2012 Fanfiction Awards - planning thread

[Aakash98]

I'd like to ask a question, how does a story get nominated, like for a story to have a chance to win the Best Pokémon Chaptered Fic does the story have to be complete?

Are they any guidelines to be nominees?

[Shadow Lucario]

I'd like to ask a question, how does a story get nominated, like for a story to have a chance to win the Best Pokémon Chaptered Fic does the story have to be complete?

Are they any guidelines to be nominees?

The story just has to have been updated within the year of the awards. So anything that has been updated or posted in the year 2012 is fair game. Once the end of the year comes around they'll post a nomination thread and people will go there and post what fics they think deserve which awards.

Speaking of which, I'm really excited to be back this year after a complete absence last year. Here's hopin right?

[Aakash98]

Thanks for the info Shadow Lucario, you seem very experienced at this maybe you'll win at least one award this year.

[Shadow Lucario]

Thanks for the info Shadow Lucario, you seem very experienced at this maybe you'll win at least one award this year.

Having been on this board for five years and seeing the awards for three I'd hope to come as experienced. :P If someone likes my writing enough to nominate me then I'd be content with that.

[Zibdas]

Oo, how exciting~
Why would we need a nomination cap though, just out of curiousity?

[The Great Butler]

Oo, how exciting~
Why would we need a nomination cap though, just out of curiousity?

I was initially against one when I first started running the awards each year (this is my third) but over time I came to understand that without one, there would be a tendency for some nominations to crowd out others for a variety of reasons.

So I think we're all good on categories, right? Only establishing the minimum and maximum caps should be left, I think.

[Shadow Lucario]

So was it agreed upon that PMD fics get their own category? I don't write PMD fics, but I also believe they should have an award all to their own.

[The Great Butler]

So was it agreed upon that PMD fics get their own category? I don't write PMD fics, but I also believe they should have an award all to their own.

I'm going to need some more time to address that; I didn't even notice all those posts at the end of the last page and I can't work it out now. But I would tend towards the personal choice of saying no on my part right now.

[Zibdas]

Do you have a guess as to when the Nominational Thread will be up?

[bobandbill]

Start of next year as before, I imagine.

[The Great Butler]

Do you have a guess as to when the Nominational Thread will be up?

bobandbill is correct, I'll work on it as soon as the year is up.

I'm really not feeling in favor of a genre award strictly for Mystery Dungeon fics. I'd like to hear some more arguments in favor of it, because I'm just not seeing the need yet.

[pokenutter]

I'm going to need some more time to address that; I didn't even notice all those posts at the end of the last page and I can't work it out now. But I would tend towards the personal choice of saying no on my part right now.

If it would help sway you, I'd also like to throw my support behind a Mystery Dungeon fanfic category. In my experience, PMD fics tend to be very different in terms of tone and content, and as such, it may not be fair to judge them on the same level of Trainer's Journey fics and the like. Plus, the genre could probably use a bit more love.

[Feralninja]

The way I see this whole PMD situation is thus:
There is a trainer-centric category, and a pokemon-centric category. The trainer-centric genre is very broad, and encompasses many different story types. The pokemon-centric does the same. Last year, the idea to have a journey fic category was vetoed because it fell under the heading of a trainer fic. A PMD fic is technically a pokemon-centric fic, and therefore falls under the umbrella. While it has become a large part of that genre in the past year, at least on these forums, it still is pokemon centric, and therefore belongs under the category.

[JX Valentine]

I think part of the problem on both sides of the PMD-as-a-category argument is that the terms are rather vague. For example, what is "Pokémon-centric" fanfiction? What exactly separates that from PMD fic? Is PMD fic actually a subgenre of Pokémon-centric, or can it be considered a standalone concept (which was what my original comment on the subject of PMD fics was trying to ask)? Granted, yes, I was subtly proposing the category in the first place, but I was also hoping people would think about it in more detail, especially since discussing it would kill two birds with one stone (i.e., discuss whether or not a PMD category would be viable and tackle what I thought was a vaguely-defined category all in one go).

But because I'm terrible at outlining my thoughts, lemme just make my opinion clear by saying this.

On the one hand, we've had an inordinate number of new PMD fics this year. Either that, or I'm just noticing them this year. I can't quite tell without spending far more time on research than is probably healthy for discussing awards on a fanfiction community. In any case, it seems like we'd have quite a selection if we wanted a category for them.

But because that's not a good argument for having categories (because by my logic right there, we could have fanfiction categories for any random fad "genre" that ambled along -- like having a category for self-insert journey fics if we held the awards in 2006 or something), there's also the argument that PMD fics are "out there." So what is out there? My fics are typically "out there," if I do say so myself (which is why I don't have massive fan followings, besides having the update schedule Microsoft would envy), but does that mean my fics occupy their own genre? The answer, unfortunately for my egotism, is no. So in order to better argue whether or not PMD is a viable genre, we'd need to actually define it as a genre. Specifically, I mean. So in other words, beyond just saying that PMD fics are "out there" or "different from the rest."

So, what makes PMD fic a PMD fic? What does the term "PMD fic" mean? To answer that, let's establish a rough definition: PMD fics are fics set in the PMD universe (read: no humans in sight), in which Pokémon (usually a human turned into one plus fully Pokémon companions) go off to save the world. Okay, so first problem is exactly the question I asked earlier: what separates that idea from other genres?

That leads into the other hand. One could easily argue that PMD fics are basically members of other genres. Which one that is tends to be up for debate. It could be in the TF "genre" (because a human transforms into a Pokémon and goes off on their own adventure like that), and I'm pretty sure that's traditionally what the fandom tends to group it under. TF, of course, is barely its own genre; it's generally a concept belonging to sci-fi and fantasy. As such, PMD (being a subgenre of a subgenre according to some people) ends up grouped under either fantasy or sci-fi -- usually fantasy. Alternatively, it could be considered a subgenre of adventure, considering it usually involves that and a few other elements. ...Which in turn means that it might not be viable for it to get its own category because of how vague adventure is as a term.

So this is probably where the grounds that PMD fic = Pokémon-centric lies. See, Pokémon-centric is more or less a catch-all concept. It applies to all fic that focuses on Pokémon, including PMD fic (considering the fact that PMD, by definition, focuses on Pokémon). It's a sister category to trainer fic, which is itself a catch-all concept that includes not only journey fic but also fics that are generally about trainers. Just like it's safer to say "trainer fic" instead of "adventure fic" (because "adventure" is vague), it's safer to say "Pokémon-centric" instead of "PMD" until PMD fic is thoroughly defined.

Another thing to think about, of course, is the fact that removing PMD fics from the Pokémon-centric pool may render that category as either redundant (because you have two categories for Pokémon-centric fics, just slightly different ones) or not viable (because we don't have a large enough selection of non-PMD Pokémon-centric fics to maintain it). So if we do have a PMD category, we may be looking at a one-or-the-other scenario.

But then again, PMD fics are like trainer fics in that the older that concept gets, the more and more it gets a solid definition, so back on the first hand, it is a solid fandom idea... if we bother to define it thoroughly. It's just a question of whether or not it's solid enough to be a full genre that deserves its own category, not to mention whether or not it'd render a category we've already got as redundant.

So tl;dr, main issue with the PMD argument on both sides is that the arguments for and against it are incredibly vague right now. In my opinion, on the one hand, it has a specific definition and plenty of fics to serve as examples of that definition. On the other, that doesn't necessarily make it a standalone genre, nor does that necessarily mean that Pokémon-centric wouldn't be a fitting category for it. If we're going to proceed with arguments for or against it, we'd have to address the original question: is it or isn't it considered a Pokémon-centric fic? (Please note that there's nothing in the category's definition that says a Pokémon-centric fic has anything to do with humans or the human world. The question is not meant to make you compare PMD fics with other fics that could be in the category; it's meant to make you think about what that term means.)

...And yeah, the against camp should probably be specific too. (Besides Feral, anyway. Feral's summed up a pretty valid point as clearly and specifically as that point could probably get.) I mean, seems like there's a lot of voices for it already, so... yeah. As someone who doesn't even write (or read all that often) PMD fic, I don't really mind either way what happens. I just threw out the suggestion in the first place to generate discussion because I was bored.

[Agent Tectonic]

Leave it to JX to write an essay about the problem (which is quite true in my opinion). For me, I'm all for trying to see if it does work. After all, it doesn't do any harm. To me, I know that there is one category that always gets only one fic nominated (actually, I think that it is JX's fic, but don't quote me on that). So even if the population is low after a split, it's not like it's an outlandish concept. However, in that same breath, I don't think I've seen many fics that focus on a non-PMD style. I don't remember if the perspective one-shot contest posters were this year or last year, but aside from those, I don't think I've seen an actual non-PMD poke-centric story.

So, like I said, I don't see a problem in at least trialing PMD fics as its own category and seeing how it turns out. My only hesitance is that I'm naive as to whether there were stories that could fit into poke-centric fics if it does get segregated.

[Brutaka]

Wow JX. You make a good point. You see though, I could probably define a PMD story, seeing as I write it. Heck, all you have to do is play the game.
First, the main character turns into a Pokemon. The Pokemon itself could be anything, though it's usually small, basic, and non-legendary. I say 'usually', because I've seen a Charmeleon, but it's close enough. Shortly afterward, they meet a partner Pokemon, also usually small and basic. Together they decide to start an 'insert type of team here' team. They go on their first mission. Tour of the town. The beginning of the major plot points begins to unfold. New members of the team may or may not join. Go on more missions. Somewhere down this line, they fight their first legendary, usually having to do with the plot. The story follows this path until the plot is revealed full out. Team goes off to fight the final boss, all most always legendary and extremely powerful, which is preceded by a large, very hard dungeon. Then, when they win, the main hero begins to disappear for whatever reason. Partner hero becomes depressed. Hero somehow comes back. Partner is happy. Team picks up where it left off and continues missions. A second story ark can occur now.

However, as with any fan fic genre ever, any step can be skewed slightly or largely, or not used at all.

So that's defined. I'm still a little uneasy on exactly what the pokemon-centric category covers. Is it any fic that features a Pokemon as it's main character? If it is, I think that may be a tad too broad, honestly.

And I agree with Agent Tectonic, I think, in that testing the category out would do no harm at all. If anything, that'd allow the non-pmd pokemon-centric people a better shot, really, seeing as how nearly all the pokemon-centric fics as of right now are, in fact, PMD.

[Feralninja]

Another thing to think about, of course, is the fact that removing PMD fics from the Pokémon-centric pool may render that category as either redundant (because you have two categories for Pokémon-centric fics, just slightly different ones) or not viable (because we don't have a large enough selection of non-PMD Pokémon-centric fics to maintain it). So if we do have a PMD category, we may be looking at a one-or-the-other scenario.

But then again, PMD fics are like trainer fics in that the older that concept gets, the more and more it gets a solid definition, so back on the first hand, it is a solid fandom idea... if we bother to define it thoroughly. It's just a question of whether or not it's solid enough to be a full genre that deserves its own category, not to mention whether or not it'd render a category we've already got as redundant.

I don't remember if the perspective one-shot contest posters were this year or last year, but aside from those, I don't think I've seen an actual non-PMD poke-centric story.

This is also a good point. A really quick sweep of the archive shows that there really aren't too many non-PMD pokemon fics this year. Now, if I understand correctly, PMD fics are very much like journey fics, which take a considerable amount of time to write. If this is the case, likely many of the fics eligible this year will also be eligible next year. It might be a good idea to see how many get nominated, and if they are a sizable block, consider the category for next year's awards.

[JX Valentine]

To me, I know that there is one category that always gets only one fic nominated (actually, I think that it is JX's fic, but don't quote me on that).

If we're just talking about genre categories (because there's one under other fic awards in which I end up being one of the only nominees for annually, if not the only), then yep, that's actually and sort of hilariously true, and it's sci-fi/fantasy. However, that's also a horse of a different color. One of the main issues that was brought up between Feral and yours truly is the fact that PMD fics could be nested under Pokémon-centric because of how broad that category is. (And there's not really that many non-PMD Pokémon-centric fics out there to put under that category, so you'd end up having basically a redundant category because PMD and Pokémon-centric would basically have the same nominees unless we redefined the latter category or took it out altogether.) Meanwhile, sci-fi/fantasy can't really be nested under anything because it's a distinct genre. Whereas you could argue that PMD fics share elements with Pokémon-centric fics (i.e., both focus on Pokémon), sci-fi/fantasy doesn't really share its traits with anyone except adventure, which is too vague a genre to have a category in the first place. So whereas PMD could potentially be a redundant category, sci-fi/fantasy won't. That's why it's a horse of a different color despite its low annual nominees: because you can't take every nominee in the category and dump them into a single other listing the way you could with PMD fics, if that makes sense.

But honestly, the easiest way to solve the redundancy is just to look at which type of fic gets more entrants. If we have mostly PMD fics and not enough non-PMD Pokémon fics, it probably wouldn't hurt to scrap the -centric category (recategorizing anything that might've fallen into it but not within the realm of PMD as any of the other fic types) and go with the more specific category, especially since a number of people are excited about that idea. Last year's pool for the -centric category wasn't that amazing either (although the fics in it were), so it could be a workable option to do without.

...Or specify the definition of -centric fics in a way that makes it clear it's for PMD fic as well as any other 'mon fic. Either or. I just really think that category needs discussion.

Meanwhile, back to the horse of a different color, sure, it's a different color, but I'll admit it's a horse. Unfortunately, I can't really offer up my opinion on whether or not sci-fi/fantasy is a viable category because I'd be an *** if I did (either by being ungrateful or by unintentionally blowing off the other sci-fi/fantasy authors on the forum), so I'll leave that up to other people's opinions.

[Agent Tectonic]

This is slightly going out on a limb, but I still would like to see what the response is on it, but what if the categories were broken down into trainer fics, non-trainer fics, and MD fics. Unless I'm missing something glaringly obvious, but this should encompass just about everything without a huge room for debate as to where a fic goes. 99.9% of the time, trainer fics are exclusively human-based (I'm not saying 100% since I've considered having a fic where a an actual Pokemon tries to train a team for the League, but that's another story). On the flip side, MD fics are self-explanatory for almost the same reasons trainer fics already is a genre. Then you have the non-trainer fics which is the middle area. As I see it, it doesn't really matter what perspective is being written if the whole premise is just some adventure story that doesn't involve the other two.

Just an idea I thought of since reading up on this, so I don't mind if this gets taken negatively.

[jireh the provider]

In my personal taste, I'd say my preferred heroes on my story would be the actual pokemon themselves. I'm not a huge fan of human heroes from the anime or manga or movie. Its not my cup of tea. One way to convince me to enjoy a story with a human hero/ine is if the human is self created.

This is why PMD is as popular as the main series to fanfic. i myself can be considered as a PMD writer yet also, I can make a pokemon centered story without the PMD brand.

The system is okay as it is. so when will the voting start?