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Thread: A Not-So-Hail Hail Team ~ OU hail

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    Default A Not-So-Hail Hail Team ~ OU hail

    Hail Team with a 50% chance of clear skies
    Heya guys, I made this hail team which is… odd. It isn’t really a hail team since only one pokemon gets the benefit, but it is at the meantime. So it’s a weather but not really weather team, thus for the name.



    Abomasnow @ Leftovers
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
    Modest Nature
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Focus Blast
    - Leech Seed

    Abomasnow is the weather setter here. I try to maximize its bulk which extends its longevity during weather wars by giving him a leftover. Blizzard makes good use of the weather Abomasnow himself set, and a further damage boost from STAB. Giga Drain mainly deals with Politoed that tries to weather change, and it also makes a source of recovery. Focus Blast is mainly filler, but it does its job well beating incoming steel types. Leech Seed is a great strategy in the form of leeching hp on a wall, forcing switches or allows Abomasnow to recover HP.

    One great usage of Abomasnow in this team is that it can lure steels, such as Genesect or Scizor, preying on a weaker ice type. This allows me to effectively switch Magnezone as lead and beat them with a HP (Fire).

    Other options: Clear Skies / Other Weathers
    The reason why I chose Abomasnow over clear skies is that it can cancel out weather, and mess up weather oriented teams, forcing them to switch Ninetales/Politoed/Tyranitar in to recast the weather, which allows a free attack or a switch out. The reason why I chose Hail was because it does damage and can neglect Leftovers. Rain and Sun just boosts certain attacks, but sometimes it may be unfavourable. Like Magnezone loses his ability to KO Steels with HP Fire in Rain when it weakens or Rotom-W doesn’t hit as hard in Sun with Hydro Pump. Sand is another option, but Abomasnow can deal with switching in Breloom effectively.


    Magnezone @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Flash Cannon
    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Thunder

    Magnezone is one of my new favourites. Magnezone helps in trapping Steels like Genesect, who looks for a free kill in Abomasnow, Mamoswine or Gyrados with its not-so-predictable movepool. Scarf Magnezone allows Magnezone to effectively kill steels faster. Besides HP (Fire), Volt Switch is used because it makes Magnezone to scout for threats. Thunder is a last slot move, allowing Magnezone to have a more harder hitting STAB. It also abuses rain via the 100% Thunder.


    Mamoswine @ Life Orb
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Icicle Crash
    - Ice Shard
    - Stone Edge

    Mamoswine serves as an effective Revenge Killer by dishing priority, Life Orb, STAB boosted Ice Shard. Ice Shard is why I chose Mamoswine. Mamoswine effectively revenge kills the Kami Trio (I KO’d three Tornadus one day when 2 of them were at full hp, Landorus is x4 weak, not so sure about Thundurus however) and dragons. Earthquake serves as a strong STAB move, outspeeding Heatran (Heatran without speed investment) and KOing it. Icicle Crash is chose as another move because of it’s higher damage compared to Ice Shard. Icicle Crash usually deals with pokemon that Mamoswine can outspeed or pokemon that won’t get KO-ed by Ice Shard. The last slot, Stone Edge, is mostly filler, but it can come in handy against maybe another Ice type.


    Gyarados @ Life Orb
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Substitute
    - Stone Edge
    - Waterfall

    Gyarados is more of a beast then I had originally thought of. With Gyarados alone, I can often take down at least 3 pokemon before fainting to a LO recoil / Pokemon who learns Thunderbolt. The reason is Dragon Dance. After a dragon dance or two, it can outspeed a lot of pokemon and can swiftly KO with ease. The strategy here is to Substitute on something that can’t break the sub. I follow by Dragon Dancing as the pokemon switches in. After the switched in broke my sub, I would’ve easily gotten a +2 speed and attack, which is enough to outspeed a huge amount of threats. Waterfall is a killer here, especially useful against Rain Teams. Few can stand up to the powess of a +2 LO STAB Waterfall. Stone Edge takes care of Pringles and other Water Absorb Mons. After stacking up boosts from Moxie, Gyarados usually dies from LO Recoil, but not after taking down three pokemon.


    Rotom-Wash @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Trick
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Hydro Pump

    Rotom-W has one of my favourite typings: Water/Electric. Other than that, it has great traits that make it a good special wall. With only one weakness in grass, Rotom-W is hard to take down. One might wonder what a Choice Specs is doing on a defensive Rotom-W, but a combination of Specs + Trick to a wall or a physical attacker can heavily cripple it for the rest of the game. Will-o-wisp is usually not used after Specs is tricked away, but it can get the opponent guessing about the item. Although I prefer to trick it away, Rotom-W’s Specs Boosted, STAB boosted Hydro Pump is nothing to scoff about, especially in rain. Volt Switch beats Tornadus, and a Specs, STAB boosted Volt Switch is nothing soft and fluffy too.


    Hitmontop (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Toxic
    - Sucker Punch
    - Close Combat
    - Rapid Spin

    Hitmontop is a rare-to-see in OU, but it can still do it job pretty well. Hitmontop makes an excellent physical wall, with a suitable ability of Intimidate. I’ll get to the calculations a bit later, but I’ll explain as of now. Hitmontop can spin away Spikes and Stealth Rock, on top of being a great wall. Toxic is used to cripple Special Attack based pokemon that tries to switch in. After they switch in, I switch out… Yay! I realized that lately, I have had problems with spin blockers like Pringles and Gengar. I swapped Bulk Up for Sucker Punch, which can be a true headache to them. Close Combat is Hitmontop’s STAB Choice, and can effectively beat Tyranitar.

    Here are the calculations I promised
        Spoiler:- Hitmontop in Action!:


    It doesn’t seem to impressive, but considering the fact that those three pokemon usually carry something else other than Choice Band, I say Hitmontop is a pretty good wall.

    That’s it… thanks for reading guise!

    ---
    Changelogs

    Abomasnow
    Magnezone
    Thunder > Tri Attack
    Mamoswine
    Jolly > Adamant
    Rotom-W
    Hitmontop
    Gyarados

    Last edited by OceanicLanturn; 26th November 2012 at 12:48 PM.

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    abomasno can take on breloom? are you kidding? mach punch 100% 2 or 0HKO I don't even need to calculate just use politoed it would be more beneficial to your team you have 3 pokemons who might benefit from rain compared to only 1 benefiting from hail, use jolly nature on mamoswine it will make you able to beat timid heatrans and adamant lucarios.

    Like said just change abomasno he is terrible if it wasn't for snow warming he would be in the depths of NU forever.

    Magnezone thunder (if you want to use rain)/thunderbolt>tri attack normal moves without STAB are really weak.. there is no real point using tri attack and if you want to use rain use HP fighting or HP ice or just keep HP fire as it hits ferrothorn in the same way only HP fighting hits heatran.

    trust me superpower>stone edge on mamoswine sure volcarona it is hit strong enough with earthquake anyway and superpower lets you beat balloon heatran and rotom-W.
    sub with life orb is a bad idea you will be worn out really quick so better use leftovers and also use intimidate it works better with subtitute.
    On rotom use scarf and thunderbolt since volt switch isn't that strong and will o wisp MEH you can trick scarfs what else you need?

    Hitmontop is outclassed in OU there are betyter spinners like donphan or starmie who will fit the rain team well if you want to use sand sandslash is a good spinner with sand rush. or if you hate using spiunners like I do just use espeon I like an offensive set with life orb it is very effective psychic/shadowball/grass knot (useful on tyranitar jellicent and gastordon)/HP fire or HP fighting.
    Last edited by Ilan; 26th November 2012 at 12:28 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by Professor Oak
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilan View Post
    abomasno can take on breloom? are you kidding? mach punch 100% 2 or 0HKO I don't even need to calculate just use politoed it would be more beneficial to your team you have 3 pokemons who might benefit from rain compared to only 1 benefiting from hail, use jolly nature on mamoswine it will make you able to beat timid heatrans and adamant lucarios.

    Like said just change abomasno he is terrible if it wasn't for snow warming he would be in the depths of NU forever.

    Magnezone thunder (if you want to use rain)/thunderbolt>tri attack normal moves without STAB are really weak.. there is no real point using tri attack and if you want to use rain use HP fighting or HP ice or just keep HP fire as it hits ferrothorn in the same way only HP fighting hits heatran.

    trust me superpower>stone edge on mamoswine sure volcarona it is hit strong enough with earthquake anyway and superpower lets you beat balloon heatran and rotom-W.
    sub with life orb is a bad idea you will be worn out really quick so better use leftovers and also use intimidate it works better with subtitute.
    On rotom use scarf and thunderbolt since volt switch isn't that strong and will o wisp MEH you can trick scarfs what else you need?

    Hitmontop is outclassed in OU there are betyter spinners like donphan or starmie who will fit the rain team well if you want to use sand sandslash is a good spinner with sand rush. or if you hate using spiunners like I do just use espeon I like an offensive set with life orb it is very effective psychic/shadowball/grass knot (useful on tyranitar jellicent and gastordon)/HP fire or HP fighting.
    I mean when Breloom switches in when Abomasnow is in xD Oh well, that wasn't a very good comparison :3

    Okay, so if i'm going clear skies then what should Abomasnow be replaced with?

    err for Gyrados i'm gonna keep the set with maybe a different item. I'm not trying to make it bulky or anything. Also, I'll switch Magnezone from Tri Attack to maybe T-bolt or Thunder. Leaning towards thunder to abuse the ever common rain and catch some stuff off guard.

    Err IMO I like Volt Switch on Rotom because it lets me get away and all. Choice Scarf is a good item to trick, but the recepients are less. Besides, Rotom himself can abuse it while Scarf is just... faster...?

    I'll try and see Superpower, though i'm not a fan of the attack drop. I'll try it.

    I'll try another spinner or maybe Espeon instead of Hitmontop, I'll see :3

    Stuff to change
    - Magnezone: Thunder > Tri Attack
    - Mamoswine: Jolly > Adamant

    Stuff to try
    - Rotom-W: Thunderbolt > Volt Switch
    - Mamoswine: Superpower > Stone Edge
    - Espeon/Sandslash/Starmie/Donphan > Hitmontop

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    You could also tryout the Stallrein set from Smogon. If played right, you could kill off 2 Pokemon without even attacking.

        Spoiler:- Wild Future:



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    One little thing I noticed is that, if you're gonna keep Hitmontop, you could run Foresight>Sucker Punch. Sucker Punch is better for Gengars, whereas Foresight is better for Jellicent because it lets you hit it with Rapid Spin. I might cost you your Hitmontop, though, because you'll most likely be butned by said Jellicent, but it could really be worth it.

    Definitely Volt Switch>T-Bolt in my opinion. I like Volt Switch more, because, well, the ability to scout with it is pretty cool.

    You might consider Lefties>Life Orb on Gyara, though I can definitely see where you're going with the set you have, and if it's played right, I think it can destroy stuff.

    Stallrein is.. Meh. I say you don't need it lol.

    These are my little suuggestions, although I'm not very good at rating team, so yeah.

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    the team doesnt look to bad, gyarados and magnezone look out of place tho
    your ev spread on rotom, your better off just giving him lefties and switching trick for pain split. I do have to agree with superpower, it helps mamo plow through ferrothorn and air ballon ran that stone edge cant, plus your ice stab hits the flyings that stone edge does, so its redundant. Also, run adamant, the few things he outpaces with jolly doesnt really make up for the loss in power. I would drop dos, i dont see how he helps besides a beating stick, in which case mamo does it. i feel victini would do good as a replacement. Victini is a monster in hail, and helps check sun teams that screw hail, i presonally like the banded set, but his scarfed work good, and makes a nice volt-turn core with rotom. I personally dont see how zone helps much besides scizor, which you cover with rotom, victini/dos, and top to an degree, i say genesect cause he makes everything better :P. In seriousness, genesect has good coverage from everyone else, half your team checks heatran and blissey, and his rock polish set gives you a power sweeper, or you can use scarfed keldeo, gives a more reliable fighting and more powerful water. Finally, mach punch on hitmontop over toxic.



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    Thanks for the replies guys, now to decipating them!
    Quote Originally Posted by PokemanzAssassin View Post
    One little thing I noticed is that, if you're gonna keep Hitmontop, you could run Foresight>Sucker Punch. Sucker Punch is better for Gengars, whereas Foresight is better for Jellicent because it lets you hit it with Rapid Spin. I might cost you your Hitmontop, though, because you'll most likely be butned by said Jellicent, but it could really be worth it.

    Definitely Volt Switch>T-Bolt in my opinion. I like Volt Switch more, because, well, the ability to scout with it is pretty cool.

    You might consider Lefties>Life Orb on Gyara, though I can definitely see where you're going with the set you have, and if it's played right, I think it can destroy stuff.

    Stallrein is.. Meh. I say you don't need it lol.

    These are my little suuggestions, although I'm not very good at rating team, so yeah.
    Hitmontop: Foresight > Sucker Punch
    Gyarados: Leftovers > Life Orb


    Quote Originally Posted by mcdanger View Post
    the team doesnt look to bad, gyarados and magnezone look out of place tho
    your ev spread on rotom, your better off just giving him lefties and switching trick for pain split. I do have to agree with superpower, it helps mamo plow through ferrothorn and air ballon ran that stone edge cant, plus your ice stab hits the flyings that stone edge does, so its redundant. Also, run adamant, the few things he outpaces with jolly doesnt really make up for the loss in power. I would drop dos, i dont see how he helps besides a beating stick, in which case mamo does it. i feel victini would do good as a replacement. Victini is a monster in hail, and helps check sun teams that screw hail, i presonally like the banded set, but his scarfed work good, and makes a nice volt-turn core with rotom. I personally dont see how zone helps much besides scizor, which you cover with rotom, victini/dos, and top to an degree, i say genesect cause he makes everything better :P. In seriousness, genesect has good coverage from everyone else, half your team checks heatran and blissey, and his rock polish set gives you a power sweeper, or you can use scarfed keldeo, gives a more reliable fighting and more powerful water. Finally, mach punch on hitmontop over toxic.
    Rotom-W: Pain Split > Trick, Leftovers > Choice specs
    Mamoswine: Superpower > Stone Edge, Adamant > Jolly
    Gyarados: Victini / Genesect

    I'll test them out :3

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    Sigh, I feel like this night feel like an idiotic post, but maybe Specs/Scarf Golduck can work as a good anti-weather lead as it can 1-2HKO all weather leads depending on item. Cloud Nine really is the key here as it allows it to negate weather. Anyways, here's some stats to show it's effectiveness assuming max SpA EVs, Choice Specs:

    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Tyranitar: 92-108% Damage (52% chance for OHKO)
    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Hippowdon: 109-129% Damage (guarenteed OHKO)
    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Ninetales: 106-125% Damage (guarenteed OHKO)
    Golduck Hidden Power Fire vs 252/252 +SpD Abomasnow: 84-100% Damage (minuscule chance for OHKO, guarenteed 2HKO)
    Golduck Hidden Power Grass vs 252/252 +SpD Politoad: 39-47% Damage (guarenteed 3HKO)

    Biggest problem you'll have is with Politoad but can't do much back except for a Toxic. Hail isn't very common so you won't find Abomasnow much but on everything else it works pretty nicely IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrocious View Post
    Sigh, I feel like this night feel like an idiotic post, but maybe Specs/Scarf Golduck can work as a good anti-weather lead as it can 1-2HKO all weather leads depending on item. Cloud Nine really is the key here as it allows it to negate weather. Anyways, here's some stats to show it's effectiveness assuming max SpA EVs, Choice Specs:

    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Tyranitar: 92-108% Damage (52% chance for OHKO)
    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Hippowdon: 109-129% Damage (guarenteed OHKO)
    Golduck Hydro Pump vs 252/252 +SpD Ninetales: 106-125% Damage (guarenteed OHKO)
    Golduck Hidden Power Fire vs 252/252 +SpD Abomasnow: 84-100% Damage (minuscule chance for OHKO, guarenteed 2HKO)
    Golduck Hidden Power Grass vs 252/252 +SpD Politoad: 39-47% Damage (guarenteed 3HKO)

    Biggest problem you'll have is with Politoad but can't do much back except for a Toxic. Hail isn't very common so you won't find Abomasnow much but on everything else it works pretty nicely IMO.
    Cloud nine only negates weather temporary thus not really viable.
    as for the calcs none of those pokemons (maybe except politoed) runs those EVs tyranitar runs 252/176*
    ninetales is offensive.


    Quote Originally Posted by Professor Oak
    Only two things are infinite, the universe and the amount of zubat in caves, and I'm not sure about the former.
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    I was just talking about the sheer power it does. I it provides a surprise element and KOs weather leads allowing you to idk set up some other weather later.

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    Will do synergy stuff rate later if you'd like, for now I'd just like to say I like the team, a weather team that will most prolly win weather wars :3 My only suggestion ATM being Abomasnow, Focus Punch > Focus Blast and Sub > Giga Drain, giving a SubSeedPunch with 100% accurate STAB c: Nature and EV changes may be needed, will calculate if you wanna try it out.
    Last edited by SkyDriver; 28th November 2012 at 11:49 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Skydryver View Post
    Will do synergy stuff rate later if you'd like, for now I'd just like to say I like the team, a weather team that will most prolly win weather wars :3 My only suggestion ATM being Abomasnow, Focus Punch > Focus Blast and Sub > Giga Drain, giving a SubSeedPunch with 100% accurate STAB c: Nature and EV changes may be needed, will calculate if you wanna try it out.
    Sure... Your Abomasnow set sounds interesting... But I'm kinda unsure about the EVs though..

    Yeah I fought a lot of weather teams before... and so far I like the record xD

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