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Thread: Flying Mono-type Team

  1. #1
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    Default Flying Mono-type Team

    Ok I'm making competitive mono-type teams. The first is of my fav type being Flying. Currently I do know only one strategy that could decimate this team but if you dont have it, it is really good. But, I'm going to leave it up to you guys. Here it goes, rate my team.


    Swanna @ Focus Sash
    Nature: Modest
    Ability: Big Pecks
    EV Spread: 252 Sp Att, 252 Spd, 4 HP
    -Scald
    -Hurricane
    -Ice Beam
    -Tailwind

    Used mainly to set up Tailwind, but can also take out Rock types and somewhat wall Ice types. With the ability to Scald pokemon, It has that extra chance to burn pokemon, as well as having a strong water type move. If I even was put into a rain weather situation, thats wehere swanna really shines with scald getting a better boost and hurricane never missing. Ice Beam is there for coverage.


    Skarmory @ Rocky Helmet
    Nature: Jolly
    Ability: Sturdy
    EVS: Stange Mix, 252 Def, 128 Att, 132 Spd
    -Swords Dance
    -Stealth Rock
    -Steel Wing
    -Aerial Ace

    My immunity bird as I call him. Used to throw out Steath Rocks to get rid of Focus Sashs and Sturdy Pokemon (Gigalith inspired). Other than that, If left out on the field, Swords Dance and Aerial Ace will do the trick. Steel Wing is for Stab bonus that can take out aerodactyl threats and it can hit terrakion once or twice.


    Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
    Nature: Impish
    Ability: Poision Heal
    EVS: 252 Def, 184 Att, 72 Spd
    -Swords Dance
    -Earthquake
    -Ice Fang/Fire fang
    -Taunt/Protect

    EDIT: For the Electric Types! I had hyper cutter before, but I realized that this was much better with Poison Heal, I still need a little help with EVS if people want to make suggestions. Swords Dance to gain some attack power, earthquake for stabs that can rid electric types and steel types. Ice fang or fire fang for coverage. I prefer Ice fang for dragon types though. Taunt to hopefully rid stealth rock users, but it depends how fast I throw out my gliscor. Protect to help gain toxic orb advantage and stall for potential ice beamers. (Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated)


    Staraptor @ Life Orb
    Nature: Hasty/Jolly
    Ability: Reckless
    EVS: 252 Att, 252 Spd, 4 HP
    -Double Edge
    -Quick Attack/U-Turn
    -Brave Bird
    -Close Combat

    My physical sweeper. Probably one of my best pokemon in this team. It has the power to wreck almost every pokemon with its ability and life orb alone. Brave Bird is the most commonly used move to take out neutral and super effective types. Double Edge is mainly to wipe out electric pokemon. And Close combat is for rock, ice and steel type. If I happen to not kill you with my physical assault, quick attack will take care of you(Unless your ghost....dang) . If that's the case, I would choose U-turn over Quick Attack to flee from potential doom


    Yanmega @ Miracle Seed/Big Root
    Nature: Modest
    Ability: Speed Boost
    EVS: 252 Sp Att, 252 Spd, 4 HP
    -Protect
    -Bug Buzz
    -Giga Drain
    -Air Slash

    I got the NEED! The NEED to SPEED! Yeah...borderlands. Any rate. Built to be my special sweeper, with a wide base coverage, it can do some significant damage. Rock being its main weakness, I decided to go with Giga Drain to not only inflict damage to rock types but as a much needed recovery move. Protect to stall moves and raise speed obviously, and stabs!


    Noctowl @ Flame Orb
    Nature: Bold
    Ability: Insomnia
    EVS: 252 Def, 104 HP, 156 Sp. Def
    -Feather Dance
    -Psycho Shift
    -Night Shade
    -Roost

    At first I was unsure of the power of Noctowl, I mean shes a decent sp defense wall with a lot of HP, but her defense is lacking greatly...I decided to try to amend that. After making this pokemon I found out that physical attackers (Unless you have guts) are absolutely screwed. Featherdance the first turn to lower your attack harshly and gain burn status. Psycho Shift to pass on my status problem. Roost to heal from any damage cause by physical attackers or burn damage. And Night shade as a solid hit with constant damage. The biggest problem that i saw with Noctowl is special attackers, taunt, Defiant users, Guts, and Clear Body. Other than that, physical hitters dont stand a chance against noctowl.

    EDIT:The following pokemon were suggested and could be seen as a possible replacement for the pokemon named in parenthesis. Feel free to rate them as well! Here they are:


    Xatu @ Choice Scarf
    Nature: Modest
    Ability:Magic Bounce
    EVS: 252 Sp. Att, 252 Spd, 4 HP
    -Psychic
    -Shadow Ball
    -Heat Wave
    -Me First/Signal Beam

    (Would replace either Swanna or Yanmega) Psychic for stab, shadow ball for decent coverage with ghosts and other psychics, heat wave for steel types and ice types, and me first to tag along with Choice Scarf for that extra 1.5x damage. But i am willing to swap it for Signal Beam for dark type coverage. This would be the Stealth Rocks Staller who could try to sweep and do damage.

    Xatu @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - U-turn
    - Heat Wave
    - Roost
    - Featherdance

    (Replacement for Noctowl) A recommended support Pokemon. Heat Wave lets it manhandle common hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory, as well as giving it a burn chance. 56 Spe EVs beats Adamant Breloom, so it stops him pretty well too. Featherdance for helping curbstomp SD TechniLoom and weakening an incoming Terrakion. This set seems to be a better replacement for what Noctowl can do while avoiding Stealth Rocks at the same time.



    Salamence @ Lum Berry/Focus Sash/Choice Scarf
    Nature: Lonely/Hasty
    Ability: Moxie
    EVS: 252 Att, 252 Spd, 4 Sp Att
    -Outrage
    -Dragon Dance/Rock Slide
    -Fire Blast
    -Earthquake/Rock Slide

    (Replacement for Swanna/Yanmega) Most people suggested Dragonite, but for the moveset that was given, I just prefer Salamence over Dragonite for capable sweeping abilities. Salamence with the Lum Berry would be able to use Outrage free without the cost of confusion, but Focus Sash would allow me to use Dragon Dance at least once. Fire Blast is for those Genesects that is supposedly my big problem (which its not). And earthquake to take out steel types and electric types. However I may switch it for Rock Slide for Ice coverage and flinching hax.

    If I decide to use Choice Scarf, I would make it a Hasty. Someone suggested Naive, but i find that most people use ice beam over a stone edge on salamence so I would need as much special defence as possible. Dragon Dance would then be replaced with Rock Slide instead of Earthquake.


    Togekiss @ Leftovers
    Nature: Bold/Modest
    Ability: Serene Grace
    Bold EVS: 252 Def, 204 Sp Def, 54 HP
    Modest EVS: 252 Sp Att, 252 HP, 4 Sp Def.
    -Flamethrower
    -Thunder Wave
    -Encore
    -Aura Sphere

    (Replacement for Noctowl) Your typical thunder wave-Encore Combo. I would thunder wave as a means to scout for your move. If it turns out to be a status move, I would then encore it. Flamethrower is there for steel types, as well numerous type coverages. Aura sphere is also there for steel pokemon who are resistant to flame thrower, a.k.a Empoleon. It is also a guaranteed hit that can take out ice, rock, dark, and normal types as well. I like to have the extra bulk with Togekiss, however some people do suggest to make it a more modest approach.
    Last edited by Yzpo Z.; 27th November 2012 at 8:12 AM. Reason: Adding Suggestion Pokemon

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    You really need to explain why you picked certain pokemon and explain what they do, why their sets are the way they are, etc. We arn't mind readers so you gotta make a good attempt to explain. You also need to offer Ev's if the team isn't ev trained it's considered incomplete. Also, you lack a defensive pokemon. Your using defensive pokes like Gliscor(Which is fine for offense) and Skarmory and making them offensive which is really a waste. Also, With flying you have access to some dragons too. I'd suggest you use one such as Dragonite for good offensive potential over Noctowl I also assume you're aware of your stealth rock weakness yeah? I seached for a Flying type with Rapid Spin and only Delibird can do it..... So thats not gonna work. I also think your thinking a bit too narrow minded, there are plenty of pokemon with Flying as a secondary type besides those guys, Gyarados, Aerodactyl, the genies, etc. Actually i just thought of something. Xatu with Magic Bounce might help with the stealth rock problem. It will take some prediction though.
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    No EVs, post those please, otherwise it's technically not a competitive thread.



    Genesect can literally OHKO every member of your team. (2HKO Skarmory unless Rocks are up)

    Stealth Rocks ruin your team, but with a MonoFlying there's not much you can do about that.

    Literally anything with a BeamBolt combination will demolish you, so Porygon2, HP Ice Rotom-W, and numerous other things I'm forgetting.

    Scarfed Terrakion can simply spam Stone Edge once Skarmory goes down and you're screwed.

    Tyranitar has a field day on this team, slaying everything except Staraptor.

    Now for some actual changes...



    Swanna's base stats don't cut it. He needs to leave, may I suggest Tornadus-T instead?



    Tornadus-T @ Life Orb
    Naive - Regenerator
    252 Speed, 252 Sp. Atk, 4 Attack
    -Hurricane / Air Slash
    -Focus Blast / Superpower
    -U-Turn
    -Taunt / Rain Dance

    This set works best in Rain, thanks to Hurricane's perfect accuracy in Rain. Since you have no rain, you might want to consider Air Slash. Air Slash has significantly less power but significantly more accuracy. Focus Blast or Superpower depends on personal preference. Focus Blast is a special move and therefore generally does more damage, while Superpower hits certain threats (namely Blissey and Chansey) harder. U-Turn is for bugging the hell out of there while maintaining momentum, and healing with Regenerator at the same time. In the last slot either move works. Taunt stops those Rocks that screw you over so bad from coming up, while Rain Dance affords you 5 turns of perfectly accurate Hurricanes.

    Now, Skarmory should run a defensive set.


    Skarmory @ Leftovers
    Impish - Sturdy
    252 Defence, 252 HP, 4 Attack
    -Stealth Rock
    -Whirlwind
    -Roost
    -Brave Bird

    This set focuses more on walling threats and supporting your team, which is what Skarmory does best. Stealth Rocks should stay, while Whirlwind allows you to phase out threats. Brave Bird is in case you Whirlwind in a Grass or Fighting type. Roost heals off any damage your Skarmory might take.


    On Gliscor, go Poison Heal + Toxic Orb.

    Staraptor should probably be Timid, but he's so frail it hardly matters.

    Noctowl is a strange set... Why not use Dragonite?


    Dragonite @ Lum Berry
    Jolly - Multiscale
    252 Speed, 252 Attack, 4 HP
    -Dragon Dance
    -Outrage / Dragon Claw
    -Fire Punch
    -ExtremeSpeed

    Simple Dragon Dance set. Multiscale almost garuntees at least one Dragon Dance, and then after that you kick ***. Simple. Outrage is the preferred STAB, but Dragon Claw works if you're worried about being locked into Outrage. Fire Punch ****s up Genesect even in the rain, and hits the Steel types that resist Outrage. Extremespeed pretty much makes him impossible to revengekill, since it gets priority even over other priority moves. Also nice for picking off faster, frail threats, but after two or three Dragon Dances not much outspeeds him. Lum Berry can cure confusion from Outrage once, and also stops your opponent from shutting him down with Paralysis or a Burn.

    That's it for now, hope I helped.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vatti View Post
    You really need to explain why you picked certain pokemon and explain what they do, why their sets are the way they are, etc. We arn't mind readers so you gotta make a good attempt to explain. You also need to offer Ev's if the team isn't ev trained it's considered incomplete. Also, you lack a defensive pokemon. Your using defensive pokes like Gliscor(Which is fine for offense) and Skarmory and making them offensive which is really a waste. Also, With flying you have access to some dragons too. I'd suggest you use one such as Dragonite for good offensive potential over Noctowl I also assume you're aware of your stealth rock weakness yeah? I seached for a Flying type with Rapid Spin and only Delibird can do it..... So thats not gonna work. I also think your thinking a bit too narrow minded, there are plenty of pokemon with Flying as a secondary type besides those guys, Gyarados, Aerodactyl, the genies, etc. Actually i just thought of something. Xatu with Magic Bounce might help with the stealth rock problem. It will take some prediction though.
    Yeah, i was in the middle of editting while you were posting so i youd like, you can check out ny explanations a bit more. I understand that some pokemon are defense lagging, but my pokemon are meant to be sweepers at its best. Noctowl alone isnt really meant to be an offensive pokemon, its purely my status wall. With night shade doing some decent damage. I do happen to realize that Stealth Rock is a potential issue, and i did make a Xatu with Magic Bounce to try to avoid this issue, but the guessing game can be a bit tricky, and as you said, finding a flying type pokemon with rapid spin is pretty difficult (unless you can make a really really good delibird). And it is really difficult to take out my Noctowl on my team considering its my physical status wall. I did for a while have an archeops on my team, and was thinking of replacing it with Aerodactyl, But then I wouldnt have much sp attackers, swanna being my only sp attacker at that point. I dont really remember my EV Spread either, I can double check with the IV calculator to get an better range on where its at, which is mainly why I put the stats at level 50 there.

    Ill do a little bit more editting to put down my evs. I have to do some research to remember how my spread was on some of these pokemon. I apologize for that.

    @SevenSevens
    First thing, I do appreciate your input, even suggesting some ways to change my pokemon. I will end up remaking the gliscor. The one thing I have to say before explaining my ideas is if this was a true competitive mode, then Genesect wouldnt be allowed in Many Many tourneys. On a simple WiFi match sure, but I believe true skill is to not rape with Uber OU pokemon. Secondly, yes, Stealth Rocks does tend to be a problem, and I've tried amending this with Magic Bounce Xatu. Also I was thinking of putting Taunt on Skarmory. BeamBolt is a tricky combo that I had to fight against. I had a Starmie use it against me once. I am still researching on finding a good special defense flying pokemon that can resist this combination. Most times though, if staraptor doesnt kill him, than someone else will. And yes, obviously terrakion can rape pretty much everything on the field. Gliscor, as serebii put it, might be the best counter I have against Terrakion, and yes I was thinking of remaking him to better his EV Spread. Tyrannitar is not an issue. Between skarmory and staraptor alone, he really doesnt stand a chance.

    Swanna may not seem as a threat, but considering that swanna is my typical lead pokemon, the main point is to throw out tailwind, making a majority of my pokemon faster for 4 turns. And i do understand that Tornadus is a better counter than swanna, but to find one with the right ability takes time. Unless someone here wants to willing give me a tornadus with speed nature then sure Ill give him a try, but until then, swanna is mainly there for tailwind support. As well as taking out rock types and doing some damage to steel types, which was a big issue before putting swanna in the game.

    Skarmory can be made in many different ways. Yes you can make him into a supporting member with doing nothing but whirlwinding stealth rocks (I have thought of this). But then skarmory is taunt bait. With Brave bird leading him to his impending doom. It maybe able to do some damage, but hes not really there for the long run. I do believe in the stealth rock support though which is why its on my current set up. I decided instead to train Skarmory to be a phycial attacker, whose capable of holding its on agains physical attackers.

    I do agree with Gliscor, I believe that toxic orb-posion heal combo is a very good strategy. My friend has one and it can survive for a long time. And my EV spread after doing some research needs a lot of fixing. I might end up remaking him to become a toxic orb-poision heal combo.

    Staraptor- I believe you meant Jolly, but after breeding numerous, dream worlds with no luck of getting the nature I want with a good IV Spread, Hasty came out to be the best one. And for the exact reason of it being frail anyways, I decided what the heck. And It does do massive amount of damage. Often OHKOing even dragonite (depending on the EV spread)

    Noctowl is a very strange set. Like I stated before, I didnt hink I would be able to do much with him, but after further using the Noctowl, I found that it is an excellent counter to physical hitters, with the few exceptions listed in the first post. Im not a dragonite fan however, I'm more of a salamence kind of guy. I have considered putting in a dragon/flying pokemon but the problem would be im really easily defeated by ice type pokemon. I wanted to limit the amount of 4x weakness as much as possible. Or at least spread it. Swanna being electric, gliscor being ice, and yanmega being rock.

    I do notice that Dragonite might be a good replacement for someone, so I might consider him in the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzpo Z. View Post
    @SevenSevens
    First thing, I do appreciate your input, even suggesting some ways to change my pokemon. I will end up remaking the gliscor. The one thing I have to say before explaining my ideas is if this was a true competitive mode, then Genesect wouldnt be allowed in Many Many tourneys. On a simple WiFi match sure, but I believe true skill is to not rape with Uber OU pokemon. Secondly, yes, Stealth Rocks does tend to be a problem, and I've tried amending this with Magic Bounce Xatu. Also I was thinking of putting Taunt on Skarmory. BeamBolt is a tricky combo that I had to fight against. I had a Starmie use it against me once. I am still researching on finding a good special defense flying pokemon that can resist this combination. Most times though, if staraptor doesnt kill him, than someone else will. And yes, obviously terrakion can rape pretty much everything on the field. Gliscor, as serebii put it, might be the best counter I have against Terrakion, and yes I was thinking of remaking him to better his EV Spread. Tyrannitar is not an issue. Between skarmory and staraptor alone, he really doesnt stand a chance.

    Swanna may not seem as a threat, but considering that swanna is my typical lead pokemon, the main point is to throw out tailwind, making a majority of my pokemon faster for 4 turns. And i do understand that Tornadus is a better counter than swanna, but to find one with the right ability takes time. Unless someone here wants to willing give me a tornadus with speed nature then sure Ill give him a try, but until then, swanna is mainly there for tailwind support. As well as taking out rock types and doing some damage to steel types, which was a big issue before putting swanna in the game.

    Skarmory can be made in many different ways. Yes you can make him into a supporting member with doing nothing but whirlwinding stealth rocks (I have thought of this). But then skarmory is taunt bait. With Brave bird leading him to his impending doom. It maybe able to do some damage, but hes not really there for the long run. I do believe in the stealth rock support though which is why its on my current set up. I decided instead to train Skarmory to be a phycial attacker, whose capable of holding its on agains physical attackers.

    I do agree with Gliscor, I believe that toxic orb-posion heal combo is a very good strategy. My friend has one and it can survive for a long time. And my EV spread after doing some research needs a lot of fixing. I might end up remaking him to become a toxic orb-poision heal combo.

    Staraptor- I believe you meant Jolly, but after breeding numerous, dream worlds with no luck of getting the nature I want with a good IV Spread, Hasty came out to be the best one. And for the exact reason of it being frail anyways, I decided what the heck. And It does do massive amount of damage. Often OHKOing even dragonite (depending on the EV spread)

    Noctowl is a very strange set. Like I stated before, I didnt hink I would be able to do much with him, but after further using the Noctowl, I found that it is an excellent counter to physical hitters, with the few exceptions listed in the first post. Im not a dragonite fan however, I'm more of a salamence kind of guy. I have considered putting in a dragon/flying pokemon but the problem would be im really easily defeated by ice type pokemon. I wanted to limit the amount of 4x weakness as much as possible. Or at least spread it. Swanna being electric, gliscor being ice, and yanmega being rock.

    I do notice that Dragonite might be a good replacement for someone, so I might consider him in the future.
    Genesect is allowed in OU, he's not Uber. What you're talking about is localised tournaments, not standard competitive battling.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sevensevens View Post
    Genesect is allowed in OU, he's not Uber. What you're talking about is localised tournaments, not standard competitive battling.
    Many sites use the typical wifi rules. Genesect is banned from wifi and many sites. Im not saying that he is not in OU but for many tourneys/leagues, he isn't allowed. And your right on the fact that he is not uber. I stand corrected on the part. Im not going to delve deeper into this considering this is a rate my team thread, PM me if you wish to discuss it more.

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    I would use Thundurus-T over Noctowl, Volt Absorb would help this team a lot.
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    Finally, some one else that appreciates the grace of Flying type Pokemon lol

    I'm really liking the team, but I would recommend running a Togekiss over Noctowl. Togekiss has better overall bulk, and can support the team better than Noctowl could. Heal Bell, Wish, Thunder Wave, are some of the many support options available to it. Also, Swanna can be replaced with a Dragonite or Salamence, for a much more offensive option. I guess you can run a Delibird for Rapid Spin support, but that wouldn't work out very well

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    Quote Originally Posted by thatjeremykid View Post
    I would use Thundurus-T over Noctowl, Volt Absorb would help this team a lot.

    Volt Absorb would help. But as stated before, it is really difficult to find a legit Genie with the right nature and ability. If you, or anyone, have a a thundurus or tornadus with its dream world ability and a nice nature, then I would gladly train one and replace one of my pokemon.

    Quote Originally Posted by zerocielX View Post
    Finally, some one else that appreciates the grace of Flying type Pokemon lol

    I'm really liking the team, but I would recommend running a Togekiss over Noctowl. Togekiss has better overall bulk, and can support the team better than Noctowl could. Heal Bell, Wish, Thunder Wave, are some of the many support options available to it. Also, Swanna can be replaced with a Dragonite or Salamence, for a much more offensive option. I guess you can run a Delibird for Rapid Spin support, but that wouldn't work out very well
    Im glad to hear im not the only one that loves Flying types. So many people undermine the power of them. Its funny because I did make a Togekiss, using a thunder wave-encore combo. It can do some decent damage as well in special attack. He was also my flamethrower user to take out alot of steel types, especially genesect. I will probably switch around noctowl and togekiss as seems fit. I prefer Salamence over Dragonite any day. And was in the process of making a Moxie Salamence. But I'm not sure that I would get rid of Swanna for it. Again Swanna is my tailwind support, with tailwind it makes my entire team really fast. And imagining an outraging moxie salamence who is fast and can hit hard makes me want swanna in there that much more. And swanna is a really good special attacker, especially if caught in a rain storm situation. Thanks for your input. I appreciate hearing from another flying type user.
    Last edited by Yzpo Z.; 24th November 2012 at 4:58 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzpo Z. View Post
    Many sites use the typical wifi rules. Genesect is banned from wifi and many sites. Im not saying that he is not in OU but for many tourneys/leagues, he isn't allowed. And your right on the fact that he is not uber. I stand corrected on the part. Im not going to delve deeper into this considering this is a rate my team thread, PM me if you wish to discuss it more.
    No, he's not banned from Competitive Wifi. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

    Oh, and you posted this in the competitive section, so I will rate it as a competitive wifi team, as is the standard. If you're playing with alternative rules, list them or don't complain.
    “The God of the old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."

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    I really don't have much to say because I'm not really a Monotype fighter so I'm not sure about strategy's. But if you take off the Miracle Seed and Replace it with Big Root you should get a better damage and Recovery output on Yamega.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoteLobo View Post
    I really don't have much to say because I'm not really a Monotype fighter so I'm not sure about strategy's. But if you take off the Miracle Seed and Replace it with Big Root you should get a better damage and Recovery output on Yamega.
    Thank you, I have done so. I assumed miracle seed so that i can get a better attacking giga drain on Yanmega, but because giga drain is used for the recovery move I will replace it back with Big Root. I was debating back and forth between this item.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sevensevens View Post
    No, he's not banned from Competitive Wifi. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

    Oh, and you posted this in the competitive section, so I will rate it as a competitive wifi team, as is the standard. If you're playing with alternative rules, list them or don't complain.
    I apologize but i assume that this is for general competition rate my team. Not just Smogon standards, which I know that a lot of you guys tend to lean toward. When the discussion thread begins to say Smogon RMT, then I will stop complaining, which i don't believe I ever was complaining, i was stating facts. I will try next time on my later posts to include "Not Just Smogon" RMT. Thanks for your input.

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    I feel like a moron right now. I forgot to mention Xatu. Xatu is HUGE!!!!! He can completely help patch up you Stealth Rock weakness with Magic Bounce! Why didn't I think of this sooner...

    But, yeah, Xatu can be a major help for your team. As for a set, I don't know. Night Shade, Thunder Wave, Roost and U-Turn I guess. Or maybe even a Dual Screen set with U-Turn and Roost (I mention U-Turn so that you won't become Pursuit bait to Scizor/Tyranitar)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzpo Z. View Post
    I apologize but i assume that this is for general competition rate my team. Not just Smogon standards, which I know that a lot of you guys tend to lean toward. When the discussion thread begins to say Smogon RMT, then I will stop complaining, which i don't believe I ever was complaining, i was stating facts. I will try next time on my later posts to include "Not Just Smogon" RMT. Thanks for your input.
    Just an FYI, but the Serebii competitive community does use the Smogon tiering system as a default for competitive battles. If you want to use a separate tiering system, that's perfectly fine, but you will need to clarify. Otherwise, raters will not know what they can or cannot suggest under the system you are using.

    On a side note, please edit your old posts instead of double posting. ^_^

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    Quote Originally Posted by zerocielX View Post
    I feel like a moron right now. I forgot to mention Xatu. Xatu is HUGE!!!!! He can completely help patch up you Stealth Rock weakness with Magic Bounce! Why didn't I think of this sooner...

    But, yeah, Xatu can be a major help for your team. As for a set, I don't know. Night Shade, Thunder Wave, Roost and U-Turn I guess. Or maybe even a Dual Screen set with U-Turn and Roost (I mention U-Turn so that you won't become Pursuit bait to Scizor/Tyranitar)
    I know Xatu with Magic Bounce will help, lol I have made one already. I just feel that the problem lies in the move pool and ev spread while the guessing game becomes a bit hard to do. If i was to make Xatu, it would have to either replace Swanna or Yanmega (preferably Yanmega) As of now this is my Xatu:

    Xatu @ Choice Scarf
    Nature: Modest
    Ability:Magic Bounce
    EVS: 252 Sp. Att, 252 Spd, 4 HP
    -Psychic
    -Shadow Ball
    -Heat Wave
    -Me First/Signal Beam

    For everyone that suggests Xatu, This would be my set up for him. Psychic for stab, shadow ball for decent coverage with ghosts and other psychics, heat wave for steel types and ice types, and me first to tag along with Choice Scarf for that extra 1.5x damage. But i am willing to swap it for Signal Beam for dark type coverage. This would be the Stealth Rocks Staller who could try to sweep and do damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    Just an FYI, but the Serebii competitive community does use the Smogon tiering system as a default for competitive battles. If you want to use a separate tiering system, that's perfectly fine, but you will need to clarify. Otherwise, raters will not know what they can or cannot suggest under the system you are using.

    On a side note, please edit your old posts instead of double posting. ^_^
    I do understand that Serebii uses Smogon tiers. I will try to clarify a little more that I was using the general wifi tier, which I thought I posted in my previous posts. I did go a little overboard when I was told i didn't understand when I know I do. Also thanks for clearing up those double posts I will try better to make my thread more clean.
    Last edited by Yzpo Z.; 26th November 2012 at 5:52 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzpo Z. View Post
    I do understand that Serebii uses Smogon tiers. I will try to clarify a little more that I was using the general wifi tier, which I thought I posted in my previous posts. I did go a little overboard when I was told i didn't understand when I know I do. Also thanks for clearing up those double posts I will try better to make my thread more clean.
    What in the world is "general wifi tier"? If what you mean is "Pokemon allowed on Wi-Fi", there are absolutely no limits or bans in Friend Code Wi-Fi matches. If what you mean is Random Match, the ones that aren't banned due to raw power are banned becuase of being event exclusive (And Chatot due to Chatter)

    Either way, your team is still swept by anything with a bolt-beam combo. A general rule of thumb with mono-type teams is that most people use 1-2 Pokemon outside of the type so you can still have a viable team. Otherwise, an opponent can just simply exploit the huge number of common weaknesses you have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomspot555 View Post
    What in the world is "general wifi tier"? If what you mean is "Pokemon allowed on Wi-Fi", there are absolutely no limits or bans in Friend Code Wi-Fi matches. If what you mean is Random Match, the ones that aren't banned due to raw power are banned becuase of being event exclusive (And Chatot due to Chatter)

    Either way, your team is still swept by anything with a bolt-beam combo. A general rule of thumb with mono-type teams is that most people use 1-2 Pokemon outside of the type so you can still have a viable team. Otherwise, an opponent can just simply exploit the huge number of common weaknesses you have.
    You guys can gang up on me for not wanting to use Smogon-based tiers, at this point I'm over it. And most cases people make pokemon to play on "Random Matches" to test their strength of their team against random players. I know what it takes to make a competitive team and I don't need someone to tell me that the only competitive aspect of pokemon is based off of Smogon rules. I don't truly believe that anyone is understanding my point in that if you were to make a competition team for lets say the VGC tournaments (which by the way is a competition) that you cant use pokemon like Genesect in the game. And i look back and clearly stated that yes, if I wanted to do a wifi match then genesect is allowed, but I don't base my team based on Smogon standards. I dont know how much more clearly I can be on this topic.

    Proof of quote:

    The one thing I have to say before explaining my ideas is if this was a true competitive mode, then Genesect wouldnt be allowed in Many Many tourneys. On a simple WiFi match sure, but I believe true skill is to not rape with Uber OU pokemon.
    Also the whole having pokemon outside the type to form a mono-type team, doesnt make it a mono-type team. Mono-type teams are teams that use one similar type for all six pokemon. So for example, which seems to come up often, if I made a flying type team and decide to put genesect in there just so I can resist bolt-beam, doesn't make my team a mono-type flying team considering its not a flying type pokemon. It may be your best option; however, it doesnt make it a true mono-type team.
    Last edited by Yzpo Z.; 27th November 2012 at 2:37 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yzpo Z. View Post
    You guys can gang up on me for not wanting to use Smogon-based tiers, at this point I'm over it. And most cases people make pokemon to play on "Random Matches" to test their strength of their team against random players. I know what it takes to make a competitive team and I don't need someone to tell me that the only competitive aspect of pokemon is based off of Smogon rules. I don't truly believe that anyone is understanding my point in that if you were to make a competition team for lets say the VGC tournaments (which by the way is a competition) that you cant use pokemon like Genesect in the game. And i look back and clearly stated that yes, if I wanted to do a wifi match then genesect is allowed, but I don't base my team based on Smogon standards. I dont know how much more clearly I can be on this topic.

    Proof of quote:



    Also the whole having pokemon outside the type to form a mono-type team, doesnt make it a mono-type team. Mono-type teams are teams that use one similar type for all six pokemon. So for example, which seems to come up often, if I made a flying type team and decide to put genesect in there just so I can resist bolt-beam, doesn't make my team a mono-type flying team considering its not a flying type pokemon. It may be your best option; however, it doesnt make it a true mono-type team.

    Dude, you are WRONG. Firstly, let me state that when you use random match-up, 19 times out of 20 you end up against some ten year old kid who doesn't know a damn thing about competitive battling. That's not a real display of skill, it's the complete opposite. Now, if you post a thread here we're going to assume you're either using Pokemon Online's standard WiFi rules or Smogon's. You are using neither, you're using some imaginary set of rules you call simply "wifi rules". There is no such thing.

    As for the quote... That was YOU you quoted!! And you're wrong. Even official competitive tournaments use Smogon's ruleset, which means, as long as the tournament is OU, Genesect is allowed.

    Point in case, you think you know what you're talking about when you are in fact wrong, and then you're getting pissy at people trying to help you because of it. I recommend you learn about tiers and official (see that word?) rulesets and guidelines before making an invalid argument.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sevensevens View Post
    Dude, you are WRONG. Firstly, let me state that when you use random match-up, 19 times out of 20 you end up against some ten year old kid who doesn't know a damn thing about competitive battling. That's not a real display of skill, it's the complete opposite. Now, if you post a thread here we're going to assume you're either using Pokemon Online's standard WiFi rules or Smogon's. You are using neither, you're using some imaginary set of rules you call simply "wifi rules". There is no such thing.

    As for the quote... That was YOU you quoted!! And you're wrong. Even official competitive tournaments use Smogon's ruleset, which means, as long as the tournament is OU, Genesect is allowed.

    Point in case, you think you know what you're talking about when you are in fact wrong, and then you're getting pissy at people trying to help you because of it. I recommend you learn about tiers and official (see that word?) rulesets and guidelines before making an invalid argument.
    Wow, ok because I don't know anything about tournaments. After I have attended the last three tournaments for VGC. SPOILER ALERT! Genesect isn't allowed. Sorry to burst your bubble but i read the rule and regulations of all tournaments before entering so to say that they use Smogon and Pokemon Online is wrong.

    I quoted myself because people didnt believe that I said that you can use Genesect for wifi matches. You should actually read my posts instead of getting hot-headed and defending Smogon so much.
    Last edited by Yzpo Z.; 27th November 2012 at 7:41 AM.
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  20. #20

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    Guys, chill.

    Look, Yzpo Z., it's fine if you want to use non-Smogon tiers, and anyone who tries to tell you otherwise is a moron. But the point I believe randomspot555 was trying to get across was that "Wi-Fi Rules" just isn't specific enough. There are multiple ways people can play over Wi-Fi, and each banlist is different. Now, the way you're talking, it sounds like you're playing on Random Matchup. If that's the case, you can tell us that and we'll know exactly what you're talking about. If you're using a custom ruleset, you'll probably have to explain that in detail so that we can understand. It's not that people want you to use a certain ruleset, it's just that it's hard for people to rate a team when they don't know what the restrictions are for the Pokemon they can suggest.

    No more arguing over rulesets, anyone. But while I'm here, I could offer a little advice.

    Flying teams tend to hate Stealth Rock, so I definitely recommend you run Xatu to help keep that at bay. I prefer this set over Noctowl.

    Xatu @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - U-turn
    - Heat Wave
    - Roost
    - Toxic / Thunder Wave / Featherdance

    This is actually a great support Pokemon. In fact, I usually prefer Xatu over Espeon as an OU Magic Bounce user. Heat Wave lets it manhandle common hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory. 56 Spe EVs beats Adamant Breloom, so it stops him pretty well too. I like Featherdance as a filler for helping curbstomp SD TechniLoom and weakening an incoming Terrakion, but it also has a few status moves to choose from.

    Try Gyarados over Swanna. It has the same typing, but more bulk for soaking up Ice attacks, which will give you a little more cushioning there. I think a classic Bulky DD set would fit well over it.

    Gyarados @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 176 HP / 128 Atk / 204 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Taunt
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce

    Running Choice Scarf Salamence or Thundurus-T over Yanmega would make you a bit less Electric weak (the latter moreso than the former), while also giving you a decent check to a lot of stuff. The sets are:

    Salamence @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast
    - Dragon Claw

    Thundurus (Thundurus-T) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast

    SD Skarmory is very underwhelming in power. Honestly, I think you'd be better off abusing its best talents, its great typing and bulk. A specially defensive set of Stealth Rock / Roost / Whirlwind / Brave Bird would give you a good sponge for random Draco Meteors and Outrages, while also offering easier support and more survivability.

    Lastly, run a Choice Band on Staraptor. Not only are you hitting harder, but you also avoid the recoil associated with the Life Orb, which can really add up quickly alongside the recoil from your STABs. Besides, prediction isn't so much of an issue when you're as ridiculously strong as a Reckless Staraptor.

    Just a few tips. Flying monotype teams are tough to make, so I hope this helps! ^_^

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    Guys, chill.

    Look, Yzpo Z., it's fine if you want to use non-Smogon tiers, and anyone who tries to tell you otherwise is a moron. But the point I believe randomspot555 was trying to get across was that "Wi-Fi Rules" just isn't specific enough. There are multiple ways people can play over Wi-Fi, and each banlist is different. Now, the way you're talking, it sounds like you're playing on Random Matchup. If that's the case, you can tell us that and we'll know exactly what you're talking about. If you're using a custom ruleset, you'll probably have to explain that in detail so that we can understand. It's not that people want you to use a certain ruleset, it's just that it's hard for people to rate a team when they don't know what the restrictions are for the Pokemon they can suggest.

    No more arguing over rulesets, anyone. But while I'm here, I could offer a little advice.

    Flying teams tend to hate Stealth Rock, so I definitely recommend you run Xatu to help keep that at bay. I prefer this set over Noctowl.

    Xatu @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 248 HP / 204 Def / 56 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - U-turn
    - Heat Wave
    - Roost
    - Toxic / Thunder Wave / Featherdance

    This is actually a great support Pokemon. In fact, I usually prefer Xatu over Espeon as an OU Magic Bounce user. Heat Wave lets it manhandle common hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory. 56 Spe EVs beats Adamant Breloom, so it stops him pretty well too. I like Featherdance as a filler for helping curbstomp SD TechniLoom and weakening an incoming Terrakion, but it also has a few status moves to choose from.

    Try Gyarados over Swanna. It has the same typing, but more bulk for soaking up Ice attacks, which will give you a little more cushioning there. I think a classic Bulky DD set would fit well over it.

    Gyarados @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 176 HP / 128 Atk / 204 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Taunt
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce

    Running Choice Scarf Salamence or Thundurus-T over Yanmega would make you a bit less Electric weak (the latter moreso than the former), while also giving you a decent check to a lot of stuff. The sets are:

    Salamence @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Fire Blast
    - Dragon Claw

    Thundurus (Thundurus-T) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast

    SD Skarmory is very underwhelming in power. Honestly, I think you'd be better off abusing its best talents, its great typing and bulk. A specially defensive set of Stealth Rock / Roost / Whirlwind / Brave Bird would give you a good sponge for random Draco Meteors and Outrages, while also offering easier support and more survivability.

    Lastly, run a Choice Band on Staraptor. Not only are you hitting harder, but you also avoid the recoil associated with the Life Orb, which can really add up quickly alongside the recoil from your STABs. Besides, prediction isn't so much of an issue when you're as ridiculously strong as a Reckless Staraptor.

    Just a few tips. Flying monotype teams are tough to make, so I hope this helps! ^_^
    Yes, it took me a long time to figure out a good competitive strategy for mono-flying type team. So much that everyone's suggestions of stealth rock seems to be old news I might look into making xatu more status support than a sweeper. That way it gives me a reason to switch out noctowl. I do tend to switch back and forth between life orb and choice band on staraptor, however i do find that keeping her in their with life orb supported me better. Salamence as a scarfer seems interesting, especially if im going to end up outraging everything for the moxie boost. I just don't want to get stuck into a situation where outrage won't work. Ill give the scarf a try and get back to you. Thundurus-T i always wanted to try, but since I'm also trying to make the team for other competitions, it is hard for me to get a hold of a good one. Ill test it in smogon though to see if I like it. Gyarados, my good friend, I trained one as a sweeper before it turned out well. I always wanted to see if I can raise its bulk somehow, and gyarados could be used as my taunter. I always was thinking maybe giving it thunder wave instead of taunt? If its a replacement for swanna, i would need some way of ensuring my team is faster. Ill add your gyarados and thudurus suggestions to my suggested pokemon replacements list.

    Thanks for ending the little argument. It was one of my main reasons for asking him to PM me instead. As stated before, I will try to make it more clear as to what I'm using it for. Its not just for random match ups either, I have used this set on smogon, PO, and was even considering VGC tourneys. I just hate it when people only expect it to be one standard rule set without considering other options. Again though, its my fault for not being clear enough.
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    This is a genuine question. What in the world is "Wifi rules" and what specifically are you playing under. You can't just say "Well, I'll use it in WiFi, in Random Match, maybe even VGC" because then you just posted three drastically different rule sets of the following:

    1. Imagingary/unknown ruleset.
    2. Single/Double/Triple/Rotation (needs to be specificed what you're using it for) and 3-4 Pokemon, with a ban list of events and cover legendaries.
    3. VGC, which is 4v4 Doubles and you should specificity which VGC rulesset you're going by since they do change every year.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomspot555 View Post
    This is a genuine question. What in the world is "Wifi rules" and what specifically are you playing under. You can't just say "Well, I'll use it in WiFi, in Random Match, maybe even VGC" because then you just posted three drastically different rule sets of the following:

    1. Imagingary/unknown ruleset.
    2. Single/Double/Triple/Rotation (needs to be specificed what you're using it for) and 3-4 Pokemon, with a ban list of events and cover legendaries.
    3. VGC, which is 4v4 Doubles and you should specificity which VGC rulesset you're going by since they do change every year.
    How about this. If you guys really need a set of rules to follow, then use the VGC rule set. Most often I look at the lastest rule set, the last couple being Unova region only. Typically event pokemon are banned from VGC tournaments as well as common legendaries such as Mewtwo, Dialga, Lugia, and Ho-oh. The rulesets don't vary much with VGC tournaments. The only thing that really changes is the type of battling, whether its singles, doubles, triples, or rotation and maybe some region-based exclusive tournaments. If you guys don't know the ruleset than you can look at the VGC Discussions thread on the Competitive Pokemon page. I didn't think that a general CRMT would be that complicated to rate without a specific ruleset for that person. Honestly though this all started because I said Genesect was banned in most tournaments, I tried clarifying my opinions and I got slammed for it because my example was based on a seperate rule set. In the future, as I have stated, I will make sure to state what I'm using the team for because everyone does tend to lean toward Smogon rules. I will place in the subject line VGC, Smogon, PO, or custom-set so that everyone knows exactly how to rate my team. Can we now please move on from this, I am honestly trying to come up with a good competitive flying type team and this thread seems to be avoiding that greatly. And I do greatly appreciate feedback on my teams.
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    Well yeah, we "really need" a set of rules to follow. The default rules are Smogon standard 6v6 singles. If you are using some alternate set of rules, that needs to be specified. And generally, most people don't believe that a team made for one rulesset can just be copy/pasted and successfully used in another. 6v6 Doubles with Smogon standard is different enough. Saying it is for VGC 4v4 is a WHOLE different ballgame.

    So this team is built for Doubles 4v4 VGC? And you say "Unova only", but your team clearly violates that, but then you go on to say "the latest" and 2012 VGC allowed non-Unova Pokemon. So what are the four Pokemon you'd likely be using in each match and which ones do you consider your reserves?

    See, this is why a rulesset, if it isn't the one that 95% of the RMT in this forum use, is important. Everyone (many of whom are much better raters than me) has given you this info that you're at least doing this in some type of Singles format, but now you're saying VGC Doubles.

    Moving onto a suggestion, what about a Trick-Scarf Togekiss? Thunder Wave on the switch, then you can either hack it away with Air Slash or Aura Sphere/Flamethrower/Fire Blast. Pair it up with Gliscor or Salamence who can help with Earthquake hitting both opponents.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomspot555 View Post
    Well yeah, we "really need" a set of rules to follow. The default rules are Smogon standard 6v6 singles. If you are using some alternate set of rules, that needs to be specified. And generally, most people don't believe that a team made for one rulesset can just be copy/pasted and successfully used in another. 6v6 Doubles with Smogon standard is different enough. Saying it is for VGC 4v4 is a WHOLE different ballgame.

    So this team is built for Doubles 4v4 VGC? And you say "Unova only", but your team clearly violates that, but then you go on to say "the latest" and 2012 VGC allowed non-Unova Pokemon. So what are the four Pokemon you'd likely be using in each match and which ones do you consider your reserves?

    See, this is why a rulesset, if it isn't the one that 95% of the RMT in this forum use, is important. Everyone (many of whom are much better raters than me) has given you this info that you're at least doing this in some type of Singles format, but now you're saying VGC Doubles.

    Moving onto a suggestion, what about a Trick-Scarf Togekiss? Thunder Wave on the switch, then you can either hack it away with Air Slash or Aura Sphere/Flamethrower/Fire Blast. Pair it up with Gliscor or Salamence who can help with Earthquake hitting both opponents.
    You know what? I hate switching my ideas around on you but, I'm really tired of everyone not understanding how i am going to use my pokemon. All I said was Genesect was banned from most tourneys and people flipped it around and thought I said it was banned from smogon. Thats how this whole thing started. Go ahead and use Smogon standards, I honestly don't care anymore. Ill just tell you yes or no, and reason from now on. I won't include any other tourneys so that way no one gets confused and everyone is happy.

    As for togekiss, I never thought togekiss could learn trick, but i don't really think I would risk swapping a scarf to someone on Smogon. I saw someone do that once on Smogon and they got their whole team handed to them 6-0.
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    I do have dittos for trade!

    Pokemon I'm searching for (hidden abilities):
    Filling up on safaris. If your type is not listed, it most likely means i dont need it.

    Bug: Paras, Illumise, Masquerain
    Dark: Pawniard, Vullaby, Sandile, Absol, Liepard
    Fighting: Riolu
    Flying: Hawlucha
    Ground: Trapinch, Marowak, Palpitoad
    Psychic: Grumpig, Sigilpyh,
    Poison: Toxicroak, Garbordor
    Steel: Klang, Bronzong

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