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Thread: ~ Official Pokémon News Discussion Thread ~ [POST POKEMON NEWS HERE]

  1. #15201
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    Platinum is a shocker as well, considering I felt it was the best one out of Gen 4, maybe HGSS edges it out.
    But then again, FRLG 12, HGSS 12.72 and ORAS with a potential 10. Sounds okay I guess.

    Z will be alone, but will get the required sales. But as you stated, the track record is against it. Especially since it's like the situation in Gen 3. Ruby/Sapphire(X/Y0 and Emerald(Z).


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    For whatever reason, third versions (or in Gen V's case, sequels) have actually sold consistently more than the previous third version/sequel.

    I know what the explanation is, but it's still kinda weird.

    Quote Originally Posted by CyberBlaziken View Post
    Well, Diamond and Pearl were the start of the DS revolution. As were Ruby and Sapphire for the GameBoy Advance.
    I would assume the discrepancy is related to the difference of scale between those two "revolutions."

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    Yeah, I think DP sold more than everything else sans 1st and 2nd gen because of the DS install base. With that in mind I don't think anything will top it until either Nintendo handhelds start selling more, or more likely, Pokemon goes mobile.

    It'll be interesting to see how Pokemon Go does compared to the main series. It'll probably have an astronomical amount of downloads but since it's F2P it'll be harder to tell how profitable it'll be.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    I think ORAS can not be compared with gen 1 and gen 2 remakes when comparing sales, because Gen 1 and Gen 2 are the most legendary and recognizable generations, far above the following generations.

    I think ORAS could be better compared with gen 4 and 5 potential remakes. It's just Kanto and Johto are the golden era of the franchise, so their remakes would be the most nostalgic ones for fans.
    Last edited by Boss1991; 6th October 2015 at 12:41 AM.

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    ORAS already hit 10 million. As of June 30, ORAS is at 10.27 million and XY is at 13.99 million. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/software/3ds.html

    Disappointing that XY probably wont surpass BW in terms of sales. I know BW was on the DS and had the huge install base on the DS, but I highly doubt that made a difference. Most of the casuals who bought a DS were more interested in Mario Kart, New Super Mario Bros., Brain Age & Nintendogs, looking at sales figures.

    And it wouldn't surprise me if ORAS doesn't outsell FRLG or HGSS. This slight decline in sales for the main series games is pretty annoying. BW sold less than DP & RS and now XY will probably end with less than BW.

    No way Z is going to sell more than the 7-8 million range, but at least that's understandable.
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    I think it is unfair to compare ORAS to gen one and two remakes, because of the gen 1 and 2 mania.

    But ORAS will probably have similar or better sales than following remakes. Pokemon seems to be generally going down is sales and I don't understand why, seeing how games are definitely not going down in quality.
    Last edited by Boss1991; 6th October 2015 at 2:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boss1991 View Post
    I think it is unfair to compare ORAS to gen one and two remakes, because of the gen 1 and 2 mania.

    But ORAS will probably have similar or better sales than following remakes. Pokemon seems to be generally going down is sales and I don't understand why, seeing how games are definitely not going down in quality.
    Hardware sales are usually correlated to individual game sales, when hardware sales go down, software sales usually do too. The 3DS has only sold about 1/3 of what the DS has sold, a large part of the DS market has jumped ship to mobile platforms, so Pokemon has less of a market than it used to. As a matter of fact, it's quite a feat that the 3DS and XY have sold as well as they have in spite of mobile.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Hardware sales are usually correlated to individual game sales, when hardware sales go down, software sales usually do too. The 3DS has only sold about 1/3 of what the DS has sold, a large part of the DS market has jumped ship to mobile platforms, so Pokemon has less of a market than it used to. As a matter of fact, it's quite a feat that the 3DS and XY have sold as well as they have in spite of mobile.
    I think that anyone who says that Nintendo and/or Pokemon is doomed because of the smart phone generation needs to remember this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bguy7 View Post
    I think that anyone who says that Nintendo and/or Pokemon is doomed because of the smart phone generation needs to remember this.
    And that's not even mentioning how Nintendo and Game Freak are actually starting to embrace mobile now instead of oppose it.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boss1991 View Post
    I think it is unfair to compare ORAS to gen one and two remakes, because of the gen 1 and 2 mania.

    But ORAS will probably have similar or better sales than following remakes. Pokemon seems to be generally going down is sales and I don't understand why, seeing how games are definitely not going down in quality.
    That makes no sense. Don't forget that the remakes were created well past the Pokemania phenomenon (2010 for HGSS, and 2004 for FRLG. In fact, FRLG were attempts to maintain the Pokemania momentum given how much people hated Gen 3 at the time, as well as the inability to transfer Pokemon from the GBC to GBA, even if there was a legitimate reason). Even if you factor in Pokemania, the remakes are merely a fraction of what the total sales are for both RBY and GSC.

    Additionally, I think it's way too early to say that ORAS will sell better than following remakes, because the assumption is that GF will keep remaking Generation games, and I think that Gen III will be their last one unless there is enough demand for DP remakes. After all, there really isn't any justification to remake anymore games considering that DPPt and BW+B2W2 are playable on the 3DS.

    Also, I can't understand why people are getting concerned about sales. Pokemon relative to other game franchises, is still pulling in multimillion numbers well into the 3DS era from its robust beginnings on the Game Boy. That's impressive. Sure the numbers are dropping, but there's no cause for concern. However, I do think Game Freak needs to adapt their design philosophy to continue to sustain these large numbers. People are starting to realize how disgustingly easy the games are, and how much of the same experience it is on a yearly basis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    That makes no sense. Don't forget that the remakes were created well past the Pokemania phenomenon (2010 for HGSS, and 2004 for FRLG. In fact, FRLG were attempts to maintain the Pokemania momentum given how much people hated Gen 3 at the time, as well as the inability to transfer Pokemon from the GBC to GBA, even if there was a legitimate reason). Even if you factor in Pokemania, the remakes are merely a fraction of what the total sales are for both RBY and GSC.

    Additionally, I think it's way too early to say that ORAS will sell better than following remakes, because the assumption is that GF will keep remaking Generation games, and I think that Gen III will be their last one unless there is enough demand for DP remakes. After all, there really isn't any justification to remake anymore games considering that DPPt and BW+B2W2 are playable on the 3DS.

    Also, I can't understand why people are getting concerned about sales. Pokemon relative to other game franchises, is still pulling in multimillion numbers well into the 3DS era from its robust beginnings on the Game Boy. That's impressive. Sure the numbers are dropping, but there's no cause for concern. However, I do think Game Freak needs to adapt their design philosophy to continue to sustain these large numbers. People are starting to realize how disgustingly easy the games are, and how much of the same experience it is on a yearly basis.
    It makes sense imo, because many people not concerned about post-gen 2 games and generations, would have bought those gen 1 and gen 2 remakes just for the memories and nostalgia. It is only a guess, but a good one imo.

    About future remakes, I obviously mean in case those exist. And, like you, Im not quite sure there is a reason for remaking them.
    Last edited by Boss1991; 6th October 2015 at 4:05 AM.

  12. #15212
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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    Additionally, I think it's way too early to say that ORAS will sell better than following remakes, because the assumption is that GF will keep remaking Generation games, and I think that Gen III will be their last one unless there is enough demand for DP remakes. After all, there really isn't any justification to remake anymore games considering that DPPt and BW+B2W2 are playable on the 3DS.
    Just because you haven't seen any demand for it yet doesn't mean it doesn't have any. It's simply too early. A few years from now we'll almost certainly see people clamoring for Sinnoh in the same way that they have for Hoenn. Also, the 3DS probably won't be around forever, especially with the NX on the horizon. I imagine we could see a DP remake around 2018-2019ish, so it'll probably be a few years off, but I'm reasonably certain it'll happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Just because you haven't seen any demand for it yet doesn't mean it doesn't have any. It's simply too early. A few years from now we'll almost certainly see people clamoring for Sinnoh in the same way that they have for Hoenn. Also, the 3DS probably won't be around forever, especially with the NX on the horizon. I imagine we could see a DP remake around 2018-2019ish, so it'll probably be a few years off, but I'm reasonably certain it'll happen.
    Exactly. Personally, Sinnoh's my favourite region and has the best Pokémon introduced. I just gave the main games something fresh. If they were remade with better graphics and more features (like Primal reversions), I would absolutely flip. I really want the Sinnoh remakes to happen. Adding post-game content to would just top it all off. Imagine what a huge Primal Dialga would look like on your 3D screen (or whatever console it's made on.) So yeah, there is a bit of hype around the world. It should happen.
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  14. #15214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Just because you haven't seen any demand for it yet doesn't mean it doesn't have any. It's simply too early. A few years from now we'll almost certainly see people clamoring for Sinnoh in the same way that they have for Hoenn. Also, the 3DS probably won't be around forever, especially with the NX on the horizon. I imagine we could see a DP remake around 2018-2019ish, so it'll probably be a few years off, but I'm reasonably certain it'll happen.
    I didn't say I didn't see demand for it, I'm not certain GF will be as eager to remake DP as they were with ORAS (even if it did take a lot of time from when fans first clamoured for Hoenn remakes), HGSS, and FRLG. I assume the next handheld will be backwards compatible with the 3DS, and seeing how close the 3DS is to the DS, Nintendo could very well allow backwards compatibility to both generations. If it is, then there's really no point in GF remaking DP. Also, as opposed to the older remakes, we're at a point where we can get a large amount of Pokemon to fit in one cartridge as far as distribution in the region is concerned, not to mention the greater wi-fi capabilities have allowed people to get Pokemon they weren't able to get in the older games. Seems like we're reaching a point of diminishing returns in regards to justifying remakes.

  15. #15215

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    None of that really factors in, though. If there's a game to be made that will sell units - there will be and it will - then eventually Sinnoh's place in the cycle will come up. Simple as that. It has nothing to do with backwards compatibility, and that's a big leap in assumption to assume that DS titles will be playable on whatever next handheld we get, at that. How many Pokémon "fit in one cartridge" is equally not a factor because they can choose - and have chosen - to intentionally omit critters so as to leave an artificial gap like that, for that sole purpose.

    We're a number of years off from it being a relevant topic but the fact remains that D/P will be a decade old already (!) next year and you have to engage in some logical gymnastics to say "they won't be as eager to remake it."


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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    I didn't say I didn't see demand for it, I'm not certain GF will be as eager to remake DP as they were with ORAS (even if it did take a lot of time from when fans first clamoured for Hoenn remakes), HGSS, and FRLG. I assume the next handheld will be backwards compatible with the 3DS, and seeing how close the 3DS is to the DS, Nintendo could very well allow backwards compatibility to both generations. If it is, then there's really no point in GF remaking DP. Also, as opposed to the older remakes, we're at a point where we can get a large amount of Pokemon to fit in one cartridge as far as distribution in the region is concerned, not to mention the greater wi-fi capabilities have allowed people to get Pokemon they weren't able to get in the older games. Seems like we're reaching a point of diminishing returns in regards to justifying remakes.
    Even if the NX allows normal DS games to play on it, it doesn't mean they shouldn't or wouldn't make Sinnoh remakes. For us, it provides a new take with new graphics, as well as an excuse to play a Sinnoh game again, and for them, there's money to be made.

    Join Ash and Pikachu as they travel to the Tenno Region, a region known for its advanced space program. Along their way towards the Tenno League and becoming a Pokémon Master they'll encounter new Pokémon, new enemies, such as the evil Team Planetary, and, of course, a certain trio of Team Rocket members, along with friends new and old.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    I didn't say I didn't see demand for it, I'm not certain GF will be as eager to remake DP as they were with ORAS (even if it did take a lot of time from when fans first clamoured for Hoenn remakes), HGSS, and FRLG.
    As long as the series sells and they can keep banking on nostalgia, they'll be happy to remake anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    I assume the next handheld will be backwards compatible with the 3DS, and seeing how close the 3DS is to the DS, Nintendo could very well allow backwards compatibility to both generations. If it is, then there's really no point in GF remaking DP.
    How many game consoles do you know that are backwards compatible with a system 2 generations old? Usually if there's any backwards compatibility, it's only for the previous generation. So in fact, the safest thing to assume would be that the next handheld is only backwards compatible with the 3DS, if even that.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    Also, as opposed to the older remakes, we're at a point where we can get a large amount of Pokemon to fit in one cartridge as far as distribution in the region is concerned, not to mention the greater wi-fi capabilities have allowed people to get Pokemon they weren't able to get in the older games. Seems like we're reaching a point of diminishing returns in regards to justifying remakes.
    Not having any extra Pokemon didn't stop Emerald from being made, and at this point it's looking like it won't stop Z from being made either. This isn't much of a concern.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Torpoleon View Post
    ORAS already hit 10 million. As of June 30, ORAS is at 10.27 million and XY is at 13.99 million. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/software/3ds.html

    Disappointing that XY probably wont surpass BW in terms of sales. I know BW was on the DS and had the huge install base on the DS, but I highly doubt that made a difference. Most of the casuals who bought a DS were more interested in Mario Kart, New Super Mario Bros., Brain Age & Nintendogs, looking at sales figures.

    And it wouldn't surprise me if ORAS doesn't outsell FRLG or HGSS. This slight decline in sales for the main series games is pretty annoying. BW sold less than DP & RS and now XY will probably end with less than BW.

    No way Z is going to sell more than the 7-8 million range, but at least that's understandable.
    I said when ORAS was revealed that they did it too soon and it'd damage XY's sales, and it has.

    XY could still hit 15 million.

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    Imo XY will hit 15 million. Just now thinking, maybe this year they did not release a new core game because the new Nintendo console (NX) will release in late 2017, and they are planing to, maybe, release the next Pokemon gen on that platform to spike up the sales in the start. What do you think?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuvixer View Post
    Imo XY will hit 15 million. Just now thinking, maybe this year they did not release a new core game because the new Nintendo console (NX) will release in late 2017, and they are planing to, maybe, release the next Pokemon gen on that platform to spike up the sales in the start. What do you think?
    Sure, they can release Gen 7 on 2017. But surely that's not the reason for not releasing a game this year.
    We still have next year, 2016. Zygarde is still waiting for his game.

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    I think the year gap is just to give themselves more time to think about what to add in Pokemon Z, and what to bring in for Generation 7.
    It's a smart move though, with Pokemon Z. They could have easily moved on to Gen 7 next year, but the 3rd version gives them more time.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    As long as the series sells and they can keep banking on nostalgia, they'll be happy to remake anything.
    As long as that mindset exists, they won't be groundbreaking with their remakes, and hit even greater sales potential. Hopefully I'll be proven wrong, but ORAS is not a good indication so far. And while the comment is true, though I would wonder how many people are more aware of Masuda's comments now that it's plastered throughout the internet. Not to be a Debbie downer, but they are things to think about when it comes to thinking about how GameFreak

    Additionally, nostalgia can be a double-edged sword, people that played DP are going to remember how broken the experience was with a slow battle system and a . What's interesting to me if they decide to remake DP, is how they'll incorporate Platinum. This could be another polarizing move.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    How many game consoles do you know that are backwards compatible with a system 2 generations old? Usually if there's any backwards compatibility, it's only for the previous generation. So in fact, the safest thing to assume would be that the next handheld is only backwards compatible with the 3DS, if even that.
    Yes, it is extremely rare to see backwards compatibility to more than one generation (the early editions of the PS3, and the GBA comes to mind, out of the years of console releases), but I think it's a possibility given the closeness in terms of console design between the 3DS and DS, but that'll depend largely on what the next handheld looks like, and how it fares from a technological standpoint.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Not having any extra Pokemon didn't stop Emerald from being made, and at this point it's looking like it won't stop Z from being made either. This isn't much of a concern.
    They don't compare to remakes, as the games you mention have different reasons to be made (mostly from a story standpoint).

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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    As long as that mindset exists, they won't be groundbreaking with their remakes, and hit even greater sales potential.
    As it was mentioned earlier, the most groundbreaking games aren't the highest selling.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    Additionally, nostalgia can be a double-edged sword, people that played DP are going to remember how broken the experience was with a slow battle system and a .
    The slow battle system is a product of the original release, that won't carry over to the remake. There was nothing inherently broken about DP.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    What's interesting to me if they decide to remake DP, is how they'll incorporate Platinum. This could be another polarizing move.
    The most important thing from Platinum to carry over would be the expanded Sinnoh Dex, and I'm near certain they will because not only do they keep past regional dexes intact, but they actually give them a slight bump with cross gen evolutions. And there is absolutely, 100% no rational reason for them not to include them, so I would be extremely surprised if they don't. Other than that as long as they retain what we had in DP I'll be satisfied with the remakes, DP had more content than even some third versions and remakes.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    Yes, it is extremely rare to see backwards compatibility to more than one generation (the early editions of the PS3, and the GBA comes to mind, out of the years of console releases), but I think it's a possibility given the closeness in terms of console design between the 3DS and DS, but that'll depend largely on what the next handheld looks like, and how it fares from a technological standpoint.
    Well Nintendo is working on a new OS that incorporates 3DS, Wii U, and future consoles, so I don't think they'll be able to do DS BC.

    Quote Originally Posted by BurningWhiteKyurem View Post
    They don't compare to remakes, as the games you mention have different reasons to be made (mostly from a story standpoint).
    And you don't think they couldn't enhance DP's story? There's plenty of things they could do with it, the inevitable addition of Dialga/Palkia Megas could add a lot to Sinnoh's lore and now that making event Pokemon catchable in game is within the realm of possibility they could throw in Arceus to the mix for a nice, Delta Episode esque post game arc (and in theory they could do the same with Darkrai and Shaymin, but I don't see them taking every single possible opportunity to expand the storyline, there's just too many options).
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Not having any extra Pokemon didn't stop Emerald from being made, and at this point it's looking like it won't stop Z from being made either. This isn't much of a concern.
    Emerald had Johto starters, johto pokemon in safari, Sudowoodo and Smeargle that were not in Ruby, Sapphire, Firered or leaf green. So Emerald did had extra pokemon in the game.

    If future remakes are to end up like ORAS then I don't want them to make any more remakes. Pokemon Z is the next likely game announcement. However, due to ORAS containing the rest of the non-event pokemon, the only things to expect in the game is new forms, megas, alternate/new story and new areas. It stinks how we don't have future pokemon to transfer to ORAS or XY games because of this. The only thing to make up for this is another mythical pokemon becoming available but sadly that is unlikely to happen. An interactive/gift shiny pokemon would be nice since HGSS had Gyarados and BW2 had Dratini, Gible and Haxorus but this is unlikely as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torpoleon View Post
    ORAS already hit 10 million. As of June 30, ORAS is at 10.27 million and XY is at 13.99 million. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/software/3ds.html

    Disappointing that XY probably wont surpass BW in terms of sales. I know BW was on the DS and had the huge install base on the DS, but I highly doubt that made a difference. Most of the casuals who bought a DS were more interested in Mario Kart, New Super Mario Bros., Brain Age & Nintendogs, looking at sales figures.

    And it wouldn't surprise me if ORAS doesn't outsell FRLG or HGSS. This slight decline in sales for the main series games is pretty annoying. BW sold less than DP & RS and now XY will probably end with less than BW.

    No way Z is going to sell more than the 7-8 million range, but at least that's understandable.
    It's clear that XY will not sell as good as the previous generations. We are now on the 3DS which sells are slightly more than 50 million after a handheld that sold 150 million. Percentage wise Gen 6 is still more sucessfull than 3,4 and 5.

    But it's sad that the sells for the franchise fall every generation.

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