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  1. #1
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    Default Community POTW #12

    Reno's busy writing the last one so here's the next one



    This week we'll be doing Darmanitan. The Pokémon with two unique abilities which require completely seperate planning for use. I want to see great sets utilising these abilities

    http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/555.shtml

  2. #2

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    When it says, 'the move will lose it's secondary effect' in the description of the Sheer Force ability, does that include recoil, and stat losses? If it does, Flare Blitz and Superpower could make very good moves for this. If not, it is a lot more limeted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ψosiden View Post
    When it says, 'the move will lose it's secondary effect' in the description of the Sheer Force ability, does that include recoil, and stat losses? If it does, Flare Blitz and Superpower could make very good moves for this. If not, it is a lot more limeted.
    No. Sheer Force only works on moves which offer status afflictions or give a chance of the opponent's stats getting lowered. It's basically the inverse of Serene Grace.

    Flare Blitz DOES get the boost, but it doesn't lose the recoil

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    Darmanitan@life orb/choice band
    Nature: adamant
    Evs:4 hp 252 atk 252 spd
    Ability:sheer force

    Flare blitz/fire punch
    stone edge
    superpower/earthquake
    u-turn

    Basically, your two main stabs get the boost form sheer force making fire punch acceptable over flare blitz for no recoil but flare blitz is still much better. Stone edge doesnt get the sheer force boost but combos well with the stab and is a great move in general. Superpower gets a lot of power and neutral coverage on all pokemon i believe, but EQ is an option but leaves you weak to flygon and others and fire moves get similar coverage to it. U-turn is just to get out should you need to. For the item, if you want choice band for more power or life orb and more freedom
    in the making...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Serebii View Post
    No. Sheer Force only works on moves which offer status afflictions or give a chance of the opponent's stats getting lowered. It's basically the inverse of Serene Grace.

    Flare Blitz DOES get the boost, but it doesn't lose the recoil
    Isn't there a trick, though, that sheer force + life orb + move with secondary effect = No LO recoil?

    EDIT: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blog.php?b=26034

    A bunch of other sites also confirm this.

    With that being said, this guy's moveset is gonna change DRASTICALLY when the RS remakes and the 3rd game come out.
    Last edited by daveshan; 20th March 2011 at 5:28 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by daveshan View Post
    Isn't there a trick, though, that sheer force + life orb + move with secondary effect = No LO recoil?

    EDIT: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blog.php?b=26034

    A bunch of other sites also confirm this.

    With that being said, this guy's moveset is gonna change DRASTICALLY when the RS remakes and the 3rd game come out.
    Sheer Force doesn't take damage from Life Orb
    Nambiri

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo-Unlegendary View Post
    Well Darmanitan can't afford to have sunny day on it's set (too frail) so it will need some building around for that to happen. And the one pokemon you fail to mention is Swampert. Good defenses, Resistance to Darmanitan's main STAB, Ground STAB to fall back on if Darmanitan gets a boost from Sunny Day and Water becomes unreliable, Swampert will make mincemeat out of this one.
    It doesn't need it on its set. Pair it with Ninetails, or something else with sunny day. And it still hits hard outside of sun, it just hits obscenely hard in the sun.


    Quote Originally Posted by NAMBIRI View Post
    Sheer Force doesn't take damage from Life Orb
    I'd like to clarify this. With Sheer Force, a Pokemon doesn't take Life Orb recoil when it uses ONLY a move that gets the Sheer Force boost.
    FINE. I'LL MAKE A SIGNATURE

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    I claimed Plusle. I don't know what claiming it does, but I claimed it.

    A +6 Att 10th round metronome Helping-Hand boosted Max Attack Victini V-Generate vs. a -6 Def Min. Defense min. HP Paras in Sun does 135516-159432 damage, or 75286.7%-88573.3%

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    Well, zen mode is going to be a tricky one to use, and it can't have any egg moves...
    Darmanitan
    ZenMode/Sitris Berry
    Bold(I can't decide EVs).
    -Substitute
    -Flamethrower/Fireblast
    -Psychic
    -GrassKnot

    Use substitute to get down to 50% health, and restore 25% of your health health with your sitris berry. Flamethrower, FireBlast, Psychic are all for stab, and GrassKnot hit Rock and Water types.

    I based this of a belly drum snorlax set in the last thread.
    Isn't there a trick, though, that sheer force + life orb + move with secondary effect = No LO recoil?
    If there is, I never heard of it. Maybe it should be tested out.

    Oh, I just thought of a belly drum set. But, it won't be legal until the pinch berries are released.
    Darmanitan
    Jolly/Adamant/252att/252speed
    SheerForce/SalacBerry
    -Substitute
    -BellyDrum
    -FirePunch
    -BrickBreak/Earthquake

    Use it like a substitute bellyzard, but save this set for later, as the salac berry is banned until it is released.

    NitroCharge
    Adamant/252att/252Speed
    SheerForce/
    -NitroCharge
    -FirePunch
    -Earthquake
    -StoneEdge
    Last edited by Zachmac; 20th March 2011 at 5:13 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveshan View Post
    Isn't there a trick, though, that sheer force + life orb + move with secondary effect = No LO recoil?

    EDIT: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blog.php?b=26034

    A bunch of other sites also confirm this.

    With that being said, this guy's moveset is gonna change DRASTICALLY when the RS remakes and the 3rd game come out.
    Yes there is. However, it gets Flare Blitz recoil still, which was what was being discussed

    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Well, zen mode is going to be a tricky one to use, and it can't have any egg moves...
    If you manage to get a female Zen Mode Darmanitan, you CAN breed it and the offspring has a 50% chance of having Inner Focus, which when Darumaka evolves, turns into Zen Mode. It CAN have Egg Moves

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Well, zen mode is going to be a tricky one to use, and it can't have any egg moves...
    Darmanitan
    ZenMode/Sitris Berry
    Bold(I can't decide EVs).
    -Substitute
    -Flamethrower/Fireblast
    -Psychic
    -GrassKnot

    Use substitute to get down to 50% health, and restore 25% of your health health with your sitris berry. Flamethrower, FireBlast, Psychic are all for stab, and GrassKnot hit Rock and Water types.

    I based this of a belly drum snorlax set in the last thread. If there is, I never heard of it. Maybe it should be tested out.

    Oh, I just thought of a belly drum set. But, it won't be legal until the pinch berries are released.
    Darmanitan
    Jolly/Adamant/252att/252speed
    SheerForce/SalacBerry
    -Substitute
    -BellyDrum
    -FirePunch
    -BrickBreak/Earthquake

    Use it like a substitute bellyzard, but save this set for later, as the salac berry is banned until it is released.

    NitroCharge
    Adamant/252att/252Speed
    SheerForce/
    -NitroCharge
    -FirePunch
    -Earthquake
    -StoneEdge
    From what I know, you can get egg moves onto a Zen Mode Darmanitan using the new breeding mechanic (as long as you have a female Zen Mode Darmanitan, you can get a 40% chance of the child inheriting the Hidden Ability, which means Darumaku will get Inner Focus instead of Hustle). Anyway, here's a set I was thinking of:

    Pure Force Darmanitan
    Adamant/Jolly
    EV spread: 252 attack and speed
    Held item: Life Orb
    Ability: Sheer Force
    -Fire Punch
    -Rock Slide
    -Earthquake
    -U-Turn/Brick Break

    The essential premise of this set is to cause as much damage as possible without dealing recoil to yourself. Thankfully, the first two moves in this set help to eliminate the Life Orb's recoil, so you can hit them with ridiculously strong moves while remaining a deadly force. With the double power boost, you can consider dropping Adamant for Jolly, in order to boost your speed a little bit higher to help you outrun certain threats.

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    Grrrr. Still waiting for Eelektross. I'm just going to keep waiting.

    Anyway, Darmanitan. Gotta love that monster attack stat.

    Choicemanitan
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Nature: Jolly/Adamant
    EVs: 252 ATK and Speed, 4 HP
    @: Choice Scarf/Choice Band

    -Flare Blitz/Fire Punch
    -Superpower
    -Rock Slide
    -Earthquake

    Darmanitan's stats put it in the direction of a choice item user. Two 120 power attacks and two 100 power attacks. Awesome. Fire Punch can be used over Flare Blitz if you have an issue with the recoil.

    Bulkmanitan
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: same as the last one
    @: Life Orb/Leftovers

    -Bulk Up
    -Flare Blitz/Fire Punch
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide

    Not too difficult to figure out.

    Drummanitan
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: same as the last one
    @: Life Orb/Leftovers/Salac Berry

    -Belly Drum
    -Fire Punch
    -Earthquake|Substitute
    -Rock Slide|Focus Punch

    This can be a straightforward Belly Drum route, or a variation of Bellyzard. Either way, you need great prediction.

    Chargemanitan
    Ability: Sheer Force
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: same as the last one
    @: Life Orb/Leftovers

    -Flame Charge
    -Flare Blitz/Fire Punch/Rock Slide/Earthquake/Superpower
    -Flare Blitz/Fire Punch/Rock Slide/Earthquake/Superpower
    -Flare Blitz/Fire Punch/Rock Slide/Earthquake/Superpower

    Perhaps this should be known as "Rocketmanitan"! Flame Charge will kick some speed and then you launch some monster power.

    Zenmanitan-Doll Style!
    Ability: Zen Mode
    Nature: Modest
    EVs: 252 Special Attack/126 defense and special defense/4 HP
    @: Wise Glasses/Black Sludge/Petaya Berry

    -Substitute
    -Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Overheat
    -Psychic
    -Focus Blast/Grass Knot

    The idea is to trigger Zen Mode manually. Substitute cuts the HP to activate the Zen. After that, special attacks. Black Sludge is an option, but a very dangerous one. It quickens the activation of Zen Mode, but it also limits how long this can be used. If you want to be safe, give it Wise Glasses. Since Zenmanitan will be with low HP, Petaya Berry can work great.

    Zenmanitan-Choice style!
    Ability: Zen Mode
    Nature: Modest
    EVs: 252 Defense and Special Defense/4 Special Attack
    @: Choice Specs

    -Flamethrower/Overheat/Fire Blast
    -Grass Knot
    -Psychic
    -Focus Blast

    Let your opponent unleash Darmanitan's Zen by taking damage. The EVs may seem odd, but Pre-Zen Mode Darmanitan is fragile, so it needs the bulk to survive.

    Counters
    Aerodactyle can one-hit it with Stone Edge. It can switch into the fire attack and Earthquake and Darmanitan down. Also, Stealth Rock will not be something that Darmanitan will appreciate, unless it has Zen Mode. Basically, a solid super effective attack from something faster will put it down. Otherwise, Gyarados can switch into anything not called Stone Edge and trigger Intimidate and smash through with Waterfall. The traditional Physical Walls like Skarmory and Forretress are benched here for obvious reasons.

    As for Zenmanitan, Chansey, Gyarados, and to a lesser extent Snorlax can tolerate Zenmanitan and cripple the lowered HP with Toxic.

    Cinccino will get a special mention because of Skill Link Rock Blast. It breaks Substitutes and the squishy Darmanitan it shields. However, Zenmanitan may have enough bulk when Zen Mode is active. Another way to counter Zenmanitan is the move Heal Pulse.

    Other Options

    Physical STAB on Zenmanitan can work as something to use while you are not in Zen Mode, but it's better to just try to activate it.
    Belly Drum can automatically activate Zen Mode, but the better route is to use substitute because it's safer.
    Hammer Arm can be used over Superpower if the attack drop is something you want to avoid, but Darmanitan will still have plenty of attack after a Superpower and a drop in speed and base power and accuracy is a worse way to go.
    Brick Break is a choice if you don't want any stat drops.
    Uproar is a special mention because it makes Darmanitan immune to sleep, but Darmanitan does not want to be locked at all, Zen Mode or not.
    Focus Sash can be useful for activating Zen Mode, but the slow down factor and the common sandstorms make you look bad. It could work with a non-Zen Darmanitan for a lead set with Taunt and U-Turn, but that is something that puts Darmanitan's offensive magic through waste management plants. Better to think "how can I sweep the unlucky soul?" rather than "how can I annoy the unlucky soul?" when using Darmanitan.
    Speaking of which, U-Turn can be useful for hit and run tactics. But passing up an uber-power move (100+ base power) for guerrilla tactics pacifies that 140 attack stat.
    Stone Edge gets critical hits, but don't depend on criticals. Ever. You can rely on them, but not depend on them. Besides, Rock Slide hits harder, which I unfortunately found out significantly later.
    Salac Berry can be used with outside of Drummanitan, but its not a good idea. Same goes for Liechi Berry.

    I hope I did well. Please comment, I want some feedback on how well I'm doing!
    Last edited by Meowmeow; 21st March 2011 at 7:09 PM. Reason: Made a few discoveries that prompted some needed changes

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    Jellicent laughs at such a Pokemon.

    Also, just a warning. No HyperBeam, NO Giga Impact!

    I'm back, baby.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bone Cold Marowak Guy View Post
    Jellicent laughs at such a Pokemon.

    Also, just a warning. No HyperBeam, NO Giga Impact!
    It does laugh at the Zen form but Jellicent is a special wall, not physical. Scald could hurt non-Zen ones, I guess.
    Last edited by ASB; 21st March 2011 at 3:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASB View Post
    It does laugh at the Zen form but Jellicent is a special wall, not physical. Scald could hurt non-Zen ones, I guess.
    Yeah, true, but Zen Mode's so frail, it's barely worth it. 50% health or less isn't great, ever.

    I'm back, baby.

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    Darmanitan @Life Orb
    Sheer Force
    Jolly
    -Flare Blitz
    -Stone Edge/Bulk Up
    -U-turn
    -Bulldoze/Earthquake/Bulk Up

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghosts of the Forums View Post
    Darmanitan @Life Orb
    Sheer Force
    Jolly
    -Flare Blitz
    -Stone Edge/Bulk Up
    -U-turn
    -Bulldoze/Earthquake/Bulk Up
    Bulldoze still only gets 80 base power and no speed lowering after sheer force i believe while EQ gets 100 base power so it is useless
    in the making...

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    zen master
    zen mode
    peteya berry
    modest/jolly
    substitute
    psycic
    fire blast,flamethrower
    focus blast

    easy peasy

    sub sets off zen mode low health causes berry to go
    (get it by using a pokemon with false swipe and pick up on morimoto's simi's and you will get one)

  18. #18

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    Sheer Force CB:
    Flare Blitz
    Superpower
    Rock Slide
    Earthquake/U-Turn
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 252/252 attack/speed, 4 HP

    Max Speed allows it to outrun all non-speed boosted base 108 speeds. The idea is to hit insanely hard, or switch with U-Turn, which deals insane damage. Earthquake is an option, but I prefer U-Turn.

    Zen Mode Belly Drum
    Belly Drum
    Fire Punch
    Earthquake
    Stone Edge
    Nature: Jolly
    Item: Leftovers
    EVs: 252/252 attack/speed

    This set seems really odd at first, considering Zen mode's base 30 attack. The idea is to sweep with Darmanitan at first, then use belly drum. Belly drum is to set it into Zen mode, which will boost its defences. The seeming-childish attack of 159 will get boosted to 1272, and darmanitan's defences will let it live. The point is for the set to be unexpected, making it all the better.
    Last edited by Spacial Rend; 20th March 2011 at 8:05 PM.

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    Darmanitan@Life Orb/Liechi Berry
    Sheer Force
    Jolly
    4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Spe
    -Fire Punch
    -Belly Drum
    -Substitute
    -U-Turn/Stone Edge/Earthquake
    It can't quite do it like Charizard, but it can try. Belly Drum+Sub activates Liechi. Sweep with Fire Punch. U-Turn is to escape but Stealth Rocks will KO it. Stone Edge and Earthquake to take out Fire types.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAwesomeOne View Post
    Darmanitan@Life Orb/Liechi Berry
    Sheer Force
    Jolly
    4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Spe
    -Fire Punch
    -Belly Drum
    -Substitute
    -U-Turn/Stone Edge/Earthquake
    It can't quite do it like Charizard, but it can try. Belly Drum+Sub activates Liechi. Sweep with Fire Punch. U-Turn is to escape but Stealth Rocks will KO it. Stone Edge and Earthquake to take out Fire types.
    Belly Drum already maxes out the attack stat. Liechi is better replaced by the Salac.

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    The Life Orb+Sheer Force Trick is useless because all of moves are Fire type, excluding Smack Down.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAwesomeOne View Post
    The Life Orb+Sheer Force Trick is useless because all of moves are Fire type, excluding Smack Down.
    The trick is incredibly useful because of Flare Blitz, Rock Slide, and Fire Punch all getting the Sheer Force + Life Orb boost, as well as Flare Blitz and Fire Punch getting STAB, making for a very strong attack. Also does Flame Charge get the Sheer Force boost? If it does, then it DOESN'T boost speed.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by gyaradosuseddragonrage! View Post
    The trick is incredibly useful because of Flare Blitz, Rock Slide, and Fire Punch all getting the Sheer Force + Life Orb boost, as well as Flare Blitz and Fire Punch getting STAB, making for a very strong attack. Also does Flame Charge get the Sheer Force boost? If it does, then it DOESN'T boost speed.
    No. The only things it will affect are status inflicting moves (this includes confusion and flinching) and moves that lower the opponents' stats.

    For all those still wondering, Sheer Force moves do remove Life Orb recoil.
        Spoiler:- Spoiler:

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    piggy backing on Rhys29
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhys29 View Post
    No. The only things it will affect are status inflicting moves (this includes confusion and flinching) and moves that lower the opponents' stats.

    For all those still wondering, Sheer Force moves do remove Life Orb recoil.
    Sheer Force only negates recoil on sheer force boosted moves only (these are also what sheer force boosts):
    -Moves that up your stats
    -Moves that lower the opponents stats
    -Moves that have a flinch chance
    -Moves that may induce a status problem
    Does not include:
    -Moves that have a negative effect on the user
    -High critical hit ratio moves
    -Moves that do not do damage
    -Moves that have an added effect like Brick Break or Shadow Force
    -Moves that only hit all pokemon on the field: Earthquake, Surf
    Last edited by twcopal; 20th March 2011 at 10:10 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by twcopal View Post
    piggy backing on Rhys29


    Sheer Force only negates recoil on sheer force boosted moves only (these are also what sheer force boosts):
    -Moves that up your stats
    -Moves that lower the opponents stats
    -Moves that have a flinch chance
    -Moves that may induce a status problem
    Does not include:
    -Moves that have a negative effect on the user
    -High critical hit ratio moves
    -Moves that do not do damage
    -Moves that have an added effect like Brick Break or Shadow Force
    -Moves that only hit all pokemon on the field: Earthquake, Surf
    That is incorrect, it does not affect moves that up your stats. And it is worth noting that if an effect has a 100% chance to occur, it is not affected.

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