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Thread: Community POTW #16

  1. #51
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    Never have both Sludge Bomb and Sludge Wave, Steels will come in and piss in your face.
    Why 4 Att, and 4 Spe? Why Lonely?

    No Bulk Up sets as of yet.
    Toxicroak@Life Orb/Expert Belt
    Jolly
    252 Att, 4 Def, 252 Spe
    -Bulk Up
    -Brick Break
    -Poison Jab
    -X-Scissor/Stone Edge

  2. #52
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    Double/Triple Set
    Triple Position: Center
    Stats: Quiet - 252 Attack & Sp.Atk, 6 HP
    Ability: Dry Skin
    Moves: Sludge Wave, Sucker Punch, Drain Punch, Taunt

    Double Partner/Partner 1: Empoleon
    Stats: Modest - 252 Sp.Atk, 129 Defense & Sp.Def
    Ability: Torrent
    Moves: Surf, Ice Beam, Flash Cannon, Hidden Power (Flying or Fighting)

    Partner 2: Drizzle Politoed (who switches immediately to a second Steel Type like Lucario, Durant, or Magnet Pull Probopass)

    Free Healing from Surf and stress-free Sludge Waves (Barring opponent Steel Types) mean you'll wreak havoc. If Drought Ninetales comes in, your other Steel Type should have a Move to handle it (Stone Edge, Head Smash, Earth Power, Power Gem, Drill Run, etc.). Ninetales can't quite surpass Durant's Speed, so that's a good bet...

  3. #53
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    You know something, toxicroak can make a pretty good sub-puncher

    Toxicroak @Black Sludge
    Ability: Poison Touch, Dry Skin (With rain support)
    Jolly (+Spd, -Sp. Att)
    Ev: 252 Speed, 244 HP, 8 Attack

    Moves:
    Substitute
    Drain Punch
    Focus Punch
    Poison Jab

    ITEM: Black sludge because it is a leftovers, and when stolen damages the opponent 95% of the time.

    ABILITY: If you have poison touch, that is fine. If you have rain support, Dry Skin is better.

    NATURE: Get that Substitute up as fast as possible

    EV: 252 speed for obvious reasons. 244 HP gives you max leftovers and is the best number as it gives 368 health. 8 attack because there is nowhere else it is needed.

    MOVES: Substitute, duh. Drain Punch is a really reliable way to heal your self and you get STAB on it. Focus Punch because without focus punch, it wouldn't be a sub puncher. Poison Jab is your stronger stab with a great chance of poison.

  4. #54
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    Mentioning it as one of the best ways to deal with Ferrothorn on a rain team might be a good idea. Many people argue Keldeo as a way to do so, but unlike Toxicroak it's weak to Power Whip. Toxicroak can easily set up to +4 on Ferrothorn and OHKO it with a Fighting move.

  5. #55
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    Countering toxicroak:

    Toxicroak is pretty predictable. He has an OK speed, poor defences, and respectable offenses. Generally, I would use Espeon, for STAB on psychic and its speed. You should only be worried about the ever so common sucker punchy that will murder Espeons.Super effective attacks completely cripple toxicroaks. Psychic types more than anything.


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  6. #56
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    Let there be poison
    ability poison hand
    Nature Jolly/Adament
    item Black Sludge/Leftovers
    Evs Attack 252 Speed 252 Hp 4
    Sucker punch
    Poison jab
    Drain punch
    Fake out

    Fake out is always a great way to start out the battle since it goes first and it makes the opponet flinch Poison jab is if you really want the opponet to be poisoned plus STAB sucker punch is to take out the Psychics and Drain Punch is to get your HP back
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  7. #57
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    Welp, this is my first POTW... wish me luck
    Urm just word to the wise i know NOTHING about natures othher than some up stats and some lower some so ill just put "HP up nature" yeah...

    Bulk-upicroak

    Item: Expert Belt/Life Orb
    Nature: Attack up nature...
    Ability: Poison Touch/ Dry Skin
    Moves:
    Sucker Punch
    Poison Jab
    Stone Edge
    Bulk Up

    Ok. So, the trick here is to bulk up a couple of times then sweep, because of Toxicroak's dismal defence and special defence a certain amount of predicion is required with this set.
    Bulk Up, the real reson for this set, without it this set could be turned into a choice band/scarf set, replacing it with crosschop or something similar... but I like the idea of being able to use more than one move without switching...
    Sucker Punch is his main "counter" move due to his low speed and x4 psychic weakness.
    Poison Jab is his only physical STAB, bar Gunk shot, but you'd have to go back to 4th gen to get that...
    Stone Edge Is just there for coverage and I think that with this set he gets a neuteral hit on everything... at least...
    Item wise, only use the life orb if you have rain support with dryskin otherwise use the expert belt and poison touch it good for this physical set
    Any spare IV's you have should be invested in speed and/or special defence


    Survivicroak

    Item: Black Sludge/Leftovers
    Nature: HP Up Nature OR Special Attack, depending on what you need really, this set works for either...
    Ability: Dryskin

    Moves:
    Toxic/Raindance
    Venoshock/Sludge Bomb/Sludge wave
    Nasty Plot/Raindance
    Substitute/ Drain Punch / Vaccum Wave

    Ok, only use Raindance instead of Nasty Plot if you would rather have a higher survivability rate.
    And vice versa only use Raindance instead of Toxic if you want to use Venoshock, for it's power.
    K, Venoshock should only be used in conjunction with Toxic, if not throw it out. Sludge Bomb and Sludge Wave can be used with toxic, but because they're pretty stong moves in themselves, I tend not to use toxic and rely on the Nasty Plot boost, which brings me onto...
    Nasty Plot is brilliant foor toxicroak, on a good day it can lead to over 500 in the base special attack, which is niice, buut on a bad day it can get you killed... darn fire types...
    Substitute Is nice, especially with black sludge and rain support, us it first and you might get a free nasty plot in... if you're going for a more attackie pokemon then use either Drain punch (it heals, which is nice) or vaccum wave, which gives a priority move and they both have STAB, which is also nice, but it's your choice dependant on what you need really...
    IV wise, invest only in Hp and Special attack stats, each for each nature.
    You could also not use a slot for raindance and have politoed on your team, which adds a bit more "oomph"

    Please critique me, i know it's long, but i have used both of these sets with toxicroak (he's a personal favorite of mine )
    Mmmmm Steel types...

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  8. #58
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    My favorite Toxicroak set (if I actually liked it):

    Toxicroak @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Poison Touch
    Nature: Hasty (+Spd,-Def)
    EVs: 252Spd|176Atk|80Sp.Atk
    -Moveset-
    *Drain Punch
    *Venoshock
    *Fake Out
    *Sucker Punch

    It's incredibly slow, so start with Fake Out. If it poisons, sweep with Venoshock. Spam Drain and Sucker Punch until it's poisoned.
    Last edited by Shining Fire; 18th April 2011 at 9:54 PM.

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  9. #59
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    Surprise!

    ability:anticipation/dry skin/poison touch

    item:leftovers/shell bell/lum berry

    nature:naive(-sp.def,+spd)/hasty(-def,+spd)

    eves:252spd 128atk 128sp.atk

    moves:
    acupressure/workup
    substitute/protect/taunt
    sludge bomb/sludge wave/poison jab/brick break/vacuum wave/focus punch
    sludge bomb/sludge wave/poison jab/focus blast/vacuum wave/focus punch


    Bulky Frog

    ability:anticipation/dry skin/poison touch

    item:leftovers/shell bell/lum berry

    nature:careful(-sp.atk,+sp.def)

    eves:252hp 252sp.def 4spd

    moves:
    bulk up
    drain punch/revenge
    bullet bunch/payback/sucker punch/stone edge
    EG/bull doze/substitute/rain dance/taunt

  10. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Weavile22 View Post
    Countering toxicroak:

    Toxicroak is pretty predictable. He has an OK speed, poor defences, and respectable offenses. Generally, I would use Espeon, for STAB on psychic and its speed. You should only be worried about the ever so common sucker punchy that will murder Espeons.Super effective attacks completely cripple toxicroaks. Psychic types more than anything.
    Uhhh...sucker punch is VERY common, thus rendering simply using psychic, especially from espeon, useless as espeon will be ohkoed by sucker punch.

    The best counter for toxicroak is drought ninetails or something like landorus to take any suckerpunch or outspeed w/ earthquake.

  11. #61
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    I'm looking at Toxicroak and, while it is good, it's pretty tame. Its attack at base 106 is small compared to other Fighting types (it DOES have the highest attack among Poison types) and its speed is merely above average. The only way you are going to get any significant damage dealt without STAB is to Choice it or it will be exposed to the weaknesses from attacks that will become common thanks to new Fighting types like Terrakion and Conkeldurr, as well as already existing fighters with Infernape and Machamp. What's worse, it doesn't even get Superpower, so you're stuck with Cross Chop. In this metagame, Cross Chop won't go very far.

    If Toxicroak is going to be used at all, it MUST use what other fighters lack. Gimmicks just aren't an option if Toxicroak is going to survive in a metagame packed with overpowered attackers and quicker disruptors. Toxicroak is walking on fishing line when it comes to competitive value. I wish Toxicroak were better.
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  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by stenli View Post
    Rain Stall
    Toxicroak @ Leftovers
    - Protect
    - Sucker Punch
    - Brick Break or another Fighting-type move.
    - Ice Punch

    Protect means free healing every 2 turns. Sucker Punch for priority. Fighting-move is fighting-move. Ice Punch is for the dragons.
    For a Fighting move, what about Drain Punch? It got a boost to 75 BP, so it's equally powerful as Brick Break.

    An added Dry Skin would mean that Leftovers+Drain Punch+Rain would be quite a bit of healing each turn. And with that from behind a Sub...
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  13. #63
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    Settin' em' up, knocking them down.

    Toxicroak @ Black Sludge
    Adamant / Dry Skin
    -Toxic
    -Brick Break
    -Sucker Punch
    -Protect

    A kinda Toxic Stall, but set up for ruining most, well, setup. Toxic to poison and ruin SubSeeders (If you go first...) Brick Break for death to dual screens, Sucker Punch for general owchies, and Protect to stall and scope. This set works best alongside a Spinner with Rain Dance, i.e Blastoise, and a switch-forcer, like Dragon Tail. (Can Blastoise learn it?)

    EDIT: Blastoise CAN indeed learn Dragon Tail, so a nice set to go alongside might be...
    -Dragon Tail
    -Surf
    -Rain Dance
    -Rapid Spin

    Sorry for getting off-topic, if that's what to call it.
    Last edited by Mr. Marowak; 19th April 2011 at 2:54 PM.

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  14. #64
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    This is what I think of Toxicroak as a sweeper:
    item:focus sash
    abilityoison touch
    nature:jolly(+speed+attack

    Moves
    -sucker punch
    -ice punch
    -poison jab/drain punch/brick break
    -swords dance

    Toxicroak just doesn't have good defense or special defense. You could make him a sweeper as his attack is good and his speed is...well, OK. Anticipation isn't a very useful ability because Toxicroak is more of a sweeper than a big tank so he probably will take out the opponent before it can attack (If that is what you intend to use him for). Dry skin is very risky because it can be very useful but also very dangerous. That sort of leaves you with the best ability Toxicroak has which is Poison touch. I'd recommend giving him a focus sash because there are some Pokemon that can outrun him and when the opponent attacks, your most likely doomed. Sucker punch is a devastatingly powerful move for Toxicroak especially when it goes up against speedy psychic types like Alakazam. Toxicroak can use Ice punch to counter flying AND ground types. Poison jab is a good move for him if you want to teach him poison type moves or you can teach it a move like Drain punch which can not only damage the opponent, but heal you as well. Swords dance is a good option because I think that If you choose Toxicroak, your #1 priority is speed but attack won't be as good so swords dance takes care of that.
    Last edited by ringuma; 19th April 2011 at 7:39 AM.

  15. #65
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    If I had a Toxicroak, this is how I would set it up.

    FYI: I set up my pokemon so that they have moves that super effective against the types that pokemon is weak against and I'm an all out attacker. That's just my style.

    Physical Obliteration
    Ability: Poison Touch
    Item: Black Sludge / Poison Barb / Black Belt
    Nature: Jolly / Adamant
    -Poison Jab
    -Sucker Punch
    -Brick Break / Cross Chop / Drain Punch
    -Rock Slide / Ice Punch / Stone Edge / Thunder Punch

    Poison Jab is just a good STAB. Sucker Punch covers Psychic types, plus it has priority. Brick Break is a good STAB too. Cross Chop is Stronger, but you get less Acc and PP. Drain Punch is just as good as Brick Break and you get some HP. Rock Slide, Ice Punch, and Thunder Punch are all good options against Flying types. Stone Edge is another option, but it has less Acc.

    Regeneration
    Ability: Dry Skin
    Item: Damp Rock / Black Sludge / Leftovers / Shell Bell
    Nature: Jolly / Adamant
    -Poison Jab
    -Sucker Punch
    -Drain Punch
    -Rain Dance / Rest / Substitute

    The focus hereb is healing yourself and staying alive instead of dealing damage. Black Sludge will heal you because your a Poison type, Damp Rock extends Rain Dance which heals you because of Dry Skin, etc. Have fun choosing your method of healing.


  16. #66
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    this has nothing to do with the current topic at hand, but on the Whimsicott POTW:

    It's a lot harder to use Whimsicott in multiple Pokémon battles compared to singles. It can't do its job effectively, and multi Pokémon battles are often much faster, given you less time and reason to utilise Whimsicott's disruptive attacks.
    this is completely wrong, just saying.
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  17. #67
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    OK i think of toxicrokk as a glass cannon due to the massive Psychic weakness and a large amount of psychic types used the move set i would use is
    Revenge is a dish best sered to suckers
    Sucker punch.
    Revenge/brick break/drain punch
    Poison Jab
    and finally. Bullet Punch/ice punch
    the item would be depending on the fighting move you use and ability you run if you use Revenge i would suggest focus sash but if brick break/drain punch your running on fumes so use a life orb anyway. as for the ability in a rain team dry skin otherwise maybe run poison touch. your choice

    Sucker punch hits Psychics hard most of the time except in the case of defenceives like claydol and the part rock type duo.
    Revenge will hit an e-quaker hard with a focus sash or the other two moves if you dont like the revenge idea drain punch heals life orb damage. brick break is handy if reflect or light screen are in effect to in case of defencive alomamola etc.
    poison jab is simply for stab.
    and bullet punch means you can hit priority if you know your going down anyway in case life focus sash hp remaining or you could run ice punch for weakness coverage.

    EV's 252 Attack. 252speed if you want if not place these in HP if your running life orb the last 4 can go where ever i guess. Nature would obviously be ADAMANT
    Last edited by The Intersect; 19th April 2011 at 4:23 PM. Reason: forgot to put how i would place ev's

  18. #68
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    4 EV's=+1 to a Stat.
    Toxicroak will never live a Psychic.

  19. #69
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    yeah i realised that once i said it and removed that note but the last 4 i know but its mentionable anyway

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by SomeoneIGuess View Post
    Sweepers don't care about 30% chances of poisoning. 50% is larger.


    Poison Touch is for your contact moves.
    Hmm. . . you obviously haven't read my post, in which I calculated and showed my workings out to the percentage chance of poison ^^ it is on page 2.

    You do not add the percentages together, they're multiplied, so if Sludge bomb WAS a contact move (it obviously isn't), much like poison jab is, the chances of poisoning are 44%!

    Read my post on the second oage if ou want to understand why (my knowledge of maths when calculating probability and percentage has never failed me yet).
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  21. #71
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    Personally I think the only reason someone would use him in OU is for two reasons:
    1.Dry Skin, something that gives him a prevalent spot as a Fighting type for Rain teams, meaning he pairs well with Politoed, and is sometimes a rain team's only way of dealing with Ferrothorn.

    2.His typing comes with a rare prize:resists to Fighting, Rock and Dark, allowing him to stand in the face of common Scrafty and Terakion with impunity.

  22. #72
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    ^
    Yeah, 4X weak to Psychic, great!

  23. #73
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    Not to mention weak to ground, not my so much, but earthquake is like, the most spammed attack in the whole game? How many sweepers do you see not running earthquake? Only those who can't learn it (and those tend to be shoved down to lower tiers, where not so good sweepers are there but can STILL learn earthquake anyways so. . . yeah).

    The fact that earthquake will be saring you in the face almost constantly is why the metagame is so hostile towards poison types. Only when they have levitate or a secondary type to make neutral towards ground types can they even think to stay alive more than 3 turns unless they have a stall strategy, and even then, they don't kill much with the stall strategy

    In other words, a very good partner will be one that can aid Toxicroak in anyway from being killed by the always common ground types and the not so common yet A LOT MORE DANGEROUS psychic types ^^ lol crawdaunt ^^ (I think he is dark type).
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  24. #74
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    [QUOTE=ringuma;12330166]This is what I think of Toxicroak as a sweeper:

    The frog faster than you can say.....sweep.

    item:focus sash
    abilityoison touch
    nature:jolly(+speed+attack

    Moves
    -sucker punch
    -ice punch
    -poison jab/drain punch/brick break
    -swords dance

    Toxicroak just doesn't have good defense or special defense. You could make him a sweeper as his attack is good and his speed is...well, OK. Anticipation just isn't very useful in general and Dry skin is a very risky ability as it gives Toxicroak immunity to water type attacks but it also gives him a weakness to fire type attacks with so that sort of leaves you with the best ability Toxicroak has which is Poison touch. I'd recommend giving him a focus sash in case a pokemon outruns him and beats him. Sucker punch is a devastatingly powerful move for Toxicroak especially when it goes up against speedy psychic types like Alakazam. Toxicroak can use Ice punch to counter flying AND ground types (Gliscore is a good example). Poison jab is a good move for him if you want to teach him poison type moves. Or you can teach it a move like Drain punch which can not only damage the opponent, but heal you as well. If you'd like to use a fighting type move like brick break to break defenses instead of drain punch, that's fine too.
    Last edited by ringuma; 20th April 2011 at 1:02 AM.

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by gyarados151 View Post
    The fact that earthquake will be saring you in the face almost constantly is why the metagame is so hostile towards poison types. Only when they have levitate or a secondary type to make neutral towards ground types can they even think to stay alive more than 3 turns unless they have a stall strategy, and even then, they don't kill much with the stall strategy
    Actually, the hate for Poison-types is more because Poison only hits Grass Super-effectively, and Steel, the most commong defensive type, is immune to it.
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