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Thread: Things you hate and/or would like authors to avoid

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    Default Things you hate and/or would like authors to avoid

    Let's say you are reading a fanfic. It starts more or less nicely, and has some things that you say "Hey, this might be interesting".

    And suddenly something happend, let it be shipping, fakémon or the extreme use of Legendaries. Maybe the author killed some character you love for no reason?

    In short, what things do you hate on stories or fics?


    The thing I can't really stand about Pokémon fics is, for example, the humanization of all Pokémon. While I do accept Pokémon having feelings, and being intelligent and capable of comunication between them, I don't like fics that are based on a shipping, for example, between two Pokémon. Might be because
    I haven't played the Mystery Dungeons games, in which apparently Pokémon are just like people, but it just isn't my pice of cake.

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    subtlety is a great tool for story telling, yet often undervalued.
    what's left unsaid can be more engaging than having everything explained, keeps the reader invested in finding out more, with a tiny tease without revealing too much.

    pacing is also something to really keep in mind when writing. there's no need to rush interesting character development, interactions, or plot points. while spending too long on less interesting or less integral parts of a story can cause the reader to lose interest.
    should choose whether a story will be an immersive journey for the reader or maybe a tense race full of interesting action and wild developments

    power creep is something usually found in manga/anime but can be found in fan writing often times. there's almost no need to have legends, gods, etc thrown into a story too early, it's usually excessive and can really ruin an otherwise great writing.
    sometimes ridiculous over the top works are good too :P

    detail and immersion in a story is another hangup i tend to have with some community created content. devoting half a chapter explaining something that can be summed up in a few sentences can make the reading tedious and unrewarding.
    engaging the readers imagination is half the fun. give the reader the basic structure with a bit of a creative seed to spur on their senses and let them imagine the sights and smells of the forest/sea/mountain or w/e

    could give a thousand irks about fan writing but i think these are the main ones i have problem with
    at any rate just keep writing, bad or good it's nice to have people making an effort to write and make a more immersive universe for others to enjoy
    beast

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    Personally, I think that just about anything has the potential be done well. As a result, I don't really hate anything in particular, simply because I don't think it's fair to make a blanket statement and claim that "it's impossible to do x well/in a way that I like." With the right skill level, experience or effort, anything can be made enjoyable, imo.

    The things that generally irk me are a lack of proofreading, a lack of research, or insensitivity towards difficult subjects. I also don't like fics that are dark or "mature" just for the sake of trying to seem edgy. I also can't get into comedy that relies on randomness to be funny. That said, to me those are more marks of a lack of skill and maturity, to be honest. I also just don't like to read fics about Ash or any of the main characters from the animé, but that's just personal preference.

    Again, I really do feel that just about anything can be pulled off, it just takes the right author/skill level. :>

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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychic View Post
    Personally, I think that just about anything has the potential be done well. As a result, I don't really hate anything in particular, simply because I don't think it's fair to make a blanket statement and claim that "it's impossible to do x well/in a way that I like." With the right skill level, experience or effort, anything can be made enjoyable, imo.

    The things that generally irk me are a lack of proofreading, a lack of research, or insensitivity towards difficult subjects. I also don't like fics that are dark or "mature" just for the sake of trying to seem edgy. I also can't get into comedy that relies on randomness to be funny. That said, to me those are more marks of a lack of skill and maturity, to be honest. I also just don't like to read fics about Ash or any of the main characters from the animé, but that's just personal preference.

    Again, I really do feel that just about anything can be pulled off, it just takes the right author/skill level. :>

    ~Psychic
    I completely agree on that: anything can be done well. But some things require more...skill, or love, however you want to put it.

    About the dark themes: it depends on the intention of the author as well, whether the author wants to make the reader feel something intense or do an actual realistic world, in which there are both good and bad things happening everyday.

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    I hate when people don't do their research or think about the characters. Especially when it comes to the bad guys--give us their characters, not just evil for evil's sake!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackjack Gabbiani View Post
    I hate when people don't do their research or think about the characters. Especially when it comes to the bad guys--give us their characters, not just evil for evil's sake!
    Honestly, I have to ask: what do you mean by "for evil's sake"? Does it just simply mean they're aware they are the bad guy in a story who has to be defeated, so they just do evil because why not?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    Honestly, I have to ask: what do you mean by "for evil's sake"? Does it just simply mean they're aware they are the bad guy in a story who has to be defeated, so they just do evil because why not?
    Evil for no reason.
    Evil without motive.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegagoldfish View Post
    Evil for no reason.
    Evil without motive.
    This. Being evil just for the sake of being evil is boring. I prefer gray characters, or bad characters you can actually empathize with. They should have their reasons to do what they do, and not a boring "I want to conquer the world"

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    I dunno, I don't mind seeing someone being evil just because they want to. Reminds me of a one-off villain from New Cutie Honey whose only response to when someone asked for their motivation was, "Fuck you. That's my motivation. I make gang members fight to the death, and I got scantily-clad women to serve me drinks while I watch. Why wouldn't I be doing this?" Then again, the OVA series is tongue-in-cheek in nature anyway, so it got away with this because it knows it's not serious.

    To answer the OP's questions on-topic, I recently realized this while reading a Pokémon fan fic on FFN. Now, I have some issues when it comes to the romance genre--it's nothing new, I've had issues with it for half a decade at this point. I just don't want to take up space complaining about everything I don't like about it, so I'm going to put down the one thing about that particular fan fic that bothered me the most:

    The story's universe got two characters to be a couple. Labeled as a rom-com, some silly bullshit does happen (actually, "bullshit" is too harsh of a word, the silly moments actually weren't that bad), plus some drama here and there in attempt for some bonding between Characters A and B. Characters C-through-Z tell Character A (and by extension, us as the audience) that he has feelings for Character B even though we don't see that progression between A and B (at least not onscreen). Meanwhile, throughout the entire story, Character A gets all of the character development while Character B stays virtually the same from day one. And neither of them know why it is they love each other, if they do.

    So why should I care about these two characters coming together in the end? Just because the story tells us instead of showing us? I understand if the story is basically the one character's story, like CLANNAD is Tomoya Okazaki's story. However, he shares it with multiple people, particularly with Nagisa Furukawa. We may not always follow her around, but we see character development with her alongside Tomoya, and because of that, we can see at the very end of the series that they're two very different people from when they were shown in the beginning.

    Point I'm trying to make is that if there's going to be romance in the story, show progression with both characters even if we only have one protagonist we follow the whole time. I don't just want to see The Protagonist grow as a character, I also want to see his/her Significant Other grow as well. I want them both to share hardships while having their own personal hardships. And I don't want supporting characters telling The Protagonist that he/she has feelings for Significant Other, let them figure that out on their own, and let that kind of discussion come naturally and act as support rather than trying to be matchmakers. Don't tell them that they're happy, ask what makes them happy.

    I hate it when authors don't let their characters just be characters. I don't expect them to be like real people, but they shouldn't be so flat and have a flat romance. Having two two-dimensional characters in a relationship doesn't make them three-dimensional.

    I'm going to be calling myself "Grumpy/Disgruntled Old Maid" if this keeps up.
    Last edited by Kutie Pie; 22nd January 2016 at 9:33 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yagami Kyo View Post
    This. Being evil just for the sake of being evil is boring. I prefer gray characters, or bad characters you can actually empathize with. They should have their reasons to do what they do, and not a boring "I want to conquer the world"
    Same here, I personally hate characters with dull motives or goals, be they pro-or antagonists.

    "Take over the world" and "Stop (Villain) from (Take over area)!" Are the most boring.

    Things like "End all wars, by killing everyone" and "Stop (Villain) because I will probably be famous for it" are better.
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    Has unnecessary lemons been mentioned yet?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yagami Kyo View Post
    This. Being evil just for the sake of being evil is boring. I prefer gray characters, or bad characters you can actually empathize with. They should have their reasons to do what they do, and not a boring "I want to conquer the world"
    Yeah, basically. That's why I didn't like Ghetsis. But if someone was to write him, I'd expect more of his character than just that aspect. If someone IS a boring one dimensional villain, then at least fill them out with something else (does he like to read? What's his daily routine? Does he like music? What was his education like? His relationships with the other Sages? And so on).
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    No, but it bears mentioning, although I haven't run into it often.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    Has unnecessary lemons been mentioned yet?
    Well it depends on what you mean by that. If you're talking about "reading a story that's labeled as a lemon but it still has plot so you don't reach the sex scene until later into the story", that's not exactly unnecessary. If you're talking about "reading a story and suddenly--BAM! sex that will never be followed up on again!", then yeah, it just comes off as something that the author wanted to throw in for the sake of throwing it in. Why, though, seems to vary, and I don't know how many of those reasons are "legit"--although I wouldn't question "I just wanted to get my jollies somehow".

    When it comes to fan fiction, those are usually labeled as such, so I haven't really had that experience where I'm reading something that's basically "T" or lower when all of a sudden I'm reading about characters getting naked and jumping in bed together. It's also something I haven't also run into in published books, movies, or other forms of entertainment, either (since I check sources for those sorts of things so I know what I'm getting into), so I'm sure the experience is different between them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kutie Pie View Post
    Well it depends on what you mean by that. If you're talking about "reading a story that's labeled as a lemon but it still has plot so you don't reach the sex scene until later into the story", that's not exactly unnecessary. If you're talking about "reading a story and suddenly--BAM! sex that will never be followed up on again!", then yeah, it just comes off as something that the author wanted to throw in for the sake of throwing it in. Why, though, seems to vary, and I don't know how many of those reasons are "legit"--although I wouldn't question "I just wanted to get my jollies somehow".

    When it comes to fan fiction, those are usually labeled as such, so I haven't really had that experience where I'm reading something that's basically "T" or lower when all of a sudden I'm reading about characters getting naked and jumping in bed together. It's also something I haven't also run into in published books, movies, or other forms of entertainment, either (since I check sources for those sorts of things so I know what I'm getting into), so I'm sure the experience is different between them.
    Yeah, I was referring to the later where the plot is basically, "Look at these two characters who aren't canonically in love with each other- NOW WATCH THEM HAVE MAD SEX WITH EACH OTHER!1!!!1"

    The only story I've actually "read" with lemons was "My Immortal", and boy howdy, were those lemons rotten. It pretty much made me hate all lemons for some reason.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    The only story I've actually "read" with lemons was "My Immortal", and boy howdy, were those lemons rotten. It pretty much made me hate all lemons for some reason.
    Lol "My Immortal" is such a special case that I think having all of the poorly-written sex just adds to its narm charm. It kind of helps that nobody knows for certain whether the fic was legit or was a troll fic (and surprise sex is pretty common in troll fics, but that's neither here nor there). At the very least, "My Immortal" didn't attempt to try and make the sex come off as poetically and perfectly romantic as possible like "My Inner Life", a story that's not a troll fic, which puts it on a teensy-slightly-higher pedestal in terms of quality sex scenes in my book (figuratively, not literally *beat*).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kutie Pie View Post
    Lol "My Immortal" is such a special case that I think having all of the poorly-written sex just adds to its narm charm. It kind of helps that nobody knows for certain whether the fic was legit or was a troll fic (and surprise sex is pretty common in troll fics, but that's neither here nor there). At the very least, "My Immortal" didn't attempt to try and make the sex come off as poetically and perfectly romantic as possible like "My Inner Life", a story that's not a troll fic, which puts it on a teensy-slightly-higher pedestal in terms of quality sex scenes in my book (figuratively, not literally *beat*).
    Is "My Inner Life" the one where it's more or less this one chick's dream journal about hangin out with Link and having his babies? I've heard of it, I think that'll be on my list of badfics to read if I had one.
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    For one thing I dislike about the amateurish fics, is the treatment of death of characters. Let it be villains, friends or foes, subordinates, just some random pedestrian nearby, or even the protagonist him/herself. Death is a serious issue, because not only generally speaking the characters are suffering during the process hence sympathetic from the audience eyes, but also from the author's viewpoint, the character will be gone forever, which should cause quite a large change in the plot planning process, especially when the death is of some important characters.

    Please show that the death is something extremely important, and that the characters watching the death is emotionally distracted. Don't just brush it off with a remark of "Oh, is he dead and gone vanish in thin air? Okay I see, let's go then." like it was just watching a random pedestrian pass by in front of you. (Read: nothing significantly important to be remained in your memory)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
    For one thing I dislike about the amateurish fics, is the treatment of death of characters. Let it be villains, friends or foes, subordinates, just some random pedestrian nearby, or even the protagonist him/herself. Death is a serious issue, because not only generally speaking the characters are suffering during the process hence sympathetic from the audience eyes, but also from the author's viewpoint, the character will be gone forever, which should cause quite a large change in the plot planning process, especially when the death is of some important characters.

    Please show that the death is something extremely important, and that the characters watching the death is emotionally distracted. Don't just brush it off with a remark of "Oh, is he dead and gone vanish in thin air? Okay I see, let's go then." like it was just watching a random pedestrian pass by in front of you. (Read: nothing significantly important to be remained in your memory)
    But what if it was the death of just some random pedestrian who was going to have no impact on the plot? Do you still try to put meaning in it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    But what if it was the death of just some random pedestrian who was going to have no impact on the plot? Do you still try to put meaning in it?
    Well, every single person is still a person; I understand that in literature and fiction, the people aren't real, but they're designed to be as real people. So what if someone didn't have an attachment or impact on the main characters? They must have still been important to somebody. Maybe this is just me, but from my perspective, I don't feel like anyone is a "nobody;" every single person in life has meaning, and I feel like those in fiction ought to be treated as such to try and reflect real life as best it can.

    But I mainly agree with Crystal; death is such a hugely-impacting event in the lives of those living that it really isn't something that's just skimmed over or that people would get over in half a page. Even if you're the most stoic, testosterone-laden manly man, death is something leaves an impression.

    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    Has unnecessary lemons been mentioned yet?
    I've personally never seen anything sexually-explicit, but I generally don't like anything that even alludes to sex, so yeah, I guess I could include this <_<


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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    But what if it was the death of just some random pedestrian who was going to have no impact on the plot? Do you still try to put meaning in it?
    It may not have any impact to the plot, but it will still have some impacts toward other characters. The one close to that passed-away pedestrian will be sad and agonizing, and if your story main character(s) see the disheartened relatives, he/she will obviously sympathized, even that is none of his/her business.

    The emotional impact need not to be direct, and need not to be significant, but there must be some reactions, even that is as simple as one "Are you OK?" consolation towards the remaining relatives.

    In the case of that random pedestrian just died and lying on the road without any other people in the nearby, still other characters seeing the corpse should be moved. May be questioning the ease and suddenness of ending of life where will that also happens to me just the next moment, or the very pragmatic thinking of there is a corpse hence this place must be dangerous I must tighten up my nerve and be more careful.

    It is just that, when there is death, the emotions of other characters cannot remain static. Even that is just some very small impact, still there is impact towards other characters.
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    This might just be a pet peeve of mine, but I hate how a lot of authors seem to think the "journey fic" has been done to death and now a lot of them try to avoid it.

    Years ago, there were hundreds of them. Now, they're rare. I miss that and I want to see loads of them again.

    Seriously, when you say "Pokemon fic", that's the sort of stuff I immediately think of; children/teens going on a journey to become the best, encountering drama along the way and finding themselves in the process.

    Plus, I'm sick of all these fics where humans live alongside Pokemon and/or can talk to them and/or feature the main characters AS Pokemon. I've said this before and I'll say it again - the humans are the most important characters in Pokemon fics. The Pokemon themselves are secondary.

    This is just my opinion really, but I really wish people would stop trying to make "different" fics and just go back to basics.


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    Quote Originally Posted by 0bss1d1ankn1ght View Post
    Is "My Inner Life" the one where it's more or less this one chick's dream journal about hangin out with Link and having his babies? I've heard of it, I think that'll be on my list of badfics to read if I had one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Nexus View Post
    . I've said this before and I'll say it again - the humans are the most important characters in Pokemon fics. The Pokemon themselves are secondary.
    Unless it's Pokémon Mystery Dungeon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omegagoldfish View Post
    Unless it's Pokémon Mystery Dungeon.
    A good point, though the series is still about a human becoming a Pokemon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Nexus View Post
    This might just be a pet peeve of mine, but I hate how a lot of authors seem to think the "journey fic" has been done to death and now a lot of them try to avoid it.

    Years ago, there were hundreds of them. Now, they're rare. I miss that and I want to see loads of them again.

    Seriously, when you say "Pokemon fic", that's the sort of stuff I immediately think of; children/teens going on a journey to become the best, encountering drama along the way and finding themselves in the process.

    Plus, I'm sick of all these fics where humans live alongside Pokemon and/or can talk to them and/or feature the main characters AS Pokemon. I've said this before and I'll say it again - the humans are the most important characters in Pokemon fics. The Pokemon themselves are secondary.

    This is just my opinion really, but I really wish people would stop trying to make "different" fics and just go back to basics.
    To be fair, even within the canon game series, the "basic" journey fic format had become less and less significant, where now it incorporate more and more high-fantasy heroic plots where player is enter into a quest of saving the world. It is only in GenI&II, the priority of player's journey is traveling to enter the Pokemon League. Starting from GenIII onwards, Pokemon League seems to become secondary, whereas villainous team plot became more of the primary issue. Also you can't help that the fandom have more and more non-journey fic, as the canon also have lot of spin-offs where the player is not a newbie trainer going on a journey aiming to enter the Pokemon League. Granted, there are spin-offs that the player is not even a human character.

    Because of such reason (Well, not really for any specific reason, actually just out of a whim), I currently planned to write a journey fic that is "back to the basics". The two protagonists are early teens aiming to becoming stronger for their own respective reasons, going out for a journey to enter the Pokemon League, encounter different dramas along the way and deepen the understandings about themselves during the process.
    Just a sidenote. I'm not planning to feature any villainous team nor any legendary pokemon battles within my fic. This is the story about the growth of my two main characters, not any high-fantasy heroic fiction where protagonists are on the quest to save the world. The mental struggles regarding on the results of the actions they took is the primary drama of my fic.

    I agree the saying of human character is the most important and pokemon is just secondary, especially for trainer journey fics, even provided that the pokemons can talk human languages. But, not true for PMD fics.
    That is because the trainers are like the leader or the head of one's handheld pokemons, so obviously the trainer is more of the center of focus compare to his/her handhelds. That's why the human characters should be more flesh out than any pokemon characters. But that doesn't mean the pokemons should than become mindless machine just for the purpose of battles. Pokemons should still have some personalities, and author may add some non-stereotypical unorthodox characteristics if one wanted to do so, but, the characterization of pokemon shouldn't outshine its trainer. IMO the handhelds of one trainer is there to support and add spices to the characterization of their owner, hence they are secondary to the trainer, they should be designed in a way that their characteristics and personalities are dependent on other human characters.



    Speaking of trainer journey fic, I also have one pet peeve when it is written by amateur. That is the writer trying too hard in following the structural pattern of newbie protagonist receive a starter from a professor -> leave home town and go on a journey -> challenge gyms in different cities -> meet villainous team -> defeat them and stop their devastating plan -> arrive at the Pokemon League -> beat the E4 and Champion and become the new Champion -> happy ending Hooray!......

    It is not that I have problem with such stereotypical structure (Though to speak the truth, it will feel a lot more refreshing if any step within the above-mentioned procedure is significantly altered, but even if not, it is still fine, as long as the story is well-written), but it is more of a problem where author trying to follow this plot structure without thinking too much of the characters themselves. The result is then the characters are plot-driven, they just mindlessly going to place after place, mindlessly challenges battle one after another, mindlessly go against the villainous team, and become the Champion in quite an unconscious manner.

    For example, one of the most over-used amateurish reason to let a character set off on a journey is that anime reason of "being 10-year-old". Oh please, is this some kind of obligation enforced by the government that if one don't go leave one's home town at 10 you will then be in jail? Even it is some kind of obligation, by realistic POV I'm sure there will be a bunch of indoor children doesn't want to leave his/her home just for the sake of it. So I would prefer some other character-centered individual reason that will drive the protagonist to leave home on his/her own will.
    And then another amateurish reason to let the protagonist go challenge gyms and enter Pokemon League is simply "because I'm a pokemon trainer". Again, is this some kind of obligation saying if you are a trainer you must go beat the gyms and enter some tournaments, no exception allowed? I could easily see there are many just wanted to be an amateur trainer enjoying pokemon battles as a kind of leisure, but not a professional sport, and because of that such characters have no interest in entering the league despite that they are pokemon trainers.
    And then same for the villainous team, the main characters go against them just "because they are doing bad things". Such protagonist is really frivolously brave in the same manner as Ash Ketchum.

    As trainer journey fic have a stereotypical plot structure, amateurish writer will easily fell into the plot planning trap of "Just Because", where characters do something and act in such way just because the plot demands so, there is no build-up about the characters themselves, and also no build-up why the plot is heading to such direction. It is really not interesting and engaging in just reading a list of events happening, without the in-story characters themselves being wholeheartedly involved.
    "人には知らない世界はそこに存在する、そして人には知らない冒険はそこに始まってる"
    Chapter 1: 謎の世界の生き物、闘うトレーナーたち

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