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Thread: •Official B2/W2 In-Game Tiers• * READ THE OP *

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucario01 View Post
    What about Waterfall and Aqua Jet as notable moves for Azumarill?
    Aqua Jet requires breeding, but Waterfall certainly needs to be put there.

    Shuckle for Bottom [1/3]. Having to rely on your opponents attack to do damage is never good. It's typing is fairly bad as well, adding resistances to Normal and Poison.

    Incoming joke tiering.

    Ditto - Ditto tier(Bottom)
    Availability - Very late (Giant Chasm)
    Notable Moves - Transform...
    Stats What stats? Terrible all round.

    - Description -

    +Can breed with anything.
    -Very late in the game
    -Only one move: Transform.
    -Its non-existent defences mean it will almost never get a Transform off.
    -Even after Transforming, Ditto is at a disadvantage because all copied moves have 5PP and you share strengths and weaknesses with the opponent who gets a free turn to exploit them.


    Even its sole pro isn't worth much since you can't breed until postgame, at which point its only really there for the convenience value.



    @Serperior. Well it looks to me as Serp doesn't particularly belong in Low-Middle or Low. It boasts a serperior movepool in the end to Leavanny and Simisage(which will also probably end up Low-Middle/Low) and good levelup moves too, but without Growth/Coil boosts its just too weak to threaten anything. It's mostly self-serving thanks to learning its own setup moves and other moves like Leech Seed/Giga Drain, or even supporting with Dual Screens but useless in most big battles. Available early, but has a very shallow movepool until Lentimas Town move tutors. I could honestly go either way imo.
    Last edited by Aurath8; 24th October 2012 at 10:37 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Huspoel View Post
    You're saying some really smart stuff there.

  2. #102
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    I'm gunna go ahead and rate the rest of my ingame team


    Braviary white 2 only - Top
    Availability - Early (route 4 monday)
    Notable Moves - Fly, Return, Superpower, Shadow claw, Brave Bird, Rock slide, U-turn, hone claws.
    Stats great attack and HP, decent speed.

    - Description -
    You get this bad boy early on from route 4. Immediately comes to use against burgh and destroys bug/grass typing. He is a fully evolved Pokemon when you get him so will help out for general trainers and be able to crush most opponents during the early-mid game. No shortage of STAB moves, Fly from nimbasa and return very early on make for great damage output especially combined with 120 attack which can be boosted by defiant ability and hone claws. He does have a relatively shallow move-pool although superpower can be move tutored slightly early to him and brave bird comes late. Defiant is useful ability when you can predict and intimidate about to come out. If you didn't get braviary so early he would most likely be high tier but I think that makes him top in my book.

    +Early access
    +Powerful STAB moves early on
    +great attack stat
    +Fully evolved when most other pokemon are mid-evo's.
    -Brave bird comes late
    -Shallow move pool


    Drilbur - Top
    Availability - Early (relic passage - sewers)
    Notable Moves - Earthquake, x-scissor, rock slide, sword dance, iron head
    Stats Amazing attack, decent speed

    - Description -
    No doubt about it this guy should be top. If you hold off evolution until level 33 you get earthquake one of the best moves in the game really early. Excadrill and his steel typing are great additions to an all ready great pokemon. Nothing much to say other than a reliable OHKOer. Useful against elsa and other strong trainers.

    +Early access
    +Earthquake at level 33
    +Steel typing
    +great coverage with rock slide
    +great attack
    -movepool bit bland

    @serperior I think low-mid if its between low and low-mid. Theres lots of ways serperior can go it gets both Calm mind and Sword dance and it is useful against the last gym. I think its fair that samurott should be critiqued for low speed if this guy is getting critiqued for low offensive power.

    The unova starters are really rather poor in general.

    Shuckle bottom [2/3] aurawarrior8, dragoniteftw
    Ditto bottom [1/3] dragoniteftw
    Last edited by Dragoniteftw; 25th October 2012 at 3:44 PM.

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  3. #103
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    [2/3] Ditto in bottom

    [1/3] Drilbur in top

    ^Click it!^

  4. #104
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    Whoa, hold on. You can't approve a Pokémon's tiering if you submitted the tier suggestion in the first place. Ditto and Shuckle should both be at [2/3].

    Ditto kinda sucks in battle, though, so I'll make it [3/3].
    100% of information in signatures on this forum involving percentages is false. If you feel as cheated by this atrocity as I do, don't you dare copy this into your signature.
    Hold on... if this percentage was correct at the time of print, that means the actual percentage of false information is less than 100% if this signature is included. Which means that... no! I've become a slave to the system!!

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by TotalPotato View Post
    Whoa, hold on. You can't approve a Pokémon's tiering if you submitted the tier suggestion in the first place. Ditto and Shuckle should both be at [2/3].

    Ditto kinda sucks in battle, though, so I'll make it [3/3].
    Edited my post, thanks.

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  6. #106
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    Regarding Braviary, I'm fairly sure you can't get it before Burgh; I'm pretty sure you need to beat Burgh so Colress can move those Crustle out of the way or whatever before you can catch Braviary. That said, it's clearly brilliant for that early in the game, imo, so I think Top suits it quite nicely. [1/3]

    Agreeing on Excadrill in Top. Nothing's really changed for him, really; he finds Marlon harder than he would've found Brycen, but he does quite well against Colress thanks to Earthquake and X-Scissor. [2/3]

    And I'm also agreeing on Shuckle being bottom. [3/3]

  7. #107
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    Yeah, you have to wait till after the 3rd badge.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
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  8. #108
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    Right, I've editted the OP with Leavanny, Shuckle, Ninetales and Ditto.

    [1/3] for Gigalith and Golurk's respective tierings becuase nobody else seems to care >.>

    Muk - Bottom Tier
    Availability - Mid-Early (Castellia Sewers)
    Notable Moves - Return, Fire Punch, Thunderpunch, Gunk Shot, Ice Punch, Rock Slide
    Stats - Great Atk and HP. Lackluster everywhere else. Terrible Spe

    -Doesn't get a Physical STAB move until Gunk Shot (Lv 49) or 8 Red Shards at Driftveil
    -Evolves very late considering where it's found
    -Has basically no Physical moves until Driftveil, where it requires heavy Shard investment
    -It's Spe means it'll be taking hits left and right
    -Honestly, I can't think of a positive factor

    Raticate - Bottom Tier
    Availability - Mid-Early (Castellia Sewers)
    Notable Moves - Return, Crunch, Sucker Punch, Double Edge, Wild Charge, Zen Headbutt, Iron Tail
    Stats - Usable Atk and great Spe. Lacking everywhere else

    +Early Return / Frustration makes it viable from the get-go
    +Early Crunch / Sucker Punch
    -Watchog is better in every way
    -Outlives it's usefulness at around Clay
    -Doesn't learn any useful moves after Crunch for a long timr
    -Frail. Very frail.
    Last edited by Tsumiki; 25th October 2012 at 12:27 PM.

  9. #109
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    [2/3] for Glourk in low

    [2/3] for Gigalith in Mid

    [2/3] for Braviary in top

    [1/3] for Raticate in bottom

    [1/3] for Muk in bottom

    ^Click it!^

  10. #110
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    Braviary for Top [3/3]. 100/123/75/57/75/80 base stats at that point in the game is just off the charts. You outpower and even outspeed everything. With Superpower at Lentimas it gets the almost unparalled Fly+Fighting coverage, staying useful right to the end.
    Muk for Bottom [2/3]. I checked it out too and genuinely has no positive points to it.
    Raticate for Bottom [2/3]. It is fairly decent after it evolves at lvl 20 with STAB Hyper Fang, but just sucks afterwards.
    Excadrill for Top [3/3]. Gets all the tools he needs to tear up the game through levelup.

    Delibird - Bottom
    Availability - Very late(Route 22)
    Notable Moves - Ice Punch, Aerial Ace, Seed Bomb, Brick Break
    Stats Horrid attacking stats excluding Hustle, average speed, worse defences than Ditto

    - Description -

    -Very late and lacking in stats at that point in the game.
    -Incapable of damage without Hustle or Toxic
    -Requires Tms/Move Tutors as it only learns one move, Present, through levelup.
    -Outgunned, outspeeded and outclassed by just about every pokemon in the game.
    Last edited by Aurath8; 25th October 2012 at 3:30 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Huspoel View Post
    You're saying some really smart stuff there.

  11. #111
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    Editted the OP as needed. I think we're more or less done with Top Tier. Possibly 2~3 more Pokemon at the very best.

    [1/3] Bottom Delibird. It's worse than lolMuk
    Last edited by Tsumiki; 25th October 2012 at 3:37 PM.

  12. #112
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    Oops my bad, forgot about the crustle. I'll get to some more mid level tiering i think Top is about done

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    Pidove - Low Tier
    Availability - Very early (Route 20)
    Notable Moves - Fly, U-Turn, Roost, Return, Taunt
    Stats - Decent attack and speed, average physical defence. Rest is bad.

    - Description -
    Fifth gen's early game normal/flying pokemon. Arguably the worst so far. It lacks super-effective (and even neutral) coverage, which is bad for something designed to be a fast attacker without boosting moves. It's not as bad as Purrloin/Watchog etc. and it has SOME use early game, hence Low tier instead of Bottom. But it's just outclassed by so many things.

    + Caught very early
    + Can do some work against Roxie's Venipede and Burgh's pokemon
    - Horrible special attack, has only special flying moves until you get the HM for Fly. Return will be your best STAB, and alone it doesn't do good at all
    - U-Turn requires some "grinding" at the PWT, so you'll be stuck with only two attacking types (Normal, Flying) with common resistances (Rock, Steel)
    - "Just get a Braviary" (or, if you don't need the Normal/Flying combo, just get any other flyer. It will mostly do better)

    Sunkern - Bottom
    Availability - Very early (Route 20)
    Notable Moves - Leech Seed, Sunny Day, Solarbeam, Giga Drain, Sludge Bomb (Need to use Tutors or keep it unevolved until lv41), Earth Power (Needs tutor)
    Stats Bad. Sunkern actually has the WORST base stats of any pokemon, ever. Sunflora has bad attack, OK special attack and 75-75-85 defenses, with a Speed so horrible not even Chlorophyl will help.

    - Description -
    Your worst option for a Grass type. With Sewaddle it's the only Grass type you can catch for a little while, but it doesn't mean you're gonna need it. Can't do anything against Roxie anyway. Pain in the butt to level up until it's evolved, and even then, it will fail dealing with the endgame (though it helps against the final Gym, so does any other grass type).

    + Nothing. It's that bad.
    - Caught very early in the game. Yes, it's a con, as you will have to spend MORE time with its base form before gaining access to a Sun Stone.
    - Very generic grass type movepool, doesn't even get Giga Drain by itself unless you keep it as a Sunkern until level 41 (Good luck). Can't abuse Leech Seed because it's just so slow and not exactly bulky.
    -Only viable strategy is with Sunny Day and some attacking moves (you only have three options in Solarbeam, Earth Power and Sludge Bomb), but you're so slow that doubling your speed won't do any good. Not even ingame. Unless you need to outspeed Gigalith.

    Psyduck - Middle Tier
    Availability - Very early (Floccesy Ranch)
    Notable Moves - Surf, Hydro Pump, Psychic, Ice Beam, Brick Break
    Stats Good Special Attack and Speed, usable Physical Attack, mediocre bulk

    - Description -
    Special counterpart of Azumarill. It's outclassed by many water types (most notably Starmie) but you can get it so early it can really help out. Not as good as Huge Power Azumarill but it's a lot faster nonetheless.

    + Available very early in the game
    + Quickly gains decent special attacks (Water gun, Confusion, then Water Pulse)
    + Even the weakest psyduck will at least 2hko Roxie's Koffing with Confusion and do a nice chunk of damage to Whirlipede as well
    + Water Pulse looks so cool
    + Water is a really good type you often don't have access to early game, if you don't like Azumarill this works great
    + once taught Ice Beam, it's fast enough to decimate most of the Champion's pokemon (barring Lapras) with super effective attacks
    - Not extremely useful against most major battles
    - Average to subpar on the endgame, don't expect many OHKOes with just your neutral STAB
    - You'll probably catch it as a temporary poke to be replaced lategame when the really good Waters are available
    - poor coverage midgame unless Blizzard is used (not very accurate)


    Mareep - Middle-Low Tier
    Availability - Very early (Floccesy Ranch)
    Notable Moves - Discharge, Thunder Wave, Power Gem, Signal Beam, Volt Switch, Thunderbolt, Light Screen
    Stats Poor physical attack, good special attack, good special bulk, decent physical bulk, bad speed (not as horrible as Sunflora though)

    - Description -
    The earliest Electric pokemon you can catch, it's a decent tank that can dish out some damage, spread paralisys and maybe setup Light Screen

    + Caught very early
    + Learns Thunder Wave immediately. Great move for the early game
    + Decent coverage through only Level Up moves (no shards wasted)
    - Works pretty much against every Gym leader and early game major battles, except for Elesa, Clay and Drayden (Though Thunder Wave on his Haxorus will make your life a lot easier, and ampharos is not WEAK to the gym, it just can't use its STAB).
    + Tanking a hit and Volt Switching is a very reliable way of sending your fast-but-frail sweeper into battle
    + Who wouldn't give it a hug? Except you'd get electrocuted. Yeah, Static is a decent ability for a change, since Ampharos can actually take some hits.
    - Outclassed by Magnezone as a wall, and Eviolite Electabuzz is probably bulkier and faster, then it turns into Electivire which has superior coverage, speed and offensive stats. It's a good poke, but basically ANY electric pokemon does his job better.
    - Barring the final Gym, it hardly has any use late-game. It's slow like Magnezone, but lacks the awesome typing to take hits. Thunder Wave helps but not really, you end up taking hits from pretty much anyone.
    - Coverage moves are great midgame, but they end up lacking raw power. Don't expect to oneshot anything not weak to your Electric STAB.

    Hope it helped with the early game choices
    Last edited by edonub; 25th October 2012 at 5:42 PM.

  14. #114
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    Metang - Top Tier
    Availability - Giant Chasm
    Notable Moves - Physical: Bullet Punch, Hammer Arm, Meteor Mash, Ice Punch, Thunderpunch, Fire Punch, Zen Headbutt, Earthquake, Explosion, Brick Break
    Special: Shadow Ball, Psychic, Psyshock, Grass Knot, Hidden Power
    Other: Hone Claws, Agility

    Stats - As a Metagross, it has Superb Attack, workable SpA, really great Defensive Typing and Defenses.

    Description: Hits like a truck and can take both physical and special hits. After one Agility, it can outspeed most of the in-game tiers and hit very hard with STAB Meteor Mash and STAB Zen Headbutt.

    + Caught close to evolution
    + Has two powerful STAB Attacks
    + Can go mixed
    + Has a great defensive typing with resistance and immunity to Team Plasma's onslaught of Steel and Poison, respectively.
    + Useful for all the Elite 4 members, including the Champion.
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  15. #115
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    [1/3] for Golduck in middle, see my post about Swanna for elaboration.

    IMO Metagross doesn't belong in top just because of the late availability, high at best.

    [1/3] Pidove in low

    [1/3] Sunkern in bottom

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  16. #116
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    I don't think it should be High just because it is found late game. It evolves shortly after catching it and has really great stats for the Elite 4. A good Pokemon to get if you need a hard hitter later on.

    Clefable - Low
    Availability - Late
    Notable Moves - Body Slam, Cosmic Power, Meteor Mash, Light Screen, Reflect, Gravity, Encore, Ice Beam, T-Bolt, Flamethrower, Psyshock
    It has a huge movepool, but those, IMO, are its best attacks.

    Stats: Mediocre Special Attack and Special Defense, good HP, low speed, low attack

    + Highly versatile
    + great support movepool
    + The moves it learns are acceptable for the level you catch it at
    - Very slow and is outsped by many Pokemon
    - Cannot make good use of the Special Attacks it learns due to its mediocre stat.
    Last edited by azeem40; 25th October 2012 at 8:41 PM.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
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  17. #117
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    Maybe we should slow down with the nominations until we get some of the others tiered that have been mentioned?

    As for Metagross, I feel like he falls in the same category as Hydreigon. A great pkmn, but because he's so late in the game he's not that big of an asset. Hydreigon would be much higher up if he weren't available so late. I still think high or upper-mid, we're tiering for the full game, most of which Metang isn't available for, making him a bad candidate for top.

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  18. #118
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    What about Clefable? I get it on Metagross, so I guess high works.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

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  19. #119
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    I think Stored Power and Calm Mind belong on Clefable's notable moves list.

    [1/3] Clefable in low

    [1/3] Metagross in upper mid. I know you said high, but if Hydreigon is in bottom then High is too high for Metagross.

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  20. #120
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    It just doesn't feel comfortable putting such a powerhouse which doesn't evolve late relative to catching it in mid.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

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  21. #121
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    [2/3] Golduck for middle.

    [2/3] Sunkern Bottom

    [2/3] Unfezant for low

    Metagross could actually break High imo. It's not as if though it has evoltion problems, it's jut found late in the game. When you add the fact that it can breeze through the E4 with the right moveset, I'd say High is adequate? I'm not going to place a vote because knowing me, I'vr probably looked over a major flaw or something but it's something to chew on.

    [2/3] Clefable for Low

    Editted the OP, whee.
    Last edited by Tsumiki; 25th October 2012 at 11:29 PM.

  22. #122
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    There isn't anything you overlooked, but this tiering is for usefulness for the entire game, right? So ranking him high for just the E4 doesn't make much sense now that I think about it.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

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  23. #123
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    There isn't anything you overlooked, but this tiering is for usefulness for the entire game, right? So ranking him high for just the E4 doesn't make much sense now that I think about it.
    It's lateness is the only thing stopping it from Top imo. It has more going for it in it's short run than most Pokemon have throughout the entire game.

    [1/3] Lower Mid for Amoharos. It's lack of a STAB between Thundershock (8) and Discharge (40) really hurts it imo. It does get Parafusion though. The rest of it's movepool is pretty bland
    Last edited by Tsumiki; 25th October 2012 at 11:43 PM.

  24. #124
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    Yeah, that is true too. It could go either way IMO. It makes sense for it to be both Mid High and High.
    In order to understand my train of thoughts,
    you'll have to put yourself in my position. You can't expect me to think like you because my life ain't like yours; You know what I'm sayin?

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  25. #125
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    I thing Metagross deserves Upper-Middle [2/3]. It is found after the 8th gym during the climax of the game, but it evolves immediately and becomes useful immediately with its wonderful stats and Meteor Mash, Hammer Arm and Agility before you even touch the TM list. It is quite useful for the E4 and manages to cut a huge hole in the Champion's team. Certainly not top, but with the short time it has, it does very well indeed.

    Sunflora for Bottom[3/3].

    Unfezant for Low[3/3]. It hovers just above Bottom, imo. It's stats aren't half-bad for a Normal/Flying type, but its levelup moves just suck.

    Ampharos for Lower-Mid[2/3].

    I'm considering placing Clefable in Bottom. Its late, relies on supporting other teammates to be viable(which isn't the most efficient way to play) and its stats are pretty average all-round bar its Spdef and HP which are 90 and 95 respectively. Not to sure on this.

    Golduck for Middle [3/3].
    Quote Originally Posted by Huspoel View Post
    You're saying some really smart stuff there.

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