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Thread: The Crystalline Guard

  1. #7601
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShowMeTheMankey View Post
    Chomp is broken with or without sand veil. If it's reintroduced purely because of the fact that sand veil will be banned is just ridiculous and ******** and stupid and not a good thing to do and I have clearly run out of adjectives a while ago
    Meh. Personally, I never thought it was that insanely OP. It's ridiculously easy to revenge kill, since it's only got 102 speed. Personally, I find moxiemence more threatening, and even then, I don't think that's ban worthy.

    The only problem was that sand veil turned around the tide of the battle one too many times. And it's not like stall cares to much, half of them carry Skarmories anyway, and they have better things to worry about, like Gliscor and Reuniclus. If something is banned because it's too dangerous for stall, it should be one of those two. Or both. If you want it banned, I'd like to see what your argument is. Insults don't prove anything either way. Just try to keep a level head - that's what strategy games are all about.

    And besides that, the metagame has changed quite a bit since it was banned in early B/W. There are plenty of little things that can change this, like Mamoswine's and Donphan's rise in usage.

    ...Though I do wonder if this'll cause Sableye and Bronzong to be seen more.
    Still not sure whether to use genes ect or counter him on a new team. Speaking of excadrill. I'm surprised there aren't more sand genes ect. I mean correct me if I'm wrong but sand can't do anything but help it right?
    It'll help a little, but Genesect really doesn't care either way.
    Last edited by Zachmac; 14th October 2012 at 7:59 PM.

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    Your House: Tourmaline
    Opponent's House: Emerald
    Opponent's Name: McDanger
    Win/Loss/Draw + Score: Win, 3-0
    Rate your performance out of 50: 35
    Rate opponent's performance out of 50: 35
    Any improvements for opponent: Hmmm i dunno, the only thing besides that miss that would have helped is if my gyara hadn't outsped that poke at the end. However, I do give you major props for being original
    Any thing else worth mentioning?: He missed a Stone Edge on my moxie-ing gyarados that pretty much cost him the game. /I might have/ been able to work around it dying, but not likely, or if I had the score would have been 1-0 instead most likely. Other than that miss, gg.
    "Strong Pokémon. Weak Pokémon. That is only the selfish perception of people. Truly skilled trainers should try to win with their favorites." -Karen

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  3. #7603
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    As of today, I can now say that specs Keldeo is one of my favorite competitive pokemon sets ever.

    I only added it to handle those blisseys and scizors....but it's just so fast and hits so hard, I think I'll be hanging on to this set for a while.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HyperLugia View Post
    Welcome on board I like how you have a good grasp of your strengths and weaknesses, definitely makes it easier to improve. I agree, multi battling is so fun xD I almost wish that one year they'd use that as the battle format for the VGC instead of just regular double battles... Since they do double battles /every year/ anyways....



    No way really? xD I just beat Drayden with all of my team in the 40-41 range and had little trouble... Also I caught my Cobalion in a regular pokeball too 8D though I was trying for that LOL



    Yeah, Heatran does sound like a good fix... it's just he doesn't really fit well on my current team :[



    Haha really? xD I joined Comp battling after Excadrill was already banned so I don't even know. But yeah... So much Genesect! lol
    Scarf nape or scarf bluff nape is a good counter to genesect. Even a CC predicting a heatran swith in or similar does 60-70%, which will stack up with rocks pretty quickly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thegame88 View Post
    Still not sure whether to use genes ect or counter him on a new team. Speaking of excadrill. I'm surprised there aren't more sand genes ect. I mean correct me if I'm wrong but sand can't do anything but help it right?
    He loses thunder, but gains flamethrower against ferrothorn, so i'd consider it good, passive damage helping, but with sand and possibly a spinner, it gets too much support for one pokemon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    ...Though I do wonder if this'll cause Sableye and Bronzong to be seen more.It'll help a little, but Genesect really doesn't care either way.
    Personally the only pokemon MORE annoying than genesect is bronzong. He's really underrated and is a great rain counter with levitate and great special defenses as well as dual screens. Really just posted this at the mention of Bronzong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkbeat View Post
    Personally the only pokemon MORE annoying than genesect is bronzong. He's really underrated and is a great rain counter with levitate and great special defenses as well as dual screens. Really just posted this at the mention of Bronzong.
    Meh, I don't think Bronzong is all that underrated, but maybe a little. The reason it's never really seen in OU is because it doesn't have a good recovery move, meaning that offensive pokemon can just pound away at it without worrying too much.

    Though a physically defensive version could probably work pretty well with a wish-passing Blissy.

    It is an all round good pokemon though, which is why I even brought it up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkbeat View Post
    Personally the only pokemon MORE annoying than genesect is bronzong. He's really underrated and is a great rain counter with levitate and great special defenses as well as dual screens. Really just posted this at the mention of Bronzong.
    I still think Heatproof is better, since no one is going to risk using Ground moves until they KNOW it has Heatproof. Though I guess Levitate would be better in the rain, since the rain is basically Heatproof along with it.
    Oh hey, I have a Nuzlocke story.
    I hath claimed the ULTIMATE TROLL!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamina
    Do you know why people have eyes at the front? It's to see the vast landscape, and to move forward. If we had eyes in the back, we'd only see ourselves leaving our birthplace. That way, people could never move forward. Our eyes are at the front, so that when we walk, the distant landscape draws closer. That's why people can move forward.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Psychic Swordsman View Post
    I still think Heatproof is better, since no one is going to risk using Ground moves until they KNOW it has Heatproof. Though I guess Levitate would be better in the rain, since the rain is basically Heatproof along with it.
    Though half of being a defensive pokemon is being able to come in on an attack and defend it's allies. By giving it heatproof, it'll no longer be able to defend from the ground attacks, but will find it's ability to be even less useful, since your enemies will become suspicious if you swap it in on a pokemon like Heatran who that ability to to help wall.

    Maybe you could get away with it if your team has a lot of ground resist, but honestly, it's more effective to pair it up with a politoad or some other fire resist.

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    I think I might need help understanding cores /: For some reason, they seem so confusing for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ShowMeTheMankey View Post
    Chomp is broken with or without sand veil. If it's reintroduced purely because of the fact that sand veil will be banned is just ridiculous and ******** and stupid and not a good thing to do and I have clearly run out of adjectives a while ago
    I don't think so...not with Genesect running around now...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coloure View Post
    I think I might need help understanding cores /: For some reason, they seem so confusing for me.
    Well, no one ever explained them to me, but I've picked up that a core is simply a group of pokemon who support eachother well, and are what the rest of the team revolves around.

    The most famous cores are known as Skarbliss and Jellithorn, both of which defensive. While Skarbliss has fallen in popularity, Skarmory's stats and typing allow it to take most physical attacks for Blissey, and Blissy's massive HP and special defense allow it to take on all off Skarmory's counters, besides ones who use trick.

    Jellithorn is similar, but both of which are more of mixed walls that handle different OU threats with their typing. Ferrothorn struggles with just about every pokemon with a fire or fighting attack, while Jellicent can easily take most of them on, and it really helps that most fighting type attack users are crippled by Jellicent's will-o-wisp, along with any Dragonite or Salamence not carrying a lum berry.

    And the most famous offensive core happens to be Rotom-W and Scizor. These two are so successful since Rotom-W can use Volt Switch on it's incoming counter, and swap out to Scizor, who can handle almost all of Rotom-W's counters with ease, thanks to it's high attack stat. And when it uses U-turn on an incoming counter, it changes to Rotom-W, who in return, is likely to counter said pokemon. Most offensive cores, however, just rely on wearing down a common weakness. A have an offensive core of Dragonite, Salamance, and Haxorus, and while a steel type can wall one of them, it'll have difficulty withstanding too many outrages from all three, with Skarmory being the only exception.
    Last edited by Zachmac; 14th October 2012 at 9:04 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lodestar View Post
    I don't think so...not with Genesect running around now...

    chompisfaster

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    Quote Originally Posted by spiderman123 View Post
    chompisfaster
    Though most Genesects are scarfed, I think it's only a fair argument if you give a larger list then just one pokemon.

    Genesect alone won't fit on every team in the universe. But really, Chomp is checked by a lot of pokemon rather easily. I'm still not too worried.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Mysterious Stranger View Post
    Honestly, Psycho, I feel that what prohawk did is okay, because it was obviously a joke. I'm sure you've said "Google it" before. And yeah, give the ladder time to make sense.
    It's not that, it's just the additude and the swearing that bothers me. But it's behind us now, so yeah, let's let it drop.

    Quote Originally Posted by ShowMeTheMankey View Post
    Chomp is broken with or without sand veil. If it's reintroduced purely because of the fact that sand veil will be banned is just ridiculous and ******** and stupid and not a good thing to do and I have clearly run out of adjectives a while ago
    I disagree with you there. The Banning of Sand Veil has made illegal Chomp's most evil set (SubSD Sand Veil Hax) which is awesome. Then, with all the BW2 additions, like Keldeo, Tornadus-T and Landorus-T, there's a lot more stuff that can counter Chomp. So, imo, it's at the very least worth a retest. In the long term though, I think it will stay OU. It'll be a big threat, sure, but I think it'll stay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thegame88 View Post
    Still not sure whether to use genes ect or counter him on a new team. Speaking of excadrill. I'm surprised there aren't more sand genes ect. I mean correct me if I'm wrong but sand can't do anything but help it right?
    The only benefit it gets from Sand is that it doesn't get hurt by Sandstorm and most other Pokemon do. It's a nice bonus, but not as good as having a boosted Flamethrower or having your only weakness reduced and being able to run Thunder over Thunderbolt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    As of today, I can now say that specs Keldeo is one of my favorite competitive pokemon sets ever.

    I only added it to handle those blisseys and scizors....but it's just so fast and hits so hard, I think I'll be hanging on to this set for a while.
    Gah, I remember being 6-0 in a match against ND by that thing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychic Swordsman View Post
    I still think Heatproof is better, since no one is going to risk using Ground moves until they KNOW it has Heatproof. Though I guess Levitate would be better in the rain, since the rain is basically Heatproof along with it.
    Yes, but Levitate allows you to avoid Spikes and be able to switch into Ground Attacks, which I think is more of an advantage. Besides, all the opponent needs to do is keep one layer of Spikes on the field and the game's up.

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    Last edited by Psycho Cut; 14th October 2012 at 9:19 PM.
    Hey Serebii, how you doing? Not sure how many of you guys from way back are out there, but just to let you know that I'm back, though I'm not sure how regularly I'll be on. Thanks for everything, and I hope I can continue to enjoy my time here!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    As of today, I can now say that specs Keldeo is one of my favorite competitive pokemon sets ever.

    I only added it to handle those blisseys and scizors....but it's just so fast and hits so hard, I think I'll be hanging on to this set for a while.
    It's pretty much like running Banded Terrakion, but with the ability to hit on Special + Physical and no priority weakness

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkbeat View Post
    Personally the only pokemon MORE annoying than genesect is bronzong. He's really underrated and is a great rain counter with levitate and great special defenses as well as dual screens. Really just posted this at the mention of Bronzong.
    Bronzong is actually amazing. If it had recover it would see so much more usage

    Quote Originally Posted by lodestar View Post
    I don't think so...not with Genesect running around now...
    Chomp is faster and can hit with fire moves. ScarfChomp is not uncommon either

    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Cut View Post
    I disagree with you there. The Banning of Sand Veil has made illegal Chomp's most evil set (SubSD Sand Veil Hax) which is awesome. Then, with all the BW2 additions, like Keldeo, Tornadus-T and Landorus-T, there's a lot more stuff that can counter Chomp. So, imo, it's at the very least worth a retest. In the long term though, I think it will stay OU. It'll be a big threat, sure, but I think it'll stay.

    Yes, but Levitate allows you to avoid Spikes and be able to switch into Ground Attacks, which I think is more of an advantage. Besides, all the opponent needs to do is keep one layer of Spikes on the field and the game's up.
    Tornadus-T nor Keldeo counter Chomp as counters need to be able to switch in, take a hit, and KO or force out the next turn. ScarfChomp owns Tornadus-T and non-scarf Keldeo.

    Also Spikes are actually pretty rare outside of stall and Dexoys-D leads. You can pretty much get away with running Heatproof Bronzong, or even feigning Heatproof. I'm always wary of Bronzong whenever I see it because you never know exactly what it's going to do. Unless you see a Kingdra, then it's obvious

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thegame88 View Post
    Still not sure whether to use genes ect or counter him on a new team. Speaking of excadrill. I'm surprised there aren't more sand genes ect. I mean correct me if I'm wrong but sand can't do anything but help it right?
    while sand helps him, he prefers rain

    Quote Originally Posted by ShowMeTheMankey View Post
    Chomp is broken with or without sand veil. If it's reintroduced purely because of the fact that sand veil will be banned is just ridiculous and ******** and stupid and not a good thing to do and I have clearly run out of adjectives a while ago
    no, just no and smogon has already said garchomp IS coming back. He isnt OP, he fits fine in this metagame, but a top tier poke like genesect



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    Quote Originally Posted by Prohawk View Post
    It's pretty much like running Banded Terrakion, but with the ability to hit on Special + Physical and no priority weakness



    Bronzong is actually amazing. If it had recover it would see so much more usage



    Chomp is faster and can hit with fire moves. ScarfChomp is not uncommon either



    Tornadus-T nor Keldeo counter Chomp as counters need to be able to switch in, take a hit, and KO or force out the next turn. ScarfChomp owns Tornadus-T and non-scarf Keldeo.

    Also Spikes are actually pretty rare outside of stall and Dexoys-D leads. You can pretty much get away with running Heatproof Bronzong, or even feigning Heatproof. I'm always wary of Bronzong whenever I see it because you never know exactly what it's going to do. Unless you see a Kingdra, then it's obvious
    levitate balloon bronzong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magicmonkey View Post
    levitate balloon bronzong.
    Outclassed by balloon rotom-fan. Just saying.

    Unless you meant to say heatproof balloon? But the lack of leftovers isn't worth it.

  19. #7619
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Outclassed by balloon rotom-fan. Just saying.

    Unless you meant to say heatproof balloon? But the lack of leftovers isn't worth it.
    they pop the balloon and think they can EQ. they where wrong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Mysterious Stranger View Post
    Genesect @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Download
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 192 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - U-turn
    - Thunder
    - Ice Beam
    - Flamethrower

    it's great, cause you can feign a scarf set, and then just whack them with another SE hit.
    Thanks! I'll definately try it out.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Mysterious Stranger View Post
    Honestly, Psycho, I feel that what prohawk did is okay, because it was obviously a joke. I'm sure you've said "Google it" before. And yeah, give the ladder time to make sense.
    Yeah but then again, she's a little girl. She's not gonna know he's joking. You can't really tell over the internet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Which also means you can't use Sand Veil Cacturne/Sandslash.

    But honestly, I was swept by a pretty new play just because none of my attacks were hitting their darn cacturne before...I'm rather glad those abilities are banned. And without it, Garchomp doesn't worry me at all either.
    Sandslash never really used Sand Veil anyways. Its other ability outclasses it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    Outclassed by balloon rotom-fan. Just saying.
    Got nothing on my Final Gambit Shedinja =D

    Swampert is actually a fairly decent Gene Counter, even though it can't OHKO it back. Maybe HP Fire Swampy =]

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prohawk View Post
    Got nothing on my Final Gambit Shedinja =D

    Swampert is actually a fairly decent Gene Counter, even though it can't OHKO it back. Maybe HP Fire Swampy =]
    It doesn't need to OHKO, it just needs to KO first.

    But please, I've got a Shedinja that knows substitute and holds the sticky barb. That's much more creative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magicmonkey View Post
    Scarf nape or scarf bluff nape is a good counter to genesect. Even a CC predicting a heatran swith in or similar does 60-70%, which will stack up with rocks pretty quickly.


    He loses thunder, but gains flamethrower against ferrothorn, so i'd consider it good, passive damage helping, but with sand and possibly a spinner, it gets too much support for one pokemon.
    Flamethrower still does like 70% in rain, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coloure View Post
    I think I might need help understanding cores /: For some reason, they seem so confusing for me.
    The next quote might help you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Usatoday View Post
    So some of you wanted me to make a guide so I hope this will do.
    Synergy Time
    The Guide
    Step 1: Choose a pokemon to center the team around how about a gliscor

    Step 2: Determine a set you'd like to try out, we have a gliscor who can be played both defensively and offensively so how about we make a little unique set.

    Gliscor @ Flying Gem
    Nature Adamant
    Ability Poison Heal
    Evs 204 HP 252 Atk 52 Spd
    Acrobatics
    Ice Fang/U-Turn
    Earthquake
    Tailwind
    Now this set is unique it takes the sand veil offensive gliscor and twists it as tailwind is not typically used in singles. However we sacrifice speed for a little bulk and tailwind will give gliscor the speed it lost. Now for those who dont know tailwind will double the speed of your team for three turns. Now we have acrobatics as the obvious powerful stab move and with max attacking investment it will do a lot of damage. Next we have ice fang to hit dragons such as dragonite or salamence so we dont have to waste the flying gem, however we can opt for u turn if we desire to scout or preserve gliscor simply by using this move on the last turn of tailwind. Earthquake is the final stab move that we'll use for jirachi and metagross. Now the evs are custom made so that gliscor will have just enough speed to outspeed scarf base 110's with a positive nature while the rest goes into to hit points so gliscor will have an easier time setting up a tailwind and finally poison heal to absorb toxic from walls such blissey and get its health back. However if your running a sand team we might want to run sand veil however you might miss the status absorber.

    Step 3: Figure out your weaknesses. In this case gliscor is weak to ice and water.

    Step 4: Figure out what pokemon use these types. In our case common ones include rotom-w latios mamoswine politoed vaporeon and gastrodon. Now if you notice most of these pokemon are special attackers bar mamoswine so the best bet is to go with a special sponge.

    Step 5: Find a pokemon to fit the requirements you need. In this case we need a special wall and a pokemon to take on water and ice so why not give a slowking a try

    Step 6: Determine the set.

    Slowking @ Leftovers
    Nature Calm
    Ability Regenerator
    Evs 252 HP 252 SDef 4 SAtk
    Toxic
    Scald
    Slack Off
    Grass Knot
    Now slowking is what you might call a specially defensive behemoth as it can sponge a specs draco meteor from latios and live with about 33% remaining this will allow slowking to also sponge scalds ice beams and surfs from pokemon and then recover them off via slack off or switching out with regenerator. Scald will allow us a nice stab and to get some damage off upon whatever decides to take it and potentially burn the opponent with the 30% chance. Next off we have grass knot which may seem weird but it one of the few ways we can hit gastrodon with this core while toxic will allow slowking to cripple and ware down opponents pokemon to a point where gliscor can come in and wipe out the rest of the opponents team

    Step 7: Look at the two you have and analyze their weaknesses combined. In this case we have nothing to really take grass ghost or dark attacks.

    Step 8: So looking at our weaknesses we may want a dark type which can also resist grass so lets take a look we could try houndoom bisharp hydreigon honchkrow and shiftry. Out of these pokemon we want something that can come in on gengar a pokemon neither of our pokemon will appreciate so we can go sucker punch bisharp or honchkrow but hydreigon houndoom and shiftry are out. So lets try honchkrow

    Step 9: Determine your set so we have a few sets to try scarf or life subroost honchkrow.


    Honchkrow @ Life Orb
    Ability Moxie
    Nature Jolly
    Evs 4 Def 252 Atk 252 Spd
    Sucker Punch
    Night Slash
    Superpower
    Brave Bird
    Now with the release of black and white two the don of pokemon into a new rage as you can now run superpower with moxie a thing that will make ferrothorn and skarmory quiver in fear. Sucker punch allows me to hit gengar and dragons that have set up very hard with a stab life orb base 80 move. Night slash allows honchkrow to still have a stab when the pokemon are predicting a sucker punch. Brave bird allows honchkrow to abuse its second stab.

    Things to Remember


    1. Orginality vs Stupidity
    You need to remember that while originality is good there is a point where sets wont work obviously a physical slowking will not work well at all.

    2. Threats
    Any core will not be able to take on every threat however this makes it up to you to find a pokemon that will counter this threat or threats.

    3. Rest of the Team
    While gliscor may not be the only pokemon focused on this team you want to make sure you have pokemon that work with the pokemon already given to you.

    Thank You For Reading This Has Been The Guide To Building A Effective Core
    Last edited by Aeon™; 14th October 2012 at 9:50 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachmac View Post
    It doesn't need to OHKO, it just needs to KO first.

    But please, I've got a Shedinja that knows substitute and holds the sticky barb. That's much more creative.
    Yes, that is a far better way to say what I should have said lol *notes for future reference*

    Pah, my Shedinja does damage. You gots nothing on me

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    swampert fails as expert belt genesect tends to run giga drain



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