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Thread: It's not THAT Bad

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes falling into pits because of Sonic's stiff and awkward controls and faling over when simply running into anything, including poeple and checkpoints
    That almost never happens. And I love how you instantly assume that just because I don't think this game is bad that I think it's the best thing since sliced bread. I don't "like" the game, I just find it less bad than the Adventure games.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes Tails' poor flying controls and his bad attacking method
    Poor flying controls are debatable, and there's only one time that the Dummy Rings are really that bad and that's in that one section of Aquatic Base with all of the enemies above that huge pit that you have to defeat to progress. But ideally, I would like to have Tail Whip in Tails' gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes having to mash A like crazy just to take out one or two enemies out of the five or six that are located in the room with Shadow
    Now this I actually do like in moderation, mashing buttons is fun.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes running at a snail's pace and dealing with a very poor execution on what could have been a good playstyle with Silver
    I enjoy it when I treat it like it's not a Sonic game, but I do agree that this could've been done slightly better. Although it's really only the running speed and the lack of a direct attack initially that needed work, other than that Silver's gameplay was fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes getting flipped over by anyting with Shadow's vehicle sections
    Again, doesn't happen as much as you think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes the mach speed sections that have so many flaws that I don't even know where to begin
    The only time the mach speed sections are really bad is when they're cluttered, most notably Crisis City. Other than that they're not that bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    >Likes fighitng enemies with an extremely slow hammer attack and having a double jump that completely messes up your momentum, making you fall in a pit with Amy.
    I'll give you that Amy's was bad, but the good thing about Amy is that she's not playable for very long. At least it's not like SA1 and SA2 where the bad gameplay styles outnumber the good ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    So, you'd prefer a game with no good parts at all over a game that has a few good parts? Are you ****ing serious?
    It doesn't have "no good parts", though, you guys are exaggerating its flaws. It's a bit wonky, yes, but the gameplay isn't as bad as you guys claim it to be, it's mediocre at worst. And you guys are completely missing what I'm saying, I'm saying that it's better to have gameplay which is better on average (06) than having a game with one slightly better gameplay style and several others which are complete ****.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    That almost never happens.
    Again, doesn't happen as much as you think.
    >Implying I didn't play the game and did not have this happen to me quite a lot

    And hell, judging from playthroughs that I have seen, I am definitely not the only one.

    And I love how you instantly assume that just because I don't think this game is bad that I think it's the best thing since sliced bread. I don't "like" the game, I just find it less bad than the Adventure games.
    Fine, "liking" was an exaggeration. But thinking this game's gameplay isn't bad is still among one of the worst opinions I have ever read in any forum ever. Possibly because you found less problems. If that was the case, I can accept that. But I ran into a lot of ridiculous crap, and due to that, this game is among one of the worst I played.

    Poor flying controls are debatable, and there's only one time that the Dummy Rings are really that bad and that's in that one section of Aquatic Base with all of the enemies above that huge pit that you have to defeat to progress. But ideally, I would like to have Tail Whip in Tails' gameplay.
    Tails pushes the player forward whenever he flies whether you want him to or not which feels rather unfomfortable and when he gets tired, he just drops. Back in other games, you had a chance to control where he could land, if there were places for him to land that he could reach while tired. In this game, nope.

    Yeah, the Dummy Rings were that bad in that section. You know why? Because you got hit and then you got confused because all of the rings looked identical. Sure, you can only say it gets that bad in Aquatic Base, but what if the game is being played by someone who is not as skilled or just new to the series? This will happen constantly. If it only happened in one area for everyone, maybe this would be forgivable, but this can happen anywhere. Hell, remember the Dummy Rings from Sonic Heroes? Those looked different and you could tell which ones were real. Why isn't this the case here?

    And this isn't the only problem. Another two problems are moments when you are attacking enemies and then the game starts slowing down because there are too many on the screen. And the other problem is the first person mode which is horrid because of the camera. You can never get it to aim at the direction you were facing when you activate it, and since the camera isn't very fast, the odds say you'll get hit while adjusting it to face the enemy you want to destroy.

    Now this I actually do like in moderation, mashing buttons is fun.
    I think you missed my point. You have to button mash just to kill one or two enemies out of the five or six that are usually in the room, therefore you are barely progressing. aAnd guess what, after that room, there's another room with enemies. It's fun when you're playing as Omega because he can hit multiple enemies at once, but this isn't the case with Shadow.

    I enjoy it when I treat it like it's not a Sonic game, but I do agree that this could've been done slightly better. Although it's really only the running speed and the lack of a direct attack initially that needed work, other than that Silver's gameplay was fine.
    I beg to differ. I found it extremely annoying due to having to constantly searching for boxes, getting hit when trying to stun enemies, the fact that if you wanted to glide from a location to another and you just killed an enemy, you had to wait until your meter recharged, making Silver's stages slower than they already are, having the items you grab bouncing off eachother if you were holding several of them(hell sometimes when you only have one item, the item will still completely miss the enemy) and the fact that Silver can barely catch any of the missiles that enemies shoot at him(Have fun fighting Egg Genesis).

    And some other issues I have is the fact that he has to stun enemies to throw them and that he can't manipulate the items and enemies that he is controlling. I think his stages could've been faster and more fun if you only needed to stun the larger enemies and if you could manipulate the items and enemies you're holding. Even if it ended up being too easy, I wouldn't care. I prefer pathetically easy stages over slow and boring stages.

    The only time the mach speed sections are really bad is when they're cluttered, most notably Crisis City. Other than that they're not that bad.
    But they are. They have a lot of flaws, including how the game just expects you to press forward in a ramp after making you think pressing up and down would do nothing, how you can't change the direction when you jump, the fact that you can't jump when you get hit, meaning that hitting a wall is the same thing as an instant death. These three are flaws that **** up entire runs through levels, and these were present in every single one of these sections.

    I'll give you that Amy's was bad, but the good thing about Amy is that she's not playable for very long. At least it's not like SA1 and SA2 where the bad gameplay styles outnumber the good ones.
    Only 2 playstyles sucked in Adventure and they were Amy and Big(Knuckles was actually good in this game since the design in the stages he got was better than Adventure 2, since you had more open room and exploring the stages while looking for the shards felt more fun). In Adventure 2, the only playstyle that I think was bad was the hunting stages because they were hit and miss. The shooting stages were fun since you didn't have to walk through large pathways, therefore you didn't feel slow, you had platforming and the lock-on system was decent, and while Sonic and Shadow's stages were linear, they still felt fun because of their speed.

    It doesn't have "no good parts", though, you guys are exaggerating its flaws. It's a bit wonky, yes, but the gameplay isn't as bad as you guys claim it to be, it's mediocre at worst.
    We really aren't. Sure, you had some fun with it and you didn't seem to find any problems, but trust me, you are a part of a very small minority.

    And you guys are completely missing what I'm saying, I'm saying that it's better to have gameplay which is better on average (06) than having a game with one slightly better gameplay style and several others which are complete ****.
    It is, but the majority's experiences with this game did not go as well as yours, and the majority's experience with this game was completely shitty, therefore, at least in my opinion, 06 is anything but better on average.
    Last edited by Josef Stylin; 26th December 2012 at 12:10 AM.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    And the other problem is the first person mode which is horrid because of the camera. You can never get it to aim at the direction you were facing when you activate it, and since the camera isn't very fast, the odds say you'll get hit while adjusting it to face the enemy you want to destroy.
    You never need to use first person view anyway (unless you want to use it in that Aquatic Base section).

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    But they are. They have a lot of flaws, including how the game just expects you to press forward in a ramp after making you think pressing up and down would do nothing, how you can't change the direction when you jump, the fact that you can't jump when you get hit, meaning that hitting a wall is the same thing as an instant death. These three are flaws that **** up entire runs through levels, and these were present in every single one of these sections.
    Then don't jump. You don't need to jump that much in the mach speed sections anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    Only 2 playstyles sucked in Adventure and they were Amy and Big(Knuckles was actually good in this game since the design in the stages he got was better than Adventure 2, since you had more open room and exploring the stages while looking for the shards felt more fun). In Adventure 2, the only playstyle that I think was bad was the hunting stages because they were hit and miss. The shooting stages were fun since you didn't have to walk through large pathways, therefore you didn't feel slow, you had platforming and the lock-on system was decent, and while Sonic and Shadow's stages were linear, they still felt fun because of their speed.
    A lot of these gameplay styles go against what Sonic games are supposed to be. Treasure hunting stages are too open ended and confusing, it's basically a game of "find the needle in the haystack" and defies the speed aspect of the gameplay. Mech shooting is too slow and clunky, you're literally moving at walking speed. 06 is slow, but it's not that slow, and most of 06's playstyles have a better mix of speed and platforming elements.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullkid View Post
    We really aren't. Sure, you had some fun with it and you didn't seem to find any problems, but trust me, you are a part of a very small minority.
    You obviously don't frequent Sonic forums, you'll find all kinds of people and a lot of different opinions out there.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Kingdom of Earth~ View Post
    Okami and/or Okamiden.
    What? Okami was and still is an amazing video game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    You never need to use first person view anyway (unless you want to use it in that Aquatic Base section).
    That doesn't make it go away.

    Then don't jump. You don't need to jump that much in the mach speed sections anyway.
    Yes, there are few sections where jumping is a must but in the mach speed sections, there is a lot of crap in my way, I would like having the option of being able jump to avoid some of it.

    A lot of these gameplay styles go against what Sonic games are supposed to be. Treasure hunting stages are too open ended and confusing, it's basically a game of "find the needle in the haystack" and defies the speed aspect of the gameplay. Mech shooting is too slow and clunky, you're literally moving at walking speed. 06 is slow, but it's not that slow, and most of 06's playstyles have a better mix of speed and platforming elements.
    No speed? I remember being able to go fast in the treasure hunting stages to get from a point to another. And guess what? That's what I did.

    But like I said, the mechs feel faster because the pathways you cross aren't as long as the ones in 06. Due to the characters being slow and because of the longer pathways you have to cross, you feel slower than the mechs. And due to how slow the characters feel, you sense a lack of a speed aspect. How is 06 a speedy platformer if it's combining platforming with something that does not feel like it's there?

    You obviously don't frequent Sonic forums, you'll find all kinds of people and a lot of different opinions out there.
    So Sonic forums are the entire internet nowadays?
    Last edited by Josef Stylin; 26th December 2012 at 3:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by briguin View Post
    Star Wars The Force Unleashed 2.
    Yes, it's story could have been better, and yes, the only lightsaber duel in the game (vs Vader) wasn't that good, but everything else was good. Heck, for once a wii game had great graphics.
    I totally agree with you on that. I liked it a lot better than FU1 for cutting out a lot of filler, but the problem was that it was too short, but being able to look like Admiral Akbar in cutscenes made it so worthwhile. XD I love that your costume choices carry over to the cutscenes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klizcool View Post
    Halo Wars. All of my friends hate it. Every one I know who played it hate it. I'm the only who played and said "that wasn't bad."
    I agree LOL

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    Sonic Adventure 1 and 2.

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    Call of Duty 4. While the sequels got stale ( Especiallly MW3), this entry is actually really enjoyable. The story is interesting and at the time, it felt really fresh. (But what do I know? XD) The gameplay was fun, the multiplayer was addicting, and the graphics ( at the time) were great. And all of this is coming from a guy who usually hates FPS games ( except Halo)
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    Quote Originally Posted by briguin View Post
    Star Wars The Force Unleashed 2.
    Yes, it's story could have been better, and yes, the only lightsaber duel in the game (vs Vader) wasn't that good, but everything else was good. Heck, for once a wii game had great graphics.
    Stop this. Metroid Prime 3, Super Mario Galaxy/2 among others all look great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    Sonic Adventure 1 and 2.
    Both of which are fairly well-regarded and mostly only disliked by 2D Sonic purists.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ampy View Post
    Stop this. Metroid Prime 3, Super Mario Galaxy/2 among others all look great.
    I love when people say things like those, though! It's their little biases slipping out against the Wii as a system for children and casuals. As a result, it has to be bad!

    Well, that seems to be the general tenor among a lot of "hardcore" gamers.
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    L.A Noire

    I always hear people remarking how terrible and boring L.A Noire is
    No.
    Stop.
    L.A Noire is like my favorite game. period. I think it's gorgeous, interesting and challenging.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phlogiston View Post
    Both of which are fairly well-regarded and mostly only disliked by 2D Sonic purists.
    Wrong. A lot of people hate both Adventures for having gameplay styles that play nothing like Sonic's that take up most of the game. The Adventures are like Unleashed without the boost, the only reason people hold them up on a pedestal so much is because of nostalgia.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Metroid: Other M.

    Why did that get so much hate? I loved playing it. Granted, it's the only Metroid game I've played, but still.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonetail View Post
    Metroid: Other M.

    Why did that get so much hate? I loved playing it. Granted, it's the only Metroid game I've played, but still.
    The plot was absolutely horrible.

    It had a worse plot than Modern Warfare 3. The actual gameplay was pretty cool.

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    The Lego series of games, these games are pretty fun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Un0va View Post
    The plot was absolutely horrible.

    It had a worse plot than Modern Warfare 3. The actual gameplay was pretty cool.
    I liked the plot. Although honestly, I wasn't playing it for the plot in the first place. But I really got into it once I saw the cute hissing chicken.

    However, my reason for liking the plot was most likely due to my non-existant knowledge of Metroid. I know very little about Metroid games so my mindset is different to the people who have been hardcore fans for years. That's my only logical explanation anyways.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Wrong. A lot of people hate both Adventures for having gameplay styles that play nothing like Sonic's that take up most of the game. The Adventures are like Unleashed without the boost, the only reason people hold them up on a pedestal so much is because of nostalgia.
    They're still fairly well-regarded, and far more so than what's generally being gone for in this game. (Also, the only really bad part about the games that I can detect are the Knuckles and Rouge stages in 2, though I haven't done much in 1.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonetail View Post
    Metroid: Other M.

    Why did that get so much hate? I loved playing it. Granted, it's the only Metroid game I've played, but still.
    Quote Originally Posted by Un0va View Post
    The plot was absolutely horrible.

    It had a worse plot than Modern Warfare 3. The actual gameplay was pretty cool.
    The plot is a huge problem because it also affects the gameplay, and you're basically forced to perform, just as one example, a MASSIVE violation of common sense by running into an area which you would generally need the Varia Suit for for reasons that basically add up to "The writers can't handle the idea of Samus being independent and she requires male overhead because she's a giant stereotype now."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Wrong. A lot of people hate both Adventures for having gameplay styles that play nothing like Sonic's that take up most of the game. The Adventures are like Unleashed without the boost, the only reason people hold them up on a pedestal so much is because of nostalgia.
    No, it's because they are way better than any 3D Sonic game that came after, and no one really hates the gameplay. If they did, you wouldn't have everyone asking for a "Sonic Adventure 3".

    I hate when people pull the BS nostalgia argument. Especially when most people played the originals first.
    Last edited by Jb; 1st January 2013 at 4:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    No, it's because they are way better than any 3D Sonic game that came after, and no one really hates the gameplay.
    That is just plain not true. There is ALWAYS someone who hates the games for some reason. And these games are more divisive than you realize. Some people do like it, yes. But not everyone, a lot of people do hate the unfitting gameplay styles of Sonic's friends. Also, whether or not they are "better" than another game is an opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    If they did, you wouldn't have everyone asking for a "Sonic Adventure 3".
    Just because a lot of people are asking for it, doesn't mean that everyone is. In fact, there's a significant portion of the fanbase that doesn't or doesn't care. The Adventure fans just happen to be more vocal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    I hate when people pull the BS nostalgia argument. Especially when most people played the originals first.
    Do you not know how nostalgia works? It's when someone bases their opinions on an old game on mainly the experience they had when they were younger. In other words, they hold the game to a higher standard because it was a crucial part of their life (typically childhood). And that's definitely going on for the Adventure games. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone bash Unleashed for the Werehog gameplay because it's too slow for Sonic, but still support the Adventure games when they do the exact same thing. It's a textbook example of nostalgia bias.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    That is just plain not true. There is ALWAYS someone who hates the games for some reason. And these games are more divisive than you realize. Some people do like it, yes. But not everyone, a lot of people do hate the unfitting gameplay styles of Sonic's friends. Also, whether or not they are "better" than another game is an opinion.
    While being better is subjective, as said the majority of Sonic fans do at least enjoy the games and find them better than later 3D games. The way you're trying to make it seem, is that everyone hates it and those that don't is because of nostalgia. With the last amount falling in the middle.



    Do you not know how nostalgia works? It's when someone bases their opinions on an old game on mainly the experience they had when they were younger. In other words, they hold the game to a higher standard because it was a crucial part of their life (typically childhood). And that's definitely going on for the Adventure games. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone bash Unleashed for the Werehog gameplay because it's too slow for Sonic, but still support the Adventure games when they do the exact same thing. It's a textbook example of nostalgia bias.
    When I was younger I could point out shitty games. SA was not one of them. The game was solid and fun(bad camera though.) The thing with Werehog gameplay was that it was Sonic. In slow form. Knuckles was never that fast and has always climbed walls and such so him doing that in 3D isn't a big deal. Yeah, Big sucked but he had like what? 4 levels out a total 30 something? E-102 was change of pace from the usual formula of doing nothing but going fast. Which worked out terrible(See Sonic Generations).

    Now I know you're gonna say Generations was great, and it was compare to Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic Unleashed and Sonic 06. But doing nothing but running, at least in 3D gets old fast. For 2D, it works fine.

    3D needs to have varied gameplay, just look at Mario games.

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    Since it fits in the topic of the site...

    Pokemon mystery dungeon explorers of sky.

    On here people like it (Thankfully!) But on almost EVERY other site I visit to talk about it, I get bombarded by hate comments from people saying it's bad and I should be ashamed for liking it. (I even got banned from Nintendo Life once for defending my opinion when the single mod running the site disagreed with me)

    Here's why it isn't bad (As most know on here)

    -The story
    -Extra missions
    -TONS of content
    -the sound track

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    That is just plain not true. There is ALWAYS someone who hates the games for some reason. And these games are more divisive than you realize. Some people do like it, yes. But not everyone, a lot of people do hate the unfitting gameplay styles of Sonic's friends. Also, whether or not they are "better" than another game is an opinion.

    Just because a lot of people are asking for it, doesn't mean that everyone is. In fact, there's a significant portion of the fanbase that doesn't or doesn't care. The Adventure fans just happen to be more vocal.
    Now, are these just your opinions that you're projecting onto an entire fan community? Because it really sounds like they are.

    Do you not know how nostalgia works? It's when someone bases their opinions on an old game on mainly the experience they had when they were younger. In other words, they hold the game to a higher standard because it was a crucial part of their life (typically childhood). And that's definitely going on for the Adventure games. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone bash Unleashed for the Werehog gameplay because it's too slow for Sonic, but still support the Adventure games when they do the exact same thing. It's a textbook example of nostalgia bias.
    Oh, yes, because everyone has played the Adventure games before Unleashed.

    Not to mention that holding the older games higher -- gasp! -- could also be a form of nostalgia itself!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    While being better is subjective, as said the majority of Sonic fans do at least enjoy the games and find them better than later 3D games. The way you're trying to make it seem, is that everyone hates it and those that don't is because of nostalgia. With the last amount falling in the middle.
    Sure, there's plenty of sane fans out there that like the Adventure games, but for every one of those sane fans, there's 5 more that are just supporting the game out of nostalgia.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jb View Post
    When I was younger I could point out shitty games. SA was not one of them. The game was solid and fun(bad camera though.) The thing with Werehog gameplay was that it was Sonic. In slow form. Knuckles was never that fast and has always climbed walls and such so him doing that in 3D isn't a big deal. Yeah, Big sucked but he had like what? 4 levels out a total 30 something? E-102 was change of pace from the usual formula of doing nothing but going fast. Which worked out terrible(See Sonic Generations).


    Now I know you're gonna say Generations was great, and it was compare to Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic Unleashed and Sonic 06. But doing nothing but running, at least in 3D gets old fast. For 2D, it works fine.

    3D needs to have varied gameplay, just look at Mario games.
    So? The character you're playing as doesn't matter, the gameplay does. And in terms of gameplay, the Werehog has more in common with the treasure hunting gameplay than Sonic's. At any rate, there's no excuse for including gameplay that has nothing to do with the source material with exceptions to reboots and spinoffs. It alienates fans who hate those types of gameplay styles and breaks the pace the main gameplay is trying to establish. I agree that the gameplay needs more variety, but you can have varied gameplay without having to stretch outside of the speedy theme, and that is what needs to be done, not some stupid genre roulette.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phlogiston View Post
    Oh, yes, because everyone has played the Adventure games before Unleashed.

    Not to mention that holding the older games higher -- gasp! -- could also be a form of nostalgia itself!
    It's not everyone, of course, but definitely the vast majority of Adventure fans. And nostalgia itself isn't the problem, it's that nostalgia clouds people's judgment.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

  25. #175
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    The Sonic Adventure games were fairly well received back when they first came out. I doubt the people saying that they enjoyed Sonic Adventure back in 1999 were fueled by nostalgia.

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