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Infinity
21st December 2005, 1:09 AM
It's a bit sketchy so if you have contributions please tell me and then we can make the proper adjustments.

Double Battle Tier list:

TIER 1: UBERS
Deoxys
Deoxys-fr
Deoxys-lg
Groudon
Ho-oh
Kyogre
Latias
Latios
Lugia
Mew
Mewtwo
Rayquaza

TIER 2: STAPLE
Aerodactyl
Deoxys-e
Gyarados
Kingdra
Metagross
Salamence
Zapdos

TIER 3: STANDARD
Claydol
Dusclops
Exeggutor
Flygon
Gengar
Heracross
Jumpluff
Kabutops
Lanturn
Ludicolo
Moltres
Omastar
Rhydon
Shiftry
Slaking
Victreebel

TIER 4: COMMON
Alakazam
Armaldo
Blaziken
Charizard
Celebi
Clefable
Cradily
Donphan
Dodrio
Dragonite
Electrode
Gardevoir
Gorebyss
Hariyama
Huntail
Jirachi
Jolteon
Machamp
Manectric
Mantine
Marowak
Milotic
Miltank
Minun
Misdreavus
Ninjask
Porygon2
Plusle
Raikou
Regice
Regirock
Sceptile
Shedinja
Skarmory
Slowbro
Snorlax
Starmie
Steelix
Suicune
Swampert
Tauros
Tyranitar
Vaporeon
Weezing

TIER 5: BORDERLINE UNDERUSED
Altaria
Arcanine
Articuno
Blastoise
Blissey
Cloyster
Crobat
Electabuzz
Entei
Espeon
Forretress
Golem
Granbull
Hitmontop
Houndoom
Kangaskhan
Lapras
Luvdisc
Magneton
Medicham
Mr. Mime
Muk
Poliwrath
Quagsire
Qwilfish
Registeel
Sableye
Sunflora
Swellow
Tropius
Venusaur
Ursaring
Zangoose

TIER 6: GOOD UNDERUSED
Absol
Ampharos
Azumarill
Banette
Breloom
Cacturne
Camerupt
Dugtrio
Fearow
Gligar
Golduck
Grumpig
Hitmonlee
Jynx
Linoone
Lunatone
Magmar
Meganium
Nidoking
Nidoqueen
Piloswine
Pinsir
Primeape
Sandslash
Shuckle
Solrock
Tentacruel
Typhlosion
Vileplume
Walrein
Wobbuffet
Umbreon

TIER 7: AVERAGE UNDERUSED
Aggron
Ariados
Bellossom
Dunsparce
Exploud
Feraligatr
Flareon
Girafarig
Glalie
Hitmonchan
Hypno
Kecleon
Octillery
Persian
Raichu
Scizor
Scyther
Sharpedo
Slowking
Smeargle
Stantler
Swalot
Tangela
Togetic
Xatu

TIER 8: POOR UNDERUSED
Arbok
Dewgong
Kingler
Ledian
Ninetales
Noctowl
Parasect
Pidgeot
Politoed
Rapidash
Raticate
Seviper
Sudowoodo
Torkoal
Venomoth
Whiscash
Wigglytuff
Yanma

TIER 9: BARELY USABLE
Butterfree
Crawdaunt
Farfetch'd
Furret
Lickitung
Nosepass
Relicanth
Seaking
Sneasel
Wailord

TIER 10: CRAP
Aipom
Beautifly
Beedrill
Castform
Chimecho
Corsola
Delcatty
Delibird
Dustox
Illumise
Magcargo
Masquerain
Mawile
Mightyena
Murkrow
Pelipper
Roselia
Spinda
Volbeat

TIER 11: UNDESERVING OF MENTION
Ditto
Unown

So what do you think...?

Speed and power is the name of the game in Double Battles.

Fluorescent Adolescent
21st December 2005, 1:11 AM
You copied and pasted that from the smogon forums ¬¬

Infinity
21st December 2005, 1:12 AM
You copied and pasted that from the smogon forums ¬¬

Yes for the Single Battle, but I did a considerable amount of altering.

aipomkong
21st December 2005, 1:36 PM
cloydol is standard at least

chaos952
21st December 2005, 2:16 PM
Kingdra and Ludicolo are pretty common starters in 2 versus 2...

Slaking and Alakazam works as a great starter combo, but most people don't use it.

Fluorescent Adolescent
21st December 2005, 2:18 PM
ROFL ninjask in borderline UU. Ninjask is **** in double battles.

He should be under barely usable IMO.

Pax Deorum
21st December 2005, 3:31 PM
Ninjask used Sub
Opponent #1 Attacked the Sub, the substitute faded
Opponent #2 Attacked Ninjask, Ninjask fainted

See, crap in 2 vs 2

aipomkong
21st December 2005, 3:49 PM
TIER 1: UBERS
Deoxys
Deoxys-fr
Deoxys-lg
Deoxys-e
Groudon
Ho-oh
Kyogre
Latias
Latios
Lugia
Mew
Mewtwo
Rayquaza

TIER 2: STAPLE
Celebi - common
Gengar - common (standard at best)
Gyarados
Heracross - standard/common at worst
Jirachi - common
Metagross
Salamence
Snorlax - common, can't curse/special sponge for **** in 2v2
Swampert - common
Zapdos

TIER 3: STANDARD
Aerodactyl - more like staple
Alakazam - common
Blissey - underused, doesn't do **** with lum/no chance of special sponging
Suicune - common
Donphan
Dragonite - common
Dugtrio - underused
Dusclops
Jolteon
Milotic - common
Raikou - common
Rhydon
Slaking
Starmie - common
Tyranitar - bl/common
Weezing - common

and moving Dusclops down, but Wisping is useful...

urm... earthquake/shadow ball/imprision what?

TIER 4: COMMON
Armaldo
Blaziken
Claydol - standard
Dodrio
Electrode
Exeggutor - standard
Flygon - standard/staple
Hariyama
Machamp
Marowak
Miltank
Minun
Porygon2
Plusle
Regice
Regirock
Sceptile
Slowbro
Tauros
Vaporeon

TIER 5: BORDERLINE UNDERUSED
Altaria
Arcanine
Articuno
Blastoise
Charizard - common
Clefable - common, follow me + calm mind/softboiled/ddmence anyone
Cloyster
Cradily - common
Crobat
Electabuzz
Entei
Espeon
Forretress
Gardevoir - common
Golem
Hitmontop
Houndoom
Jumpluff - lol, standard, ever heard of aero/jumpluff
Kangaskhan
Kingdra - lol, more like staple
Lanturn - standard
Lapras
Ludicolo - standard
Manectric - common
Magneton
Medicham
Moltres
Mr. Mime
Muk
Ninjask - common, despite it's weakness
Poliwrath
Quagsire
Registeel
Skarmory - common
Steelix - standard/common
Swellow
Venusaur
Wobbuffet - common
Umbreon
Ursaring
Zangoose

TIER 6: GOOD UNDERUSED
Absol
Ampharos
Azumarill
Banette
Breloom
Cacturne
Camerupt
Fearow
Gligar
Golduck
Gorebyss - common
Grumpig
Hitmonlee
Huntail
Jynx
Linoone
Lunatone
Magmar
Meganium
Nidoking
Nidoqueen
Omastar - standard
Piloswine
Pinsir
Primeape
Sandslash
Shedinja - common
Shiftry - lol, standard
Solrock
Tentacruel
Typhlosion
Victreebel - read shiftry
Vileplume
Walrein

TIER 7: AVERAGE UNDERUSED
Aggron - common/standard
Ariados
Bellossom
Dunsparce
Exploud
Feraligatr
Flareon
Girafarig
Glalie
Granbull - common/bl
Hitmonchan
Hypno
Kabutops
Kecleon
Misdreavus - common
Octillery
Persian
Raichu
Scizor
Scyther
Slowking
Smeargle
Swalot
Tangela
Xatu

TIER 8: POOR UNDERUSED
Arbok
Dewgong
Kingler
Mantine
Ninetales
Noctowl
Parasect
Pidgeot
Politoed
Qwilfish
Rapidash
Raticate
Seviper
Stantler
Sudowoodo
Torkoal
Whiscash
Wigglytuff
Yanma


TIER 9: BARELY USABLE
Butterfree
Crawdaunt
Farfetch'd
Furret
Lickitung
Nosepass
Relicanth
Seaking
Sableye - common/bl
Sharpedo
Shuckle - bl
Sneasel
Sunflora - bl
Tropius - bl
Venomoth
Wailord

TIER 10: CRAP
Aipom
Beautifly
Beedrill
Castform
Chimecho
Corsola
Delcatty
Delibird
Dustox
Illumise
Ledian
Magcargo
Masquerain
Mawile
Mightyena
Murkrow
Pelipper
Roselia
Spinda
Togetic
Volbeat

TIER 11: UNDESERVING OF MENTION
Ditto
Luvdisc - swift swim/stab/good special range means bl for uberdisc
Unown

So what do you think...?

Don't flame me because there is something on here you do not like, just kindly tell me and then we can possibly get it adjusted.

Speed and power is the name of the game in Double Battles.

legends are poor in 2v2, anything which relys heavily on defence is pretty much dead straight away

swiftswim
gyara/sala double intimidate
dusclops imprision
claydol skill swap

those four make most pokemon like celebi **** in 2v2

Kaiser
21st December 2005, 7:29 PM
everything with a STAB/CB eq / rock slide (that deals great damage) and has a good speed,should be staple / standard imo.

-MK ;376;

Infinity
21st December 2005, 10:20 PM
Snorlax can use Self-Destruct and with STAB that works quite nicely, so I think it should be a bit higher than common. Ah yes Areo/Jumpluff Sub + Swagger, I'll move it up. Swift Swim does make Kingdra useful, but its limited movepool... I don't know, I'll put it as a Staple though. Too many Earthquakes, but resisting Explosions has its usefulness Aggron is common at best. How could I forget about that Disclops set? I've been screwed over too many times thanks to that set.

I suppose for Ninjask you could Protect and Swords Dance and then have its partner Psych Up before it dies... Or Endure with Liechi... meh.

How can Shuckle be BL? It's not like its going to do much other than take hits.

Ah yes Garde and Trace....

Ah yes Huntail and Kabutops need to be up a few tiers as well... I made some changes... Thanks to your advice.

aipomkong
21st December 2005, 10:23 PM
snorlax doesn't have self destruct until XD moves are implemented into NB

also Metagross does it a LOT better, Snorlax can't take doubled up hits

Infinity
21st December 2005, 11:10 PM
snorlax doesn't have self destruct until XD moves are implemented into NB

also Metagross does it a LOT better, Snorlax can't take doubled up hits
Alright, I'll move Snorlax down a bit more...

I want to move Slowbro to BL, what do you guys think?

microgamer
23rd December 2005, 7:25 AM
IMO...

-Stantler should be good/average UU because of the Stantler/Medicham/Role Play combo
-Togetic should be in good/average/poor UU because it's a decent Follow Me user
-Rhydon and Donphan should be common because they're still vulnerable to Rain Dance teams and such

Infinity
23rd December 2005, 8:16 AM
IMO...

-Stantler should be good/average UU because of the Stantler/Medicham/Role Play combo
-Togetic should be in good/average/poor UU because it's a decent Follow Me user
-Rhydon and Donphan should be common because they're still vulnerable to Rain Dance teams and such
I have no argument other than Rhydon because it outclasses most of the commons in usefulness thanks to Lightningrod, it just rapes the heck out of a few teams and resists Explosions, although you won't have to worry about that too much since it is usually paired up with Gyarados. It could be debatable...

Tazzler
24th December 2005, 9:35 PM
IMO, moltres should move up to common or standard at best b/c it , like zapdos, change the weather to support the team. Like the combo eggytres.

Hemp Man
25th December 2005, 7:24 AM
Deoxys-E is unbanned in tourneys, so you may want to put it in a tier,

Infinity
28th December 2005, 7:40 AM
Deoxys-E is unbanned in tourneys, so you may want to put it in a tier,
Uh... Where was it unbanned and I am going to test that Moltres out and see my results.

Hemp Man
28th December 2005, 8:20 AM
http://www.smogon.com/community/showthread.php?t=5563

Sorry if posting links to other forums isnt allowed.

Infinity
28th December 2005, 8:33 AM
http://www.smogon.com/community/showthread.php?t=5563

Sorry if posting links to other forums isnt allowed.

Hmm, Uber Speed, but that isn't going to get you too far in the metagame without an Uber Attack. Ok I will edit that. Hah so much for the definitive Uber list.

DemonScythe
28th December 2005, 10:03 AM
lol, I don't even see half of these pokes in doubles

Mantine is good its quite commom with Swiftswim + Earthquake
resist and good SpDef. Rhydon is common, Marowak is Standard.
Kingdra and Zapdos aren't staples lol, Claydol and Gengar are staples
the other two are just standard. Snorlax is standard, VictoryBell is
only common. Kabutops, Shiftry, Heracross and Jolteon aren't standard
only common or less. Moltres is Standard used so much with Eggy.
Umbreon and Wobbufett are Good Underused, they can't do much in doubles.
Registeel is common with its good defences, Piloswine goes under Average
Underused and same can be said for Ninjask. Ledian and Venomoth go up to
Poor Underused since they still have *some* use. Finally Swellow and Steelix
are quite common.

Meh this is pretty much from my experience..

aipomkong
28th December 2005, 12:49 PM
Kingdra is more staple then Gengar will ever be

Infinity
28th December 2005, 6:13 PM
lol, I don't even see half of these pokes in doubles

Mantine is good its quite commom with Swiftswim + Earthquake
resist and good SpDef. Rhydon is common, Marowak is Standard.
Kingdra and Zapdos aren't staples lol, Claydol and Gengar are staples
the other two are just standard. Snorlax is standard, VictoryBell is
only common. Kabutops, Shiftry, Heracross and Jolteon aren't standard
only common or less. Moltres is Standard used so much with Eggy.
Umbreon and Wobbufett are Good Underused, they can't do much in doubles.
Registeel is common with its good defences, Piloswine goes under Average
Underused and same can be said for Ninjask. Ledian and Venomoth go up to
Poor Underused since they still have *some* use. Finally Swellow and Steelix
are quite common.

Meh this is pretty much from my experience..
Kingdra really utilizes its Swift Swim ability here, paired up with another Rain dancer and you get a Hydro Pump to the face. Zapdos has it's merits, fast and kills quickly + not worrying about EQ. Ice Beam is all too common, so Claydol doesn't do too much because it is meant to absorb hits, I need to see some more tests though like it Skill Swapping Slaking, even then it is not a staple because defensive pokémon really don't work at all here. Kabutops (Swift Swim), Victoreebel (Chrlorophyll), Shiftry (Chrlorophyll + Explosion), Heracross (quick killing machine; here's how I use it I have it's partner explode and it Endures/Salac/Rev or Megahorn that combo alone can take out half a team easily, since Ttar isn't that common), and Jolteon... yeah your right. Wobby and Umbreon, yeah I can see that. Registeel is tough, but it's not going to take that much abuse with it being slow, sure it can explode, but when you're up against something like Choice Band Areo and Salamence it is going to be dead quickly. Most good teams has some Explode resist to it so it isn't going to matter too much, since its attack isn't going to do that much anyway... Snorlax is too slow and it can't handle all of those attacks to do much, it won't get a boost until it gets Self Destruct on NetBattle. Ledian and Venomoth, I agree. Swellow doesn't take much anything with a decent Attack or Sp. Attack can OHKO it, Toxic + Guts + Facade won't do much when its Attack keeps on getting lowered or resisted, and don't forget the Speed Boosts Rain and Sun give some pokes, yeah I don't think it will do that well, sorry. Steelix can Explode, but it gets KOed too easily because lets face it it cant take much from the special category, although Steelix is better than many BLs so I'll up it, but not Swellow. I will make the needed adjustments.

Hemp Man
28th December 2005, 9:05 PM
lol, I don't even see half of these pokes in doubles

Mantine is good its quite commom with Swiftswim + Earthquake
resist and good SpDef. Rhydon is common, Marowak is Standard.
Kingdra and Zapdos aren't staples lol, Claydol and Gengar are staples
the other two are just standard. Snorlax is standard, VictoryBell is
only common. Kabutops, Shiftry, Heracross and Jolteon aren't standard
only common or less. Moltres is Standard used so much with Eggy.
Umbreon and Wobbufett are Good Underused, they can't do much in doubles.
Registeel is common with its good defences, Piloswine goes under Average
Underused and same can be said for Ninjask. Ledian and Venomoth go up to
Poor Underused since they still have *some* use. Finally Swellow and Steelix
are quite common.

Meh this is pretty much from my experience..


Mantaine has 40 base attack.

aipomkong
28th December 2005, 9:34 PM
earthquake
resist

Hemp Man
28th December 2005, 10:08 PM
Nvm, I didnt see that. >_>

Keanu Reeves
30th December 2005, 10:29 AM
Sub + Swagger is null and void I hope you know that

DemonScythe
30th December 2005, 11:45 AM
Kingdra is more staple then Gengar will ever be
its not a staple though since its only used for rain dancing and thats just a standard strategy, not used in every team..

Claydol doesn't do too much because it is meant to absorb hits, I need to see some more tests though like it Skill Swapping Slaking, even then it is not a staple because defensive pokémon really don't work at all here. Claydol is VERY useful those defences can take a ton of ****, it can setup Reflect and Lightscreen, aid partners with Skillswap/swagger, STAB Earthquake hurts alot of ****, and just lay a big explosion in the end, what are talking about not useful..
here's how I use it I have it's partner explode and it Endures/Salac/Rev or Megahorn that combo alone can take out half a team not really that **** pretty much fails it takes outs one poke, but then the other kills it because rarely the partner will be able to OHKO the other opponent, and well T-tar is getting used more from what I see.
Registeel is tough, but it's not going to take that much abuse with it being slow, sure it can explode, but when you're up against something like Choice Band Areo and Salamence it is going to be dead quickly.
CB is very unpopular in doubles and Registeel easily just uses Irondefence and lols at your DDs with its 150 Defences, but yeah he isn't used much.
Snorlax is too slow and it can't handle all of those attacks to do muchmore like snorlax sucks up **** from weather teams even if its a 2 on 1 and with a partner its an easy setup for him.
Steelix can Explode, but it gets KOed too easily because lets face it it cant take much from the special category well of course its stupid to leave steelix on special hits, but that ****** still lols at Plusle and Minun and Swellow and Electrode, and serves as a great wall with STAB Earthquakes and Explosions to go around..

Mantaine has 40 base attack
80 base Sp Att and STAB Hydropump does enough especially in rain..

Hemp Man
30th December 2005, 10:31 PM
I know that, but I didnt see you say resist, so I thought you meant Mantaine using Earthquake >_>.