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Thread: Unpopular Opinions About Western Animation

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    Default Unpopular Opinions About Western Animation

    A thread to basically get something off of your chest about anything in the animation world--in the Western hemisphere. Feel free to disagree, but please keep it civil.

    I'll start off:

    - Johnny Test is a great example of wasted potential. I don't care if it's a rip-off of Dexter's Laboratory, it was clear there could've been some funny episodes and jokes made starring an eleven-year-old lazy-ass kid goading his genius sisters for their experiments (while being a guinea pig himself) and having a talking mangy mutt sidekick being the straight man. The side-characters, admittedly, made the show for me when it first started out, but they fell into stereotypes pretty quickly. The first season is honestly the only watchable season, but since it doesn't bother trying, it never kicks off the ground when it had the chance. (Also, I'm pissed the theme song that was used on Kids WB didn't make it into the DVDs. Like what the hell?)

    - I don't really believe this is the Disney Revival if only because it's still a little too soon to tell, and even if it is, I don't see it's anything like the Renaissance. I doubt the phrase "Disney Renaissance" was coined and stuck until sometime in the early 2000s when people got to look back in retrospect--although feel free to correct me if this was coined in the 90s. My guess that if it was, it had to have been after Lion King came out (similar to how I began noticing "Revival" was being thrown around after Frozen came out), in which case they probably started eating their words once Pocahontas was released the following year, and Disney steadily lost ground after that. Disney still makes good movies (likewise, they have their bad), but Lion King was definitely the pinnacle.

    - I like DreamWorks, more than Disney and Pixar at times. Yes, they have their low points, but they have high points, too, just like every studio. I think it's sad they closed their traditional animation department for good after Shrek was successful (although I'm still waiting for Me and My Shadow in that aspect), especially since they had great talent working there. For a studio born from their hatred of Disney, although they made a name for themselves, ever since they decided to move on (…maybe) from their hatred, they're been showing they have a creative bone in their body. Still have some kinks to work out (their financial troubles aren't helping), but their hits out-weigh the misses. Which is one reason why I'm bummed Mr. Peabody & Sherman didn't do so well, more-so with Megamind, holy crap, Megamind.

    - Despicable Me was a fluke for Illumination Entertainment. They got lucky their first animated film became a hit, but Minion-mania is ruining it. I am looking forward to seeing how they do How the Grinch Stole Christmas, but it's going to have a hard time trying to get out of Chuck Jones' adaptation's shadow. Also holy shit, they got the rights to make a Pluto adaptation?? I mean, it's gonna be a live-action/CGI film, but how're they going to do that?? (I thought Imagi's Astro Boy killed interest in this sort of thing?)
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    I didn't hate Scrappy Doo. I believe other characters like every member of the main cast of Teen Titans Go deserve the hate.
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    actually, the "Disney Renaissance" started at Little Mermaid :P

    oh yeah, not a fan of post-cancellation family guy...

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    Simpsons is still funny.

    The original purpose of the show has changed, you've grown up. Doesnt change that it's still a funny show.

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    Teen Titans Go isn't as terrible as people say it is. This "iteration" was never meant to replace the original.

    Family Guy is selectively funny. The humor in it is more scattered, and the basic plot is pointless most of the time.
    American Dad is actually a pretty decent show.
    King of the Hill is the best anime adult show. The simplicity of it makes several people overlook the good writing.

    I'll think of more if I feel like it.

    Edit:
    Quote Originally Posted by Kutie Pie View Post

    - Despicable Me was a fluke for Illumination Entertainment. They got lucky their first animated film became a hit, but Minion-mania is ruining it. I am looking forward to seeing how they do How the Grinch Stole Christmas, but it's going to have a hard time trying to get out of Chuck Jones' adaptation's shadow. Also holy shit, they got the rights to make a Pluto adaptation?? I mean, it's gonna be a live-action/CGI film, but how're they going to do that?? (I thought Imagi's Astro Boy killed interest in this sort of thing?)
    That reminds me. There is a guy on youtube known as "Ralph the Movie Maker" who thinks similarly and hates Minions with a burning passion. I think the way he looks at films has a good level of scrutiny.
    Last edited by Auraninja; 19th July 2016 at 10:30 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinjer View Post
    actually, the "Disney Renaissance" started at Little Mermaid :P
    I know, but I don't believe "Disney Renaissance" was coined with the Little Mermaid, nor Beauty and the Beast despite it being nominated for "Best Picture". Also considering Rescuers Down Under didn't do well in theaters, that clearly couldn't have coined the term even though it is part of the Renaissance line-up.

    I dunno, the 90s was a more simpler time compared to nowadays where word-of-mouth spreads faster than ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Auraninja View Post
    That reminds me. There is a guy on youtube known as "Ralph the Movie Maker" who thinks similarly and hates Minions with a burning passion. I think the way he looks at films has a good level of scrutiny.
    I've never heard of him, I should go check him out.

    Another thought I've had is I don't get the hate for the 2007 TMNT movie. Although I've watched the movies and the 2003 TV series, I know I'm not knowledgeable about the TMNT mythos, just the basics. I'm totally aware there's multiple universes/retellings of the franchise, but I think it has to go out of its way to be insulting and/or completely wrong about the source material to be considered a bad Turtles-verse. So I don't see how it is TMNT is terrible outside of possibly the villain(s) who are, admittedly, not that great.
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    - While NickToons' Doug was the superior version of the two, Disney's Doug was still pretty decent.
    However, I prefer the opening theme of Disney's Doug over NickToons' Doug theme.

    - Scrappy-Doo isn't that bad of a character.
    Last edited by Kalos Adventurer; 20th July 2016 at 12:05 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinjer View Post
    actually, the "Disney Renaissance" started at Little Mermaid :P

    oh yeah, not a fan of post-cancellation family guy...
    Speaking of The Little Mermaid...

    "SPOILERS" INCOMING

    Here's my interpretation of Disney’s “The Little Mermaid”, a movie where none of the characters are particularly admirable.

    The story opens with an Incompetent King parading his mermaid daughters around in a musical like a bunch of Rocketeers. That’s creepy, by the way. In lieu of actually governing, he lets dogmatic thought and unrealistic cultural expectations of beauty create discontent in the citizens of his Atlantic kingdom. So unhappy are the citizens that they seek the aid of a sea witch to aid them in alleviating their distress. The sea witch’s name is Ursula, but for the sake of this writing, we’ll call her Sally May. I dunno, it fits.

    Meanwhile, the Incompetent King’s daughter, the “Heroine”, has fallen in love with the Prince of a race of land dwelling Aquan Killers. Guess she likes to live dangerously. The Incompetent King is understandably worried about this. So, to get his point across about how savage this Aquan Killer race is, he engages in an act of violent psychological abuse. If his aim with a magic trident had been slightly worse, it would have also been physical abuse.

    So traumatized is the "Heroine" that she goes to Sally May for a solution to escape her circumstances of birth. As it turns out, however, Sally May is a predatory lender who preys on troubled people with promises of a better life, but with steep, nearly unattainable costs. Sally May offers her a chance to join the Aquan Killers, but pressures her to click Accept without reading the Terms & Conditions. Ok, I’ll give “Heroine” a pass on this one. We’ve all been there.

    Flash forward to her grad...er...wedding day, and the “Heroine” still hasn’t met her end of the deal. Sally May now owns her forever.

    The Incompetent King, in his great wisdom, effectively hands over the sovereignty of the entire Atlantic Ocean to save his daughter- one person. Sally May gains the Incompetent King's powers and is nearly unstoppable. The “Heroine”, the Incompetent King, and their animal sidekicks float around gormless. The Aquan Killer Prince does what Aquan Killers do best however and totally murders Sally over a contract that is completely legal in the Incompetent King’s dystopian paradise. And thus Sally’s reign of terror comes to an end.

    This whole fiasco could have been avoided, by the way, if the "Heroine" hadn't gone grave robbing.
    Last edited by Ketaru; 30th July 2016 at 3:23 AM.

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    I can still find enjoyment in Family guy.

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    This isn't really a movie thing bit I HATE what animation has become on Cartoon network and Nick. I mean you have these BRILLIANTLY animated shows like Dreamwork's Dragons and Star Wars Rebels not to mention shows like Voltron and TMNT 2012 and then you look at these ridiculous 10 minute shows that have taken over Cartoon Network and it just makes you sad. Not to mention the animation quality is atrocious in most cases.

    Thankfully Disney Channel has a couple of decent animated shows for kids along with Disney XD.
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    I don't find Teen Titans Go to be that bad, I like the show's sense of satire and self-referential, and later on self-deprecating sense of humor. The show feels sort of like a parody, and the writers are clearly having fun messing with people's criticisms of the show.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kutie Pie View Post
    Johnny Test is a great example of wasted potential. I don't care if it's a rip-off of Dexter's Laboratory, it was clear there could've been some funny episodes and jokes made starring an eleven-year-old lazy-ass kid goading his genius sisters for their experiments (while being a guinea pig himself) and having a talking mangy mutt sidekick being the straight man. The side-characters, admittedly, made the show for me when it first started out, but they fell into stereotypes pretty quickly. The first season is honestly the only watchable season, but since it doesn't bother trying, it never kicks off the ground when it had the chance. (Also, I'm pissed the theme song that was used on Kids WB didn't make it into the DVDs. Like what the hell?)
    Johnny Test had potential? I always found the characters to be teeth-grittingly annoying, the animation to be akin to that of a 16 year-old's attempt at a Flash cartoon series, and the sound effects to be horrid. Crack that whip!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rezzo View Post
    Johnny Test had potential? I always found the characters to be teeth-grittingly annoying, the animation to be akin to that of a 16 year-old's attempt at a Flash cartoon series, and the sound effects to be horrid. Crack that whip!
    TBH, Johnny Test during the Kids WB-era was perfectly fine imo. The animation also was pretty good, it's only when it got transferred to CN later on did I feel a lot of its amusement and charm soured. It was never a deep show, just an episode-by-episode of the day in the life of a kid with crazy scientist sisters and his dogs. When it went to CN it just feels like the characters became super obnoxious, overly loud and stupid and the sound effects were painful, not to mention the change in animation style to flash which is easier and cheaper to create. I'm glad it seems CN is moving away from the trend of just making these cartoons about obnoxious, loud characters who do stupid things twenty-four seven.

    If anything I think the introductions of Steven Universe and Gravity Falls and their successes have done good with at least, hopefully, pushing these cartoons in a somewhat better directions then what they are. I do really miss CN's action shows though, Secret Saturdays, for example had a lot of potential and left before its time. Don't even get me started on Young Justice either, such good shows but I'm aware action isn't as profitable as comedy and when a show is merchandise driven the merch not selling to their standards is like a death sentence for the even a great show.

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    I'm probably going to step on a few toes here, but...

    I don't like Stephen Universe all that much. While I like the use of gemstones (and I like Pearl's design), I don't feel that it lives up to how much the fanbase praises it to be.

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    I actually liked the Lion Turtle twist at the end of Avatar: The Last Airbender.
    "Everyone creates the thing they dread. Men of peace create engines of war. Invaders create Avengers. People create... smaller people? Er... children! I lost the word there. Children. Designed to supplant them. To help them end."

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    Here are some of mine, if that's ok.
    - A lot of people say CN is good as of right now, but for me I'd say yes and no. It does have a few good shows like SU, WBB, so on, but some of their decisions strike me as kinda gre-I'm still mad about Galactic: Kids Next Door. Like, Mr. Warburton got most of the original team back to make a teaser for it, and they were willing to make it into a full show, and CN says they "aren't interested". But when Craig McCracken wants no part of remaking the PPG, Cartoon Network goes and does it anyways. CN still doesn't sit that well with me today is all.

    - The Simpsons are still funny to me. I understand if others don't like it, and that's all good! But The Simpsons have some pretty big standards to live up to.

    - I was never huge on Billy and Mandy or Foster's Home. I liked them, but I was always more of a Kid Next Door.

    - Some of the cartoons that people hype up (Namely early CN shows) don't hold up that well. I'd say CN's best era was 2001-2008.

    - Class of 3000 is a fantastic show, and it had no business being cancelled.

    - I'm not nearly as big a Disney fan as I once was. It feels like all they make are princess movies, live action remakes, or very niche films.

    I think that's about it for me.

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    I love Don Bluth, but I felt a little underwhelmed with American Tail and All Dogs Go to Heaven after hearing praises about them for years before I got to see them. This could be because I didn't grow up with those films like I did with Secret of NIMH, Land Before Time, even the Small One short, but I just didn't… get it. They're Don Bluth films, and they're good movies, definitely, but I wasn't emotionally drained from them or amazed by anything, and they don't stick with me very well.
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    Korrasami came out of nowhere and people only like it because both are girls (I kinda like them for that sole reason too)
    John K fanboys are dumb.

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    Alright. *Breathes deeply*

    I don't really like the Lego Movie. it just seems so... average to me. The humour is not my style (too many references, not enough wit) and I find the pacing way too fast to the detriment of the perhaps bloated secondary cast (as in, there are a lot of supporting characters who aren't really developed or made memorable). Yeah, the twist at the end has emotional value, but for me it saps something out of the rest of the movie. It's weird, since I love a lot of other really popular and acclaimed films (including Pixar stuff), but I cannot bring myself to care for this one for some reason.

    I find the Book of Life mediocre too (again due to pacing problems and also because it lacked the emotional depth I expected from a movie about death), though I don't know how unpopular that is.

    Agree with Kutie Pie about Despicable Me. I really like the first one, but the second in hindsight had so many holes (long story short: the romance was a bad idea and the espionage plot was wasted), and the only other two movies I've seen from Illumination - Hop and the Lorax - were meh at best. But yeah, can't stand the minions any more except maybe if I were to see the first movie again, and I question whether they would ever be able to make something good again.

    Quick-fire opinions on Pixar: Cars, while not their best movie, is far from their worst (though the sequel IS bad) - I can think of at least three non-Cars films I'd put lower; although I don't think Ratatouille and the Incredibles are bad at the same time something about them doesn't really click with me either; on the subject of those two, I might prefer A Bug's Life to both although again I am not sure why.

    The Little Mermaid, while possibly the start of Disney's Golden Era, is only okay. The songs are good but it feels like Ariel didn't really grow as a character when she should've done, and that puts me off the film a bit.

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    I don't think Powerpuff girls 2016 is a massive trainwreck.

    Granted it's not good at all, but I don't feel it's as bad as people claim it to be.

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    IMO, a lot of the cartoons these days either have become super corporate or super hipster. I'm not saying things like this didn't exist before, but these are what's pretty much everything these days. They either try too hard to be different (Adventure Time) or they just pander (SpongeBob or the new PPG). It's not like I don't like some of these shows, it's just that I don't like them as much as what we used to have and this is definitely not the nostalgia talking. This is more so directed towards shows. In terms of movies, I can still rely on Disney or Pixar to make a quality film. I mean hell Zootopia has firmly established itself as my second favorite Disney movie and my favorite animated movie ever is actually made by Dreamworks (no, it's not Shrek). A lot of shows these days are just bland. There are a few "gems" though
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    Tiny Toons is not a great show, and the animation is too wonky for my tastes.
    Kids Next Door was not very good. The show tried to be two different types of shows.
    Frozen's "Let It Go" theme would have been good if it got rid of the chorus.
    Dumbo didn't age that well. It is not very memorable, except the pink elephants.
    South Park's "Chinpokomon" episode was dumb. I don't care if it's a Pokemon spoof, but it sucked as a parody.
    Batman: The Killing Joke was actually a good movie. The second half was great (not the best), but I also think the first part gets hated on a little too much.
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXD17 View Post
    IMO, a lot of the cartoons these days either have become super corporate
    True, especially if you look at Cartoon Network and what they're doing. Two examples being Young Justice (Cancelled because of poor toy sales) and Ben 10 turning to garbage (Omniverse was awful, and this reboot looks like the final nail in its coffin (for me at least)).

    Also can't forget about Nickelodeon who has moved away from Cartoons to live action shows (mainly sitcoms) because they're cheaper to make than animation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EvanUn0 View Post
    - Class of 3000 is a fantastic show, and it had no business being cancelled.
    I agree. I actually loved this show when I was younger and never understood why it disappeared.

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    The Chinpokomon episode made me laugh for odd gags (I admit Trey Parker's rip off of the original dub theme made me laugh) but the parody itself was a pretty predictable anime jab. South Park didn't get really clever with parodies and satire until about Season Five.

    I am also among those people who don't like Animaniacs. I mean I used to be fond of it and Pinky and the Brain has still aged well, but it and most of the other 90s WB cartoons now feel a bit too obnoxious and in your face meta for my tastes, and this is coming from a big fan of Looney Tunes.
    Last edited by DatsRight; 29th September 2016 at 3:36 PM.

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