Enter Elesa, Electrifying Gym Leader! (710

[Pepsi_Plunge]

We don't know that. For all we know, Darmanitan could have been new. So with the plot of the episode, Ash really should have won. A draw would've been nice at least, but nooooo.

Problem is even if we don't know that, the dude got in a freakin adventurer outfit just for the battle, he liked to battle too aka he has experience and due to adventurer outfit we can assume that.

We are in the 4th gym, Oshawott is not a beast yet to beat an evolved pokemon, that even though he had type advantage was probably a lot stronger then him.

He changed his opinion by seeing the pashion her daughter and Satoshi have for being trainers, that was a much better ending writing wise then him just winning and him changing his opinion, OK you won she stays...

That is about as bad as people who suggest when Pikachu finally beats Krokorok if it doesn't have an owner the thing should just walk away.

[playerking]

Problem is even if we don't know that, the dude got in a freakin adventurer outfit just for the battle, he liked to battle too aka he has experience and due to adventurer outfit we can assume that.

We are in the 4th gym, Oshawott is not a beast yet to beat an evolved pokemon, that even though he had type advantage was probably a lot stronger then him.

He changed his opinion by seeing the pashion her daughter and Satoshi have for being trainers, that was a much better ending writing wise then him just winning and him changing his opinion, OK you won she stays...

So, his love for battles could be recent, plus Oshawott is strong, it could of taken out and evolved Pokemon. It's not like evolved Pokemon are the strongest of the strong, they could still be weak for all we know.

And since it was because Bianca's father noticed that, even though he should already know that since Bianca already beat 2/3(?) gyms already and she has 3 Pokemon. It was obvious Bianca wanted to be a trainer. Also, what's the point of the battle and Ash loss, if, Bianca's dad only got convinced in a couple of minutes of more convincing. Plus I think Oshawott deserved another win.

Also, Ash put himself going back to Pallet town on the line. So I think he should have won.

[Pepsi_Plunge]

That is a long stretch while what I say is plausible and reasonable, problem is its diferent to beat a wild Scraft or Mandibuzz, instead of a trainer Darmanitan, even though you wanted it to win like it or not it wasn't a BS loss and is acceptable.

He knew that but he didn't accept it, till he saw it with his own eyes...that happens in so many animes, we see villans and even masters respecting their student/enemy wtv due to their pashion.

Unless you go get your examples in Bleach or Fairy Tail which are a river ********.

[shac]

I don't think a single attack has been spammed like that in an episode ever. When even Darmantian fired up for flame-charge, I was like WTH??

[Pepsi_Plunge]

Lool yeah, I was like another Flamecharge XD, I guess its their family "special" attack or something.

[dman_dustin]

No that is just for you taste from a writing perspective it wasn't a bad episode, I think Pignite should have won/draw and that was their only error imo, the rest was acceptable and understandable.

The happy ending was part of the development and was pretty good.

No it wasn't, let's just go through what happened.

Bianca and Ash want to challenge gym leader- Okay

Ash and Co, and Bianca run into her father- Okay

Bianca's Dad wants Bianca to come home- Okay

Bianca says that if she beats Elesa she can do what she wants and if she loses she'll come with him and apparently stop being a trainer- Okay

Bianca not beating a single Pokemon of Elesa's- NOT OKAY AT ALL, next episode as we know Palpitoad beats Zebstrika, how in the hell is Palpitoad stronger than the Zebra that didn't even take hardly any damage at all from Bianca's Pokemon and curbstomped her into oblivion? Unless the condition was she just HAD to beat ONE single Pokemon of Elesa's it was completely unacceptable. They could've easily had Pignite beat or even TIE with Zebstrika, and if Pignite one, could've been one shotted from Emolga's aerial ace or other possible flying moves. Moving on.....

Before Bianca and her father leave, Cilan wants to make them lunch- Okay

Iris somehow convinces Ash to be a nice guy and fight for Bianca- Okay

Ash takes the chance of him losing that he would be sent back to Pallet Town, and if he won Bianca can do what she wants- Okay

Oshawott sending itself out to fight- Was okay, until the outcome and Oshawott has only itself to blame

Ash being completely obliterated, not finding very many openings- Not Okay

Ash seemingly getting his groove back and losing- Not Okay At All.

Because of the whole friendship spiel, Bianca's dad decides to let Ash off the hook and let's his daughter do what she wants- What the hell were they thinking? I mean my goodness, was the Friendship Spiel THAT important that both Bianca and Ash had to lose without actually even having a chanve.

Like I said the odds were way too stacked against Bianca and Ash, it wasn't even realistic, in any way shape or form. I mean where's the struggle, where's the "OH is he going to do it, or isn't he?" But no, apparently Bianca's dad is some Elite Four member of some region we haven't heard of. And Bianca's skill as a trainer, is the equivalent to a Sunkern that only knows splash.

Bianca and Ash had absolutely no shot at winning their matches, in any way shape or form. And apparently friendship spiel is far more important than someone's life. Because they just took Ash's and Bianca's life goals and shoved it up their rear ends, and the only resolution that came from this episode, was because of all the good things they remembered being together.

Thank you Pokemon, you just implied to many children that they can't help friends when their in trouble with their own skills and talents but don't worry if you reminisce about it, the problem magically goes away.
-------

Oh but then again this a cartoon. The cartoon some times do have not very good messages. How many times have I seen, someone's life close to being flushed down the toilet, only for some aspect of the whole situation, somehow making the "Villain" be a nice guy and just say figuratively "Just Kidding" with a punch to the arm. Were are the jerk people, who no matter what happens, takes the ultimatum to heart?

[Pepsi_Plunge]

Haha that is the moral you took from the episode? well its explained then .

On another note, you need to link me to your fanfiction dman, you said you were writing one if you can link me to it, I would appreciate(if you are posting it online).

[playerking]

That is a long stretch while what I say is plausible and reasonable, problem is its diferent to beat a wild Scraft or Mandibuzz, instead of a trainer Darmanitan, even though you wanted it to win like it or not it wasn't a BS loss and is acceptable.

He knew that but he didn't accept it, till he saw it with his own eyes...that happens in so many animes, we see villans and even masters respecting their student/enemy wtv due to their pashion.

Unless you go get your examples in Bleach or Fairy Tail which are a river ********.

Yes but, wild Pokemon could be as strong as trained Pokemon, because as I said, we don't know how long Bianca's Dad has had Darmanitan for. But for Bianca and Ash to lose, even under the circumstance, then yeah, I think Oshawott losing was unnecessary.

Yes but that's Bianca's dad's fault. He should know that after she won gym battles, and after she battled Elesa, that she liked being a trainer. Then all it took would be Ash beating Bianca's Dad, yet Ash still lost and Bianca's dad changed his mine in a matter of minutes.

[Pepsi_Plunge]

Bottom line is I said this before, people can dislike some decision, I disliked Pignite losing but we can't deem that as bad writing(I know you didn't say that).

[dman_dustin]

.
On another note, you need to link me to your fanfiction dman, you said you were writing one if you can link me to it, I would appreciate(if you are posting it online).

The fanfiction that I reference from time to time, is my own personal fan fiction.

I don't really think I'll be posting it ever online, I might, but I still have to finish Hoenn (Already did Sinnoh), start and finish Johto, start and finish Kanto, Start and finish a filler saga, start and finish Unova (which is where it will end). Yeah, it's not going to be on the internet any time soon, especially since I have to edit it and fix storylines, make it more cohesive and better written.

Blah, Blah, Blah.
-----------------

Anyway:

I disliked Pignite losing but we can't deem that as bad writing

Why can't we? Even though our opinions might mean jack squat in the end, we can still call it bad writing from an opinion perspective.

I mean how many critics tell you such and such movie sucked, or the movie rocked their socks off, and how many put stock in their word and watch or avoid depending on their reviews.

Likewise with songs, games, and other media formats, the only one who can determine if it's any good or not is the person who watches, reads, or listens to it.

Now okay, if by "Bad Writing" you mean some English (I have no idea what the equivalent to English class is in other countries) Teacher would give you an F, or D because of this story. Okay, fine, I'm sure some scholar out there would find this story to be decent.

But from a child's point of view, or a viewer's point of view, it was pretty bad writing, simply because basically all your hopes and dreams nearly went down the toilet, only for it to be magically be resolved because of memories of friendship. Hell if it was me, and I made some ultimatum like that. I would keep to the ultimatum, even if I didn't have to. I put my life goals on the line, I lost, I should accept the consequences.

That's why it's bad writing, because Ash risked everything and he lost. It doesn't matter if he got to stay in the end, or Bianca got to do what she want, that's completely moot.

The point is Ash didn't have to risk everything for Bianca, but he risked everything because he believed Bianca should make a life choice herself, not her father. Yes maybe her father wanted what's best for her, blah, blah, blah, but it's not like Bianca was doing something destructive, obviously judging by how apparently good Bianca's father was.

So Ash risked everything, his hopes and dreams, on the idea that Bianca should do what she wants, and her father should just accept her for who she is. And he lost. Now, granted, some countries have some culture thing attached where you can dishonor your family by choosing to do something your "father" doesn't want you to do. But put cultures aside, and go for the most basic human factor here.

I just hate seeing all those times where Heroes succeeded because they believed in themselves and people believed in them only to be contradicted by some honor rule saying that "Your Father has the final say in the matter."

[Dephender]

It's time for the incorrectly translated episode!

At least whomever translated this knew enough grammar to know that "charisma" is not an adjective :P

(also, I'm ncredibly happy d-man dustin isn't writing this show)

[dman_dustin]

At least whomever translated this knew enough grammar to know that "charisma" is not an adjective :P

(also, I'm ncredibly happy d-man dustin isn't writing this show)

Oh yes because having a character risk everything for his friend, and actually succeeding is such horrible writing.

My goodness, yes, let's not have Ash win at gym battles, or any battles, because succeeding is bad writing.

Oh and yes it's completely good writing to continuously show how incompetent Bianca is as a trainer. Who gave her two badges that she somehow got with just Bianca? Erika because Bianca saved her Gloom and Erika Clone 2 for saving her Gloom Clone 2.

Oh and further into this bashing of me. Yes it would be completely bad writing, and so horrible to give Pokemon actual screen time. Roggenrola being used to battle instead of Pikachu or Oshawott, blasphemy! Slay the horrible non greedy jerk who wouldn't write Pokemon just to make some cash for the franchise. And wouldn't make Pokemon A be more important than Pokemon Z.

Edit:

Oh but wait this isn't about how horrible of a person I am. No, no, it's about Bianca vs Elesa and losing, and Ash vs Bianca's dad and losing.

If only I could find some nice thing to say about this episode. Oh right.....Bianca finally has a third Pokemon. Finally. After like 30 episodes.

[Almighty Zard]

am i the only one who thinks that Oshawott losing is acceptable? I mean when was the last time the thing LOST a fight--; Lenora round 1? if so then I don't mind the loss at all.

Now Bianca being curbstomped by Zebrastrika...Shelmet obviously wasn't a good choice, and you think she would've learned from the Don Tournament that her mouse isn't good against them either.

So in a way it was a one against one, and Zebrastrika just came out the victor.

[pokefandt]

am i the only one who thinks that Oshawott losing is acceptable? I mean when was the last time the thing LOST a fight--; Lenora round 1? if so then I don't mind the loss at all.

Now Bianca being curbstomped by Zebrastrika...Shelmet obviously wasn't a good choice, and you think she would've learned from the Don Tournament that her mouse isn't good against them either.

So in a way it was a one against one, and Zebrastrika just came out the victor.

He lost to Roggenrola in episode 37, if that counts. Meh I don't mind the loss either. It's usually pikachu getting ko'd or getting knocked around by the one shot opponent of the day.

Bianca needs some serious training BADLY is all I'm going to say on the matter.

[Pepsi_Plunge]

am i the only one who thinks that Oshawott losing is acceptable? I mean when was the last time the thing LOST a fight--; Lenora round 1? if so then I don't mind the loss at all.

Now Bianca being curbstomped by Zebrastrika...Shelmet obviously wasn't a good choice, and you think she would've learned from the Don Tournament that her mouse isn't good against them either.

So in a way it was a one against one, and Zebrastrika just came out the victor.

I said it was also, I though he would lose since I saw the preview unless the guy fightning him was just a random dood.

[Poke Master 7]

So both Bel and Ash get destroyed in their respective battles after they make a bet against Bel's father. Was there some kind of moral of don't bet because the house always wins kind of deal going on here or what?

[j_gamez]

am i the only one who thinks that Oshawott losing is acceptable?

nope. after darmanitan use flame charge and fire punch (i think thats what he use) i dont see how will oshawott win.

the only thing im not okay with is elesa and bianca battle
the battle is short and a boring battle
saw the zebra sweep coming but they should at least make an epic ending for that poor pig.
if only bianca have some extra training.....

[RandomOne]

They made Bianca a super noob! How is Pignite losing to Zebstrika when it has beaten every gym so far by himself? And he is well-known for his strength. Episode later, Palpitoad beats Zebstrika (Yay!) without Pikachu \ Snivy, so... what's up?

[Almighty Zard]

They made Bianca a super noob! How is Pignite losing to Zebstrika when it has beaten every gym so far by himself? And he is well-known for his strength. Episode later, Palpitoad beats Zebstrika (Yay!) without Pikachu \ Snivy, so... what's up?

type and move advantage obviously.

She can't win every battle with Pignite alone, maybe this was to show us that she's going to step up her game hopefully and give her other pokemon training as well.

[Pepsi_Plunge]

They made Bianca a super noob! How is Pignite losing to Zebstrika when it has beaten every gym so far by himself? And he is well-known for his strength. Episode later, Palpitoad beats Zebstrika (Yay!) without Pikachu \ Snivy, so... what's up?

What is up is that Satoshi is better then her.

[fishyfool]

If it's any compensation, Water/Ground sponges everything Zebstrika can chuck at Palpitoad.

[Rizardon]

It always amuses me how seriously you people take Pokemon.

It's a kids' show, come on. What kind of development are you expecting?

[Durian Seed]

What is up is that Satoshi is better then her.

Which will make it that much worse if she ever beats him in the ISshu league, as it was confirmed by Bel, in this episode, her goal/dream is to win the league.

[AuraChannelerChris]

They should've made Bianca's dad a quirky trainer in the game. Fits well with her clumsy daughter.

[ShinyCharyZard]

They should've made this the two parter instead of the Subway rubbish.. or it could've even been a three parter/mini arc.

This is because I would've loved to see Ash actually stick to his word and go home after losing the battle. Then the story could've continued from there, with Bianca's father realising the friendship thing and travelling to Pallet along with Bianca, Cilan and Iris to retrieve Ash.

Enter the Sinnoh team, to show the Unova crew how it's done.

Ah, sometimes I really do wish I could write an episode or two..