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Thread: Competitive Single Rates (5th Gen Standard OU) - READ FIRST POST

  1. #4501
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    The common rocky helmet users, Ferrothorn and Deoxys D, are better off being V-Created to death in the first place, so I don't need to get my HP down to 1 when I face them. I don't think anything else runs rocky helmet. Garchomp beats me, yes, but Cresselia can take a hit and retaliate with Ice Beam. I could also run Infernape (Blaziken in Ubers) to nail these threats to begin with.

    Scarf Keldeo and Scarf Terrakion do get the chance to revenge me, but I can always switch out. Thanks for the Wobbuffet option, though. Wobba can counter faster Scarf users. However, this gives half my team a psychic typing (Cresselia, Victini, Wobbuffet), so it might not be ideal.

    I'm actually thinking about using this set in an Ubers sun team (yeah, suck it, Kyogre). You pretty much get either sun or rain in one of those teams. The team members I'm thinking are...

    Defensive Groudon
    Swords Dance Blaziken
    Dual Screens Xatu
    Stall breaker Xatu
    Healing Wish Latias
    SubCM Latias
    Calm Mind Arceus-Steel
    Choice Scarf Garchomp
    Support Cresselia
    Cleric Espeon
    Nasty Plot Darkrai
    Custap Berry Wobbuffet

    What do you think I should use as team members for Victini? You can also add in your own members. When I get a full team, I'll make a new thread on it.
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  2. #4502

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    Quote Originally Posted by silverangel View Post
    The common rocky helmet users, Ferrothorn and Deoxys D, are better off being V-Created to death in the first place, so I don't need to get my HP down to 1 when I face them. I don't think anything else runs rocky helmet. Garchomp beats me, yes, but Cresselia can take a hit and retaliate with Ice Beam. I could also run Infernape (Blaziken in Ubers) to nail these threats to begin with.

    Scarf Keldeo and Scarf Terrakion do get the chance to revenge me, but I can always switch out. Thanks for the Wobbuffet option, though. Wobba can counter faster Scarf users. However, this gives half my team a psychic typing (Cresselia, Victini, Wobbuffet), so it might not be ideal.

    I'm actually thinking about using this set in an Ubers sun team (yeah, suck it, Kyogre). You pretty much get either sun or rain in one of those teams. The team members I'm thinking are...

    Defensive Groudon
    Swords Dance Blaziken
    Dual Screens Xatu
    Stall breaker Xatu
    Healing Wish Latias
    SubCM Latias
    Calm Mind Arceus-Steel
    Choice Scarf Garchomp
    Support Cresselia
    Cleric Espeon
    Nasty Plot Darkrai
    Custap Berry Wobbuffet

    What do you think I should use as team members for Victini? You can also add in your own members. When I get a full team, I'll make a new thread on it.
    Wait. Isn't this the singles rate? Not the teambuilding help thread?
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  3. #4503
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    Raikou @ Life orb
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 sp. atk 252 speed 6 sp. def
    Nature: Rash
    - Thunderbolt/Thunder
    - Weather Ball
    - Aurasphere
    - Extremespeed/Shadow Ball

    I am planning to build an anti-weather crown Raikou for the upcoming wifi double battle competition. I am still quite new to competitive battling so I need some help here. Rash nature is forced so i can't really do anything about it. Thunderbolt and Thunder for STAB but i can't decide which to keep. Thunder has got perfect accuracy in rain and hits opponent's rain team hard. Thunderbolt is more reliable outside of rain but don't hit as hard. Weather Ball to abuse whatever weather that comes my way. Aurasphere to counter Tyranitars and steels. The last move is for either priority or coverage. It has a low power Steel type hidden power so we can forget about it. Extra info: I will have Ninetales in my team to activate drought once i get rid of opponent's Politoed if necessary. I have my own Politoed to set up rain if the opponent do not run a weather team at all.
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  4. #4504
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    Lapras @ Leftovers
    252 HP, 252 Defense, 6 Special Defense.
    Bold Nature, Water Absorb
    ~ Whirlpool
    ~ Perish Song
    ~ Protect
    ~ Ice Beam

    Oddest thing ever? Maybe. But it is simple. Ice Beam anything that resist whirlpool. Then, proceed to whirlpool, to trap them. Then Perish Song and Protet then on the last turn switch out causing them to faint. It is only avoidable if 1. Whirlpool misses or 2. You have the super rare Shed Shell.
    Aslo I run this set with Politoed but with Encore > Ice Beam and was wondering which was better.

  5. #4505
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    That is a nice set, a bit gimmicky but with the right prediction it can easily take out one of the opponents main offensive or defensive threats, I have a few suggestions though. I question the usefulness of ice beam, if you really want an attacking move I would go with icy wind for the added utility, but instead I suggest using rest, especially if used on a rain team with hydration for its ability. This gives it enough staying power to tank a few hits and maybe get 2 or 3 KO's.

    edit: infact if you run this and politoed on the same team you could have a cool perish trap core to a rain stall team. Just throw in a vaporeon and a physically defensive steel.
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  6. #4506
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    Tyranitar @ Choice Specs
    Modest Nature, Sand Stream
    252 HP, 252 Special Attack, 6 Defense
    - Fire Blast
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Dark Pulse

    This set has been running very well for me, and it does have a usable 95 Special Attack so I prefer the surprise factor. That way, people won't WoW me to cripple me.

  7. #4507
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    I had a thread about a year back regarding doing a whole team of Ambipom (shocking, right?). With it's semi-vast movepool(ish) I'm able to make a whole team of 6.

    But, since I want to make the team now, I'm not gonna remake the whole thread, but I'll just post the one moveset I want help on:

    Ambipom@Sitrus Berry
    Technician
    186 HP, 252 Defense, 190 SpDef
    Impish (+Defense, - SpAtk)
    ~Attract
    ~Toxic
    ~Protect/Spite
    ~Taunt/U-Turn/Double Team

    So, here's my attempt to make a "wall" (I know Ambipom is far from a wall, but I still wanna try it! lol) Its usage as a wall explains the EV spread (it's higher in Defense since Fighting move are usually Physical)

    What I plan on doing is Poisoning the foe with Toxic, then using Attract (if situation works). My hopes are that if Attract worked, the opponent would switch out, allowing me to Poison more Pokemon.

    In moveslot 3, I'm not sure if I want to Troll and spam Protect, or sap their PP with Spite

    In moveslot 4, I don't know what direction to take. Either I Troll around with Double Team, prevent setups with Taunt, or prevent being trapped by Taunt and making a semi-clean getaway.

    Any help would be appreciated!
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  8. #4508
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmbipomMaster View Post
    I had a thread about a year back regarding doing a whole team of Ambipom (shocking, right?). With it's semi-vast movepool(ish) I'm able to make a whole team of 6.

    But, since I want to make the team now, I'm not gonna remake the whole thread, but I'll just post the one moveset I want help on:

    Ambipom@Sitrus Berry
    Technician
    186 HP, 252 Defense, 190 SpDef
    Impish (+Defense, - SpAtk)
    ~Attract
    ~Toxic
    ~Protect/Spite
    ~Taunt/U-Turn/Double Team

    So, here's my attempt to make a "wall" (I know Ambipom is far from a wall, but I still wanna try it! lol) Its usage as a wall explains the EV spread (it's higher in Defense since Fighting move are usually Physical)

    What I plan on doing is Poisoning the foe with Toxic, then using Attract (if situation works). My hopes are that if Attract worked, the opponent would switch out, allowing me to Poison more Pokemon.

    In moveslot 3, I'm not sure if I want to Troll and spam Protect, or sap their PP with Spite

    In moveslot 4, I don't know what direction to take. Either I Troll around with Double Team, prevent setups with Taunt, or prevent being trapped by Taunt and making a semi-clean getaway.

    Any help would be appreciated!
    Well for starters your EV spread can't work because it's a total of 628 EVs while the max is 510.

    Anything that's immune to poison (Poison Heal users, Poison types, Steel types, Magic Guard users, etc.) instantly screws this set over. You can't rely solely on Toxic, or you'll lose every time; it's very easy to work around.

    Double Team is typically banned under evasion clause, but it depends on where you're battling.

    Attract is totally gimmicky, and screwed over by genderless Pokemon or Pokemon of the same gender. Way too unreliable.

    Plus, using Ambipom as a wall is beyond silly. It has no bulk on either side of the spectrum, no resistances beyond an immunity to ghost types, no reliable healing... And a full team of Ambipoms will be 6-0'd by anything with Mach Punch. It will get absolutely destroyed; just because a Pokemon has a vast movepool doesn't mean it can make use of every move it learns. Also, typically the "species clause" is in effect just about everywhere, rendering the entire concept moot.

    If you're not taking advantage of Ambipom's combination of speed and Technician, there's really no reason to use it at all. As a UU, normal type wall, Snorlax does everything it can do, except better. Not to be rough, but the set you're proposing is nothing short of gimmicky, and will probably get destroyed.
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  9. #4509

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    Roserade @Grass Gem
    Natural Cure
    252 Speed,252 Sp At
    Modest(+Sp at - At)
    -Leaf Storm
    -Weather Ball
    -Sludge Bomb
    -Energy Ball

    Is Roserade ok to fight experienced pokemon?

  10. #4510
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    Shuckle@ leftovers/chesto berry
    Contrary
    252 def 252 spedef 4 hp
    - shell smash
    -power split
    - stealth rocks/ rest /toxic
    - an attacking move not sure which so its not taunt bait
    Big time wall. This set is self explanatory. Lower both attacks, but raise defenses.
    Then split attacks.Then proceed to stall their team to death. This would be used on a sand team.
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  11. #4511
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorge565 View Post
    Shuckle@ leftovers/chesto berry
    Contrary
    252 def 252 spedef 4 hp
    - shell smash
    -power split
    - stealth rocks/ rest /toxic
    - an attacking move not sure which so its not taunt bait
    Big time wall. This set is self explanatory. Lower both attacks, but raise defenses.
    Then split attacks.Then proceed to stall their team to death. This would be used on a sand team.
    If you want to use a Shuckle first things first, it needs Max HP. EV wise you should go 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD with an Impish nature. Use it under sand and its defenses will be rock solid. Problem with Shuckle in general though is the lack of recovery, very low HP, and not being able to do any attacking damage whatsoever.

    GodDamnZilla

  12. #4512

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    can someone please help me to see if everything is ok with roserade or if there is anything i can do to improve her

  13. #4513
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    Quote Originally Posted by Articuno master013 View Post
    Roserade @Grass Gem
    Natural Cure
    252 Speed,252 Sp At
    Modest(+Sp at - At)
    -Leaf Storm
    -Weather Ball
    -Sludge Bomb
    -Energy Ball

    Is Roserade ok to fight experienced pokemon?
    Weather Ball is pretty gimmicky, it's not worth using. Go for Sleep Powder instead, which is more or less mandatory on Roserade; Sleep is always good, and Sleep Powder's semi-reliable accuracy helps you shut down potential counters who try to switch in.

    I'm not fond of Leaf Storm, at least not in this case. The SpA drop makes it more inclined for a Choice Specs set, since it's better for hit and run. But of course in general Specs and Sleep Powder don't mix. I'd drop it for Giga Drain, which is only marginally weaker than Energy Ball, but also has the added healing benefit.

    And Energy Ball might be replaced with Hidden Power, depending on what type it is. Fire will roast steel types who otherwise wall you, and Bugs as well, though Ground and Ice can be viable Hidden Powers as well.
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  14. #4514

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    thanks a lot KillerDraco I'm gonna try to use the sleep powder instead of weather ball.
    Quote Originally Posted by KillerDraco View Post
    Weather Ball is pretty gimmicky, it's not worth using. Go for Sleep Powder instead, which is more or less mandatory on Roserade; Sleep is always good, and Sleep Powder's semi-reliable accuracy helps you shut down potential counters who try to switch in.

    I'm not fond of Leaf Storm, at least not in this case. The SpA drop makes it more inclined for a Choice Specs set, since it's better for hit and run. But of course in general Specs and Sleep Powder don't mix. I'd drop it for Giga Drain, which is only marginally weaker than Energy Ball, but also has the added healing benefit.

    And Energy Ball might be replaced with Hidden Power, depending on what type it is. Fire will roast steel types who otherwise wall you, and Bugs as well, though Ground and Ice can be viable Hidden Powers as well.

  15. #4515
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    Liepard @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 255 Health EV's (can't remember if it can have up to 255 or 252), and 255 Speed EV's.
    Nature: Timid
    - Fake Out
    - Torment
    - Encore
    - Dark Pulse

    This is a single battle wall. Pretty much trolls the other pokemon. First use fake out. Then, use torment, as Prankster gives it a priority boost. As the Focus Sash will keep it alive, use encore, with yet another priority boost. STAB Dark Pulse pretty much finishes the opponent off.

  16. #4516
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    Well I'm not very good at this but here goes

    Wailord @ [TBD]
    Ability: Water Veil
    EVs: 252 ATK/ 252 DEF/ 4 SPD
    Nature: Gentle [+ Sp DEF, - DEF]
    - Dive/ Bounce
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Zen Headbutt

    Given Dive or Bounce to get a second turn strike, Dive for STAB and Bounce for use against Grass Types. Rest for when Wailord's health is lowered and Sleep Talk to use Zen Headbutt or Bounce/Dive while asleep. Zen Headbutt for sheer damage and chance to Flinch.

    Like I said, I'm not good at this so just hear me out.

    I'll take anything you can give me
    Last edited by hellothisismuffin; 9th April 2013 at 12:35 AM.
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  17. #4517
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothisismuffin View Post
    Well I'm not very good at this but here goes

    Wailord @ [TBD]
    Ability: Water Veil
    EVs: 252 ATK/ 252 DEF/ 4 SPD
    Nature: Gentle [+ Sp DEF, - DEF]
    - Dive/ Bounce
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Zen Headbutt

    Given Dive or Bounce to get a second turn strike, Dive for STAB and Bounce for use against Grass Types. Rest for when Wailord's health is lowered and Sleep Talk to use Zen Headbutt or Bounce/Dive while asleep. Zen Headbutt for sheer damage and chance to Flinch.

    Like I said, I'm not good at this so just hear me out.

    I'll take anything you can give me
    In a competitive setting, two-turn moves are generally considered poor options. If you Dive or Bounce, your opponent is just going to switch to an appropriate counter, so you've essentially given them a free turn. Also, considering 60 speed isn't exactly fast, flinching should never be high on your priority list.

    Wailord is generally not used much, because though its HP is high, its offenses are average at best, its speed is poor, and its defenses outright suck. As a "bulky" water type (and only bulky by virtue of its HP since as mentioned its defenses are awful) it's generally outclassed by Rotom-W, who, despite having poor HP, has strong defenses, better resistances, and a potent STAB combination.
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  18. #4518
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    That's a shame I was looking forward to using a Wailord.

    But if I was to use Rotom-W what should his moveset consist of? I need a solid Water type for my team
    Quote Originally Posted by Vernikova View Post
    My microwave is shooting electricity from the back and it's scaring me.

  19. #4519
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    Would Rotom-W be a good wall?

    Should I use Trick?

    I don't know, I don't use Rotom a lot
    Quote Originally Posted by Vernikova View Post
    My microwave is shooting electricity from the back and it's scaring me.

  20. #4520
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgs4manj View Post
    Liepard @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 255 Health EV's (can't remember if it can have up to 255 or 252), and 255 Speed EV's.
    Nature: Timid
    - Fake Out
    - Torment
    - Encore
    - Dark Pulse

    This is a single battle wall. Pretty much trolls the other pokemon. First use fake out. Then, use torment, as Prankster gives it a priority boost. As the Focus Sash will keep it alive, use encore, with yet another priority boost. STAB Dark Pulse pretty much finishes the opponent off.
    Will someone reply to this?

  21. #4521
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothisismuffin View Post
    Would Rotom-W be a good wall?

    Should I use Trick?

    I don't know, I don't use Rotom a lot
    I wouldn't call him a wall, but he's definitely a good bulky attacker, and the crux of many VoltTurn strategies. He's good at checking rain teams as well, due to his resistances to Flying, Water, and Ice, and neutrality to Thunder, along with solid bulk (albeit with low HP).

    The most common set on his tends to be:

    Rotom-W @Leftovers
    EVs: 232 HP / 56 SpA / 220 Spe
    Modest Nature
    -Hydro Pump
    -Volt Switch
    -Pain Split
    -Will-o-Wisp

    TrickScarf is also viable, though less seen than the above. It tends to be:

    Rotom @ Choice Scarf
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    -Hydro Pump
    -Hidden Power Ice
    -Trick
    -Volt Switch

    There's a few other options too, like Thunder Wave, Dual Screens (not recommended personally), Thunderbolt/Thunder Specs, using a Calm Nature for more special bulk... Rotom's options aren't too expansive, but it does have a few choices.

    Quote Originally Posted by mgs4manj View Post
    Liepard @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 255 Health EV's (can't remember if it can have up to 255 or 252), and 255 Speed EV's.
    Nature: Timid
    - Fake Out
    - Torment
    - Encore
    - Dark Pulse

    This is a single battle wall. Pretty much trolls the other pokemon. First use fake out. Then, use torment, as Prankster gives it a priority boost. As the Focus Sash will keep it alive, use encore, with yet another priority boost. STAB Dark Pulse pretty much finishes the opponent off.
    This will get absolutely wrecked; base 50 defense and special defense undermine any attempt to wall. Most things are going to be a guaranteed 2HKO on it. It may annoy the opponent slightly, but it will not have any significant output on the match. Dark Pulse alone isn't going to do much either, given that without any special attack investment, you won't be hitting hard at all. You're not going to be "finishing off" anything. Liepard may be able to troll with Prankset but it's too frail to ever be considered a wall (making the full HP EVs a total waste), and if they taunt you on the Torment turn, you're done.

    Also you only want 252, not 255. 255 is the technical max, but 252 is the effective max since it's the highest possible amount that's divisible by four.
    Competitive/IGRMT Mod and one of the writers for the PotW.

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  22. #4522
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    So I'm working on an anti-rain Dragonite. Since this is really situational, I want to give it some shuffler-type moves, as I feel these could compliment each other nicely. Here's what I have so far:

    Dragonite @ Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: ???
    Nature: ???
    - Hurricane
    - Thunder Wave
    - Roost
    - Dragon Tail

    Here's my reasoning: I want to spread paralysis throughout the enemy team, so Thunder Wave is a must. This also has the added bonus of crippling any Swift Swim users. Dragon Tail is useful for forcing switches when it's not raining, while Hurricane is good for when it is raining. Both are STAB moves, but useful in different situations. Leftovers, Roost and Multiscale are there to keep Dragonite alive.

    Because not every team has rain, I want Dragonite to be useful in those situations as well. Keeping-Dragonite-alive EVs are probably the most important. Offensive EVs probably aren't as big a deal, as I'll probably be using my Work Up Umbreon on this team, but I would like Dragonite to be able to hold its own if Umbreon is KO'd before it can set up a Baton Pass.

    Any ideas?

  23. #4523
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    Quote Originally Posted by danburite3 View Post
    So I'm working on an anti-rain Dragonite. Since this is really situational, I want to give it some shuffler-type moves, as I feel these could compliment each other nicely. Here's what I have so far:

    Dragonite @ Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: ???
    Nature: ???
    - Hurricane
    - Thunder Wave
    - Roost
    - Dragon Tail

    Here's my reasoning: I want to spread paralysis throughout the enemy team, so Thunder Wave is a must. This also has the added bonus of crippling any Swift Swim users. Dragon Tail is useful for forcing switches when it's not raining, while Hurricane is good for when it is raining. Both are STAB moves, but useful in different situations. Leftovers, Roost and Multiscale are there to keep Dragonite alive.

    Because not every team has rain, I want Dragonite to be useful in those situations as well. Keeping-Dragonite-alive EVs are probably the most important. Offensive EVs probably aren't as big a deal, as I'll probably be using my Work Up Umbreon on this team, but I would like Dragonite to be able to hold its own if Umbreon is KO'd before it can set up a Baton Pass.

    Any ideas?
    Just saying, Swift Swim + Drizzle is banned in OU, so you shouldn't put that in your analyses.
    I would recomend a Careful nature with 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD evs to last as long as possible

  24. #4524
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    i would also highly recommend substitute>hurricane. theres no need for hurricane, as common pokes that can take a t-wave arent phazed by a hurricane, pardon the pun. plus, no offensive evs leave it pitifully weak, and it needs all that hp+SpD. substitute allows it to bypass toxic, which would rain on his parade. dragonite has the added benefit of being faster than a lot of common toxic users, such as heatran(i believe), politoed, ferrothorn, blissey, etc.

    i would recommend as an offensive partner choice band terrakion. im sorry, but work up umbreon is a terrible set. terrakion helps forcee switches, which benefit you from possible hazard damage, or switching into a paralyzed pokemon. you can also easily take a lot of pokemon with dragonite, pokemon like keldeo [hp ghost], scarfterra, and most special threats, allowing you to safely regain momentum.

  25. #4525
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    Surely thunder over t wave, 100 accuracy in rain 30% paralysis. Plus nice damage.
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