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Thread: Evolving Strategy (600)

  1. #26
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    Monferno's debut was good despite losing, I think the episode was cheap seeing as how Ash's pokemon are a LOT stronger than they were depicted in the episode but still a good battle despite the one sided-ness of it.
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  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurtwigFan1 View Post
    One thing that bugs me though,

    Ash could beat Brandon. Paul couldn't beat Brandon. Therefore, wouldn't it seem that Ash should be able to beat Paul or at least lose by a far smaller margin? It just seems unrealistic to me. Can't the writers remember things like that?
    Like dman_dustin was saying, the writers were pretty damn inconsistent with this 2 parter. Leave it up to the writers to take something that would otherwise be something awesome and flat out ruin it... to the extent Ash lost anyways. I mean, were the writers deciding to cater to Paul this time instead of Ash?

    Oh well, by the sound of things, this sucker was animated nicely.

    Oh... and we get Monferno.

    (now we wait until the Spear Pillar arc... if we even get one)

    *C_L*


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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurtwigFan1 View Post
    Ash could beat Brandon. Paul couldn't beat Brandon. Therefore, wouldn't it seem that Ash should be able to beat Paul or at least lose by a far smaller margin? It just seems unrealistic to me. Can't the writers remember things like that?
    I used to think that, or thought like that. But you have to take in consideration of various factors. In a perfect would with limiting factors, in theory Ash should've won.

    And I agree it was quite unrealistic simply because of the abilities and statuses, and somehow Paul got a stronger Ursaring, because I have no idea where this strength suddenly came from. Given the fact Chimchar has beaten 3 times now (which is hilarious by the way). Ursaring should've went down long before Chimchar, and Electabuzz, seriously it's like Paul's Pokemon went from level craptastic to level impossible, in such a short time too.

    I just wish Monferno could've come into existence in a fairer method, was it so horrible for the match to end in a tie, I would've much preferred that then what we got. Considering Electabuzz got its butt kicked, but no it has impossible stamina just like Ursaring.
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  4. #29
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    I agree with your points dman dustion. I disliked how Gliscor defense decrease in this episode. It can take a few hits from Byron's Bastiodon and yet cannot take one frenzy plant ( Which he resist) from Torterra. The writers almost made Ash an idiot again by not using a fire move when Monferno's blaze kick in.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by bui View Post
    I agree with your points dman dustion. I disliked how Gliscor defense decrease in this episode. It can take a few hits from Byron's Bastiodon and yet cannot take one frenzy plant ( Which he resist) from Torterra. The writers almost made Ash an idiot again by not using a fire move when Monferno's blaze kick in.
    Actually grass would do normal damage to Gliscor as its ground type would make it x2 but its flying type would halve that to x1.

    This was just embarrassing the way ash lost. 6-2 really? Did the writers think because of the way Paul lost to Brandon they needed to make up for it? Ursaring and its ridiculous stamina was urking to say the least. I could have seen a result like this being plausible about sometime before the 4th gym but its one badge to go before the league, even if it was gonna have Paul as the victor 6-4 would have been a little more believable.
    Last edited by neo_senku; 18th June 2009 at 4:18 PM.

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  6. #31
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    Thank for the correction. I still think it should't have fainted.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurtwigFan1 View Post
    Ash could beat Brandon. Paul couldn't beat Brandon. Therefore, wouldn't it seem that Ash should be able to beat Paul or at least lose by a far smaller margin? It just seems unrealistic to me. Can't the writers remember things like that?
    do you actually think ash could beat brandon with his sinnoh team? its actually laughable to even think that! the only reason ash got so far before on his THIRD TIME! was because he used pokemon he'd had for years!

    I personally thought this was a great episode.

    chimchar evolved and showed it really is a powerful lil pokemon - also loved electabuzz's face when it saw monferno!

    staraptor was quite cool aswel as was buizel even though it lost! - should have recalled it ash!

    but one thing i did think if both sides hadnt been able to switch pokemon i think the battle would have ended more evenly mabe even giving ash the win!

  8. #33
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    This episode upsets me. I hate to see Ash lose to a jerk like Paul.

    I hope there is enough time for Ash to catch Paul's team in terms of power before the league.

    What did Paul say to make Ash grit his teeth like that at the end? Also, what did Ash say to Monferno after it fainted/woke up? It seemed to make it smile at least.

  9. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by TurtwigFan1 View Post
    Ash could beat Brandon. Paul couldn't beat Brandon. Therefore, wouldn't it seem that Ash should be able to beat Paul or at least lose by a far smaller margin? It just seems unrealistic to me. Can't the writers remember things like that?
    You forgot some points.
    1. Paul didn't use his full team of experienced Pokémon, he also used his (probably) underused Lairon, Nidoking and Hariyama (which we probably won't see again) which don't seem as strong as the others.
    2. Brandon used all of his regis, which wasn't the case with Ash. Ash beat his team of 3 "normal" Pokémon and Regice and not all 3 regis.
    3. Ash used his Kanto team, which is probably stronger than his Sinnoh team now, with which he lost to Paul.
    4. Brandon may have trained his regis between Ash's victory and Paul's loss against him.

    I think the battle was really great, cool animations, a new evolution and not the usual structure of only changing the Pokémon if they faint. I really liked that both of them withdrew their Pokémon even if they didn't faint. That made the battle more exciting.
    Ash losing 6-2 is quite a big loss, but he won nearly every gym battle in Sinnoh with his first try, so it's time that he loses a battle.


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  10. #35
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    Meh there's always the main league. Hopefully the writers will have Ash evolve more of his pokémon and have them learn some more moves.
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  11. #36
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    Seems to me like Team Rocket hate Paul but also to see Ash lose so badly, it made me happy to see that.
    Ursaring has changed massively from DP081, from a weakling that couldn't take on Chimchar to a beast that almost sweeps Ash.
    I don't use "uber" Pokemon , I don't calculate stat values, I don't use cheating devices, I don't breed my way to perfection, and I don't care about natures. I catch my Pokemon the way they are, and treat them like individuals instead of brainless drones. If you use this philosophy, copy & paste this into your signature. (Started by Tyranitar)

  12. #37
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    I counted! Glisor didn't last 20 sec.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shego View Post
    Tell me about it. This is like unaccpetable. It could have two trainers each have at least one pokemon remaining.
    ...

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  14. #39
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    It doesn't matter. Gliscor nearly defeated Torterra in DP131, it was obviously tired. Torterra just managed to land a hit first.
    I think that may be why Paul recalled it when Ash sent out Pikachu.



    Paul's team is obviously a powerhouse.

    Weavile stood up to a 4X damage hit and could still battle. It took quite a few hits from what is probably Ash's strongest pokemon right now, Staraptor, to take it down.


    Honchkrow proved it's stamina in all three of it's battles against Ash and it's battle against Maylene. It didn't even seem tired at the end of the Pokeringer contest despite taking a ton of powerful hits.


    Ursaring KOed three of Ash's pokemon and survived many attacks from Brandon's pokemon.

    Gliscor took down Gligar without even taking a hit

    Torterra bought Garchomp to it's knees and showed off in the Tag Team Tournement. Even after taking many super effective hits from Gliscor it was still able to keep going.


    Electabuzz took a lot of hits from Monferno and still won after Monferno used blaze. It also took a few hits from the Regis

    Magmortar easily took down Maylene's Lucario and stood up to Pikachu and Buizel without becoming tired. It also took a ton of hits from Brandon's pokemon




    To me it looks like Ash's main mistake was not changing his pokemon enough. Paul swapped his pokemon constantly, there where many insytances where Ash should have immediately swapped pokemon rather than allowing them to battle and become weakened before swapping.

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    Monferno's blaze was irrevelant because it didn't use a fire move after it activated.

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    So how did this battle go exactly? Match-up-wise, I know we had:
    Pikachu vs Magmortar
    Pikachu vs. Ursaring
    Staraptor vs. Ursaring
    Chimchar vs. Ursaring
    Monferno vs. Electabuzz
    Buizel vs. Magmortar
    Buizel vs. Ursaring
    Gliscor vs. Torterra

    There may have been more that I missed, but I still don't know exact order of the happenings.
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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by GalladeRocks View Post
    So how did this battle go exactly? Match-up-wise, I know we had:
    Pikachu vs Magmortar
    Pikachu vs. Ursaring
    Staraptor vs. Ursaring
    Chimchar vs. Ursaring
    Monferno vs. Electabuzz
    Buizel vs. Magmortar
    Buizel vs. Ursaring
    Gliscor vs. Torterra

    There may have been more that I missed, but I still don't know exact order of the happenings.
    Pikachu vs Magmortar - Satoshi withdraws Pikachu, sends out Buizel

    Buizel vs Magmortar - Shinji withdraws Magmortar, sends out Ringuma

    Buizel vs Ringuma - Ringuma wins

    Mukuhawk vs Ringuma - Ringuma wins

    Satoshi sends out Hikozaru, Shinji withdraws Ringuma and sends out Eleboo

    Hikozaru vs Eleboo - Eleboo uses Light Screen and shinji siwtches to Dodatose

    Hikozaru vs Dodaitose - Satoshi withdraws Hokozaru, sends out Glion

    Glion vs Dodaitose - Dodaitose wins

    Pikachu vs Dodaitose - Shinji withdraws Dodaitose

    Pikachu vs Ringuma - Ringuma wins

    Hikozaru vs Ringuma - Hikozaru wins. Evolves to moukazaru

    Moukazaru vs Eleboo - Eleboo wins

  18. #43
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    Pikachu vs Magmortar(Pikachu is burned and withdrawn eventually)
    Buizel vs Magmortar(Paul withdraws Magmortar after it takes some damage)
    Buizel vs Ursaring(Ursaring, although Buizel deals a lot of damage)
    Staraptor vs Ursaring(Ursaring wins rather easily and is withdrawn)
    Chimchar vs Torterra(Chimchar is withdrawn)
    Gliscor vs Torterra(Torterra finishes off Gliscor with one frenzy plant)
    Pikachu vs Torterra(Torterra is immediately withdrawn)
    Pikachu vs Ursaring(Ursaring..yeah..again)
    Chimchar vs Ursaring(Chimchar wins but has a surprisingly tough time considering Ursaring just battled Buizel, Staraptor, and Pikachu)
    Monferno vs Electabuzz(Electabuzz, even though Monferno is owning the battle)

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    Quote Originally Posted by thunderblade12 View Post
    To me it looks like Ash's main mistake was not changing his pokemon enough. Paul swapped his pokemon constantly, there where many insytances where Ash should have immediately swapped pokemon rather than allowing them to battle and become weakened before swapping.
    I agree. If Ash would have swapped more often, then he might have been able to finish off more of Paul's pokemon. If, for instance, he had withdrawn buizel when it had come to Buisel vs. Ursaring, then Buisel would have been able to take out one later in the match.

    All those aside, it was a great episode to watch. Animation was top notch. All the attacks, special abilities everything were very nicely shown.

  20. #45
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    i love how everytime a pokemon evolves this season under Ash's care it tends to lose it's first non TR battle.

    If Monferno, Grotle and Buizel don't evolve by the league then all i've got to say is he better bust out his reserves, cause right now his current team doesn't stand a chance against Pauls.

  21. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Almighty Zard View Post
    i love how everytime a pokemon evolves this season under Ash's care it tends to lose it's first non TR battle.

    If Monferno, Grotle and Buizel don't evolve by the league then all i've got to say is he better bust out his reserves, cause right now his current team doesn't stand a chance against Pauls.
    This is what im saying.....but watch out...the naysayers will be saying how Buizel WONT evolve....it CANT evolve.

    I think everything is changed now, especially the fact that ash has 2 starters on his team at the same time, and they have both evolved once so far. That has NEVER happened. Same thing with the Water Pkmn......they have never evolved. So whats to say that it wont happen this time? im sensing that it will happen this time. It would be epic and ash would actually have potential. He will not be over powered. Look at his rivals Pkmn? Why cant he be overpowered? Hes been doing this for 10+ years.

    And in reality he could have an overpowered team anytime he wants with his reserves so whats to stop him from having a team of his current team be "Overpowered" I think they will be a bit more even then and give ash some backing in being an actual contender for the league title and possibly the elite 4

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straitos View Post
    This episode upsets me. I hate to see Ash lose to a jerk like Paul.

    I hope there is enough time for Ash to catch Paul's team in terms of power before the league.

    What did Paul say to make Ash grit his teeth like that at the end? Also, what did Ash say to Monferno after it fainted/woke up? It seemed to make it smile at least.
    Me too. I'm already tired of having Paul humiliate Ash after he wins. Well that better be the last one. I'm so sorry that Ash lost. In the preview of the episode 601, I'm starting to worry about what would become of Ash now after that battle. I hoping that doesn't make Ash become like Paul after that duel. Making him happy with his pokemon, and defeat his jerky rival in the Sinnoh League.
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  23. #48
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    I've watched the episode, and I loved it. Great animation, Monferno looked awesome, although I wish he would've beaten Electabuzz. Can't wait for depressed Ash next episode!
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almighty Zard View Post
    i love how everytime a pokemon evolves this season under Ash's care it tends to lose it's first non TR battle.

    If Monferno, Grotle and Buizel don't evolve by the league then all i've got to say is he better bust out his reserves, cause right now his current team doesn't stand a chance against Pauls.
    I have never agreed with you more until this very moment.

    My God, Ursaring was an absolute beast. It was just taking hits left and right and dished out loads of damage, and I thought Grotle and Torterra were tanks. I mean I trained an Ursaring and its my favorite Pokemon, but geez it just tore up Ash's team. Monferno was cool, but it didn't take down a thing, man.

    I really don't want Ash to use reserves, but besides Staraptor and Monferno, its really looking bleak from this battle. :/


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  25. #50
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    Unhappy

    Poor Ash........ If there was anything I could tell him, I'd say, "Turn that frown upside down, keep on training, and you'll win to Paul next time.

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