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Thread: chaos' guide to making a successful site v1

  1. #76
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    Don't use index.php?id= urls. It's bad form. Use mod_rewrite, google it if you have no clue. It also gives you bad ratings on Google. Even worse is site.com/?id=3 :/
    I just really have to agree with this. I don't get why people don't care about SEO. If you don't care about seo, then you don't care about your sites future. I recieve 80% of my hits from search engines such as Google and Yahoo.

  2. #77
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    This is a really good guide and I think it will help me ^^.
    BTW: Faltzer it is Togepi from MMC
    PokeIsland
    ^My Site^
    What my favorite pokemon?

  3. #78
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    There is a wat to evade the no right-click thing anyway, what you must do is right click and hold it down, then when the thing comes up saying dont copyor somethng press ok while right is still held down, put the mouse over what you want to copy, and release so the no right click stuff is a waste anyway, if you make all those special effects it bugs people that wantto concentrate on teh actual site good tip.
    TO CONTENT | CENTER - CONTENT | RIGHT - LINKS TO THINGS NOBODY CARES ABOUT
    lol
    GOLDYOSHI:

    The thing is, it isn't for chatting, it's for drawing. And you could just as well hang out in fan art on the forums if you wanted to critisize pictures!

    There is no real community in Oekakis, just people who draw and comment. It can't keep a site together, at least, I think. :O

    And yes, finding your niche is important. I always hated it when Ifo und a site that had news and info that I could just as well get somewhere else. If they had other stuff, well, OK, but it should be unique. No 'Raise a Pikachu' game, or 'Catch a Pidgey', you didn't make it.

    For example, on my site, Ihave POkemon theories, explaining thigns like why Feebas only live in 6 tiles and why Electrode explodes at the slightest shock. I have fun things there. Personality. And that's rare nowadays.

    I liked this guide so much, I posted a link to it at another forums, with credit, of course. hopefully, more people will read ut. <_<;
    what if it was a site about art? maybe pokemon art!
    The first idea is good, but putting them in a footer won't generate nearly as many clicks as on the side.
    you wont generate may 'clicks' anyway dude

    Help make my website better send me some info and walkthroughs!
    visit my sprite shop click the latios egg visit venausaur vs greevil's shop

    my shop

  4. #79
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    Disregarding the bloated ego, this is a great guide in my opinion. Most advice are common sense for the at least slightly experienced webmaster but for most starting ones it isn't and it's always good to point those things out. With the growth of Pokémon websites overcoming the growth of Pokémon itself it's getting harder and harder to come up with original ideas so just saying 'be original' isn't much of a help really. Also, the guide is kind of old and still v1 so I guess you could revamp it some time soon. As nabt said: "It's nice to see someone with experience helping out the community". Kudos for the guide

    Be sure to drop by The Sun Shrine, my site ^^.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer View Post
    I just really have to agree with this. I don't get why people don't care about SEO. If you don't care about seo, then you don't care about your sites future. I recieve 80% of my hits from search engines such as Google and Yahoo.
    SEO is a good thing, but using mod_rewrite to implement some uber-complex querystring rewriting (though the querystring is still the same stupid page=somestatictext) isn't necessarily the proper thing to do. If you're rewriting the URLs of an application like a blog, a forum or a CMS, then it's all right (getting rid of Joomla's index.php?com_option=blahblahblah&id=6 and transforming it into something more logical) but when you have complete control over how your URLs are going to look, for me it's just a hassle - purposefully damaging your own URLs, and then attempting to "fix" them with a 79-line .htaccess involving regular expressions a mile long.

    And generally, not looking from the point of view of the visitor, using one script to serve all content (index/default) isn't a good idea since it gets messy. I don't know what's so good about it.

    I don't even use .htaccess, I wrote an email to my server administrators and they tweaked the server configuration globally in a way so that it doesn't matter whether you put the file extension into the URL or not. This way everyone got the same benefit and I didn't have to write any .htaccess files. All my files are still .php, but if I ever wanted to change the technology used (to Perl, Python or anything else) I could do so, and no one would notice.

    Some of you people sound like you work for Microsoft: first let's release a badly planned version - it doesn't matter if it makes future maintenance difficult - and then we can issue patches later.

    *EDIT* :
    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer
    This ticks me off. Why did you have to post this piece of paragraph when you post a link to your forum in every main page of your categories. Example:

    http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/5...pocriteoz3.jpg


    Just my two cents.
    Whaa...? What are you smoking, Faltzer? Probably because the Smogon Forums aren't the site's main attraction? It's not like chaos has got 3 useless things on his site and a font-size 40px link to the forums, he's just trying to promote a sense of community by encouraging visitors to register and get more personalized info on the matter from "the experts". Seriously, before the move to the new server (when the site became pretty chaotic) I used to visit Smogon pretty frequently whenever I was looking for a good NetBattle moveset for an obscure pokemon, and I have never been a member of the forums.

    Quote Originally Posted by zuloon
    Smashboards.com has it's forum as its main attraction. It's doing fine.
    ... Jesus H. Christ. Now I know why chaos doesn't post in this thread any more. Being a webmaster isn't rocket science, but still some people don't see such obvious things.
    Last edited by Magma Leader Maxie; 6th March 2007 at 9:16 PM.

    [PI Forums|Magma HQ|Kikkoman!]
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    O'Neill: Teal'c, the cliché is "are you thinking what I'm thinking". And the answer is "yes".

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magma Leader Maxie View Post
    SEO is a good thing, but using mod_rewrite to implement some uber-complex querystring rewriting (though the querystring is still the same stupid page=somestatictext) isn't necessarily the proper thing to do. If you're rewriting the URLs of an application like a blog, a forum or a CMS, then it's all right (getting rid of Joomla's index.php?com_option=blahblahblah&id=6 and transforming it into something more logical) but when you have complete control over how your URLs are going to look, for me it's just a hassle - purposefully damaging your own URLs, and then attempting to "fix" them with a 79-line .htaccess involving regular expressions a mile long.

    And generally, not looking from the point of view of the visitor, using one script to serve all content (index/default) isn't a good idea since it gets messy. I don't know what's so good about it.

    I don't even use .htaccess, I wrote an email to my server administrators and they tweaked the server configuration globally in a way so that it doesn't matter whether you put the file extension into the URL or not. This way everyone got the same benefit and I didn't have to write any .htaccess files. All my files are still .php, but if I ever wanted to change the technology used (to Perl, Python or anything else) I could do so, and no one would notice.

    Some of you people sound like you work for Microsoft: first let's release a badly planned version - it doesn't matter if it makes future maintenance difficult - and then we can issue patches later.


    You don't need a 79 line .htaccess file to rewrite all URLs. This shows how much you know. And if you're good for writing PHP code which uses some regex, then you're going to do great with mod_rewrite. Did you look at my topic anyway about mod_rewrite before you jump to any conclusions about it?

    *EDIT* :

    Whaa...? What are you smoking, Faltzer? Probably because the Smogon Forums aren't the site's main attraction? It's not like chaos has got 3 useless things on his site and a font-size 40px link to the forums, he's just trying to promote a sense of community by encouraging visitors to register and get more personalized info on the matter from "the experts". Seriously, before the move to the new server (when the site became pretty chaotic) I used to visit Smogon pretty frequently whenever I was looking for a good NetBattle moveset for an obscure pokemon, and I have never been a member of the forums.


    ... Jesus H. Christ. Now I know why chaos doesn't post in this thread any more. Being a webmaster isn't rocket science, but still some people don't see such obvious things.
    I was smoking crack with Joe Crack. Promoting a sense of community is alright, though that's why the sites main content is mainly there for. The forum was mainly created for discussions and strategy for people who need help from "the experts'.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer View Post
    You don't need a 79 line .htaccess file to rewrite all URLs. This shows how much you know. And if you're good for writing PHP code which uses some regex, then you're going to do great with mod_rewrite. Did you look at my topic anyway about mod_rewrite before you jump to any conclusions about it?
    No, I did not look at your topic because I perhaps know more about .htaccess then you think. I like many things .htaccess allows me to do (I currently use some features like it's WWW-Authenticate header substitute, which makes locking out admin-only areas of a site very easy), but this one particular feature, mod_rewrite, being used on a site where no dynamic processing (like viewing threads, topics, news comments) is done whatsoever makes no sense to me. Sorry, it just doesn't. Mod_rewrite should be used where some script requires an ID or sometimes another crucial piece of data passed by querystring, and you want to make it cleaner. "page=goldsilver" isn't a crucial querystring unless you have a system in place that allows users to create their own areas on your site.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer View Post
    I was smoking crack with Joe Crack. Promoting a sense of community is alright, though that's why the sites main content is mainly there for. The forum was mainly created for discussions and strategy for people who need help from "the experts'.
    I don't see how the smogon forums have ever been much an "attraction" - firstly, there are many, many other forums about Pokemon where people can go. Secondly, you have to swear a lot and have an inflated head to be a member worthy of visiting.

    Many sites offer a link to their bulletin board (or ticketing/knowledgebase system, if they're more professional) to get more information for a certain topic.

    [PI Forums|Magma HQ|Kikkoman!]
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    O'Neill: Teal'c, the cliché is "are you thinking what I'm thinking". And the answer is "yes".

  8. #83
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    Using mod_rewrite is much more secure, as its URL manipulation stops crucial data from being given out to the internet. This is crucial to prevent site hackings and stops the user from knowing what you use for includes.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer View Post
    Using mod_rewrite is much more secure, as its URL manipulation stops crucial data from being given out to the internet. This is crucial to prevent site hackings and stops the user from knowing what you use for includes.
    Assuming of course that you know nothing about security in PHP, and that you use PHP only for including segments of a HTML file (for which you might as well use SSI, it's slightly faster too). Mod_rewrite definitely isn't crucial for preventing "site hackings", and if you already are determining what files to include by the query string, you're already making that public information (assuming of course that there is a reason why the user knowing what files are included is a terrible security threat)

    [PI Forums|Magma HQ|Kikkoman!]
    Teal'c: Are you considering the same tactic as I?
    O'Neill: Teal'c, the cliché is "are you thinking what I'm thinking". And the answer is "yes".

  10. #85
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    A hacker can simply view your include files, and view secret PHP data that you might have hiding within. And I'm ****** that you recommend SSI when you were first suggesting to use PHP includes instead of SSI for includes.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faltzer View Post
    A hacker can simply view your include files, and view secret PHP data that you might have hiding within. And I'm ****** that you recommend SSI when you were first suggesting to use PHP includes instead of SSI for includes.
    If you save something as .php, the server will never send the contents of the file: it will be executed and any output (worst case scenario: a piece of a table) sent. You always seemed to have problems understanding this, I have no idea why. If you have .inc files, make them .inc.php to overcome this problem (which isn't really a problem).

    I recommended PHP in the "which is better" discussion if I remember correctly, because SSI just includes files, php can do so much more. If you're going to use the language for doing stuff like processing contact forms on your site, then there's no point in using SSI at the same time. I didn't really recommend using php include instead of SSI. So if you had some subtlety you would recognise that I didn't say that.

    [PI Forums|Magma HQ|Kikkoman!]
    Teal'c: Are you considering the same tactic as I?
    O'Neill: Teal'c, the cliché is "are you thinking what I'm thinking". And the answer is "yes".

  12. #87
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    This is a really old thread. I would be willing to remake this guide and maybe include some new information/etc, but I don't know if it would actually be appreciated here. Most of the comments I've seen on this since the very beginning ignored the content and complained about my writing.
    [20:54:24] Serebii: switching is cheap
    [20:54:42] Serebii: its as cheap as ubers

    95% of Serebii.net does not understand competitive battling. If you're one of the 5% that do, then don't waste your time putting this in your sig - head straight to Smogon.

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  13. #88
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    I'm all for a new guide, really. The current one in my opinion could require some organization, and I'd like to see any new things you've learned if possible from a new guide

  14. #89
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    Yeah, little late reply, I don't know if you've changed your mind but a re-written guide would be useful, this one's kind of old. I enjoyed reading it, though, learned a few things with it.

    Be sure to drop by The Sun Shrine, my site ^^.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magma Leader Maxie View Post
    SEO is a good thing, but using mod_rewrite to implement some uber-complex querystring rewriting (though the querystring is still the same stupid page=somestatictext) isn't necessarily the proper thing to do.
    I'm tired of this "SEO" buzzword. There are plenty of other reasons for using these techniques. Simpler URLs = easier to type. Using proper HTML tags (headings, etc) and cleaner HTML makes for better browser compatibility. Ultimately, this makes thing easier for the visitors of your site. It just so happens that search engines like this too (which is obvious: they're trying to return the best results for users).

    And generally, not looking from the point of view of the visitor, using one script to serve all content (index/default) isn't a good idea since it gets messy. I don't know what's so good about it.
    Depends how you structure it. I've recently started using something called "Model-View-Controller", so my index file is just 30 lines of PHP code which calls other files to get and display the content.

  16. #91
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    I find PHP including/requiring is something very useful and good for structuring your pages, and my index.html file looks like:

    PHP Code:
    //Variables declared, and some CMS functions which I don't want made Open source
    require('settings.php')

    echo 
    $doctype;
    echo 
    "<html><head>"
    require($_SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT']."themes/".$currenttheme."header.php");
    echo 
    "</head><body>";
    require(
    $_SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT']."themes/".$currenttheme."index.php");
    echo 
    "</body></html>" 
    There's 25 lines in that on HTML file (including comments) and I just use those 3 require()s to retrieve all setting and database variables, and the theme's header file and index file.

    Cheers,

    BP

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichUncleSekeleton
    I'm tired of this "SEO" buzzword. There are plenty of other reasons for using these techniques.
    Of course there are numerous reasons to have clean HTML and easy URLs, but you can't deny that SEO is an important aspect of having a good (or at least, popular) site; it provides a popular advertising outlet (Google). Acknowledging alternative reasons is one thing; being "tired" of SEO is another.
    PM me to rate your website (including message boards) privately.

  18. #93
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    Yeah I understand that, what I meant was it annoys me a little when people keep raving about search engine optimisation, when they're really talking about user optimisation. SEO is really just a marketing buzzword that some people use to sell. Some professional web designers charge a fee for "SEO", like if you don't pay for that part they won't make your site properly. This stuff isn't something you can "tack on" to a site after you've made it.

    And your site won't get into Google or get particularly high just from having "SEO'd" pages - you still need links to your site from other popular sites, which generally only come from having good content.

  19. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichUncleSkeleton
    Yeah I understand that, what I meant was it annoys me a little when people keep raving about search engine optimisation, when they're really talking about user optimisation. SEO is really just a marketing buzzword that some people use to sell. Some professional web designers charge a fee for "SEO", like if you don't pay for that part they won't make your site properly. This stuff isn't something you can "tack on" to a site after you've made it.
    Fair enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by RichUncleSkeleton
    And your site won't get into Google or get particularly high just from having "SEO'd" pages - you still need links to your site from other popular sites, which generally only come from having good content.
    Yeah, I probably should've said "helps provide". :s My bad.
    PM me to rate your website (including message boards) privately.

  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichUncleSkeleton View Post
    Yeah I understand that, what I meant was it annoys me a little when people keep raving about search engine optimisation, when they're really talking about user optimisation. SEO is really just a marketing buzzword that some people use to sell. Some professional web designers charge a fee for "SEO", like if you don't pay for that part they won't make your site properly. This stuff isn't something you can "tack on" to a site after you've made it.

    And your site won't get into Google or get particularly high just from having "SEO'd" pages - you still need links to your site from other popular sites, which generally only come from having good content.
    You are 100% correct, however most people don't realise SEO does not really exist, as Google will index your site content anyway. And while people don't know, I have made about $300 from various clients who paid extra for SEO

  21. #96
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    I know, and I can afford a dedicated server because of it.

  22. #97
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    Well, nice to see you're justified blueparukia.

  23. #98
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    So...is using a lot of GIFs a bad idea?
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  24. #99
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    Good guide. i will keep that in mind


    ps; try not to be so insulting the next time
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  25. #100
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    This was a very well made guide. All of it makes sense and I will take it all into consideration. Thanks for the help.
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