Official Serebii 5th Gen Tier List & Standard Rules Discussion Thread

[KalenArleth]

But can someone explain why Blaziken is uber now?

I think it's because of the DW ability Speed Boost.

Don't quote me on that though.

[streetlightdsb]

I think it's because of the DW ability Speed Boost.

Don't quote me on that though.

That, and the incredible power of Hi Jump Kick, which, with Swords Dance/ Flare Blitz/Stone Edge or Night Slash allows it to at least 2HKO just about everything.

[quilava1]

blazeiken shouldn't be banned

[Zachmac]

blazeiken shouldn't be banned

For what reason? We can give you the reasons it should be banned. Not only does it get speed boost, but it has 120 att and 110 sp.att IIRC. Not to mention baton bass, a base 130 power stab(high jump kick), along with a 120 one(Flare Blitz). So, what about Ninjask and Yenmega? They both lose half their health to stealth rock, and fall to priority, while Blaziken resist Ice shard, Bullet punch, and sucker punch, and will probably only fall to Extreme Speed and the rarer Aqua jet.

[kaiser soze]

Is it possible to ban certain pokemon and abilities, similar to how certain forms are banned from OU?

[d0nut]

Is it possible to ban certain pokemon and abilities, similar to how certain forms are banned from OU?

Abilities by themself can be banned, but banning an ability on only one pokemon hasn't been done, nor does it look like it will.

[Zenotwapal]

Curious:

Why not just ban all Dream World abilities and Pokemon?
Because it seems to bring more problems than good. It's just too much to keep up with. It's probably one of the reasons why Smogon is taking so damned long revamping the metagame.

And Also: Why not just ban overpowered pokemon to Ubers, and have just open tiers. None of this OU/UU/NU/BL/FU nonsense. Its also too much to keep up with, and would probably draw more diverse teams. It would also make playing competitively more enjoyable.
The only tiers there would be, for instance, would be Uber, Standard, and Pre-Evo.

[d0nut]

Curious:

Why not just ban all Dream World abilities and Pokemon?
Because it seems to bring more problems than good. It's just too much to keep up with. It's probably one of the reasons why Smogon is taking so damned long revamping the metagame.

And Also: Why not just ban overpowered pokemon to Ubers, and have just open tiers. None of this OU/UU/NU/BL/FU nonsense. Its also too much to keep up with, and would probably draw more diverse teams. It would also make playing competitively more enjoyable.
The only tiers there would be, for instance, would be Uber, Standard, and Pre-Evo.

Banning all DW abilities would be stupid since there is no reason to ignore one of the main new features in competitive battling. It really hasn't been slowing Smogon down that much tbh since they would probably go the same speed anyway since their way of testing is very systematic.

Open tiers would also defeat the purpose of having different metagames, and if anything it would not promote diversity since competitive battling is competitive, therefore people play to win. That means for the most part people will stick with what works so the only things we would ever see would be OUs. Weaker pokes wouldn't be as useable in a metagame filled with powerful sweepers like Excadrill or Reuniclus so removing tiers would cause these weaker pokes to never be used at all. Tiers are meant to promote diversity since they allow people to use the less common things instead of having to use and deal with all the more powerful threats. It also isn't that hard to keep up with, and if you think it is then maybe this isn't the game for you.

[kaiser soze]

Think of competitive tiers like different sport leagues. In (american) football, you have the peewee leagues/middle school etc (little cup). then theres the high school level (UU). next is college football (OU) and the NFl (uber). each level has better athletes (pokemon) and they are seperated to create even playing fields. hope the analogy helps.

also the eviolite is going to be another problem. if you sent a lot into OU because they can use the item, they wont be able to function with sets with different items. porygon2 probably could survive as OU but stuff like gligar wont.

maybe banning the eviolite in UU and below?

[ungulateman]

also the eviolite is going to be another problem. if you sent a lot into OU because they can use the item, they wont be able to function with sets with different items. porygon2 probably could survive as OU but stuff like gligar wont.

maybe banning the eviolite in UU and below?

A Pokemon being reliant on an item to perform well isn't new. (CurseLax only really worked because of Leftovers, Blissey, Scarf Flygon, to a lesser extent CB Scizor.) I really don't see why the Eviolite should be banned if it improves the metagame's variety.

[Slydevil]

is kyurem uber?

just wondering

[kaiser soze]

is kyurem uber?

just wondering

It is actually UU, accroding to smogon's new OU/UU tiers

[girazard]

Curious:

Why not just ban all Dream World abilities and Pokemon?
Because it seems to bring more problems than good. It's just too much to keep up with. It's probably one of the reasons why Smogon is taking so damned long revamping the metagame.

And Also: Why not just ban overpowered pokemon to Ubers, and have just open tiers. None of this OU/UU/NU/BL/FU nonsense. Its also too much to keep up with, and would probably draw more diverse teams. It would also make playing competitively more enjoyable.
The only tiers there would be, for instance, would be Uber, Standard, and Pre-Evo.

Doing that would not make the Standard metagame any more diverse. There is NOTHING stopping you from using NU/UU Pokemon in Standard.

Also what D0nut said.

[windsong]

Smogon's new UU tiers suck everything is broken.

Srs i got to like, 5th or something like that in about an hour of laddering.

[d0nut]

Yea, right now UU is pretty unbalanced since BL hasn't been worked on yet. Smogon's bigger OU keeps some things from dominating UU, though there are a few things which never even made it to UU on PO such as Zapdos which are pretty rediculous. There's also things like Kyurem which hits too hard for the tier, and Sun which works well since there is no Rain, and Hail doesn't match up very well against Fire types. Sand also doesn't have enough UU abusers to fight off Sun teams very well. There's probably more, but I haven't messed around too much with UU yet on Smogon.

[Mr.Munchlax]

Can I just say that I hate everything after the Uber list (OU, UU, etc.) I'm just confused because I don't know which pokemon are ok to use anymore since all of my favorites are either in the OU or the UU list!

[Articuno_rocks]

Just a quick question: Is this thread only for Uber/OU discussion? According to the title and the first post, you can discuss all the tiers, including NU... for some reason, most of my favorite Pokemon end up in NU.

[jesusfreak94]

Just a quick question: Is this thread only for Uber/OU discussion? According to the title and the first post, you can discuss all the tiers, including NU... for some reason, most of my favorite Pokemon end up in NU.

Any 5th Gen tier you'd like. Of course, PO doesn't have an NU tier just yet, and Smogon barely has a UU, so...yeah.

[Articuno_rocks]

Any 5th Gen tier you'd like. Of course, PO doesn't have an NU tier just yet, and Smogon barely has a UU, so...yeah.

I'm not really experienced with Pokemon abbreviations so... what's PO? : o

[Primera Stark]

How one would create Lightningrod Seaking? Since its Attack stat is better, but LR powers up SpAtk. =(