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  1. #5551
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    Since no one replied to the Team Building Help Thread in a few days, I will post my help here.

    I feel like basing my team around Dragonite and this set:
    Dragonite @ Life Orb
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 SpA / 200 Spe / 56 Atk
    Moves:
    Outrage
    Earthquake
    Fire Blast
    Thunderbolt

    His goal is to hit as many leads for Super effective damage as possible. Outrage for STAB. Along with Fire Blast and Earthquake, nothing resists it. Since his Atk is so high, I didn't feel the need to max out Atk, so I maxed out SpA.

    Empoleon @ Leftovers
    Ability: Torrent
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 SpA
    Moves:
    Scald
    Stealth Rock
    Roar
    Ice Beam

    Idk how to describe this Pokemon.

    I prefer to be a balanced team, mixing offense with defense. This is OU ofc.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
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  2. #5552
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    Which Ground/Flying mon would be better at a defensive role, Landorus (both formes) or Gliscor?

  3. #5553
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duranteater View Post
    Which Ground/Flying mon would be better at a defensive role, Landorus (both formes) or Gliscor?
    Gliscor is almost always a defensive Pokemon, and I've never heard of a defensive version of Landorus. I'd say that speaks for itself.

  4. #5554
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosBlizzard View Post
    Gliscor is almost always a defensive Pokemon, and I've never heard of a defensive version of Landorus. I'd say that speaks for itself.
    I've seen some Landorus-T sets that run Impish to tank physical mons in OU like Terrakion to set up rocks, U-Turn to scout and at certain occasions: set Gravity in which he is the best user of it IMO so it came down to this question :/

  5. #5555
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duranteater View Post
    I've seen some Landorus-T sets that run Impish to tank physical mons in OU like Terrakion to set up rocks, U-Turn to scout and at certain occasions: set Gravity in which he is the best user of it IMO so it came down to this question :/
    Yes, this does happen. It's defense is surprisingly good thanks to intimidate, but Gliscor is usually considered better at this, thanks to it's DW ability allowing for easy recovery.

    Landy, on the other hand, has to rely off leftovers for recovery, so it won't be walling others for very long.
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  6. #5556
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    Doesn't anyonr have advice for me?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  7. #5557
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    Quote Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post
    Doesn't anyonr have advice for me?
    Zachmac answered your first question in detail, and your second question is both vague and in the wrong thread. Your Dragonite isn't particularly good, and you offer little to no explanation as to why you chose what you did, justifying its abnormalities. The biggest thing that strikes me about the set is Outrage. The set is almost entirely special based on the EV spread, but you're using Outrage on it. Outrage on Dragonite, even a physical one, will hurt you more than help you if you aren't banded (or DD w/ Lum Berry maybe). The easiest fix to the set would be to either go full physical or full special, and I'm guessing you'd want full special. Mixed attackers tend to be mixed to hit specific targets, not just because "Oh, well I can't pick between the two." Mixed Pokemon are almost necessarily weaker than going full in one direction or the other, so you should use them with caution and valid reason. As such, I would recommend you replace Outrage with Draco Meteor and go full special. That or just rethink the set altogether. Your Empoleon is 100% standard, so I don't know what you want anyone to tell you besides that.

  8. #5558
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosBlizzard View Post
    Zachmac answered your first question in detail, and your second question is both vague and in the wrong thread. Your Dragonite isn't particularly good, and you offer little to no explanation as to why you chose what you did, justifying its abnormalities. The biggest thing that strikes me about the set is Outrage. The set is almost entirely special based on the EV spread, but you're using Outrage on it. Outrage on Dragonite, even a physical one, will hurt you more than help you if you aren't banded (or DD w/ Lum Berry maybe). The easiest fix to the set would be to either go full physical or full special, and I'm guessing you'd want full special. Mixed attackers tend to be mixed to hit specific targets, not just because "Oh, well I can't pick between the two." Mixed Pokemon are almost necessarily weaker than going full in one direction or the other, so you should use them with caution and valid reason. As such, I would recommend you replace Outrage with Draco Meteor and go full special. That or just rethink the set altogether. Your Empoleon is 100% standard, so I don't know what you want anyone to tell you besides that.
    Like I said earlier, I am a TOTAL noob in fifth gen competitive battling, so even if I wanted to start team building, I wouldn't know what to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Okay, so here is the set.

    Dragonite @ Choice Specs
    Multiscale
    Modest/Quite
    -Hurricane
    -Thunder
    -Draco Meteor
    -Surf/Earthquake/Roost

    Hurricane is the most important move in this set, being an extremely accurate and powerful STAB with no downsides and perfect accuracy in the rain. It even 2HKOs the likes of Ferrothorn. Thunder, on the other hand, is capable of 2HKOing Rotom-W. Draco Meteor was added for nothing in specific, but is there purely for it's immense power and STAB. Finally, Surf is it's next most powerful attack after these three in the rain, but with a quit nature, Earthquake can 2HKO a specially defensive Jirachi that had already tried to tank a Hurricane earlier in the fight. Roost is also an option on Dragonite if you want to keep it healthy, and while risky to be locked into, it can also be a life saver in the long run.

    The trick to using this set is to start with Hurricane until something that resist it is sent in. The next time you send in Dragonite after that, use the appropriate attack to finish off the pokemon who had swapped in previously more reliably then any other attack. Also, this set, like most choice band or specs sets, should make an excellent wall breaker.

    This set should be paired up with a Politoed and a pokemon with Rapid Spin, but if you want to go into details, you should either use this thread (click here) or PM me to continue the discussion.

    Also, I've never use this set before, so I it may not actually turn out that well, but that's a risk you have to take whenever you want to create your own custom set.
    Thanks, so is Rain the most dominant weather in OU?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  9. #5559
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    How bulky is a 252/252/4 Hp/SpA/Speed -Atk +Def Togekiss against the commonly used pokemon in todays metagame? Assuming flawless ivs of course.
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  10. #5560
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    Quote Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post
    Like I said earlier, I am a TOTAL noob in fifth gen competitive battling, so even if I wanted to start team building, I wouldn't know what to do.



    Thanks, so is Rain the most dominant weather in OU?
    Yes, Rain is by far the most seen weather in the OU metagame.

  11. #5561
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    I have never used a weather team before, so I think I will just stick to a weather-less team. How would I go about choosing members?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  12. #5562
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    Try out team members that could counter opposing weather. A great example is Terrakion who can abuse Sands sp defense increase effect and do sick damage onto a lot of OU mons.

  13. #5563
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    I am still thinking of leading with Dragonite.

    Would this be a better set?

    Dragonite @ Life Orb
    Nature: Hasty / Mild / Rash
    EVs: 252 SpA / 180 Spe / 76 Atk
    Moves:
    Draco Meteor
    Superpower
    Thunder
    Hurricane

    Hurricane and Thunder can help against rain teams, while Draco Meteor alongside Superpower hits everything for atleast neutral damage. Max SpA is to maximize damage Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Hurricane do.

    Like I said, I don't know how to explain team members as I haven't competitive battled in over 4 years.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  14. #5564
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    Quote Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post
    I am still thinking of leading with Dragonite.

    Would this be a better set?

    Dragonite @ Life Orb
    Nature: Hasty / Mild / Rash
    EVs: 252 SpA / 180 Spe / 76 Atk
    Moves:
    Draco Meteor
    Superpower
    Thunder
    Hurricane

    Hurricane and Thunder can help against rain teams, while Draco Meteor alongside Superpower hits everything for atleast neutral damage. Max SpA is to maximize damage Draco Meteor, Thunder, and Hurricane do.

    Like I said, I don't know how to explain team members as I haven't competitive battled in over 4 years.
    You don't want to rely too much off your enemies weather, just have a way to beat them. Thunder and Hurricane are unreliable solutions, so I'd use something else.
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  15. #5565
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    How do I beat enemy weather? Idk how to go about choosing Pokemon that would counter other people's weather condition. How about T-Bolt and Aqua Tail instead?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  16. #5566
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    Quote Originally Posted by HRRlion View Post
    How bulky is a 252/252/4 Hp/SpA/Speed -Atk +Def Togekiss against the commonly used pokemon in todays metagame? Assuming flawless ivs of course.
    if its bulk is 252/0 +def, not too terribly bulky. for one, the def. boost sucks because there is no investment. another is that rocks really wreck it, so as a bulky poke, its not as good in the rock infested ou meta as say, skarmory.

  17. #5567
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    You don't want to rely too much off your enemies weather, just have a way to beat them. Thunder and Hurricane are unreliable solutions, so I'd use something else.
    This is a good point, but notice that it goes away if you run a rain team yourself. This is actually a good set under rain if you swap out Superpower for Aqua Tail.

    Quote Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post
    How do I beat enemy weather? Idk how to go about choosing Pokemon that would counter other people's weather condition. How about T-Bolt and Aqua Tail instead?
    With the advent of infinite weather in OU, there is essentially one way to counter weather: kill the enemy weather starter and then summon your own weather. To counter weather in this generation, you must be able to stop your opponent from restarting their weather if it gets stopped, and then replacing the weather condition they started with one that is either neutral or beneficial to you. It sucks, but that's how you do it.

  18. #5568
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    Hmm, so it is generally recommended to use weather teams? Actually, IIRC, I HAVE once used a weather team, and it was a Rain Team back in 4th Gen.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  19. #5569
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    Quote Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post
    Hmm, so it is generally recommended to use weather teams? Actually, IIRC, I HAVE once used a weather team, and it was a Rain Team back in 4th Gen.
    I mean, it can be a bit easier, since you get the boost of weather. Honestly tho, unless you plan on laddering really really high, weather teams are not a must. In fact, you could very easily pull off a great non-weather team.
    But if you are just starting to battle in this fifth-generation OU metagame (which I assume by the fact that you're asking about using weather), weather is probably recommended.


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  20. #5570
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    Yes, I want to start in the OU metagame and also get into UU as well.

    So far, I have 3 Pokemon, 2 being the cores of my Team. Dragonite is my lead and with this set:
    Dragonite @ Lum Berry/Life Orb
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
    Ability: Multiscale
    Nature: Jolly
    Moves:
    Dragon Dance
    Fire Punch
    Outrage/Dragon Claw
    Earthquake

    Standard DDNite set here. Outrage will be used with Lum Berry to cure the confusion once the 2-3 turns are done. However, that will leave DNite vulnerable to Steel types, especially Ferrothorn, so my other option is Dragon Claw. While it is significantly weaker, the Life Orb mitigates this somewhat. It also allows me to switch to Fire Punch incase the aforementioned foe switches in, which it might because of the Dragon type attack. Standard EVs, maxing Atk and Spe, and pouring the remaining 4 into HP. Is that wise? Or should I give it to a defensive stat so Download Pokemon like Genesect don't get their SpA boosted?

    Empoleon @ Leftovers
    EVs: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 SpD
    Nature: Calm
    Moves:
    Scald
    Toxic
    Protect
    Stealth Rock

    Specially Defensive Empoleon is my choice to cover the Ice and Rock weakness Dragonite has. Scald to burn physical sweepers, Toxic+Protect to stall, and Stealth Rock for residual damage. The HP EVs allow it to lose minimal HP from Leech Seed and Stealth Rock. 44 Def allows it to never be OHKOed by Dragonite and Salamence's Outrage (I think?). The remaining EVs go to SpD to become more of a special wall.

    Ferrothorn @ Choice Band
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
    IVs: 0 Atk / 0 SpA
    Nature: Adamant
    Moves:
    Power Whip
    Gyro Ball
    Spikes
    Bulldoze

    You may be wondering why I also chose to get 0 SpA IV. It is because I like to play very safe. Who knows, a Pokemon with flatter could come in. Anyway, Power Whip and Gyro Ball are STAB, while also getting OK coverage. Bulldoze allows it to hit Pokemon that wall Gyro Ball and Power Whip, such as Heatran, on the switch. Spikes may seem odd for a Choice Banded Pokemon, but it can be useful sometimes. Besides, it doesn't learn many notable moves besides support and IMO, being locked into them is worse. I'd rather be locked into Spikes since multiple layers can be set down than a move that is only useful the first time.

    So, what can I add to improve the core a bit? Is Dragonite even viable as a DD lead?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  21. #5571
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    Doesn't anyone have suggestions for me?
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  22. #5572
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    You may be wondering why I also chose to get 0 SpA IV. It is because I like to play very safe. Who knows, a Pokemon with flatter could come in.
    Confusion is only effected by attack IIRC, so 0 sp.att IV is pointless, but more importantly, 0 attack IV will really hurt you badly, since Ferrothorn is choice banded. 0 speed is probably wanted for Gyro Ball, though.

    I think you could really use a ghost type to finish the core, and it'll also have the ability to block rapid spin, since you're running two entry hazards. Dragonite covers the fighting weakness, but it's a set up sweeper, not a wall like your other two. I'd suggest Jellicent for perfect synergy with Ferrothorn, Dusklops for pure defensive power, or Cofagrigus to suit your bulky offense theme you seem to have going better.

    Also, if you want your Dragonite to sweep, you may want a way to outplay Donphan and Mamoswine to avoid Ice Shard, so I think Jellicent would be an especially strong member in your team.

    Don't use Dragonite as a lead. First, team viewer messes leads up, so you should really try and out predict your enemy, and second, Dragonite could be a valuable late game sweeper, even with a less bulky set like that. In the early fight, choice scarfers with the ability to outrun it and OHKO are often running around, making it difficult for you to take out more then one pokemon with it.
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  23. #5573
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Confusion is only effected by attack IIRC, so 0 sp.att IV is pointless, but more importantly, 0 attack IV will really hurt you badly, since Ferrothorn is choice banded. 0 speed is probably wanted for Gyro Ball, though.

    I think you could really use a ghost type to finish the core, and it'll also have the ability to block rapid spin, since you're running two entry hazards. Dragonite covers the fighting weakness, but it's a set up sweeper, not a wall like your other two. I'd suggest Jellicent for perfect synergy with Ferrothorn, Dusklops for pure defensive power, or Cofagrigus to suit your bulky offense theme you seem to have going better.

    Also, if you want your Dragonite to sweep, you may want a way to outplay Donphan and Mamoswine to avoid Ice Shard, so I think Jellicent would be an especially strong member in your team.

    Don't use Dragonite as a lead. First, team viewer messes leads up, so you should really try and out predict your enemy, and second, Dragonite could be a valuable late game sweeper, even with a less bulky set like that. In the early fight, choice scarfers with the ability to outrun it and OHKO are often running around, making it difficult for you to take out more then one pokemon with it.
    The 0 Atk was mistaken. I was thinking of a Pokemon I chose for my team earlier. It is only 0 Spe. Also, I was actually thinking of balance when I made the team, but I'll try out Bulky Offense. I wish I knew more about this...
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

  24. #5574
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    i'm very curious about this. if a pokemon with the ability technician is to attack using acrobatics while holding no item, does the base power boosts by x1.5 first due to its ability then double due to no item or acrobatics effect comes in first then cancel out technician? if it is the former case, then acrobatics delivers whooping 165 power, not applying STAB or flying gem
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  25. #5575
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    If you have an item, then Technician will work with it. Otherwise, no.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

    - TI, Ready For Whatever
    Paper Trail.

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