now has fully mastered the skills Tsunade imparted to her. This indicates that Sakura is indeed superior or equal to Tsunade at this point. Having similar skills doesn't make her a "clone". Going by your logic, Hinata is also a Niji clone. Naruto is a Jiraya clone because he can master the rasengan just like him? Sorry but this doesn't make any sense.

Yes, that could be argued. I never said that they weren't clones of other characters to some extent, but that doesn't exactly save Sakura from critcism either. :x

Void Ventus
28th August 2014, 2:30 AM
DBZ levels
Naruto is Goku, Sasuke is Vegeta, Sakura is Krillin (or Tienshinhan if you decide to add GT). Calling her a Yamcha is a major disgrace to her character development. A Yamcha would be the Elvis wannabe that Ino was hired to pretend and marry in one of the fillers from OG Naruto.

Sakura may not outright show her love for Sasuke anymore like Karin still does, but you can tell she still has feelings for him. Why, just look at the manga right now. It's all about being subtle and leaving slight hints. Even Naruto told her she was lying to herself when she said she loved him. Sakura is almost Kushina 2.0. Go look it up, someone has made a comparison. Anger issues, inner anger, hair going up when they're furious, cutting their hair to save themselves, etc. Kushina also told Naruto to marry someone who's like her. Connect the pieces, and BAM! NaruSaku confirmed. Of course, he could just be trolling NaruSaku fans, which I'd be fine with. NaruHina all the way!

As for her powers... Yeah, she's useless against Kaguya. Your medical skills aren't gonna help you when one hit from Kaguya equals instant death. Fists that hit like trucks? Pfftt so what? Look at what Naruto, Sasuke, Kakashi, and Kaguya have. They have long ranged attacks that are far more lethal. Not discrediting all her training, as she did well for someone who does not have any special bloodline traits (at least not that we know of yet). Tsunade has Senju and Uzumaki DNA, so of course she's going to be more powerful than Sakura. When you're fighting a God, it's 100% fine if you're worthless. Unless you have Plot no Jutsu on your back and is granted with Ultimate Chikara no Jutsu, it's best to just sit back, relax, and watch the main characters do the fighting

Nodame
28th August 2014, 2:33 AM
Yes, that could be argued. I never said that they weren't clones of other characters to some extent, but that doesn't exactly save Sakura from critcism either. :x

Whatever, you have the right to state your opinion, and I respect that.

Agility
28th August 2014, 3:20 AM
Lol..

You really CAN'T criticize Sakura and company, just like you couldn't criticize Krillin and company in DBZ. That's because the characters who AREN'T part of a famous / powerful clan like the Uzumaki or Uchiha (Saiyans) are apparently incapable of becoming that powerful on their own because they don't have the correct bloondlines (human). The only basis you have for comparison are to characters of like strength; such as Vegeta and Goku, or Sakura and, say, TenTen.

Lorde
28th August 2014, 3:25 AM
Why didn't we get a new chapter today anyway? Is WSJ on break again?

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 3:44 AM
She trained off-screen while Naruto has been the only member of Team 7 who has done a sufficient amount of on-screen training throughout the series. Naruto's power-ups up until he got The Sage of Six Paths' powers were at least somewhat realistic given the fact that he was shown working hard to perfect his new jutsu, which is something that Sakura has never been shown doing on a regular basis with her Tsunade abilities. :x

Okay, let me get this straight. You say Sakura has trained off-screen and Naruto has done a decent amount of on-screen, but then you say Sakura hasn't been shown trying to improve herself. Your post contradicts itself. And even if she did train off screen, it doesn't make her less than a fighter or a "useful" character. Learning the Byakugou isn't a small feat, Shizune, the first student of Tsunade, who's one of the best Medical Ninjas in the series couldn't master it. Only Sakura and Tsunade were able to do it.
That's part of why she's so useless lol. It may not be fair, but sometimes when everyone around you is a Super Saiyan or crazy new alien threat, there's nothing you can do but stand by being Yamcha (so to speak). Or at least, that's how it was most of the series until Sakura's final punch which came out of nowhere.
For starters, this is Naruto, not Dragon Ball Z. I'm not even going to get on that. Next, going your logic, everyone in Konoha 11 is useless, right? Even if she wasn't given godly powers, she still assisted in the fight against Kaguya. Saving Sasuke and delivering a punch to Kaguya. I don't know how that makes her useless. (>.>)


Also, people already covered this, but there's absolutely no way Sakura's worked harder than Naruto with her training. Maybe not even as hard as Sasuke, despite his natural talents.
besho didn't say Sakura worked harder than Naruto though. She said Sakura worked hard to get where she is and people twisted it around as usual. But, like I mentioned before, the Byakugou isn't easy to achieve.
DBZ levels
Naruto is Goku, Sasuke is Vegeta, Sakura is Android #18
I'd be fine if it was like that, but if she was compared to Krillin, she'd be the strongest out of everyone who didn't have godly powers.


Sakura may not outright show her love for Sasuke anymore like Karin still does, but you can tell she still has feelings for him. Why, just look at the manga right now. It's all about being subtle and leaving slight hints. Even Naruto told her she was lying to herself when she said she loved him. Sakura is almost Kushina 2.0. Go look it up, someone has made a comparison. Anger issues, inner anger, hair going up when they're furious, cutting their hair to save themselves, etc. Kushina also told Naruto to marry someone who's like her. Connect the pieces, and BAM! NaruSaku confirmed. Of course, he could just be trolling NaruSaku fans, which I'd be fine with. NaruHina all the way!
This post rubs me the wrong way. But, I love your attempt in bringing up the confession, I mean NaruHina seems like it'll totally happen after Kaguya's defeat, even if it has little to no development.

Fists that hit like trucks? Pfftt so what?
Yet, the God, Kaguya got mollywhopped by the useless Sakura who has fists that hit like trucks.

Void Ventus
28th August 2014, 3:52 AM
Lol..

You really CAN'T criticize Sakura and company, just like you couldn't criticize Krillin and company in DBZ. That's because the characters who AREN'T part of a famous / powerful clan like the Uzumaki or Uchiha (Saiyans) are apparently incapable of becoming that powerful on their own because they don't have the correct bloondlines (human). The only basis you have for comparison are to characters of like strength; such as Vegeta and Goku, or Sakura and, say, TenTen.
Doesn't mean that you still can't be an excellent fighter if you don't have a special bloodline. It doesn't seem like the Sarutobi Clan is anything special, but it seems Hiruzen at his prime would have been able to go toe to toe with Hashi/Tobirama. Minato too, and he became Hokage really young, and was feared as the Yellow Flash of the Leaf.



Why didn't we get a new chapter today anyway? Is WSJ on break again?
It seems they're going to be strict on distribution from now on.


I'd be fine if it was like that, but if she was compared to Krillin, she'd be the strongest out of everyone who didn't have godly powers.


This post rubs me the wrong way. But, I love your attempt in bringing up the confession, I mean NaruHina seems like it'll totally happen after Kaguya's defeat, even if it has little to no development.

Yet, the God, Kaguya got mollywhopped by the useless Sakura who has fists that hit like trucks.

Yup, my bad. Completely forgot about Kakashi and everyone else. Sakura is nowhere near the strongest not Naruto/Sasuke ninja alive right now.

Kishi is trying to mirror Kushina with Sakura. Is this his way of telling us it's going to end with NaruSaku? Maybe, maybe not. Hinata did influence Naruto on his "Ninja Way", and her getting fatally wounded from the Pain fight did leave to the 9th tail being finally released. Whichever one it is, I won't be disappointed. I've already been disappointed earlier this year in Kyoryuger when Daigo hooked up with Amy instead of stalker Yayoi.

If Kaguya was a normal ninja, sure. But the point is, in the fight against Kaguya, she's useful to make a bit of a distraction, but not really an important asset. One of Naruto's clones could have done the job, and have close to the same result. It's like bringing a rock to a gun fight. Sure, you could throw it and deal a bit of pain, but that's not gonna kill them (unless the shooter opens his mouth and chokes on it, but that's different). Plus, she can't die. The goal of the fight is to seal her, not kill her. Only Naruto and Sasuke have the means to do. If Sakura dies (which she won't, as she's protected by plot), then no biggie. She's expandable in this fight.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 4:37 AM
Kishi is trying to mirror Kushina with Sakura. Is this his way of telling us it's going to end with NaruSaku? Maybe, maybe not.
Yes and no, though I won't speak about NaruSaku. Parallels really don't confirm anything in Naruto, I mean, was Tsunade in love with Orochimaru like Sakura was with Sasuke? And there's Naruto and Yahiko, etc. They're parallels, not direct copies. :)

Hinata did influence Naruto on his "Ninja Way"
I might be reading this wrong, but wasn't it the other way around. Hinata picked up Naruto's nindo and used it as her own, right? Or she just had the same as him?

and her getting fatally wounded from the Pain fight did leave to the 9th tail being finally released. Whichever one it is, I won't be disappointed.
Well, Hinata's a friend of Naruto and he believed she was another victim of Pain. Not only that, it was right in front of him, we all know how emotional Naruto is.


One of Naruto's clones could have done the job, and have close to the same result.
The jolly thing about it was that it wasn't Naruto's clone and it was the pink haired kunoichi delivering a smashing punch to the almighty Rabbit Goddess. :)

It's like bringing a rock to a gun fight.
I'd bring one....

Sure, you could throw it and deal a bit of pain, but that's not gonna kill them (unless the shooter opens his mouth and chokes on it, but that's different).
Well damn.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 5:18 AM
Omg. Why did this argument turned into a Sakura vs Naruto now?? I wouldn't dare to compare anyone to Naruto's development. He's the strongest and the most developed character in Naruto and nobody can argue that. The show is called Naruto after all. My point is that She is just a normal girl, who has grown so much. And one of the main points of her character is being powerful without being born into a powerful clan or have any special abilities of her own. She didn't need that to be all that she can be. She killed an akatsuki and punched Kaguya WITHOUTany haxed powers. Unlike Naruto and Sasuke whom had to rely on their natural talents.





She trained off-screen, so what? it doesn't change the fact that Sakura by now has fully mastered the skills Tsunade imparted to her. This indicates that Sakura is indeed superior or equal to Tsunade at this point. Having similar skills doesn't make her a "clone". Going by your logic, Hinata is also a Niji clone. Naruto is a Jiraya clone because he can master the rasengan just like him? Sorry but this doesn't make any sense.

Sakura is said to be naturally talented in chakra control. So it's not like she had a disadvantage and turned it into a positive like Naruto and Rock Lee. It's said she had better chakra control then both Naruto and Sasuke. Now this is out of date but it's been said. As far as Sakura punching Kaguya, she did that and it was impressive. But she did it while Kaguya was dodging Naruto and Sasuke. Let's not try and make this out like she outsped Kaguya or equally matched her in anything. Anybody in that same situation could have ambushed Kaguya if Naruto and Sasuke were backing them up. I'm glad Sakura got to do something, but I'm going to keep saying this, it doesn't elevate her level any higher then it already was. Also which Akatsuki member did Sakura kill? It was not Sasori. Sasori got killed by Chiyo's puppets that resembled his parents. Sakura didn't kill Sasori, so who is this mystery Akatsuki member she killed?

Void Ventus
28th August 2014, 7:30 AM
Yes and no, though I won't speak about NaruSaku. Parallels really don't confirm anything in Naruto, I mean, was Tsunade in love with Orochimaru like Sakura was with Sasuke? And there's Naruto and Yahiko, etc. They're parallels, not direct copies. :)
Well, of course. Sakura's not an Uzumaki, nor was brought to the Leaf to be the next Jinchuuriki for Kurama. Likewise, Sasuke isn't a creepo pale snake man thing, nor is Naruto from the Rain. Still, Obito and Yahiko and Naruto all have had the same goal, yet only Naruto was the one to break free from becoming evil in the process. So while Sakura mirrors Kushina, there's also a chance that Naruto won't care, and go for Hinata instead.

I might be reading this wrong, but wasn't it the other way around. Hinata picked up Naruto's nindo and used it as her own, right? Or she just had the same as him?
Yeah, nvm, I think it was Naruto who inspired Hinata, and then it was after the Neji vs Hinata fight that she inspired him to be better. I stand corrected.


Well, Hinata's a friend of Naruto and he believed she was another victim of Pain. Not only that, it was right in front of him, we all know how emotional Naruto is.
Something something about Neji lol...... It still hurts, especially since Rock Lee SD was still airing, and he was still alive there (the manga published way before he died though)


The jolly thing about it was that it wasn't Naruto's clone and it was the pink haired kunoichi delivering a smashing punch to the almighty Rabbit Goddess. :)
If this was Part 1, Naruto would have down kicked her face in. Ahh part 1, back when Pervy Jiraiya was still alive


I'd bring one....

Well damn.
Yeah... Imagine it, and be terrified. Eeeeeeecccch eeeegggh or however you spell a dying man's gagging sound
(Don't imagine it. It's going to scar you)

JD
28th August 2014, 3:55 PM
Chapter is out.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 4:18 PM
Well, of course. Sakura's not an Uzumaki, nor was brought to the Leaf to be the next Jinchuuriki for Kurama. Likewise, Sasuke isn't a creepo pale snake man thing, nor is Naruto from the Rain. Still, Obito and Yahiko and Naruto all have had the same goal, yet only Naruto was the one to break free from becoming evil in the process. So while Sakura mirrors Kushina, there's also a chance that Naruto won't care, and go for Hinata instead.


The ninja who never gives up, gives up on the girl he's liked since chapter 3 and goes for another and all of their conversations couldn't make two pages in a word document. I'm not so sure.

The victory seemed a bit rushed in my opinion, I thought Kaguya would have had a longer run as a villain, but oh well.

justinjiaxinghu
28th August 2014, 4:18 PM
Damn im reading it


FINISHED OMG OMG OMG IS IT ****ING FINALLY OVER NO THIS ISN'T TRUE OHHHHHMMMYYYGOOOOOOOODDDDDD

JD
28th August 2014, 4:24 PM
Hagoromo looked quite shady..I'm not sure if it's over yet. Plus, Naruto still has to fight Sasuke.

justinjiaxinghu
28th August 2014, 4:28 PM
Oh yeah about that. I don't really know man if they're really gonna fight. Perhaps they're gonna have a Co-Hokage thingy?

Nodame
28th August 2014, 4:37 PM
Even Naruto told her she was lying to herself when she said she loved him. Sakura is almost Kushina 2.0. Go look it up, someone has made a comparison. Anger issues, inner anger, hair going up when they're furious, cutting their hair to save themselves, etc. Kushina also told Naruto to marry someone who's like her. Connect the pieces, and BAM! NaruSaku confirmed. Of course, he could just be trolling NaruSaku fans, which I'd be fine with. NaruHina all the way!

Kishi said the girl was honest, so you can relax now. There's also no need to bring up the confession, which you clearly don't understand.


there's also a chance that Naruto won't care, and go for Hinata instead.

Yeah because zero development is a good writing.



Sakura is said to be naturally talented in chakra control. So it's not like she had a disadvantage and turned it into a positive like Naruto and Rock Lee. It's said she had better chakra control then both Naruto and Sasuke. Now this is out of date but it's been said. As far as Sakura punching Kaguya, she did that and it was impressive. But she did it while Kaguya was dodging Naruto and Sasuke. Let's not try and make this out like she outsped Kaguya or equally matched her in anything. Anybody in that same situation could have ambushed Kaguya if Naruto and Sasuke were backing them up. I'm glad Sakura got to do something, but I'm going to keep saying this, it doesn't elevate her level any higher then it already was. Also which Akatsuki member did Sakura kill? It was not Sasori. Sasori got killed by Chiyo's puppets that resembled his parents. Sakura didn't kill Sasori, so who is this mystery Akatsuki member she killed?
You're trying way to hard to diminish every Sakura development. Its sad.




The victory seemed a bit rushed in my opinion, I thought Kaguya would have had a longer run as a villain, but oh well.

I agree. It's a shame because there was potential behind her character. Her motives for consolidating all chakra in the world and creating an army could have lead to something more. It feels "off", but I'm not freaking out about it. Well guess there is one good thing to this at last, THE WAR IS OVER. I hope..

pwnswitchclik
28th August 2014, 5:04 PM
Hagoromo looked quite shady..I'm not sure if it's over yet. Plus, Naruto still has to fight Sasuke.

I agree, it gives me the funky feeling next chapter will be Shyamalaned, some other bizarre plot twist is on it's way.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 5:05 PM
Kishi said the girl was honest, so you can relax now. There's also no need to bring up the confession, which you clearly don't understand.



Yeah because zero development is a good writing.



You're trying way to hard to diminish every Sakura development. Its sad.



I agree. It's a shame because there was potential behind her character. Her motives for consolidating all chakra in the world and creating an army could have lead to something more. It feels "off", but I'm not freaking out about it. Well guess there is one good thing to this at last, THE WAR IS OVER. I hope..

Does this mean you're not going to tell me which Akatsuki she killed? Awww :(

Anyway the latest chapter...meh. A crappy end to a crappy war arc. This has got to be the worst Naruto arc to ever happen. So many rushed plots, so many BS moves like Orochimaru getting his arms back, his revival in general, Sasuke suddenly putting a end to his hatred for Konoha without even a single fight for it. Ugh this was like 100 different Naruto fanfics rolled into one big mess. And Trolldara's body being there annoys me because he could still be alive. I don't care at all for him being redeemed! I suppose now all that's left is for everyone to wake up and get the new Sannin suckup moment this entire Kaguya fight has been leading up to. The only thing I liked was Zabuza and Haku being remembered by Naruto. Those were the good ole days. I need a serious Naruto vacation for awhile. This arc drained me.

uber gon
28th August 2014, 5:49 PM
Sage of the Six Paths: You saved the world! FOR MY SUDDEN BUT INEVITABLE BETRAYAL!

Naruto: Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!

Shneak
28th August 2014, 5:55 PM
Holy **** that was the most anti-climactic ending.

Part of me is glad that Kaguya is gone but most of me is angry that she wasn't a more satisfying final villain. Unless Madara miraculously comes back to life. Even the Hokages were irrelevant cause they could have just been ghost summoned by the Sage of Six Paths.

Red and Blue
28th August 2014, 5:56 PM
Finally. The war has come to an end. I wouldn't worry about the Sage becoming a last minute villain. I'm sure Kishimoto has the sense not to do the same thingthree times in a row. I wonder what the sage has to say?

Nodame
28th August 2014, 6:01 PM
Does this mean you're not going to tell me which Akatsuki she killed? Awww :(


Lol woah woah Lets not get too far. Denying Sakura's presence in a fight against the Akatsuki is really sad on your end. All I see from you is the same notion of Sakura's character from Part 1. If that was the case she would just be standing around and doing nothing, but did she no. It's just like Sakura said at the end of Part I "I will get stronger no matter what." Clearly that was shown in the fight against Sasori, and she gave it her all to take him down. Chiyo wouldn't take Sasori alone if it wasn't for Sakura's help.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 6:45 PM
Lol wo wo Lets not get too far. Denying Sakura's presence in a fight against the Akatsuki is really sad on your end. All I see from you is the same notion of Sakura's character from Part 1. If that was the case she would just be standing around and doing nothing, but did she no. It's just like Sakura said at the end of Part I "I will get stronger no matter what." Clearly that was shown in the fight against Sasori, and she gave it her all to take him down. Chiyo wouldn't take Sasori alone if it wasn't for Sakura's help.

Well I hate to be the big stormy cloud you're making me out to be. I have no problem with Sakura, but I'm not going to pretend she's one of the best. I wouldn't even put her in the top 5 Konoha elites. Top 10, sure she'd fit there. You probably think I hate Sakura. I don't. I don't deny her credit in the Sasori fight, but she didn't kill the man. If you think she did, you need to reread that chapter. Chiyo did, and even she said Sasori should have won this fight. Sakura was great in that fight and it showed she greatly improved, but she did not kill Sasori. That's the only point I'm trying to make there. Not trying to rain on her parade but I won't make stuff up to elevate her either.

By the way, your comment about her standing around and doing nothing. Other then Sasori and this last stretch of the war arc, Sakura still stands in the background doing either very little or nothing. The Sasori fight and her punching random Juubi monsters in the war have been like her only action scenes in part 2. It's a improve over part 1, but beyond that she just sticks to healing. I think it's a crime what kishi's done with Sakura. If he was going to pull her forehead powerup BS, he could have at least given us some scenes of Naruto meeting Sakura in the middle of her training, have her keep it secret, give us subtle hints that something big is coming with Sakura, maybe have Tsunade ask her "How's the training going?" every once in awhile. Instead it comes out of nowhere and feels even worse then Sasuke's powerups.

Still, I don't hate Sakura. I know everyone on here probably thinks I do. But I don't play favorites when a character has a problem and other fans don't want to acknowledge it. Several of my true favorites in Naruto have flaws and BS moments that I call them out on too. So I'm not just picking on Sakura.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 6:55 PM
If he was going to pull her forehead powerup BS, he could have at least given us some scenes of Naruto meeting Sakura in the middle of her training

How would this happen if Naruto was away from the village for 3 years?

And about the Chiyo and Sasori thing, it is true Chiyo delivered the final blow to Sasori, but Chiyo couldn't have done it without Sakura and Sakura couldn't have gotten as far as she did without Chiyo.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 7:06 PM
How would this happen if Naruto was away from the village for 3 years?

And about the Chiyo and Sasori thing, it is true Chiyo delivered the final blow to Sasori, but Chiyo couldn't have done it without Sakura and Sakura couldn't have gotten as far as she did without Chiyo.

I believe I gave Sakura credit for her role. I just said she didn't kill Sasori. Yes, she helped Chiyo, and this was her moment of glory in part 2, but she didn't kill Sasori. That is all I'm trying to say. She helped defeat him, for sure. But did not kill him.

As for Sakura's training, you mean to tell me she only trained during the time Naruto was gone? If she was done with it by the time part 2 started, where the **** was it when Pain destroyed the village and Tsunade really could have used some help before Naruto arrived? Where was it when Team seven met Orochimaru, and Kabuto on the bridge disguised as Sasori? They could have had Sakura still training in part 2. Naruto met Sakura plenty of times in part 2 during their downtime with Sai. You could have had Sakura be tried from training and have Naruto ask her whats wrong, and she keeps her new training a secret. We had plenty of Tsunade and Sakura moments in part 2 as well. You could have had Tsunade ask Sakura how her progress with "that" justu was going and have Sakura give a vague response. Part 2 had plenty of chances to really build Sakura up into a true Sannin even if it's off screen. Instead we get her showing it off after Sasuke turns good to try and suddenly make her stand beside the two giants of the series with no buildup?

Once again, I'm not trying to beatup Sakura's character. I actually like Sakura more then you guys think. But this was poorly handled.

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 7:20 PM
I believe I gave Sakura credit for her role. I just said she didn't kill Sasori. Yes, she helped Chiyo, and this was her moment of glory in part 2, but she didn't kill Sasori. That is all I'm trying to say. She helped defeat him, for sure. But did not kill him.
Yeeeeeah, I never said Sakura killed Sasori. I just said they couldn't have done it without each other. I kind of don't know why you keep repeating yourself. ._.

As for Sakura's training, you mean to tell me she only trained during the time Naruto was gone?
Yes, it all happened while Naruto was away. Shizune confirmed that she was storing the chakra for three years.

If she was done with it by the time part 2 started, where the **** was it when Pain destroyed the village
Sakura had to abide by Tsunade's rules, meaning she couldn't go in the front lines at that time, and she respected Naruto's decision in fighting Pain alone. Not only that, she couldn't see what was going on, only Hinata and her bodyguard could see since they have the Byakugan.

and Tsunade really could have used some help before Naruto arrived?
Sakura was told by Iruka to heal the injured people in the hospital, she was doing her own thing.

They could have had Sakura still training in part 2. Naruto met Sakura plenty of times in part 2 during their downtime with Sai. You could have had Sakura be tried from training and have Naruto ask her whats wrong, and she keeps her new training a secret. We had plenty of Tsunade and Sakura moments in part 2 as well. You could have had Tsunade ask Sakura how her progress with "that" justu was going and have Sakura give a vague response.
It's not that type of training though, it's slowly conserving chakra into one point...

Part 2 had plenty of chances to really build Sakura up into a true Sannin even if it's off screen. Instead we get her showing it off after Sasuke turns good to try and suddenly make her stand beside the two giants of the series with no buildup?
It could have, but it didn't. And Sakura's not the only one who's a victim of this, Sasuke is as well, we've hardly seen Sasuke train, except when he was part of Team 7 and when he sparred the lives of Orochimaru's men before he absorbed him.


Once again, I'm not trying to beatup Sakura's character. I actually like Sakura more then you guys think. But this was poorly handled.
You're doing a great job at it.

Nodame
28th August 2014, 7:30 PM
Sakura was great in that fight and it showed she greatly improved, but she did not kill Sasori. That's the only point I'm trying to make there.

I'm aware of that. She didn't kill Sasori directly. My point is that she did have a moment of glory in that fight. My bad if my words weren't specified.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 7:41 PM
I'm only doing a great job at it because I'm calling out Sakura's flaws. It's not my fault if she has more then one.

And you're right, Shizune said she was storing it for years. She said that while Sakura is about to unleash the chakra so that doesn't counter anything I just said about the powerup coming out of nowhere, because the explanation is just on the spot as the jutsu is about to be used. Still cheap. As for Sakura in the Pain arc, Pain was attacking long before Naruto got there. As for Iruka telling Sakura to go to the hospital, if Sakura has Tsunade level strength with the forehead she could have told Iruka that she could help Tsunade protect the village the same way Tsunade did. If she is like Tsunade she can't die easily and Konoha does have other medics. So why has it taken Sakura this long to reveal this justu when there have been plenty of times she could have helped? Sakura's sudden boost of power makes zero sense and is cheaper then anything Sasuke has done. To compare the two is laughable. Yes Sasuke gets plot armor Uchiha powers, but he gets fight after fight after fight to buildup to his evolving Sharingan. Sakura has none of this and then we have to accept her as a Sannin?

To Besho. I agree with that completely. The Sasori fight IMO is Sakura's greatest moment in the series. I wish she had more of them.

Emperor Empoleon
28th August 2014, 7:53 PM
ITS OVER

In the coming weeks, we can at last lay this manga to rest.

Lorde
28th August 2014, 7:54 PM
Kaguya lost too easily imo; I expected her to at least have a trump card. Oh well. I didn't see the need for the deceased Kage to be resurrected, but alas, at least the war is over unless Madara revives or Orochimaru becomes the final villain. :x

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 7:57 PM
Kaguya lost too easily imo; I expected her to at least have a trump card. Oh well. I didn't see the need for the deceased Kage to be resurrected, but alas, at least the war is over unless Madara revives or Orochimaru becomes the final villain. :x

Well Orochimaru is still alive so there's always the chance he takes over Madara's dead body.

Red and Blue
28th August 2014, 8:05 PM
Is Madara truly dead? Or is he just unconcious? If it's the latter than I wonder what's going to happen when he wakes up?

Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama
28th August 2014, 8:09 PM
I'm only doing a great job at it because I'm calling out Sakura's flaws. It's not my fault if she has more then one.

And you're right, Shizune said she was storing it for years. She said that while Sakura is about to unleash the chakra so that doesn't counter anything I just said about the powerup coming out of nowhere, because the explanation is just on the spot as the jutsu is about to be used. Still cheap. As for Sakura in the Pain arc, Pain was attacking long before Naruto got there. As for Iruka telling Sakura to go to the hospital, if Sakura has Tsunade level strength with the forehead she could have told Iruka that she could help Tsunade protect the village the same way Tsunade did. If she is like Tsunade she can't die easily and Konoha does have other medics. So why has it taken Sakura this long to reveal this justu when there have been plenty of times she could have helped? Sakura's sudden boost of power makes zero sense and is cheaper then anything Sasuke has done. To compare the two is laughable. Yes Sasuke gets plot armor Uchiha powers, but he gets fight after fight after fight to buildup to his evolving Sharingan. Sakura has none of this and then we have to accept her as a Sannin?

To Besho. I agree with that completely. The Sasori fight IMO is Sakura's greatest moment in the series. I wish she had more of them.
If we're saying it's cheap, then I put it on the same level as Hinata's Twin Lion Fist, a jutsu we've never seen her train for, that seemed quite cheap to me. And once again, you're wrong. When Pain destroyed the village, Sakura screamed for Naruto to come, read what happens in chapter 429, there you'll find your answer. And it's because she said this before she activated the Seal "It's almost done. I've almost stored the necessary chakra." So, it's a charging jutsu, for all we know it couldn't have been released at anytime, Sakura's wrapped around plot as well. Once again, I'm not making you try to like Sakura or accept her. You seem to get your kicks out of going after her most of the time.

Lorde
28th August 2014, 8:19 PM
Is Madara truly dead? Or is he just unconcious? If it's the latter than I wonder what's going to happen when he wakes up?

He'll be talk no jutsu'd probably. Watch him use Rinne Tensei like Nagato did also. :p

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 8:27 PM
If we're saying it's cheap, then I put it on the same level as Hinata's Twin Lion Fist, a jutsu we've never seen her train for, that seemed quite cheap to me. And once again, you're wrong. When Pain destroyed the village, Sakura screamed for Naruto to come, read what happens in chapter 429, there you'll find your answer. And it's because she said this before she activated the Seal "It's almost done. I've almost stored the necessary chakra." So, it's a charging jutsu, for all we know it couldn't have been released at anytime, Sakura's wrapped around plot as well. Once again, I'm not making you try to like Sakura or accept her. You seem to get your kicks out of going after her most of the time.

The only character I get my kicks out of going after is Madara. Sometimes Sasuke, but mostly Madara. Everyone in this fourm probably knows I have it out for Madara. But as much as I dislike him I'll give him credit where it's due like him being the only threat to Naruto and Sasuke.

Anyway enough about that. I took your advice and reread chapter 429. I know how the Mitotic Regeneration works. What I am complaining about is we had no idea Sakura could use it until she actually used it. Unlike Hinata, Sakura is a main character. Unlike Hinata, Sakura actually had a fight before the Pain arc where you could have mentioned she had a trump card. Or if you want to pull that charging adapter stuff, have her mention that she has a jutsu that she's charging up. Kishis took this jutsu and tried to pass it off to Sakura, who has been a supporting shinobi up to this point, and tried to put her on the same view as Naruto and Sasuke. And I'm saying it was done poorly and comes out of nowhere, when Naruto and Sasuke have been fighting powerful enemies and Sakura has not.

I know it seems like I'm picking on Sakura. I suppose I am in this. I don't even know why we're on Sakura, I was originally talking about how useless Karin became after rejoining Sasuke. I like Sakura, but I'm not going to praise her for BS powerups when I called out other characters like Sasuke and even Naruto for the same thing.

Kamex
28th August 2014, 9:51 PM
Not to push the issue but...


Omg. Why did this argument turned into a Sakura vs Naruto now?? I wouldn't dare to compare anyone to Naruto's development. He's the strongest and the most developed character in Naruto and nobody can argue that. The show is called Naruto after all. My point is that She is just a normal girl, who has grown so much. And one of the main points of her character is being powerful without being born into a powerful clan or have any special abilities of her own. She didn't need that to be all that she can be. She killed an akatsuki and punched Kaguya WITHOUTany haxed powers. Unlike Naruto and Sasuke whom had to rely on their natural talents.
Well you said "no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power." Naruto earned most of his power, other than the Six Paths' power as of late. And even if you don't count that, Naruto is way beyond Sakura, so I still don't think she deserves any credit that Naruto (and even Sasuke IMO) don't deserve. Naruto started out as a normal boy as well, all the destiny stuff and being descended from Senju and being a successor of Ashura came way after he proved himself to be much more hard-working than Sakura already, and even in Part II he continued to work his butt off while Sakura remained stagnant. She only defeated Sasori because a legend was helping her, and I have nothing positive to say about her undeserved glory from the chapter before the last.


She trained off-screen, so what? it doesn't change the fact that Sakura by now has fully mastered the skills Tsunade imparted to her. This indicates that Sakura is indeed superior or equal to Tsunade at this point. Having similar skills doesn't make her a "clone". Going by your logic, Hinata is also a Niji clone. Naruto is a Jiraya clone because he can master the rasengan just like him? Sorry but this doesn't make any sense.
You're right about Hinata to some extent. But Naruto has plenty going for him that Jiraiya didn't have; Multi Shadow Clone Jutsu, mastering Sage Mode (because of the shadow clones), adding an element to Rasengan, ridiculous amount of work ethic/wanting to be Hokage, Senju lineage, everything that has to do with having the Kyuubi locked within him, etc. Sakura is pretty much just Tsunade 2.0, at least skill-wise.

Bottom line: Sakura as a main character is a complete failure in my humble opinion. She works as a character in general, but repeatedly trying to make her as relevant and on par as Naruto and Sasuke was a mistake if Kishi was going to put in such a halfhearted effort...


DBZ levels
Naruto is Goku, Sasuke is Vegeta, Sakura is Krillin (or Tienshinhan if you decide to add GT). Calling her a Yamcha is a major disgrace to her character development. A Yamcha would be the Elvis wannabe that Ino was hired to pretend and marry in one of the fillers from OG Naruto.
Meh, at some point Krillin, Tien and Yamcha were basically in the same boat. I only chose Yamcha because he's a little more recognized for failing to be of much help in the DBZ fights. My point still stands with any of those characters.


Lol..

You really CAN'T criticize Sakura and company, just like you couldn't criticize Krillin and company in DBZ. That's because the characters who AREN'T part of a famous / powerful clan like the Uzumaki or Uchiha (Saiyans) are apparently incapable of becoming that powerful on their own because they don't have the correct bloondlines (human). The only basis you have for comparison are to characters of like strength; such as Vegeta and Goku, or Sakura and, say, TenTen.
You're right. But I don't criticize Sakura for not being as powerful as Naruto and Sasuke, I criticize the story for pretending that she has to be, and then pretending that she succeeded, when clearly the same story shows us that she hasn't. At least not believably. Either Sakura doesn't have the means to catch up so she doesn't, OR she does have the means so she does catch up. Why force her character to tag along with the big boys if you're not even going to write her character well and give her a chance? I dunno, it doesn't really make sense to me.


For starters, this is Naruto, not Dragon Ball Z. I'm not even going to get on that. Next, going your logic, everyone in Konoha 11 is useless, right? Even if she wasn't given godly powers, she still assisted in the fight against Kaguya. Saving Sasuke and delivering a punch to Kaguya. I don't know how that makes her useless. (>.>)
I just used Dragonball Z as a metaphor. Okay, fine she's not useless. But my point is that Sakura is roughly on the same level as most of the Konoha 11. They may not be useless, but there's very little they could feasibly do to fight the greatest villain in the series. Sakura did her healing thing, that's about all that made sense. Punching Kaguya was nothing special, it was just a really strong sucker punch on an incapacitated enemy. It's nice that she did that, but to suggest that Sakura is just as relevant and important and powerful as Naruto and Sasuke just because she jumped in at the last second goes over my head.

But whatever, if people are really satisfied with how Sakura's been handled in the story, then I'm not complaining. There are plenty of things I like about the Naruto series that others practically hate, so to each their own.

Nodame
28th August 2014, 10:12 PM
By the way, your comment about her standing around and doing nothing. Other then Sasori and this last stretch of the war arc, Sakura still stands in the background doing either very little or nothing. The Sasori fight and her punching random Juubi monsters in the war have been like her only action scenes in part 2. It's a improve over part 1, but beyond that she just sticks to healing. I think it's a crime what kishi's done with Sakura. If he was going to pull her forehead powerup BS, he could have at least given us some scenes of Naruto meeting Sakura in the middle of her training, have her keep it secret, give us subtle hints that something big is coming with Sakura, maybe have Tsunade ask her "How's the training going?" every once in awhile. Instead it comes out of nowhere and feels even worse then Sasuke's powerups.

Still, I don't hate Sakura. I know everyone on here probably thinks I do. But I don't play favorites when a character has a problem and other fans don't want to acknowledge it. Several of my true favorites in Naruto have flaws and BS moments that I call them out on too. So I'm not just picking on Sakura.

I forgot to mention something lol. Okay first of all Sakura's power up wasn't BS that you're claiming. I've also reread the manga multiple times, and If you pay attention to Sakura's conversation with Yamato she says, "I wanna do more than just the little things." Healing was a small thing for her, but carrying the burden of healing the entire alliance is pretty big. It's more than one person. Which doesn't make this small. Yes in the beginning of the war you saw her in like small scenes, but once she got the fight with Obito and Madara things changed. Let's not forget when she was desperate to save Naruto from death after loosing Kurama. You may argue that Oh well you knew he was gonna be saved after getting Yin Kurama, and that may be true however Naruto would've probably died had Sakura not give everything her all. Aside from that she had a big asset in trying to save Sasuke with Obito and Naruto, and let's not forget about her getting a hand in defeating Kaguya. I'm not saying your picking on Sakura, and I'm not trying to praise her. All I'm doing is giving her credit for what she's accomplished.


Well you said "no one can take the fact that she's the ONLY member of team 7 who wholey earned her power." Naruto earned most of his power, other than the Six Paths' power as of late. And even if you don't count that, Naruto is way beyond Sakura, so I still don't think she deserves any credit that Naruto (and even Sasuke IMO) don't deserve. Naruto started out as a normal boy as well, all the destiny stuff and being descended from Senju and being a successor of Ashura came way after he proved himself to be much more hard-working than Sakura already, and even in Part II he continued to work his butt off while Sakura remained stagnant. She only defeated Sasori because a legend was helping her, and I have nothing positive to say about her undeserved glory from the chapter before the last.


Do you even have reading comprehension? :x I didn't say Sakura worked harder than Naruto though, don't twist things up. My point is despite not having a power from an outside sources, she has proven herself worthy.

Red and Blue
28th August 2014, 10:14 PM
Good God, you guys are STILL arguing over Sakura?


Anyways did anyone notice the rabbit like monster that emerged alongside the tailed beasts? I wonder what the heck is it?

Lorde
28th August 2014, 10:21 PM
Good God, you guys are STILL arguing over Sakura?

She's being glorified by fans for doing almost nothing throughout the series, which is the crux of the debate. Incompetence should not be rewarded with praise in my opinion. :x


Anyways did anyone notice the rabbit like monster that emerged alongside the tailed beasts? I wonder what the heck is it?

Kaguya's true form maybe? Not that it really matters now that she's sealed and all.

Nodame
28th August 2014, 10:24 PM
She's being glorified by fans for doing almost nothing throughout the series, which is the crux of the debate. Failure should not be rewarded with praise in my opinion. :x


We are giving her credit for what she's accomplished. You're the one who's in denial.

Platinum fan.
28th August 2014, 10:39 PM
I forgot to mention something lol. Okay first of all Sakura's power up wasn't BS that you're claiming. I've also reread the manga multiple times, and If you pay attention to Sakura's conversation with Yamato she says, "I wanna do more than just the little things." Healing was a small thing for her, but carrying the burden of healing the entire alliance is pretty big. It's more than one person. Which doesn't make this small. Yes in the beginning of the war you saw her in like small scenes, but once she got the fight with Obito and Madara things changed. Let's not forget when she was desperate to save Naruto from death after loosing Kurama. You may argue that Oh well you knew he was gonna be saved after getting Yin Kurama, and that may be true however Naruto would've probably died had Sakura not give everything her all. Aside from that she had a big asset in trying to save Sasuke with Obito and Naruto, and let's not forget about her getting a hand in defeating Kaguya. I'm not saying your picking on Sakura, and I'm not trying to praise her. All I'm doing is giving her credit for what she's accomplished.



Do you even have reading comprehension? :x I didn't say Sakura worked harder than Naruto though, don't twist things up. My point is despite not having a power from an outside sources, she has proven herself worthy.

Well this is hopefully my last post on Sakura. I don't even know how I started talking about her when I was talking about Karin. But frankly I'm tired of talking about the both of them.

I do give Sakura credit where it's due. My entire argument was kishi turning Sakura into something she's not. Kishi decided to have her stick to a medic/support shinobi after the Sasori fight. I'm fine with that. She's a great healer. Healed Kankuro's poison, was great in the Sasori fight, and every once in awhile she lends unexpected knowledge. My problem is Kishi suddenly turns this series upside down with Sasuke's reforming and now that Sasuke's good again, he wanted a Team Seven glory moment and so he had to come up with something for Sakura that just came out of nowhere. Suddenly she had the forehead jutsu, suddenly she can summon slugs. I wonder why she never did this before. The slugs would have come in handy for Sasori. And if she didn't have it before that fight and got it after, show her training and working for it. I want to get behind Sakura's advancement but it came out of nowhere and just seems like a excuse to give Team Seven the Sannin treatment when clearly Sakura should not be anywhere near Naruto and Sasuke level, and should be nowhere near sturdy enough to fight the same enemies they do. I'm all for Sakura having her moment but I wish she got built up like Naruto did for this so it doesn't come off so forced.

I'm sorry. I wanted to make that short but it wasn't. I like Sakura. I just didn't like how kishi tried to push her as Naruto and Sasuke level when she's been just slightly above average as a shinobi until now. That's just me. But I will give Sakura and anyone credit where it's due. But I don't hate her or anything. Sometimes I don't think she gets the credit she truly does deserve in some areas.

Lorde
28th August 2014, 10:46 PM
We are giving her credit for what she's accomplished. You're the one who's in denial.

Helping beat Sasori and doing a few good deeds during the war are basically the only positive things that she's really done in Part 2. That doesn't elevate her to Naruto's, Sasuke's, or even Kakashi's tier like some people are saying though. In her case, being an arguably badly-written character who Kishi made into more of a burden in the middle of Part 2 doesn't make me want to praise her.

Nodame
28th August 2014, 10:52 PM
Well this is hopefully my last post on Sakura. I don't even know how I started talking about her when I was talking about Karin. But frankly I'm tired of talking about the both of them.

I do give Sakura credit where it's due. My entire argument was kishi turning Sakura into something she's not. Kishi decided to have her stick to a medic/support shinobi after the Sasori fight. I'm fine with that. She's a great healer. Healed Kankuro's poison, was great in the Sasori fight, and every once in awhile she lends unexpected knowledge. My problem is Kishi suddenly turns this series upside down with Sasuke's reforming and now that Sasuke's good again, he wanted a Team Seven glory moment and so he had to come up with something for Sakura that just came out of nowhere. Suddenly she had the forehead jutsu, suddenly she can summon slugs. I wonder why she never did this before. The slugs would have come in handy for Sasori. And if she didn't have it before that fight and got it after, show her training and working for it. I want to get behind Sakura's advancement but it came out of nowhere and just seems like a excuse to give Team Seven the Sannin treatment when clearly Sakura should not be anywhere near Naruto and Sasuke level, and should be nowhere near sturdy enough to fight the same enemies they do. I'm all for Sakura having her moment but I wish she got built up like Naruto did for this so it doesn't come off so forced.

I'm sorry. I wanted to make that short but it wasn't. I like Sakura. I just didn't like how kishi tried to push her as Naruto and Sasuke level when she's been just slightly above average as a shinobi until now. That's just me. But I will give Sakura and anyone credit where it's due. But I don't hate her or anything. Sometimes I don't think she gets the credit she truly does deserve in some areas.

I understand your viewpoint and I agree with you that she needed more moments and build up. At least you do acknowledge Sakura and that's great.


Anyway, The Japanese government has decided that the chapters will be published three day before their commercialization and not five days like before. They have estimate that three days was enough....

Red and Blue
28th August 2014, 11:01 PM
She's being glorified by fans for doing almost nothing throughout the series, which is the crux of the debate. Incompetence should not be rewarded with praise in my opinion. :x



Kaguya's true form maybe? Not that it really matters now that she's sealed and all.


I guess that makes sense. It just feels nothing is being accomplished from all this fighting.


I wonder if the rabbit could be another tailed beast? As little sense as that makes, LOL.

nuzamaki90
29th August 2014, 2:33 AM
Blah blah Sakura blah blah rage

Can we talk about how much freaking power Naruto put into that punch at Zetsu and Kaguya's arm?

Shneak
29th August 2014, 5:05 AM
Blah blah Sakura blah blah rage

Can we talk about how much freaking power Naruto put into that punch at Zetsu and Kaguya's arm?

I think the gravity pull of Kaguya's Chibaku Tensei moon helped a bit.

Kamex
29th August 2014, 9:23 AM
So does this mean there will be two moons from now on...? Interesting if that's the case.

Void Ventus
29th August 2014, 9:45 AM
So does this mean there will be two moons from now on...? Interesting if that's the case.

No. The Chibaku Tensei is in the other dimension. Hagoromo summoned them back to the real world with the help of all the dead Kages after.

Platinum fan.
29th August 2014, 3:51 PM
The dead Kages didn't help so much with the final Kaguya fight. They did when Trolldara was around. Which just makes me wonder what was the point of the dead Kage? I still would have much preferred the alliance trying to help, even if by just support. The dead Hokage imo just took slots away from others that could have helped. And I still don't like that loophole of them being summoned after they were sealed away and Orochimaru getting his original arms back. They should have just stayed gone. This is when the war became a fanfic.

-Raiga-
29th August 2014, 6:13 PM
What I liked about this chapter-

-The part where this arc is finally over.

What I disliked about this chapter-

-Madara existing in any kind of form, implying the arc will go on for another 200 chapters.

Lorde
29th August 2014, 7:55 PM
I have a bad feeling that Hagoromo is the final villain and that the war isn't over yet. The ending just seemed too perfect in that Kaguya was sealed too easily while several things are still unanswered. :x

RiotFire
29th August 2014, 8:55 PM
Or Kishi could seriously troll us and this whole fight turns out to be Naruto's infinite tsukuyomi dream and the real fight is still yet to happen ¬_¬

Everything seemed a bit too 'sunshine and rainbows' for my liking.