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foxyman1167
14th February 2009, 4:34 PM
What is your favorite/least favorite thing about the new Physical/Special split introduced in the 4th Generation?

Basically here you post reasons why or why not you like the new Physical/Special split. Things like "Gengar can now use a proper Shadow Ball" are acceptable, but things like "OMG I HATE TEH PHYSICAL/SPECIAL SPLIT WITH A PASSION!" are not acceptable. If you do post something not in favor of the Physical/Special split, please provide a valid reason as to why, or else you are spamming, and I will let a mod/admin know.

Here is my reason, concerning Dragonite, one of my favorite pokemon.

I love that Dragonite can use Dragon Dance now, and actually use a Dragon move boosted by Dragon Dance.

This may be considered a poll, so if so, please move it to the right place.

Now, please post away.

[Ampharos]
14th February 2009, 4:38 PM
Having a perfect sweeper in RSE, then importing them and seeing that they're useless now because their attacks all got switched.

Sapphiredragon929
14th February 2009, 5:06 PM
What I really liked was that it made Dark all physical with the exception of a couple of moves. Also, now Ghosts get a better chance in battling.

Woot!

LightingKimba
14th February 2009, 5:53 PM
Hitmonchan isn't absolute crap anymore, and Blissey's not as fat and bulky as it were before.

Cappuccino
14th February 2009, 6:34 PM
The split balanced things out, I think. You no longer have pokemon that can't use STAB moves effectively due to their low attack/special attack and their type being of that side. I remember when trying to make a team in the 3rd gen and having to put aside otherwise good pokemon cause they couldn't support their own type's moves. It's not limited in that sense anymore.

Plus, I like that it actually makes sense now. Beat Up or the elemental punches being special? Or Shadow Ball/Hyper Beam being physical? That didn't really fit.

foxyman1167
14th February 2009, 6:59 PM
;9416769']Having a perfect sweeper in RSE, then importing them and seeing that they're useless now because their attacks all got switched.

That's what I hate the most, but now I train Pokemon so they can be used in either R/S/E or D/P/Pt

Birds of Paradise
14th February 2009, 11:47 PM
I like the split since now I choose moves according to a pokemon's stats. But what I dont like is situations like flareon where its attack is higher than its special attack, so flamethrower is not as effective and fire blitz hurts the user.

Cappuccino
14th February 2009, 11:55 PM
^ The second part is true, but that's doesn't really have to do with the split itself. (I mean Flareon's, and some other Pokemon's, situation)

RandomRubberDuck
14th February 2009, 11:58 PM
Well, someone already mentioned it, but, Hitmonchan is finally useful; the elemental punches were crud til this generation on it.

Surfer pikachu
15th February 2009, 1:24 AM
Fav: That some pokemons are more useful
Least:That another pokemons lose some attacks like sceptile's Leaf blade

Anima87
15th February 2009, 2:08 AM
Favorite thing about the split: I can now use Hitmonchan! YAY!

Least favorite thing about the split: Hitmonlee still isn't as good as I would like, but he has his moments...

Auraninja
15th February 2009, 2:33 AM
Favorite thing: It lead to the invention of cool moves like Power Gem and Luster Cannon.

Least Favorite thing: Some Pokemon (especially Sceptile) lost their signature moves to other Pokemon. Man, Leaf Blade was so cool on Sceptile.

Kikas123
15th February 2009, 2:49 AM
Favourite Thing: I believe it rounded things out, and now more things make more sense.

Least Favourite: One of my favourites, Alakzam lost a lot of his lustre.

Sonic Boom
15th February 2009, 4:41 AM
Favorite thing: It lead to the invention of cool moves like Power Gem and Luster Cannon.

Least Favorite thing: Some Pokemon (especially Sceptile) lost their signature moves to other Pokemon. Man, Leaf Blade was so cool on Sceptile.

I'm failing to see how the physical/special split has anything to do with this. To me, all this really is about move creation and distribution.

....Unless you mean the elemental fangs and Giga Impact. If that's the case, I understand that. But as for Power Gem, I don't see that.

Pros: Hitmonchan finally has a purpose in battling concerning type coverage, Gyarados has even more firepower, complete with a STAB bonus, Blissey has somewhat more efficiency in battle.

Cons: ....none I can think of really.

There is one thing though that irks me though, so that may be a con: Earthquake remains as a physical move. I've always seen the attack as a special move, for some reason; maybe because the Pokemon makes no physical contact to the opponent, letting the earth do the job. Then again, many physical powerhouses can use EQ, so maybe Gamefreak was paying attention to the battling aspect a little more than usual, and saw this.

Disaster_Lord
15th February 2009, 2:24 PM
Now you can create brutal physical sweepers easilly...(Gyarados, hitmonchan,arcanine, Swampert and sharpedo)
And hidden power got justice, it is now a key move in many sets.
Things i do not like...Well dark is mostly physical oriented...and is somewhat hard to breed for dark pulse coz you only get one in game...

ChuklaeAquos
15th February 2009, 2:34 PM
i think its good because they havenow made moves seem more like the type they shuld be (physical/special) so for example: dark attribute isnt just special but it matteers on if the pokemon make physical contact with the enemy poke!

Yonowaru in Chaos
15th February 2009, 2:37 PM
Eh I'm kinda disappointed Alakazam and Gardevoir lost their bag punchers, but I guess it sort of "decentralises" them a bit.

After all, I'd hate it even more if people overused them if they kept them (somehow).

Abidon
15th February 2009, 4:56 PM
My favorite thing is that now the attacks make a bit more sense-though for some reason I think more should be done, such as the fact that there needs to be a mixture of types in both moves and abilities. The elemental fangs seams like they could be both a special attack and a physical attack, and muddy water probably could fit in both Water and Ground typing.

It's sorta nice seeing pokemon types that have different rolls two-most flying types that weren't legendery pokemon where always physical sweepers, but now that there are some special flying type moves it's sorta adds a bit more depth. Of course, some of these birds like Chatot don't do well competitively, but it just makes the overall world feel like it has a bit more depth to it.

detochomorocho
16th February 2009, 12:33 AM
favorite thing: The change for all the punchs to physical was great and adding electivire in my case was awesome, also teh diversity in the type moves is very great.
Least favorite thing: Shedinja lose almost all his attacks, i had mine with shadow ball and other 3 attacks and they where physical, but now are special attack and in that stat he isn't great, that was the only dislike i have.

Dmatt
16th February 2009, 5:33 AM
I couldn't be happier about the split, it always haunted me that some pokemon were lackluster because their inability to use their righteous STAB , say Absol, Gyarados, Swampert (its water side) or Gengar .
The only little downside was some pokemon I liked losing some moves , like Charizard's Outrage, since it was best when backed by its special , or Aerodactyl's Ancientpower , just because the cool stat boost ;)

dragon-dark-master
16th February 2009, 7:54 AM
I love it! Now Sp. Atk and Attack make sence!!!

leon25270
16th February 2009, 8:56 AM
That's what I hate the most, but know I train Pokemon so they can be used in either R/S/E or D/P/Pt

Personally, I don't mind having to switch between two mindsets when planning for teams. It gives me more reason to play the games.

And yes, Shadow Ball makes more sense now.

Unfortunately, some Pokemon lost the Elemental Punches... (Mourns for his Gardevoir)

And I'm also writing a series of short stories centering on Hoenn's Battle Frontier. Imagine all the confusion that the Physical/Special Split would make, especially if you're writing about a battle between some random Pokemon and a Blastoise with both Mirror Coat and Counter! It would also be hard to write about certain Frontier Brains like Anabel. (Yes, a fanfic writer's point of view...)

SilverMorty
16th February 2009, 10:13 AM
I liked how pokemon like Kingler, Hitmonchan and Gyarados could finally use their good stats effectively

A bit saddened by pokemon like Alakazam and Gengar losing their huge movepool but it did give other pokemon a chance to shine (Although I miss Hypno getting the punches, worked well in my FR). Also Flareon losing a physical Shadow Ball :(

On the same track saddened Sceptile couldn't use Leaf Blade, Crunch and Dragon Claw with it's good Special stat though. Also a bit saddened most of Bulbasaur lines natural moves are physical.

Illusione-Tempus
16th February 2009, 12:12 PM
I really like the split! It makes me not dizzy about looking for the attacks that are Special and Attack!

Like back at those good old days at Ruby and Sapphire (yeah, late starter), I was confused because the opponent has stactic so I start thinking which could get in contact and which doesn't. At first I thought "Bite eats our foe, I better don't use it. Ah here we go, Hyper beam!" but turns out to be paralyzed too...

(I hate non-spliting!)

Cuthrout
16th February 2009, 12:20 PM
i think my favourite part is that it made things very calculative, and because of it it made some pokemon better but some worse which was a lil problem. but even still i like it

Cappuccino
16th February 2009, 4:07 PM
I really like the split! It makes me not dizzy about looking for the attacks that are Special and Attack!

Like back at those good old days at Ruby and Sapphire (yeah, late starter), I was confused because the opponent has stactic so I start thinking which could get in contact and which doesn't. At first I thought "Bite eats our foe, I better don't use it. Ah here we go, Hyper beam!" but turns out to be paralyzed too...

(I hate non-spliting!)

Um... You must be mistaken there. Static wouldn't paralyze someone who used Hyper Beam even back in the 3rd gen. Physical/Special isn't the same with moves that make contact or not. And it still is the same way after the split, Earthquake is a physical move but it still doesn't make contact. And back in 3rd gen, the elemental punches were Special but they made contact, so if you used them on a Carvanha you'd get damage from Rough Skin.

I like Pokemon (...)
16th February 2009, 4:56 PM
I mostly like the split. I wasn't competitively battling in RSE/FRLG so I didn't lose anything important.

It also helps to make strategic movesets (Dragon types don't resist 4/7 special types now).

Can't really think of anything bad.

ChloboShoka
16th February 2009, 5:46 PM
The split was great cause the sp atck and sp defence didn't make sense to me at first, but it makes a lot more sence now. The attacks makes more sense, too. YAY! XD The downside is as what others have said some of the attacks seemed to have lost thier charm a bit. But it's all cool.

MKFC
16th February 2009, 7:52 PM
Good: Everything but what's in bad
Bad: All my awesome physical Ghost-types (Shedinja especially) no longer have Shadow Ball

mutantmango
16th February 2009, 8:29 PM
The Physical/Special split was a great move, and has helped me a lot.

However, Hidden Power is still annoying, as it is primarily only used with Special Attackers. Maybe I want my Aerodactyl to have a physical Psychic move? I wish they could have "Hidden Power Psychic 70 PHYSICAL/SPECIAL". Or would that make things a bit complex?

fire fan 888
16th February 2009, 9:07 PM
i like the split because now i understand sp. attack and attack better and i can make strategies that are useful now.

DarkMongoose
17th February 2009, 1:31 AM
A lot of Pokemon are truly useful with STAB now.
Others, like Alakazam and Sceptile, are weakened-those elemental punches and Leaf Blade are sorely missed, especially with Leaf Blade's increased power. Pokemon like Blaziken can be more useful with their attacks, using the higher of their offensive capabilities.

COKTAL
19th February 2009, 11:50 PM
I'm on both sides. It helped alot of pokemon out in being able to use their strong stats more effectively, but it makes it somewhat harder to make good walls. For instance, in R/S/FR/LG/E you would know what types are super-effective and you could increase that defense more knowing which one it would go against. Now they could use a type move that can be either Normal Attack or Special.

pokemaster001
20th February 2009, 8:33 PM
Good: makes more sense, and has more variety
Bad: all the people complaining/being happy about the Punches, shadow ball, Gengar, Alakazam, and Hitmonchan, usually some in the same post

Poluxi
20th February 2009, 8:57 PM
I like it because it creates a really nice variety in moves
so most people aren't attacking each other with the same move (most of the time lol)

Pkmn Breeder Jack
21st February 2009, 4:06 AM
Probably Physical Elemental Punches on the Elekid line.

GreenNinja
21st February 2009, 6:04 AM
well it opened up hyper beam for some pokemon, such as alakazam. plus some moves being special didnt make sence like dragon claw, clearly its physical same with fire funch. and aura sphere coming from attack stat when its based on mystical(aura) energy? i think it makes sence to be honest.

at first i didnt like it, but now if anything i think it made things simpler when selecting move sets. though i will say some types move pools are a bit one sided, but i do wonder when they decided to make this change, seems a bit last minute to me.

aaron-now
21st February 2009, 6:05 AM
I hate how the punches have made a 3rd gen Alakazam look terrible. Then again it helps hitmonchan

DarkLegend
21st February 2009, 6:39 AM
The balance of power has been realigned. We know get to see much more variety in pokemon, move sets and strategies. Some of my favorite pokemon has been considerably powered up (Gligar and Sneasel) while others have been rightfully dropped from their high horse (Elemental Punch Alakazam and Shadow Ball Gengar)

pokemaster001
21st February 2009, 5:38 PM
I hate how the punches have made a 3rd gen Alakazam look terrible. Then again it helps hitmonchan

Elemental Punch Alakazam and Shadow Ball Gengar
see? where's the originality people?

DarkLegend
21st February 2009, 6:17 PM
<___<

Just because two people cite the same example does not imply that they are unoriginal...

kryptonite krunch
22nd February 2009, 2:58 AM
Moves like calm mind and nasty plot actually make a difference. Before, I found it completey useless to use moves that boost your EVs. Well, if you had well trained pokemon, which I always had, then it felt really useless. But, now, you pretty much need to use dragon dance, calm mind etc. etc. if you want to suceed.

The spilit definitly made movesets make more sense.

Typhlosion Trainer
22nd February 2009, 5:12 AM
The splits made actual moves that were special when they should have been physical, physical. Like Fire Punch.

swampert55
22nd February 2009, 11:55 PM
It made a few UU/NU Pokemon like Aggron and Beautifly slightly better, but it also overpowered OUs like Tyranitar.

Moo66
23rd February 2009, 12:55 AM
It just makes everything make sense to me. I hated having to remember what types did physical or special. Now I just have to think about what the move does. Like when something says beam or ball I think of special.

themonsteroftheisland
26th February 2009, 5:45 AM
Pros: The moves FINALLY make sense, all pokemon now have potentially viable STAB attacks, a lot more flexibility all around

Cons: Some fun toys were blunted, like physical Hidden Powers, Charizard's Outrage, Shadow Ball being changed from physical.

Ah well, nothing is perfect, and not too many pokemon were overall hurt by this swap. Note: Leaf-blade got a power boost, from 70 to 90, which corresponds with the 20 point disparity between Sceptile's Special Attack and Attack. Also note that Energy Ball, while lacking the critical hit chance, does have a chance to lower special defense AND has a 10 point boost on the original Leaf Blade.

So Sceptile's attacking options have slightly changed, but there aren't as many downsides to leaf blade's defection as some people seem to think.

Firehawk10590
26th February 2009, 8:47 PM
Pros: The moves FINALLY make sense, all pokemon now have potentially viable STAB attacks, a lot more flexibility all around

Cons: Some fun toys were blunted, like physical Hidden Powers, Charizard's Outrage, Shadow Ball being changed from physical.

Ah well, nothing is perfect, and not too many pokemon were overall hurt by this swap. Note: Leaf-blade got a power boost, from 70 to 90, which corresponds with the 20 point disparity between Sceptile's Special Attack and Attack. Also note that Energy Ball, while lacking the critical hit chance, does have a chance to lower special defense AND has a 10 point boost on the original Leaf Blade.

So Sceptile's attacking options have slightly changed, but there aren't as many downsides to leaf blade's defection as some people seem to think.
About Leaf Blade: A Physical Sceptile set is now viable, due to Swords Dance and a good physical movepool (Leaf Blade, Dragon Claw, Earthquake).

FliCe
27th February 2009, 3:29 PM
I dont mind the difference between atk. and sp.atk. Its more the def. and sp.def. that bothers me. Its hard to find a pokemon with good spatk or atk + good defence and special defence. Basicly, pokemon with good spdef+def always have a crappy stat like speed or spatk/atk.

pokemaster001
27th February 2009, 3:58 PM
<___<

Just because two people cite the same example does not imply that they are unoriginal...
look at my first post, before the posts, there were already like 10 people talking about it and I hate repetitive threads

Witch of 'Cos
28th February 2009, 6:19 AM
My favourite thing about it is some pokemon were finally able to use their STABs. Such as Gyarados, Salamence and Gengar.


It just makes everything make sense to me. I hated having to remember what types did physical or special. Now I just have to think about what the move does. Like when something says beam or ball I think of special.
Minor nitpick I know...buuut....Gyro Ball.

DarkLegend
28th February 2009, 6:26 AM
I toss a giant steel ball in your face....
That is pretty physical...

They seemed to use some physics here.
The faster an object moves, the more momentum it carries...
So when the fast object collides with another... the momentum gets instantky canceled out and the resulting force affects the object

In Pokemon's case... damage...

I cant think of a name
28th February 2009, 6:44 AM
My favorite thing is that the game is more realistic. I don't really have a least favorite though.

Trainer Emily
28th February 2009, 10:58 AM
The good thing about it...
It makes the game having more sense, like shadow ball & hyper beam turning special and crunch & the elemental punches physical.

And it also made 2 good HMs, as opposed to only Surf as the only good HM. Now there's Waterfall for the physical attackers.

It also makes certain pokemon more versatile (i.e. Physical-type/Physical-type Pokemon with higher special attack & Special-type/Special-type Pokemon with higher attack, like the Poison/Ghost Gengar & Ice/Dark Sneasel AKA Weavile).

Not much for the disadvantages, except that it completely eliminated any 100%-accurate Physical Rock-type attacks, like Ancientpower turning special...and the new Power Gem is also Special.

Umbreon-dana
28th February 2009, 2:58 PM
Hidden Power on both fronts, Flareon can actually use a Physical STAB for a positive, Physical Ice Shard on the negative (poor Glaceon ;_; ), special Shadow Ball on the positive, Sneasel line has some use, and a useful Hitmonchan.

Fwee.

Skreamish
1st March 2009, 6:55 AM
I'm indecicive about the split, because they have some pokemon who are physical types, but alot of a of the moves of its type arn't physical, or vice versa. [Like Flareon, who is a physical Fire type, and the only physical fire type move it can learn is fire fang].

Onyx Umeki
1st March 2009, 7:44 AM
Yeah, Flareon got messed up in this game...


It still is decent though

LeoP2008
1st March 2009, 9:02 AM
First off, let me say I LUV THE PHYSICAL/SPECIAL SPLIT!!!....*cough* um, excuse that. Anyways, to give actual reasons as to why...

Good:
1.) Attacks make sense.
.....For example, Hyper Beam is...well, a beam that is hyper. So, why was the attack based on physical attack stats?? Sure, some loved that little fact (Gyarados) but it still made no sense. Now, a game about fantasy has logic....which I'm sure is good...
2.) Some Pokemon get to utilize their great stats.
.....Gyarados is my favorite Water~type. In R/B/Y, he was a force to be reckoned with. BUT in G/S/C, his Special Attack stat went way down. Water attacks were not his forte any longer. With the Physical/Special split, Gyarados has a chance at using some quality Water attacks again. Hitmonchan is smiling too.
3.) Strategy gets more strategic.
.....Basically, battles feel like actual battles.

Bad
1.) Some Pokemon lose what made them special.
.....Sceptile wants his Leaf Blade back. Leafeon refuses to give it back. Not to mention all the ghosts that lost their poor Shadow Balls.
2.)...um.........uh........that's really it.

Shadow chaser
1st March 2009, 10:48 AM
Pursuit is now physical yes! And finally there's a good and decent attack for grass types(Energy ball) and the invention of nasty plot.

Bad things? Alakazam loosing his punches!

Jetx
1st March 2009, 11:26 AM
Bad
1.) Some Pokemon lose what made them special.
.....Sceptile wants his Leaf Blade back. Leafeon refuses to give it back. Not to mention all the ghosts that their misplaced Shadow Balls.actually the base power of Leaf Blade increased by 20, so it's just as powerful on Sceptile as it was on the 3rd gen games.

ChuklaeAquos
1st March 2009, 1:08 PM
actually the base power of Leaf Blade increased by 20, so it's just as powerful on Sceptile as it was on the 3rd gen games.

i think what LeoP2008 is saying is he wants Sceptile to be the only one (besides Grovyle) to be able to learn leaf blade and leafeon to never learn it.

Sharks Shouldn't Fly
1st March 2009, 5:02 PM
I think the split is a pretty good idea, but I think they categorized them strangely. I had no idea Flame Wheel would be a physical attack, for example, but it is.

Gin_no_Soyokaze
1st March 2009, 5:45 PM
The physical/special split threw off most of my strategies from the third generation because I create mostly defensive teams. >.<
For example, my Skarmory, which used to laugh at anything but fire/electric attacks, now had to worry about the special attacks ,such as aura sphere, which would now do unbelievable amounts of damage. Which, in turn, caused me to raise more offense-based Pogeymanz.
At least now, Pokemon that used to have half physical, half special dual types can exploit the STAB advantage on both types (Like Blaziken, Venusaur, ect.)

foxyman1167
2nd March 2009, 8:49 PM
I think the split is a pretty good idea, but I think they categorized them strangely. I had no idea Flame
Wheel would be a physical attack, for example, but it is.

Flame Wheel is physical because like in the anime, a Pokemon surrounds itself in fire, and runs into the foe. Thats how Flame Wheel is physical.

Cynthia
2nd March 2009, 10:58 PM
My least favorite thing, lack of a physical version of Hidden Power.

I also miss physical Sludge Bomb

LeoP2008
2nd March 2009, 11:55 PM
i think what LeoP2008 is saying is he wants Sceptile to be the only one (besides Grovyle) to be able to learn leaf blade and leafeon to never learn it.

Close. I just think Sceptile should be the BEST at HIS/HER Sig move. Its kinda like Dialga having Roar of Time when we all know Arcues could do it better....which suX 'cause if he could use Roar of Time, that would be true....

ayeeprill
3rd March 2009, 12:01 AM
I like the split, but I find the categories extremely strange.

hevvy j
3rd March 2009, 1:12 AM
Yeah. :p:p:p

Archgemini24
3rd March 2009, 3:13 PM
I do not mind it so much. Sure it threw off some very popular movesets or even just individual moves on certain Pokemon, but it is nothing the playerbase cannot get around. Overall I think it was a good thing, as it let a few more Pokemon be reasonably viable.

Of the Pokemon of mine it hurt the most, my Charizard felt it. However, since he can get Swords Dance and Dragon Dance instead of moves like Growth and other Special Attack Boosters, it is only felt for a turn or two. HP Ice/Grass/Water are a lot more useful on him now, though (since if you run into something that is week to one of these, chances are it is going to one or two shot you, so you can still get some parting shots).

My Dragonite, however, is liking this. The other base-total 600 Pokemon (Tyrannitar, Salamence and Garchomp), are liking it even more, because their stats are more slanted toward what they already do well (on top of being faster in the case of the other dragons). Not this this really hurts them much, because both attacking stats are high enough for all of them that you can make them Special or Physical Sweepers pretty well.

chilo_life
4th March 2009, 4:00 AM
I like how it helped out certain Pokes who would have been close to useless without the the split.

Shadow chaser
4th March 2009, 6:50 PM
My Weezing is loving the split! Now I just run a Bold nature and focus on def, hp and sp. atk, no more worries about the EV investments for Fire Blast.

legendary maniac
10th March 2009, 7:28 AM
it doesn't really affect me; to me they're just moves




__________________________________________________ _______________

ben 118
12th March 2009, 4:56 AM
now my shiny gyarados (not hacked) has some good physical attacks. but my poor Alakazam has lost all his elemental punches

Zhanton
12th March 2009, 7:26 AM
I thought it was a lot more logical, but it really threw a lot of strategies out, but gave way for new ones. It's got its pro's and con's.

Xx Flare xX
12th March 2009, 8:24 AM
Helped me out, made things alot better.
can't think of a downside, sowwy :(

dragon-dark-master
12th March 2009, 8:28 AM
Helped me out, made things alot better.
can't think of a downside, sowwy :(

Why is there a need to be sorry?!?!?!

I dont think I could ever think of one if I tried!

neo_senku
12th March 2009, 5:35 PM
What I like about it is it made certain pokemon more useful like water types that had a good atk stat, but poor sp. atk stat.

One thing I dislike is that no physical equivalent was created for hidden power.

Miss_Pocket_Monster
12th March 2009, 5:44 PM
The best thing this split did was to power up my Crawdaunt. The third generation was evil to her, but now that Crunch and Crabhammer are physical moves, she can do no wrong. ;342;

Unfortunately, the physical/special split has ruined Shadow Ball for me. I liked it so much more as a physical move. Ditto on Hidden Power.

Avrig
12th March 2009, 5:54 PM
I found Physical/Special split now a way more logical than before, when they were dependent on moves types.
I like it more like this, and it makes things more interesting, since it's still a little new thing to be learn. I also think that it gives you a much more variety in moves with many pokémons than the old way. Definitely like it!

Displeased Owl
12th March 2009, 7:25 PM
made the sneasel family viable in competitive play. however my least favourite thing would have to be how alakazam doesn't benefit from being a diverse sp. sweeper with the elemental punches. still the amount of pokemon that now do benefit from the punches compensates for that.

jwla
12th March 2009, 10:33 PM
I also miss physical Sludge Bomb

Yes. I miss that, too. How the heck is Gunk Shot physical, but, Sludge Bomb isn't?

I love the physical/special split. It's worked out rather well for most Pokémon.

Silverninetails
13th March 2009, 7:24 AM
I actually love it because it's more realistic. Maybe it's because my first pokemon game is diamond..

fschulze47
14th March 2009, 3:11 AM
i agree, it's more realistic, and some pokemon (im looking at azumarill) got cheated out of their abilities because they lacked a physical/special STAB that matched their types. I like it, quite alot, but defense is a lot less reliable, because, if you look at a pokemon like cloyster, with GREAT defense but pathetic special defense, it becomes less predictable, seeing as lucario can carry Aura Sphere AND Close Combat, the former of which will hit cloyster A LOT harder than the latter.

Zazie
14th March 2009, 3:47 AM
My favorite thing is that it balanced the power of the Pokemon better. Some of the weaker pokemon were helped by this while stronger ones were toned down a bit. I don't dislike anything about as I can't think of a single pokemon that has been made useless due to the change.

Tadashi
14th March 2009, 4:40 AM
My favorite thing about the Physical/Special split is that it all finally makes sense.


Using Alakazam as an example, it had Elemental Punches as viability. That confused me, because I never thought that Alakazam had good enough Atk power to use them properly. Only then do I find out that Electric types are considered "Special Attackers" . WHAT?! O_O That makes no damn sense to me.

Finally, this split makes everything seem correct. Elemental Punches become Physical because there is contact made, not because of their type classification O_o And things like Discharge become Special, because there is no physical contact made! Gosh it's wonderful! :D


I've just... never thought that the old system was correct. Finally, this system is one that works, and it works well.

burgaz62
14th March 2009, 8:11 AM
i hate it because sceptileas my first ever special sweeper, but without leaf blade it sucks now

Lion Demon
14th March 2009, 8:38 AM
It makes the game more realistic and interesting.

Actually aside baenette theres nothing bad about it!

Murra Myrrh
14th March 2009, 1:10 PM
I think the slpit was good, REALLY good. It's kinda sad that some of my best sweepers in FR/LG kinda turned useless, but now it's easier to make strong pokemon. The only pokemon that I transfured from my old games that didn't lose value are my tanks, but even then only one of my tanks really stood out. Now the game has a more natural flow to in...IMO....Though there is one thing I'm somewhat disapointed in...Some types don't have an even amount of special and physical damage, like rock type attacks. I know most rock type pokemon are physical, but there are some other pokemon who can learn rock moves, but it doesn't mesh with their natural stats. Get what I'm saying? I'm not overly upset, it's just it would be nice.

koosbane
14th March 2009, 1:31 PM
I really liked the split, seeing as I didn't play the third gen. games too much, atleast not competitively. So I really think it makes sense. some attacks that aren't physical like flamethrower didn't make sense to be physical.

sages21
20th March 2009, 7:29 PM
i liked it because irs more realistic and because many pokemon benefited from it. i think they should have made a few more attacks to help pokes who would lose viability because of this just like alakasam lost the elemental punches but got many new moves

Landotron
24th March 2009, 12:38 AM
I think the offensive minded Pokemon got the best gain, which is good because my style is typically offensive.

Now they can use dual stab, one physical and one special. (Rain dance Kingdra comes to mind with surf and waterfall)

Although some Pokemon lost important things to them, such as Sceptile's special leaf blade, most Pokemon gained another attack that was almost as good, while probably getting a lot of other stuff too. Sceptile can still use Energy ball or Grass knot (which is occasionally better than leaf blade, although often worse) while also gaining stuff like special hidden power. Alakazam's loss is without much gain, minus a hidden power, but most offensive Pokemon either got a lot of new attacks that works off their better stat, or got more attacks to make up for some that they lost.

Defensive Pokemon, got hit hard I think. Which is good, because I'm not a defensive player. Now that Blissey has a lot more to worry about, basically every type can hurt her. There are things like Flare Blitz that can make fire Pokemon much more threatening to her.

All considered, I really like the special physical split, and my biggest reason is the physical STAB that dragons get.

DarkAuraUmbreon
18th April 2009, 10:49 AM
WHY SACRED FIRE IS PHYSICAL ??????

Apart from this .... the diferences are great !!! The game become more logical !!!

Zhanton
18th April 2009, 11:19 AM
Now it makes tons more sense. I never really understood why certain typed moves were also physical while others were always special. Sure, it messed up some Pokes that were super good in the 3rd gen *cough*alakazam*cough* but it gave others the breath of life. =]

mudkip master
18th April 2009, 11:26 AM
hitmonchan works now not haveing s atk punchs

kablay
18th April 2009, 5:50 PM
Absol is actually good! I loved it in R/S but never used it because it sucked... Now it's on my main team c: I mean, it's not Salamence or anything but it's really cool looking and I'm just glad it's useful now. But one thing I don't like is that the Dark type basically changed into a full-physical type; the only special attack is Dark Pulse! Yeah, it's a good attack, but it doesn't give much variety. I just wish they would have done more of a split w/the types than they did.

seraph8x
19th April 2009, 3:38 AM
Least favorite thing- Hyperbeam is now all but useless- It used to be practically a staple of every physical sweeper, but now that things like Gyarados and dragonite don't have any use since it wastes a turn and does crap damage anyway. And there are hardly enough special sweepers anyway.

Also flareon is now worse, since it has no viable physical attacks. Then again, that was always it's problem, right?

#Gecko#
19th April 2009, 3:51 AM
^^^
You can use Giga Impact.

Like everyone said, I like it how its now more realistic. I always wanted Pokemon with the Physical/Special Split. The only thing I hate was that my favorite Pkmn Sceptile lost Special Leaf Blade. It can be replaced, but I loved my third gen Sceptile w/ Leaf Blade!

Toastybob
19th April 2009, 5:46 AM
Shadow Ball = Special = Epic win.

Also, Seraph8x, Hyper beam was always a waste of a turn. The split did not affect its viability at all, and, as #Gecko# pointed out, you can always replace it with Giga impact.

theclaytonator
19th April 2009, 6:59 AM
I like everything about it. Now you can train a physical fire pokemon or a special bug pokemon and so forth.

It all makes sense now!

You have been Claytonated.

Arceus, The Original One
19th April 2009, 12:16 PM
One thing i couldn't understand, was Spark.
I mean, why is it a weak no self-damage version of Volt Tackle, it's not like it's useful, I mean, most of the people here who wanted a physical electric move, would have went with Thunder Fang. It should have remained a special move.

Toastybob
19th April 2009, 4:45 PM
One thing i couldn't understand, was Spark.
I mean, why is it a weak no self-damage version of Volt Tackle, it's not like it's useful, I mean, most of the people here who wanted a physical electric move, would have went with Thunder Fang. It should have remained a special move.

Spark is the same as Thunder fang, except it has better accuracy and lacks a chance to make the opponent flinch. If Spark remained a special move, which wouldn't have made sense, it would have become completely useless, because nobody in their right mind would use that over thunderbolt.

Commander L. Halsti
19th April 2009, 5:29 PM
It helps somewhere, and it also takes away somewhere. I can easily beat a Pokemon now by specifically targeting its weaker stat. My Pokemon often carry both types of attacks,so, I'm always prepared. However, some Pokemon got screwed over. Weavile would've been a good addition to my team, if it Sp. Atk wasn't horrid. Since the only useful Ice STAB-s for it are Special attacks(chain-breeding to get Ice Punch is not an option), it's a disaster. Weezing's STAB moves were classified as Physical before, and that's why Sludge did horrendously big damage to anything. Now, they get power from the Sp. Atk. stat, which means Sludge won't cut it anymore. and I have to raise the stat, too.

Irisfatum
20th April 2009, 5:56 PM
The Attack/Special Attack split was probably the best change they've made.

Best thing about it is the fact that Gengar FINALLY has some good special STAB moves to work with in Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb. For the longest time I've had to rely on Thunderbolt for the ghouly's main special attack...and that just didn't fit. ):

seraph8x
20th April 2009, 8:02 PM
It helps somewhere, and it also takes away somewhere. I can easily beat a Pokemon now by specifically targeting its weaker stat. My Pokemon often carry both types of attacks,so, I'm always prepared. However, some Pokemon got screwed over. Weavile would've been a good addition to my team, if it Sp. Atk wasn't horrid. Since the only useful Ice STAB-s for it are Special attacks(chain-breeding to get Ice Punch is not an option), it's a disaster. Weezing's STAB moves were classified as Physical before, and that's why Sludge did horrendously big damage to anything. Now, they get power from the Sp. Atk. stat, which means Sludge won't cut it anymore. and I have to raise the stat, too.

Doesn't targeting a weaker stat with specific moves increase the strategic nature, instead of simply having ALL of the moves of a type do the same type of damage?

That, and I'm not sure it's really that easy to just "target the weakness" in terms of defense/special defense because relatively few pokemon can viably use both types of attack- even then, they wouldn't be able to cover every pokemon if they had to spilt their moves between physical and special attacks, and after that, there would be little room for swords dance, nasty plot, or dragon dance.

yeminied
22nd April 2009, 7:53 AM
I'm not a competitive battler but I just like that now your Pokemon's moves can finally work with the appropriate stat.

Honestly, how could fire punch be a special type move and gust be a physical move ???

Slowking[George]
22nd April 2009, 11:18 AM
The split balanced things out, however important moves changing from physical to special or vice versa ruined whole movesets, e.g. Leaf Blade turning from Special to Physical.

Profesco
23rd April 2009, 12:46 AM
;9638061']The split balanced things out, however important moves changing from physical to special or vice versa ruined whole movesets, e.g. Leaf Blade turning from Special to Physical.

This point, exactly. I was bummed out that Sceptile lost its old signature move to its weaker stat. Sure the base power was boosted a little, but that doesn't really make up for the difference in Sceptile's attack stats.

In most other situations, though, I'm very fond of the split. Pokemon mentioned often, like Gengar and Weavile, now have more room to shine. That, and it opens up a new dimention of variability in battle strategy. That's always a plus. ^_^

Virtuos
23rd April 2009, 3:18 PM
physical/special split cleared most of the logic out, but why is EQ physical?
EQ doesnt require for the user to have contact with the foe, eh?

christiandeath77
23rd April 2009, 6:54 PM
I thought they shouldve done that a long time ago.It helped a lot of pokemon.



like Professco, I liked Dragonite knowing Hyper Beam as it's signature move, but I'm glad it's more viable now.

GeneralHannibal
27th April 2009, 3:39 AM
Gyarados without a doubt. I almost lost it when i saw the split in moves. Hidden power flying is no longer necessary now. A STAB water move makes this pokemon beastly. I also no longer have to worry about elemental punches from Alakazam.

GeneralHannibal
27th April 2009, 3:43 AM
It helps somewhere, and it also takes away somewhere. I can easily beat a Pokemon now by specifically targeting its weaker stat. My Pokemon often carry both types of attacks,so, I'm always prepared. However, some Pokemon got screwed over. Weavile would've been a good addition to my team, if it Sp. Atk wasn't horrid. Since the only useful Ice STAB-s for it are Special attacks(chain-breeding to get Ice Punch is not an option), it's a disaster. Weezing's STAB moves were classified as Physical before, and that's why Sludge did horrendously big damage to anything. Now, they get power from the Sp. Atk. stat, which means Sludge won't cut it anymore. and I have to raise the stat, too.

Weavile is best used to revenge kill dragons(which are everywhere). Ice shard is all it needs for this. It has priority and most dragons have a 4X weakness to ice( Dragonite, Scalamence,Flygon,Altaria,Garchomp).