Community POTW #75

[MetalCrow]

Comparing them to Flygon is like saying Gyarados and Milotic are the same, because they have the same general typing and move pools.

Quick question...have you ever used a defensive gyarados before?

Anyways, flygon's power in uu is almost unrivaled due to the offensive pace of the metagame, and the fact that it has the moveset to make quick work of dedicated walls and sweepers alike...mostly it boils down to either being a physical-band, physical-scarf, or mixed -scarf set...they're all darn good sets for different reasons...all in all tho, you're usually gonna see sets that have a dragon attack, earthquake, fire attack, and either u-turn/roost/auxilary dragon attack...that's all you have to look out for...so that means that you'll only need a little bit of prediction, and the right sort of team and you'll be ok...or you could just slap a scarf cryogonal on your team and call it a day

[windsong]

What the **** U-turn should never be slashed. Ever. Flygon should be running Earthquake / Outrage / U-Turn / Filler no matter what set it's running (and don't give me **** about Specs sets, they clearly suck and even if they didn't they would still be better off using U-turn). It's one of the best damn moves in the game, and because of how easily Flygon can gain momentum by forcing switching then U-turning out, there's not reason not to use it. Especially in UU, which is so centralized on entry hazards.

[Cometk]

What the **** U-turn should never be slashed. Ever. Flygon should be running Earthquake / Outrage / U-Turn / Filler no matter what set it's running (and don't give me **** about Specs sets, they clearly suck and even if they didn't they would still be better off using U-turn). It's one of the best damn moves in the game, and because of how easily Flygon can gain momentum by forcing switching then U-turning out, there's not reason not to use it. Especially in UU, which is so centralized on entry hazards.

windsong is a bw uu aficionado

[Cosmic Potato]

What the **** U-turn should never be slashed. Ever. Flygon should be running Earthquake / Outrage / U-Turn / Filler no matter what set it's running (and don't give me **** about Specs sets, they clearly suck and even if they didn't they would still be better off using U-turn). It's one of the best damn moves in the game, and because of how easily Flygon can gain momentum by forcing switching then U-turning out, there's not reason not to use it. Especially in UU, which is so centralized on entry hazards.

I will agree special flygon is very bad but U turn is not very good on LO sets in my opinion.

[philzone]

What the **** U-turn should never be slashed. Ever. Flygon should be running Earthquake / Outrage / U-Turn / Filler no matter what set it's running (and don't give me **** about Specs sets, they clearly suck and even if they didn't they would still be better off using U-turn). It's one of the best damn moves in the game, and because of how easily Flygon can gain momentum by forcing switching then U-turning out, there's not reason not to use it. Especially in UU, which is so centralized on entry hazards.

Specs set shouldn't be considered ???????????! What are you on about. A special set swept my whole team in the last wifi tournament. This one was great.
My personal nightmare.
Levitate
Timid
Life orb
-draco meteor/dragon pulse
-earth power
-flame thrower
-giga drain
Evs 252 speed, 252 sp att

Sorry if this set has already been mentioned, but it seriously destroys foes. Plus U-turn has its difficulties. Namely stealth rock, spikes and other entry hazards. Flygon may u-turn, but you can lose the switch in with the hazards.

[Star Champion AJ]

Plus U-turn has its difficulties. Namely stealth rock, spikes and other entry hazards. Flygon may u-turn, but you can lose the switch in with the hazards.

I have to disagree a little for some reasons:
Flygon is a low maintenance Pokémon in terms of entry hazards, weather and other similar things,
1: Levitate gives Flygon a full immunity to Spikes and Toxic Spikes (there are exceptions)
2: His Ground typing gives Flygon a Stealth Rock resistance
3: Sandstorm helps him a lot and Sunny Day can help a set with Fire type moves (95% of all sets, I believe) and/or Solarbeam
4: You should worry more about revenge killers, Ice Shard (and other Ice type moves, even Powder Snow kills Flygon) and his Dragon cousins (Salamence, Dragonite, Garchomp...) than the aforementioned entry hazards.

[Aquaholic]

Partner/Team Options

Alongside an Eviolite Volt Switch Magneton or Leftovers Volt Switch Magnezone, Flygon could operate well on a VoltTurn team. Steel covers the Dragon-type weakness and that horrid x4 Ice weakness. Lefties would heal Magnezone of any SR damage, whereas Magneton can sponge hits and get out faster than the 'Zone. It could go with this moveset:

252 Atk/Spe / 4 HP
-U-turn
-Screech
-Earthquake
-Dragon Tail

U-Turn is the main move for any VoltSwitch team, Screech is there to act as a pseudo hazer. If the opponent stays in, they get a nasty hit from any of Flygon's other moves. If they do switch out after Screech and they're Ice-type, they'll not like being forced back by Dragon Tail. If EQ is used and they resist/are immune, Flygon can retreat with U-Turn to Magneton/Zone.

[your boss]

Specs set shouldn't be considered ???????????! What are you on about. A special set swept my whole team in the last wifi tournament. This one was great.
My personal nightmare.
Levitate
Timid
Life orb
-draco meteor/dragon pulse
-earth power
-flame thrower
-giga drain
Evs 252 speed, 252 sp att

Sorry if this set has already been mentioned, but it seriously destroys foes. Plus U-turn has its difficulties. Namely stealth rock, spikes and other entry hazards. Flygon may u-turn, but you can lose the switch in with the hazards.

Lol with U-turn's difficulties, anyway you could add Fire Blast to replace flamethrower, but specs is outclassed by Hydreigon

[Ilan]

Specs set shouldn't be considered ???????????! What are you on about. A special set swept my whole team in the last wifi tournament. This one was great.
My personal nightmare.
Levitate
Timid
Life orb
-draco meteor/dragon pulse
-earth power
-flame thrower
-giga drain
Evs 252 speed, 252 sp att

Sorry if this set has already been mentioned, but it seriously destroys foes. Plus U-turn has its difficulties. Namely stealth rock, spikes and other entry hazards. Flygon may u-turn, but you can lose the switch in with the hazards.

If it swept YOUR team it don't mean it good... every team have it's weaknesses it is used for surprise factor..

anyway flygon is good only for 3 things Life Orb choice band and choice scarf and all of them with the same set:
EQ outrage Fire Punch U turn.

That's for UU in OU you actually should use fire blast against skarmory but in UU there is no reason to use mixed.

[philzone]

If it swept YOUR team it don't mean it good... every team have it's weaknesses it is used for surprise factor..

anyway flygon is good only for 3 things Life Orb choice band and choice scarf and all of them with the same set:
EQ outrage Fire Punch U turn.

That's for UU in OU you actually should use fire blast against skarmory but in UU there is no reason to use mixed.

It took down tyranitar , garchomp, excadrill and landorus. All in sandstorm. Partners include skarmory, ferrothorn and forretress, as they resist ice and can hurt with steel moves. Mainly seen in sandstorm, try its special set with tyranitar, garchomp, ect. Try a rapid spinner, to remove entry hazards for switching in pokemon, because that is its main fall down with u-turn. Heatran doesn't mind it, and also try in sun, as fire punch(or any fire move flygon learns) gets a boost, and also hits ice types harder.

[Ilan]

It took down tyranitar , garchomp, excadrill and landorus. All in sandstorm. Partners include skarmory, ferrothorn and forretress, as they resist ice and can hurt with steel moves. Mainly seen in sandstorm, try its special set with tyranitar, garchomp, ect. Try a rapid spinner, to remove entry hazards for switching in pokemon, because that is its main fall down with u-turn. Heatran doesn't mind it, and also try in sun, as fire punch(or any fire move flygon learns) gets a boost, and also hits ice types harder.

flygon could care less against entry hazards... really.......... it resist stealth rock and immune to the rest! stop mentioning it like you mentioned trick room lucario..
that's cause your team is offesive.. any defensive pokemon can stop a base 80 specs..
and outspeeding flygon nah you probably tried boosting in front of it or something that you lost against something don't make it any good...

and flygon need sun support since when? it only spams EQ and outrage anyway ire punch is only against certain threats.. like the bug/steels ferrothorn and flying steels.
Just for reference neutral Outrage is stronger by 30 BP than SE fire punch that's why you use i only against steels that are neutral or immune to EQ. which are all I mentioned actually.

I wonder if Blue Harvest even read it as every time I see the smogon sets then gimmick sets and then bad sets....

IDK why people post bad sets if they know they are bad...

[jesusfreak94]

The closest thing Flygon should ever get to a special set is running Fire Blast over Fire Punch. It has its uses, mainly hitting physically defensive Bronzong (the most common kind) for more damage, and I guess the occasional Tangrowth. If you need a Dragon-type Specs user, just use Kingdra. And if you miss the extra SE coverage, use Nidoking.

And Flygon is one of the most hazard-resistant Pokemon in existance. Just saiyan.

[Cosmic Potato]

Specs set shouldn't be considered ???????????! What are you on about. A special set swept my whole team in the last wifi tournament. This one was great.
My personal nightmare.
Levitate
Timid
Life orb
-draco meteor/dragon pulse
-earth power
-flame thrower
-giga drain
Evs 252 speed, 252 sp att

Sorry if this set has already been mentioned, but it seriously destroys foes. Plus U-turn has its difficulties. Namely stealth rock, spikes and other entry hazards. Flygon may u-turn, but you can lose the switch in with the hazards.

losing to flygon is f*cking pathetic

[philzone]

flygon could care less against entry hazards... really.......... it resist stealth rock and immune to the rest! stop mentioning it like you mentioned trick room lucario..
that's cause your team is offesive.. any defensive pokemon can stop a base 80 specs..
and outspeeding flygon nah you probably tried boosting in front of it or something that you lost against something don't make it any good...

and flygon need sun support since when? it only spams EQ and outrage anyway ire punch is only against certain threats.. like the bug/steels ferrothorn and flying steels.
Just for reference neutral Outrage is stronger by 30 BP than SE fire punch that's why you use i only against steels that are neutral or immune to EQ. which are all I mentioned actually.

I wonder if Blue Harvest even read it as every time I see the smogon sets then gimmick sets and then bad sets....

IDK why people post bad sets if they know they are bad...

Sun was a suggestion. Entry hazards are for the pokemon that switches from u-turn. Counters. (UU)frosslass out speeds it then destroys with ice beam. Another way is switching in a bulky pokemon when it outrages. Try bronzong, as it resists a lot of outrages power, and then can destroy it. Suicune does well with strong defences and access to ice beam. Swampert can use ice punch or avalanche to destroy it.

[Ilan]

Sun was a suggestion. Entry hazards are for the pokemon that switches from u-turn. Counters. (UU)frosslass out speeds it then destroys with ice beam. Another way is switching in a bulky pokemon when it outrages. Try bronzong, as it resists a lot of outrages power, and then can destroy it. Suicune does well with strong defences and access to ice beam. Swampert can use ice punch or avalanche to destroy it.

What is so hard to understand Flygon really don't care about hazards and sun... is only for 1 move which isn't even STAB.

Frosslass isn't a check it is 0HKO from scarf outrage. (I am sure even without calculations). (after calculation scarf always 0HKO after stealth rock and if it is band then it is 0HKO anyway.. except 252/252 which it is a 2HKO but then it don't outspeed).
About Suicune I need to use calculator (the famous crocune doesn't run ice beam) Flygon 3HKO suicune with Outrage and have a chance to 2HKO without it is a decent opponent but.. it have a chance to fail countering CB flygon.
252 Atk Choice Band Flygon (+Atk) Outrage vs 252 HP/252 Def Suicune (+Def) : 43.81% - 51.49% (2-3 hits to KO) (w\ stealth rock)

Oh and maybe you are right flygon needs hazard support .. on the other side.

Suicune also 3-4 HKO flygon with scald so.. you need to beware.

[philzone]

Oh and maybe you are right flygon needs hazard support .. on the other side.

Especially if you are switching in stuff like weavile, chandlure, arcanine (stuff which fall to stealth rock) when you use u-turn

Suicune also 3-4 HKO flygon with scald so.. you need to beware.

Plus the burn ruins flygon. Actually most stat contitions badly affect it: burn ruins its physical moves, paralysis (from stuff like glare) causes speed drops, which is bad. Poison lowers the amount of times you can use a life orb, whilst chipping at its health, though most have a choice scarf. Speaking of which, the choice lock can ruin flygon, as an outrage can mean that it is a lure to steel types, but, it isn't all bad, as then you can switch to arcanine or chandlure.

[MetalCrow]

the choice lock can ruin flygon, as an outrage can mean that it is a lure to steel types, but, it isn't all bad, as then you can switch to arcanine or chandlure.

You can have those steel counters all you want, but flygon probably isn't going to wbe making it out alive for the simple reason that it is forced into at least one turn of outrage after a switch...that is plenty of time for something like bronzong(who tends to run hidden power ice & earthquake at times) to do the damage to flygon, predict the switch(if flygon even survives) then ko the fire type of you're choice with an easy earthquake...see the problems now?

Flygon is strong, but not strong enough... Bulky, but not bulky enough...Fast, but not fast enough...it's just almost good enough, but it just plain lacks something important in every aspect

[philzone]

You can have those steel counters all you want, but flygon probably isn't going to wbe making it out alive for the simple reason that it is forced into at least one turn of outrage after a switch...that is plenty of time for something like bronzong(who tends to run hidden power ice & earthquake at times) to do the damage to flygon, predict the switch(if flygon even survives) then ko the fire type of you're choice with an easy earthquake...see the problems now?
Flygon is strong, but not strong enough... Bulky, but not bulky enough...Fast, but not fast enough...it's just almost good enough, but it just plain lacks something important in every aspect

Air balloon? And the fire type should OHKO the steel type. Anyway, you could opt for dragon claw instead of outrage, but you are exchanging raw power for not being destroyed by steels (if you are not running a choice item). Plus, the thing it lacks is probably dragon dance, or a suitable stat boosting move (hone claws and that is about it). Flygon is kind of the middle pokemon

[MetalCrow]

Air balloon? And the fire type should OHKO the steel type. Anyway, you could opt for dragon claw instead of outrage, but you are exchanging raw power for not being destroyed by steels (if you are not running a choice item). Plus, the thing it lacks is probably dragon dance, or a suitable stat boosting move (hone claws and that is about it). Flygon is kind of the middle pokemon

You're missing the point...the steel type could just switch out to avoid the inevitable fire attack...there's plenty of uu or lower pokemon who could sponge those weak fire blasts or a decently strong outrage or earthquake...plenty of them


Interestingly, the best way to deal with a flygon is probably with another flygon...it 4x resists fire attacks & is immune to earthquake, so you have a 50/50 shot at switching in and taking little-to-no damage whatsoever...a quick scarfed outrage to the face is an ohko too

[philzone]

You're missing the point...the steel type could just switch out to avoid the inevitable fire attack...there's plenty of uu or lower pokemon who could sponge those weak fire blasts or a decently strong outrage or earthquake...plenty of them


Interestingly, the best way to deal with a flygon is probably with another flygon...it 4x resists fire attacks & is immune to earthquake, so you have a 50/50 shot at switching in and taking little-to-no damage whatsoever...a quick scarfed outrage to the face is an ohko too

Wrong. It only has a 2x resistance to fire, just like garchomp, and also, choice scarf could be used on both of the flygons, so its a tie. Also, you have air balloon rhyperioy, which can come out with avalanche, if switched into a choice locked earthquake or fire punch. It seems air balloon could be a counter, as then you resist one of its stabs.