Expanded Pokedex Discussion Thread [Read First Post]

[Excitable Boy]

Also, bear in mind that we don't know for certain whether or not this generation of games is over yet.

Not implying anything, mods.

[sAv1Or)]

Apart from Gen 1 (obviously) and maybe Gen 2, its impossible to catch every pokemon with just the games within that generation. With more Pokemon than ever, its going to be increasingly impossible to fit every pokemon into the games. Of course this means you'll need to trade, poketransfer, pal park, Dream World, whatever to complete the pokedex.
And really, the amount of people who play pokemon and don't have internet access is fantastically minute.

It would be nice to have better option of accessibility.

Though I still dream of a day they bring back the distribution methods of Gen 1. The ability to catch all the Pokemon, except version exclusives, within the game was very nice. Even if they made it accessible through limiting Pokemon throughout the time of day/season/area/outbreak, it would still be nice to have back.

[Bolt the Cat]

Apart from Gen 1 (obviously) and maybe Gen 2, its impossible to catch every pokemon with just the games within that generation. With more Pokemon than ever, its going to be increasingly impossible to fit every pokemon into the games. Of course this means you'll need to trade, poketransfer, pal park, Dream World, whatever to complete the pokedex.
And really, the amount of people who play pokemon and don't have internet access is fantastically minute.

That's not quite accurate. 1st, 3rd, and 4th gen all did a good job of making every or at least nearly every Pokemon accessible within their particular generation. And of course those extra methods will always be there, but what I'm saying is we shouldn't have to rely on them all of the time. As for future generations, they need to fix that by careful planning. For instance, with this generation, BW1 had a 150 Pokemon regional dex with a good 100-200 more reasonably available in post game. BW2 had a 300 Pokemon regional dex and about 50-100 more post game. Put those two games together and you'll find yourself pretty close to the 649 total. That means that had they intended and planned BW2 from the beginning, and had they put in completely different Pokemon in BW2 so as not to repeat species, they would've been close to if not past the point where they could comfortably fit all 649 in those two games alone. Now of course I'm not suggesting that they cram as many Pokemon into the game as possible. But what I am suggesting is that they be mindful of which Pokemon get put in which game, so they are careful not to unnecessarily repeat themselves when another Pokemon could use their place more.

Also, bear in mind that we don't know for certain whether or not this generation of games is over yet.

Not implying anything, mods.

True, but I don't think a full retail game is necessary to pick up the stragglers, maybe another app like the Dream Radar or a new area of the Dream World.

[Excitable Boy]

As you said yourself, though, Pokemon games within the same generation do share some families. A new game wouldn't consist of nothing but what they still need to make available, obviously.

Besides, IIRC, the only 'mons that weren't available in DP via some means were some starters, legends, Tropius, and Tangela/growth. That didn't stop GameFreak from releasing Platinum or HGSS.

[Bolt the Cat]

As you said yourself, though, Pokemon games within the same generation do share some families. A new game wouldn't consist of nothing but what they still need to make available, obviously.

Besides, IIRC, the only 'mons that weren't available in DP via some means were some starters, legends, Tropius, and Tangela/growth. That didn't stop GameFreak from releasing Platinum or HGSS.

There's other factors as well, though. Next gen is approaching fast, and the pressure is on to jump to 3DS. Since the first main game on the 3DS is going to be the 6th gen games, I don't think they're going to want to squeeze in another 5th gen game in between. It'd be better to make the remaining Pokemon available through either the DW or some small app like the Dream Radar.

[sAv1Or)]

There's other factors as well, though. Next gen is approaching fast, and the pressure is on to jump to 3DS. Since the first main game on the 3DS is going to be the 6th gen games, I don't think they're going to want to squeeze in another 5th gen game in between. It'd be better to make the remaining Pokemon available through either the DW or some small app like the Dream Radar.

Looks like GF is going to make it difficult for more people again :/ Pokemon only available through 3DS features is going to be a pain for people like me who don't own a 3DS nor can afford one so they're going to have to compensate somehow

[Hidden Power]

It's kind of inevitable isn't it? The population of Pokemon increases by a little over a hundred with every generation, yet the geographical scale of the game remains fairly small. I mean, we do get larger looking cities with the improvement in graphics, but the game hasn't really have much diversity for Pokemon locations. I was rather annoyed by the way BW1 try to fit tons of new Pokemon in that couple of grass patch in the post-game area. It's just unrealistic in terms of game design. Even if the two BW2 games had each taken up approximately half of the total Pokemon species such that we have a hundred or so version exclusive, the game is still lacking enough prominent locations to place the Pokemon in fitting location and form some sort of ecological system.

I've actually never seriously try to "catch 'em all" starting from the second generation, since I often restart my game a couple of times before I settle down with one playthrough, after which I'll only breed and train a couple of Pokemon I like.

[sAv1Or)]

It's kind of inevitable isn't it? The population of Pokemon increases by a little over a hundred with every generation, yet the geographical scale of the game remains fairly small. I mean, we do get larger looking cities with the improvement in graphics, but the game hasn't really have much diversity for Pokemon locations. I was rather annoyed by the way BW1 try to fit tons of new Pokemon in that couple of grass patch in the post-game area. It's just unrealistic in terms of game design. Even if the two BW2 games had each taken up approximately half of the total Pokemon species such that we have a hundred or so version exclusive, the game is still lacking enough prominent locations to place the Pokemon in fitting location and form some sort of ecological system.

This is a good point. Though I do enjoy the larger scale cities so that doesn't really bother me.

I think they have a good amount of areas available to catch Pokemon, I just think they need to put more Pokemon in each area, which is very doable. They could just implement a more vast encounter % system and make each area very fruitful w/ Pokemon. Especially post-game where they could unlock more Pokemon per-area after you have beaten the game.

[Bolt the Cat]

It's kind of inevitable isn't it? The population of Pokemon increases by a little over a hundred with every generation, yet the geographical scale of the game remains fairly small. I mean, we do get larger looking cities with the improvement in graphics, but the game hasn't really have much diversity for Pokemon locations. I was rather annoyed by the way BW1 try to fit tons of new Pokemon in that couple of grass patch in the post-game area. It's just unrealistic in terms of game design. Even if the two BW2 games had each taken up approximately half of the total Pokemon species such that we have a hundred or so version exclusive, the game is still lacking enough prominent locations to place the Pokemon in fitting location and form some sort of ecological system.

Well first of all, Unova is pretty smallish for a main series region. If they made the regions about the size of Hoenn and Sinnoh, they could comfortably fit in more Pokemon per game. Also, you're forgetting that BW1 added in Shaking Spots and Double Grass, which more than doubles the amount of Pokemon they can fit per area. At any rate, you guys are missing the point. It's not about trying to cram in as many Pokemon as possible into each game. It's about using the resources they have to fit a reasonable amount in. There's no excuse for not being able to fit in the missing several dozen Pokemon into BW2 when they're wasting wild Pokemon slots on repeats for Double Grass (making it a highly pointless mechanic), evolved forms for Shaking Spots (several of which probably shouldn't even be catchable), and Unova Dex Pokemon post game.

[sAv1Or)]

Well first of all, Unova is pretty smallish for a main series region. If they made the regions about the size of Hoenn and Sinnoh, they could comfortably fit in more Pokemon per game. Also, you're forgetting that BW1 added in Shaking Spots and Double Grass, which more than doubles the amount of Pokemon they can fit per area. At any rate, you guys are missing the point. It's not about trying to cram in as many Pokemon as possible into each game. It's about using the resources they have to fit a reasonable amount in. There's no excuse for not being able to fit in the missing several dozen Pokemon into BW2 when they're wasting wild Pokemon slots on repeats for Double Grass (making it a highly pointless mechanic), evolved forms for Shaking Spots (several of which probably shouldn't even be catchable), and Unova Dex Pokemon post game.

So are you saying they should or shouldn't fit more in? Cuz right now it sounds like you're siding w/ us...

I wasn't saying the point was to cram as many Pokemon as they can, I was saying that they could have added a lot more than they did. And they definitely have the means to do so

[Bolt the Cat]

So are you saying they should or shouldn't fit more in? Cuz right now it sounds like you're siding w/ us...

They should, but not excessively.

[sAv1Or)]

They should, but not excessively.

Alright. Then we agree here ^^

I think there was so much missed opportunity in BW2 as far as distribution. Don't get me wrong, I thought the Pokemon available and where they were available was near perfect for me, but the only change I'd really make was adding a little more here and there.

[Bolt the Cat]

I think there was so much missed opportunity in BW2 as far as distribution. Don't get me wrong, I thought the Pokemon available and where they were available was near perfect for me, but the only change I'd really make was adding a little more here and there.

I think they should shift most of the Pokemon somewhere earlier in the game. Especially some of the ones that are post game or otherwise unreasonably later. Meanwhile, they should've added in some of the harder to get National Dex Pokemon in post game (Pikachu, Unown, Snorunt, Machoke, and Tentacruel to name a few).

[sAv1Or)]

I think they should shift most of the Pokemon somewhere earlier in the game. Especially some of the ones that are post game or otherwise unreasonably later. Meanwhile, they should've added in some of the harder to get National Dex Pokemon in post game (Pikachu, Unown, Snorunt, Machoke, and Tentacruel to name a few).

Inside the Mystery Door would have been a nice place for the Unknown to be. And I have always been a fan of Tentacruel, so that would have been a nice addition.

[Bolt the Cat]

Inside the Mystery Door would have been a nice place for the Unknown to be. And I have always been a fan of Tentacruel, so that would have been a nice addition.

They "Mystery Door"? IDK what you're talking about. I was thinking the Underground Ruins where you catch 3/4 of the Regis. IDK if that's what you mean, though.

[sAv1Or)]

They "Mystery Door"? IDK what you're talking about. I was thinking the Underground Ruins where you catch 3/4 of the Regis. IDK if that's what you mean, though.

That is what I mean. The huge door that you go through and it has all the broken statues

[Bolt the Cat]

That is what I mean. The huge door that you go through and it has all the broken statues

I figured that's what you meant. IDK where else Unown could go anyway.

[sAv1Or)]

I figured that's what you meant. IDK where else Unown could go anyway.

Well they could have just thrown in another unknown cave. Cave of Being is another place that comes to mind since nothing else was there.

[Wulava]

Unova has a lot of potential for prior-gen Pokemon distribution, but they didn't put it to good use...

But what I'm really disappointed is... there are no new set of starter giveaways.

[sAv1Or)]

Unova has a lot of potential for prior-gen Pokemon distribution, but they didn't put it to good use...

But what I'm really disappointed is... there are no new set of starter giveaways.

Are you talking about Wifi event release?

It would be cool if there was an in-game release like in Yellow where you could get Bulbasaur, Charmander, and Squirtle barring certain qualifications.

[Hidden Power]

Well first of all, Unova is pretty smallish for a main series region. If they made the regions about the size of Hoenn and Sinnoh, they could comfortably fit in more Pokemon per game. Also, you're forgetting that BW1 added in Shaking Spots and Double Grass, which more than doubles the amount of Pokemon they can fit per area. At any rate, you guys are missing the point. It's not about trying to cram in as many Pokemon as possible into each game. It's about using the resources they have to fit a reasonable amount in. There's no excuse for not being able to fit in the missing several dozen Pokemon into BW2 when they're wasting wild Pokemon slots on repeats for Double Grass (making it a highly pointless mechanic), evolved forms for Shaking Spots (several of which probably shouldn't even be catchable), and Unova Dex Pokemon post game.

The shaky grass is a mechanic to put a couple of different/rare Pokemon in that same location, but doesn't really count as a "different" habitat for me. I was referring to the blandness of stuffing Pokemon in grass patches and water bodies found on the standard numbered routes, as opposed to providing properly named locations such as mountains, lakes, sea caves, underwater seaweed, forests, and man-made locations such as factories, lighthouses etc. You know, something more interesting than grass alone, shaky or not shaky.

[Bolt the Cat]

But what I'm really disappointed is... there are no new set of starter giveaways.

Yeah, they could've at least given us the Sinnoh starters.

The shaky grass is a mechanic to put a couple of different/rare Pokemon in that same location, but doesn't really count as a "different" habitat for me. I was referring to the blandness of stuffing Pokemon in grass patches and water bodies found on the standard numbered routes, as opposed to providing properly named locations such as mountains, lakes, sea caves, underwater seaweed, forests, and man-made locations such as factories, lighthouses etc. You know, something more interesting than grass alone, shaky or not shaky.

We don't really need it. The locations are pretty diverse enough to accommodate all of the Pokemon. Besides, there was plenty of diversity in this game. We got a factory, a sewer, a city park, a desert, desert ruins, an electrically charged cave, a burial tower, a volcano, an icy canyon, and a Victory Road made out of all sorts of different environments. What more could you possibly want?

[Hidden Power]

Yeah, they could've at least given us the Sinnoh starters.



We don't really need it. The locations are pretty diverse enough to accommodate all of the Pokemon. Besides, there was plenty of diversity in this game. We got a factory, a sewer, a city park, a desert, desert ruins, an electrically charged cave, a burial tower, a volcano, an icy canyon, and a Victory Road made out of all sorts of different environments. What more could you possibly want?

Isn't that about as many locations as Gen III/IV, except we're fitting much more Pokemon? Well, that's just the impression I get with each passing generation anyway. More new Pokemon, but more or less the same geographical size.

[Ninja Eevee]

i dont thank GF or Pokemon for giving us thr 493 for this game. this is what it should of been in the first place. its like they realised what a bad choice it was in BW, so its, for me, the BW we should of got originally. dont get me wrong, im really happy with this idea though.

[Bolt the Cat]

Isn't that about as many locations as Gen III/IV, except we're fitting much more Pokemon? Well, that's just the impression I get with each passing generation anyway. More new Pokemon, but more or less the same geographical size.

In terms of region size, I definitely agree with you. Unova is too small for its own good. But in terms of number of Pokemon available, I think it's fine. Unova as is is easily capable of fitting more than half of the National Dex by itself. With Double Grass and Shaking Spots allowing areas to hold more than double the amount of Pokemon, I don't think we'll have as much of a problem with this for a while, probably not for a few generations when the National Dex passes 1000 or so.

i dont thank GF or Pokemon for giving us thr 493 for this game. this is what it should of been in the first place. its like they realised what a bad choice it was in BW, so its, for me, the BW we should of got originally. dont get me wrong, im really happy with this idea though.

I don't get what you're saying.