Paper Mario Series

[Lost Requiem]

Got this for Christmas.

It's okay so far. I think the only thing I really like right now is the OST. And the paper stuff (I always loooove how Nintendo uses paper in these games).

I don't recall the Toad's ever directly mentioning that they were paper before this game though, so that was kind of weird.

(I swear we're twins...)

I got Sticker Star a while ago. THe humor wasn't as good, and Kersti is a Goombella and Tippi mixed together with some annoyance. I'm in CHapter three, and the games bores the living day lights out of me. Honestly, I feel with each new installment after TTYD it's been getting worse. Also, Miyamoto actually disapproved of a game like TTYD, saying it was "To boring".

Also, the almost non-existent fourth wall in this game is kinda funny, but then again it really isn't. I prefered the leaning on the fourth wall jokes and the active bowser/peach from the previous games. Honestly, it's like a bad love child of Paper Marion and New Super Mario Bros...

[Trickster Zorua]

(I swear we're twins...)

I got Sticker Star a while ago. THe humor wasn't as good, and Kersti is a Goombella and Tippi mixed together with some annoyance. I'm in CHapter three, and the games bores the living day lights out of me. Honestly, I feel with each new installment after TTYD it's been getting worse. Also, Miyamoto actually disapproved of a game like TTYD, saying it was "To boring".

Also, the almost non-existent fourth wall in this game is kinda funny, but then again it really isn't. I prefered the leaning on the fourth wall jokes and the active bowser/peach from the previous games. Honestly, it's like a bad love child of Paper Marion and New Super Mario Bros...

(I'm part of the twins...)

I got also Paper Mario Sticker Star! Yesterday! I really like it! x3

[Manna]

(I swear we're twins...)

Honestly, I feel with each new installment after TTYD it's been getting worse.

Not on this front, sadly *hugs SPM*

[lindsy95]

TBH, SPM had the story and dialogue aspect down. It's just the removal of RPG-ness that bothers me.

[diakyu]

I got Sticker Star a while ago. THe humor wasn't as good, and Kersti is a Goombella and Tippi mixed together with some annoyance. I'm in CHapter three, and the games bores the living day lights out of me. Honestly, I feel with each new installment after TTYD it's been getting worse. Also, Miyamoto actually disapproved of a game like TTYD, saying it was "To boring".

Didn't he say something more along the lines of it was just a port of TTYD?

[GildedScizor]

Got Sticker Star for chrissy, and I'm up to the start of W4-1. I'm still overall undecided on the game as a whole, but I'm leaning towards a negative impression.

PROS:
Increased difficulty (The first boss has 90 HP for crying out loud)
More intricate puzzles
Fourth-wall removing humour remains
Not bad music (Love Gooper Blooper's rythmic Spanish clapping theme)

CONS:
Lack of storyline
Disappointing rehash of the RPG battle system
Overworld sublevel format (for God's sake Nintendo, stop turning every Mario game into the same stupid old Mario Bros style)
Lack of partners
Creativity with characters and bosses is lacking
Uninspiring levels
It's completely unnecessary to fight most enemies anymore
And probably many more...

Overall atm I'd give it a 5/10 but I'm still giving it benefit of the doubt due to it being the first handheld Paper Mario. To be fair, even though I'd heard this game wasn't all that great I still wanted it as I've played through the first three a million ties and just wanted to continue it on.

[diakyu]

Disappointing rehash of the RPG battle system

Now this is interesting. Do you mind explaining?

[AuraChannelerChris]

Now this is interesting. Do you mind explaining?

Stickers being the only method to attack...
Bosses turning into puzzles...
No experience points...

[GildedScizor]

Now this is interesting. Do you mind explaining?

Stickers being the only method to attack...
Bosses turning into puzzles...
No experience points...

What he said.

[shiny charizard master]

I honestly don't know how to feel about this game, other than "it could have been so much more."

The visuals and music were great. Paper Mario is THE series for the 3DS, no doubt. I mean, a world of Paper, designed in a 3D world begs, nay, demands a certain depth that can only be aided by the 3D, rather than being pointless or downright hindering as many 3DS games' 3D features do. I can't really qualify the music the same way, but it was all lovely to me.

But then we wade into the chaff of this game. By doing whatever unnatural hybrid of Puzzle-Adventure and Action-RPG they did, both parts kinda fall flat, as they are possibly 2 of the most demanding genres of games. Puzzle-Adventures require the ability to make puzzles that are difficult, but don't require insane logic to be the solution (Vacuums destroy Twisters? Hello?). The adventure part makes the puzzles even more demanding that a standard puzzle game because it means that solutions to puzzles should be scattered across the land, but not jammed in nooks so deep that you'll never find them. This doesn't mesh well with Action-RPGs that demand a modicum of action from the battles mixed with the aspects of a well balanced RPG. Yet because of the focus on the Puzzle-Adventuring parts, the battles are polarizing - on one end, standard enemies are too easy to kill and offer nothing to your game experience (they place a drain on your resources they can't hope to replenish, doubly so when your resources are REQUIRED to solve puzzles later in the level), yet on the other end, the bosses are insanely hard (A plus to masochistic gamers such as myself), but their difficulty stems from idiosyncratic puzzles that are more on par of the Puzzle-Adventure, where the concept of a 'boss battle' is a super difficult puzzle that you can flee from at any time in order to stock up on the equipment you may need to overcome it, an idea that conflicts with the Action-RPG trope that bosses should be difficult, sometimes even painstakingly so, but you should stand your ground and persevere against these foes. It tries to be two things so radically different that it ends up failing to deliver a wholesome experiences that either provide.

Yet the most important thing to me that sticks out, painfully so, is that it has removed a lot of what I believe made the Paper Mario games, indeed all of the Mario RPGs, so great. By cutting back so heavily on the story, which in turn led to a cut in characterization, which in turn led to a lesser need for dialogue, we end up with only a modicum of the charm and witty dialogue I've come to love and know from these series. It's still there, but it only serves as an occasional chuckle and a bitter reminder that there could have been so much more. This is especially apparent with Bowser, one of the most lovable and hammiest of antagonists in the history of the universe, yet one that manages to remain a giant threat and a constant reminder that he IS powerful (The most flawless execution of both of these aspects is definitely in Mario&Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story). So what do they do to such a robust and dynamic character? They make him mute. MUTE! It's such a tragedy that, because of that silly idea that no story is necessary for a Paper Mario and that the gameplay alone will sell the game (Thanks a lot, Miyamoto), they decided Bowser didn't need to say anything at all.

I haven't been able to read the whole thread (30 pages? Yikes), yet, so if you don't understand the jab at Miyamoto, here's the issue: Back in 2010, when the first prototype of the game was made and given to Miyamoto to be played, he said the game was "too similar to The Thousand Year Door" and that they should focus more on the sticker aspect. Yeah, yeah, coming from the guy who greenlighted 4 New Super Mario Bros games within a 6 year period. He also mentioned the most damning phrase I've ever heard: "It's fine without a story, so do we really need one?" That is the filthiest excuse for a cop-out I've ever heard for a game. It just reeks of "Why go for excellent when good will sell?" And before anyone jumps out with "DON'T DISRESPECT MIYAMOTO!" blarny, that's the core of the issue. Miyamoto IS a legend. Not listening to his advice would be considered the equivalent of signing your own death warrant. So Intelligent Systems did just that, and took his advice. A darn shame if you ask me.

From looking at the bits and pieces of information available about their original concept, we see what could have been an amazing game: Basically the first two Paper Mario games were used as the basic formula (The battles, the bigger plot, partners, wide open world, all that fun stuff). Items and badges were replaced by stickers, where you "pasted" badge-stickers to yourself to gain powers (basically the standard badge system, but with a cutesie paper-friendly appeal to it), and various stickers were used to solve the puzzles found within the game (just like the now oppressively core mechanic of Sticker Star). It just disheartens me that after 8 years, we were THIS CLOSE to the next Paper Mario RPG, but it was stripped from our grasps.

Yeah, there were a lot of little things I'd have loved to mention, like how I HATE HATE HATE the Mario Bros 3 styled overworld that has infected every Mario game for the past 6 years, or the fact that I do like the sticker museum (completionist crap, haha). Unfortunately, I've probably already gone beyond Verbose and into "Shut the hell up already" territory. So I'll just leave it at this. I just hope Nintendo doesn't pull an EA and realizes that any backlash is against the direction the game is taking, not the game series itself, and kills the series.

Sauce for Miyamoto's meddling (and a good read [if you like game design process] or a depressing read [if you were hoping for the next Paper Mario RPG]): http://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interv...papermario/0/2

[diakyu]

The change that SS took was not all from Miyamoto's advice. The advice was just advice, the developers didn't have to take it. However they did, mostly because the developers had already been thinking of dumbing down the games because SS is paper mario's first time on handhelds. And then there are the Club Nintendo surveys saying that most people disliked the story of SPM. But most of SS's limitations come from being a handheld game. We all know the next PM game will most likely be for the Wii U, so you might get a better game if you didn't like SS.

[shiny charizard master]

Although I'm positive I explained that part clearly enough, I'll say it again: Of course they didn't HAVE to listen to Miyamoto. But in all honesty, who wouldn't listen to him? Would you ignore the advice of Stephen King? Peter Jackson? Stephen Hawkings? Of course not. The overall issue still that, as you said, he isn't the only one to blame, there were definitely many reasons, but I'd eat my shoes if his words had no impact on the developers (who DID have a story and colorful characters, among other things at that time, whether they wished to "dumb down" or not).

And everybody should know those Club Nintendo surveys are completely and utterly skewed. Let's take the advice of a tiny portion of the Nintendo community where even less of the members actually even care about what they write down, doing whatever they can to get their precious club points as fast as possible. I'm suuuuuuuure that will give 100% accurate results. We should next ask people who play point and click adventures if they think an FPS needs more story.

And lastly, there have been AMAZING games on handheld systems with depth. Maybe it's because I like to strive for perfection in everything I do, and expect others to do the same, but the excuse that "it's just a handheld, it doesn't need to be good," is cringe-worthy at best to me.

I only complain because I care. Hahahahahahahaha.

[AuraChannelerChris]

I honestly never thought those surveys really did matter that much... I DO write my thoughts, though, and I sure as hell didn't say that SPM was really bad.

[DarkOverlord777]

Got Sticker Star for Christmas. I have to say, it's alot better than I thought it'd be. At first I didn't like the idea of having to use stickers to attack, as I just don't feel that turn based attacks fit mario's style, but I have to say, I am pretty impressed, and have warmed up to it. While I'd still rather just use the simple way of dealing with enemies such as in Super Paper Mario, without it being turn based, I think this game really does have all the other aspects to a mario game that we all know and love. The puzzlingness, the hidden secrets, the large amount of enemies, the powerups(while presented differently, of course), the humor, and the TOADS. Its all there. And one benefit to the turn based system, you could say, is that it makes the bosses much more challenging. And just when you've used up your thing stickers, you find something that you need them for, and it leaves to go back and find them again. This game is quite fun, and I've think its one of the funnest mario games I've played in awhile, just ahead of 3d Land and NSMB 2 by a bit.

[The Great Butler]

Overall atm I'd give it a 5/10 but I'm still giving it benefit of the doubt due to it being the first handheld Paper Mario. To be fair, even though I'd heard this game wasn't all that great I still wanted it as I've played through the first three a million ties and just wanted to continue it on.

I wouldn't even give it higher than a 3/10. It's possibly the most disappointing game I've ever played, when how long it took to come out is taken into account. It's so bland and boring that I made it only a couple of levels in - as far as just after the first encounter with Bowser Jr. - before I was so bored and irritated with the repetitive and uninteresting gameplay that I gave up. I'm probably going to end up selling it.

[munchlaxguy]

I wouldn't even give it higher than a 3/10. It's possibly the most disappointing game I've ever played, when how long it took to come out is taken into account. It's so bland and boring that I made it only a couple of levels in - as far as just after the first encounter with Bowser Jr. - before I was so bored and irritated with the repetitive and uninteresting gameplay that I gave up. I'm probably going to end up selling it.

What? This is the best paper mario I've ever played 10/10 for me I am loving it.It has humor and is super fun.

[shiny charizard master]

What? This is the best paper mario I've ever played 10/10 for me I am loving it.It has humor and is super fun.

*inserts joke that Munchlaxguy hasn't played any other Paper Mario game*

Although, in hindsight, that's the best possible explanation, considering "It has humor" is something every other Paper Mario game and Mario and Luigi game has, but they have far, FAR more of it than Sticker Star, and in my opinion, better quality humor. This is because Sticker Star's humor is limited to "HURR HURR PAPER JOKES" and it didn't have any of the great visual humor found in the background events of The Thousand Year Door and ALL of the Mario & Luigi Series. This game only has a sip of humor when you could play any other Mario RPG and get more than a chug of this type of tongue-in-cheek humor. We didn't wait 3 years (8 for those who didn't care for Super Paper Mario), and pay 40 bucks for a "sip" of what we loved about this series.

[munchlaxguy]

*inserts joke that Munchlaxguy hasn't played any other Paper Mario game*

Although, in hindsight, that's the best possible explanation, considering "It has humor" is something every other Paper Mario game and Mario and Luigi game has, but they have far, FAR more of it than Sticker Star, and in my opinion, better quality humor. This is because Sticker Star's humor is limited to "HURR HURR PAPER JOKES" and it didn't have any of the great visual humor found in the background events of The Thousand Year Door and ALL of the Mario & Luigi Series. This game only has a sip of humor when you could play any other Mario RPG and get more than a chug of this type of tongue-in-cheek humor. We didn't wait 3 years (8 for those who didn't care for Super Paper Mario), and pay 40 bucks for a "sip" of what we loved about this series.

I've played two of the other games so you shouldn't say stuff like that .-.

[abrar14]

I'm getting Sticker Star in February. Cannot wait!

[PokeMaster366]

    Spoiler:- Final Boss Fight:

Show Spoiler

 
When I was into the third stage of the fight (the one with the Podoboos), I tried to use a fan just to hit Bowser, but when I did that, all of the Podoboos flew away as well and fell on Bowser, dealing 10 points of damage each.