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View Full Version : New to this Metagame, and I like it (Gen III CRMT)



M4zz
25th December 2011, 2:14 AM
.::Team at a glance::.
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/094.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/251.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/121.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/227.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/143.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/376.png


http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/094.png
Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 172 HP / 148 SAtk / 188 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Ice Punch / Fire Punch
- Thunderbolt
- Giga Drain
- Hypnosis

I decided to run Gengar in my lead slot to basically put things to sleep, etc. Actually, I don't even know how leads work in this generation, which is why I need some help with this team. Gengar handles a load of things very well, and is basically shut down by only things that have CM, Regice, or Blissey. Ice Punch hits Grass Types and Celebi and Dragon Types like Salamence, but I've been debating if I should have Fire Punch there instead, mainly for better coverage against steel types, but I am undecided. Thunderbolt hits Gyarados, and any other Water or Flying type out there. Giga Drain goes Hand-in-hand with Hypnosis, as it's one of Gengar's best forms of self-recovery and is one of his strongest attacks.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/251.png
Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Leech Seed
- Psychic
- Heal Bell
- Recover

Celebi brings some bulk tot he team, helping slow down things like Metagross. Leech Seed, Leftovers, and Recover keep her HP at a high number and allow for her to take multiple hits. Heal Bell is team support, as three of my Pokemon run Rest, bringing them back into the game much quicker. Psychic prevents Celebi from becoming Taunt-fodder, and helps hit Machamp and Weezing.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/121.png
Starmie @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 240 HP / 240 Sp.Atk / 28 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin
- Recover

Coming in to replace an unnecessary Water-Type on the team, Starmie finally gives me an answer to the hundreds of layers of Spikes that I've needed to play around and an answer to the likes of Salamence. I've chosen to run Surf / Ice Beam because Gengar already carries Thunderbolt, which gives me the answer for Gyarados. Surf is STAB, hitting things like Tyranitar and Houndoom that have no business touching Starmie, and if I were to carry BoltBeam instead, would beat its *** down. Ice Beam, as mentioned, hits Salamence, removing that problem, and can also hit things like Celebi and other Grass Types that would normally sponge up Surf. Rapid Spin supports the team by clearing away Spikes, and Recover maintains Starmie's health throughout the match.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/227.png
Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Keen Eye
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Atk / 184 Def / 12 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Drill Peck
- Roar
- Rest

The defensive wall of the team, Skarmory helps Pokemon like Gengar and Snorlax complete their sweeps easier through the abuse of Spikes. The ability to knock off 25% of a non-Levitating or Flying-Type Pokemon is tremendous, as some of my sweepers really need the added push with Leftovers being so prevalent in the Metagame. Couple that with a Phazing move, Roar, and we have ourselves something to pass the time with. Rest keeps this Tin Bird's rusty *** from becoming too beat down that it's unsalvagable, and Drill Peck prevents myself from becoming Taunt-fodder, and gives me something to hit Celebi with.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/143.png
Snorlax (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 144 HP / 68 Atk / 132 Def / 164 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Curse
- Shadow Ball
- Body Slam
- Rest

This. Thing. Can. And. Does. Wreck. Weakened. Teams. Especially once Gengar, Dusclops, and Skarmory have been removed from play, as it leaves the equivalent to zero left to really shut it down. Add in three or four Curses, mix that with his great bulk, and we have ourselves a broken Metagame. Body Slam is excelent STAb for Snorlax, as it has the off-chance of Paralyzing things, and potentially slowing or shutting them down. Shadow Ball hits the Ghost-Types that resist Body Slam, and does a number to Gengar and Celebi. Rest deals with Toxic oh so well and maintains his bulk so well, it's like throwing salt on your opponent's paper cut.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/376.png
Metagross @ Choice Band
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Meteor Mash
- Rock Slide
- Explosion

If the above Physical threat wasn't enough, then ladies, gentlemen, and hybrids, I give to you, Choice Band Metagross, sporting +600 attack and the most Powerful move to ever exist. Explosion. It's a very damaging move, but at the cost of your own Pokemon, will usually bring anything not named Full-Health Skarmory and Ghost Types with it, and I'm not even sure that Skarmory will live it. Earthquake and Rock Slide make a quazi Quake-Edge combo, hitting quite a few things in the Metagame, and Meteor Mash is excelent STAB that may even raise Metagross' attack stat.


Well, there's the team. It's doing fairly well right now, I'm sitting at 18th on the Smogon ADV ladder. Any comments questions, or concerns?

Aura Sensei™
25th December 2011, 6:39 PM
Skarmory could use Steel Wing over Rest for added coverage.Only one concern,2 of your pokemon are weak to electric(Suicune and Skarmory).Other than that,team is very diverse.:D

meteor64
2nd January 2012, 8:10 PM
.::Team at a glance::.
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/094.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/251.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/245.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/227.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/143.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/376.png


http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/094.png
Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 172 HP / 148 SAtk / 188 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Ice Punch / Fire Punch
- Thunderbolt
- Dream Eater
- Hypnosis
Dream Eater is a terrible move, its easy to play around and useless when your opponent is not asleep, by which I mean paralyzed by Lax, or even on Rest-talkers- do you really want to stay in on Zapdos Sleep talk just to use Dream Eater?
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/251.png
Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Leech Seed
- Psychic
- Heal Bell
- Recover
Fine.
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/245.png
Suicune @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 60 SAtk / 8 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Surf
- Roar
- Rest
Fine also.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/227.png
Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Keen Eye
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Atk / 184 Def / 12 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Drill Peck
- Roar
- Rest
Use Hidden Power and Whirlwind always, people. I don't know how many times I say this, but the extra power of Drill Peck is rarely if ever going to do something HP Flying doesn't, and Whirlwind gives you protection versus Baton Pass teams, who will undoubtedly trample on you without it.
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/frlg/143.png
Snorlax (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 144 HP / 68 Atk / 132 Def / 164 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Curse
- Earthquake
- Body Slam
- Rest
Shadow Ball is standard for a reason, its not like using EQ will make a difference in damage after Cursing up.
http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/376.png
Metagross @ Choice Band
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Meteor Mash
- Rock Slide
- Explosion
Fine, but watch out for Magneton if you pick RS or MM

Well, there's the team. It's doing fairly well right now, I'm sitting at 18th on the Smogon ADV ladder. Any comments questions, or concerns? You have no spinner. Thats pretty crucial. As it is, Forrettress and Cloyster will have a whale of a time on your team.

I've probably come across as overly critical,
but thats the purpose here, is it not? Your team can at least cover all the common threats, so that alone makes it viable, but I reckon itll need a few minor tweaks and some good play it can succeed. I can happily test this for you at somr point if you wish.

M4zz
2nd January 2012, 8:51 PM
You have no spinner. Thats pretty crucial. As it is, Forrettress and Cloyster will have a whale of a time on your team.

I've probably come across as overly critical,
but thats the purpose here, is it not? Your team can at least cover all the common threats, so that alone makes it viable, but I reckon itll need a few minor tweaks and some good play it can succeed. I can happily test this for you at somr point if you wish.

The need for a spinner would greatly help. I've debated replacing it with Metagross, as he really doesn't help the team much more. Also, I'm finding Pokemon like Gengar, Gyarados, and Salamence to be a bit of a problem with my team. Any ideas on how to fix this?

meteor64
3rd January 2012, 12:11 AM
The need for a spinner would greatly help. I've debated replacing it with Metagross, as he really doesn't help the team much more. Also, I'm finding Pokemon like Gengar, Gyarados, and Salamence to be a bit of a problem with my team. Any ideas on how to fix this?

My answer would be Claydol or Starmie, depending on which is more irksome. With Starmie you can run Surf, TB, Recover, and spin, but Mence still gives problems unless you run or bluff Ice Beam, but that opens up a whole other can of worms - still, it might be appropriate for your team to run boltbeam. Claydol can run Psychic, Ice Beam, Rapid Spin and Explosion( for Gyarados). Gengar shouldnt be a problem because, as I said, Shadow Ball is standard on Lax for a reason.

Aura Sensei™
3rd January 2012, 12:18 AM
Or Boltbeam,and Rapid Spin.

meteor64
3rd January 2012, 12:42 AM
Or Boltbeam,and Rapid Spin.

The problem with Boltbeam on Starmie is that you lose out on something important- whether it be STAB, Recover or Spin. Now, since we are including Starmie to patch up holes and spin, obviously we cant lose Rapid Spin. So it comes down to Surf or Recover. Surf would be the first thing to consider, since it doesnt technically aid it directly at its role in the team, right? Wrong. Often hitting something on the switch with STAB Surf can turn mid-game into end-game- a simple prediction with Surf can spell the end for many teams. The added power behind a Surf can really spell the game a lot more of the time than you'd expect. Pretty much every Starmie sweep relies on Surf, and even on teams where the object isnt to get a Starmie sweep, you'll be surprised how easily it does it anyway.

So then theres Recover. Dont leave out Recover on Starmie EVER. Its just not cool, almost all usefulness it has flies out the window without Recover.

Looking at the circumstances, the best options are to run Surf or Ice Beam, then Thunderbolt, Spin and Recover. Its pretty much 50/50 what will serve you better, from what I can make out, and your best bet is to test both and see what happens..

Aura Sensei™
3rd January 2012, 11:07 PM
Yeah,I guess you're right.

M4zz
3rd January 2012, 11:23 PM
The starmie idea sounds good. I presume just remove Suicune for it?

meteor64
4th January 2012, 12:31 AM
The starmie idea sounds good. I presume just remove Suicune for it?

You said Metagross wasn't pulling the weight, but Suicune is feasible, although I reckon it'd change the direction of your team if you do lose it. Nevertheless, I can totally see Metagross Exploding on Bliss to make way for a Starmie sweep, I do a similar tactic with Dugtrio.

Aura Sensei™
4th January 2012, 11:46 PM
I wouldn't get rid of Suicune,honestly.

meteor64
5th January 2012, 1:24 AM
I wouldn't get rid of Suicune,honestly.

Reasoning?
Suicune isnt exactly doing anything Starmie isn't except providing bulk, which he already has in Skarm, Gross, Lax, Celebi. Starmie simply fits better. Cune can phaze, but so can skarm, and ultimately faces the same problems in attempting to phaze raikou, jirachi, zam, etc. In fact, looking back on it, Cune really has no place on this team. Anything it does is done by either another member of the team or just another water type.

However it does mean Starmie must carry Surf if there is no Cune. Otherwise you just die to T-tar, no questions asked.

As a side note, I reckon Metagross should go in lead. Itll allow you to scout for Skarm or Forry as soon as possible, which will both provide problems for Lax and Metagross, yet are completely countered by Starmie (excepting HP bug forry, who Gengar can deal with). Itll also make your opponent show their Zapdos or bulky Water, who Snorlax will deal with. In short, leading with Metagross will allow you to glean information on their Metagross check guaranteed, which will likely be very useful in the long run.

Aura Sensei™
6th January 2012, 12:08 AM
Good ponit,he should get rid of Suicune.But Starmie's moves aren't chosen yet.

DragonXmicro
6th January 2012, 1:57 AM
There's something bad here. With the insane amount of fire type usage in the third Gen, you have half your team weak to it. Two resist, bar getting snorlax skill swapped. So adding starmie for metagross is a good idea, and I like your gengar, while u can spin and set hazards, u can also spinblock with it. Good job, other than fire fighting weak, good team.

Now that I mention it, Blaziken in sun would royally **** this team, bar gengar

meteor64
6th January 2012, 11:55 AM
There's something bad here. With the insane amount of fire type usage in the third Gen,
...What?
Have you even played 3rd gen? Blaziken is barely even OU any more, and the only time you'll normally see a Fire move outside of that is on DDMence, the odd T-tar, or a relatively rare Houndoom.

The most common special attacks are Ice Beam, Hidden Power Grass and Psychic, followed by Surf and Thunderbolt.


Two resist
More than enough.


bar getting snorlax skill swapped.
lol, never seen Skill Swap in my life, ever, and Snorlax will still tank any special hit even without Thick Fat. Max Sp.Atk Zapdos does around 25-30% with Thunderbolt I think, then takes a Body Slam to the face.


Good job, other than fire fighting weak, good team.

Nobody really cares about Fighting either, Mence, Zapdos, Gengar and Celebi are all way too common for Fighting to be the ultra viable type it is in later Gens. Granted, Heracross and Medicham are beasts, but thats nothing to do with STAB Fighting. Also, Hidden Power Flying and Psychic are just way too dominant in this metagame to consider bulkier options like Hariyama and Machamp on most teams (though they are perfectly useable)

And how is his team weak to Fighting? He has Celebi, Gengar and probably Starmie... you could say he has to worry about Medicham, but EVERY team has to worry about Medicham. Its insanely scary.


Now that I mention it, Blaziken in sun would royally **** this team,
Barely anyone bothers with Sunny Day. That's being lenient. In my entire career of ADV, I've seen it... twice?


I'm sorry, but just reading this gives me the impression you just don't know what you're on about and have never played it before. If you do, then I'm not sure what sort of people you've played against, but they can't be brilliant.

DragonXmicro
6th January 2012, 2:11 PM
No, they were pretty good. I've seen sunny day on about fifty or so teams, and saying this through my own experiences.

meteor64
6th January 2012, 3:42 PM
No, they were pretty good. I've seen sunny day on about fifty or so teams, and saying this through my own experiences.

Dude, the only times you will ever, EVER see Sunny Day are on Charizard, Exeggutor or Houndoom, who have other, more versatile sets to run most of the time. And these Pokemon aren't even common- looking at last months statistics-

# 30 - Charizard (5.11 %), has Sunny Day 22.51% of the time
# 33 - Houndoom (4.73 %), has Sunny Day 13.26% of the time
# 67 - Exeggutor (1.32 %), has Sunny Day 35.64% of the time

And even if any of these cropped up with Sunny Day, the only one that would actually be troublesome is Exeggutor with Leech Seed, because you can just wall the crap out of the other two with Lax. Boosted Fire moves mean nothing when you have massive HP, good Sp. Def, Thick Fat and STAB Body Slam.

Sunny Day is not, and never will be, a legitimate threat in Adv. It doesn't do anything worthwhile enough to warrant its place on teams, and more often than not you're just limiting yourself and letting your team get destroyed by one of the many common threats that laugh at it- "Woo boosted Fire moves, I sure hope they don't have Blissey/Snorlax/Suicune/Tyranitar/Salamence/Houndoom/Aerodactyl/Insert pokemon which laughs at Sunny Day here"

Fire moves have a very specific role in Adv and are just plain not common, much less STABed. Blaziken is barely OU (at 5.12% usage) and whaddaya know- Starmie covers it! Every other Fire type can be covered by Lax. You're seeing problems that just aren't there.

JASON221
6th January 2012, 4:29 PM
Good thinking.. http://www.kread.info/g.gif

M4zz
6th January 2012, 10:56 PM
Wow. I figured this part of the competative section was dead. So here goes nothing:

In short, here's the change I've made.

Starmie>Suicune

Starmie will be running Surf and Ice Beam, seeing that Gengar carries Thunderbolt. Starmie provides to the team something what its replacing never could - a way to hit Salamence. Starmie also helps with the insane Spikes weakness on the team and gives me another way to hit Skarmory.

meteor64
7th January 2012, 12:18 AM
Wow. I figured this part of the competative section was dead. So here goes nothing:

In short, here's the change I've made.

Starmie>Suicune

Starmie will be running Surf and Ice Beam, seeing that Gengar carries Thunderbolt. Starmie provides to the team something what its replacing never could - a way to hit Salamence. Starmie also helps with the insane Spikes weakness on the team and gives me another way to hit Skarmory.
Just to make sure, you have got rid of Dream Eater on Gengar and Earthquake on Lax, right?

M4zz
7th January 2012, 1:04 AM
Just to make sure, you have got rid of Dream Eater on Gengar and Earthquake on Lax, right?

Forgot to add that. Yes, I have.

meteor64
7th January 2012, 3:53 AM
Forgot to add that. Yes, I have.

Well then I'd say it's pretty much set. You might want to edit the OP to make it easier for others to analyse what you have, rather than what you had :P

Crystal_
10th January 2012, 11:30 PM
The team looks pretty good. You WILL want Metagross, to explode into Skarm and open up Snorlax.
I wouldn't say you need spin per say, but it's true it will really help you. You can still use Forr for spikes+spin in one, which lets you use spikes shuffling Suicune while still having spin (it's not so good as a spinner though, and won't spin vs ghosts).
And lastly you could also make Gengar exploder if you think you can explode into Blissey. FPunch is good too, but Gengar can honestly do a lot of things anyway, and Giga+Hypnosis is still pretty good. You will probably want ice for Zapdos.