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Thread: The CW's saturday Vortexx block appears to have died

  1. #1

    Default The CW's saturday Vortexx block appears to have died

    I guess it must be a tough business but what did they expect to happen when 90% of their shows were reruns from years ago? Sonic X and Yugioh can only carry you so far before they need to be reinforced. I cannot even comment on the garbage that took over the time slots. This is a massive fail for the CW.

    Someone should start a petition to get the KidsWB reinstated.

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    Saban didn't really do anything with the block after they bought it from 4KIDS, and I don't think the CW really gave two craps about it in the first place (they don't give two craps for anything that doesn't bring them money, really--"CW" stands for "Cash Whore Wad"). The programs they showed were pretty much leftovers with other sucky material thrown in (WWE Saturday Morning Slam was pure garbage), and there was really no variety to be seen. For two years, there were little changes in an attempt to be its own identity. I actually thought they had gotten the rights to re-air Tiny Toons about this time last year, and I was happy to see that, but it was really only like a Halloween special and that was all I saw of the show on the block.

    And remember, this is from the same people who had hosted Fox Kids years ago. Oh, how the mighty have fallen.

    It's really no surprise it went under, but at the same time, it's really sad because now that means there aren't anymore Saturday morning cartoons. I don't know what the hell this One Magnificent Morning is besides that it's going to be nothing but E/I programs, and bring me memories of the more superior One Saturday Morning block from years ago with the suspiciously similar title. But you know what sucks the most? Last week, they didn't do anything special for their final broadcast. I bet there are kids right now who've turned on the TV and went, "What am I watching?", and have probably turned the channel/turned the TV off in disappointment and went to go play their video games. Just watch, the ratings for One Magnificent Morning are going to suck because kids don't give a crap for the E/I programs if it doesn't keep their attention and it's not from PBS.

    I weep for the future, because the non-cable future's never going to know what it was like to wake up in the mornings on Saturday and sit in front of the television with their dry cereal watching nothing but cartoons until noon. Well, at least there's the DVDs/Blu-Rays of cartoons they can always watch if their parents love them enough to buy them such cartoons.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soaring Pikachu View Post
    Someone should start a petition to get the KidsWB reinstated.
    It's not going to happen. Don't even bother wasting Internet space for such a thing, because the CW doesn't care. (And even then, it'd be renamed to KidsCW and the programs are going to suck.)
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    Hey, at least I got to see Gohan blowing Cell into bits for the 475th time! If I didn't know any better the producers of the block timed its demise with the end of the cell saga.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soaring Pikachu View Post
    Someone should start a petition to get the KidsWB reinstated.
    You gotta be kidding. After years and years, anime fans wrote letters of protest and shouted on every message board, "4Kids sucks! Throw them out!" just because they were following United States censorship laws for children's programming like they should for dubbing. Well, they got their wish, only to find that the new guys doing the dub barely changed a single policy. (Because they had to follow the same censorship laws.)

    And now there are people who want 4Kids back? Unbelievable.
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    Its a real shame. They took about the only thing that kids (and young-spirited adults) looked forward to in the wake of an otherwise tough week of school/work or whatever, with live action nonsense with stuff they probably don't care about...Now people will have to rely on cable and the internet if they want their fill of animated fun!

    I seriously thought this "One Magnificent Morning" stuff would be a Sunday thing. Because those early morning infomercials aren't getting any more entertaining...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maedar View Post
    You gotta be kidding. After years and years, anime fans wrote letters of protest and shouted on every message board, "4Kids sucks! Throw them out!" just because they were following United States censorship laws for children's programming like they should for dubbing. Well, they got their wish, only to find that the new guys doing the dub barely changed a single policy. (Because they had to follow the same censorship laws.)

    And now there are people who want 4Kids back? Unbelievable.
    4kids were not following censorship "laws." There were rewriting stories, and edited things that were not offensive at all like rice ball. No one who had rights to that cartoon block since the 90's knew what the hell they were doing.

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    And so Saturdays just became not so "magnificent" anymore. But all joking aside it's a sad day. Saturday morning cartoons are iconic. I remember being a child waking up early to watch KidsWB or Fox Kids. Now neither exist. Fox Kids has been gone for awhile now. There was a time when cartoons use to play on weekdays from like 3:00 to 5:00. It just got less and less and less until now it's over. Unless you got cable or the internet there is no cartoons for you to watch. Well there's PBS I suppose. It's a sad day for sure. Even UPN had cartoons. Pokemon first started on UPN before KidsWB picked it up. R.I.P. Saturdays.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maedar View Post
    You gotta be kidding. After years and years, anime fans wrote letters of protest and shouted on every message board, "4Kids sucks! Throw them out!" just because they were following United States censorship laws for children's programming like they should for dubbing. Well, they got their wish, only to find that the new guys doing the dub barely changed a single policy. (Because they had to follow the same censorship laws.)

    And now there are people who want 4Kids back? Unbelievable.
    He said Kids WB, not 4KIDS, who bought out Fox Kids' block before moving over to the WB channel who didn't give a crap about it. But you know what, to be honest, I actually do miss 4KIDS a little bit if only because they were a source of anime to non-cable viewers. (Now that the Internet and Netflix are much more ubiquitous, maybe not so much these days, but they were back then.) At the time, it made sense regardless, but though their dubs weren't that good, usually, they did bring anime to a generation of children, and I have to give them credit for that. They made stupid decisions with how they edited the shows and with their finances, but they at least knew how to run a block and how to market shows--how else did Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh get popular?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    4kids were not following censorship "laws." There were rewriting stories, and edited things that were not offensive at all like rice ball. No one who had rights to that cartoon block since the 90's knew what the hell they were doing.
    I kinda have to wonder how willingly they were doing it. They didn't edit everything out, some things remained untouched in the background and even in the foreground. The whole rice ball controversy was I think for just the one early episode--because they would later mention it by name. My guess is it all depended on who was writing the script/directing the dub of that episode. But of course, that was just Pokémon, they did mess around with the other shows that can't be overlooked. Still, when they first started out, I doubt they did anything different from what DiC Entertainment did with the Sailor Moon dub.
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    They made stupid decisions with how they edited the shows and with their finances, but they at least knew how to run a block and how to market shows--how else did Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh get popular?
    Maybe the complaining fans helped a little. You know what the Streisand Effect is?

    Basically, it's the reason Married With Children was a smash hit, despite the letter-writing campaign and boycott against it. The soccer moms who protested the show's "anti-family" themes actually drew attention to it and made more people watch it than before making it the longest-running sitcom to date, and making Bounty's stocks (who theses guys had threatened to boycott) skyrocket.

    In one episode of the show, they actually made fun of the boycott; in the episode, a sitcom was made about the Bundys' life, which was cancelled after one episode because "some lady in Michigan didn't like it". Hilarious, huh? It was the producers way of saying, "thanks for the free publicity and ratings boost, chumps.")

    And this sort of thing is older than you may think. Frederick II of Prussia was said to have loved potatoes, but his plan to introduce them as a staple crop wasn't working, because the commoners didn't trust the strange new vegetables. So what did he do? He told his men to fence his potato farms and have armed guards posted around them... Secretly encouraging them to accept bribes and retire at nightfall. As he expected, this made the peasants think there was something special about the potatoes, so almost overnight, they started stealing them to plant their own gardens.
    Last edited by Maedar; 5th October 2014 at 4:37 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maedar View Post
    Maybe the complaining fans helped a little. You know what the Streisand Effect is?

    Basically, it's the reason Married With Children was a smash hit, despite the letter-writing campaign and boycott against it. The soccer moms who protested the show's "anti-family" themes actually drew attention to it and made more people watch it than before making it the longest-running sitcom to date, and making Bounty's stocks (who theses guys had threatened to boycott) skyrocket.
    The situations are different though. In M.W.C's case the same people offended by it were the target audience, age wise that is. In this case however, the target audience is kids who don't know any better, while the people complaining were a very small group of teenagers who read too much manga.

    So while your situation might work today, where we have numerous teenagers/adults who still watch anime, certainly back in the time I doubt it contributed to the ratings in the slightest.
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    So in other words, in both cases, the most visible complainers were clearly NOT the target audience. Right?

    Look, I can list several other examples. The only reason anyone ever went to see The Last Temptation of Christ was because protestors picketed theaters and called it a "blasphemy". That made people interested in a movie that, when analyzed in the standard way, would be considered pretty bad.

    How do you get people to watch something? Have a vocal minority yell and complain about the controversy in it, and people will line up in droves.

    To be quite honest, if someone objects to a TV show, they perform a miraculous method of avoiding trouble called "changing the channel". It's much easier to change your own viewing habits than to get a huge corporation to change its policy.

    Just ask the Southern Baptists. I doubt Disney cared one iota about their eight-year boycott.
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    Even if the complainers helped with the popularity, apparently they were also watching the shows so they can complain about that week's episode, thus were ironically adding onto the ratings with the non-complainers. Honestly, I don't think the manga/English subs of those shows were that readily available to Western audiences at the time. Now when One Piece came around, it probably was, but I still don't think the majority of the viewers at the time were aware of such changes/censorship. I'm sure savvy viewers could tell things were off, but kids don't typically care about this sort of thing. Sure, that kind of mentality was probably what hurt the quality to begin with, but anime just wasn't as mainstream/positively-received back then like it is now.

    4KIDS is old news now even if the reputations of some of the anime they had dubbed is still hurting to this day. Just because they were notorious for it doesn't mean they were the only ones who made bad dubs. It's just that strangely enough, you don't hear too many people complaining about other current dubs besides Pokémon's dub, which I guess suggests the older viewers are watching the subs like they're inclined to and don't care about any dubs that do come out. (Even though I think a lot of dubbed anime marketed towards children just typically don't have good dubs.) Even if Kids WB were to somehow make a comeback, you're still going to get the complaints about the programs they would show, whether they're new programs or were carried over, or about the block itself in how "It's just not the saaaaaaame!" or something to that effect. And considering that networks such as Cartoon Network and Nickelodeon go through the same schlock, it's not going to change anything unless the ratings were low enough.

    Besides, I think 4KIDS knew about the periphery demographic if the dialogue in their dubs were anything to go by. I guess their sense of humor just weren't the vocal minority's cup of tea--which I can understand, but it's their loss.
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    Kutie, the original versions of Yu-Gi-Oh were quite violent.

    For example, in one GX episode, the main antagonist (Rudger) "initiates" Bommer (a black man from South America) into the Dark Signers by lynching him with giant spider webs. (The Dark Signers are undead humans.)

    Naturally, 4Kids had to seriously edit that scene. (The censor would likely have gone to jail if they hadn't.) And yet, the diehard fans of the original anime still said they had "butchered" it. That kind of made me question the sanity of said fans.

    Whenever I bring up the fact that the target audience is young children, they claim, "Why not? Kids have seen worse." True, but that doesn't change the law.

    In fact, you know why kids watch Game of Thrones and Dexter? It's because the TV-MA ratings are right there at the beginning. That doesn't make them want to change the channel, it makes them WANT to watch it. That's where the soccer moms seriously screwed up.

    And V-chips are worthless. Most parents who try to use them need to ask their children how to disable them. (No, that is NOT just a joke. Kids are better with electronics these days than their technophobe parents.)

    Seriously.
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    Y'know, i'm still wondering how this thread quikly transformed from a linup's end to a censorship debate...

    Am I the only one who prefers dubs over "Original" and grim Japanese nonsense?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trot Away View Post
    Am I the only one who prefers dubs over "Original" and grim Japanese nonsense?
    No. I don't like watching a movie I can't understand by reading the subtitles, and a like cartoons that way even less.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maedar View Post
    Kutie, the original versions of Yu-Gi-Oh were quite violent.
    Oh, I'm well aware of that (though funnily enough, Season 0 was tamer with the violence than the manga). 4KIDS didn't always get an anime that was for kids, but I'm pretty sure every single one of the anime they had the licenses for went through some kind of censoring (though I question Ultimate Muscle a lot--Mr. Cheeks still haunts me). I do think it's ridiculous how fans moan and whine about how scenes were "butchered" strictly because it wasn't kid-appropriate for Western audiences that was marketed here as a kids' show. Did some of the censoring go too far? Sure, I can believe that, but for the most part, a lot of the more legitimate complaints came from the changes in the script. The Tokyo Mew Mew dub was one of the worst offenders, mainly because they tried to "Americanize" it. (The transformation sequences getting censored I have no qualms over, personally, even though they're beautifully animated, but then I look at Sailor Moon, and realize those transformations were left untouched despite DiC's own censoring.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Trot Away View Post
    Y'know, i'm still wondering how this thread quikly transformed from a linup's end to a censorship debate...
    Lol, sorry about that. I sometimes have to wonder if it's the kind of network that determine the amount of censorship for each time-slot. Cable networks seem to be more lenient about the shows they market toward children than free TV networks are, so I wonder if 4KIDS would've gone slightly more easily on their shows if they were on a cable network. I look at the 2003 Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon and sometimes think to myself, "This is produced by 4KIDS, right?" because what they tend to censor in anime were usually left intact in that show--but then again, it could be because it was more tastefully handled in the TMNT cartoon, but I don't know.

    Am I the only one who prefers dubs over "Original" and grim Japanese nonsense?
    I don't mind either one. If a dub is readily available, I will watch it, though I usually do go around looking to see what people think of the dub.
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    I have to say it maybe its for the best. Think of it all they showed were reruns of shows that have been over for years! With series like TMNT and Pokemon getting bought by CN and Nick respectfully(and haveing new episodes/reboots), Fox ,NBC WB should have looked for new programs wither Anime or cartoons to fill in the void but they didn't and so the CW block is over.

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