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Thread: GOP Debate 8/11/11

  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    Donations do not mean his foreign policy is any less psychotic, naive, or dangerous.
    The generals, officers, and NCOs all disagree with you. And I'm fairly certainly lifelong generals know more about the military than you or Obama.

  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    The generals, officers, and NCOs all disagree with you. And I'm fairly certainly lifelong generals know more about the military than you or Obama.
    I have seen his numbers, which amazingly is not alot considering how many members there are in the military. I have not yet seen you or anyone else provide a break down of those numbers as to how many of each donated.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  3. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    I have seen his numbers, which amazingly is not alot considering how many members there are in the military. I have not yet seen you or anyone else provide a break down of those numbers as to how many of each donated.
    In the other thread I posted a source showing statistics of military donations to each candidate. So tell me, how is not going to war with Iran, not starting any more unprovoked wars, and having free trade with other countries. Also, why do we need to have foreign troops in Germany or send military aid to Israel?

  4. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    In the other thread I posted a source showing statistics of military donations to each candidate. So tell me, how is not going to war with Iran, not starting any more unprovoked wars, and having free trade with other countries. Also, why do we need to have foreign troops in Germany or send military aid to Israel?
    It goes beyond that including allowing Iran to develop nuclear weapons and not even stepping in to stop Iran when they start nuking the middle east. There is a reason why he was smacked down like a idiot during the Presidential Debate for his foreign policy.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  5. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    It goes beyond that including allowing Iran to develop nuclear weapons and not even stepping in to stop Iran when they start nuking the middle east. There is a reason why he was smacked down like a idiot during the Presidential Debate for his foreign policy.
    Tell me, if he was "smacked down" why is it that the audience all supported Ron Paul when he made his Iran speech? Also, look at the comments on the video, all of the love Ron Paul is getting.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhxwJnPbzt4

  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    Tell me, if he was "smacked down" why is it that the audience all supported Ron Paul when he made his Iran speech? Also, look at the comments on the video, all of the love Ron Paul is getting.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhxwJnPbzt4
    You are ignoring the facts that his statements in that debate were no less naive, stupid, or ignorant of the world. Try actually debating the facts than looking for validation from comments and polls conducted strictly on the internet.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  7. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    You are ignoring the facts that his statements in that debate were no less naive, stupid, or ignorant of the world. Try actually debating the facts than looking for validation from comments and polls conducted strictly on the internet.
    1. Both the CIA and international inspectors have found no evidence of nuclear weapons being built in Iran. (1, 2)

    2. Iran doesn't have an air force that can reach the United States.

    3. If Iran did some how manage to attempt to attack the US, there would be massive retaliation, and Iran knows this.

    4. Why should we start yet ANOTHER war, on top of the half a dozen wars we are currently fighting around the globe? Why should even more American troops have to die and waste trillions of dollars?

    5. What harm is there in allowing Iran to develop nuclear weapons, tons of countries in the region already have nuclear weapons, including China, Russia, India, Israel, and Pakistan.

    6. The reason why the countries in the Middle East and the surrounding areas are somewhat anti-American and the reasons they have attacked the United States, is BECAUSE we are meddling in the internal affairs of Middle Eastern countries.

  8. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    1. Both the CIA and international inspectors have found no evidence of nuclear weapons being built in Iran. (1, 2)
    The CIA has since recanted the mistake and is now looking toward Iran building a weapon.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-nuke-weapons/

    http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpu...lear-bomb.html

    Also Iranian defectors have also said Iran is building the bomb.

    http://www.haaretz.com/news/internat...-help-1.332312

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    2. Iran doesn't have an air force that can reach the United States.
    Which is meaningless as open as our southern border is, you could sneak a nuclear bomb across with out anyone noticing.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    3. If Iran did some how manage to attempt to attack the US, there would be massive retaliation, and Iran knows this.
    This is the same country that believes it is on the verge of bringing about the end of the world. MAD doesnt work here.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...121501428.html

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    4. Why should we start yet ANOTHER war, on top of the half a dozen wars we are currently fighting around the globe? Why should even more American troops have to die and waste trillions of dollars?
    Other than the fact Iran has been fighting a proxy war with us for years? Killing tens of thousands of American soldiers? And provides the single greatest threat to the U.S. in the Middle East?

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    5. What harm is there in allowing Iran to develop nuclear weapons, tons of countries in the region already have nuclear weapons, including China, Russia, India, Israel, and Pakistan.
    Yeah except none of those countries see a need to actually destroy Israel, or to bring about the end of days to fulfill their own belief of Islamic prophecy.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    6. The reason why the countries in the Middle East and the surrounding areas are somewhat anti-American and the reasons they have attacked the United States, is BECAUSE we are meddling in the internal affairs of Middle Eastern countries.
    No not really, they wish to create their own Islamic Super Nation, they need us to be out of the way for that, as well as Israel our ally to be destroyed.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  9. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    The CIA has since recanted the mistake and is now looking toward Iran building a weapon.
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-nuke-weapons/
    http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpu...lear-bomb.html
    Also Iranian defectors have also said Iran is building the bomb.
    Okay, and so even if they were to be building a bomb, they have agreed to enter into disarmament talks already and they lack a means of delivering the bomb.


    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    Which is meaningless as open as our southern border is, you could sneak a nuclear bomb across with out anyone noticing.
    *sigh* not much to say here if you're really that hellbent on warmongerering.


    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    This is the same country that believes it is on the verge of bringing about the end of the world. MAD doesnt work here.
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...121501428.html
    Maybe they wouldn't feel that way if people like you wouldn't threaten to invade them every five seconds?


    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    Other than the fact Iran has been fighting a proxy war with us for years? Killing tens of thousands of American soldiers? And provides the single greatest threat to the U.S. in the Middle East?
    We shouldn't be in the Middle East to begin with! That's the problem.


    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    Yeah except none of those countries see a need to actually destroy Israel, or to bring about the end of days to fulfill their own belief of Islamic prophecy.
    Yes, because North Korea, Iran, and China all love Israel... And why the hell should we support Israel? They can and have taken care of themselves, plus we shouldn't get involved in other countries affairs.


    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    No not really, they wish to create their own Islamic Super Nation, they need us to be out of the way for that, as well as Israel our ally to be destroyed.
    Just a minute ago you said they weren't afraid of the US and would attack us and/or Israel anyway. Now you're saying they "need us to be out of the way" in order to oppose Israel?

  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    Okay, and so even if they were to be building a bomb, they have agreed to enter into disarmament talks already and they lack a means of delivering the bomb.
    First do you honestly trust Iran to disarm? Second as we have seen with terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan. Iran has the means to deliver weapons to its proxys.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    *sigh* not much to say here if you're really that hellbent on warmongerering.
    In other words you have no comeback to the fact we have a open border in which weapons including bombs could pass through easily.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    Maybe they wouldn't feel that way if people like you wouldn't threaten to invade them every five seconds?
    Yeah this goes back to 2004 with the election of their President, like it or not they elected a mad man who believes they are the ones to bring about the end of the world. You cannot reason with nuts.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    We shouldn't be in the Middle East to begin with! That's the problem.
    Maybe you havn't been to New York lately, why don't you go down to the south side of the city, and wave your hands around where the World Trade Center used to be. See if you touch the towers.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    Yes, because North Korea, Iran, and China all love Israel... And why the hell should we support Israel? They can and have taken care of themselves, plus we shouldn't get involved in other countries affairs.
    China and North Korea could care less about what does or does not happen to Israel, the only country actively seeking its destruction of those three is Iran. As for why we support them? Because they are a consistent ally in the Middle East and the only truly stable western democracy there.

    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    Just a minute ago you said they weren't afraid of the US and would attack us and/or Israel anyway. Now you're saying they "need us to be out of the way" in order to oppose Israel?
    Yes they need us destroyed or damaged heavily so they can wipe out Israel and anyone else that stands in their way to create either

    A: A Muslim super state.

    or

    B: The End of Days.

    The outcome varies depending on which group of Islamic nut jobs we face.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  11. #136
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    We have to end these wars now BigLutz! Reports indicate we will be in Afghanistan until 2024 unless Ron Paul is elected: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ntil-2024.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by havoc37 View Post
    We have to end these wars now BigLutz! Reports indicate we will be in Afghanistan until 2024 unless Ron Paul is elected: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ntil-2024.html
    Hey I have no problem getting out of Iraq and Afghanistan but only on the condition that if we are attacked again we will respond not with troops but with nuclear warheads. The truth is if we do leave Afghanistan now, it will destroy the government and create a power vacuum in which terrorists will use to re establish the Taliban and al Qaeda, which in the end will only return us to a pre 9/11 state there.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

  13. #138
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    Uh........can we ease up on the A&B convo please?

    I have claimed Giratina

  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigLutz View Post
    Hey I have no problem getting out of Iraq and Afghanistan but only on the condition that if we are attacked again we will respond not with troops but with nuclear warheads. The truth is if we do leave Afghanistan now, it will destroy the government and create a power vacuum in which terrorists will use to re establish the Taliban and al Qaeda, which in the end will only return us to a pre 9/11 state there.
    ...

    That would be completely amoral. First if we were attacked, there would be no telling if it was related to the Taliban or not; then by nuking Afghanistan, we'd be murdering countless civilians for what we'd tentatively blame the Taliban on.

    The condition of their state is a remote priority compared to our security. We're not there to, in other words, to clean up their matters and ensure that they don't revert to a pre-9/11 state. We're there to ensure another 9/11 doesn't happen to us again.

    Quote Originally Posted by kaiser soze View Post
    Uh........can we ease up on the A&B convo please?
    I'm sorry, I posted after you asked. I'll try.

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  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by SunnyC View Post
    ...

    That would be completely amoral. First if we were attacked, there would be no telling if it was related to the Taliban or not; then by nuking Afghanistan, we'd be murdering countless civilians for what we'd tentatively blame the Taliban on.
    Obviously we would want to find the perpetrators first, but more importantly you want to rule by fear, to make sure they do not attack us again. Would we be murdering countless civilians? Yes. But consider the broad number of civilians that would be murdered by engaging in a decade long ground war.

    Quote Originally Posted by SunnyC View Post
    The condition of their state is a remote priority compared to our security. We're not there to, in other words, to clean up their matters and ensure that they don't revert to a pre-9/11 state. We're there to ensure another 9/11 doesn't happen to us again.
    Really that is not going to happen unless we completely wipe out al Qaeda, or make it so they are so afraid to attack us again that no one will support al Qaeda.
    "No. I don't agree with him on a LOT of issues. Unlike most Republicans, who are blindly loyal to their party" ~ Maedar on Barack Obama

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    Massive retaliation if they attacked us again certainly would make the terrorists stop.

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