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Thread: Brock wasn't intended to be the first Gym Leader in Red & Green - Thoughts?

  1. #1
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    Default Brock wasn't intended to be the first Gym Leader in Red & Green - Thoughts?

    So I figure I'll open this up for discussion.

    With the new Bandai figure for Brock in his Red & Green pose coming in Japan, presumably as a start to the 20th anniversary, Ken Sugimori tweeted some of his original artwork for it



    Now, some people noticed that the numbers beneath the Gym Leaders were offset by one, and Sugimori responded with posting another part of it, showcasing another trainer as being #1



    So it appears that things could have turned out differently for us and that kid could have been the Viridian City Gym Leader.

    Certainly interesting stuff

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    Honestly, I'm really surprised that Brock wasn't meant to be the first Gym Leader of Red and Green but this kid who's meant to be the first Gym Leader... what type of Pokémon would he had used-_-

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    Maybe flying, it would be strange if the first 2 gymleaders had ground and rock type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Serebii View Post
    So I figure I'll open this up for discussion.

    With the new Bandai figure for Brock in his Red & Green pose coming in Japan, presumably as a start to the 20th anniversary, Ken Sugimori tweeted some of his original artwork for it



    Now, some people noticed that the numbers beneath the Gym Leaders were offset by one, and Sugimori responded with posting another part of it, showcasing another trainer as being #1



    So it appears that things could have turned out differently for us and that kid could have been the Viridian City Gym Leader.

    Certainly interesting stuff
    He shares some design similarities with Sabrina, they both have a similar pin and seem to be wearing similar shoes, not to mention they have the same facial expression, they could have been siblings, although it just may be and probably was a design choice.

    I don't seem to be able to see a number under Sabrina I don't want to assume anything because the paper may be at an angle that does not allow the number to be seen but perhaps she was meant as an Elite Four member considering Saffron city had two gyms.

    I also noticed that the flag on LT. Surge's shirt looks like a French/Italian/Irish flag or perhaps it's something entirely different.

    Back to the mystery #1 Kid he looks like a youngster so I would assume he was a normal type gym leader.
    Last edited by Zorocario; 18th June 2015 at 10:55 AM.

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    My guess is Bug types
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    Insteresting... ^^
    I think it would be a locigal step for the first games' first Gym Leader to have Normal types. And he looks a lot like a Youngster. I would say he would've used Rattata for sure and maybe Spearow.
    Or he would've been a second Psychic type Gym Leader beside Sabrina? Maybe a younger brother or a student of Sabrina? Maybe that's the reason why he was cut out... they decided to have the Gym Leaders specialize in unique types no other Leader of the region specializes in.
    Last edited by Hasty Jynx; 18th June 2015 at 5:55 PM.
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    In hindsight Brock is an odd choice for the first as the first gym leader, two starters stomp his gym easily and the other has enough trouble that you might need to catch a mankey and level grind it. Its quite unbalanced. The other guy looks a little unpleasant, probably a flying leader or something.

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    That's shocking. Wow. Alright then. I would have to assume that it would have been a Normal-Type gym, which would have made a whole lot of sense. I've always found it kind of strange that Rock was the first gym in so many games. Normal is arguably the weakest type there is, and one of the most commonly encountered types at the beginning of the game, and yet we don't see a Normal-Type gym as the first gym until Black and White 2.

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    was the speculation that Bruno was originally the first GL, but looked too tough and was replaced ever substantiated beyond their hexadecimal values (Bruno is 233, Brock is 234 with the rest of GLs following in order)?

    are the images in the OP the only ones, or is there an image of a complete page of GLs?

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    Interesting. Unless Brock's type was different during the original stages, I could see why he wouldn't have meant to be first.

    As for the kid he could have been anything! I'm banking on Normal/Ground type.
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    The other Gym Leader's design looked boring even compared to Brock's imo, so I'm glad he was cut. Ken should release more old artwork and sketches in my opinion.

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    Thank you for sharing!
    It is indeed interesting to see that they had another first gym leader in mind.
    I wonder if they will ever re-use the model of that youngster-like gym leader in the next gens.....obviously after getting a remodelling.
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    Given that kid was supposed to be the first GL and the fact that it was supposed to be near Pallet, my guess is he would be using Normal-type Pokémon or Pokémon that inhabited the surrounding areas of Viridian (Pidgey, Rattata etc.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero of Truth View Post
    Given that kid was supposed to be the first GL and the fact that it was supposed to be near Pallet, my guess is he would be using Normal-type Pokémon or Pokémon that inhabited the surrounding areas of Viridian (Pidgey, Rattata etc.)
    I think he would've taken Giovanni's place as Viridian's Gym Leader, so I feel that he might've used Ground-types.

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    IDK. He looks kind of odd to me, but...

    As for the type, only Bug and Normal really make much sense, due to Viridian Forest holding the main Bugs, and Normal's the most available type at that stage in the game. Although, Flying wouldn't be too Farfetch'd, given you get Pidgey and Butterfree nearby...
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    I agree with the Bug assumptions. It would have made the most sense in regards to the starters, I think. One super effective and resists it, one super effective and weak to it, and one neutral to it. Better than two being super effective and one being weak to it (as Brock is).

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    Didn't really expect this to be the case. I always thought the Kanto Gym order and Gym Leader order as we know it was planned to be that way from the very beginning. But considering the many development changes and things that were changed in general during the development of the first generation games, this shouldn't be that much of a surprise, I guess. The kid's design partly reminds me of several trainer classes from R/B/Y but I don't feel that he is a complete resemblance any of them. Like others, I am interested in what type he would have specialized in. I also wonder which Gym Leader ended up replacing him, assuming there were always supposed to be 8 Gym Leaders from the very beginning. Giovanni seems like the most logical choice but I don't know.

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    Not that surprising to me to be honest. Pikachu wasn't always the mascot, either.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Noheart View Post
    Not that surprising to me to be honest. Pikachu wasn't always the mascot, either.
    I think it's Clefairy that was originally meant to be the mascot.

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    Hm I'm guessing he could have used normal types. I'm guessing he may have used Rattata, Pidgey, and Spearow if he really was the gym leader of Viridian city.

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    I also noticed that he has the same badge/emblem as Sabrina too, so maybe he was scrapped because his design was slightly similar to hers. I even wonder if maybe they would've been related.

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    Of course Brock is number 2! He has always been at the second gym!!! We just simply could never enter the 1st gym until the end of the game!
    Someone once told me that Misty's cameos in Advanced Generation help make it easier knowing that she is no longer a series regular. They couldn't have been more wrong. After she leaves behind Togepi she returns to her gym more alone than ever AND ON TOP OF THAT, her last cameo was in 2005. 2005!?!?!? ITS BEEN TEN YEARS SINCE ONE OF THE CAST WHO STARTED THE SHOW WAS ACTUALLY ON THE SHOW!?!?

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    If he was meant to be Viridian, maybe they ultimately figured it was too early for a boss fight...


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    Awesome find!

    Yeah, since this original first gym leader looks to be younger than the other 7, I would say he would have specialized in Normal types.
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    His pose looks similar to Giovanni's sprite from Gen 1.



    If he wasn't going to be a Ground-type leader, perhaps some aspects of his design were recycled into Giovanni? I hope Sugimori posts more of these so we get a bigger picture.

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