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Thread: Taboos in society.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitn3y View Post
    I think suicide can be a very beautiful thing.
    There is a hotline you should probably call ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Treecko's Awesomeness View Post
    Suicide is just selfish in my opinion. Killing yourself leaves everyone who loved you alone, and can ruin many lives besides your own.
    This is, in my humble opinion, the purpose behind the "social taboo." Quite frankly though, I don't think suicide is quite "taboo." To me, taboo is something along the lines of bestiality, insets, cannibalism, pedophilia and so forth. You know, the extreme stuff. Suicide may be frowned upon or disapproved of in general, but to me it doesn't quite hit that level of "taboo"

    Quote Originally Posted by ALordZynix View Post
    It depends if you make a difference between "suicide" and "assisted suicide".
    and then there is this. Assisted suicide should be a medical option in my opinion. let it be know SPPF that if I am ever in a coma with no hope of survival, braindead, or in any other way incapacitated to the point where normal life functions are impossible and I am a huge burden and nothing else, pull the damn plug. Roll me into the middle of a freeway, feed me to the wolfs, I don't care because I don't want to live like that, not that this is really living though. You are now my witnesses that can attest to my desires (haha, your burdened with responsibility now). In all seriousness though, while assisted suicide should be a medical option of last resort, those who deteriorate to such a state are often unable to make such a decision for themselves, and there will be a never ending debate over "he wants to live" vs "This is not what he wanted and I know he is crying inside asking us to pull the plug." Therein lies the problem with assisted suicide, the individual who needs to be of sound mind to make the decision is often not able to do so.

    Quote Originally Posted by dd1zzle View Post
    Public nudity is terrible. I don't care how hot the weather is, where a light tank top if you gotta!

    Also I think PDA should be limited to a hand hold and a peck on the lips. I don't care if you're gay, straight, bisexual, or lesbian, I don't want to see you smack lips together!
    Public nudity doesn't strike me as a taboo either. It is something that has evolved out of necessity and has now become socially expected. I was born and raised in upstate New York and I vividly recall weather forecast that went like so : "The temperature is -7 degrees outside and with wind chill it is -25. Any exposed skin is at risk of getting frost bite if exposed for more than just a few minutes." People are not dressed because it is a taboo to be naked, people are dressed because there are just certain parts of your body that you don't want to lose to frostbite. Even in warmer climates clothes help protect against disease, sun light, and other harmful things. Nudity in and of itself isn't bad, it may be ugly sometimes, and it may be stunning at other times, but it isn't bad. We are socially constructed to be shy and modest about our bodies and to immediately associate nudity with sex, but this is simply not necessary. It would not be to hard to "reteach" society that nudity is beautiful, natural and acceptable and that nudity does not always equate to sex.

    as for public displays of affection, I find them kinda nice sometimes. It is always nice to see a young couple in love, people caring for each other, a passionate kiss between lovers and genuine happiness that only love can elicit. The world is so dark and gloomy sometimes, so I find that seeing others happy can brighten my day, and often make me miss my girlfriend when she is not around. I don't advocate hardcore sex in the park, but a warm embrace and a loving kiss can makes others feel good to if they think about it a certain way.



    Generally speaking, all taboos are nothing more than social constructs human have created for various reasons, usually religious reasons. Take incest for example. This is taboo because we are taught that it is wrong, but if we were not taught it was wrong, it wouldn't be taboo. Humans are the only species that have taboos, and I find that peculiar and interesting. For example, Komoto Dragons have a survival mechanism that allows a single female dragon to start and entire colony by herself. A female Komoto Dragon can fertilize her own eggs, but only the male eggs hatch. From there the males grow, develop, and eventually reproduce with the original female, their mother. From this act both male and female eggs can be fertilized, hatched, and then reproduce with their parents, brothers/sisters, and aunts/uncles. In this fashion 1 female Komoto Dragon can start an entire population of dragons. This species has no quarrels about incest, and the same can be said for other species. Not only incest, but other taboos too, such as cannibalism, interspecial reproduction, etc. the human mind is fascinating and beyond comprehension. From this, we have concocted society, rules to govern that society, and even social expectations from others on a daily basis. This is something unique to the human species, and it will always be with us as long as we are together in society. I would even go so far as to argue that taboos exist out of a fear of judgement by others. Taboos are broken every day, maybe even every hour (just surf the internet for 5 minutes and you will get the general jist), but the people who break these taboos do not display them to the public (aside from the people on the internet I just told you to look up ... moving on). We humans are ok with breaking taboos but we are not ok with others finding out about what we do. We do not care about taboos, we care about being judged, shunned, and outcasted from society.
    Last edited by dewey911p; 3rd September 2012 at 1:28 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dewey911p View Post
    This is, in my humble opinion, the purpose behind the "social taboo." Quite frankly though, I don't think suicide is quite "taboo." To me, taboo is something along the lines of bestiality, insets, cannibalism, pedophilia and so forth. You know, the extreme stuff. Suicide may be frowned upon or disapproved of in general, but to me it doesn't quite hit that level of "taboo"
    By taboo I think of a victimless crime, so I agree with bestiality, incest and cannibalism (only if you didn't kill the person you are eating) and I would end necrophilia, but I don't think you can include pedophilia in a list of taboos. Mostly because when one thinks of pedophilia your mind automatically goes to child rape which is a far from victimless crime.

    Also, I do think "suicide" counts as a social taboo because the only milder version I can think of is a social faux pas, farting in a lift that kind of thing, and it is much extremer then any social faux pas I can think of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dewey911p View Post
    Generally speaking, all taboos are nothing more than social constructs human have created for various reasons, usually religious reasons. Take incest for example. This is taboo because we are taught that it is wrong, but if we were not taught it was wrong, it wouldn't be taboo.
    Actually, I think part of it comes from inbred children having very nasty birth defects, as displayed by quite a few people in royalty.

    Which actually brings an interesting discussion as to whether incest is then ok if the people involved can't reproduce (being either both the same sex or infertile). In that case it would be purely a taboo.

    Then again, non-reproductive sex has been a pretty big taboo of its own. That's definitely a religious one. Though it certainly has become less and less of one over the years.
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    as for the scuicide thing let me tell you this.
    a lot of them are overreactions!
    there is this one girl on this site, i talked her out of suicide twice!
    and both times were over something that could have been easily corrected!
    1) a crush on a video game character that a friend didnt approve of
    2) an article she read online that said that pretty girls grow up to be violet/killers

    as most of us know these thins are not true/stupid
    what i am saying is how many people have comitted suicide and we dont know why?
    how many of them died over something as trivial as this?
    human life is a precious thing you cant destroy it becaouse you feel bad.
    i rest my case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    as for the scuicide thing let me tell you this.
    a lot of them are overreactions!
    there is this one girl on this site, i talked her out of suicide twice!
    and both times were over something that could have been easily corrected!
    1) a crush on a video game character that a friend didnt approve of
    2) an article she read online that said that pretty girls grow up to be violet/killers

    as most of us know these thins are not true/stupid
    what i am saying is how many people have comitted suicide and we dont know why?
    how many of them died over something as trivial as this?
    human life is a precious thing you cant destroy it becaouse you feel bad.
    i rest my case.
    If someone wants to end their lives over something as stupid as the two reasons you listed, I say let then. This world needs less irrational people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitn3y View Post
    I think suicide can be a very beautiful thing.
    Well, it depends; I wont deny that there is a certain poetic beauty in someone willingly sacrifice their life for others. Although I can't remember thinking that it was beautiful when I was contemplating these thoughts half a year ago.
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    I think suicide can be a very beautiful thing.
    um what planet do u live on?
    i agree that sacrificing yourself to save another is noble.
    but taking your own life to end something temporary like bullying etc.
    and most of the time the person wants to comit suicide because of what someone else said/did.
    if you have so many rocks in your skull to know that something YOU said led someone to take their own life and not CARE... well you have that persons blood on your hands.
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    Why do you care so much about if someone wants to kill themselves. It's their business.
    Jackpot!

    I have a theory that the Pokémon world and the Mother world are one in the same. I won't go into spoilers for Mother 3, but think of Black and White's story of the dragon and the twins. Also, chimeras are kind of like Pokémon.

    Werster is without a doubt the Pokémon Master.

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    Why do you care so much about if someone wants to kill themselves. It's their business.
    i becomes your buisness when it involves you.
    like you would tell me that if your brother/sister/father/mother/friend was going to kill themselves wouldnt you try to stop them!?
    whats the difference?!
    thet person (most likely) has people who love/are loved by them!
    and the aftermath... dealing with what happens aftarwards...the sorrow... the asking "WHY!?"...
    i try not to insult people so i wont (i might get someone else to though)
    but try to think before you speak...you obviously dont have personal experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    i becomes your buisness when it involves you.
    like you would tell me that if your brother/sister/father/mother/friend was going to kill themselves wouldnt you try to stop them!?
    whats the difference?!
    thet person (most likely) has people who love/are loved by them!
    and the aftermath... dealing with what happens aftarwards...the sorrow... the asking "WHY!?"...
    i try not to insult people so i wont (i might get someone else to though)
    but try to think before you speak...you obviously dont have personal experience.
    My 12 year old sister tried to kill herself last year. She kept saying she was gonna try and kill herself and I was like go ahead idgaf. She tried to hang herself but she used a really shitty rope and it broke. My mom and my other sister were like OMG you poor thing! And I was like haha wow you suck so much you can't even kill yourself. Thats right, I'm ice cold.

    Im kinda biased against my sister though because I hate her and I would be glad if the rope hadn't broke. Still, no matter who it is I think if somebody wants to kill themself thats their choice **** what anybody else says.

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    Is it taboo in sppf society to say that you dislike Ellie. That is why I will say that I love her.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldManJenkins View Post
    My 12 year old sister tried to kill herself last year. She kept saying she was gonna try and kill herself and I was like go ahead idgaf. She tried to hang herself but she used a really shitty rope and it broke. My mom and my other sister were like OMG you poor thing! And I was like haha wow you suck so much you can't even kill yourself. Thats right, I'm ice cold.

    Im kinda biased against my sister though because I hate her and I would be glad if the rope hadn't broke. Still, no matter who it is I think if somebody wants to kill themself thats their choice **** what anybody else says.
    Imagine it was you instead who failed at hanging yourself. Do you think your mom and other sister would be like OMG you poor thing? Judging from how "ice cold" you are, I bet they would just make a stronger noose for you.
    Jackpot!

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    Quote Originally Posted by marioguy View Post
    Imagine it was you instead who failed at hanging yourself. Do you think your mom and other sister would be like OMG you poor thing? Judging from how "ice cold" you are, I bet they would just make a stronger noose for you.
    I was kinda JK. I honestly didnt really care about whether or not my sister killed herself but it would have had a devastating impact on the other members of my family especially my other sister who is only 6. And I care about them. BTW Also my sister is a terrible evil person who makes life miserable for all those around her.

    EDIT: I thought this thread was for being edgy and politically incorrect. Haha thanks for making me feel like a dick
    Last edited by OldManJenkins; 5th October 2012 at 8:14 AM.

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    I have a right to my opinion!
    yeah u do but dont be a jerk about it.

    ok i have experienced suicide in a way that i understand it more
    my friends dad commit scuicide, and yeah i knew him so yeah i was sad...but i wasnt sad enough to be blind to the fact that it tore the family apart!
    the mom couldnt provide for her 3 kids on her own, so they had to move from a house to a small dingy appartment.
    the kids were failing school cuz the mom could help them herself (she was working to much) and she couldnt afford a tutor (she was making too little).
    so her oldest graduated with crappy grades so she couldnt get a job anywhere she could make decent money at.

    so anyone who thinks that suicide is a good thing...has rocks in their skulls
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    ok i have experienced suicide in a way that i understand it more
    Wow your friends dad huh? Im pretty sure I understand it more seeing as my sister and grandmother have both attempted to take their own lives and I have a few close friends with family members that have killed themself. You shouldnt force someone to live their life being miserable. Death is not a privilege. And suicide could hypothetically be a good thing. What if it was someone who made life worse for others them like an abusive stepfather or a rapist or a serial killer? Does everyone who thinks it was a good thing when Hitler took his life have rocks in their skulls?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldManJenkins View Post
    EDIT: I thought this thread was for being edgy and politically incorrect. Haha thanks for making me feel like a dick
    This is the debate forum. It is possible that some discussions in these threads do tread on politically incorrect territory, as this thread is about questioning what most see as being inherently bad, but it certainly isn't about spewing off-colour "edgy" remarks.

    And say what you want about Hitler, but something tells me that the evil your sister did was to a lesser degree than major genocides.

    Though actually, you've brought up another taboo. Saying anything about Hitler/Nazis that sounds remotely sympathetic.

    Not that I think Nazism is anywhere near a good idea. But I have a feeling Godwin's law wouldn't be used as much as it was if saying that the Nazis might not have been evil down to every last cell wasn't viewed as equivalent to wholeheartedly agreeing to their beliefs.

    Buuut, maybe that's dangerous ground, and I should shut up before things get heated.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldManJenkins View Post
    Wow your friends dad huh? Im pretty sure I understand it more seeing as my sister and grandmother have both attempted to take their own lives and I have a few close friends with family members that have killed themself. You shouldnt force someone to live their life being miserable. Death is not a privilege. And suicide could hypothetically be a good thing. What if it was someone who made life worse for others them like an abusive stepfather or a rapist or a serial killer? Does everyone who thinks it was a good thing when Hitler took his life have rocks in their skulls?
    the part in bold:key word ALMOST

    the part in Italics: then u should have seen the damage it does...obviously u didnt so....

    the underlined part: yeah i can sort of agree with that but honestly how many people who comit suicide have done those things, if they are in a situation like that usually they think that they can get away with it...so no reason to end it...hitler knew he was toast so it was death by himself or his enemy...at least he had the choice to make his painless.
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    It's good Suicide's a taboo.

    If everyone was nonchalant about it, every 13 year old would think popping themselves off when they have had one embarrassing day in school, is a reasonable reaction. It's a deterrent effect for people who don't fully understand death, or haven't had much experience with dealing with it happening to people they know/love.

    I do however agree with OldManJenkins, that sometimes it is a good thing. I know if I ever got something like Alzheimer's I would probably feel the same way as Terry Pratchett, and be looking for euthanasia.

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    Suicide eh? Id have to say Im completely and totally for some one offing themsevles for what ever reason they see fit.

    Off course I dont intend to tell any one to kill them selves that second, id reccomend we'd have a sort of one on one suicide counselor who would hear them out, and give their opinion on whether or not they should go about offing themselves.

    Regardless of this id say that any one should have that right, regardless of any one opinon on the topic.

    No one askd to be born, we where brought into this world, forced into its rules and social norms and were told we have to like it. At that point lfe sound more like a prison than something sacred, and for the sole reason alone that I or any one else never asked to be born, Id say it should be an unlimited right.

    Then there's the people who cry about the families and friends feelings. Last I checked, I was never detained for buying that expesnive ps3 because my mother didnt like it, I have (yet) to be sent to rehabilitation because I dont believe in some ones god and they cried over it, no one has been put in juvi because their family or friends didnt like that they got a tattoo. Whoop de doo people do things other people dont like and genuinily get deprssed about it a times. Theres are times were I feel like Im basically being told that Im just a reservoir of happiness for people and that should be the sole reason for me to stay alive.

    And on a final note, ansem, I know there can be issues when the person who tries to commit suicide is a father of 3 or more with a wife, but bear in mind not EVERY one is a man with 3 or more kids with a wife. You do not know how much I hate that damn rebuttal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    yeah u do but dont be a jerk about it.

    ok i have experienced suicide in a way that i understand it more
    my friends dad commit scuicide, and yeah i knew him so yeah i was sad...but i wasnt sad enough to be blind to the fact that it tore the family apart!
    the mom couldnt provide for her 3 kids on her own, so they had to move from a house to a small dingy appartment.
    the kids were failing school cuz the mom could help them herself (she was working to much) and she couldnt afford a tutor (she was making too little).
    so her oldest graduated with crappy grades so she couldnt get a job anywhere she could make decent money at.

    so anyone who thinks that suicide is a good thing...has rocks in their skulls


    Ok, fair enough your experience may have made you bitter on this subject and i sympathize for your pain.
    Though when it comes to death their are those who understand more about it than others and death is a normal thing
    in which everyone experiences.

    ( Death in itself is the main taboo people should be talking about because its the least understood.)

    Now if theirs a person who is in so much pain, that they simply can not handle their life,
    no matter how much help they've tried to seek out help. Who are you to say that they cannot be free and
    act in a manner in which they desire?

    Though its understandable that killing yourself may effect the ones around you in extreme ways, but its more selfish to want someone
    to live out their life in pure pain because you simply might want them around for the convenience
    , than someone who simple wants to be
    free from pain.
    Yeah alright, theirs situations were things will and can get better and situations which could easily be solved by means other that suicide,
    but i think its fair to say that anyone has the right to kill themselves and their is no political,moral view in should be aloud to steal the fundamental freedom
    that comes with being alive in this reality.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celestial Moth View Post
    Ok, fair enough your experience may have made you bitter on this subject and i sympathize for your pain.
    Though when it comes to death their are those who understand more about it than others and death is a normal thing
    in which everyone experiences.

    ( Death in itself is the main taboo people should be talking about because its the least understood.)

    Now if theirs a person who is in so much pain, that they simply can not handle their life,
    no matter how much help they've tried to seek out help. Who are you to say that they cannot be free and
    act in a manner in which they desire?

    Though its understandable that killing yourself may effect the ones around you in extreme ways, but its more selfish to want someone
    to live out their life in pure pain because you simply might want them around for the convenience
    , than someone who simple wants to be
    free from pain.
    Yeah alright, theirs situations were things will and can get better and situations which could easily be solved by means other that suicide,
    but i think its fair to say that anyone has the right to kill themselves and their is no political,moral view in should be aloud to steal the fundamental freedom
    that comes with being alive in this reality.
    So the main argument to your post is:
    Is it possible for every situation to get better?
    That’s the real question.
    Yes I believe that every situation can get better over time…but people lack the patience.
    You have seen the shows where homeless people end up being millionaires.
    How many people have had that opportunity but ended their life before it presented itself?
    Granted, not everyone will become a millionaire, but the situation will surely get better.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    So the main argument to your post is:
    Is it possible for every situation to get better?
    That’s the real question.
    Yes I believe that every situation can get better over time…but people lack the patience.
    You have seen the shows where homeless people end up being millionaires.
    How many people have had that opportunity but ended their life before it presented itself?
    Granted, not everyone will become a millionaire, but the situation will surely get better.
    That's pretty true, and i agree with you, and the question in which you re-established should really be contemplated.

    Though their are situations were things will not get better. I refer to debilitating mental disorders, debilitating
    medical disorders or even situations were ones own choices put oneself in a tricky situation, as well as situations were all
    things are out of that persons control and will not get better.
    Its true though
    that even in these situations patience will go a long way and would more likely than not help them in a very positive way.
    But you cant deny the fact that theirs situations were people can not handle "the cards they've been dealt" because of the
    different ways in which everybody handles their own pain.

    Theirs situations were no matter what anyone does they will no be able to help someone through or relieve someone from
    the great pain that said person may be inflicted by. I don't recommend that people kill themselves, though i understand their
    are situations that are utterly without hope and are filed with unendurable pain.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    Yes I believe that every situation can get better over time…but people lack the patience.
    Im not trying to be hostile here but who are you to say that other peoples problems will get better? Can you see into the future? How do you know that the situation may not just get worse? How do you know if the "better" is even worth it in the eyes of the person with the problem?

    See, the issue here I believe is that the people who say that "it will get better" only think in terms of their own life and the challenges theyve had to over come, but may have never considered that their challenges may have been easier for them to get a grasp off and im some situations may have been entirely luck based and coincidental that people have taken for granted. Basically, its black swan theory http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory

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    Quote Originally Posted by The renegade View Post
    Im not trying to be hostile here but who are you to say that other peoples problems will get better? Can you see into the future? How do you know that the situation may not just get worse? How do you know if the "better" is even worth it in the eyes of the person with the problem?

    See, the issue here I believe is that the people who say that "it will get better" only think in terms of their own life and the challenges theyve had to over come, but may have never considered that their challenges may have been easier for them to get a grasp off and im some situations may have been entirely luck based and coincidental that people have taken for granted. Basically, its black swan theory http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory
    ok let me say something.
    i have a problem that gives me migraines daily since i was born.
    so basically every moment i am awake i have to deal with splitting pain in my head and nausea that usually leads to vomiting… and would you tell me to commit suicide?
    If anyone had a cause to end his life its me.
    Guess what?
    Because of puberty its starting to dissipate slightly.
    After a few more years I maybe it will fade altogether.
    But there is always hope…
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    ok let me say something.
    i have a problem that gives me migraines daily since i was born.
    so basically every moment i am awake i have to deal with splitting pain in my head and nausea that usually leads to vomiting… and would you tell me to commit suicide?
    id say that'd be up to you. Honestly If any one wanted to commit suicide for any reason, i wouldnt judge them for it, I may think in some cases its pants on head retarded but they may see it differently than i do, so so be it.

    ok let me say something.
    Guess what?
    Because of puberty its starting to dissipate slightly.
    After a few more years I maybe it will fade altogether.[/QUOTE]

    Yeah, thats cool. Some people get it during adulthood and it never goes away, if anything it might get worse.

    Quote Originally Posted by ansem the wise View Post
    But there is always hope…
    Sure, i just think its foolish at times to have false hope. Not that migraines dissipating is false hope, but rather im applying that to the more urgent issues in general

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