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Thread: Pokémon Shuffle Mega Viability Rankings V2

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    Default Pokémon Shuffle Mega Viability Rankings V2

    ~Mega Viability Rankings~


    Say hello to the V2 of Pokémon Shuffle Mega Viability Rankings.

    Shuffle is not a hardcore or competitive game by any means, but as in any Pokémon game some naturally stand out more than others, and like other recent games Mega Evolution is a key feature in Shuffle. Here we will organize a list ranking the different Mega Evolutions for their general usefulness in this mess of a game to provide a reference for what Megas are most effective. For those familiar with Smogon viability rankings, this will function similarly to their tier rankings. Remember that this is a group effort so if you disagree with where something is placed feel free to suggest a change.


    Resources:
    First version.
    Mega Evolution Rates and Speedup Tables.




    A rank
    These are the most effective Megas currently in the game. Most of the time they are your first choice in a stage, as they will generally be the most effective due to their ability to set up combos, quick Mega Evolution and/or efficiency with clearing the board of unwanted disruptions. However they aren't almighty and not necessarily the best option for every occasion.




    B rank
    The equivalent of the Over Used tier, as they are effective in many situations and may sometimes be the best choice, especially if Super Effective. They might lack the ability to set up combos efficiently or may take longer to Mega Evolve, but these Megas will often perform well in their given role.




    C rank
    This Megas manage themselves relatively well on their respective areas, but the presence of better options or key flaws limit their effectiveness, so they end up not being used as often. However there are still many situations where they can still be the best option or a good alternative.




    D rank
    Megas in this rank have notable flaws that keep them from being stronger outside of specific cases or type advantage. These Megas aren't necessarily ineffective and might be useful in determinated situations or in an specific niche, but they tend to be less reliable than Megas above.




    E rank
    Megas in this rank are only useful for a very specific niche or situation and tend to perform very poorly outside of it. They might have notable flaws that keep them from being usable elsewhere or they may be completely outperformed by another similar Mega. There are stages where these Megas stand out but they should not be relied upon most of the time. Closely related to the Never Used tier.




    F rank
    The Audino rank. These Megas are those that may have utility in the earlier stages of the game but quickly become outclassed as other Megas become available, or maybe they simply came too late to be used anymore. Whether it's due to low power or being completely outcasted by other Megas, they see little to no use once other options become available, ideal for our Tutorial Mega and it's friends.

    Last edited by komedy27u; 30th April 2016 at 5:26 AM. Reason: Mega Manetric and Mega Ampharos on the same rank (C)


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  2. #2
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    I asked permission to Psynergy to open a V2 for this thread, so that I can updated it more often ^^

    Currently it's only a copy of the old one with the latest Megas that were discussed before. Also removed the references as they are outdated and don't seem to be alive, I'll add that info later on.

    Since this is a new page in this ranking, and the game has seen some big changes recently, it would be the best time to make some changes to they way the Ranking are represented. To that end, I'd like to know the opinion of the community before hand:



    Should we add + and - to the tiers?
    This may or may not reduce the list to A, B, and C Ranks.


    Should we make a separate list with Mega Speedups and Raise Max Level into consideration?
    Example: Charizard formally had a Max 80AP and evolved at 16 icons, now could have 105AP and evolve at 11 icons.


    Should we create a "Niche" Rank for those that don't fit other ranks, yet aren't better or worse for that?
    Or even a S-Rank if items are considered.


    What the heck do we do with MRay?
    S-Rank, B-Rank, really, What?
    Last edited by komedy27u; 27th March 2016 at 12:35 AM.


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    I think our current rankings are fine. Adding +/- tiers or an S Rank only really makes sense to break apart the C Rank tier. But C Rank's the average and I don't think it makes sense to split it up right now

    I also don't agree with a Niche ranking. Right now it'd just be Aero & Steelix and that's covered fine with D Rank.

    I still think Mega Ray should be B Rank. Like I've said before, when Mega Ray gets going it's super useful in most cases for reasons why Mega Gengar can still get good usage on NFE or NEutral stages.
    But it's getting there that's the problem. Otherwise it requires Mega Start or some candies applied. Even the upcoming Mega Boost+ dragon (Zygarde 10%) won't be that useful due to low power (Mawile & Steelix at least get the strong Jirachi) and not disappearing due to the effect's no dragon caveat.

    I also want to avoid a mega speed up list both because it's still difficult to get them and because there's some logic in spreading them around. But also, because, like, it would only really effect Mega Ray's ranking. He's the only one I've seen where it's basically a requirement and would drastically effect his placement. Meanwhile I don't think even the mega lollipops would cause Sableye to go jumping up a bunch of places and the C Rank plateau would still be pretty C Rank

    e: Also MLUs have the issue of only being on a very small selection of megas. Both charizards, venusaur, blastoise, sableye & altaria off the top of my head. Not worth having a list at this point, honestly.

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    Splitting up C-Rank seems fine but the others can stay where it is at the moment simply because C-Rank is rather crowded. Otherwise do not split the rankings at all.

    WRT Speedups and Max Levels we have ten Speedups and two RML's readily available from a casual standpoint assuming casuals can make Level 51 of any escalation battle (Gira1, Cress, Darkrai, Passcode, Gira2, Keld1, Keld2, Kyurem, Darkrai2, Mission) so you can theoretically max out any mega bar Rayquaza but can only increase Max Level of affected megas by two at most so the latter is irrelevant while the former can have some relevance, but I do not think it will affect the list that much at all bar Rayquaza being solid A and maybe Garchomp in A.

    I wouldn't be opposed to creating an "Aerodactyl Rank" for those really binary megas (that is, either they are one of the best for the stage or they are terrible with no middle ground) between C and D for things like Aero, Steelix, Diancie, and Mawile, but I am not attached to the issue.

    If we are not factoring Speedups, then Mega Rayquaza has no business being in A and should simply be dropped to B. You might have the game's best effect but if you never mega evolve in most cases and your Mega Boosters cannot be affected by your effect, then you aren't that great.

    Also talking about B Rank, I believe we should move Mega Mewtwo X into B Rank and not the D Rank it is currently in. It might be an endgame mega, but of all the Fighting-types, it is by far the most practical; I can name many scenarios where I would rather run a MMX Fighting squad over Lucario/Medicham optimise. Before anyone mentions its initial Psychic-typing, I do not think it is that relevant at all because at most, you will only miss out on 1,125 DMG. That is assuming no speedup investment at all. This loss in damage output is generally only relevant in about 2% of scenarios as otherwise, you either belt the opponent or lose by miles in the other 98%. MMX also comes with great support in Machamp for Ejecting, Gallade who really helps patch up the MMX team's block weakness, and Lucario who can increase damage output with Pummel. It's no different to Mega Blaziken, and that is in B. It is certainly better than anything in D, is much more practical than pretty much anything in C as well, and compares favourably to those in B at the moment. After all, how is a Mega that is "still effective in many situations and will generally pull their weight in stages, especially when they're Super Effective" and something that "performs well in their given role" in D?

    I feel the rankings can be tooled around a bit, but MMX definitely feels out of place where it is at the moment.

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    I don't haveI would not put Mawile in its own "Niche" rank, honestly.

    The reason I pushed for C Rank eventually is because Mawile is effectively your only Steel option and has managed to carry the bulk of the game, even in scenarios where type effectiveness overlaps thanks to its mega effect. That's not Niche. Compare with Aero, who you'd only bring in for the super disruptive ones, or Steelix, who you only bring in on SE with tons of Metal Blocks. The times where you will wind up using Mawile trump the times where you'll use Aerodactyl & Steelix.

    Also this might be looking ahead a bit, but if Aggron is a Good Steel Mega I just want to say that Mawile should be pushed to D at worst and not E like Sableye. Mawile was around for like half the game and that needs to be recognized.

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    For now, we're probably fine with the Ranks and I don't like the idea of+/- Ranks. If anything we should split C into two ranks and change D and E into E and F. I also think it'd be best to leave the list without Speedups/Lollis for now. Lollis especially since there is only one Mega they'd have a decent effect on and isn't enough to get it up a rank. Charizard Y isn't A Rank material even with 105 AP.

    I'm kinda torn on Mega Rayquaza, it has been not performing well for me at all and yet it was far more effective than Gengar during Diancie's Escalation with the Boss Battles. B feels too low for it and A is kinda high so I dunno. I guess A for now.

    Anyhow some other possible rank changes: Medicham and Absol for B Rank? I believe Medicham was discussed a bit in the other topic. But basically it is a Fighting Mega who can boost itself to evolve in a similar speed to Lucario and can combo sometimes (although not very often). If some combos do happen, it easily outdamages Lucario. Its clear is also more of a defensive pattern keeping the middle clear helps keep combos possible.

    Absol for B Rank is more or less because Ghosts and Dark struggle heavily with disruptions on the board and Absol is one of the few that can clear them. The others being Sharpedo who can't really get the disruptions below it and Sableye whom is well.... Sableye. Apart from Absol, our best Ghost/Darks for fighting disruptions are Trevenant with Swap+ and Bisharp with Rock Break+. There are no Barrier Bash+ nor Block Smash+ Pokemon. There aren't even high powered Barrier Bash and Block Smash Pokemon to use.

    Garchomp to A? If Mega Rayquaza stays in A, does Garchomp belong in there too? If not, Garchomp is just on the border. Great type coverage, Mega effect and power. It has some competition, but it often outperforms even Mega Rayquaza in my experience.

    Blastoise to D? Disappointing Mega effect, disappointing power and disappointing coverage. It's just so disappointing even with the Raise Max Levels available for it. I mean coverage alone it has to fight with Glalie and Garchomp off the top of my head, whom are far superior Megas in just about every way. Has some little use in Timed and that's about it.

    Charizard X to E Rank? How did this even end up in D? I see more use with the Normal Megas in Timed than with this Mega.

    Diancie to D? Despite original impressions, it has some very limited use on Finneon and a few other stages with heavy amounts of Barriers (such as Mega Glalie.) You'll still likely need to Mega Start it however.

    Blaziken & Swampert to D? I know not happening, but each thread can use this suggestion. Still despise these Megas on Turn Based. Some use in Timed but that's it.
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    Ok, no + or -, but splitting C Rank. In the process, borderline Megas in current B and D can be moved, so if there's any particular case (Like MMX) do mention it.

    No niche Rank, each mega on it's own value, I may change the description of D (soon E) since not all niches may go to the same Rank.

    About candies, I still feel we should consider them, but agree that it should be VERY limited, with 10 candies (or less) available for casual players, and no lollis yet. This means that MChomp can be considered for A but MRay can't, so I'll move it to B until another consensus is reached. I'll wait to see if more people appear ^^



    Now, my opinions:

    MMX: I agree D (soon E) might be too low. So D (New) feels better

    MCharX: It was the result of the previous thread, to be fair it's almost completely useless and F sounds more fitting.

    Absol: C, since it has way too much competition, though it is usefull.

    Ampharos: E, I stopped using this after MRay appeared.

    MBlast: D, I also stopped using it, but on disruptive timed stages is still a solid option.

    MGarde: C, works well with PixiePower though MRay may move it to D if it eventually gets to A.

    Lati@s: D. MRay eats them, but they're better options itemless and candyless.

    Manetric: D, I used it once or twice on SE stages, more consistent (imo) than Amp.

    Mawile: C, unfortunately we still have nothing better against fairy u.u

    Medicham: C, personally I don't see many combos and the disruptions clearing is limited, some people have managed great things with it though so there's something there I'm not seeing (or else it'll be D).

    Swampert: D. Very disappointing that the extra combos don't do much, MBlaze Needs pyre and Swamp has nothing u.u

    MVenu: D. Have you seen MSceptile? The sole possibility of that mega kills MVenu, also the fact that there are better options for every SE stage including MRay.

    MChomp: A. Only if candies are considered, but this fella has saved my hearts many times ^^


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    For me, it seems like it is getting harder not to consider speed-ups in some capacity. The difference between 0 and 10 speed-up 'Chomp is huge; and I bet it is the same for M-Ray (I've not put any speed-ups into him). Maybe we could consider a subset of Megas that we list twice, where one is w/o candies and one is with them. Notably, candies don't make a huge difference for all of them. For example, M-Glalie is a solid Mega without candies and gets markedly better with them. HOWEVER, even saying that, he probably a B rank both ways. I suspect M-Luke is in a similar position. Probably most megas are in that position--i.e. speed-ups make them better, but not a tier better. Off the top of my head, 'Chomp and M-Ray are the two that defy that rule--possibly making it worth the notation.

    I also support moving M-Blaze down to C or so. I get that he's good in some circumstances, but there are a lot where he isn't--doesn't sound like B to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by R_N View Post
    I think our current rankings are fine. Adding +/- tiers or an S Rank only really makes sense to break apart the C Rank tier. But C Rank's the average and I don't think it makes sense to split it up right now

    I also don't agree with a Niche ranking. Right now it'd just be Aero & Steelix and that's covered fine with D Rank.

    I still think Mega Ray should be B Rank. Like I've said before, when Mega Ray gets going it's super useful in most cases for reasons why Mega Gengar can still get good usage on NFE or NEutral stages.
    But it's getting there that's the problem. Otherwise it requires Mega Start or some candies applied. Even the upcoming Mega Boost+ dragon (Zygarde 10%) won't be that useful due to low power (Mawile & Steelix at least get the strong Jirachi) and not disappearing due to the effect's no dragon caveat.

    I also want to avoid a mega speed up list both because it's still difficult to get them and because there's some logic in spreading them around. But also, because, like, it would only really effect Mega Ray's ranking. He's the only one I've seen where it's basically a requirement and would drastically effect his placement. Meanwhile I don't think even the mega lollipops would cause Sableye to go jumping up a bunch of places and the C Rank plateau would still be pretty C Rank

    e: Also MLUs have the issue of only being on a very small selection of megas. Both charizards, venusaur, blastoise, sableye & altaria off the top of my head. Not worth having a list at this point, honestly.
    Kinda agree with all of this.
    Also agree with the last posted that Blaziken shouldn't be B.

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    it might be good to add a link to this page which has all the details about how many candies each 'mon can take and the effect it has on their evolution speed: https://www.reddit.com/r/PokemonShuf...table_updated/

    I actually think that the ratings as they currently are are pretty good. I do agree with Aesnath that the effect of candies on some megas does mean that they would be in a different tier. Most wouldn't matter, a fully candied audino is still going to be completely useless, but a completely candied garchomp or rayquaza is a different matter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aesnath View Post
    For me, it seems like it is getting harder not to consider speed-ups in some capacity. The difference between 0 and 10 speed-up 'Chomp is huge; and I bet it is the same for M-Ray (I've not put any speed-ups into him). Maybe we could consider a subset of Megas that we list twice, where one is w/o candies and one is with them. Notably, candies don't make a huge difference for all of them. For example, M-Glalie is a solid Mega without candies and gets markedly better with them. HOWEVER, even saying that, he probably a B rank both ways. I suspect M-Luke is in a similar position. Probably most megas are in that position--i.e. speed-ups make them better, but not a tier better. Off the top of my head, 'Chomp and M-Ray are the two that defy that rule--possibly making it worth the notation.

    I also support moving M-Blaze down to C or so. I get that he's good in some circumstances, but there are a lot where he isn't--doesn't sound like B to me.
    The problem is some Megas get massive upgrades but realistically you probably would never invest in them so that ends up a bit confusing. Megas such as Sharpedo and Latias as an example are much better with candies, but you have far more usable Megas without a massive investment needed such as Gengar and Glalie.

    If we were to do a list, I strongly suggest we separate it and have an Uncandied + Mega Start list, which is what we have currently and a Candied list with every Mega, where we also ignore Mega Starts. (RIP Banette and Mewtwo in A Rank.)

    Glalie is also an easy A Rank for me candied btw. 19 and 13 is a massive difference in mega evolving speed. Lucario's 14 and 10 is pretty accurate in unchanging though.
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    Just posting to say that Mega Sceptile is coming and it is confirmed to be a Mega Blaziken/Swampert clone (Grass-type, 12 icons, 3 speedups, turns three other grass-types into Mega Sceptile).

    As for my idea on placement, same rank as Mega Swampert in C or the new proposed D rank. Does mostly the same as Mega Swampert (though Mega Sceptile teams have Sleep Charm support as the main distinction) though it gives us a pretty viable alternative for Water-type targets given our only other choices are Mega Ampharos/Mega Manectric (who can remove disruptions but have worse consistency issues than Mega Sceptile et al imo) and Mega Venusaur (removes disruptions, kills combos in turn-based, only really good for beating Gliscor itemless from my observations).

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    Eh. Another lacklustre Blaziken clone that isn't as good due to lack of Pyre/equivalent.

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    RIP Grass Megas. Sceptile for old/current D Ranking.

    I guess Rayquaza, Gengar and Mega Started Ampharos/Manectric will always be the way to go with Waters. This really sucks since there are so many Water types in the games and we really don't have good Megas for them. The water Megas themselves are also lacking but we still have Gyarados coming who will hopefully not suck.
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    Venasaur can be useful for certain stages, true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Secundum View Post
    Venasaur can be useful for certain stages, true.
    Wait, it is? I can't think of an instance where I've used it outside of Greninja whom is a Timed stage and Ampharos who was just for leveling up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HylianGlaceon View Post
    Wait, it is? I can't think of an instance where I've used it outside of Greninja whom is a Timed stage and Ampharos who was just for leveling up.
    I used it in a few competitions iirc, and sometimes on an event stage if i'm fed up with manectric

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    Occasionally when you know the disruptions will be in a certain pattern, it's better to have the reliability over the randomness of Ampharos and Manetric.

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    I agree with the ranking overall. But why Mega-Charizard X it's in the same rank as Mega-Aerodactyl and Mega Steelix? For me he is an solid Rank E. I only used him once and probably will never use again.
    Last edited by DioBrandoTHEWORLD; 5th April 2016 at 5:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DioBrandoTHEWORLD View Post
    I agree with the ranking overall. But why Mega-Charizard X it's in the same rank as Mega-Aerodactyl and Mega Steelix? For me he is an solid Rank E. I only used him once and probably will never use again.
    Yeah I'm not seeing the niche use here. Or, like, it's so niche I can't envision it being used, like Altaria.

    If you want something super effective, you have 5 other higher ranked options (one of which you get for almost the entire game at this point) and Abomasnow, all of which also deal SE damage & have handy abilities before mega evolution(ok well dragon talon's kind of whatever but). The X effect is also handled by the arguably better Mewtwo (fighting will at least hit SE and there's higher base power before max level ups)

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    Quote Originally Posted by R_N View Post
    Yeah I'm not seeing the niche use here. Or, like, it's so niche I can't envision it being used, like Altaria.

    If you want something super effective, you have 5 other higher ranked options (one of which you get for almost the entire game at this point) and Abomasnow, all of which also deal SE damage & have handy abilities before mega evolution(ok well dragon talon's kind of whatever but). The X effect is also handled by the arguably better Mewtwo (fighting will at least hit SE and there's higher base power before max level ups)
    Exaclty! Even M-Altaria is better than M-Charizard X for me. Clearly any of the other super effective are better than M-Charizard X. I would say M-Altaria should go up one ranking to D and M-Charizard X down to E. On the other hand, I believe that M-Mewtwo X should be at least Rank C because it's really good with Mega Start and don't take too long to mega evolve.

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    Yeah, agree with Mega X being E rank. It's completely useless.

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    MCharX moved to E.
    It was a close vote on release and there's more than enough for a tie breaker. If anyone else thinks Altaria should go up to D please say so and why, I personally don't think so even if it is better than MCharX 'cause the "Never Used" rank fits it more.


    On MBlaze.
    I feel candied MRay greatly hurt MBlaze where Talonflame helped only a bit, I no longer think it's A Rank but not C Rank either, but the Blaziken supporters have gone to hiding so It'll go down if more people vote on it.


    On the C Rank split.
    I'll apply this after MScep's competition. To make this easier every current C Rank will go to the new D Rank unless two or more people vote for staying in C, like MAbsol's case where more than enough people have spoken. I'll check past post on the weekend since those count too but I can't remember them. Also will add the references, forgot about that, thanks for reminding me ^^


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    Absol, Ampharos, Gardevoir, Mawile, Blastoise. Those 5 should stay in C rank imo.

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