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Thread: How has BW changed the dynamics of the Anime? Will these changes continue?

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwail8023 View Post
    Yeah, that sounds pretty awesome.
    Yeah! .

    I agree cause they'd finally be able to show off a friendly main rival well. She doesn't have anything specificly against ash, but they fight constantly because otherwise its hard for them to get along.

    But they have each others backs if ya know what I mean. ;D xD
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokemaniac24 View Post
    I would like to see a new kind of main rival for Ash. Usually, the main rivals he gets are all males, they are all arrogant and they are all mean to him at some point or another. I like what they were trying to do with Trip and the backstory but he really got screwed over in the end. I would like to see a smart, competent and serious female rival as Ash's main rival next generation. It would be something different for Ash.
    The female rival should have the good qualities of Gary, Paul and Trip. She should also have her own good qualities as well and be experienced so no one can complain about her like they did with Trip.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmphaticPikachu View Post
    Yeah! .

    I agree cause they'd finally be able to show off a friendly main rival well. She doesn't have anything specificly against ash, but they fight constantly because otherwise its hard for them to get along.

    But they have each others backs if ya know what I mean. ;D xD
    Yeah, I definitely do. They really should try this idea out: it's already been 4 series with no main female rival-- they should try to implement an idea like this.

    Quote Originally Posted by J Ken View Post
    The female rival should have the good qualities of Gary, Paul and Trip. She should also have her own good qualities as well and be experienced so no one can complain about her like they did with Trip.
    Agreed.
    Opinions Regarding the Pokémon:
    1. Anime: OS > AG > BW > DP > XY
    2. Movies: OS = AG > DP = BW = XY
    3. English Dub: 4Kids Entertainment/TAJ Productions (EP001-EP276; AG001-AG020) = 4Kids Entertainment (AG021-AG145) = TPCi/SDI Media (The Origin)/Very Good > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (BW)/Poor > PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions (AG146-AG192)/Very Poor > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (XY) = PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions/DuArt Film & Video (DP)/Atrocious
    4. Games: XY > BW1 > BW2 > RSE > GSC > Y > HGSS > DP > RBG
    5. Pokémon: The Origin: Excellent: 93/100.
    6. Manga: RS > RB > Y > FRLG > XY > BW > E > DP > GSC
    "It's like with each new Generation, Dogasu becomes an even bigger idiot than he was the last Generation." - Kalos Adventurer

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    Quote Originally Posted by J Ken View Post
    The female rival should have the good qualities of Gary, Paul and Trip. She should also have her own good qualities as well and be experienced so no one can complain about her like they did with Trip.
    strike a balanced, make her experienced enough that she's able to hold her own and looks tough...yet Ash still feels the need to try and "teach her" despite her being able to kick his ***.

    I wouldn't honestly worry to much about the experience. They've already proven what they wanna do with the anime...I'd think a "new player" or new trainer connects better with the young lings rather then someone who is experienced. (ash isn't replaced cause he's known to well. XD)


    thoguh we need to see what 6th gen is like before any real predictions can be made...the feel of the gen does dictacte the anime a bit.
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
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    ^The female protagonist from the 6th gen games could be his new rival.

    I definitely think they should stick with multiple rivals. Carrying on rivals from BW to the next gen would be cool, like having some of them (Bianca, Trip, Cameron) show up and challenge the next League or for a tournament or two for a cameo appearance. Rotation would be good if they decided to actually NOT screw it up. Having it balanced and keeping Ash's team strong would be nice, maybe they shouldn't give him all 3 starters next gen and just spread them out like they did in AG... and try giving the Pokemon he catches personalities again. His Hoenn and Sinnoh teams were memorable because of their defined personalities, in five years time I doubt I'll remember much if anything about Leavanny, Unfezant, Boldore, or Palpitoad.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EmphaticPikachu View Post
    strike a balanced, make her experienced enough that she's able to hold her own and looks tough...yet Ash still feels the need to try and "teach her" despite her being able to kick his ***.

    I wouldn't honestly worry to much about the experience. They've already proven what they wanna do with the anime...I'd think a "new player" or new trainer connects better with the young lings rather then someone who is experienced. (ash isn't replaced cause he's known to well. XD)
    That sounds like a good plan for this female rival. It'd be funny to see Ash get frustrated about it like he did with Trip: "What a meanie!" (pouts). XD.

    Quote Originally Posted by johno1995 View Post
    ^The female protagonist from the 6th gen games could be his new rival.

    I definitely think they should stick with multiple rivals. Carrying on rivals from BW to the next gen would be cool, like having some of them (Bianca, Trip, Cameron) show up and challenge the next League or for a tournament or two for a cameo appearance. Rotation would be good if they decided to actually NOT screw it up. Having it balanced and keeping Ash's team strong would be nice, maybe they shouldn't give him all 3 starters next gen and just spread them out like they did in AG... and try giving the Pokemon he catches personalities again. His Hoenn and Sinnoh teams were memorable because of their defined personalities, in five years time I doubt I'll remember much if anything about Leavanny, Unfezant, Boldore, or Palpitoad.
    That sounds like a good idea as well, and sadly I also agree somewhat about his Unova team. I won't remember a few of them. They should disperse the starters like they did in AG: that was a good idea.
    Last edited by PokemonNation2000; 1st January 2013 at 10:20 PM.
    Opinions Regarding the Pokémon:
    1. Anime: OS > AG > BW > DP > XY
    2. Movies: OS = AG > DP = BW = XY
    3. English Dub: 4Kids Entertainment/TAJ Productions (EP001-EP276; AG001-AG020) = 4Kids Entertainment (AG021-AG145) = TPCi/SDI Media (The Origin)/Very Good > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (BW)/Poor > PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions (AG146-AG192)/Very Poor > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (XY) = PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions/DuArt Film & Video (DP)/Atrocious
    4. Games: XY > BW1 > BW2 > RSE > GSC > Y > HGSS > DP > RBG
    5. Pokémon: The Origin: Excellent: 93/100.
    6. Manga: RS > RB > Y > FRLG > XY > BW > E > DP > GSC
    "It's like with each new Generation, Dogasu becomes an even bigger idiot than he was the last Generation." - Kalos Adventurer

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    They don't have to go the Gary/Paul/Trip route with her. Have her be the underdog in the rivalry with her and Ash. Ash always seems to tie/lose to his main rival until the League. How about in this rivalry, the girl actually struggles against Ash and Ash wins the majority of the battles. If Ash is going to lose the League no matter what, have the Final 2 of the League be Ash and the girl rival and the girl rival beats Ash in the League and wins the whole thing. That would be different than the whole League rival thing they always do.

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    I think it was a very god idea to give Ash a rotating team. However, I don't think that the idea was pulled off very well. Certain Pokemon on his team got far too much screentime compared to others. For example, Ash's Tranquil was hardly in any battles before its evolution into Unfezant. There was no reason it should have evolved, other than the fact that the writers wanted to make it seem like it wasn't falling behind. I think that they should continue giving Ash a rotating team in the future, but give each Pokemon a more balanced battling ratio.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokemaniac24 View Post
    They don't have to go the Gary/Paul/Trip route with her. Have her be the underdog in the rivalry with her and Ash. Ash always seems to tie/lose to his main rival until the League. How about in this rivalry, the girl actually struggles against Ash and Ash wins the majority of the battles. If Ash is going to lose the League no matter what, have the Final 2 of the League be Ash and the girl rival and the girl rival beats Ash in the League and wins the whole thing. That would be different than the whole League rival thing they always do.
    That would definitely be an interesting twist for once, if they keep making Ash lose the league anyway...why not make it less predictable?
    Opinions Regarding the Pokémon:
    1. Anime: OS > AG > BW > DP > XY
    2. Movies: OS = AG > DP = BW = XY
    3. English Dub: 4Kids Entertainment/TAJ Productions (EP001-EP276; AG001-AG020) = 4Kids Entertainment (AG021-AG145) = TPCi/SDI Media (The Origin)/Very Good > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (BW)/Poor > PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions (AG146-AG192)/Very Poor > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (XY) = PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions/DuArt Film & Video (DP)/Atrocious
    4. Games: XY > BW1 > BW2 > RSE > GSC > Y > HGSS > DP > RBG
    5. Pokémon: The Origin: Excellent: 93/100.
    6. Manga: RS > RB > Y > FRLG > XY > BW > E > DP > GSC
    "It's like with each new Generation, Dogasu becomes an even bigger idiot than he was the last Generation." - Kalos Adventurer

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwail8023 View Post
    That sounds like a good plan for this female rival. It'd be funny to see Ash get frustrated about it like he did with Trip: "What a meanie!" (pouts). XD.



    That sounds like a good idea as well, and sadly I also agree somewhat about his Unova team. I won't remember a few of them. They should disperse the starters like they did in AG: that was a good idea.
    YES. MAKE HIM RAGE. xD ...as long as she didn't JUST get her starter like trip did. I would of taken that loss with fineness if trip didn't just get that starter from the professor TWO SECONDS AGO.
    ...ahem, sorry, I had a small rage fit. Please excuse me. XD

    ANd I agree with the starters being distrubuted...hell even two starts ain't THAT Bad. But you fill up 4 members of their team doing all 3 of them. :/...

    the female rival is misunderstood! she's just blunt but not really mean! (Mostly...XD)
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
    My eyes! (my eyes!) are filled with curiosity! You think! (You think!) that you have power over me! In this life! (This life!) There’s no room for you and me! So turn around and face the day with me!
    Such a sexy song. Urgh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EmphaticPikachu View Post
    YES. MAKE HIM RAGE. xD ...as long as she didn't JUST get her starter like trip did. I would of taken that loss with fineness if trip didn't just get that starter from the professor TWO SECONDS AGO.
    ...ahem, sorry, I had a small rage fit. Please excuse me. XD

    ANd I agree with the starters being distrubuted...hell even two starts ain't THAT Bad. But you fill up 4 members of their team doing all 3 of them. :/...
    Yeah, I also hated that move. That was way too soon for Ash to lose...

    I agree on the starters as well.
    Opinions Regarding the Pokémon:
    1. Anime: OS > AG > BW > DP > XY
    2. Movies: OS = AG > DP = BW = XY
    3. English Dub: 4Kids Entertainment/TAJ Productions (EP001-EP276; AG001-AG020) = 4Kids Entertainment (AG021-AG145) = TPCi/SDI Media (The Origin)/Very Good > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (BW)/Poor > PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions (AG146-AG192)/Very Poor > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (XY) = PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions/DuArt Film & Video (DP)/Atrocious
    4. Games: XY > BW1 > BW2 > RSE > GSC > Y > HGSS > DP > RBG
    5. Pokémon: The Origin: Excellent: 93/100.
    6. Manga: RS > RB > Y > FRLG > XY > BW > E > DP > GSC
    "It's like with each new Generation, Dogasu becomes an even bigger idiot than he was the last Generation." - Kalos Adventurer

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    The perfect balance (in terms of rivalries) for me would be:

    - a competent female rival, who has travelled in various regions and who uses advanced strategies (maybe rely in defensive moves to counter Ash's speed strategies)
    - a male rookie trainer, who will pick the starter weak to Ash's and that will have troubles in battling, but Ash will mentor him from time to time and he will grow stronger during the saga. He could be rival of both the female rival and Ash.

    Obviously, this balance would be too perfect for the writers to pull off, but one can always dream. XD

    Anyway, I liked the idea of the rotation and the tournaments and I'll be glad if they improve those ideas.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cresselia92 View Post
    The perfect balance (in terms of rivalries) for me would be:
    - a competent female rival, who has travelled in various regions and who uses advanced strategies (maybe rely in defensive moves to counter Ash's speed strategies)
    - a male rookie trainer, who will pick the starter weak to Ash's and that will have troubles in battling, but Ash will mentor him from time to time and he will grow stronger during the saga. He could be rival of both the female rival and Ash.
    This is a really cool parallel and it would be amazing if this occurred.
    Opinions Regarding the Pokémon:
    1. Anime: OS > AG > BW > DP > XY
    2. Movies: OS = AG > DP = BW = XY
    3. English Dub: 4Kids Entertainment/TAJ Productions (EP001-EP276; AG001-AG020) = 4Kids Entertainment (AG021-AG145) = TPCi/SDI Media (The Origin)/Very Good > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (BW)/Poor > PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions (AG146-AG192)/Very Poor > TPCi/DuArt Film & Video (XY) = PUSA/TPCi/TAJ Productions/DuArt Film & Video (DP)/Atrocious
    4. Games: XY > BW1 > BW2 > RSE > GSC > Y > HGSS > DP > RBG
    5. Pokémon: The Origin: Excellent: 93/100.
    6. Manga: RS > RB > Y > FRLG > XY > BW > E > DP > GSC
    "It's like with each new Generation, Dogasu becomes an even bigger idiot than he was the last Generation." - Kalos Adventurer

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    Well back on topic...

    Some of the biggest changes have already been said, but Ash catching multiple Pokemon, having multiple rivals, multiple tournaments that the entire group enters. Other things like the focusing on only Unova Pokemon, cutting TR from every episode, and integrating the games differently were interesting changes as well. As to the last point, things like integrating both BW and BW2 elements into the anime (Bianca, Cheren, N, PokeStar Studios, Ash meets all the gym leaders of both games, etc) were definitely a plus. Yes I would like to see some of these things continue on into the future as I expect it to get even better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwail8023 View Post
    This is a really cool parallel and it would be amazing if this occurred.
    Yeah. I'd like to see a triangle for once. Oh, and I like the idea of the "sidekicks" having rivals. If we'll have other companions, they should have rivals too (as long as they aren't one-sided).
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    [QUOTE=Cresselia92;15530548]
    - a competent female rival, who has travelled in various regions and who uses advanced strategies (maybe rely in defensive moves to counter Ash's speed strategies)
    - a male rookie trainer, who will pick the starter weak to Ash's and that will have troubles in battling, but Ash will mentor him from time to time and he will grow stronger during the saga. He could be rival of both the female rival and Ash./QUOTE]

    Have in the end, the male rookie trainer beat both of them, to prove his strength. Obviously since he's not the main character we need to see some back story and ALOT of training, but it can be pulled off.

    For example, Ash and this other girl constantly give the rookie male trainer advice. In fact they compete upon can give better advice...
    The rookie male takes it all in, and eventually starts becoming really strong behind them, while the female rival and the ash focus on each other. (IE they constantly have at it. We'll see plenty of battles with them, because they're so competitive.)
    When the league comes, ash is preparing for her and is geniunly surprised by the rookie trainer making it in the league.

    By the end of it...Well depends on if the writers want ash to win or not. If they go about liek they have, I'd say they;d make it so the rookie beats BOTH of them, knocking both their confiedence down a notch. Possibly even providing a lesson not to get too competent for the children, and experience isn't everything.


    EDIT: CONFIDENT. Not to competent. xD;
    Last edited by EmphaticPikachu; 1st January 2013 at 10:37 PM.
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
    My eyes! (my eyes!) are filled with curiosity! You think! (You think!) that you have power over me! In this life! (This life!) There’s no room for you and me! So turn around and face the day with me!
    Such a sexy song. Urgh.

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    I think some people give BW way too much credit. Yeah, a few patterns were broken, but it's not like it's the second coming of AG, which was the saga that really changed a lot of fixed patterns and brought about change in a positive way. Most of the things that BW did differently from other sagas like the rotation of Ash's Pokemon only had a negative impact on the story. We could probably find more examples of negative change than positive change if we just look back. BW will only be remembered for the former in my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciccone View Post
    I think some people give BW way too much credit. Yeah, a few patterns were broken, but it's not like it's the second coming of AG, which was the saga that really changed a lot of fixed patterns and brought about change in a positive way. Most of the things that BW did differently from other sagas like the rotation of Ash's Pokemon only had a negative impact on the story. We could probably find more examples of negative change than positive change if we just look back. BW will only be remembered for the former in my opinion.
    No one is denying that BW poorly executed its ideas such as Pokémon rotation or the evil team or the rivalries.

    We just think that these ideas, done right, could have made BW a much better saga.


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    I actually like the idea of a strong, female rival. One who has been through as many Leagues as Ash, but hasn't seen the continuing success that he has (Probably always having trouble getting past the Top 16).

    I like even more if she always lost to Ash , not due to incompetence, but simply Ash always finding a way to win when she thinks she has him against the wall. Unlike Ash, she would think that battles are won on paper and that if she has a set strategy, then she can't lose. All the while Ash teaching her (not in a condescending way) that in a battle, anything can happen and that you always have to account for the unexpected. Outside of battles, she would still keep that personality, being a lot smarter than Ash and always making light of his bone headed decisions, but in a playful way instead of being mean like Paul. Of course she would sit to watch some of his battles and become captivated by his style and start to think differently about how she battles.

    In their League battle, she is finally able to cut loose and let the battle flow, much like Ash does after starting out nervous about battling someone she has come to care a lot for and that the losses she suffered from him actually meant something (Feeling like "I know that in the end, he'll find a way, just as he always does) and lead her to a win. Again, much better than creating a rival solely for the League and having him beat Ash at the end. Also, in the end, I find it would be fitting for her to lose in the next round, preferably the Finals, meaning Ash would Get Top 4 and she would get Top 2, giving her a huge boost forward.

    It would be able to show her constantly getting better and that Ash has come a long way and not losing to rookie Trainers.

    Then again, Best Wishes did have a good rival dynamic, akin to most Shounen anime that I would like to see done again only much better in Best Wishes we had

    Main Character: Ash
    Main Girl: Iris
    Main Character's Best Friend: Cilan
    Main Character's Rival: Trip
    Strong Guy, Hyper Energetic Rival for Main Character: Stephan
    Main Girl's Rival: Georgia
    Ditzy Blonde: Bianca
    Mean Princess: Burgundy

    If they can try this again, but do it better, I would like to see something like this again. I would like to see a Tournament Arc that is done well and is able to flesh out all of the characters, preferably all 6 on 6 battles than give us some real insight into these characters. But with an anime like Pokemon, that is wishful thinking.

    In fact, both are just wishful thinking in terms of the Pokemon anime and will more than likely never see the light of day.
    Last edited by deathseer; 1st January 2013 at 10:57 PM.
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    Im actually unsure as to how much legacy BW will leave, all due respect to the writers following what must have been a tense and emotional time for them, but since the cancelled/postponed episodes, BW has seemed a half-hearted attempt to show that Ash is nowhere near his full potential and whats more important is developing his travelling companions and letting them leave the show with dignity.




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    Quote Originally Posted by Subject
    Will these changes continue?
    I think we might already know the answer to this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    I think we might already know the answer to this.
    So you're saying they will go back to the DP formula then right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokemaniac24 View Post
    So you're saying they will go back to the DP formula then right?
    if this N saga is short...then it will be very hard to say "Formula."

    Lets wait for January 8th to say what exactly we're expecting before we guess how long the anime is, or if they are going back to a "formula".

    Plus the episodes haven't even aired yet...
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
    My eyes! (my eyes!) are filled with curiosity! You think! (You think!) that you have power over me! In this life! (This life!) There’s no room for you and me! So turn around and face the day with me!
    Such a sexy song. Urgh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciccone View Post
    I think some people give BW way too much credit. Yeah, a few patterns were broken, but it's not like it's the second coming of AG, which was the saga that really changed a lot of fixed patterns and brought about change in a positive way. Most of the things that BW did differently from other sagas like the rotation of Ash's Pokemon only had a negative impact on the story. We could probably find more examples of negative change than positive change if we just look back. BW will only be remembered for the former in my opinion.
    Best wishes is the dragon ball gt of pokemon it had good ideas but wasn't executed well only difference is the show will continue after best wishes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShinyPokemon inc. View Post
    Best wishes is the dragon ball gt of pokemon it had good ideas but wasn't executed well only difference is the show will continue after best wishes.
    Don't insult Dragon Ball with that GT crap, GT was crap because it wasn't Toryiama work, even Z became bad when it started ignoring all the characters and the show started being about who transforms more.

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