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Thread: Official One Piece Manga Discussion Thread

  1. #3226
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    Hmm very very interesting chapter. I agree with Sogeking on the fact that Sabo is probably not dead. Also with the whole Sanji discussion, Oda put Sanji there for three reasons I think.

    1. To get stronger of course. He will most likely learn some new kama techniques. I mean did you see the way those new kamas kicked?!

    2. To meet Ivankov. Ivankov left appox. 2 weeks before the flashback started to go back to Kamabakka Kingdom. So I think that he might run into Sanji and that's how Sanji will probably leave.

    3. Oda loves messing with Sanji. I mean come on, the wanted poster thing was too hilarious. Then the whole Duval situation. Seriously Oda continually messes with Sanji's character. I love it.

  2. #3227
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    Sabo has to be dead. The whole point of the flashback was to show how Ace adapted to Sabo's death and became closer to Luffy, Which in turn will help Luffy overcome Ace's death and grow in strength. If Sabo lives, Then the growth in this chapter becomes meaningless. Also, Oda has rarely faked us out when he shows someone dying and never in a flashback. So I think it's pretty much confirmed that Sabo is dead.

    As I thought, Sabo was killed by the Celestial Dragon. Depressing, But also a wonderful end to the flashback. I can't wait to see Luffy's new resolve.
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  3. #3228
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    Sabo has to be dead. The whole point of the flashback was to show how Ace adapted to Sabo's death and became closer to Luffy, Which in turn will help Luffy overcome Ace's death and grow in strength. If Sabo lives, Then the growth in this chapter becomes meaningless. Also, Oda has rarely faked us out when he shows someone dying and never in a flashback. So I think it's pretty much confirmed that Sabo is dead.

    As I thought, Sabo was killed by the Celestial Dragon. Depressing, But also a wonderful end to the flashback. I can't wait to see Luffy's new resolve.

    I disagree, as mostly it boils down to the fact that, if Sabo is dead, its easily the worst death scene Oda has EVER done.

    No death speech, (a letter stating his intent to KEEP LIVING and HAVE ADVENTURES is in fact, completely contrary) no dying with a smile and content with what he accomplished in life? Oda doesn't play that way. Particularly when there's NO BODY.

    Pirate who bit off his tounge to avoid slavery isn't dead. Pell isn't dead. Not a single person on Skypeia died. The entire Franky Family isn't dead. Ultra racist completely iredeemable non-cover story villain ARLONG isn't even dead.

    Hell, the snowboarding rabbits in Drum had sadder more tragic death scenes, and they were mute, and didn't even die.

    Oda doesn't kill without good reason, and he doesn't build up characters like this without proper closure.

    Sabo's alive. It might take a few years before we get back to him, but he ain't dead. Especially not from that most un-lethal attack of all, explosions.
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  4. #3229
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    I really don't see how it's the worst death. It was touching. The moment Sabo freed himself from the life he hated, He's stuck down. That's why his wording in the letter had such an effect. As for him smiling and being content, Why would he be when he had yet to actually accomplish his dream?

    I said Oda rarely fakes us out when showing someone dying. Aside from Pell, When were any of those other characters said to be dead? And when has Oda did a flashback where the current guess character doesn't die when they're shown taking a killing blow? The only time I remember someone being said to be dead and not really being dead was Pell. All the other flashback characters that have been killed have stayed dead.

    There was a perfect reason to kill Sabo. Sabo's death acted as the trigger to bind Ace and Luffy closer together and made Ace the person he was. Ace finally showing emotions at the end was our closure. Sabo turning up alive later on would undermine the growth we got from this flashback.
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  5. #3230
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    I really don't see how it's the worst death. It was touching. The moment Sabo freed himself from the life he hated, He's stuck down. That's why his wording in the letter had such an effect. As for him smiling and being content, Why would he be when he had yet to actually accomplish his dream?

    I said Oda rarely fakes us out when showing someone dying. Aside from Pell, When were any of those other characters said to be dead? And when has Oda did a flashback where the current guess character doesn't die when they're shown taking a killing blow? The only time I remember someone being said to be dead and not really being dead was Pell. All the other flashback characters that have been killed have stayed dead.

    There was a perfect reason to kill Sabo. Sabo's death acted as the trigger to bind Ace and Luffy closer together and made Ace the person he was. Ace finally showing emotions at the end was our closure. Sabo turning up alive later on would undermine the growth we got from this flashback.
    I would have to agree with this statement. Though if Sabo were still alive, I'm sure Oda would have a good reason as to how and why. Meanwhile, I think there's only maybe a chapter or two left of the flashback before we return to the main story. I'm guessing that all there is left is Ace getting the crap beat out of him for defending Roger and him telling Luffy he wasn't going to die any time soon. Then we return to Luffy who will then resolve to return to Saboady and reunite with his crew. Though before he leaves, Marguerite stops him and asks to join him (or she's sent by Hancock to keep him safe.)
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  6. #3231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gentleman Skeleton View Post
    I would have to agree with this statement. Though if Sabo were still alive, I'm sure Oda would have a good reason as to how and why. Meanwhile, I think there's only maybe a chapter or two left of the flashback before we return to the main story. I'm guessing that all there is left is Ace getting the crap beat out of him for defending Roger and him telling Luffy he wasn't going to die any time soon. Then we return to Luffy who will then resolve to return to Saboady and reunite with his crew. Though before he leaves, Marguerite stops him and asks to join him (or she's sent by Hancock to keep him safe.)
    He could've easily had his ship sink and wind up floating into Dragon's ship, and join the Revolutionaries. Considering that the Revolutionaries are going to play a bigger role in the future, it's not far off. Him appearing to be dead plays the same effect as him dying.
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  7. #3232
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    Dragon's ship left the night before, So he couldn't have gotten on it. I just don't see why Oda would tell us he's dead and make a big deal about it then just undo it all, When he could just as easily have Sabo disappear to the same effect. Or even have been taken prisoner by the Celestial Dragons, Which would have been greatly symbolic. It would also hurt his character if he was alive and didn't come to the aid of his "brother".
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  8. #3233
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    If Sabo is alive, though, and I think he is, we don't know why Sabo didn't go out to save Ace. For all we know, he did try but was unable to actually make it to Ace for whatever reason.

    And like Sogeking said, if Sabo's alive but Luffy and Ace are sure that he's dead, they'd be affected the same way.

    EDIT: But I must say, I don't see how his letter would be a problem if he did die. The fact that we'd know that all of Sabo's hopes and dreams for the future have come to nothing (for him) does have an effect, like you said, TsukiMirage. Still think he's dead, but I don't think the letter means he has to live.
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  9. #3234
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    Not that I believe it, But if Sabo is still alive, I'll trust that Oda had a good reason to do what he did. So far he hasn't been a let down in the character development department.
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  10. #3235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Kamex View Post
    If Sabo is alive, though, and I think he is, we don't know why Sabo didn't go out to save Ace. For all we know, he did try but was unable to actually make it to Ace for whatever reason.

    And like Sogeking said, if Sabo's alive but Luffy and Ace are sure that he's dead, they'd be affected the same way.

    EDIT: But I must say, I don't see how his letter would be a problem if he did die. The fact that we'd know that all of Sabo's hopes and dreams for the future have come to nothing (for him) does have an effect, like you said, TsukiMirage. Still think he's dead, but I don't think the letter means he has to live.
    If he's alive he's pretty much either a slave or a revolutionary. If he's a slave no way he would have made it, and we haven't seen the revolutionaries do too much, and are pretty much kept a mystery right now.
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  11. #3236
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    Spoilers are out, and I freaking knew it about Sabo.
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  12. #3237
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    I like how it concludes at the beginning of the manga series.

  13. #3238
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    Still really an assumption that Sabo is alive. Anyway, Looks like we'll be getting a time kip soon for Luffy to train.
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  14. #3239
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    Still really an assumption that Sabo is alive. Anyway, Looks like we'll be getting a time kip soon for Luffy to train.
    Sabo's being treated by Dragon. It's not like he'd die now.
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  15. #3240
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    It doesn't show who's being treated by Dragon. The only picture of Sabo we get is a flashback (in a flashback).
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  16. #3241
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    Good chapter but I'm glad that the flashbacks are done for now and we are moving back to luffy.

  17. #3242
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    It doesn't show who's being treated by Dragon. The only picture of Sabo we get is a flashback (in a flashback).
    Face it, Sabo is pretty much alive.
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  18. #3243
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    It doesn't show who's being treated by Dragon. The only picture of Sabo we get is a flashback (in a flashback).
    He's the only person it could be. Oda has said an important character in the future will have an eyepatch, so maybe he gets one.
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  19. #3244
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    Unless we have something to identify the person, It's still an assumption. Especially when Dragon a crew left before Sabo got blown up.

    Anyway, A great conclusion. It was nice how the present events tied to the past events and how much Luffy worked to turn his rubber abilities into an offensive weapon. Looks like Luffy's gonna be even more determined after this. Lucky he's in the prefect place to learn to use his haki. It was also nice to see Zoro again. Hope he returns soon in the present time.
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  20. #3245
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    Unless we have something to identify the person, It's still an assumption. Especially when Dragon a crew left before Sabo got blown up.

    Anyway, A great conclusion. It was nice how the present events tied to the past events and how much Luffy worked to turn his rubber abilities into an offensive weapon. Looks like Luffy's gonna be even more determined after this. Lucky he's in the prefect place to learn to use his haki. It was also nice to see Zoro again. Hope he returns soon in the present time.
    Dragon was shown returning to the ship. Iva even complains for making him wait. It provides a perfect chance for Luffy to connect to the Revolutionaries, since Dragon has never met Luffy, and Luffy was unaware of him until Water 7.
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  21. #3246
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    Return from where? And when would he have grabbed Sabo, As the WG would have been on guard there during their time there and while the wreckage was being cleared away. I'm not saying it's impossible, Just that we need a little more before we can say it's more then an assumption. It could easily be that Dragon saved a different person, Like Bluejam, Who would have been just as injured and in need of medical care.
    A soul that cannot be saved drifts and disappears,
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  22. #3247
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    Quote Originally Posted by TsukiMirage View Post
    Return from where? And when would he have grabbed Sabo, As the WG would have been on guard there during their time there and while the wreckage was being cleared away. I'm not saying it's impossible, Just that we need a little more before we can say it's more then an assumption. It could easily be that Dragon saved a different person, Like Bluejam, Who would have been just as injured and in need of medical care.
    There's no reason for it to be Bluejam. And even if Dragon grabbed him while people were there, instead of finding Sabo floating somewhere else, Dragon has shown that he can appear and disappear almost out of no where.

    Remember, the target group is 10-12 year olds. Oda's not going to throw retarded red herrings at us.
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  23. #3248
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    How would it be a retarded red herring? There's nothing saying that it 100% has to be Sabo. Otherwise there wouldn't be no reason not to show who it was. Bluejam is a known pirate with considerable strength that would help the revolutionaries, So there is a reason for the person to be him. And Dragon appearing to pull Sabo out would still have been seen, Thus Dogura would have no reason to say that Sabo was died. Not to mention how would Dragon even know about Sabo being there.
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    In the instant it vanishes, it shines faintly,
    Now, it creates a night with a full moon.



  24. #3249
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    Things happened in this order:

    Sabo runs away.
    Dragon meets with Sabo and saves the hobos.
    Dragon meets with Iva.
    Dragon leaves the island.
    Sabo gets his pirate ship next morning.
    Sabo gets blown up.

    Sabo couldn't have been saved by Dragon, but explosions are the least deadly attack in One Piece, so there's still a small possibility.

    The people who were being nursed in Dragon's ship were probably the hobos, Bluejam has absolutely no reason to still be alive.
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  25. #3250
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yellow Torterra View Post
    Things happened in this order:

    Sabo runs away.
    Dragon meets with Sabo and saves the hobos.
    Dragon meets with Iva.
    Dragon leaves the island.
    Sabo gets his pirate ship next morning.
    Sabo gets blown up.

    Sabo couldn't have been saved by Dragon, but explosions are the least deadly attack in One Piece, so there's still a small possibility.

    The people who were being nursed in Dragon's ship were probably the hobos, Bluejam has absolutely no reason to still be alive.
    Dragon didn't leave the island, his crew did. That's what Iva was complaining about making him wait. He also brought back someone with serious injuries. Also it's a guy, but that's really a moot point anyway.

    And Bluejam is a weak East Blue pirate with no potential. Like Higuma the Bear. Dragon knows nothing about him, and really has no use for him.

    Sabo wasn't shown, but it's a common literary device. It's more subtle that just showing him, and Oda's often known for using subtlety.
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