Last edited by Sadib; 8th November 2011 at 6:26 AM.
So, shunning homosexuals from media attention is not the way to go. I agree that Gay Pride parades are often not the best way for homosexuals to gain attention, but the other side of the spectrum--making homosexuals completely absent in the media--is, in my opinion, the exact wrong way to go.
I believe that homosexuality should be as abundant in the media as heterosexuality. TV shows should depict homosexual relationships alongside heterosexual relationships. Commercial ads should cater to both homosexuals and heterosexuals (given the product they're trying to sell isn't inherently exclusive). Doing this would push for societal acceptance, because suddenly the media--the subconscious-or-not governor of what is "normal" in our culture--would be telling people that it's OK for two men or two women to love one another romantically. We already take so much from the media and apply it to our ideas of what is "supposed to be," so I don't see the problem in throwing homosexuality into the mix, since it is also something that's "supposed to be."
Conversely, I don't believe it's right to just say "leave me alone, gay people. Do what you want, but leave me out of it." Because that's teaching tolerance, not acceptance, and that's giving the message that it's OK to just ignore the things you don't like. Again, tolerating or ignoring stuff is not the way to go--accepting them is. I applaud you for at least not saying "gays suck," but in my eyes, ignoring them (us) is not much better.
Last edited by Grei; 8th November 2011 at 6:58 PM.
Current Omega Ruby team plan
Nobody would get a lawsuit for saying they're straight, don't be ridiculous. Nobody says they're straight on the news because everybody is assumed to be straight, unless stated otherwise. Gay people are a minority.
Nobody is bugging you about it. If there was full acceptance and equality, there would be no need for the parades and media attention.
Last edited by Profesco; 9th November 2011 at 12:28 AM.
Don't you just hate people who use "gay" as an insult, but don't know why that's wrong? Isn't it odd how the media implies that only homosexual people have anal sex?
What on earth are you talking about. There's plenty of straight butt sex on TV. Why do you even post here?
None of those shows have gay anal sex. I don't understand you.
I don't mean to butt in (), but can't the general absence of anal sex on television - whether straight, gay, or otherwise - be explained by the fact that it's anal sex?
"What's it gonna be? I don't know. But maybe along the way, you take my hand, tell a few jokes, and have some fun. C'mon, pal. You're not afraid, are ya?"
Although I hate to tell you guys, but the word 'gay' has meant someone who is sexually loose and indulges in too many pleasures, much longer than it was used as a label for homosexuals. Just calling yourself gay carries the historical assumption that people attracted to the same sex are sexually immoral in the same vein as prostitutes or adulterers. We're trying to remove a meaning that was already ascribed to the word, and it was used in a derogatory manner long before homosexuals (probably called gay because the assumption was if they enjoyed being with the same sex it was extra sexual, and thus 'gay') took the term and made it into something they could own.
I'm really trying hard to keep pointless commentaries out of this thread but I honestly am not seeing the lack of anal sex on television. One show in particular implies it quite regularly, or did before it went to crap; Two and a half men. I'm sure I'm exposed to other references on a daily basis too. I guess homosexual anal sex is pretty non-existent in my experiences but considering where we are in the movement for homosexual acceptance, thats not too surprising.
I think its pretty unfair to keep to the negative stigma surrounding anal sex. Homosexuals are not the only couples who partake in the act and it's been documented in heterosexual interactions for centuries. Want a source (since last time I brought up that point about 2 years ago ppl freaked out) just Google any combination of time period names, art, anal sex and I'm sure you'll find the source you desire. At least I can say that the only time I have the pleasure of hearing some rant about homosexuals, anal sex, and the devil its usually coming form some ill-informed extremest. I suppose that's not really saying much considering most those against either are usually the same type of people.
Last edited by ChedWick; 9th November 2011 at 2:18 AM.
Imagine you just walked in from the rain and your shoes were all muddy and you walked on a floor that was just cleaned and got it all muddy. You didn't mean to mess up the clean floor, but as long as you decided you didn't want to take your shoes off and walked in anyway, just cause you didn't mean to doesn't mean the floor didn't get messed up because you kept walking.
People are too politically correct nowadays, and no one knows how to accept anyone else's opinions nowadays, I can tolerate gays, but that's not enough for some people, they expect me to bow to them or something. F no. I'll be tolerant, and they should be happy with that.
Don't like it? Oh well, it's my opinion, not yours.
"Whether you choose to believe or not, mystic power is and always will be there."
You're may be trying to be tolerant of gays, but you're really not. It was pretty obvious when you said that gay people coming out somehow offends you. You just want gays to disappear from your vision so you don't have to deal with them.
If it upsets you so much that others challenge your statements, then don't incriminate yourself.
You would be analogous to someone who is xenophobic (wants foreigners to piss off) but not actively racist. While the latter is a more serious kind of intolerance, the former is still intolerance.
Letting you exercise bigotry goes beyond merely "respecting your idea", it becomes "giving your ideas credibility in modern society". If you're allowed to ask gay people to piss off, what's to stop racists asking blacks to piss off and Christian extremists asking Muslims to piss off?
Let me try to get this all structured here:
I'm actually all for that, as long as they kept it small (as in the number of people married), because records do have to be kept.
> gay pride parades
I have no issue with these, either. I think it's a beautiful expression of sexuality in a world where many are trying to sweep said sexuality under the carpet because if they can't see it, they think it'll go away. And I think Pride is still serving a purpose: it shows people that we as a culture will not bow to the pressure of the right, and that we will use the rights we haven't been denied in an effort to obtain the ones we have been denied.
> Biblical arguments
As I have always said, you need to look not just at Christianity, or Abrahamic even religion as a whole, but at all sides of religious and spiritual beliefs. Marriage is not merely a Christian tradition, nor is sex/sexuality, and should not be treated as such.
> "gay" as insult
I don't like this, but I'm not passionate about it either way. My common reaction to "you're gay" would be "yes, thank you for noticing". I have a tendency to intentionally take what people say literal to the word, especially if they're using explicit language. The three-letter f word is a smoke, the four-letter one is a beautiful sexual experience, the three-letter a one is of course, a butt. And lame is not something to poke fun at, as I am somewhat lame in that I have a horrible limp and can never walk without pain. So, a "big (f)ing pen" is a large pen that is used for sexual reasons. A "lame-(a) car" is a car that, for whatever reason, not only has a butt, but a butt that hinders its walking ability. After awhile, people tend to use expletives more correctly around me, or just plain less.
> "straight discrimination" (contains copious irony)
Oh, no, Razor, you've figured out our Master Plan. Truth is, we gay people have been reproducing with the assistance of laboratories to start to spread a gene throughout our kind, making us immune to a disease we will later covertly unleash on the unsuspecting public. It will make all breeders our slaves so we will forever rule
MidgardEarth. This is all so we can summon our lords Loki and Pan to forever seal our control on the planet and all its people. But the worst is still to come, as we will do something so heinous, just thinking of it will make you unable to sleep at night. We will... make everyone eat only gourmet food for eternity! That's right, no more McDonald's or Taco Hell. It's Filet Mignon and a nice Burgundy for you! And tomorrow, an Italian Pesto dish![/sarcasm]
Obviously, nothing in that one reply should be taken seriously.
Also, Gergovia's avatar is a quite fitting response to how Razor has been to him.
Stop putting words in my mouth. I never said gay people coming out offends me, either you read it wrong or you just didn't read it after something offended you.
It's funny how some of you people judge, call me a homophobe, etc. when you don't know anything about me. You read what you wanted to read, you saw what you wanted to see. All I said was that I hate it being in the media all the time, I don't mind gays in the media, I don't want to hear ABOUT gays in the media. Like "Old announcer reveals he's gay!" good for him, "Man comes out on national TV!" good for him, what are you doing with this? You are simply putting them in the target for bigots to bash and bash. Let's say there are two guys that work for a TV company and their getting married, I have no problem with them announcing it on TV, they would do the same for straight people getting married. What I have a problem with is turning on the TV and hearing about it all the time. I'd do the same if it had something to do with OWS, immigration reform, anti-racism parades, etc. I support all of those, but I'd be completely sick of hearing about them every second.
But apparently that isn't fair to you, you don't want me to be tolerant, you want me to basically support their cause, whether it kills you inside or not, it's not my job to do that. I believe they should be allowed to get married, but why should they get their 15 minutes of fame simply for being gay? Don't they want to be treated the same? That's exactly how I feel when a Hispanic says they're better than a white person, and I'm half Hispanic, so don't try to call me a racist, it's like "We're fighting for equality aren't we? So why do you expect a better treatment?"
I don't get it, you want me to be tolerant, I am, but now you want me to actually support the cause? How is that my job? If you choose to help them fight for their cause, good for you, god bless your heart, but don't get mad at me cause I don't choose to.
I didn't want to have to go into detail or waste 10 minutes of my life typing this, but you called me a homophobe, and that's offensive to me.
Also, George - whateveryournameis - Stop acting like a victim, you attacked me first, I have a right to defend myself, don't I?
Either don't flame, or expect to be flamed. I flamed you and I expected to be flamed, thus why I choose to ignore half of these posts.
"Whether you choose to believe or not, mystic power is and always will be there."
You guys thought you had this debate pegged right? You thought "Oh they BORN that way" or "Oh, Some traumatic event happened that Made em THAT way"....
What do you think now huh?
Razor Xtreme, you ask why gay people should get to go on TV just because they're coming out of the closet, which in your defense, I've seen, there's the airman and the newscaster I remember in recent history - but the fact is people view 'coming out' as a courageous thing to do, and that's why the get to be featured on TV. Aside from that, why shouldn't they? Is there a reason to keep people from getting more than they deserve? If some gay people get more publicity than they should from coming out of the closet, why exactly is that bad?
And please do not take this thread or what anybody says in it personally. Unless you get physically sick whenever someone criticizes you, you don't need to flame anybody who is impolite to you. It even says that at the beginning of my thread, "Repay insensitivity with politeness."
Gay is here to stay, Like, why is it important to know "WHY GAY?"
Yeah some gays are a bit obnoxious but there are str8 obnoxious people too...
I don't see what makes a "In your face" gay any different from a "In your face" str8 person..