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View Full Version : Scizor or Scyther with Eviolite?



Cryochronic
29th April 2011, 3:35 AM
Both Scizor and Scyther are powerful pokemon and despite Scizor being Scyther's evolution, they share the same Base Stat Total.

While Scizor gains a strong defense and has its weaknesses reduced to a single 4x Fire, it sacrifices speed, neutralizing its sweeping capabilities without a priority move.

Scyther is cursed with a 4x weakness to rock and 4 weaknesses to common types. However, it has access to Eviolite, which boosts its defenses beyond that of Scizor. It also maintains a 105 Base Speed, enabling it to sweep through a number of other pokemon. And with Technician, Scyther can be a humongous threat.

Scyther's new bulk also enables it to be an effective Swords Dance, Agility, or Substitute Baton Passer for added versatility.

So in your opinion, will Scyther move from UU to OU in this generation? Will it overtake its evolution in terms of usefulness?

Slydevil
29th April 2011, 1:31 PM
use used both of them scyther @ eviolite +swords dance and baton bass
for me scyther works a lot better than scizor if you can set up.
but good thing about scizor is he has a lot of resistances than scyther.

MewTwoEx
29th April 2011, 1:34 PM
The steel type definitely adds a big advantage to Scizor. In my opinion, it depends on the user and their team and what type of offense they want Scizor/Scyther to bring, so i would call it a draw.

chanseychansey77
29th April 2011, 6:18 PM
Terrakion stole all hope of Scyther getting any good, it outspeeds and murders it with Stone Edge.

kaiser soze
29th April 2011, 10:45 PM
eviolite scyter wont be able to maximize acrobatics though, even with STAB

Cometk
29th April 2011, 10:56 PM
eviolite scyter wont be able to maximize acrobatics though, even with STAB

There's only a 30 base power difference between Acrobatics and Aerial Ace after Technician and STAB. And now you'll be able to hit those pesky Garchomps.

palingensia
30th April 2011, 12:55 AM
i can't see eviolite scyther being better than scizor at all. first up is the obvious stealth rock weakness, which kills any attempt at being bulky. next up is, despite the extra bulk, the typing is bad enough to offset it. i'd probably use scizor any day.

blaZofgold
30th April 2011, 4:58 AM
...Why not both? Just to be more annoying

It's true I never liked Scizor since its SO SO SLOW

But Scyther sounds way too frail, even with Eviolite, that Flying type just really makes it hard for it.

And 105 spd isn't that fast, so many other leads can outrun that, even rogue ones like Galvantula.

It's certainly better as a late-game sweeper, but Scizor can be used in more situations and as a revenge killer.

rk9growlithe
30th April 2011, 5:15 AM
...Why not both? Just to be more annoying

Yeah! But it would be annoying if people just had teams full of Blissey, Scizor, Eviolite Chansey, and Eviolite Scyther.

chanseychansey77
30th April 2011, 5:22 AM
SR kills off any defensive capabilities granted by Eviolite, just go with Scizor.

cantab
30th April 2011, 7:38 AM
If I were to run Scyther, I'd think about Life Orb over Eviolite anyway. As mentioned, poor typing makes the defensive boosts less relevant.

I'm not sure why I'd choose a Pokemon weak to four common attacking types (and Flying, but that's less seen), 4x weak to Stealth Rock, with good but not outstanding stats, and so-so STAB.

UnoDS
30th April 2011, 7:56 AM
I would go for Scizor, as already mentioned he doesn't have the Stealth Rock weakness + might be good to mention he doesn't get dmg from sandstorm, unlike Scyther.

xmip
30th April 2011, 4:35 PM
stealth rock
end of discussion

Rezzo
30th April 2011, 5:32 PM
Both Scizor and Scyther are powerful pokemon and despite Scizor being Scyther's evolution, they share the same Base Stat Total.

While Scizor gains a strong defense and has its weaknesses reduced to a single 4x Fire, it sacrifices speed, neutralizing its sweeping capabilities without a priority move.

Scyther is cursed with a 4x weakness to rock and 4 weaknesses to common types. However, it has access to Eviolite, which boosts its defenses beyond that of Scizor. It also maintains a 105 Base Speed, enabling it to sweep through a number of other pokemon. And with Technician, Scyther can be a humongous threat.

Scyther's new bulk also enables it to be an effective Swords Dance, Agility, or Substitute Baton Passer for added versatility.

So in your opinion, will Scyther move from UU to OU in this generation? Will it overtake its evolution in terms of usefulness?

It's definitely gained usability over Scizor as a BPer this gen, but it won't ever hit OU because of that 4x SR weakness and lack of type coverage compared to Scizor.

Zachmac
30th April 2011, 9:30 PM
I don't think scyther has the typing to pull it off. Weaknesses to Rock, Electric, Fire, Flying, and Ice. Not to mention it could have better defenses, and it's walled by Steel types.
Terrakion stole all hope of Scyther getting any good, it outspeeds and murders it with Stone Edge. Really? Saying that it can't be used because of one pokemon? Okay, then, let's not use Scizor, Ferrothorn, Fortress, Tyranitar, Genesect, Hydregon, ect., because of Infernape.

Karzon
30th April 2011, 10:02 PM
I Really? Saying that it can't be used because of one pokemon? Okay, then, let's not use Scizor, Ferrothorn, Fortress, Tyranitar, Genesect, Hydregon, ect., because of Infernape.

We already don't use Infernape because of Starmie and Slowbro...But we don't use Starmie because of Shedinja. Slowbro is ok, because he learns flamethrower.


It looks like it could work. Maybe not OU worthy, but it could be fun to play with.

jesusfreak94
30th April 2011, 10:03 PM
We already don't use Infernape because of Starmie and Slowbro...But we don't use Starmie because of Shedinja. Slowbro is ok, because he learns flamethrower.


Um...what?

Witchan
30th April 2011, 10:09 PM
Even with Eviolite, Scyther doesn't stand a chance against powerful sweepers with super effective moves, unless there's Light Screen and Reflect support. That's why I prefer Scizor over Eviolite Syther anyway, not only because he's good at physical attacking and having Toxic immunity.

SomeoneIGuess
1st May 2011, 5:17 AM
Depends, I guess.

Scyther's typing is crap, but the speed lets him sweep better than Scizor. Until you find out he doesn't have Acrobatics or Superpower. Then you know that Scizor wins him hands down.

Use Scizor unless you want Scyther's Ground and Fighting Immunity/Resistances. But I'd use Escaliver over Scizor if he had a better movepool.

Zachmac
1st May 2011, 6:07 AM
Um...what?

...s/he is just stacking onto my argument that a pokemon can't go to NU or UU because of a single pokemon.

shotdown911
2nd May 2011, 4:18 AM
i can't see eviolite scyther being better than scizor at all. first up is the obvious stealth rock weakness, which kills any attempt at being bulky. next up is, despite the extra bulk, the typing is bad enough to offset it. i'd probably use scizor any day.

Agreed, If Scyther had that bug/steel typing I think it would be a different story, but it doesn't and with the Evolite you lose STAB Acrobatics and Life Orb, so it would be tough for Scyther to get anywhere other than being a good UU or NFE poke.

bean1706
2nd May 2011, 2:55 PM
After using both on random battles for a few games I can easily say that scizor is better. Scyther's just too fragile and can't take hits from big hitting pokemon such as garchomp. Plus I just sweeped their whole team with scizor so he's better :)

Haxorusfan
7th May 2011, 4:08 AM
I like Choise Band Scizor, But Sword Dance evo stone scyther

DoubleJG3288
7th May 2011, 4:20 AM
Keep the Eviolite on 'mons that can make better use of it, such as Dusclops and Chansey. Scizor is beastly enough, and although Stealth Rock isn't all that common in random battles, the heavy hitters are still to be feared.

Porgon-XYZ
7th May 2011, 4:26 AM
Scizor has a Steel typing, with only 1 weakness, which means it will still take less damage from most attacks even if his defenses aren't as high. Typing is all that matters.

Haxorusfan
7th May 2011, 4:28 AM
Scizor is much better also cause of Stealth Rock damage

legendarypokemonmaster
7th May 2011, 5:45 AM
Scyther with Evolite might work in Little Cup, brcause it is killed by to many rock moves outside of Little Cup.

Infectious
7th May 2011, 6:29 PM
More than half the people in this topic act as if Rapid Spin doesn't exist. Volcarona has x4 Rock weakness, yet people use it. On sun teams, Charizard is used, even with its x4 weakness. Zapdos, Gyarados, Dragonite, Mence, and Chandelure are used, they have weakness to SR, that doesn't stop people from using them. I'm not saying scyther is superior, I'm just pointing out that rapid spin exists, and common pokes with SR weakness exist too.

Dattebayo
7th May 2011, 6:37 PM
It's because there are other Pokemon who do things better than Scyther, even its full evolved form.

JASP01
11th May 2011, 3:09 AM
I always liked the idea of using Scyther over Scizor.
Technician+Bug Bite+Aerial Ace/Acrobatics+_____ sounds good.
*However*, what you're doing sounds like a bad idea. Too many weaknesses. Scizor gains defenses, Scyther is clearly a sweep.
Still, I think more people should give Scyther a try.

RifleAvenger
11th May 2011, 3:15 AM
In OU, go for Scizor. Even with Evolite, Scyther is frail, and evolite takes away the items it needs to deal higher damage. Scizor's, technician boosted, STAB priority in bullet punch means that the loss of speed from Scyther doesn't matter so much.

In lower tiers, Scyther could prove very useful.

Agonist
11th May 2011, 3:18 AM
Scyther with a eviolite might make a decent bulkyish swords dancer in uu, but in standard, always use scizor over scyther

Sizerdrix
11th May 2011, 1:21 PM
OU Ranked stats, as of April 2011
3 | Scizor | 112589 | 18.7871
153 | Scyther | 2990 | 0.4989

Enough said.

Venomfang
12th May 2011, 12:21 AM
Syther. It's fast, strong, and with evolite it has good defence.

WeatherEffectRain
22nd June 2011, 11:56 PM
I'm just gonna ignore all these posts and give a word. Scyther is a big threat in RU, where my RU team can just barely handle it due to Claydol with SR. I can't for the life of me remember what set he used though.

But, yeah, Scyther is huge in RU.

mudkips
23rd June 2011, 12:39 AM
Scyther with Evolite might work in Little Cup, brcause it is killed by to many rock moves outside of Little Cup.

too bad scyther is banned in little cup..... anyway as said scyther is awesome in RU, but in OU always use scizor

Zachmac
23rd June 2011, 12:50 AM
Scyther could make a good subsalac/subleichi. With SR around, and it's typing, I wouldn't suggest trying eviolite. Subberry doesn't care about SR, in fact, it just means you need only one substitute.

I find it annoying how Scyther, 105 speed with the flying type doesn't get acrobatics, but Scizor, 65 speed and the steel type, does.

NukeRider
23rd June 2011, 1:15 AM
scyther will stay in uu. though with the eviolite he gets a defense boost, he loses leftovers or life orb. Scyther will become very predictable, and easy to defeat. Also, he's still x4 weak to stealth rock. No way he can claw his way into ou

Moneyy
23rd June 2011, 1:38 AM
I will be using Scyther a lot now. I like Scizor but Scyther is better in both design and battling in my opinion.

SuperNUuser
5th November 2012, 11:18 AM
Yeah yeah, Scyther has its crappy typing and the HUMONGOUS stealth rock weakness... But in my opinion, I'd use Scyther more. In the world OU, there are a bunch of fire types, wrecking my Scizor every day. With Eviolite, Scyther is superior in defenses so which mean, it's quite better in most of the stats. It's bulk may me mediocore with at least solid defenses and horrible hp, but other than speed, defense and attack, both Scyther and Scizor are equals and not counting the Evolution difference. They would rather be totally different Pokémon like Pinsir and Heracross than be an evolution line.
However, in the world of UU, RU and NU, Rock Types are abundant but my Scyther survived a whooping Rock Slide from an Aggron. Scizor can also survive it's greatest weakness with Iron Defense, Substitude and other defensive support moves its movepool can offer. So, both Pokémon are equals in terms of stats and since Scizor has only one weakness which is a HUGE one while Scyther has over a trillion weaknesses, I'd say I recommend Scizor but I still like Scyther more. Hey! It's my opinion so don't take me too seriously!

jesusfreak94
5th November 2012, 12:14 PM
Please don't bump old threads.