Community POTW #45

[Blue Harvest]

OK Shedinja has a grand total of two usable stats to put EVs and maybe 7 remotely viable moves. Reno don't disappoint me again.

[Dr.Chaos]

There's a reason why Shedinja is really only used in Uber and NU(I think?). Passive damage kills it. You should only send out Shedinja as a late game sweeper. You only need to put Evs in 2 stats. Shedinja actually has everything it really needs if it can stay alive long enough to abuse it.

[ThatsJustPeachy]

shedinja rhymes with ninja, nuff said


Edit: Reno's last log in date

Last Activity: 21st August 2011 7:34 AM

nuff said

[Blue Harvest]

Shedinja isn't even good in Ubers anymore. Ferrothorn is almost as much of a death sentence as Tyranitar is. Ferrothorn kills Shedinja with Leech Seed or Toxic, sets ups Spikes / SR that doom Shedinja and kills it simply by switching in on an attack thanks to Iron Barbs or whatever the ability is.

Shedinja is REALLY BAD in 6v6 singles. He's actually not terrible in 3v3 team preview wifi matches. A great psychological weapon just having it in team preview. The two turns it has to attack are much more important.

[No. 1 Machop Fan]

Shedinja is my no. 1 favourite Pokemon to use competitively! If I can fit it into a team, I will!

Here's a set one could use on a Trick Room team:

Shedinja @ Focus Sash
Brave, Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 Atk/252 SpD
IVs: 0 Def/0 Spe
- Swords Dance/Sunny Day
- Shadow Sneak/Shadow Claw
- X-Scissor
- Return/Protect/Sunny Day/Aerial Ace/Will-o-wisp/Shadow Claw/Sucker Punch

Shedinja's low Speed means it's usable on a Trick Room team if you use a little imagination. X-Scissor is your standard STAB attack, Shadow Sneak is for priority against slower Pokemon and outside Trick Room, and/or you can use Shadow Claw for a secondary STAB move. Swords Dance can be used to boost Attack once while your Sash protects you, or twice if the opponent switches. Sunny Day helps protect against Hail and Sandstorm, and also lures out such weather inducers who subsequently get their heads chopped off with X-Scissor.

That last slot, naturally, is a filler slot. Return and Aerial Ace are there for coverage, or Will-o-wisp to cripple physical attackers like Tyranitar (watch out for Magic Bouncers!)

The EVs that normally go into Speed can instead go into Special Defence to deny Download users their precious Special Attack boost.

[FlameX]

Just saying, but if Focus Sash and Pain Split were used on the same set, you could gradually drain the opponents HP, while Shedinja and its HP of 1 get no damage until the opponent's on 1 HP. Focus Sash prevents it from having its HP taken away. After that, use any move.
Could someone put this in a set?

[Blue Harvest]

Just saying, but if Focus Sash and Pain Split were used on the same set, you could gradually drain the opponents HP, while Shedinja and its HP of 1 get no damage until the opponent's on 1 HP. Focus Sash prevents it from having its HP taken away. After that, use any move.
Could someone put this in a set?

Focus Sash can only be used once (its a single use item) and Shedinja doesn't even learn Pain Split.

[Zachmac]

Well, it's got a nice niche in rotation battles. It's probably going to want a teammate with rain dance or sunny day there(in rotations, rotating t-tar back in won't recreate the sandstorm). If you pair it up with a dark type, you're enemy may struggle to decide what move to use. You'll want protect on at least one teammate, so you can scout and mess with your enemy.

I wouldn't use it outside of rotation or Ubers, though.

[Kraleck]

Well, it's got a nice niche in rotation battles. It's probably going to want a teammate with rain dance or sunny day there(in rotations, rotating t-tar back in won't recreate the sandstorm). If you pair it up with a dark type, you're enemy may struggle to decide what move to use. You'll want protect on at least one teammate, so you can scout and mess with your enemy.

I wouldn't use it outside of rotation or Ubers, though.

You spark an interesting point from me, Zachmac. Why aren't there more bits about Rotation in the Multi Battle options? Or much of Multi at all?

Granbull does so much better in Multi opposed to Singles, so why not put more on other Pokemon relating to Multi? Maybe having Shedinja this week will help with that...

[Ilan]

Shedinja isn't suited to use in OU or UU in both tiers sandsteam teams are common and hail exists (even more in UU) so we are left with RU,NU and ubers ubers is a problem cause there is ferrothorn too but surprisingly it can do well there.

It have really bad stats (final gambit shedinja FTW!) it's main set was mentioned it's main niche is to force sweepers and choice users switch and toxic/will-o-wisp something.

it so well versus psychics I tink it is able to KO alakazam with shadow sneak (not sure if boosted or not) it have baton pass but can't abuse it cause it get normally 2 turns if well played and proper team support you can reach a situation where your rival doesn't have anything that can take you down! and from there it is an autowin!

[_Calm|Mind_]

Shedinja @ Mental Herb
Trait: Sturdy & Magic Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Shadow Force
- Close Combat
- Megahorn
- Dragon Dance

Fuck yeah!!!

[Ilan]

Shedinja @ Mental Herb
Trait: Sturdy & Magic Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Shadow Force
- Close Combat
- Megahorn
- Dragon Dance

Fuck yeah!!!

That will never happen this disscussion is for LEGAL sets not hacked ones!

if you hack like this just hack wonder guard into skarmory or something useful..

anyway is there any chance choice band/ choice scarf shedinja would work?

[Garch0mp0utrage]

Shedinja... terrible in OU, UU, (and quite possibly RU..) But somewhat of a dread to ubers... Ironic isn't it?


set name: The Uber's Worst Nightmare (Maybe...)
Shedinja @ Muscle band/Focus Sash
EV's and Nature: Adamant (spd-,atk+) 252 atk, 252 spd

Moveset:
Shadow Sneak
Willo-Wisp/Toxic/Confuse Ray
Willo-Wisp/Toxic/Confuse Ray
X-Scissor/Sucker Punch

Mainly support here. For Ubers, switch into a poke that won't be able to hit Shedinja and begin to cripple your opponents team with extremely annoying supporting moves. In OU, it would be good to use this thing as a lead, but is still so dreadfully risky.. Shadow Sneak is priority+stab. Willo-Wisp can hurt ferro and forre while toxic can cripple any Pokemon that try to switch in to shedinja. Confuse Ray is like putting your opponent throuh Dark Cave all over again. X-Scissor is for stab. Sucker Punch, while not really the best of an option, can be a useful move when your facing a quicker opponent.

[Flippd]

This is definitely best used as a lead, so that entry hazards don't become a big problem. It also works as a spin blocker, so that helps, too.

Dark Ninja
Shedinja @ Focus Sash
Wonder Guard
Adamant/Jolly
252 Speed, 252 Attack
-Shadow Sneak
-Shadow Claw
-X-Scissor
-Dig

Shadow Sneak for some priority. Shadow Claw and X-Scissor are fore main STAB. Dig because it takes care of Rock-types and if the opponent uses EQ, you're still safe.

Special Ninja
Shedinja @ Focus Sash
Wonder Guard
Timid/Modest
252 Speed, 252 Sp Attack
-Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power (Water)
-Silver Wind/Bug Buzz
-Giga Drain

Considering it's dismal Sp Attack stat, I don't know who or why someone would use this set. Shadow Ball is a great STAB. Silver Wind or Bug Buzz is really up to you. Silver Wind gets the chance to raise all of it's stats (though the only to useful ones are Speed and Sp Attack) while Bug Buzz has more power and a Special Defense drop chance. HP Water takes out two of it's weaknesses. Giga Drain just for coverage and it really gets no better Special moves.

Support Ninja
Shedinja @ Focus Sash
Wonder Guard
Jolly
252 Speed, 252 Attack
-X-Scissor/Shadow Claw
-Confuse Ray
-Will-O-Wisp/Toxic
-Grudge/Spite

X-Scissor and Shadow Claw are there so you're not Taunt bait. Which one you choose is up to you. Confuse Ray is great. Nothing more needs to be said about it. Will-O-Wisp can destroy Physical sweepers like Haxorus (which will destroy this little bug due to Mold Breaker anyways) or Tyrannitar (which will Sandstorm or Crunch you to death), while Toxic can get rid of Pokemon with considerable bulk, like Blissey and Slowking. Grudge and Spite both lower PP, albeit Grudge completely destroys the PP but only if it faints. Spite lowers the PP of the last move used by 4 right off the bat, so again, it's a matter of personal preference.

Ah, as partners go, and you're not using it as a lead, anything that can change the weather to something more desirable or spin away entry hazards or you're not using this is a lead will work just fine. Here are a couple of examples:

Politoed @ Lum Berry/Choice Specs
Drizzle
Timid/Modest
252 Speed, 252 Sp Attack, 4 Hp
-Psychic
-Focus Blast
-Ice Beam
-Surf

This set is basically just a standard. Changes weather away from Hail or Sandstorm to Rain. Not bad.

Tentacruel @ Wise Glasses
Clear Body/Liquid Ooze
Timid/Modest
252 Speed, 252 Sp Attack, 4 Hp
-Rapid Spin
-Toxic Spikes
-Surf
-Blizzard

I use this set in my Soul Silver and it works wonders. It can spin away hazards while setting them up. Surf and Blizzard are just two amazing moves on their own, so that's why they're there.

Just a question: Can Wonder Guard be Skill Swapped? Because that then opens up huge options for a team.

Yeah, if you have a Reuniclus with Skill Swap and a Sableye/Spiritomb, you can use Wonder Guard to make Sableye/Spiritomb being hit by almost nothing

[MajinYoshi]

As for partners, it NEEDS a spinner and someone to take care of weather. And obviously don't mention all that Skill Swap onto Spiritomb nonsence.

[Blue Harvest]

Skill Swap does not work with Wonderguard.


My prediction for the next POTW:

Reno lists the primary set, somehow missing a key option or making some minor error. Probably won't be a big deal since Shedinja has two stats that can use EVs and probably 7 usable moves.

He lists a secondary toxic-stall confusion set.

He then describes in great detail how good Shedinja is in Ubers despite this being wrong since early 4th gen. In doubles / triples he will probably mention Skill Swap even though it doesn't work.

[Zachmac]

In gen 5, Shedinja would work best in rotations. It's too bad POTW doesn't have a section for that, I think it needs to get one.

[Eranu™]

I think shedinja is great for in ubers.
It has to have a rapid spinner as a partner which sucks though.
From my experience a set of

Shedinja
Adamant
Focus Sash -Wonder guard

252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 SpAtk
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Sneak
- X-scissor
- Dig

[windsong]

shedinja is literally not useable in any tier.

Ubers got Ferrothorn (as well as an increase in Tyranitar usage) so Shedinja isn't doing anything there other than switching into Ogre once before the opponent brings in Ferro and kills it with its ability.

OU has Sand, Ferrothorn, and hazards ****ing everywhere, along with spinblockers capable of stopping basically all common spinners. No.

UU is a metagame of Sand and Hail now, lol. And UU has more viable Spikers than any other tier -- so much so that nearly all the teams in the metagame carry either Spikes (and no spinners break through many common RU spinblockers) or have Hail / Sand.

Shedinja even sort of sucks in RU, tbh. Snover's not all that uncommon, and many of the main threatening things in the metagame -- Entei, Honchkrow, Lilligant, Gallade, etc, all hit Shedinja through Wonder Guard. Also all of the Spinners in RU match up pretty badly against most of the common spinblockers.

Hell, it's even terrible in NU, because basically all of the dominant threats carry moves that hit SE (through wonderguard).

Sheddy had literally one niche last gen; as an Ubers wall, since most of the main Ubers STABs didn't touch it. However, with the new 5th gen metagame, this has changed significantly, and Shedinja lost basically its only useable niche.

[Trickster44]

As everyone else has said, Shedinja's ability isn't all that great, no matter how interesting it is. Perhaps another Pokemon, like a Metagross, or even an Altaria, could be seen inder review. I don't usually look on Smogon or anything like that, I just like to trust those Pokemon that I have stuck with since I have begun playing.

[Serpentine]

The only real reason to have Shedinja on your team is as a psych out. By seeing it on the team preview, your opponent will put in something that can kill it and it may not be the best choice against your team.

[Serpentine]

Shedinja
Focus Sash
Adamant
252 Atk/252 Spd/ 4 Sp Def

Shadow Claw
X-Scissor
Swords Dance
Dig

Dig to avoid damage. Shadow Claw and X-Scissor at its strongest moves that get STAB and Swords Dance doubles attack.

Sandstorm-Shedinja distracts the opponent from attacking your other Pokemon and if you're running a sandstorm team, you might save your Pokemon an extra turn.
Sunny Day-Same thing as Sandstorm, pretty much.
Facade when it has an Orb-You can switch with Lopunny and still deal major damage. You'll die anyways so might as well go out with a bang.
Giga Impact-Again, serious damage.
Protect-Avoid damage and distract your opponent.
Secret Power-Good attakc power and it can cause a status and since competitive battling is done in a building you may put the opponent to sleep.
Sucker Punch-Priorityy and you can hit hardish.

Ironic Moves:
Dream Eater-Other than its high attack power, it's useless to Shedinja since it can't heal it.
Substitute-I'm curious about it. What happens if a Shedinja uses it?
Rest-Again, useless. You can't even use it to use Snore.
Final Gambit-Really? It can only deal one point of damage.
Giga Drain-No point again. Maybe more coverage but that's it.
Leech Life-Can't heal and it's weak. There are stronger Bug moves anyways.

[Black Murder Heavangelon]

Shedinja@Focus Sash
Wonder Guard - Adamant/Jolly
252 Atk - 252 Spe
-Sucker Punch
-X-Scissor
-Swords Dance/Screech
-Dig/Shadow Claw/Thief/Grudge

A Shedinja I use, for Ubers specifically. Haven't seen a Ferrothorn up there at all.

Anyways. Shedinja has this profound ability to cause switches by sheer presence alone. In which case, you should either Swords Dance or Screech. Should you do meet a Ferrothorn upon switching in, well, bring in your Magnezone for the KO. There, problem solved. Anyways, Sucker Punch is the preferred priority move over Shadow Sneak as Sucker Punch is still stronger even without STAB. Nails Psychics and Ghosts before they can KO you. X Scissor for a basic STAB that murders Psychics and Darks, and Grass types too. Dig for some Steel coverage, but enough SDs can make those 2HKOs with X Scissor. Shadow Claw for another reliable STAB with a crit chance, but Sucker Punch has the same coverage. Thief works a little funny. If you're about to get KOd, knowing you're attacks aren't going to do enough damage, you can steal their item and cripple them before going down. Grudge seems a little less practical, but completely removing a potential STAB or SE move from play for your next pokemon is very important. Like, say you use Grudge and a Conkeldurr use Payback. OOPS! All gone. And he can't do anything to your next Ghost type. VERY HANDY for monoteams like you have no idea.

Shedinja needs some goddamn Rapid Spin support and a weather disspeller. Rain and Sun teams remedy this, especially choiced Drought and Drizzle pokemon.

[menametlg]

Endure the Pain
@Focus Sash/Lum Berry
Naughty/Hasty [ 252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 SpAtk]
-Endure/Heal Block
-Toxic/Will-o-Wisp/Protect
-Swords Dance/Shadow Sneak
-X-Scissor

Since Shedinja only have 1 HP, its good to attach Focus Sash on him but since Focus Sash can't block Toxic, Confusion and Will-o-Wisp effect, you can stick with Lum Berry and teach him Endure instead. Heal Block prevent healing, good with Toxic or Will-o-Wisp. Swords Dance is for boost will Shadow Sneak is a move that go before the opponent. X-Scissor is a strong STAB.

Support
@Lum Berry/Focus Sash
Naughty/Hasty [ 252 Atk, 252 Spd, 4 SpAtk]
-X-Scissor
-Will-O-Wisp/Toxic
-Heal Block
-Protect/Grudge

X-Scissor is a STAB move. Will-o-wisp and Toxic are status. Heal Block prevent them from healing the status. Protect stall the status while Grudge kills you will fully depletes the opponent's last move.

Other options...

DIG. Since Shedinja is not affected with Earthquake, it can serve as protection while dealing lot of damage.
Confuse Ray. Good combination with Toxic.
Night Slash. A Good move that hurt Ghost type.
Sucker Punch. A priority move that hurt Ghost Type.

Countering
Any pokemon that knows Fire, Ghost, Dark, Rock and Flying can kill him instantly. Gastro Acid, Mummy, Entertainment, Worry Seed, Mold Breaker and Simple Beam will also counter Shedinja that easy. Sucker Punch is also the best move to kill Shedinja.

[Vodka Haze]

Sableye should have gotten Wonder Guard in the DW :P

The only real reason to have Shedinja on your team is as a psych out. By seeing it on the team preview, your opponent will put in something that can kill it and it may not be the best choice against your team.

Or to just win if your opponent doesn't have anything to counter it. Seriously, that's so annoying when you don't have any moves that can kill it.