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Thread: Conquering the Frozen Tower: Articuno Stars in My New BT Team!

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    Default Conquering the Frozen Tower: Articuno Stars in My New BT Team!

    No, Going for the Gold is still in use, but I know I'm not going to beat V4E with it, so I've decided to simply try a new idea for fun. So let's cut to the chase.


    Spiritomb@Choice Scarf
    Bold
    Ev's:252Hp/76Def/180Sp.Def
    ~Pressure~
    -Trick
    -Grudge
    -Memento
    -Pain Split

    Lol, it's the third slowest (after Duskull and Dusclops) TrickScarfer in the game. What makes him so attractive for the role isn't speed, but the fact that he has no weaknesses, and the ability to drain his opponent's PP using Pressure and Grudge. Nothing OHKO's him, so I should be able to easily Trick the Scarf at the bare minimum. Once that is accomplished, I can use Grudge to drain the PP of their last move, making them totally useless when my Sweepers come in. If I would be better served by it, i.e. if my opponent is locked into a setup move, I can use Memento to drop their stats, allowing an OHKO if Swampert come in, while for Articuno, an OHKO is assured. Pain Split is simply there to weaken opponents that are locked into Attacking moves (if Spiritomb isn't going to faint in turn 2), so that Swampert gets an easier KO. EV's maximize defenses, giving him a 151 in Defense and Special Defense, and a 157 in Hp.


    Swampert@Chesto Berry
    Careful
    Ev's:252Hp/4Def/252Sp.Def
    ~Torrent~
    -Curse
    -Rest
    -Waterfall
    -Return

    RestChesto CursePert. The Physical counterpart to bulky CMCune. He'll come in if there's something the star of the show can't handle, such as a Fire Type, Rock Type, Electric Type, or Steel Type, or a Pokemon locked into one of those moves. Wait, did I just list all of Articuno's weaknesses? That's the point. The only thing I wasn't really sure about was his last move. EQ is STAB, but it would've left me open to several Pokemon, namely Gyarados and almost all Grass Types. Articuno laughs in the face of Grass Types, but Gyara could've be a problem. To that end, I've sprung for Return, with it's awesome coverage on everything but Shedinja and Empoleon when combined with Waterfall.

    And now... Introducing the Star of the Show...


    Articuno@Leftovers
    Bold
    Ev's:252Hp/172Def/84Sp.Def
    ~Pressure~
    -Sheer Cold
    -Mind Reader
    -Substitute
    -Roost

    Now do you guys see why Articuno is so beastly? As long as she has Sub up, she's virtually indistructible. Switching into a Struggling or weakened Pokemon allows her to set it up with ease. Roost is for healing, should it even become a necessity. Finally, Mind Reader and Sheer Cold ensures an OHKO on anything without the Sturdy ability. Palmer should be shivering from both fear and the cold with her on my team.

    And that concludes the team. Comments and Suggestions appreciated!
    Last edited by Eon Master; 18th December 2009 at 10:52 PM.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



  2. #2
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    My only fear for you is Sturdy Magnezone that isn't exposed to your starter. Namely this one:

    604 | Magnezone | Impish | Lum Berry | Iron Head | Explosion | Swagger | Psych Up | Atk/Def

    Psych Up, Def EVs, Swagger, Explosion. I'd be careful around him.

    Also your moveset for Spiritomb seems a bit redundant, but I guess that's the point and won't really matter once Articuno gets on the field. I'm interested in knowing how this team does.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bknesal View Post
    My only fear for you is Sturdy Magnezone that isn't exposed to your starter. Namely this one:

    604 | Magnezone | Impish | Lum Berry | Iron Head | Explosion | Swagger | Psych Up | Atk/Def

    Psych Up, Def EVs, Swagger, Explosion. I'd be careful around him.
    Yeah, that Magnezone is a problem child, but he's still just a child. Defensively bulky as he is, Swampert will at least tie with him. If he gets locked into Swagger, that's fine with me, Articuno has Pressure too. She's faster, and if I set up Sub, it won't hurt me. It'll take a little while to stall out Swagger, but it'll work.

    Also your moveset for Spiritomb seems a bit redundant, but I guess that's the point and won't really matter once Articuno gets on the field. I'm interested in knowing how this team does.
    Yeah, he's meant to function the same way as the Dusknoir set I gave you. I haven't tested it extensively, but so far it seems to work extremely well.

    Quote Originally Posted by bknesal View Post
    By the way, I just noticed your team with TrickScarf Spiritomb. I was torn between Dusknoir and Spiritomb as a TrickScarf starter, but chose Dusknoir for his bulk. Funny coincidence
    Yeah, I was leaning twoards Dusknoir for a while, but I chose Spiritomb for his lack of any weaknesses, at least allowing me to Trick the Scarf before the battle gets started. He also has three very common immunities, meaning he's safe from quite a lot.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eon Master View Post
    No, Going for the Gold is still in use, but I know I'm not going to beat V4E with it, so I've decided to simply try a new idea for fun. So let's cut to the chase.


    Spiritomb@Choice Scarf
    Bold
    Ev's:252Hp/76Def/180Sp.Def
    ~Pressure~
    -Trick
    -Grudge
    -Memento
    -Pain Split

    Lol, it's the third slowest (after Duskull and Dusclops) TrickScarfer in the game. What makes him so attractive for the role isn't speed, but the fact that he has no weaknesses, and the ability to drain his opponent's PP using Pressure and Grudge. Nothing OHKO's him, so I should be able to easily Trick the Scarf at the bare minimum. Once that is accomplished, I can use Grudge to drain the PP of their last move, making them totally useless when my Sweepers come in. If I would be better served by it, i.e. if my opponent is locked into a setup move, I can use Memento to drop their stats, allowing an OHKO if Swampert come in, while for Articuno, an OHKO is assured. Pain Split is simply there to weaken opponents that are locked into Attacking moves (if Spiritomb isn't going to faint in turn 2), so that Swampert gets an easier KO. EV's maximize defenses, giving him a 151 in Defense and Special Defense, and a 157 in Hp.

    374 | Absol | Jolly | Chople Berry | Sucker Punch | Facade | Double Team | Taunt | Atk/Spe
    This guy will screw over lead Spirtomb with Taunt. You practically HAVE to switch, which will probably net him a Double Team. Watch out for hax with that.

    443 | Aerodactyl | Jolly | King's Rock | Rock Slide | Aerial Ace | Torment | Taunt | Atk/Spe

    This chap doesn't need Taunt to irritate you. He'll flinch-hax Articuno to death with Rock Slide and will slow down CursePert's boosting with Torment and Taunt. This can potentially give his teammates an advantage.

    411 | Bastiodon | Impish | Focus Band | Iron Head | Stone Edge | Swagger | Taunt | Def/SpD

    This guy isn't TOO hard, but his defenses are INSANE. Them + Focus band = A fair bit of difficulty. Look out for Swagger on the switch.

    232 | Crawdaunt | Modest | Persim Berry | BubbleBeam | Dark Pulse | Harden | Taunt | Def/SpA

    This guy isn't really threatening, but watch if he Hardens too many times if Swampert is KO'd.

    438 | Honchkrow | Adamant | Wacan Berry | Night Slash | Aerial Ace | Torment | Taunt | HP/Atk

    He WILL use Torment + Taunt in order to annoy the crap out of you.

    321 | Zangoose | Adamant | Razor Claw | Crush Claw | Shadow Claw | Aerial Ace | Taunt | Atk/Spe

    He's very powerful on the attack side and spped, so watch out for crit hax with Shadow Claw.

    They all outspeed Spiritomb and will force a switch. My suggestion for a TrickScarf Sheddy counter is:-
    Rotom(are alt. forms allowed?)@ Choice Scarf
    252 SpAtk 252 Spd 6 HP
    Timid/Modest
    -Thunderbolt
    -Shadow Ball
    -Trick
    -Signal Beam/Overheat



    Swampert@Chesto Berry
    Careful
    Ev's:252Hp/4Def/252Sp.Def
    ~Torrent~
    -Curse
    -Rest
    -Waterfall
    -Return/EQ

    RestChesto CursePert. The Physical counterpart to bulky CMCune. He'll come in if there's something the star of the show can't handle, such as a Fire Type, Rock Type, Electric Type, or Steel Type, or a Pokemon locked into one of those moves. Wait, did I just list all of Articuno's weaknesses? That's the point. The only thing I'm not really sure about is his last move. EQ is STAB, but it leaves me open to several Pokemon, namely Gyarados and almost all Grass Types. Articuno laughs in the face of Grass Types, but Gyara could be a problem. To that end, I've considered Return, with it's awesome coverage on everything but Shedinja and Empoleon when combined with Waterfall. What do you guys think?

    You're having serious Sheddy problems. No super-effective moves for it, and I dunno if Sheer Cold will affect it. However, this is good.


    And now... Introducing the Star of the Show...


    Articuno@Leftovers
    Bold
    Ev's:252Hp/172Def/84Sp.Def
    ~Pressure~
    -Sheer Cold
    -Mind Reader
    -Substitute
    -Roost

    Now do you guys see why Articuno is so beastly? As long as she has Sub up, she's virtually indistructible. Switching into a Struggling or weakened Pokemon allows her to set it up with ease. Roost is for healing, should it even become a necessity. Finally, Mind Reader and Sheer Cold ensures an OHKO on anything without the Sturdy ability. Palmer should be shivering from both fear and the cold with her on my team.

    I suppose this is your Shedinja 'counter' with SubRoost. Beware of the Taunt Aerodactyl I mentioned earlier.

    And that concludes the team. Comments and Suggestions appreciated!
    You know the drill. This is quite a good team.
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    Most of the stuff you mentioned isn't much of a problem. The Absol is, but Aero isn't. 30% Flinch hax maximum means that Spiritomb still has a 70% shot at getting off Trick. And that's if it uses Rock Slide. Sheer Cold hits Sheddy, but he disappears after battle 20, so I won't be losing any high streaks. Thanks for the rate, though.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



  6. #6
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    on spirttomb u need toxic instead of memnto they switch momento useless

    swampert switch the berry to a salac berry then switch rest for ice punch getting a effective hit on gyra since u r a cursepurt use hammer arm instead of eq

    articuno fine
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    Quote Originally Posted by venra77 View Post
    on spirttomb u need toxic instead of memnto they switch momento useless

    swampert switch the berry to a salac berry then switch rest for ice punch getting a effective hit on gyra since u r a cursepurt use hammer arm instead of eq

    articuno fine
    Lol.

    Memento is used when Spiritomb is almost dead/PP wasted, and the AI rarely switches.

    Swampert is meant to be bulky, that's why it has Rest, to allow him to stay in and sweep. EQ gets STAB and decent (enough) coverage along with Waterfall... so if anything Return>EQ. Whatta rate. I congratulate you on your knowledge of the English language.

    Nice team you have here Eon. Although I would personally use Spite>Grudge on 'Tomb since I'm not exactly sure if Grudge comes into effect if you use Momento (if that was what you were planning) otherwise, looks great.

    Also, kudos for using Articuno :]

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    ^You hit the nail on the head for correcting that person

    Anyway, Spiritomb has a choice of using Grudge against attacks, Memento against setup, or Pain Split for fun. I wasn't planning on using Grudge and Memento at once, it wouldn't work.

    And thanks I've been trying to fit her into a team for a long time.

    EDIT: 1000TH POST!!!
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



  9. #9
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    it just occured to me that you have no Shedinja killing moves
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    ^Sheer Cold hits Shedinja.

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    Oh, I thought WG applied to all moves. Oh well. :P
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    Even if it didn't, All 3 of his Pokes could PP stall it. Spiritomb can stall it with Pressure, Swampert could stall it with Rest, and Articuno could stall it with Sub + Pressure. So it's nothing really to worry about anyways.

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    Be warned: Stone Edge seems to be the default move for Pokemon who don't carry super-effective moves in the Tower, meaning Articuno may be virtually useless some rounds. When set up correctly, I predict Articuno will be able KO 1 Pokemon most of the time, 2 a good deal of the time, and possible 3 if your sub never breaks. Chances are your sub will break on the secong opponent, and the third Pokemon will get a free attack while you take a turn to use Mind Reader.

    It could work, but I honestly don't see this team quite getting very far. But I think you already know this.
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    Flash is an option over Grudge because 1. Grudge does not work alongside Memento (iirc) 2. you can screw around with the foe some more. Hypnosis is a possibility for the same reason, though the accuracy is a bummer. Spite is not because you might lower the PP of a non-choiced move.

    Return > EQ because SE coverage matters very little at +6.

    Overall, this team looks reasonably decent. Just one thing - If Arty's Sub breaks on the first or second pokemon you could potentially find it difficult for Swampert to kill the third, especially with so many faster users of Grass-type moves. For this reason you could probably try and keep Spiritomb in the game; even without being able to Trick another Scarf, he can successfully cripple many potential threats. Bear in mind that this is just speculation.

    Also, did you get the idea for the Articuno set off my comment in Project New World?

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    Quote Originally Posted by venra77 View Post
    on spirttomb u need toxic instead of memnto they switch momento useless
    Allow me to quote something from http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthread.php?t=427036

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaporeon4evr View Post
    AI’s limitations:

    ~In almost all cases, the AI will not switch Pokemon. Notable exceptions include Perish Song (don’t bother) and two-turn status moves (Yawn). This means that attacks that lower the opponent’s stats (Charm, Fake Tears, Memento) become viable, as the AI will not switch out to amend these stat drops. These moves will be very useful later in this guide, when we discuss strategy. Also, two-turn moves like Fly, Bounce, and Dig also become viable.
    Please read this guide before rating BT Teams.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlCario View Post
    Flash is an option over Grudge because 1. Grudge does not work alongside Memento (iirc) 2. you can screw around with the foe some more. Hypnosis is a possibility for the same reason, though the accuracy is a bummer. Spite is not because you might lower the PP of a non-choiced move.
    You don't understand Spiritomb's purpose. He's supposed either 1. Lock the opponent's starter into an attack then reduce that attacks PP to 0, therefore locking him into struggle or 2. Lock the opponent's starter into using a setup move then reduce it's defenses with Memento. It would be feasible to replace Memento with something else, but there really isn't any point. Especially with the first option being a move that attempts reduce the opponent's accuracy while the accuracy Hax is in place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bknesal View Post
    You don't understand Spiritomb's purpose. He's supposed either 1. Lock the opponent's starter into an attack then reduce that attacks PP to 0, therefore locking him into struggle or 2. Lock the opponent's starter into using a setup move then reduce it's defenses with Memento. It would be feasible to replace Memento with something else, but there really isn't any point. Especially with the first option being a move that attempts reduce the opponent's accuracy while the accuracy Hax is in place.
    Locking the opponent into a set up move is the best possible outcome. Why? Because they can't do a thing to hurt him, buying him even more time. Reducing their defences is pointless because 1. Swampert KO them at +6 anyway, in most cases and 2. Memento doesn't do that. Also, Flash is a perfectly viable option.

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    I don't really know much about that Trick Scarf strategy, so can anyone explain it?
    'Cause i would say to switch Trick with Trick Room and make your other pok&#233;mon as slow as possible? xD Then you can switch an item that would work better for Spiritomb so it isn't a wast...
    But i said i don't get the point of the strategy, and i know my suggestion could ruin your team, but its just a suggestion. :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlCario View Post
    Flash is an option over Grudge because 1. Grudge does not work alongside Memento (iirc) 2. you can screw around with the foe some more. Hypnosis is a possibility for the same reason, though the accuracy is a bummer. Spite is not because you might lower the PP of a non-choiced move.
    I wasn't planning on using Grudge and Memento in concert. It's one or the other, depending on the situtation. Flash might be a good idea over Memento though.

    Return > EQ because SE coverage matters very little at +6.
    Agreed.

    Overall, this team looks reasonably decent. Just one thing - If Arty's Sub breaks on the first or second pokemon you could potentially find it difficult for Swampert to kill the third, especially with so many faster users of Grass-type moves. For this reason you could probably try and keep Spiritomb in the game; even without being able to Trick another Scarf, he can successfully cripple many potential threats. Bear in mind that this is just speculation.
    Yeah, I know. It's another problem, but all teams have several. And it's less likely than the Magnezone problem.

    Also, did you get the idea for the Articuno set off my comment in Project New World?
    Yeah, I finally figured out how to use her in a BT team because of that. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slowprince View Post
    I don't really know much about that Trick Scarf strategy, so can anyone explain it?
    'Cause i would say to switch Trick with Trick Room and make your other pokémon as slow as possible? xD Then you can switch an item that would work better for Spiritomb so it isn't a wast...
    But i said i don't get the point of the strategy, and i know my suggestion could ruin your team, but its just a suggestion. :P
    Ok, I'll explain. The Choice Scarf may increase speed to +1, but it also locks the holder into a single move. Tricking the Scarf to my opponent locks them into the move that they used or are planning on using. Then, the Tricker uses various setup moves (Grudge, Thunder Wave, Flash, Memento, ect.) to cripple the opponent. Then, the setup sweeper comes in and increases their offensive stats using moves like Curse, Swords Dance, Nasty Plot, or Calm Mind, usually from behind a Substitute. It's a nearly foolproof strategy when executed properly.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



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    Forget what I said about Stone Edge. You can easily PP Stall in out with Spiritomb. But I have tried using that Spiritomb as a lead, and I should warn you that Grudge only works if the opponent KOs you the same turn that you use it. Therefore, it's pretty unreliable. Spite would be the next best choice. Combined with Pressure, it should probably still work rather well.
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    ^Yeah, I found that even Articuno can PP stall Stone Edge if necessary. I've also tried Spite, and I've found Grudge to be more effective, seeing as I can do it up to five times in a row if necessary.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



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    That was my beef with Grudge. I thought I could use it it conjunction with Memento, and was sorely disappointed when I found out it can't. And the recoil from Struggle always meant I didn't have quite enough time to set up the way I wanted.

    Obviously, it could still work, I'm just not a fan.
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    ^I think that's where our styles differ, and it makes the difference between you and me. You're an excellent analyst, but it causes some backlash because you have to come up with exact stratgies. I'm more flexible, but more reckless.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



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    N00b question:

    How come you chose Spiritomb? What about Sableye? (Just a question)
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    ^Better defenses, pure and simple.
    "I'm fighting because there's a battle to be fought, Archer. I'm fighting to win. That's all."
    "Hm. Alright, Rin. You are indeed my ideal Master. There is no one else I could hope to serve."



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