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Thread: Anti-Metagame Pokemon

  1. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    As a dragon dancer, Salamence is probably better with intimidate, since that'll make Subs/DDs easier to get up. You also won't need the extra attack from moxie as much after you DD. Moxie might save you in some situations.

    Moxie is better on the scarf version, after revenge killing a pokemon it's pretty much got an easy DD. Being locked in a move won't matter as much if it's using outrage. I'd say this one is probably it's best niche over Haxorus and Dragonite.Good players is different then most players, though.
    If the players aren't good, shouldn't you be beating them either way? No matter what set you run?

    (Expert Belt is a great set though. Plays almost like Mixed Dragonite.)

    Moxie has actually tested incredible for me. The attack boost with Adamant is so powerful. It lets me OHKO things like OTR Reuniclus at +2. It is also great since Dragon Claw isn't the strongest move in the world, and Earthquake can only hit Ferrothorn/Forretress for neutral. Intimidate is negligable when you are setting up on things like Gastrodon, Celebi, Tentacruel, and Toxic Politoed. Sun teams are at its mercy too. Sun teams are usually very dragon weak, especially with Sub to protect yourself from Venusaur. You do not need Intimidate to get a Sub against Sun. Did I mention how Moxie is needed for stallbreaking power without locking yourself?

    The attack boost is also great when they have dual screens or if they fodder a pokemon. Mence is very unpredictable. It is already extremely good at forcing switches. There is a big difference from being +2 attack and +1 speed, and +1 attack and +1 speed. Just sub, dance up once or twice, and its literally gg if you have team support to break Skarmory/Scizor. (Use Magnezone or Heatran!)


  2. #52

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    LO Deoxys-S has impressed me a lot lately as a revenge killer/sweeper. I mean, that incredible speed and decent power really add up. With a Life Orb, Deoxys-S has stats equivalent to a Base 103 speed Pokemon with Base 138 offenses holding a Scarf, but all with the ability to switch moves. Imagine ScarfChomp from way back when with more speed, more power, the ability to switch moves, more powerful STAB, and a killer movepool. Deoxys-S has an attack for just about every occasion and can be tailored to check so many threats, it's not even funny.

    I guess the main justification for Deoxys-S being anti-metagame is the fact that it can perform a variety of functions: set up hazards for a standard offense team, throw up Dual Screens for HO, or even sweep. Just as you get ready to fight a support Deoxys-S, you get slammed by the LO set.

  3. #53
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    Work Up + Subs Jolteon could be dangerous in rain. With Work Up Jolty can reach about +500 in Special Attack but it's Spikes weak.

    Maybe Work Up Azumarill and Hone Claws Durant are pretty beast in rain.

    After one Work Up Azumarill gets about 500 Atk and with Aqua Jet can sweep, it maybe walled by Skarm or Ferro.

    Durant typing just like Scizor but it isn't gets Technician or Swords Dance. But with Hone Claws and it's ability Hustle may destroy unprepared team, and with Iron Head hax.
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  4. #54
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    Maybe Work Up Azumarill and Hone Claws Durant are pretty beast in rain.
    Azumarill is okay I guess, and Durant doesn't have the coverage to sweep that well.

    I wouldn't call either "anti-metagame".
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    Mamoswine rapes sun
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  6. #56
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    I think I just found an antimetagame pokemon: Trick starmie
    This guy has saved me so many times atm, for example, switch in something it can hurt badly, like any slower fire/dragon(w/icebeam)/ground/rock type and they will probably switch in to something that would resist any of its attaks such as ferrothorn, blissey or other mons like that, trick and rape. Everytime people see a starmie they asume it'd have LO or leftovers.
    Other great option I've been using is Scarf terrakion, it's such a boss, difficult to wall and awesome revenge killer in almost any weather, also, its bulk is pretty decent (91/90/90) and with the scarf boost it can outspeed the mughty deoxys-s. Awesome late game sweeper.
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  7. #57
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    Specs'd Chandelure maybe the anti-metagame.

    With powerful STAB Overheat can sweeps. But poor on speed maybe a problem for Chandy.
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  8. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMaster View Post
    I think I just found an antimetagame pokemon: Trick starmie
    This guy has saved me so many times atm, for example, switch in something it can hurt badly, like any slower fire/dragon(w/icebeam)/ground/rock type and they will probably switch in to something that would resist any of its attaks such as ferrothorn, blissey or other mons like that, trick and rape. Everytime people see a starmie they asume it'd have LO or leftovers.
    Other great option I've been using is Scarf terrakion, it's such a boss, difficult to wall and awesome revenge killer in almost any weather, also, its bulk is pretty decent (91/90/90) and with the scarf boost it can outspeed the mughty deoxys-s. Awesome late game sweeper.
    That was anti metagame in gen 4.

    You could lead with it vs the standard stall team, and it is almost a guaranteed Trick against Blissey. A lot of stall teams lead with Heatran or Hippowdon. Surf/Ice Beam/Thunderbolt 2HKO's like every possible lead too. So they need to chose between getting Stealth Rock up, or dealing with Starmie. A lot of leads also can't threaten Starmie very much. Earthquake + BP from Metagross does not beat Starmie for example, while Modest Surf should 2HKO.

    People also don't have the balls to rock against lead Starmie, so you can use the predictability to your advantage.


  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamefreak View Post
    That was anti metagame in gen 4.

    You could lead with it vs the standard stall team, and it is almost a guaranteed Trick against Blissey. A lot of stall teams lead with Heatran or Hippowdon. Surf/Ice Beam/Thunderbolt 2HKO's like every possible lead too. So they need to chose between getting Stealth Rock up, or dealing with Starmie. A lot of leads also can't threaten Starmie very much. Earthquake + BP from Metagross does not beat Starmie for example, while Modest Surf should 2HKO.

    People also don't have the balls to rock against lead Starmie, so you can use the predictability to your advantage.
    Thanks for your opinion at starmie, it looks pretty "accurate" (yay google traductor)
    And what do you think about scarf terrakion?
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  10. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMaster View Post
    Thanks for your opinion at starmie, it looks pretty "accurate" (yay google traductor)
    And what do you think about scarf terrakion?
    Scarf Terrakion is the stuff. No questions asked.

    Scarf Terrakion really is a great revenge killer, even a decent sweeper at times. With Base 129 Atk and excellent STABs with incredible coverage, he can do a lot of damage without even needing a boosting item. Therefore, he makes a great Scarf candidate. He has the ability to outspeed all common Scarfers and common Pokemon with +1 (and some with +2) speed boosts, while doing tons of damage to them. This makes him a nice check to things like Scarf Landorus and DD Salamence. Scarf Terrakion is also probably the best answer to QD Volcarona out there, even more so if Sandstorm happens to be up.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by chikorita185 View Post
    Memento uxie with dual screen.
    Never used it but it sounds like it could screw up a huge amount when pared with a dugtrio or other trapper
    All dual screeners are outclassed by Deoxys-S, in my experience.

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  12. #62

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    Trick Room Reuniclus with HP Fire.
    It's not the best choice since it would need speed IVs but it screws over my Scizor every time I encounter it.

  13. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by Netz View Post
    Trick Room Reuniclus with HP Fire.
    It's not the best choice since it would need speed IVs but it screws over my Scizor every time I encounter it.
    That and Trick Flame Orb Reuniclus make great Scizor and Tyranitar lures. Good partners include pokemon which lose to Scizor such as Terrakion since with Scizor out of the way, Terrakion can really do some damage.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninja Dewott View Post
    All dual screeners are outclassed by Deoxys-S, in my experience.
    Except of course, espeon.
    Choice band terrakion's CC 2HKO's physically defensive Skarmory at 90%.And everyone expects scarf.

  15. #65
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    Sub Charge Beam Magnezone is pretty good right now.


    Magnezone @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Charge Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Subs on Ferrothorn and Jirachi without much trouble while beating many Scizor and Forretress. Skarmory also doesn't have a chance. Charge Beam up to +3 or so then get another kill on the next Pokemon that has to break your sub. Then either sweep, switch out, or get a third kill off Magnezone's good bulk. HP EVs make sure Jirachi Body Slam and Scizor Bullet Punch both 3HKO your subs while giving additional checks to your team against stuff like Starmie, Haxorus etc. It also survives Sp def Heatran's Lava Plume so at the cost to itself it can break Heatran down to about 50%.

  16. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Harvest View Post
    Sub Charge Beam Magnezone is pretty good right now.


    Magnezone @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Charge Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Subs on Ferrothorn and Jirachi without much trouble while beating many Scizor and Forretress. Skarmory also doesn't have a chance. Charge Beam up to +3 or so then get another kill on the next Pokemon that has to break your sub. Then either sweep, switch out, or get a third kill off Magnezone's good bulk. HP EVs make sure Jirachi Body Slam and Scizor Bullet Punch both 3HKO your subs while giving additional checks to your team against stuff like Starmie, Haxorus etc. It also survives Sp def Heatran's Lava Plume so at the cost to itself it can break Heatran down to about 50%.
    I approve to this. It is extremely good right now. Dragons + that Magnezone is extremely anti metagame. That IS the best Magnezone set by far. All the other Magnezone sets are far inferior. Getting +3 WHILE keeping a Sub, with fast sweep, bulk, and bolt/beam is extremely devastating. Back that up with 2-3 dragons, and other abusers is beyond brutal.


  17. #67
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    Talking about Magnezone, how about Magneton

    name: SubCharge
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Charge Beam
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Flash Cannon
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Magnet Pull
    nature: Timid
    evs: 16 HP / 240 SpA / 252 Spe

    Unlike Magnezone, he can outspeed Base 70s like Politoed and Breloom, while retaining it's bulk with Evolite. Subs on Ferrothorn and Jirachi without much trouble while beating many Scizor and Forretress. Skarmory also doesn't have a chance. Charge Beam up to +3 or so then get another kill on the next Pokemon that has to break your sub. Then either sweep, switch out, or get a third kill off Magnezone's good bulk. HP EVs make sure Jirachi Body Slam and Scizor Bullet Punch both 3HKO your subs while giving additional checks to your team against stuff like Starmie, Haxorus etc.

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  18. #68
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    Magnezone is a good Anti-metagame pokemon currently due to 30% of teams running a ferrothorn, Forretress, or skarmory

    Another Anti-metagame pokemon is Deoxy's speed it outruns tons of scarfers then proceeds to 1hko them.
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  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonMaster123 View Post
    Talking about Magnezone, how about Magneton

    name: SubCharge
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Charge Beam
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Hidden Power Ice / Flash Cannon
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Magnet Pull
    nature: Timid
    evs: 16 HP / 240 SpA / 252 Spe

    Unlike Magnezone, he can outspeed Base 70s like Politoed and Breloom, while retaining it's bulk with Evolite. Subs on Ferrothorn and Jirachi without much trouble while beating many Scizor and Forretress. Skarmory also doesn't have a chance. Charge Beam up to +3 or so then get another kill on the next Pokemon that has to break your sub. Then either sweep, switch out, or get a third kill off Magnezone's good bulk. HP EVs make sure Jirachi Body Slam and Scizor Bullet Punch both 3HKO your subs while giving additional checks to your team against stuff like Starmie, Haxorus etc.
    Breloom is nearly always Adamant and can't break your Substitute anyway. Politoed is either Scarf or defensive. Specs Politoed is generally Modest. But you DO outrun Adamant Dragonite / Gyarados as well as 32 speed Jirachi which is cool. Magneton only gets 3 Subs with Stealth Rocks down and Ferrothorn 2HKOs your Sub, so it probably beats you. Maybe just run Leftovers instead since 240 / 20 defense Magneton walls Jirachi better (due to speed) although its subs are 2HKOed by Scizor's Bullet Punch. I'm not sure if the loss of bulk / subbing power is worth it to outrun Dragonite / Gyarados / 32 speed Jirachi.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Harvest View Post
    Breloom is nearly always Adamant and can't break your Substitute anyway. Politoed is either Scarf or defensive. Specs Politoed is generally Modest. But you DO outrun Adamant Dragonite / Gyarados as well as 32 speed Jirachi which is cool. Magneton only gets 3 Subs with Stealth Rocks down and Ferrothorn 2HKOs your Sub, so it probably beats you. Maybe just run Leftovers instead since 240 / 20 defense Magneton walls Jirachi better (due to speed) although its subs are 2HKOed by Scizor's Bullet Punch. I'm not sure if the loss of bulk / subbing power is worth it to outrun Dragonite / Gyarados / 32 speed Jirachi.
    I actually like running that varient from ShakeItUP's RMT

    Magnezone would never dream of outspeeding in Tank Rotom-W, DD Dragonite, and Gliscor
    The defensive capabilities allow Magneton to survive many hits such as +1 Fire Punch from Dragonite and +2 Hydro Pump from non-Life Orb Cloyster.
    I've tested that varient of Magneton, and it actually works really well, pair it up with Scizor and you can easily beat steels as you lure them in

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  21. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Harvest View Post
    Sub Charge Beam Magnezone is pretty good right now.


    Magnezone @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Charge Beam
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Subs on Ferrothorn and Jirachi without much trouble while beating many Scizor and Forretress. Skarmory also doesn't have a chance. Charge Beam up to +3 or so then get another kill on the next Pokemon that has to break your sub. Then either sweep, switch out, or get a third kill off Magnezone's good bulk. HP EVs make sure Jirachi Body Slam and Scizor Bullet Punch both 3HKO your subs while giving additional checks to your team against stuff like Starmie, Haxorus etc. It also survives Sp def Heatran's Lava Plume so at the cost to itself it can break Heatran down to about 50%.
    Man, this brings back memories. I used to run this set way back when, before Garchomp was banned. It's incredibly easy to come in on something like Ferrothorn (mind the Leech Seed, though), set up a Sub, and boost to +6. As long as you have a Sub up when you kill the trapped Pokemon, I've found it's not too hard to get 2 kills with it.

  22. #72
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    Hmm, I experimented briefly with a 2mag4drag team about a month ago, but both were running HP Fire. I might go back to it now....

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  23. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by kaiser soze View Post
    Hmm, I experimented briefly with a 2mag4drag team about a month ago, but both were running HP Fire. I might go back to it now....
    I don't think you need Magneton in addition to Magnezone. I feel it is redundant against most teams. I usually use Scarfer | Rocker or some random abuser which isn't a dragon | Magnezone | 3 dragons. Its a great team really. Been top 5 on the smogon leaderboard with it for a week.

    Magnezone is the reason why I use Shed Shell Skarmory nowadays on some of my teams. Just because I know how ridiculous teams like this can be. Very reliable for ladder play, very little prediction required. A lot of teams are weak to it too.


  24. #74
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    Porygon2 with eviolite and poision heal Gliscor both wall stuff to death and do massive damage. I faced a poision heal Gliscor with a toxic orb in a Uber battle it had substitute toxic earthquake and I think protect. It walled me to death Porygon2 walled and swept through a good chunk of my team but without Gliscor the team could fall apart after it went down to toxic or high output attacks. Both can easily go into ubers and wreak havoc but I can counter gliscor with Bronzong once I get one, and the porygon can fall to Magnezone(ice beam, thunderbolt, and tri attack do little damage to it.)
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  25. #75

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    Gliscor isn't anti-metagame, it IS a large part of the metagame.
    Anyway, Cinccino is a great anti-metagame Pokemon in RU.`Bullet Seed/Rock Blast/Tail Slap/Wake-Up Slap get great coverage together and hit really hard with Technician. It can also break subs, which is a great thing in RU.

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