Oh yeah, forgot Mence and Chomp aren't banned anymore... yet.Originally Posted by assassinsceptile
Weather Team Hater
Oh yeah, forgot Mence and Chomp aren't banned anymore... yet.
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Umbreon is better.
EV fail. 252 is the max re re.
Ghost Fan
what are you talking about?
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To be honest, the mix set is almost always more dangerous than a one sided set. Hydro Pump is far more powerful than Shell Blade. Even Surf will deal more damage than Shell Blade with higher investment (a 252 invested Shell Blade deals as much as a 92 invested Surf).
If Cloyster's team is going to built around Cloyster sweeping, then there will be Rain so Hydro Pump will deal far more base damage than Icicle Spear (now compared 187.5 to 270). Therefore, I would suggest it is noted in a team-based situation the special side should be the focus with moves like Surf and Hydro Pump where as if Cloyster does not have a team to set it up, the focus should be physical with Icicle Spear being the main attraction. One's priority of accuracy should also be taken into account.
It should be mentioned Light Clay holding Reflect user is invaluable for the set since Cloyster will keep massive physical bulk if Reflect is up. Spikes also deals solid damage to counters of Cloyster like Ferrothorn and Empoleon.
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And maybe not ban. Even Lati@s most people mention that both of that not broken
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...What?
Anyway, a well-balanced EV spread is 252 Sdef, 129 Def, 129 Satk with a Sassy nature. Just throwing that out there. And is Rock Blast really necessary? It doesn't give very good coverage, so i'd rather use Aqua Ring.
~~
Still waiting for Slaking...
My stache' is better
Actually, Rock Blast gives pretty decent coverage, seeing as it hits Ice, Fire, Flying, and Bug effectively. But, Icicle Spear and *Water Move Here* cover flying and fire, and bug types aren't all that common, Rock Blast is optional.
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Lionheart
That EV Spread is garbage, why use a speed lowering nature on a poke that needs speed to sweep? And if it's a walling set, why not max HP? Rock Blast isn't very good but it's far better than Aqua Ring.
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Cascade Trainer
The New, The Improved, The One and Only Cloyster Physical Sweeper @ Life Orb/Focus Sash
Skill Link
4 HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spd
Jolly (+Spd, -SpAtk)
Shell Smash
Icicle Spear
Razor Shell/Hydro Pump
Return/Double-Edge/Explosion/Rock Blast
Instant Swords Dance + Agility. Icicle Spear is strongest attack. Water-attack of choice is secondary STAB, most important for blasting Steel and Fire types. Finally, Rock Blast is Cloyster's strongest non-STAB Physical attack under Explosion. Hidden Electric Power or Natural Gift are possibilities for hitting Water-types, especially Empoleon.
Always remember Skill Link Rock Blast always outpowers STAB Shell Strike. Shell Strike has an effect and is about 5% more accurate, but Rock Blast can strike through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy (though Icicle Spear does that anyway).
Classic Offence @ Choice Band/Life Orb
Skill Link
248 HP, 252 Atk, 8 Spd
Adamant (+Atk, -Spatk)
Icicle Spear
Razor Shell
Rock Blast/Ice Shard
Explosion/Rapid Spin/Spikes
Before Gen 5, if you wanted to run offensive Cloyster, this was how it was done. While it is true the "immediate power boost" is relatively moot due to Cloyster's mediocre Speed being acknowledged BEFORE it exchanges Defences for Speed, that isn't to say Cloyster isn't outpaced by everyone before a Shell Break. Furthermore, even after a Shell Break, Cloyster can still be outsped by certain Scarfers and priorities. Plus, the extra slot from dropping Shell Break benefits Cloyster's newfound four-slot syndrome.
Defensive @ Leftovers
Shell Armor/Skill Link
Impish (+Def, -SpAtk)
252 HP, 4 Def, 252 SpDef
Spikes
Rapid Spin
Toxic Spikes/Toxic
Razor Shell/Icicle Spear
No explanation.
Uberster @ Nevermeltice
Skill Link
Hasty (+Spd, -SpDef)
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 SpAtk
Shell Smash
Ice Beam
Icicle Spear
Rock Blast/Ice Shard/Razor Shell
+2 Ice Beam will have a 41% to OHKO max HP AND SpDef Groudon. Adjust the Speed EVs as desired. Icicle Spear is Cloyster's strongest attack. Rock Blast is to hit Kyogre and a powerful attack in general. Shell Strike is Cloyster's strongest move of all in Rain and can get Def drops if the opponent tries to stall it out. Ice Shard murders Dragons if Cloyster cannot outspeed them, or in the case to compete with opposing Priority. Partners are Kyogre and DualScreen support.
Other Options
It's possible to run a fully Cloyster Special set (with either Specs or Shell Break), but it gets highly outclassed and truthfully, it isn't very effective unless you have some plan going for using Blizzard. But that gets outclassed by Icicle Spear.
White Herb can cancel the Def drops from Shell Break or to nullify any Intimidate attempts before you actually use Shell Break, though it has little overall utility.
I'm sure there are more sets out there. Cloyster can work in multiple battles with Surf/Blizzard + Shell Smash.
Cascade Trainer
I also did some calculations. Max HP is stronger than Max Def, UNLESS Cloyster happens to be running Impish. Then maxing Def would outpower maxed HP.
Of course, if you're running Impish, you'd probably max out both stats anyway.
Of course, you also must take into consideration Cloyster's SR Number.
Banned
Thats wrong. No matter what maxing HP will ALWAYS help Cloyster more than maxing defense. This is true with just about all other Pokemon.
My little friend
As surprised as I am to see cloyster able to battle in the uber tier, I'm not too shocked to ask if expert belt or life orb would be better. After all, rock blast could catch a reshiram or lugia on the switch. NMI wouldn't be much good there.
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But yeah, it's true. Unless the Poke has a massively abnormally high HP base, HP should always be maxed before defenses. There is literally no excuse not to.
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Ice Shard can be used for ScarfChomp and Scarf *Insert dragon here*, But why running priority with a speed boosting move?
Too bad it didn't get Swords Dance or even Waterfall.
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My stache' is better
Not that I ever liked it, but that would have been great for it. I guess Razor Shell's chance and Shell Break have to do it for this sweeper.
Typhlosion is epic and has beaten the heck out of OUs!
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