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Thread: Movie 16 - ExtremeSpeed Genesect & The Awakening of Mewtwo - FIRST DETAILS

  1. #5226
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    It's official. Ash in Best Wishes is different from Ash in DP. It's easy to believe that than say the original Mewtwo doesn't exist.

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    Mewtwo: *To Ash* Thank you. I will remember you always.
    Ash: This time, we'll both be able to remember!
    Pikachu: *Jumps off Ash's shoulders and says good-bye to Pikatwo* Pikachu!
    Pikatwo: Pikachu!
    All of them set off to the air, with Mewtwo holding up Pikatwo and Meowtwo with his powers.
    Mewtwo: If, someday, you hear my voice, know that it is my spirit calling across time and space to yours.

    ^ is the original dub farewell

    and to think that ash won't remember at all..I'm so angry that the director of the plot just completely disregarded mewtwo's original character, and disregard his predecessor's work. how the hell can he just do that?

    mewtwo had a lot of depth and development. it's blatant disrespect to mewtwo and everyone who had liked him. I really loved that character, and I can't believe they would just dump it off like it never happened.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracoflare View Post
    It's official. Ash in Best Wishes is different from Ash in DP. It's easy to believe that than say the original Mewtwo doesn't exist.
    Well, if there can be two Mewtwo with identical stories outside of minor details, maybe there are multiple Ashes too. After all, there's no logical place where this stops now.

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    Can't believe I missed this, but what's with the blatant 9/11 reference in this movie? I mean it was obviously done on purpose given the setting, and I personally think it's uncalled for. I'm sure it'll be cut from the dubbed version, but it seems like the writers/producers/whoever just didn't care.

    I'm really peeved about how this movie has turned out as a whole. I'll admit that I had very low expectations from the start (no surprise there lol), but even I didn't think they would take one of the most iconic Pokemon in the franchise and ruin his legacy. I'd just like to clarify that I don't mean any disrespect to the new Mewtwo's voice actress. I read one of her interviews and she seemed really nice, so I don't hold her responsible for the way this movie turned out; she was just hired to voice the new Mewtwo and that's what she did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama View Post
    To be honest, it's a kids movie. That's all there is to it, I see no reason to get so upset.
    Everyone expected at least the ending to be stupid. But there's a fine line between simply appealing to kids, and treating us the audience like we're idiots. Especially Ash, for forgetting the first Mewtwo despite heavily implying it was the old Mewtwo when the trailer showed. He even said Mewtwo's name. The director is well aware of the existence of the 1st Mewtwo as well, but consciously went with making another.

    Little kids are loud, hyper, and have short attention spans - but they're not stupid. Speaking from experience back in 1998, I wasn't stupid enough not to notice there was a huge difference between this cool guy and this obvious fake, when that abysmal Hollywood movie came out. And I wasn't even 10 at the time. Japanese kids are smart kids. Give them some credit.

    I'm not mad or even disappointed in having another Mewtwo. In fact, I think it's pretty cool to have both a "male" and "female" Mewtwo. The possibilities there could be if the two met in the anime canon would be so much fun. But when you try to retcon the original, one of the most complex and sympathetic Pokemon ever made, then we have a problem.
    This movie sounds like the Bay Transformers movies - high on action and very pretty to look at, but makes sad attempts at characterization and plot.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelia View Post
    Everyone expected at least the ending to be stupid. But there's a fine line between simply appealing to kids, and treating us the audience like we're idiots. Especially Ash, for forgetting the first Mewtwo despite heavily implying it was the old Mewtwo when the trailer showed. He even said Mewtwo's name. The director is well aware of the existence of the 1st Mewtwo as well, but consciously went with making another.

    Little kids are loud, hyper, and have short attention spans - but they're not stupid. Speaking from experience back in 1998, I wasn't stupid enough not to notice there was a huge difference between this cool guy and this obvious fake, when that abysmal Hollywood movie came out. And I wasn't even 10 at the time. Japanese kids are smart kids. Give them some credit.

    I'm not mad or even disappointed in having another Mewtwo. In fact, I think it's pretty cool to have both a "male" and "female" Mewtwo. The possibilities there could be if the two met in the anime canon would be so much fun. But when you try to retcon the original, one of the most complex and sympathetic Pokemon ever made, then we have a problem.
    This movie sounds like the Bay Transformers movies - high on action and very pretty to look at, but makes sad attempts at characterization and plot.
    It's a pity. Pokemon never had such amazing animated night battles. It's just so amazing. Arrrgh, why destroy it? Why? Are these people trying to destroy their own franchise?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    Honestly, I blame the return of the Pikachu shorts last year. Having the short caused the movie to lose a good 20 minutes, and if the story didn't have to be crushed into a 70-75 minute movie maybe Yuyama wouldn't have decided he had to retcon Mewtwo out of existence to do it. Fitting decent stories into shorter movies was yet another thing Shudo could do that this crew can't.
    But they had the prologue to work with, which is as long as the short is. The length isn't the problem here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed View Post
    Can't believe I missed this, but what's with the blatant 9/11 reference in this movie? I mean it was obviously done on purpose given the setting, and I personally think it's uncalled for. I'm sure it'll be cut from the dubbed version, but it seems like the writers/producers/whoever just didn't care.
    The Japanese don't care, most likely. I don't think two identical towers were explicitly destroyed in the movie itself, but yeah, to have a shot of the destruction of a city that looks like New York City itself hits too close to home. So no complaints there about it being taken out of the dub, even though it's popular in movies to have New York get wrecked. A bit of a weird double standard we have :/.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kein View Post
    But they had the prologue to work with, which is as long as the short is. The length isn't the problem here.
    Vague characterization and sparkly visuals are not a good way to spend 20 minutes when that adds no value to the movie it is supposed to precede.

    That they made a prologue, the length of a normal episode, from which almost nothing productive or worthwhile came about, really says a lot about how they view the anime and those who watch it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Dude...they ruined Mewtwo. They RUINED MEWTWO. Do you not see how serious this is? This isn't some "well we can't expect the best from the anime. I'll enjoy it anyway." No, this isn't some minor thing. You cannot possibly expect people to be okay with Mewtwo, the original most powerful Pokémon, one of the most famous Pokémon around, one of the most iconic of the start of Pokémon...to be erased and replaced with a weaker clone with absolutely no explanation.

    If you're okay with it, well good for you. But this is an insult to longtime fans and another mess up for Best Wishes
    Been a fan ever since the OS gang was active. I understand that people are mad and I can understand why they're mad as well. But, it just doesn't faze me at all. Like many people have said, BW was a screw up. I just got used to things like this happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama View Post
    Been a fan ever since the OS gang was active. I understand that people are mad and I can understand why they're mad as well. But, it just doesn't faze me at all. Like many people have said, BW was a screw up. I just got used to things like this happening.
    True. We're not supposed to be watching this show anymore. I guess it's our fault to overstay in the fandom. Meh, I wish I know why I am still clinging to the anime. But I will last one more generation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracoflare View Post
    True. We're not supposed to be watching this show anymore. I guess it's our fault to overstay in the fandom. Meh, I wish I know why I am still clinging to the anime. But I will last one more generation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tuskie Tyrant Yoko Kurama View Post
    Been a fan ever since the OS gang was active. I understand that people are mad and I can understand why they're mad as well. But, it just doesn't faze me at all. Like many people have said, BW was a screw up. I just got used to things like this happening.
    Come on guys, you're acting like the anime has been like this for ages. It's only been 3 years.

    ...we're not supposed to watch this anymore? What the hell? What is happening...




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    Quote Originally Posted by Dracoflare View Post
    It's official. Ash in Best Wishes is different from Ash in DP. It's easy to believe that than say the original Mewtwo doesn't exist.
    I thought we knew this, BW series has treated Ash like a joke while AG series to D/P really tried with him even though some said his personality was gone which I was one of those who disagreed with on that.

    Yet, I look forward to X and Y anime series, maybe cuz of how he looks more mature from the image almost like AG Ash, so gives me hope hey'll return to AG Ash. I'm one of the few who didn't mind BW Ash, even though he didn't win at all till the last few episodes which some say doesn't count. I'm hopeful for X and Y anime to be better than this, they'll have new writers right? I thought every series got new writers?

    Its so weird, they have DA give all these flashbacks of other series yet they want to act like MewTwo one of the most popular Pokemon in the series isn't didn't happen? What the heck?

    I'll still see the film due to me being a big Ash fan but this is going to be the first Pokemon film to be hard to watch.
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  14. #5239

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    So, seen the summary...

    Words cannot describe my feelings, so just have this image.
    Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
    Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."
    Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

  15. #5240
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    Quote Originally Posted by diakyu View Post
    Then Returns never happened. The first movie had to of happened because it tied into the regular anime. Returns status was already shoddy due to it being a anime special ( like Mastermind of Mirage Pokemon I consider it non-canon).
    Except the TV Special was aired as a regular episode, and then re-aired as three separate regular episodes whenever the series is rerunning in Japan . It's canon.

    This entire movie is bullshit. People who followed through the Japanese version of the original Mewtwo story feel the sting even more. They ruined a perfectly good character and disrespected the work of a dead writer.
    Last edited by Satoshi; 13th July 2013 at 9:59 AM.
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    So is Newtwo's gender confirmed as female, or do people assume just because of the voice? I mean it can just be the way he (?) speaks using telepathy.

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    I've said it before: there was no way for them to write in a new Mewtwo character without pulling BS out of thin air. But it's even worse, this movie tries to retcon the original Mewtwo out of existence. Who was it that told me they wouldn't ruin my favorite character and that I shouldn't worry about it? Yeah, well, so much for that. Talk about disrespect to a dead writer and a character who had a respectable legacy within the fandom despite being part of the anime canon, which people often look down upon.

    To make things worse, we get a clear indication that the director loves to make Satoshi look absolutely retarded. They clearly show him recognizing Mewtwo in the early trailers and aired the original Mewtwo story again on TV, showing that they didn't make Satoshi look stupid due to forgetfulness, because they remembered Satoshi had met a Mewtwo before (don't even tell me they didn't!). No. They will Satoshi into the state that he's in, and they have no respect for him as a likable main character. Satoshi had a great moment with Mewtwo in the original TV Special and they shouldn't have ruined that.

    No disrespect intended to Reiko Takashima - she was simply doing her job by voicing the character, and she did it well. However, disrespect is intended for Kunihiko Yuyama. This man worked with Takeshi Shudo on many anime series, and it's hard to believe he would do something like this. So much for the "respecting Shudo's work" theory - he probably did this for shits and giggles, with no rhyme or reason for it. I wouldn't be surprised if he was the "Omae-sama" Shudo was referring to on his blog posts.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nightstar1994 View Post
    So is Newtwo's gender confirmed as female, or do people assume just because of the voice? I mean it can just be the way he (?) speaks using telepathy.
    It's considered female because it talks and sounds like a female.

    If they give it a masculine voice and masculine speech pattens, the creators are most likely intending for the viewers to identify it as a male.

    If they give it a female voice and feminine speech patterns, the creators are most likely intending for the viewers to identify it as a female.

    C'mon, the movie treats the audience like a bunch of idiots. Of course they're not going to make them think deeply about that. It is what it is.
    Last edited by Satoshi; 13th July 2013 at 10:29 AM.
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  18. #5243

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    Oh. I wonder why did Best Wishes saga as a whole started treating us like idiots. Are they trolling us for fun, or what? Hoenn and D/P executed the "nostalgia" plots pretty well. Charizard got an awesome win against Articuno for example, we had a nice Celebi Ranger episode.

    Best Wishes first tried to make all I-IV Pokemon nonexistant in Unova, then made Charizard a joke and now old Mewtwo is non-existant. Why writers, why!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if he was the "Omae-sama" Shudo was referring to on his blog posts.
    What do you mean?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Virgil133 View Post
    What do you mean?
    On Shudo's blog posts, there was often a higher-up that kept Shudo from writing Rocket Gang the way he wanted to, along with a few other things. He was constantly at ends with him. He referred to this higher-up as "Omae-sama."

    "Omae-sama" is part of the reason why the show slowly started to become formulaic past the first dozen episodes.
    Last edited by Satoshi; 13th July 2013 at 10:55 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satoshi View Post
    On Shudo's blog posts, there was often a higher-up that kept Shudo from writing Rocket Gang the way he wanted to, along with a few other things. He was constantly at ends with him. He referred to this higher-up as "Omae-sama."

    "Omae-sama" is part of the reason why the show slowly started to become formulaic past the first dozen episodes.
    It wouldn't surprise me if Omae-sama actually was Kunihiko Yuyama, now that I think about it. He is the director, after all.

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    This page records the reactions of several people to Shudo's death, including Omae-sama. Three observations:

    1. There is no separate reaction from Yuyama.
    2. Omae-sama specifically references the movies, but he comes across as being cold.
    3. The person who wrote that page probably knows who Omae-sama is but is keeping it a secret.

    I'd be surprised if Omae-sama weren't Yuyama at this point.

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    Okay, wait a moment. Is this all because of what Pokebeach posted? Ash is the only one who remembers Mewtwo to begin with, and it would be natural to ask her who she is if he realizes this isn't the one he knows. And it is true....NOBODY ELSE knows what a Mewtwo is! Only Ash would have any knowledge. Has anybody here actually seen the scene in question yet? Or is everybody here going off the assumption of what pokebeach posted? Also, when he first sees Mewtwo, despite the trailer, what forme is she in? Original or Awakened?
    Last edited by ZeoViolet; 13th July 2013 at 11:57 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeoViolet View Post
    Okay, wait a moment. Is this all because of what Pokebeach posted? Ash is the only one who remembers Mewtwo to begin with, and it would be natural to ask her who she is if he realizes this isn't the one he knows. And it is true....NOBODY ELSE knows what a Mewtwo is! Only Ash would have any knowledge. Has anybody here actually seen the scene in question yet? Or is everybody here going off the assumption of what pokebeach posted?
    Even the Japanese fans said there were absolutely no references to the original Mewtwo. This was known as early as the pre-screening.

    It's safe to say what PokeBeach posted wasn't way off. The preview at the end of the prologue also shows the scene in question - Mewtwo introduces herself "I am Mewtwo!" She enters the fray while in her new form, and Satoshi never does what he did in the early trailers when she turns back into the regular Mewtwo form.
    Last edited by Satoshi; 13th July 2013 at 12:01 PM.
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  25. #5250

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    Except that when Ash asks her who she is, it's meant to be that he (along with everyone else) doesn't know what a Mewtwo is. Even when Mewtwo Returns happened.

    Ninja'd.
    Shokotan: "And then, in Extremespeed Genesect: The Awakening of Mewtwo, we meet another Mewtwo!"
    Yuyama: "Yes, I thought it'd be better if it was a different Mewtwo."
    Good for you Yuyama. Too bad you've singlehandedly torpedoed any lingering respect I and anyone else had for you.

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