BWS2-17 Iris VS Drayden [FIRST POST UPDATED 10/19]

[Locormus]

I wish people would be careful about speaking of filler sagas. We don't have confirmation of that yet.

Where is all this coming from? The BW2 games have Kanto Pokemon and gymleaders as well as other gymleaders as well. Just because of that doesn't mean Ash's old Pokemon and Misty needs to show up again. Besides, Ash went to Kanto already back in BF. All of the Kanto Pokemon has been shown a bunch of times. There is no need for it again.

Well to be honest he said he only thought of it as a 0.01% chance, only if Iris doesn't tag along...

True, we don't have confirmation, but we have confirmation about the league happening relatively soon. How are you gonna justify the amount of time required to bridge the gap between the end of the league and a new series?

[fer92]

Basically, the opinion is that the Iris charracters could be given a closure in this episodes and I find a hard time believing that Iris stay being a main character during 1 year after the episode of average if gets closure here.

Basically I don't think that Iris if Dragonite (a Pokemon way more powerful than any of the actual main cast including Krookodile) is going to be developed if fully obeys, if Iris wins against Drayden with Dragonite fully obeying, if Georgia appears in this episodes. Basically, if Iris get closure there. Not only that, but Iris could be the first characters to give a real closure. Beause Misty, May, Dawn and Brock are giving closures but not very solid (Dawn/May are still coordinator, Brock isn't a doctor and Misty in the Gym (or who knows).

Because I don't think that the Iris' storyline is easily revampable like the Ash storyline (technically has 6 partial closures until now), May/Dawn storyline (happen one time with May) and Brock/Cilan/Misty storyline (they need a departure episode and go-go).


The basis of the opinion is supported by the apparente closure that Iris could (not will) get, the big merchandise where Ash, Cilan and TR (but not Iris and any of her pokemon) appears, and realitily minor, the heavily non-stop Piplup merchandise (if is for release September, October and early November is for the cameo, but if is for December (and already exists) and beyond and isn't with all the starters, I don't say what I think...

Of course, if Iris loses against rayden, Dragonite goes on rampage, etc. Iris storyline is open and she will be confirmed to be after the league. And we can ignore (while Contest aren't in the radar, at least) that the group will be Ash, Iris and Cilan at least until the next generation that i didn't except until after the Gensect movie. And I see Novamber and the earliest could be September of next year.

And also, I foundnd this... Really posted by Sushi.

Time to show the strength she has built up during her journey!

[Pokemaniac24]

Basically I don't think that Iris if Dragonite (a Pokemon way more powerful than any of the actual main cast including Krookodile)

Which is why Krookodile beat Dragonite :/

[fer92]

Which is why Krookodile beat Dragonite :/

Not. Iris' Dragonite is way more powerful than Krookodile. Krookodile win against Dragonite because Dragonite went on rampage and went out of control. But isn't because it's stronger than Dragonite. Basically is a plot that if you don't control a pokemon, you can lose a battle including with a high level pokemon (like Dragonite). And using Krookodile to evolve Krokorok and because Krookodile learns Dragon moves after evolution.

[Pokemaniac24]

Not. Iris' Dragonite is way more powerful than Krookodile. Krookodile win against Dragonite because Dragonite went on rampage and went out of control. But isn't because it's stronger than Dragonite. Basically is a plot that if you don't control a pokemon, you can lose a battle including with a high level pokemon (like Dragonite). And using Krookodile to evolve Krokorok and because Krookodile learns Dragon moves after evolution.

What are you talking about NOW? Obviously us as viewers have to judge the Pokemon by their battles because we have no other fair way of judging them. I don't care if Dragonite was rampging or not because Krookodile still beat Dragonite. That says enough about Krookodile.

[HatersGonnaHate]

Basically, the opinion is that the Iris charracters could be given a closure in this episodes and I find a hard time believing that Iris stay being a main character during 1 year after the episode of average if gets closure here.

Basically I don't think that Iris if Dragonite (a Pokemon way more powerful than any of the actual main cast including Krookodile) is going to be developed if fully obeys, if Iris wins against Drayden with Dragonite fully obeying, if Georgia appears in this episodes. Basically, if Iris get closure there. Not only that, but Iris could be the first characters to give a real closure. Beause Misty, May, Dawn and Brock are giving closures but not very solid (Dawn/May are still coordinator, Brock isn't a doctor and Misty in the Gym (or who knows).

Because I don't think that the Iris' storyline is easily revampable like the Ash storyline (technically has 6 partial closures until now), May/Dawn storyline (happen one time with May) and Brock/Cilan/Misty storyline (they need a departure episode and go-go).


The basis of the opinion is supported by the apparente closure that Iris could (not will) get, the big merchandise where Ash, Cilan and TR (but not Iris and any of her pokemon) appears, and realitily minor, the heavily non-stop Piplup merchandise (if is for release September, October and early November is for the cameo, but if is for December (and already exists) and beyond and isn't with all the starters, I don't say what I think...

Of course, if Iris loses against rayden, Dragonite goes on rampage, etc. Iris storyline is open and she will be confirmed to be after the league. And we can ignore (while Contest aren't in the radar, at least) that the group will be Ash, Iris and Cilan at least until the next generation that i didn't except until after the Gensect movie. And I see Novamber and the earliest could be September of next year.

And also, I foundnd this... Really posted by Sushi.

Uh no. Your ideas are based on nothing but assumption and weak supporting details. You've examined irrelevent things and have come a conclusion that has no head and no tail. Please stop!

This Drayden arc does not define everything that is Iris. Beating Drayden does not make her a dragon master because she still has things to learn. Winning simply gives her closure from her childhood loss to him. After this, she will continue to focus on her dragon master goal by likely catching another dragon and continue her rivalry with Georgia.

I'm gonna repeat this so you understand: Beating Drayden is NOT her goal, so stop acting like she has nothing left to do because she has plenty. Dragonite is not the last dragon she's gonna get.

[wingzx]

Uh no. Your ideas are based on nothing but assumption and weak supporting details. You've examined irrelevent things and have come a conclusion that has no head and no tail. Please stop!

This Drayden arc does not define everything that is Iris. Beating Drayden does not make her a dragon master because she still has things to learn. Winning simply gives her closure from her childhood loss to him. After this, she will continue to focus on her dragon master goal by likely catching another dragon and continue her rivalry with Georgia.

I'm gonna repeat this so you understand: Beating Drayden is NOT her goal, so stop acting like she has nothing left to do because she has plenty. Dragonite is not the last dragon she's gonna get.

^^ haters is right this is just a "stepping stone" she still has more to learn to become a dragon master

[1rkhachatryan]

Not. Iris' Dragonite is way more powerful than Krookodile. Krookodile win against Dragonite because Dragonite went on rampage and went out of control. But isn't because it's stronger than Dragonite. Basically is a plot that if you don't control a pokemon, you can lose a battle including with a high level pokemon (like Dragonite). And using Krookodile to evolve Krokorok and because Krookodile learns Dragon moves after evolution.

LOL Krookodile pwned Dragonite so I don't see what your talking about.

[Eneci]

Not. Iris' Dragonite is way more powerful than Krookodile. Krookodile win against Dragonite because Dragonite went on rampage and went out of control. But isn't because it's stronger than Dragonite. Basically is a plot that if you don't control a pokemon, you can lose a battle including with a high level pokemon (like Dragonite). And using Krookodile to evolve Krokorok and because Krookodile learns Dragon moves after evolution.

U probably mean Dragonite could be stronger if he wouldn't put on such a sh*t. Dragonite has shown that is really powerful but if U can't control Ur power and can't focus in times U're losing that STRENGTH isn't worth anyhing! It's like sports !


Dragon claw was a deserved gift for working hard and kicking as*!

[pokemon fan 132]

Basically, if Iris get closure there. Not only that, but Iris could be the first characters to give a real closure. Beause Misty, May, Dawn and Brock are giving closures but not very solid (Dawn/May are still coordinator, Brock isn't a doctor and Misty in the Gym (or who knows).

If we by "real closure" count achievement of someone goal, than Tracey is first character who was given that when becoming prof Oak assistant.

Speaking of other characters while May, Dawn and Brock to extent got partial closures being showed progress toward their dreams made, they still have open things in their stories for further build up.
While Misty and Maxy got no real conclusion at all.
Max because of no aging rule is doomed to forever rot at gym never getting first pokemon and start his own journey.

While Misty just randomly went back to gym out of obligation and necessity leaving her goal of becoming water master unfinished, not providing future plans and what she intends to do in life.

Because I don't think that the Iris' storyline is easily revampable like the Ash storyline (technically has 6 partial closures until now), May/Dawn storyline (happen one time with May) and Brock/Cilan/Misty storyline (they need a departure episode and go-go).

You don't need to revamp someone story to warrant his further stay in cast. There is something called sequel to previously established storyline.
And im astonished by lack of imagination in here when it comes to characters, acting like "defeat of Drayden is ultimately end for Iris".
In narrative things don't work like that at all, with there not existing barriers and limitation in how much character can develop.

If character is wrapped up, writers can reopen story and do continuation taking him forward from where they stopped. If initial issues are resolved they can decide to introduce something they forgot to include first time around and develop new subplots around him which goes in correlation with his own motives and dreams.

Even if Iris defeats Drayden, that wont make her "dragon master" with there actually existing trials and tests its expected from someone to pass to ear such prestigious title.
Nor it would mean Iris suddenly has same amount of knowledge and skill about dragon types, like Drayden does.
That's same like saying "how winning one regional league would make Ash pokemon master" which is anything but true.

How many times did we saw Ash defeating stronger, more experienced trainers than he was, but does that make him equally skilled like they were? Not at all, with various parameters being involved in such battles such as luck, element of surprise, distraction etc.

Same applies to Iris, even if she beats Drayden that doesn't mean she is equally skilled trainer like he is nor it makes her dragon master material.
Lets draw parallel with real life here:
There are countless examples where top Tennis, Chess and all kind of other sport players win championship just to later on drop very early in tournament whether its because they aren't in top shape, because someone lower ranked managed to outsmart them with their tactic, because other strong player manage to surpass them etc.

People also forget how Iris game counterpart role in BW2 games becoming Champion, offers another direction through which character could be taken, trying to become champion in anime as well eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up as Alder or Cynthia apprentice, if writers take character through this route.

So whether Iris defeats Drayden or not, this doesn't mark end for character in anyway, being laughable in least hand to expect that writers replace someone in middle of generation.
Believe it or not, Iris story can be continued regardless of outcome in that battle.

[Caseydia]

^^ haters is right this is just a "stepping stone" she still has more to learn to become a dragon master

I'm glad someone else is saying this. It needs to be addressed more. Iris still has alot to learn even if she's super sued at the end of the series. But unfortuanately like others said, I do think that this might be her last on the show. If she's going to become a Unova Champion, might as well stay in Unova until then.

[HatersGonnaHate]

I'm glad someone else is saying this. It needs to be addressed more. Iris still has alot to learn even if she's super sued at the end of the series. But unfortuanately like others said, I do think that this might be her last on the show. If she's going to become a Unova Champion, might as well stay in Unova until then.

They wouldn't make her champion because that would make Ash look really bad. If anything, they'll make her decide to collect gym badges to forshadow the future possibly. She's also not going anywhere until the entire generation is over.

[Caseydia]

They wouldn't make her champion because that would make Ash look really bad. If anything, they'll make her decide to collect gym badges to forshadow the future possibly. She's also not going anywhere until the entire generation is over.

Just be glad that the poor girl is being given proper focus after all this time. And when I mean proper, I mean not in gaps. And the reason why I said that was because Unova should be her signature region. Not to make Ash look bad about her champion status or anything but because that won't matter. But because of her status she should stay.

[Locormus]

Just be glad that the poor girl is being given proper focus after all this time. And when I mean proper, I mean not in gaps. And the reason why I said that was because Unova should be her signature region. Not to make Ash look bad about her champion status or anything but because that won't matter. But because of her status she should stay.

Because Unova is somehow her signature region? And therefore she should stay? What? That's like saying Ash should've stayed in Kanto.. Or at least in Johto considering he's based off the (eventual) ultimate champion in both those games.. xD

[1rkhachatryan]

They wouldn't make her champion because that would make Ash look really bad. If anything, they'll make her decide to collect gym badges to forshadow the future possibly. She's also not going anywhere until the entire generation is over.

This is what I'm thinking, having her go after badges would be the best bet.

[AceDetective]

This is what I'm thinking, having her go after badges would be the best bet.

that's how im thinking she eventually leaves. Stays in Unova to collect badges

[1rkhachatryan]

that's how im thinking she eventually leaves. Stays in Unova to collect badges

I would kind of like her and Ash to both collect badges next region. They just have to do it at seperate gyms lol.

[pokemonsquared]

I would kind of like her and Ash to both collect badges next region. They just have to do it at seperate gyms lol.

If that happens I see a lot of dragonite solo pwnage in the future.

[1rkhachatryan]

If that happens I see a lot of dragonite solo pwnage in the future.

Na, the earlier gyms she has no reason not to use Kibago and Emonga lol. Hopefully they wouldn't do the Pikachu crap with her.

[AceDetective]

I would kind of like her and Ash to both collect badges next region. They just have to do it at seperate gyms lol.

Well I don't like her, so would rather she not stick around. But that's just personal preference. Although if she ditches dragonite I could be ok with it