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Weedy Spyze
16th July 2012, 9:40 PM
Alright, well here's my real first attempt at a fanfiction ever.

I'm a big fan of the Pokemon Adventures manga, and if you frequented that part of the forums in the past two weeks or so I'm sure you've noticed me posting over there. I've been discussing with the many different good people of that section of the forum about some things we like and dislike about the manga, and it's given me a lot of different ideas on how I personally would change it to hopefully improve it. And after brainstorming these ideas over the past couple of days, I've finally decided to put my money where my mouth is and post my own fanfiction, a rewrite of Pokemon Adventures of sorts.

That may be a bit unfair to say, though. Adventures will be a big inspiration for this fic, but the main purpose of this fic is to write my own personal adaptation of the plotlines. So, I'll be doing plenty of changes, and will probably even do some of my personal ideas/storylines that are unique from the manga, as well as some things that came from the games but didn't make it to the manga. I know plenty of people have written an adaptation of Red & Blue in the past, but hopefully mine will entertain you as well.

I only have a prologue of sorts done at the moment, so I'm gonna go ahead and post it. There isn't much to review here, but I hope it will be enough to pique your interest and tide you over for the first real chapter. So, without further ado: here it is.

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*chapter in process of being rewritten*

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DMerle
16th July 2012, 10:03 PM
I couldn't find any actual mistakes but there are a few things like this.


A young boy, no more than eleven years of age, was sitting on the bottom of a bunk bed

It's a little confusing as it is because you have to pause and figure out if your talking about the bottom bunk, or the bottom of the bed. I'd try rewording it to just a normal bed.


A young boy, no more than eleven years of age, was sitting at the bottom of his bed.


“Red, hurry up! The other kids are already outside battling with their Pokemon!” the boy heard calling from outside the room he was in.

The last bit of this sentence is also a little confusing, maybe try;


"Red, hurry up! The other kids are already outside battling with their Pokemon!" Somebody shouted excitedly from outside his room.

All in all I did enjoy it, it was very short but I'm pretty intrigued, do you have a PM list?

Weedy Spyze
16th July 2012, 10:17 PM
I couldn't find any actual mistakes but there are a few things like this.

It's a little confusing as it is because you have to pause and figure out if your talking about the bottom bunk, or the bottom of the bed. I'd try rewording it to just a normal bed.

The last bit of this sentence is also a little confusing, maybe try;

All in all I did enjoy it, it was very short but I'm pretty intrigued, do you have a PM list?

Thanks for your feedback. I am pretty new at this, so there most likely probably will be a few errors and confusing word choice here and there. Only means there's more room to improve!

The bunk bed is sort of a plot point, though. You'll see when I post the first chapter. I'll go back and edit it a little better later, though.

I'm not quite sure what a pm list is...?

DMerle
16th July 2012, 10:29 PM
Thanks for your feedback. I am pretty new at this, so there most likely probably will be a few errors and confusing word choice here and there. Only means there's more room to improve!

The bunk bed is sort of a plot point, though. You'll see when I post the first chapter. I'll go back and edit it a little better later, though.

I'm not quite sure what a pm list is...?

No worries, there only suggestions and they are really small things at that, a PM list is just basically a list of readers who want to be notified by private message everytime you release a new chapter, that way we don't miss them if we don't have time to check, or miss the post or anything.

matt0044
16th July 2012, 11:38 PM
Interesting. I'll be checking more of this out for sure. I assume Wally's going to be Emerald for that arc. As for Red's narration, I don't hate it but mixing with a third person narration is a sort of pet peeve of mine. I'd advise not doing it for future chapters. Luckily, Pokemon Adventures/Special doesn't have that past the first chapter.

I'd say more but I'd like to wait until the next chapter. I know it'll be good.

Weedy Spyze
17th July 2012, 1:31 AM
No worries, there only suggestions and they are really small things at that, a PM list is just basically a list of readers who want to be notified by private message everytime you release a new chapter, that way we don't miss them if we don't have time to check, or miss the post or anything.

I'm sure I can do something like that, after all it can only be a good thing if someone wants to be notified of a new chapter so they don't miss it. I assume I'll have to pm everyone manually or is there some kind of more convenient system I'm not aware of lol?


Interesting. I'll be checking more of this out for sure. I assume Wally's going to be Emerald for that arc. As for Red's narration, I don't hate it but mixing with a third person narration is a sort of pet peeve of mine. I'd advise not doing it for future chapters. Luckily, Pokemon Adventures/Special doesn't have that past the first chapter.

I'd say more but I'd like to wait until the next chapter. I know it'll be good.

Yeah, the change in narration is only for the prologue, it's not gonna be in the actual story.

Thanks, I hope I don't disappoint you!

DMerle
17th July 2012, 1:36 AM
I'm sure I can do something like that, after all it can only be a good thing if someone wants to be notified of a new chapter so they don't miss it. I assume I'll have to pm everyone manually or is there some kind of more convenient system I'm not aware of lol?

If you seperate the names with a semi colon (;) you can send the message to as many people as you want at the same time.

Weedy Spyze
17th July 2012, 6:01 AM
Alright, time for the first chapter! I hope you all enjoy it.

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*chapter in process of being rewritten*

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Chapter 1 is complete! We see Red have a trainer battle, get a little bit of info on his backstory, watch him grind a bit, and then suffer his very first defeat at the hands of some mysterious Pokemon! Where will things go from here?! Well, you may already have some idea lol. But I could throw a few curve-balls in to surprise you.

Any comments and constructive criticisms are greatly appreciated. I even have a few questions for you all myself. First of all, was I way too damn detailed? I've spent the whole entire day working on this first chapter, writing and rewriting it about three different times. The first draft, it was only five pages long. But when it was all said and done, it had grown to ten pages long--double that size. To me, it may seem somewhat intimidating, so I'm eager to see what you all think.

For the record, if you couldn't tell from the text, Rick is a Bug Catcher, Ben is a Youngster, and Janice is a Lass. Their names were all taken from in-game trainers who use those exact names in FR/LG. These three won't be too important to the storyline, and were mostly just used as fodder for Red's first battle. But I may come up with some use for them again somewhere down the line.

If anyone wants to be added to a pm list, please let me know.

DMerle
17th July 2012, 9:38 AM
This was absolutely great, i really enjoyed this and for a first effort it's got a huge potential. I think the chapter length was ideal and the perfect length for me personally, not too short or long, and because it was so well-written you could of gotten away with adding even more. (Although I'm glad you ended it where you did.) The only advice I can give you at this point is to slow down a little, It's good that your pumping out material so fast but if you release chapters too often it can be a bit intimidating for potential readers, as a limit I'd try and stick to around 2 a week. Other than that like I said it was really well done and I'm thoroughly impressed, and i'd love to be on the PM list.

Also are you planning on keeping all the captures the same as in the manga, or will you be adding some of your own?

Weedy Spyze
17th July 2012, 2:01 PM
This was absolutely great, i really enjoyed this and for a first effort it's got a huge potential. I think the chapter length was ideal and the perfect length for me personally, not too short or long, and because it was so well-written you could of gotten away with adding even more. (Although I'm glad you ended it where you did.) The only advice I can give you at this point is to slow down a little, It's good that your pumping out material so fast but if you release chapters too often it can be a bit intimidating for potential readers, as a limit I'd try and stick to around 2 a week. Other than that like I said it was really well done and I'm thoroughly impressed, and i'd love to be on the PM list.

Also are you planning on keeping all the captures the same as in the manga, or will you be adding some of your own?

Thank you for your kind words, I'm really glad you enjoyed this.

There will be some differences, in fact there already is one. Red never had a Pidgeotto in the manga. Blue was the one who got Pidgeot, but here he'll probably be getting something different.

DMerle
17th July 2012, 2:57 PM
Thank you for your kind words, I'm really glad you enjoyed this.

There will be some differences, in fact there already is one. Red never had a Pidgeotto in the manga. Blue was the one who got Pidgeot, but here he'll probably be getting something different.

Ah right, It's been like 2 years since i read the original and I forgot about that lol.

anyways a few fixes;


This practiced continued for a few minutes


The practice continued for a few minutes



Just then, the boy noticed a flash of light coming from the wood of trees to his right. “Huh?” he asked, confused. “What was that?”

The boy stared at the trees for a few moments more, and after not noticing anything else out of the ordinary after a minute or two, shrugged and began on his journey back to Pallet Town again. But just as suddenly, he saw another flash out of the corner of his right eye again.

“Ok, I know I saw some kind of flash of light this time!” the boy exclaimed. His curiosity getting the best of him, the boy set off into the woods to investigate.

Here basically you refer to Red as "the boy" to many times, we've already been introduced to him as a character and know who he is so he should be called predominantly Red when being referred to, and he will suffice if his name has been mentioned in the same paragraph. "The boy" is OK, but i'd try and refrain from using it to often.


Just then, Red noticed a flash of light coming from the wood of trees to his right. “Huh?” he asked, confused. “What was that?”

He stared at the trees for a few moments longer, not seeing anything else out of the ordinary, he shrugged and began on his journey back to Pallet Town again. But just as suddenly, he saw another flash out of the corner of his eye again.

"Ok, I know I saw some kind of flash of light this time!” He exclaimed. His curiosity getting the best of him, Red set off into the woods to investigate.



The boy came across a small clearing in the trees. Standing in front of him in the clearing, he spotted another boy. This boy had spiky brown hair. His back was to him, so Red couldn't see his face, although if he had to guess he would assume that this boy was around the same age as him. “Who is that?” he asked to himself. He then glanced over to what the other boy was looking at. “And...wh-hat is that?!”

The boy was facing a floating pink...thing? Red wasn't sure how to describe this creature. It was definitely pink in color, he could tell that. It had a face sort of resembling a cat, and a very long tail. What was most puzzling to Red however was the fact that this creature was floating in the air.


Here you've done the same thing, you started referring to Red as "the boy" then used it to describe the other character at the same time which is kind of confusing, also you'll notice that you call him "the boy" several times before mentioning he looked around the same age as Red so up to that point you shouldn't really refer to him as that, as the reader doesn't know his age.


Red came across a small clearing in the trees. Standing in front of him in the clearing, he spotted someone else. He had spiky brown hair. His back was to him, so Red couldn't see his face, although if he had to guess he would assume that he was around the same age as him. “Who is that?” he asked to himself. He then glanced over to what the other boy was looking at. “And...wh-hat is that?!”

The boy was facing a floating pink...thing? Red wasn't sure how to describe this creature. It was definitely pink in color, he could tell that. It had a face sort of resembling a cat, and a very long tail. What was most puzzling to Red however was the fact that this creature was floating in the air.

Weedy Spyze
17th July 2012, 3:45 PM
Well I can see how I may have unconciously used that word choice too often. I went back and did a few edits, hopefully it's not as confusing or whatever any more. That's the only suggestion of your's I really agree with, though.

And I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't rewrite these fixes/suggestions yourself (or if you do, don't post it here for me to see). I really don't want to copy your words and place them in my story, and all the quote tags in your posts kind of made it confusing for me to read as well. I know you're just trying to give examples for fixes or whatever, but I really don't need any examples.

matt0044
17th July 2012, 7:27 PM
Nice first chapter. I love the explanation that Red's an orphan and giving him Ash's last name. BTW, where's Team Rocket? I guess they weren't important to the chapter enough so that's fine. Nice novelization of Pokemon Adventures.

Weedy Spyze
17th July 2012, 7:39 PM
Nice first chapter. I love the explanation that Red's an orphan and giving him Ash's last name. BTW, where's Team Rocket? I guess they weren't important to the chapter enough so that's fine. Nice novelization of Pokemon Adventures.

Yeah, I just decided to omit Team Rocket from this chapter completely. Even though this is somewhat of a novelization of Adventures, I'm not gonna adapt it word for word. There'd be no fun in that.

Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Do you want to be added to the pm list?

matt0044
17th July 2012, 8:14 PM
Do you want to be added to the pm list?

Sure thing.

Orbis
17th July 2012, 10:38 PM
This is epik! I do have one problem with it though: It seems like the anime. And I don't like the anime. I know the fanfiction's like a manga that was introduced in the 90's, but... Maybe you can spend some time making things interesting by not explaining every single move. That's what makes the anime boooooooring. PokeSpe did a good job of explaining things while making things interesting, so go for that!
Add me to the pm list too, plz!

Hero of Ideals
18th July 2012, 12:02 AM
Very good job, I like it alot.

My advice is to only explain moves that some fans won't know.

[Imaginative]:[Clockwork]
18th July 2012, 1:37 AM
The first three volumes of Special are the only ones I've read all the way through, so I was pretty happy to find this. :D I'll start with the Prologue.

Okay, while I like the idea of blending the original Special opening with your own, I have to agree that the quotes are a little awkward to read over. I never much cared for it in the manga either, but in that case they were at least kind of separated from the narrative by slipping the intro up over panels that didn't need dialogue to be understood. That's not as easy to do with writing alone, so it comes off sort of disjointed, especially since each quote from the manga doesn't seem to have much relation to the description following it. And because he addresses the audience, it's hard to imagine them just being his conveniently-explanatory thoughts as he begins another day of Pokémon training.

Other than that, I like the prologue. I'm not sure the description of the Poké Balls was entirely necessary, but everything else feels like it's setting up for a classic Pokémon journey, a genre I've always loved.

Now, on to the first chapter.


Pallet Town: a small, tranquil setting of peace and purity. This small town borders the edge of the Kanto sea to the south, and bordering to the north are many hills, woods, and greenery where all kinds of wild Pokemon roam. Far and free from the pollution of the larger cities of Kanto, this area provides a calm and clean surrounding that helps rejuvenate the spirits of both humans and Pokemon alike.

This paragraph started as a pleasant (if somewhat typical) description of Pallet Town, but something about the last sentence pushes it into travel brochure territory. XD It's less natural, I guess, and more informative.


And in one area of this town, a small group of three children are currently gathered in a small field, taking in part one of the most popular of Pokemon practices: Pokemon battling.

For some reason, this sentence is in present-tense, while the rest of the chapter is in past-tense.


“Caterpie, don't give up! Tackle!” a young boy wearing a straw hat and holding a large butterfly net and small container commanded.

“Dodge it, Pidgey! Finish if off with Gust!” commanded another boy, wearing a yellow shirt, and a blue baseball cap and shorts.

Things get a little wordy here. Using some action to include descriptions is a lot less intrusive than introducing a character with a list of traits. For instance, assuming this information is important for the audience to know (I guess you could argue it is, considering the butterfly net and shorts place each character in their respective trainer classes), you could mention that Rick was clutching his butterfly net nervously or that Ben was glad he wore his lucky shorts that day or something (I'll admit, the shorts thing would be harder to work in naturally, but even mentioning just the shorts at first and spreading the other details out later would be a little cleaner than listing them all upfront).


I bet the Beedrill you raised would've been able to beat Ben's Pidgey with no problem!”

I'm not sure if this is to intentionally show that maybe Janice isn't as smart as she thinks she is (if so, nice touch) or if you just messed up Caterpie's evolution line (in that case, I think you meant Butterfree).


This Pokemon, named “Poli,” pounded its fists together and studied its opponent with a determined glare, ready to win this battle for its trainer.

It's not really necessary to state that it's named Poli, since it's pretty clear from Red's “Poli, I choose you.”


The purple rodent Pokemon, called Rattata, let out another cry and then began scurrying towards its opponent at a great speed.

Again, Ben called it Rattata when he released it.

The battle was strangely delightful. It was a little too turn-based, but the random shouts from the sidelines gave it a very anime feel. It was actually almost campy, especially Red's after-school special “That's right, Janice,” at the end.

That cheesiness is one of my favorite things about this, but it can also hurt you a little bit. When Red does something like introduce the location he just entered, it kind of comes off as lazy writing (as in, you simply state things rather than explaining them in the narrative). I think this is partly because I'm not sure whether you're mimicking that style for the readers' amusement or mimicking it because it was in the source material and, well, why not? (The answer is that it looks way more ridiculous in writing than in a children's cartoon or a older children's comic. That ridiculousness can work for you if you know when to use it for a joke and not just to save time in descriptions, but I'm still not sure what you're going for.)

Overall, I like this. Maybe it's just my love for those first three volumes, but I feel like you do a good job of making it feel like a vintage Pokémon journey instead of the generic trainerfic it easily could've been. Red and Blue have the classic Pokémon rivals dynamic, which adds to the feel (I hope you don't let that stop you from doing interesting things with them, though. It may be a rivalry that's been done often but it's always possible to do it well). That, I think, is your biggest obstacle: taking something that people are familiar with and adding enough to make it fresh again. So far, there's not much difference from Special, but I hope you'll run with some of the manga's ideas to create an original journey. Good luck. :)

Weedy Spyze
18th July 2012, 2:07 AM
This is epik! I do have one problem with it though: It seems like the anime. And I don't like the anime. I know the fanfiction's like a manga that was introduced in the 90's, but... Maybe you can spend some time making things interesting by not explaining every single move. That's what makes the anime boooooooring. PokeSpe did a good job of explaining things while making things interesting, so go for that!
Add me to the pm list too, plz!

Oh dear. Well, I hope you don't dislike the anime too much lol, because there may be a couple more things in this fic inspired directly by the anime (such as Red's last name being Ketchum). I'll keep the move description thing in mind for the future, though. That's one of the reasons I asked if I was being too descriptive. The battle descriptions was one of the last things I added to the final draft, and I was worrying if they would seem a bit tad unnecessary. But I want to write this in a way someone who's not too familiar with Pokemon could theoretically read and not get too lost with some of the knowledge that's obvious to us, so that's part of the reason those were added.


Very good job, I like it alot.

My advice is to only explain moves that some fans won't know.

I'm glad you enjoyed it. That's kind of unfair advice, though. It's kinda hard for me to assume what kinds of moves some people would know and some wouldn't know.


:[Clockwork];14843824']Okay, while I like the idea of blending the original Special opening with your own, I have to agree that the quotes are a little awkward to read over. I never much cared for it in the manga either, but in that case they were at least kind of separated from the narrative by slipping the intro up over panels that didn't need dialogue to be understood. That's not as easy to do with writing alone, so it comes off sort of disjointed, especially since each quote from the manga doesn't seem to have much relation to the description following it. And because he addresses the audience, it's hard to imagine them just being his conveniently-explanatory thoughts as he begins another day of Pokémon training.

Other than that, I like the prologue. I'm not sure the description of the Poké Balls was entirely necessary, but everything else feels like it's setting up for a classic Pokémon journey, a genre I've always loved.

This paragraph started as a pleasant (if somewhat typical) description of Pallet Town, but something about the last sentence pushes it into travel brochure territory. XD It's less natural, I guess, and more informative.

For some reason, this sentence is in present-tense, while the rest of the chapter is in past-tense.

I'm not sure if this is to intentionally show that maybe Janice isn't as smart as she thinks she is (if so, nice touch) or if you just messed up Caterpie's evolution line (in that case, I think you meant Butterfree).

It seems like not many people cared too much for the style of the prologue lol. It's alright, though. I'm gonna be leaving it as is, but the prologue's style is something that will be unique to it, so these problems shouldn't show up any more.

Lmao @ travel brochure territory. That sentence is there for a reason, though.

I'm not sure what you mean here, but your quote had a typo in it that I went back and fixed, so thanks for bringing that to my attention lol.

Actually, it's just words of encouragement from Janice using a random Pokemon Rick owns that we'll probably never see. I guess it's ok to see it as Janice not being as smart as she thinks she is, though. She is a child after all.


:[Clockwork];14843824']The battle was strangely delightful. It was a little too turn-based, but the random shouts from the sidelines gave it a very anime feel. It was actually almost campy, especially Red's after-school special “That's right, Janice,” at the end.

That cheesiness is one of my favorite things about this, but it can also hurt you a little bit. When Red does something like introduce the location he just entered, it kind of comes off as lazy writing (as in, you simply state things rather than explaining them in the narrative). I think this is partly because I'm not sure whether you're mimicking that style for the readers' amusement or mimicking it because it was in the source material and, well, why not? (The answer is that it looks way more ridiculous in writing than in a children's cartoon or a older children's comic. That ridiculousness can work for you if you know when to use it for a joke and not just to save time in descriptions, but I'm still not sure what you're going for.)

Overall, I like this. Maybe it's just my love for those first three volumes, but I feel like you do a good job of making it feel like a vintage Pokémon journey instead of the generic trainerfic it easily could've been. Red and Blue have the classic Pokémon rivals dynamic, which adds to the feel (I hope you don't let that stop you from doing interesting things with them, though. It may be a rivalry that's been done often but it's always possible to do it well). That, I think, is your biggest obstacle: taking something that people are familiar with and adding enough to make it fresh again. So far, there's not much difference from Special, but I hope you'll run with some of the manga's ideas to create an original journey. Good luck. :)

I'll take that as a compliment, I suppose. How would you prefer the battles to be written? In a more anime-like style?

I can't see any time Red did that, besides maybe "The West Wood" which was from a throw-away line in the manga anyway, and it won't ever be visited again after this chapter. Locations which are more important to the overall storyline won't be treated that way.

Anyway, I generally appreciate your input. I'm taking in all of the feedback you all are giving me and thinking about how I could include some of the suggestions I like into the story. Glad you liked it, and do you want to be added to the pm list?

[Imaginative]:[Clockwork]
18th July 2012, 2:58 AM
I'm not sure what you mean here, but your quote had a typo in it that I went back and fixed, so thanks for bringing that to my attention lol.

Haha, no problem. What I'm saying there is that the sentence I quoted states that the kids "are currently gathered," which is present tense. That one sentence describes the scene as if it's happening while you read it but the rest of the chapter is told as if everything has already happened.


I'll take that as a compliment, I suppose. How would you prefer the battles to be written? In a more anime-like style?

Yours weren't bad at all, but it can get tiresome to read a Command-Attack Description-Retaliation style battle. This thread (http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?554234-BATTLES!-How-to-write-them-awesomely) has lots of good discussions on battle writing. Characters' emotions, the environment, and the chemistry between trainer and Pokemon can turn an ordinary battle scene into an epic one. Again, I'm not flaming your battle scenes; they were perfectly fine for new-ish trainers who probably wouldn't be having flaming aerial duels. It would just add an extra element to, say, build up the excitement as Ben's Rattata lands the Hyper Fang or describe Ben's annoyance at his supposed friend Janice's huge bias towards Red.


I can't see any time Red did that, besides maybe "The West Wood" which was from a throw-away line in the manga anyway, and it won't ever be visited again after this chapter. Locations which are more important to the overall storyline won't be treated that way.

It's also in times like Miss Delia's introduction, where her good traits are listed all at once instead of implying them through her behavior. Sure, she's nice, but other than what I've been told about her, I'm not getting much personality from her and her presence in this chapter doesn't seem to have much of a point besides throwing in a little backstory. Does she favor Red over the other orphans? Does Red act differently around her than when he's around his friends? We get hints at this stuff, but it's never really given time to develop.

Red stating that he's had his Pokemon a long time is another example. There's no one around that wouldn't know he's had them since they were young (besides the audience, of course) so it comes off as a little bit of an infodump.

It's not just announcing a location's name. It's more about the "Show, don't tell" rule.


Anyway, I generally appreciate your input. I'm taking in all of the feedback you all are giving me and thinking about how I could include some of the suggestions I like into the story. Glad you liked it, and do you want to be added to the pm list?

No problem! No, thank you. I'll try to keep up, but my reviewing is pretty sporadic, so I'll just follow at my own pace.

Weedy Spyze
18th July 2012, 3:40 AM
:[Clockwork];14844125']Haha, no problem. What I'm saying there is that the sentence I quoted states that the kids "are currently gathered," which is present tense. That one sentence describes the scene as if it's happening while you read it but the rest of the chapter is told as if everything has already happened.

Yours weren't bad at all, but it can get tiresome to read a Command-Attack Description-Retaliation style battle. This thread (http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?554234-BATTLES!-How-to-write-them-awesomely) has lots of good discussions on battle writing. Characters' emotions, the environment, and the chemistry between trainer and Pokemon can turn an ordinary battle scene into an epic one. Again, I'm not flaming your battle scenes; they were perfectly fine for new-ish trainers who probably wouldn't be having flaming aerial duels. It would just add an extra element to, say, build up the excitement as Ben's Rattata lands the Hyper Fang or describe Ben's annoyance at his supposed friend Janice's huge bias towards Red.

It's also in times like Miss Delia's introduction, where her good traits are listed all at once instead of implying them through her behavior. Sure, she's nice, but other than what I've been told about her, I'm not getting much personality from her and her presence in this chapter doesn't seem to have much of a point besides throwing in a little backstory. Does she favor Red over the other orphans? Does Red act differently around her than when he's around his friends? We get hints at this stuff, but it's never really given time to develop.

Red stating that he's had his Pokemon a long time is another example. There's no one around that wouldn't know he's had them since they were young (besides the audience, of course) so it comes off as a little bit of an infodump.

It's not just announcing a location's name. It's more about the "Show, don't tell" rule.

No problem! No, thank you. I'll try to keep up, but my reviewing is pretty sporadic, so I'll just follow at my own pace.

I'll take your word for it I guess? To be honest, I don't see what you're implying here at all. Everything seems to be written in the present tense from my point of view. What does everyone else have to say about this?

Well, give me a few more battles to write and see what you think then. To be honest, I only had the first battle in mind to show Red as the 'best' trainer of the kids in Pallet Town, and I didn't really want to spend too much time and effort on it. In fact, I ended up spending much more time and effort on it than I had planned lol. It was just a casual battle between kids, there was no reason to make it seem 'epic' or whatever. That would've just been silly, not to mention more trouble than it would've been worth.

Again, give me a little time. This is just the first of many chapters. I have plans for Delia, or else I wouldn't have bothered giving that bit of backstory in the first place. I can't reveal all my secrets at once, can I?

I don't really see the problem with that. Ben had mentioned before that Red's Pidge had evolved from a Pidgey, and all that sentence there did was reveal he's also had Poli since it was a Poliwag. Just a bit of backstory about Red's Pokemon. They need to have some as well, since they're also important characters for this story.

I'll keep that in mind for the future I suppose. Which was my original intention for important locations anyway.

[Imaginative]:[Clockwork]
18th July 2012, 4:04 AM
I'll take your word for it I guess? To be honest, I don't see what you're implying here at all. Everything seems to be written in the present tense from my point of view. What does everyone else have to say about this?

Apparently I'm terrible at explaining myself, haha. Okay, so we have the quote I was referring to:


And in one area of this town, a small group of three children are currently gathered in a small field, taking part in one of the most popular of Pokemon practices: Pokemon battling.

I think we can both agree that "are currently gathered" is in the present tense, because, obviously, they're "currently" gathered (as opposed to "were previously gathered" or just "were gathered"). They weren't gathered a little while ago. They're gathered at the very moment the reader passes over that sentence. Then we have a random quote from the chapter:


“I'm not just acting smug, Janice!” Ben retorted, annoyed.

"Retorted" is in the past tense, as opposed to "retorts." "Retorted" states that at some previous point in time, he, well, retorted something. That's how the rest of the chapter is written. "At some point in the past, this and that happened." The one sentenced I mentioned, however, is more "This is happening and that is happening."


Well, give me a few more battles to write and see what you think then. To be honest, I only had the first battle in mind to show Red as the 'best' trainer of the kids in Pallet Town, and I didn't really want to spend too much time and effort on it. In fact, I ended up spending much more time and effort on it than I had planned lol. It was just a casual battle between kids, there was no reason to make it seem 'epic' or whatever. That would've just been silly, not to mention more trouble than it would've been worth.

Believe me, I totally get that, and I wasn't saying it should be epic at all (in fact, I think it would have been ridiculous if it had been). I understand not wanting to spend extra time on something that's ultimately of very little consequence. I'm just saying that it never hurts to back up whatever you're writing with an little emotional punch.


Again, give me a little time. This is just the first of many chapters. I have plans for Delia, or else I wouldn't have bothered giving that bit of backstory in the first place. I can't reveal all my secrets at once, can I?

Of course not lol. I mostly just took small issue with the way she was introduced (the showing, not telling thing again), not that we didn't get all the goods upfront. XD


I don't really see the problem with that. Ben had mentioned before that Red's Pidge had evolved from a Pidgey, and all that sentence there did was reveal he's also had Poli since it was a Poliwag. Just a bit of backstory about Red's Pokemon. They need to have some as well, since they're also important characters for this story.

I just don't see the logic behind announcing something like that, rather than revealing it through the narrative.

I know I sound like a huge douche, but I'm really not trying to be, haha. I enjoyed the story. I just wanted to offer a little advice.

JX Valentine
18th July 2012, 4:42 AM
Everything seems to be written in the present tense from my point of view. What does everyone else have to say about this?

It's not. Take a closer look at the part Imaginative referenced:


And in one area of this town, a small group of three children are currently gathered in a small field, taking part in one of the most popular of Pokemon practices: Pokemon battling.

“Caterpie, don't give up! Tackle!” a young boy wearing a straw hat and holding a large butterfly net and small container commanded.

“Dodge it, Pidgey! Finish if off with Gust!” commanded another boy, wearing a yellow shirt, and a blue baseball cap and shorts.

A small green worm-like creature attempted to tackle a tiny brown bird head-first. But the bird had the advantage of flight on its side.

The verb in bold, italic font is present tense. Everything else in bold is past tense. You can tell by suffixes. "Are" is a present-tense verb, so no matter what comes after it, you're saying that the sentence takes place in the present. Meanwhile, the verbs after it end in -ed, which indicates past tense.

It's no big deal, but it just means you need to proofread a bit more carefully.


It was just a casual battle between kids, there was no reason to make it seem 'epic' or whatever. That would've just been silly, not to mention more trouble than it would've been worth.

On the other hand, Imaginative has a point. You'll want to remember that these characters are basically people. Imagine playing a game of soccer or insert-sport-here with your friends, but everything that happens follows a very specific pattern. As in, in the case of soccer, your friend passes to a teammate, the teammate makes a goal, and then you get to talk. Then, you pass to your teammate, your teammate makes a goal, and then your friend gets to talk. That's what turn-based Pokémon battles are like in writing. Even if it's not supposed to be epic, sticking to a specific format (command-attack description-retaliation, as Imaginative described it) feels wooden and unnatural because these characters aren't supposed to be confined to a very strict format. Attacks happen in real time for them, so trainers and their Pokémon should react accordingly in the same way you react in real time to everything that happens in a soccer game or whatever sport you choose. Sure, the basic format might be there, but it's okay to expand.

Especially if you're going with Adventures canon. I'm not a huge fan of Adventures myself, but I do know that every battle shows some level of creativity and that every battle can bend the "rules" here and there for the sake of creating something exciting, even if it's not meant to be a plot-changing match. So it really does make more sense to consider what Imaginative is saying, even if it's just a "tutorial battle," so to speak. (I have to admit that I felt the same way about your battles. They weren't terrible, but the format made them a little harder to get through. I had some difficulty picturing, for example, Rattata simply staying still and doing nothing as Poli wobbled -- which seems to imply moving slower than usual -- towards him just before DoubleSlap. It was because it's just not something that seems logical. If you know someone is about to punch you, you'd react too, right?)


Again, give me a little time.

Sometimes, you don't have time to make a good impression. After all, the entire point of reading fanfiction is to enjoy some free time. Readers don't want to spend time on a fic that's mediocre in the first few chapters but slowly gains momentum when they could be reading a fic that's epic in the first chapter and maintains that level of quality throughout the fic. That's why you have to put in some extra effort to make sure your first chapters are as good as they can be. Sometimes, this involves revising because if you know your first chapters have weak points, you'll want to make sure you work those out until you're sure everything is strong, if that makes sense.


This is just the first of many chapters. I have plans for Delia, or else I wouldn't have bothered giving that bit of backstory in the first place. I can't reveal all my secrets at once, can I?

While it's true that a good writer doesn't reveal their secrets all at once, an experienced writer also understands that characterization isn't built through telling us about the character. For example, instead of telling us that Delia is a mother figure to Red, you'll want to show us scenes in which she displays some motherly affection for Red and the other children -- or at least show us a little bit of that to back up the claims you made in that paragraph that describes her. After all, just telling us personality traits doesn't actually mean anything to us. You could say that a character is the kindest, sweetest person who always cares for everyone around her, and in the next paragraph, she could make a sarcastic remark that throws all of that out the window. It's like the old saying that goes, "Actions speak louder than words." Characters (even background ones!) are stronger, deeper, and generally more memorable if you show us what they're like through their actions and the way they interact with other characters, rather than just telling us, "This character is kind and showers children with affection."


I don't really see the problem with that. Ben had mentioned before that Red's Pidge had evolved from a Pidgey, and all that sentence there did was reveal he's also had Poli since it was a Poliwag. Just a bit of backstory about Red's Pokemon. They need to have some as well, since they're also important characters for this story.

Except you don't go on about how you've been with your friends for a long time, right? It's just awkward because no one actually talks like that, so it feels like you're making Red say it just to inform the audience that he's been with these Pokémon for a long time, rather than because he genuinely wants to have a conversation with them. If you want to bring up the fact that they've been together for a long while, you can say so through the narration or by implying that they've been long-term friends just by how they interact with one another. (Just because Adventures actually does something like this doesn't mean it's not weak writing.)


Anyway, sorry to butt in. I've read your work and may do a full-on review with specifics later. Honestly, it was okay, but for a first attempt, it certainly wasn't bad. It's just that the reason why I'm not offering specifics is because I'm noticing the way you react to reviewers. You say you're taking in feedback, but so far, you've called one piece of advice unfair (as opposed to asking what it meant, for example, or discussing it in more than just a line), objected to a large swath of other advice, and finished everything off with the "give me some time" line. (Sorry to put it like that. It's just one of those things you see a lot of new fic writers say.) I understand that you're new at this, but you'll want to be careful with how you react to reviewers. The last thing you want to do is imply that you're going to respond to most of your concrit with either excuses or objections. Yes, you can discuss things, and by all means, ask questions. But also remember that we're here to help you improve, especially given the fact that you're new. Whenever you receive a piece of concrit, don't object to it at first. Take a long, hard look at your writing. Maybe think about what your reviewers are saying for a day before responding. Toy with the ideas people offer to you and see where they can fit into your writing. If you can't figure out how to make your advice fit, ask for clarification. If you still can't figure it out, respond politely. And by politely, I mean something along the lines of, "I see what you're saying, and you definitely have a point. Thanks for bringing that up! But don't worry. I've thought about it carefully, but I think I'll go with something else." Do not make excuses, and don't imply that all of our answers are in a later chapter and that this is all mystique. (If people point out things thinking they're plot holes, that's not being too impatient to find out what mysteries lie ahead. That's pointing out that your story has weak points that look exactly like plot holes and that you may want to take a second look at what you're doing. Just saying.) If you go with that strategy and be very careful about what you say, you'll acknowledge your readers with respect, which will make new readers or more scrutinizing critics (of which there are many on this forum) more inclined to drop by and add to your readership count.

On that note, if a lot of people don't care for the prologue, that may mean you'll want to take a closer look at it. I mean, the whole point of posting your story on a fanfic forum is to get objective feedback, and if practically everyone who comes by points out the same weak point... that may be a bad sign.

Anyway, I've rambled too much and criticized you into the ground by this point. Don't take any of this personally or anything, and I hope you're not offended that I had to speak up here. It's just that while I'd love to review your story in the depth that I usually do (and people can tell you how hilariously that usually goes over), I'm just not even sure how you'd react to it, given how you react to other reviewers who actually have pretty good points that I would've said myself in my review anyway. Either way, I'll keep an eye on this thread and see how you react to other reviewers (and to me, for that matter), and if it seems like a pretty chill environment, I'll drop a review.

That and, to be honest, I think I like this better than the actual manga anyway, which is actually saying something despite what I said earlier about not being a huge fan of Adventures to begin with. And I may or may not be eager to see how you handle "But Fearow Itself."

Weedy Spyze
18th July 2012, 4:53 AM
Nevermind this.

JX Valentine
18th July 2012, 5:09 AM
Yeah, "retorted" in that he had just now retorded that. I'm aware that it's a past tense verb, but it works because he did retort that at a previous point in time--as in, a second ago. I do understand what you're saying, but I guess what you're suggesting just doesn't make much sense to me.

Let me try my hand at clarifying if it helps you at all. You can't have people presently gathered and listening to something in the past because that's a time paradox. In other words, you can't do something in the past while simultaneously doing something in the present. You're either doing it now, or you did it already. Dialogue is the same way. Dialogue tags (the things that describe lines of dialogue) should be consistent with every other verb tense in your work because the audience and the background characters are perceiving that line of dialogue as happening at the same time as other events of the fic. In this case, the battle commands don't take place before people gather; they take place while people are there. So you can't use past-tense verbs for dialogue and present-tense ones to describe the gathering because the crowd can hear the battle commands. Using past tense says they can't because they're not there yet to observe the battle. It's a matter of grammatical logic, basically.

If you want them to listen to something someone is saying in the present, you should use present-tense verbs. The reason why you see most narratives use past-tense verbs when describing dialogue is because most narratives use past-tense verbs for the entire work anyway. It's very rare to see a novel written in any other tense, just because it's an author's natural inclination to use past-tense. Which I admit is a shame because it's always interesting when someone tries to tackle a different narrative spin. If you want to see a present-tense work, though, I'd suggest any of these (http://www.guardian.co.uk/childrens-books-site/2012/apr/05/top-10-nicola-morgan-present-tense).

The rest I've basically described in my earlier post (including an attempt at explaining the "show, don't tell" part when it comes to characters), so I'll let you read over that instead of possibly making you feel like I'm beating you over the head with something you already read over. However, if you'd like me to expand on them, feel free to ask.

Weedy Spyze
18th July 2012, 6:31 AM
On the other hand, Imaginative has a point. You'll want to remember that these characters are basically people. Imagine playing a game of soccer or insert-sport-here with your friends, but everything that happens follows a very specific pattern. As in, in the case of soccer, your friend passes to a teammate, the teammate makes a goal, and then you get to talk. Then, you pass to your teammate, your teammate makes a goal, and then your friend gets to talk. That's what turn-based Pokémon battles are like in writing. Even if it's not supposed to be epic, sticking to a specific format (command-attack description-retaliation, as Imaginative described it) feels wooden and unnatural because these characters aren't supposed to be confined to a very strict format. Attacks happen in real time for them, so trainers and their Pokémon should react accordingly in the same way you react in real time to everything that happens in a soccer game or whatever sport you choose. Sure, the basic format might be there, but it's okay to expand.

Especially if you're going with Adventures canon. I'm not a huge fan of Adventures myself, but I do know that every battle shows some level of creativity and that every battle can bend the "rules" here and there for the sake of creating something exciting, even if it's not meant to be a plot-changing match. So it really does make more sense to consider what Imaginative is saying, even if it's just a "tutorial battle," so to speak. (I have to admit that I felt the same way about your battles. They weren't terrible, but the format made them a little harder to get through. I had some difficulty picturing, for example, Rattata simply staying still and doing nothing as Poli wobbled -- which seems to imply moving slower than usual -- towards him just before DoubleSlap. It was because it's just not something that seems logical. If you know someone is about to punch you, you'd react too, right?)

I'll admit to you right now, the battle scenes are one of the things I'm most worried about when it comes to writing this story. Especially when it comes to adapting some of the battles that is in the actual manga itself. To be honest, I sometimes find the battles of Adventures a little hard to follow. I won't elaborate why because I'm tired and you've left me about ten more paragraphs to respond to first. I guess I, somewhat unconciously, decided to go for the game turn-based style for this battle, but I may try a bit more of an anime-like style for the next one. I'll say it again, I am new at this. I'm sorry if that sounds like an excuse, but it's the truth. I'm just gonna have to practice more in order to find a style for battle writing that I'm really comfortable with.


Sometimes, you don't have time to make a good impression. After all, the entire point of reading fanfiction is to enjoy some free time. Readers don't want to spend time on a fic that's mediocre in the first few chapters but slowly gains momentum when they could be reading a fic that's epic in the first chapter and maintains that level of quality throughout the fic. That's why you have to put in some extra effort to make sure your first chapters are as good as they can be. Sometimes, this involves revising because if you know your first chapters have weak points, you'll want to make sure you work those out until you're sure everything is strong, if that makes sense.

While it's true that a good writer doesn't reveal their secrets all at once, an experienced writer also understands that characterization isn't built through telling us about the character. For example, instead of telling us that Delia is a mother figure to Red, you'll want to show us scenes in which she displays some motherly affection for Red and the other children -- or at least show us a little bit of that to back up the claims you made in that paragraph that describes her. After all, just telling us personality traits doesn't actually mean anything to us. You could say that a character is the kindest, sweetest person who always cares for everyone around her, and in the next paragraph, she could make a sarcastic remark that throws all of that out the window. It's like the old saying that goes, "Actions speak louder than words." Characters (even background ones!) are stronger, deeper, and generally more memorable if you show us what they're like through their actions and the way they interact with other characters, rather than just telling us, "This character is kind and showers children with affection."

Well, if I don't catch the reader's attention with the first chapter of my story and they decide to turn away instead of reading on, that really does not bother me too much. Maybe it would if I was trying to make a profit or something off of this story, but I'm not. And of course I'd prefer it if they kept coming back and giving me a thumbs-up for my story, but if they don't? Eh, it's no biggie. You said that the entire point or reading fanfiction is to enjoy free time...well, the same could be said for writing fanfiction. I decided to start this story because I had a lot of different ideas brewing in my head about how I could change and hopefully improve Adventures. Will I end up being successful in my endeavor? Maybe, maybe not. That's all up to the reader to decide. But as long as I'm having fun writing it, and there's people out there who are having fun reading it, then that's good enough for me.

The second paragraph I'll take to heart, though. For me, I'm kind of someone who wants to know all of the facts about something as quickly as possible, so I guess that had to do a bit with the paragraph about Delia there. Originally, I actually wrote a lot more there, but I ended up cutting most of it out. I guess it's maybe a good thing I did. I guess this is what Imaginative meant when he said "show, not tell?"


Except you don't go on about how you've been with your friends for a long time, right? It's just awkward because no one actually talks like that, so it feels like you're making Red say it just to inform the audience that he's been with these Pokémon for a long time, rather than because he genuinely wants to have a conversation with them. If you want to bring up the fact that they've been together for a long while, you can say so through the narration or by implying that they've been long-term friends just by how they interact with one another. (Just because Adventures actually does something like this doesn't mean it's not weak writing.)

Anyway, sorry to butt in. I've read your work and may do a full-on review with specifics later. Honestly, it was okay, but for a first attempt, it certainly wasn't bad. It's just that the reason why I'm not offering specifics is because I'm noticing the way you react to reviewers. You say you're taking in feedback, but so far, you've called one piece of advice unfair (as opposed to asking what it meant, for example, or discussing it in more than just a line), objected to a large swath of other advice, and finished everything off with the "give me some time" line. (Sorry to put it like that. It's just one of those things you see a lot of new fic writers say.) I understand that you're new at this, but you'll want to be careful with how you react to reviewers. The last thing you want to do is imply that you're going to respond to most of your concrit with either excuses or objections. Yes, you can discuss things, and by all means, ask questions. But also remember that we're here to help you improve, especially given the fact that you're new. Whenever you receive a piece of concrit, don't object to it at first. Take a long, hard look at your writing. Maybe think about what your reviewers are saying for a day before responding. Toy with the ideas people offer to you and see where they can fit into your writing. If you can't figure out how to make your advice fit, ask for clarification. If you still can't figure it out, respond politely. And by politely, I mean something along the lines of, "I see what you're saying, and you definitely have a point. Thanks for bringing that up! But don't worry. I've thought about it carefully, but I think I'll go with something else." Do not make excuses, and don't imply that all of our answers are in a later chapter and that this is all mystique. (If people point out things thinking they're plot holes, that's not being too impatient to find out what mysteries lie ahead. That's pointing out that your story has weak points that look exactly like plot holes and that you may want to take a second look at what you're doing. Just saying.) If you go with that strategy and be very careful about what you say, you'll acknowledge your readers with respect, which will make new readers or more scrutinizing critics (of which there are many on this forum) more inclined to drop by and add to your readership count.

Hmm, I really don't know what to say to you here. I understand what you're trying to tell me, and I suppose I should've paid more attention to detail there. I really do want my story to be the best it could possibly be, so I guess I'll just have to pay more attention to small details like that in the future.

You're not offering specifics? Lol, could've fooled me. I don't mean to sound rude, but I'm not gonna face all of the criticism I get with a smile and a nod like I'm in a pageant or something. I like to have discussions with people, not just have someone say, "Oh, you made a mistake here and there, etc." and me just nod and say "okay!" That just doesn't really work for me. At the very least, I want to acknowledge the advice given. The piece of advice I called unfair is the perfect example of that. I didn't call it unfair because I thought it was unfair to me, it's because I thought it would be unfair to the readers. The guy told me to "maybe only explain moves some people won't know," well it's kinda hard for me to decipher which moves someone would know and what they wouldn't. Should I assume that fifth gen moves would be the ones that are unknown? Or what about a more uncommon move from an earlier generation? Meditate is a move from generation one, yet I had no clue what it was or that it even existed until like two months ago. So, it's kind of unfair for me to try and guess what kind of moves people would know, or what they wouldn't. Especially since I'm trying to write this in a way so that someone who knew pretty much nothing about Pokemon, could open it up on their browser and still be able to follow it without getting too confused. I may fail terribly at that, but lol.

Even if I object or dispute with certain pieces of advice, it does not mean I don't take it in. That's just not true. Like I just now said, I like to have discussions with people. For some of these suggestions, I may not really understand what the reviewer is trying to tell me, so of course I'm gonna ask them to elaborate in that situation. Maybe I even disputed something because I didn't quite understand what someone was trying to tell me. And if I've come across as rude to anyone here, then I sincerely apologize. Not once has it been my intention to scoff at a suggestion, but I know that it's sometimes hard to decipher tone from text on the internet. It's not my intention to make any kind of excuses, either, but if something sounds like one, well then so be it. I'm not gonna claim my story to be perfect, and there probably will be a plot hole I overlooked here or there. In that case, I'll be glad if someone points that out to me.


On that note, if a lot of people don't care for the prologue, that may mean you'll want to take a closer look at it. I mean, the whole point of posting your story on a fanfic forum is to get objective feedback, and if practically everyone who comes by points out the same weak point... that may be a bad sign.

Anyway, I've rambled too much and criticized you into the ground by this point. Don't take any of this personally or anything, and I hope you're not offended that I had to speak up here. It's just that while I'd love to review your story in the depth that I usually do (and people can tell you how hilariously that usually goes over), I'm just not even sure how you'd react to it, given how you react to other reviewers who actually have pretty good points that I would've said myself in my review anyway. Either way, I'll keep an eye on this thread and see how you react to other reviewers (and to me, for that matter), and if it seems like a pretty chill environment, I'll drop a review.

That and, to be honest, I think I like this better than the actual manga anyway, which is actually saying something despite what I said earlier about not being a huge fan of Adventures to begin with. And I may or may not be eager to see how you handle "But Fearow Itself."

Hmm, that's definitely some good advice. Maybe tomorrow I'll look into both the prologue and first chapter again and try to make a few more edits, before I post the story over on fanfiction.net. Hopefully it will be a good improvement.

Feel free if you want to review the actual story itself.

I'll take that as a compliment, thank you. I hope you decide to come back and read on as I write on, and enjoy the story for what it's worth. And lol @ the strikethrough. Is it because you hated that chapter or loved it? :P


Let me try my hand at clarifying if it helps you at all. You can't have people presently gathered and listening to something in the past because that's a time paradox. In other words, you can't do something in the past while simultaneously doing something in the present. You're either doing it now, or you did it already. Dialogue is the same way. Dialogue tags (the things that describe lines of dialogue) should be consistent with every other verb tense in your work because the audience and the background characters are perceiving that line of dialogue as happening at the same time as other events of the fic. In this case, the battle commands don't take place before people gather; they take place while people are there. So you can't use past-tense verbs for dialogue and present-tense ones to describe the gathering because the crowd can hear the battle commands. Using past tense says they can't because they're not there yet to observe the battle. It's a matter of grammatical logic, basically.

If you want them to listen to something someone is saying in the present, you should use present-tense verbs. The reason why you see most narratives use past-tense verbs when describing dialogue is because most narratives use past-tense verbs for the entire work anyway. It's very rare to see a novel written in any other tense, just because it's an author's natural inclination to use past-tense. Which I admit is a shame because it's always interesting when someone tries to tackle a different narrative spin. If you want to see a present-tense work, though, I'd suggest any of these (http://www.guardian.co.uk/childrens-books-site/2012/apr/05/top-10-nicola-morgan-present-tense).

The rest I've basically described in my earlier post (including an attempt at explaining the "show, don't tell" part when it comes to characters), so I'll let you read over that instead of possibly making you feel like I'm beating you over the head with something you already read over. However, if you'd like me to expand on them, feel free to ask.

I think I am beginning to understand what you mean now. Allow me to make this proposal:


In one area of this town, a small group of three children have gathered in a small field, taking part in one of the most popular of Pokemon practices: Pokemon battling.

Would "have gathered" be a better word choice than "are currently gathered" in this situation?

JX Valentine
18th July 2012, 8:04 AM
I'll admit to you right now, the battle scenes are one of the things I'm most worried about when it comes to writing this story. Especially when it comes to adapting some of the battles that is in the actual manga itself. To be honest, I sometimes find the battles of Adventures a little hard to follow. I won't elaborate why because I'm tired and you've left me about ten more paragraphs to respond to first. I guess I, somewhat unconciously, decided to go for the game turn-based style for this battle, but I may try a bit more of an anime-like style for the next one. I'll say it again, I am new at this. I'm sorry if that sounds like an excuse, but it's the truth.

Lemme try to rephrase my point in a way that isn't as wordy or irreverent as I usually am. Yes, you're new, but the point of posting your fic on a writing community is to get feedback. We're trying to give you tips on how to improve your battles. Instead of blowing us off, you might as well listen to what we have to say. Otherwise, you're not going to improve, and you'll never grow up from being new.

The point is you can't use "I'm new" as a counter to polite constructive criticism. (By all means, if someone's being a dick in their concrit, politely tell them that you're new at this and gtfo.) Concrit is given to you because we understand you're new, so we want to help you fine-tune your writing so that you might become something more than new. It's definitely not given to you to tell you that it's a mistake or that we're expecting you to be an expert already. That would be silly, and anyone who actually does that is a very silly person. It's given to you so that you know what and how to improve in order to avoid making the same mistake again.

So, yeah, sure, you're new. But that's the point of why we give you concrit.


Well, if I don't catch the reader's attention with the first chapter of my story and they decide to turn away instead of reading on, that really does not bother me too much.

Well, sure, but half the point of posting your work to be viewed by countless people you don't already know instead of keeping it in a notebook or sharing it with friends only is to entertain those extra masses. I mean, you had to have thought of those extra masses on some level because, well, you're here. Most of the point of concrit is to help you keep as much of those masses as possible because otherwise, there's no real point in posting your work. Sure, you have a handful of fans now, but you're basically saying you don't care about anyone but them. That excludes people, and saying that out loud could drive away the fans (and silent readers) you currently have because, well, there's some folks who don't take kindly to you admitting that you essentially don't care whether or not they stick around, if that makes sense.

In short, when you post your work online, you're automatically an entertainer, so you're no longer writing just for yourself. If you wanted to write just for yourself, then there's no point in needing an audience because you're not writing for them (as obvious and redundant as that statement sounds, I know). So that's why you'll want to be careful and put forth some effort in showing that you're going to improve and that your story is worth sticking around for. Otherwise, it's going to feel like people (including your current readers) are wasting their time, and that's something you'll probably want to avoid.


The second paragraph I'll take to heart, though. For me, I'm kind of someone who wants to know all of the facts about something as quickly as possible, so I guess that had to do a bit with the paragraph about Delia there. Originally, I actually wrote a lot more there, but I ended up cutting most of it out. I guess it's maybe a good thing I did. I guess this is what Imaginative meant when he said "show, not tell?"

*le nod* Pretty much. Glad it made sense. b)'')b


You're not offering specifics? Lol, could've fooled me.

I tend to get rambly. Sorry.


I don't mean to sound rude, but I'm not gonna face all of the criticism I get with a smile and a nod like I'm in a pageant or something.

Oh, don't worry; I'm not asking you to do that. In fact, feel free to have discussions and ask questions. As I've said, if you can't figure something out, your reviewers are more than happy to explain things to you and reword their reviews in a way that hopefully makes sense.

What you can't do is word things defensively. There are ways to word your responses clearly civilly and using tones that show that you're clearly taking into careful consideration everything a reviewer says, and my entire point was that you'll need to be careful and choose those ways so that it reflects well on you as a new writer. It's actually extremely important that you do that as a new writer because you'll want to establish your reputation as someone who's keenly interested in improving or at the very least interacting with readers on a friendly level because otherwise, you end up with bad press. While that may not drive away the readers you've already gotten, it may hurt your chances at doing cool things within the community like collecting reviews from all of the Old Hats, getting nominated for the yearly awards, or even establishing connections with fellow writers. (Tip: The Café is awesome for intelligent discussion on literary topics, but it's especially so if you're friends with literally everyone. If you really like discussing things concerning writing and whatnot, definitely make sure you take a side trip there as well.)


Should I assume that fifth gen moves would be the ones that are unknown?

While I can't speak for the person who said it (because, given that they're not active reviewers, I'm not sure what they were trying to tell you either), but I'm pretty sure it's another case of "show, don't tell." As in, it sort of got tiring to read definitions of moves every time they happened because, speaking for fans of the franchise, we'd already know what Quick Attack and Bubble were. So we really don't need to have it defined, and it felt a little like it was slowing down the pace of the battle just a bit. That's how I saw it anyway. Like I said, no idea about the original poster, sorry.


Especially since I'm trying to write this in a way so that someone who knew pretty much nothing about Pokemon, could open it up on their browser and still be able to follow it without getting too confused. I may fail terribly at that, but lol.

Quick word of advice to make it easier on yourself: Assume that everyone who's reading is a fan. It makes sense; you're on a Pokémon board writing a fanfiction based on one of the most popular forms of Pokémon media and showing it off to people who are Pokémon fans. Unless you post this fic elsewhere, your readers can follow along just fine. Attempting to write for anyone else would be basically writing for the wrong audience -- like attempting to write a Saw sequel aimed at young children. It creates more work for you and tends to net you negative feedback from the readers who are fans and wondering why you're explaining the basics to them.


Even if I object or dispute with certain pieces of advice, it does not mean I don't take it in. That's just not true.

I'm sure you're telling the truth here, but you'll want to be careful because the way you word things implies that you don't. For example, every time you don't understand something, you object by saying that your way is the correct way or the best way to write things. (For example, instead of simply asking what we meant concerning our criticism of the way you write your battles, you objected by saying you're new at this, that the battles aren't meant to be epic, and so forth.) If that's not what you meant, I apologize; it's just how you tend to come off. So I'm really just saying be very careful with word choice because tone is difficult to decipher on the internet, and it's extremely easier to interpret things negatively than positively.


Hmm, that's definitely some good advice. Maybe tomorrow I'll look into both the prologue and first chapter again and try to make a few more edits, before I post the story over on fanfiction.net. Hopefully it will be a good improvement.

Good luck! And sure, I'll drop a review when it's not insane o' clock at my end of the world. (The only reason why I'm up is because coffee is a terrible mistress.)


I hope you decide to come back and read on as I write on,

Oh, don't worry. I stalk the crap out of God knows how many fics on this forum, and you're on the list because...


And lol @ the strikethrough. Is it because you hated that chapter or loved it? :P

...I'm notoriously a Bill fangirl. Like, super-notoriously. Like, that is literally half my reputation on this forum. He is literally the #1 reason why I read Special/Adventures at all. Like, seriously. There's a list out there, and that's all that the first spot says. And I think I'm beating this joke into the ground, but the short of it is, I am totally not reading this for selfish fangirl reasons that will totally not make me squeal quietly in my dark and shady corner regardless of what happens in that chapter once it's out.


Would "have gathered" be a better word choice than "are currently gathered" in this situation?

Perfect, actually! "Have gathered" says that they've gathered in the past before the past (yeah, I know, definitions of tenses tend not to make sense if you actually word them, but if you need it for the future, Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluperfect) explains it better than I ever can), so it accurately places when the crowd formed in the timeline.

Weedy Spyze
18th July 2012, 2:21 PM
^ I'm not gonna write another long-winded response, but I read all of that and I want to thank you for taking the time to give me all of that advice. I've definitely learned a few new tips and tricks from you.

I removed the fic itself from this thread in wait to prepare it for a new revision. I'm not gonna promise it will be finished anytime soon, however. I'd like to request for this thread to be closed so I could create a new thread for the new start, but I don't know what exactly is allowed around here in regards to that so...I guess the thread will just be left empty until then.