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Kaji Motomiya
14th September 2011, 5:13 AM
Remember my old deck? The one about recycling and reusing Energies for Fire Pokemon? This deck? (http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?t=458437)

I look back at it after I completed it, and I tell myself...I'm so stupid. It can never pass for anything. I even tried using it against my friend, and it was BEYOND slow. Set-up and everything. So I thought about it some more: how can I set-up while defending myself ASAP?

The answer came to less Pokemon lines, more Pokemon finding. And thus, it spawned my new Typhlosion Fire Deck (still in the works).

--

;157;

Pokemon - 29
x4 Cyndaquil (HeartGold SoulSilver 61/123) - Quilava (HeartGold SoulSilver 49/123 and/or Call of Legends 49/95) - Typhlosion (x2 HeartGold SoulSilver 32/123 and/or Call of Legends 35/95) and x2 Prime (HeartGold SoulSilver 110/123 and/or HGSS09 Promo)
x3 Hoothoot(HeartGold SoulSilver 66/123) - Noctowl(HeartGold SoulSilver 8/123)
x3 Stantler (HS Unleashed 64/95)
x2 Vulpix (HeartGold SoulSilver 87/123 and/or Call of Legends 75/95) - Ninetails (HeartGold SoulSilver 7/123 and/or Call of Legends 17/95 and/or HS Unleashed 20/95)
x2 Lillipup (Black & White 81/114) - Herdier (Black & White 82/114)

Trainer - 6
x2 Energy Retrieval (Black & White 92/114)
x2 Pokemon Communication (HeartGold SoulSilver 98/123 and/or Black & White 99/114)
x1 Pokegear 3.0 (HeartGold SoulSilver 96/123)
x1 Great Ball (BW Emerging Powers 93/98)

Supporter - 10
x4 Cheren (BW Emerging Powers 91/98)
x3 Fisherman (HeartGold SoulSilver 92/123)
x2 Engineer's Adjustments(HS Unleashed 75/95)
x1 Pokemon Collector (HeartGold SoulSilver 97/123)

Energy - 15
Fire Energy x15

;157;

--

But looking at this deck, I realized that something was lacking. There's Firepower, but no Firestarter. That's when I read Ninetails' (ability and non-ability) effect closely and found that I could manipulate this in some way. The answer was this:

--

;038;

Pokemon - 32
x4 Vulpix (HeartGold SoulSilver 87/123 and/or Call of Legends 75/95) - Ninetails (x2 HeartGold SoulSilver 7/123 and x2 Call of Legends 17/95 and/or HS Unleashed 20/95)
x4 Reshiram ((Black & White 26/114 or Black & White 113/114)
x4 Hoothoot(HeartGold SoulSilver 66/123) - Noctowl(HeartGold SoulSilver 8/123)
x3 Cyndaquil (HeartGold SoulSilver 61/123 or Call of Legends 55/95) - Quilava (HeartGold SoulSilver 49/123 and/or Call of Legends 49/95) - Typhlosion (x1 HeartGold SoulSilver 32/123 and/or Call of Legends 35/95) and x2 Prime (HeartGold SoulSilver 110/123 and/or HGSS09 Promo)
x3 Girafarig (HeartGold SoulSilver 64/123)

Trainer - 4
x4 Great Ball (BW Emerging Powers 93/98)

Supporter - 9
x4 Cheren (BW Emerging Powers 91/98)
x3 Pokemon Collector (HeartGold SoulSilver 97/123)
x2 Professor Elm's Training Method (HeartGold SoulSilver 100/123)

Energy - 15
Fire Energy x15

;038;

--

;203;

Two Pokemon inspired me to make this deck: Ninetails during my search for it, and Girafarig when I found it in my IRL collection and noticed its effect of "Show Off". The only main attacker is Typhlosion and/or Typhlosion Prime, which is kind of risky considering the set-up this deck follows.

The Trainer and Supporter cards deal with constant searching. While the Cherens mainly just "Draw 3 cards", the Pokemon Collectors and Profesoor Elm's Training Methods search for specifics: basics and Evolutions. And most of what the set-up needs are the following:
3 Vulpix, Hoothoot, Girafarig, and probably a Reshiram or 2 (<--at least 2 to 3 Pokemon Collectors are needed), and 3 Ninetails (2 HGSS/CL and 1 Unl), and Noctowl (Elms may not be enough, so the Great Balls and Cherens will have to help).

Now the Pokemon set-up must be like so:

Girafarig is or should be the first active Pokemon. It has 70 HP, which is good for a Basic, and enough to start lighting the fire. Its attack, "Show Off", spends a turn searching for 2 Fire Energy to add to the hand. Accumulate enough, if not all, and set-up for the second wave while Girafarig is sacrificed to the slaughter.
At least 2 Vulpix and a Hoothoot should be in the Bench. They are needed for evolving for their Poke-Powers: Roast Reveal and Night Sight. Girafarig's sacrifice comes in play. Roast Reveal can discard 1 Fire Energy to draw 3 cards. With multiple Ninetails (HGSS/CL) in the bench, you can draw up to six cards per turn, plus 1 from Noctowl's Night Sight!
One of the four Vulpix in the deck must be the active Pokemon after Girafarig, and it has to evolve into the Unleashed Ninetails for Heat Acceleration. It can spend the turn to search up to 3 Fire Energy from the discard pile and attach them to one of your Benched Pokemon. This is the deck's "Firestarter Effect". I discovered the usefulness of this in one practice battle. The Fire Energies discarded by the two benched Ninetails is used for this. The Firestarter is made to help build up the main attacker, Typhlosion/Prime and any capable fighting Pokemon (in this case, either the two Ninetails with their 60 Damage Will-o'-the-wisp attack or a Reshiram who should've been in the set-up ASAP).
It'll be inevitable that Unleashed Ninetails will get owned before all 15 Energies in the deck are used up. That is why setting up the main offensive Pokemon is the most top priority before working with the back-up (except Noctowl).


I will admit one thing about the deck. It's not very well built, and it's MONDO slow. I just wanted an opinion on it. So what do you think? A lot better than my old deck?

ven?
14th September 2011, 8:09 PM
Nobody cares about what basics you use, plus this is to messy, all we care about is, what prime, what card, use abbreviations like this...

4-4-4 Typhlosion hgss or col 2/2 prime

it's clean, it's easy to under stand, and it's not confusing to understand what is of each card you're running. Why runn abbreviations for a card's set? it make's it clean, a majority of the time when doing this everyone knows or owns at least half to all the cards in you're deck, just giving the basic understanding of what card you're running let's them know what card you're using almost instantaneously, the more info or the least amount of info you're using makes things far to complicated on both of our ends in both typing and reading the deck list.

noctowl get rid of it. Ninetails, typhlosion and reshiram is a combo in on it's own, adding any additional cards would just be more tech cards like cleffa or smeargle or maybe Rayquaza & deoxy's legend. Take out the giraffe put in some cleffa (at least the cleffa can hold out against an early tko unlike the giraffe).

You're T/S/S line try this
3 dual ball
1-2 collector
4 pokemon communication's
3 rare candy
4 professor oaks new theory
2 elms training

this is a good, solid and fast skeleton to work with, it's made for stage evo deck lines and gives lot's of fast options for puling out any card.

Kaji Motomiya
15th September 2011, 1:42 AM
Sorry, I had those straight out from my notes in Notepad, and these were mainly reference notes to me to find which ones I want. I'm VERY specific and OCD about these things. XD Details are very important to me.

Now, I won't argue with your choice of cards, but I want to question them. I can understand why Collector is so small, because Supporters can only be used once per turn.

So my question is, why Dual Ball instead of Great Ball? Is it because Dual Ball can make you choose your card instead of risking finding nothing with the Great Ball when you look for the top 7? Because I feel that it's two-coin effect is as risky as finding nothing in your top 7. Then again, you'd get a chance of getting 2 heads, 1 heads, or no heads.

As for Rare Candies, will they serve to evolve as soon as the Basic Pokemon or evolved Pokemon is played? If so, when do you think is the best time to use them and on which Pokemon?

And what will I do if I fail on keeping Cleffa asleep? It could get beaten in (depending on the Pokemon out) one attack...I felt having Noctowl around would be okay because it, being in the bench, can activate its Poke-Power with Ninetails (HGSS/CoL) once every turn as compared to being the active Pokemon.

ven?
15th September 2011, 4:24 AM
collector: I was giving a base number to collector, as well collector is a supporter which does take you're supporter turn, and in this kind of meta it's always better to have a card that's going to allow you to refresh you're hand each turn instead of searching for 3 basic.

dual ball: lets you search for two basic pokemon times the number of heads, this card is a faster and much more popular version to use collector's allowing you the option to thin out you're deck of extra cards (dual ball) and setup you're bench at the same time. Great balls errata was changed to looking at the top 7 cards, it's still not always the best option but it's a solid one.

rare candies: due to the errata yes you have to wait a turn until after you set a basic down however it does speed up the evo of you're stage 2 by a turn reducing the evolution to 2 turns instead of 3.

cleffa: yes if cleffa does die that is problematic, however you just got a new card of 6 and didn't have to waste a trainer or a supporter, so it depends on what you want to use it for.

These are 4 popular cards for stage 2 decks though.

Kaji Motomiya
15th September 2011, 6:01 AM
So I took your advice and tried calculating everything.

-4 Hoothoot-Noctowl
-3 Girafarig
And I ASSUME
-4 Great Ball
-4 Cheren
-1 Pkmn Coll.

That's -15 cards (40). And adding...

3 Cleffa (replacing the Girafarig)
3 Dual Ball
4 Pkmn Comm.
3 Rare Candy
4 Prof. Oak's Theory

That leaves me with 57 out of 60 cards. What should I throw in for that extra 3? More Collectors (currently at 2 as of this count) and a Dual Ball? Or maybe throw in another Cleffa?

ven?
15th September 2011, 7:00 PM
Idea here shaymin, max potion, and seeker's, basically use typlosions ability on typhlosion, build up enough damage counters then heal it instantly, and use the shaymin and seeker's to move the energy around.

Kaji Motomiya
16th September 2011, 3:52 PM
Taking your advice into consideration, I now just realized that if Rare Candies can let me skip a Stage 1, then I don't need Quilava in the deck, and I can put the Max Potions in. Is that right?

ven?
17th September 2011, 10:18 AM
If it works sure, but it's always good to keep 1 quilava just in case of not being able to run a rare candy or trainer lock.