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Thread: Battle For The Underground (709)

  1. #51
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    Does anyone know what was said between Zager and the trio at the end? A hint to the future may have been there.

    I'm very disappointed that the Nyagotiator arc, which had so much potential, worked out in an anticlimactic way that threw out most potential character development. They wasted all that potential on four poor fillers and "LOL I was lying" almost feels like a complete cop-out. What was the point of it all, to get him into the Poké Ball storage room? They've done that so effortlessly before that there was no need for it to be so complicated this time. I sincerely hope Ash is not stupid enough to ever fall for this again and the Nyagotiator thing becomes a bad memory.

    Jessie and James were pretty impressive, on the other hand. While they still could use their personalities and black uniforms back, this level of competence is what we should be seeing from them. Zager flying in and attempting to pick up the train right off the tracks with his helicopter was the exact moment he established himself as a truly threatening villain, and also provided an excellent climax to the episode. We need more like this, so I hope the Kami Trio plot ends up as exciting. I wouldn't mind a direct confrontation with Zager if Giovanni never returns.

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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sushi View Post
    Tepig has learned Flamethrower =)
    Praise the lord!I don't care how "unoriginal" or "boring" it is, I just wanted to see Tepig with a strong move. I was sick of Ember being spammed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elice_Carol View Post
    Pepsi, I can see you using my censor bypass! Why can't people get their own instead of taking my treasured fock?
    You're Irish, say 'Feck' :P

    I can't believe people are surprised Meowth was a traitor... Joe told as as soon as it was mentioned that Meowth said "leave it to me" or whatever it was, in that episode, and it should have been completely obvious really.
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  3. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    Does anyone know what was said between Zager and the trio at the end? A hint to the future may have been there.

    I'm very disappointed that the Nyagotiator arc, which had so much potential, worked out in an anticlimactic way that threw out most potential character development. They wasted all that potential on four poor fillers and "LOL I was lying" almost feels like a complete cop-out. What was the point of it all, to get him into the Poké Ball storage room? They've done that so effortlessly before that there was no need for it to be so complicated this time. I sincerely hope Ash is not stupid enough to ever fall for this again and the Nyagotiator thing becomes a bad memory.

    Jessie and James were pretty impressive, on the other hand. While they still could use their personalities and black uniforms back, this level of competence is what we should be seeing from them. Zager flying in and attempting to pick up the train right off the tracks with his helicopter was the exact moment he established himself as a truly threatening villain, and also provided an excellent climax to the episode. We need more like this, so I hope the Kami Trio plot ends up as exciting. I wouldn't mind a direct confrontation with Zager if Giovanni never returns.
    Yea and you want to know what the worst thing is? All of the Nyagotiator episodes were complete filler aside from the first. In each of those episodes, Meowth's role could have been filled with either a COD or POD and the end result would have been exactly the same. This entire thing just seems like it only existed to troll the new viewers who don't already know that any form of a TR splitting up plot goes nowhere. Heck we could have just skipped those episodes and we'd have reached Nimbasa City 4 weeks earlier. So in other words, this whole mini arc was entirely pointless because Ash will never learn that Meowth will never actually change no matter how nice they are to him.

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  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    What was the point of it all, to get him into the Poké Ball storage room? They've done that so effortlessly before that there was no need for it to be so complicated this time.
    No, it was to get Pikachu and the other of Ash's Pokemon into the room. It was all to capture them.

    Zager flying in and attempting to pick up the train right off the tracks with his helicopter was the exact moment he established himself as a truly threatening villain, and also provided an excellent climax to the episode.
    Yeah, I really loved how directly involved with the action Dr. Zager became. I expected him to just be sitting it out, controlling the event from behind the scenes, but no, he actually flew his damn helicopter in to partake in the chase. Very impressive.
    Last edited by AgentPierce; 16th September 2011 at 1:05 AM.

  5. #55
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    i would love for pikachu rage and hurt over meowth betrayal to be adressed later on in a future episode having pikachu snap next time he see him and ruthlessly attacking him over and over again but then again this is pokemon and the writers never allow the characters to keep any negative emotions for long look at ash he never stays angry nor was he outraged like pikachu was.

    look at castorm debut episode at an example team magma petty much won in that episode but instead of it ending dramatially like the did with the team galatic episode orb episode it ends with another stupid brock gang.

  6. #56
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    @Pokefan_2000 - I'm moderately sure Ash wasn't outraged because he either saw it coming or was amused by the whole thing. =p It is very typical Team Rocket.
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  7. #57
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    What was Ash saying to Meowth at the end? And why was he smiling?
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    Somehow, something in the back of my head told me Nyarsu was not really a good guy. It spoke even louder when I saw that he was trying to get alone in the telephone booth...

    WHY????!!!!

    I've never felt more betrayed by the writers than in these episodes! They are very good, though, to build the suspense up in a way that your mind isn't focused on the thought that Nyarsu is a double-crosser. He played his part well, and the writers did an excellent job.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manafi's Dream View Post
    Somehow, something in the back of my head told me Nyarsu was not really a good guy. It spoke even louder when I saw that he was trying to get alone in the telephone booth...

    WHY????!!!!

    I've never felt more betrayed by the writers than in these episodes! They are very good, though, to build the suspense up in a way that your mind isn't focused on the thought that Nyarsu is a double-crosser. He played his part well, and the writers did an excellent job.
    How? He was with them for four episodes.

    That was an extremely short time of traveling with them...

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    Quote Originally Posted by lolipiece View Post
    How? He was with them for four episodes.

    That was an extremely short time of traveling with them...
    4 episodes = 4 weeks = one month = long time to think of Nyarsu as a good guy, and the fact that they never showed even a hint as to Nyarsu's true intentions really made it feel like he was sincere. I was the last person to believe he was a double agent, because he sold himself very well.
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  11. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by Manafi's Dream View Post
    4 episodes = 4 weeks = one month = long time to think of Nyarsu as a good guy, and the fact that they never showed even a hint as to Nyarsu's true intentions really made it feel like he was sincere. I was the last person to believe he was a double agent, because he sold himself very well.
    I dunno, I was on the opposite end of the spectra here as I never believed Meowth for a second so I saw this coming from a mile away. I didn't know what the plan was, but I knew that he was only leading them on. After all, the writers have proven time and time again that they don't wander far from their safety zone and if they do, they rubber band right back into it soon enough. If this were any other anime, maybe it could be believable that Meowth could change sides, but in Pokemon Status Quo is Arceus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poke Master 7 View Post
    I dunno, I was on the opposite end of the spectra here as I never believed Meowth for a second so I saw this coming from a mile away. I didn't know what the plan was, but I knew that he was only leading them on. After all, the writers have proven time and time again that they don't wander far from their safety zone and if they do, they rubber band right back into it soon enough. If this were any other anime, maybe it could be believable that Meowth could change sides, but in Pokemon Status Quo is Arceus.
    Well, I guess you just have a better insight into Nyarsu's real character and the writers' true intentions. Nevertheless, they were very engaging episodes, and I honestly never suspected before today that Nyarsu hadn't really changed.
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  13. #63
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    P-P-P-P-PART 2!
    -We get a recap of everything we just learned. Yawn.
    -TR's sending out a ton of decoy trains. And one of them passes by Ash and Co shortly afterwards.
    -Meanwhile, Pikachu's trying to escape...but Iron Tail just isn't busting the door open.
    -The twerps discuss something, and...Dento seems to have realized something? Or he's just determined or something; I can't really tell.
    -Oh wait, now the Subway masters are talking about how TR's probably trying to escape to Anville Town. I have to admit, I'm impressed at how the writers actually managed to work that place into the anime.
    -Ash asks what Anville Town is, and Dento takes the opportunity to sparkle while getting excited about all the trains there.
    -...I just notice they're playing the credits theme from the games. AWESOME.
    -You know, I get the general idea of what's going on here, but...why did the Driftveil Drawbridge ever have to get raised? I mean, what does that have to do with anything other than giving the writers an excuse to lower the drawbridge later?
    -Back with Pikachu and Axew...awww, poor Axew is bawling its eyes out. But Pikachu notices a certain Pokeball...it's Snivy! How the hell Pikachu could tell that Pokeball apart from the rest is a mystery to me.
    -And now Snivy just so happens to pick Excadrill's Pokeball out of a huge pile of them without even looking at the balls? Either Pokemon are really damned good at telling where their friend's Pokeballs are, or...you know what, I'm not even going to try to logic this one out.
    -That's one strong door! TR has learned much since becoming serious villains.
    -Pansage is out now too! ...but it can't open the door either. Nor can Excadrill.
    -Pikachu has a crayon-illustrated brainstorm session to figure out who can help. Not Oshawott...not Scraggy...not Tepig...but wait! Dwebble can shoot stuff that can cut through rock! Perhaps THAT will work on the door?
    -Back with the twerps...an Eelektross-powered car approaches them with the subway twins in tow!
    -Meanwhile, the Pokemon have broken down the door! Horray! And now Meowth spotted them! Horray?
    -The TR train has left the subway!
    -Meowth appears to be mocking Pikachu and co by saying they can't get off the train while it's moving this fast. Pikachu is just pissed
    -Hey, it's Roggenrola! About time it actually appeared(the episode after its capture doesn't count ).
    -All the Pokemon are bright enough to start attacking the link between the train cars. That...really seems like something Meowth should have thought of.
    -Oh, and there's Meowth just in time to go OHSHI-
    -Seger, is it really necessary to wear a lab coat while piloting a helicopter?
    -The Pokemon manage to switch tracks, and TR gives chase! Meanwhile, Ash and co have almost caught up with them!
    -The twerps are running out of time, so Ingo sends out...Chandelure! It helpfully lifts Ash, Dento, and Iris over to the Pokemon's train car.
    -Ash has Roggenrola use Luster Cannon and Tepig user Ember...to boost their train's speed! And Axew joins in with Dragon Rage! I have to admit, I was expecting more blasting off TR and less running away. Not that this is a bad thing!
    -Unfortunately for them, it's hard to outrun a helicopter. Now what?
    -Oh, NOW Ash has his Pokemon attack the helicopter.
    -The TR train is catching up, though. But this prompts Tepig to learn Flamethrower! Finally, a respectable fire attack for it.
    -And Chandelure gets the honors of wrecking TR's train.
    -...is Ash trying to win Meowth back over to their side? Oh, Ash.
    -Jesus, Pikachu is angry. I guess it's nice to see it have a personality for the first time since Kanto?
    -But even though TR got away, the day is saved, and the twerps ended up in Anville Town...and Dento is, of course, spazzing out over MORE TRAINS. Remember when he was supposed to be the mature one?


    Not as much to comment on here, even though more happened in this half. Maybe I just suck at having opinions on action-packed scenes. I will say I liked the focus on Pikachu - as much as people complain about it getting focus at times, I think it's nice that it got focus since it had a personality for once. Seeing Pikachu do something other than sit on Ash's shoulder and fire off electricity when he tells it to is pretty damned refreshing.
    Also, I can finally keep the Subway Master's names straight. And it only took me several months after their English names were revealed!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juputoru View Post
    P-P-P-P-PART 2!
    -We get a recap of everything we just learned. Yawn.
    -TR's sending out a ton of decoy trains. And one of them passes by Ash and Co shortly afterwards.
    -Meanwhile, Pikachu's trying to escape...but Iron Tail just isn't busting the door open.
    -The twerps discuss something, and...Dento seems to have realized something? Or he's just determined or something; I can't really tell.
    -Oh wait, now the Subway masters are talking about how TR's probably trying to escape to Anville Town. I have to admit, I'm impressed at how the writers actually managed to work that place into the anime.
    -Ash asks what Anville Town is, and Dento takes the opportunity to sparkle while getting excited about all the trains there.
    -...I just notice they're playing the credits theme from the games. AWESOME.
    -You know, I get the general idea of what's going on here, but...why did the Driftveil Drawbridge ever have to get raised? I mean, what does that have to do with anything other than giving the writers an excuse to lower the drawbridge later?
    -Back with Pikachu and Axew...awww, poor Axew is bawling its eyes out. But Pikachu notices a certain Pokeball...it's Snivy! How the hell Pikachu could tell that Pokeball apart from the rest is a mystery to me.
    -And now Snivy just so happens to pick Excadrill's Pokeball out of a huge pile of them without even looking at the balls? Either Pokemon are really damned good at telling where their friend's Pokeballs are, or...you know what, I'm not even going to try to logic this one out.
    -That's one strong door! TR has learned much since becoming serious villains.
    -Pansage is out now too! ...but it can't open the door either. Nor can Excadrill.
    -Pikachu has a crayon-illustrated brainstorm session to figure out who can help. Not Oshawott...not Scraggy...not Tepig...but wait! Dwebble can shoot stuff that can cut through rock! Perhaps THAT will work on the door?
    -Back with the twerps...an Eelektross-powered car approaches them with the subway twins in tow!
    -Meanwhile, the Pokemon have broken down the door! Horray! And now Meowth spotted them! Horray?
    -The TR train has left the subway!
    -Meowth appears to be mocking Pikachu and co by saying they can't get off the train while it's moving this fast. Pikachu is just pissed
    -Hey, it's Roggenrola! About time it actually appeared(the episode after its capture doesn't count ).
    -All the Pokemon are bright enough to start attacking the link between the train cars. That...really seems like something Meowth should have thought of.
    -Oh, and there's Meowth just in time to go OHSHI-
    -Seger, is it really necessary to wear a lab coat while piloting a helicopter?
    -The Pokemon manage to switch tracks, and TR gives chase! Meanwhile, Ash and co have almost caught up with them!
    -The twerps are running out of time, so Ingo sends out...Chandelure! It helpfully lifts Ash, Dento, and Iris over to the Pokemon's train car.
    -Ash has Roggenrola use Luster Cannon and Tepig user Ember...to boost their train's speed! And Axew joins in with Dragon Rage! I have to admit, I was expecting more blasting off TR and less running away. Not that this is a bad thing!
    -Unfortunately for them, it's hard to outrun a helicopter. Now what?
    -Oh, NOW Ash has his Pokemon attack the helicopter.
    -The TR train is catching up, though. But this prompts Tepig to learn Flamethrower! Finally, a respectable fire attack for it.
    -And Chandelure gets the honors of wrecking TR's train.
    -...is Ash trying to win Meowth back over to their side? Oh, Ash.
    -Jesus, Pikachu is angry. I guess it's nice to see it have a personality for the first time since Kanto?
    -But even though TR got away, the day is saved, and the twerps ended up in Anville Town...and Dento is, of course, spazzing out over MORE TRAINS. Remember when he was supposed to be the mature one?


    Not as much to comment on here, even though more happened in this half. Maybe I just suck at having opinions on action-packed scenes. I will say I liked the focus on Pikachu - as much as people complain about it getting focus at times, I think it's nice that it got focus since it had a personality for once. Seeing Pikachu do something other than sit on Ash's shoulder and fire off electricity when he tells it to is pretty damned refreshing.
    Also, I can finally keep the Subway Master's names straight. And it only took me several months after their English names were revealed!
    you forgot to mention the part after pikachu first sees meowth and when meowth leaves, for a second he looks like he is showing a bit of remorse. (im surprised nobody mentioned this)
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    Part 2 was much more entertaining then Part 1 with Pikachu interacting with just some of the from Ash and co. and his exchange with Meowth was so emotion with Pikachu's rage after breaking the door and after TR escape plus that few second pause Meowth had after he closed the door that the next time its just them should be interesting to watch alone. Anyway happy Tepig learn Flamethower not that original but big improvement over Ember and also nice they work Anville Town in I wonder how that was going to appear in the anime but great episode over all.
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    Meowth shows remorse a few times, mostly at the end you can see he feels bad. I have a feeling in the later episodes, Ash will win Meowth over again some how, probaly by saving his life. I think I loved part 2 ten times better than the first part but over all these episodes were epic! Pikachu showed some major character moments, he was almost like a leader. I hope Pikachu and Meowth have a bit of tension whenever he comes back, which I hope is some time soon. I also hope again Ash trys get him on there side still too. Really loved the ending between Ash and Meowth, hope that was foreshadowing.

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    Wait I am confused, how can Dwebble's rock glue cut through a boor like a flame? I thought he used his Claws to cut the rock and the glue to repair it? Tepigs new Flamethrower should have been the key here. Oh well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MechaBulba View Post
    Wait I am confused, how can Dwebble's rock glue cut through a boor like a flame? I thought he used his Claws to cut the rock and the glue to repair it?
    It can do both, apparently. In its debut episode, we saw it shooting liquid that serves to make rocks easier to carve (probably a corrosive substance), but later, two other Dwebble used glue to stick two rock dwellings together.

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    Meowth shows remorse a few times, mostly at the end you can see he feels bad. I have a feeling in the later episodes, Ash will win Meowth over again some how, probaly by saving his life.
    Meowth showed some signs of guilt twice; one when he hangs his head and sighs after he was done confronting Pikachu and then towards the end when Ash was nice to him. But guilt isn't always the same as remorse; I don't think he'll have any long lasting regrets over this whole thing. And the problem with the scenario you mentioned is that no one in Ash's group is going to trust Meowth again after this, even if Meowth is sincere the next time. Like it or not, he's a bad guy and is with Team Rocket for good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AgentPierce View Post
    Meowth showed some signs of guilt twice; one when he hangs his head and sighs after he was done confronting Pikachu and then towards the end when Ash was nice to him. But guilt isn't always the same as remorse; I don't think he'll have any long lasting regrets over this whole thing. And the problem with the scenario you mentioned is that no one in Ash's group is going to trust Meowth again after this, even if Meowth is sincere the next time. Like it or not, he's a bad guy and is with Team Rocket for good.
    I don't know, Ash seems like the one to always see some good in Meowth like when he smiled at Meowth upon seeing him with the rockets.

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    I don't know, Ash seems like the one to always see some good in Meowth like when he smiled at Meowth upon seeing him with the rockets.
    The problem would be with Iris, Cilan, and all the pokemon, especially Pikachu. Meowth would have to TRY to win them over again and they'd all think it was part of a plan to screw them over. Meowth would have to do some really big stuff to prove he's really reformed and personally, I just can't see Meowth going through that sort of "Prince Zuko" character arc. It's much easier for him to be bad. So I hope they never touch upon it and Meowth just continues to do what he has to do with Team Rocket.

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    I don't know if I liked this episode. I thought that things were pretty tame for the most part, although I guess it's my own fault for expecting things to be totally exciting. I'm still not sure why the writers decided to have Team Rocket steal some Pokemon as part of their plan; the way things were going, it seemed like their plan involved something a little more complicated. Anyway, I liked that the Pokemon worked together, but I'm upset that Tepig learned a new move while Oshawott was nowhere to be found. I'm glad that Eelektross and Chandelure debuted here, and overall, I'm happy that things ended on a high note. 6/10.

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    I must say I liked this second part better.

    This episode was the more exciting of the two. For all the hoopla about Rocketto Dan's big plan with the Subway lines, all it was was an overly complicated(unnecesarily) plan to steal a bunch of pokeballs. I guess after the TP teasers back in Hiun city any other plots fall short.

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    I still dont get the logic of Team Rocket trying to steal very common pokemons.
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    Probably so they can get some Unova Pokémon so they can go on scouting missions with and not draw too much attention to themselves with foreign Pokémon if they are challenged to a battle by a passing trainer who spots them as trainers. They (the normal grunts, not JJ&M) will probably infiltrate as regular Unova Pokémon trainers going on their journeys so they'll want to have Unova Pokémon so as to remain as inconspicuous as possible. That way, they can identify important landmarks and areas without drawing a lot of attention to themselves from the Unova League, Police, and Team Plasma. And should they encounter Team Plasma and get into a fight with them, they'll be able to get a good idea of how strong the Plasma grunts, possibly the leaders, too, if they're lucky, are without revealing themselves as members of Team Rocket.
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