[Discussion] What is a counter?

[_Calm|Mind_]

thats not entirely true. im not exactly a newb i suppose, but at least i've been reading all this stuff before posting anything.

Can you elaborate on your post?

[spareux]

I think he is remarking upon the common generalisation that new people are idiots.
Or something.

[SilverRabbit32]

yea pretty much. Sunday said all newbs just go right ahead an post before they read this stuff, so when they post and someone inquires about Counters, they don't have a clue. I've been playing Pokemon since the first days of Red/Blue, and the game has done nothing but get more complicated, and now there is so much to try and understand about it. But based on what I know, it seems that knowing things like what a Counter actually is pretty darn important information before going to much into competitive battling.

[sleepyhead]

can a primape with vital spirit and choice scarf counter darkrai?

[Frost Nova]

Wrong tier, darling.

[aipomkong]

lol it can switch in, but then you're pretty stuck when that Lugia comes out to wall your ape.

[~-Overheat-~]

I'd say the best way to counter mence is bringing in a Regice.........

[aipomkong]

Yes because Regice takes CB Dragon Claws, Choice Specs Fire Blasts and Stone Edges very well

[Incarnati0n]

Yes because Regice takes CB Dragon Claws, Choice Specs Fire Blasts and Stone Edges very well

i think he ment specsmence, wich btw mostly carries flamethrower instead of fire blast..

heatproof bronzong is a good specsmence counter, tough it doesn't like hydro pump/HP ground. countering spcsmence needs some prediction.

[Hitsugaya]

i think he ment specsmence, wich btw mostly carries flamethrower instead of fire blast..

heatproof bronzong is a good specsmence counter, tough it doesn't like hydro pump/HP ground. countering spcsmence needs some prediction.

No. It carries FIRE BLAST. Learn your sets, please.

[Incarnati0n]

No. It carries FIRE BLAST. Learn your sets, please.

salamence@choice specs
modest, 6 HP / 252 SP.ATK / 252 SPD
-dragon pulse
-flamethrower
-hydro pump
-draco meteor

check smogon's analysis. that's an odd way of spelling fire blast y'know

[aipomkong]

They can carry both.

Flamethrower is, however, better as with Specs it OHKOs what Fire Blast can, 2hkos the same stuff that Blast 2hkos. Has more PP and is 100% accurate.

Some people do use Blast though

[NS_Blaziken_57]

I'd like to bring up a point for this dead-ish thread. This is NOT a counter:

You have out Gallade, and your opponent has out Garchomp. You know it could easily OHKO you with Dragon Claw or Outrage. You let your Gallade die, then send in Mamoswine, which KOs Garchomp with Choice Banded Ice Shard.

This is a revenge killer people. Mamoswine could not switch in on Garchomp, and hence could not counter it. Utilizing the free switch after a KO to send in a threat does not make said threat a counter.

[Frost Nova]

I think we're well aware of the distinction between a 'counter' and 'revenge killer', thank you very much. Thanks for pointing it out though.

[boxchan]

THIS IS A COUNTER



not a counter



REVENEG KILLER

also last one sums up what we're all thinking anyway

[sanjay120]

ahahaha that is great, I would sig it if I could

[NS_Blaziken_57]

I think we're well aware of the distinction between a 'counter' and 'revenge killer', thank you very much. Thanks for pointing it out though.

Not from what I've seen. People seem to think stuff like Alakazam with Energy Ball is a Rhyperior counter.

But that was at my old site (if you can't figure out what it is, look under my name), so maybe actual sites focusing solely on Pokemon are more term-savvy.

["L"]

No, Serebii is still pretty dense when it comes to knowing what a counter is that's why it's up here. By the way, you basically stated what was already in the first post:

A counter isn't when your Opponent has Gyarados out and since your Raichu knows Thunderbolt, you think it can OHKO Gyarados. You switch out to Raichu while your Opponent just Dragon Danced or even just hit your newly swapped in Raichu with STABed Waterfall or Earthquake, mainly Earthquake. Now your Raichu is either dead (most likely DEAD) or they got to Dragon Dance and then OHKO you next turn. But What happened to Thunderbolt on Raichu? You didn't get to use it because you couldn't successfully switch in and counter Gyarados

So your post just ends up looking like a sad attempt to get post counts.

[Hitsugaya]

A counter is something that can switch directly to something and will not get OHKOd in the process.

EXAMPLE: Ludicolo switching to Manaphy using Surf, and Manaphy can get Energy Balled.

["L"]

Thank you dialkia for posting something that was already stated in the first post, because we all know how hard it is for newbies to read the first post.
By the way, just because it doesn't get 1HKOed, doesn't mean it won't be 2HKoed in the process. An example would be Lucario's CSed (or CM for 1 SAtk boost) Aurasphere on a Blissey. Fat egg won't be 1HKOed but it will still die to it.

[NS_Blaziken_57]

No, Serebii is still pretty dense when it comes to knowing what a counter is that's why it's up here. By the way, you basically stated what was already in the first post:



So your post just ends up looking like a sad attempt to get post counts.

No, the original post neglects to mention the difference between a revenge-killer and a counter. He assumes that people will attempt to switch Raichu into Gyarados, and doesn't remind people that using a free switch after a KO so as to not take a hit does not make something a counter.

And why should I care about post counts? Is there any benefits to having more? You can get sigs and editing powers from the start.

["L"]

The way you seem to always randomly post what everyone already knows makes it seem like you do it for post counts.

[NS_Blaziken_57]

But like I said, that's just a lame assumption given that post counts mean nothing at this site (as far as I know). And if everyone already knew the difference, this thread wouldn't have even been made.

[Hitsugaya]

Thank you dialkia for posting something that was already stated in the first post, because we all know how hard it is for newbies to read the first post.
By the way, just because it doesn't get 1HKOed, doesn't mean it won't be 2HKoed in the process. An example would be Lucario's CSed (or CM for 1 SAtk boost) Aurasphere on a Blissey. Fat egg won't be 1HKOed but it will still die to it.

Im not a newbie, but you have a point. I guess that even being 2KOed does not make it that much of a counter. And, yeah, an EV trained Blissey does die to an Aura Sphere in a 2KO (OHKO if Calm Mind is used) from a STABed Modest or Timid EV-Trained Lucario.

[aipomkong]

what are you on about?

a +1 satk lucario cannot ohko blissey with aura sphere.