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Thread: All Hail The Underdog! (peak #1 on PO and #2 on Showdown)

  1. #1
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    Default All Hail The Underdog! (peak #1 on PO and #2 on Showdown)

    Hey guys, I'm Blaze. =)
    This is my second post and second RMT on Serebii. Yeah i dont post that much lol. I normally hang around on IRC and Showdown and probably annoy the **** out of everyone XD . Whatever lets cut to the chase. This is definitely the best team i have ever made (and believe me i make teams all the team, normally to only modest success) ;p. At a brief glance it looks like a typical Deoxys-D offense team, but theres subtle differences that make it stand out and work in this meta - especially mr. underdog Suicune himself! I topped the ladder on PO with two different alts with this team and nearly made 1st on Showdown too. Its HO, but thats the best playstyle atm (or at least the only style ill never play - got no time for silly stall games XD) Set up and destroy everything in your path ;p
    Hope you like it!

    In team preview:



    Under microscope:



    Deoxys-D @ Tanga Berry
    Ability = Pressure
    Nature = Timid ( + Speed - Attack )
    EVs = 252 HP | 4 Sp. Defense | 252 Speed
    Moves = Stealth Rock | Spikes | Taunt | Magic Coat

    I sometimes get called a noob for using Deoxys-D, but they can shove it, hes the ultimate hazard lead so why not use it? ;p After months of running hazardless HO teams, i decided in order to make a real push for the top ranks Id be needing some good ol' rocks/spikes. Taunt stops slower stuff from setting up their rocks, and Magic Coat trolls rival Taunt users who think they can stop me from setting up hazards. Tanga Berry cushions the hit from +1 Atk Genesect U-turn, so i dont have to worry about it (dont want +1 SAtk Genesect..)




    Gengar @ Choice Scarf
    Ability = Levitate
    Nature = Timid ( + Speed - Attack )
    EVs = 4 HP | 252 Sp.Attack | 252 Speed
    Moves = Shadow Ball | Thunderbolt | Hidden Power [Ice] | Trick

    Every team with Deoxys-D needs a spin blocker. Gengars the normal choice, but his unorthodox scarf set is not. I LOL every time Starmie gets spin blocked, only to be outsped and OHKOd by Shadow Ball the next turn. ;p Seriously amazing revenge killer too - outspeeds most things at +1 and many even at +2 (like DDNite and Modest Venusaur). Trick is the crux of the set, allowing it to cripple the special tanks that would otherwise wall Suicune/Genesect.



    Terrakion @ Choice Band
    Ability = Justified
    Nature = Jolly ( + Speed - Sp.Attack )
    EVs = | 252 Attack | 4 Sp.Defense | 252 Speed
    Moves = Close Combat | Stone Edge | X-scissor | Quick Attack

    Still destroys teams like it did in BW1. CB Terrakion is a nightmare for offensive and stall teams alike. Underestimate its power and you WILL die. ;p The fact that Genesect seems to have replaced Scizor has greatly helped its cause even. I only really use Close Combat and Stone Edge much: I only use X-scissor if I want to murder Celebi or hit Lati@s hard without having to risk a Stone Edge miss. Quick Attack is only used in emergency situations as it is pretty weak even with CB.



    Genesect @ Life Orb
    Ability = Download
    Nature = Modest ( + Sp.Attack - Attack )
    EVs = 24 HP | 252 Sp.Attack | 24 Sp.Defense | 208 Speed
    Moves = Rock Polish | Flamethrower | Ice Beam | Giga Drain

    LOVE this beast. The scarf set has become so predictable guys, use RP. ;p The amount of teams it can straight up 6-0 after getting +1 SAtk and setting up RP is crazy (and awesome.. yay Gene FTW!) I had a difficult time deciding which coverage moves to use, but in the end ive found this combination works the best. Even with no STAB, he hits everything hard, and gets SE coverage on most of the meta anyway. Giga Drain seems odd over Thunderbolt, but it does far more to Rotom-W and Terrakion, the latter of which especially is far bigger threat to the team than Gyarados, whom is checked by Gengar anyway =)



    Dragonite @ Yache Berry
    Ability = Multiscale
    Nature = Adamant ( + Attack - Sp.Attack )
    EVs = 252 Attack | 4 Sp.Defense | 252 Speed
    Moves = Dragon Dance | Dragon Claw | Fire Punch | Earthquake

    Used this guy in my last RMT XD Hell even using the exact same image as last time lol. But here's a slightly different moveset. The premise is the same - set up DD and pwn everything. However this has been adapted to the new metagame. Firstly, Outrage is a bit sucky as teams normally have at least two Steels, and being locked in makes you extremely vulnerable to revenge killing by Genesect, so im using Dragon Claw which still hits very hard. Secondly, I chose Yache Berry instead of Lum Berry so Dragonite can survive a +0 Genesect Ice Beam even after SR. I think this is important since Genesect is basically on at least 50% of teams these days ;p.



    Suicune @ Leftovers
    Ability = Pressure
    Nature = Bold ( + Defense - Attack )
    EVs = 252 HP | 252 Defense | 4 Sp.Attack
    Moves = Calm Mind | Scald | Rest | Sleep Talk

    Now here's the star of the team!! =D Holy ****, Suicune is a beast. It never ever dies, no way. It can set up CM and pretty much beat the common sand/rain teams all by itself. No one EVER expects this set anymore ;p It can really throw a players game plan into turmoil if they don't have a strong Grass/Electric move to KO it, which is pretty much the only things it fears. All of the strong neutral attackers that can damage it are threatened by Scald, in fact all physical attackers have to watch out for Scald burns.. so yeah, don't mess with my underdog. It may seem like a bit of an oxymoron to have such a bulky pokemon on a HO team, but it does pull its weight. This can and will quite comfortably sweep teams once the opponent's bulky waters are dead. It can also stall out practically anything it wants to 1v1 thanks to Pressure. ;p


    So there you go. Have fun stealing using it if you want to. =)

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  2. #2

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    Question what server on PO?

    *Credit Goes To Sworn Metalhead*

  3. #3
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    1) Pic or didn't happen. Sorry, I'm a skeptic when it comes to stuff like this. I can't actually trust what is actually real ladder topping and what is not

    2) Every good player would know that running Taunt AND magic Coat is useless as they essentially fulfill the same role in a battle.

    3) I can't actually see Suicune as much of a boon than a buzzkill on this team. The shaky RestTalk and the vulnerability of having just about everything set up on you really hurts more than helps.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    1) Pic or didn't happen. Sorry, I'm a skeptic when it comes to stuff like this. I can't actually trust what is actually real ladder topping and what is not

    2) Every good player would know that running Taunt AND magic Coat is useless as they essentially fulfill the same role in a battle.

    3) I can't actually see Suicune as much of a boon than a buzzkill on this team. The shaky RestTalk and the vulnerability of having just about everything set up on you really hurts more than helps.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jr Breshears View Post
    Question what server on PO?
    Excellent question, my good sir.
    Join the Tutor Program. Started by JRCxyz & Salavoir

    [In Clan Memoriam]
    RIP Battling Academy, even though I just joined.
    Memories are eternal.

    RIP Toothpaste Clan. You kept my teeth clean.
    Dental hygiene is eternal.

    RIP Survival Island. Global warming drowned us all.
    Survival isn't eternal

  5. #5
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    honestly, i also see suicune....useless. you already have a late game sweeper on gene, and a couple hole-punchers in terrakion and dnite.

    if you are going to run magic coat deo-d, switch out taunt with hp fire or something, and switch the 252 speed evs to 252 def or SpD, whichever you need most. taunt is fairly useless with magic coat, and magic coat doesnt need the speed.

    i would also like proof. no proof = didnt happen. some vids, screenshots, porygon ± stuff, whatever you can get. preferably all. full rate later.

    btw, doesnt PS! have different servers as well? js...

  6. #6
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    There's no way this team peaked #1, and it isn't as good as you think it is... I assume you posted it hoping to get all sorts of praise?
    -First of all, this is NOT a Hyper Offense team. Hyper Offense teams are teams that set up dual screens and have 5 set up pokemon. Each pokemon uses its own raw power from setting up to force its way past its counters. There are rarely any choiced pokemon, and NEVER 2 choiced pokemon. Also, you don't have any pokemon setting up dual screens, so this team is, alas, standard offense.
    -Your team struggles with weather. And by that I mean "any moderately good weather team will beat you." Azumarill can just straight up own you. Other pokemon give you almost unbearable amounts of trouble, like Venusaur, Lilligant, Tangrowth, the two Drizzle Therians, and Scizor (who can pick off both of your choiced pokemon effortlessly, and trap Gengar). On the topic of Gengar, I assume your rebuttle for this comment is going to be "Gengar can Trick and cripple the opposing pokemon."Well he can, but you can only do that once. Chances are the opponent will have more than one pokemon that's going to give your team trouble.
    -Stall also kills you. You have no spinner, and no status cleric. "But I don't need a spinner because Deoxys-D has Magic Coat and Taunt!" No, you still need a spinner. It's incredibly easy to layer hazards, and if Deoxys isn't the pokemon in battle against the hazard layer, they're going to get a hazard up. That's a problem, because it breaks Dragonite's Multiscale, and it doesn't carry Roost or Substitute. It also wears Genesect down quickly due to it's Life Orb.
    If you want me to go further in detail, please ask. I can break down your team pokemon by pokemon.
    I topped the ladder on PO with two different alts with this team and nearly made 1st on Showdown too.
    That's just flat out not true. Surely someone as talented as yourself must have other teams. If you ever want to battle on PO, you just message me, mkay? (:


  7. #7

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    jesus christ get off this guy's dick about this

    yes, the team isn't great.

    did he peak on the ladder? who knows. who gives a ****. you can be good with a **** team and peak, you can be bad with a good team and peak, or you can be lucky and have nothing else going for you except for astoundingly good looks (see user: theebay). the point is that 1) ladder peaks literally mean nothing and you guys need to stop giving a **** about it and just give his team legitimate rates and 2) ladder isn't exactly a decent measure of anything

    seriously, especially given the quality of the few attempts at legitimate rates he's gotten (which were basically people who don't know how to play HO not criticizing the team on it's sole issue, which is cune)
    Last edited by windsong; 23rd October 2012 at 2:43 AM.

  8. #8
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    dang windsong, didn't know u cared about Serebii teams still lol

    I chase the dream, not the competition.


  9. #9

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    Stop attacking this guy for his ladder rank claims. Ladder peaks are notable accomplishments, but they're not some sacred thing that only expert gurus can make. Plenty of people ladder with teams and just don't get screenshots. I've personally laddered to #10 in OU, #2 in RU, #1 in NU, and #1 in CC and Randbat, but I've never had a single screenshot because I don't think ladder peaks are a big deal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    2) Every good player would know that running Taunt AND magic Coat is useless as they essentially fulfill the same role in a battle.
    Having both is a bit superfluous, but it's not something that no good player would do. Magic Coat not only prevents opposing Taunt, hazards, status, etc., but it deflects them back towards the opponent. Taunt, on the other hand, is something that is useful for completely shutting down slower support Pokemon. When put together, these allow you to nearly shut down any support Pokemon you're up against. He could very well run something to keep from being complete Taunt-bait if it does hit, but I don't see how having both disqualifies him as a good player.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arty-Kun View Post
    There's no way this team peaked #1, and it isn't as good as you think it is... I assume you posted it hoping to get all sorts of praise?
    How so? This team isn't perfect, but it's not bad either. How is it so hard to believe that he could peak #1?

    -Your team struggles with weather. And by that I mean "any moderately good weather team will beat you." Azumarill can just straight up own you.
    Rain gives this team trouble, but Azumarill? When he has Suicune? Suicune can stall out its most powerful attack, a Rain-boosted Waterfall, just by spamming Rest and Sleep Talk. Not to mention that if Scald burns, Azumarill is useless.

    Other pokemon give you almost unbearable amounts of trouble, like Venusaur, Lilligant, Tangrowth, the two Drizzle Therians, and Scizor (who can pick off both of your choiced pokemon effortlessly, and trap Gengar). On the topic of Gengar, I assume your rebuttle for this comment is going to be "Gengar can Trick and cripple the opposing pokemon."Well he can, but you can only do that once. Chances are the opponent will have more than one pokemon that's going to give your team trouble.
    He's really not all that Sun weak, to be honest. Terrakion is one of the biggest nightmares for Sun teams to face. For example, the cookie cutter Sun team (often dubbed Lavos Sun) struggles with Stone Edge spam if Dugtrio is unable to trap and kill it for one reason or another. Dragonite is also a great weapon against Sun teams, and those teams often struggle with it as well. Not to mention that the prime speed sweeper of Sun teams, Venusaur, can be outsped (Modest variants, at least) by Gengar and checked decently enough. He's kinda Tornadus-T weak, but Gengar does an excellent job of keeping that in check too.

    -Stall also kills you.
    It's BW2. Stall doesn't exist. Besides, CB Terrakion and CroCune are two enormous pains for stall teams.

    That's just flat out not true.
    I'm not even sure how you're supposed to know this.

    Anyhow, I mainly wanted to get that garbage sorted out. I might be back for a rate later, but I do recommend that you look into a replacement for Suicune. It's really effective at times, I'll give you that, but having to rely on RestTalk for recovery kinda stinks. It also struggles against plenty of common Pokemon like Ferrothorn, Venusaur, and Gastrodon.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    2) Every good player would know that running Taunt AND magic Coat is useless as they essentially fulfill the same role in a battle.
    Magic Coat blocks faster Taunts. Taunt prevents the opponent from setting up on Deoxys and turns Skarmory or whatever into Spike bait. While there aren't THAT many Taunters faster than Deoxys D in OU, it allows him to **** with lead Terrakion and avoid Speed Ties with other Deoxys D. Really, what else is he going to put there? Hp Fire / Superpower don't KO Scizor / Tyranitar without investment + type-gem and Thunder Wave doesn't mesh with his team as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arty-Kun View Post
    There's no way this team peaked #1, and it isn't as good as you think it is... I assume you posted it hoping to get all sorts of praise?
    I'll just leave this here. http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthr...nd-find-a-flaw

    -First of all, this is NOT a Hyper Offense team. Hyper Offense teams are teams that set up dual screens and have 5 set up pokemon. Each pokemon uses its own raw power from setting up to force its way past its counters. There are rarely any choiced pokemon, and NEVER 2 choiced pokemon. Also, you don't have any pokemon setting up dual screens, so this team is, alas, standard offense.
    There are two team types. Offense and Defense.

    Does your team attempt to win by fainting the opponent through direct attacks? Then it is Offense.

    Do you attempt to win by minimizing damage and wearing your opponent down through entry hazards? Then you are running Defense.

    I know you kids like to make everything super-organized and name every little thing to make it easy to reference things. Hyper Offense, Semi-stall, Balance, Spikes Offense, Bulky Offense, etc but realistically it means nothing. In the real world even if his team doesn't fit your cookie cutter definition of "Heavy Offense" that doesn't invalidate it at all. His team is offensive. That is all you have to know.

    -Your team struggles with weather. And by that I mean "any moderately good weather team will beat you."
    No

    Azumarill can just straight up own you.
    1) No one uses Azumarill.
    2) Suicune counters the **** out of it.
    3) It is slow, relatively frail, and quickly falls to Spikes / Stealth Rocks.

    Other pokemon give you almost unbearable amounts of trouble, like Venusaur,
    Venusaur no threat if it runs HP Ice. If it runs HP Fire Dragonite counters it. If Sleep Powder ****s with him then worst case scenario Gengar deals 50-60% with HP Ice and can just Trick it, locking it into a move that he probably has an immunity or 4x resist to. Terrakion can Quick Attack for around 30% too.

    Lilligant,
    No one uses this. Also it can't get around the combo of Dnite / Genesect unless it has HP Rock and is lucky with Sleep Powder.

    Tangrowth,
    Tangrowth is used on less than 1% of teams and I can guarantee you that most of them are defensive, not sun sweepers.

    the two Drizzle Therians,
    This is actually true.

    Specs Tornadus flat out sweeps much of this team. Thundurus OHKOs everyone but Dragonite and Deoxys D with LO Thunder and outruns everyone after an Agility.

    and Scizor (who can pick off both of your choiced pokemon effortlessly, and trap Gengar).
    Scizor picks off a lot of things, that's why people use it.

    On the topic of Gengar, I assume your rebuttle for this comment is going to be "Gengar can Trick and cripple the opposing pokemon."Well he can, but you can only do that once. Chances are the opponent will have more than one pokemon that's going to give your team trouble.
    Wait what. "Scarf Trick is bad because your opponent might have two Pokemon to beat you?" No seriously that makes zero sense. 1 Pokemon threatening you is less than 2. Simple math.

    -Stall also kills you. You have no spinner, and no status cleric. "But I don't need a spinner because Deoxys-D has Magic Coat and Taunt!" No, you still need a spinner. It's incredibly easy to layer hazards, and if Deoxys isn't the pokemon in battle against the hazard layer, they're going to get a hazard up. That's a problem, because it breaks Dragonite's Multiscale, and it doesn't carry Roost or Substitute. It also wears Genesect down quickly due to it's Life Orb.
    If you want me to go further in detail, please ask. I can break down your team pokemon by pokemon.
    Ok for one no one really uses stall anymore, and even to the few that still do this team rapidly sets up on and devastates almost all examples of modern stall. He Spikes freely with Deoxys D, preventing opposing hazards. Terrakion is a nightmare to switch in on. Gengar Tricks something and blocks Rapid Spin (and luring in and killing stall that runs Starmie). Furthermore he has Crocune, whom has few counters on modern stall. Stall teams that rely on Sableye or Jirachi to beat CM Reuniclus get wrecked by CM Suicune.

    That's just flat out not true. Surely someone as talented as yourself must have other teams. If you ever want to battle on PO, you just message me, mkay? (:
    Ladder is meaningless. I've topped every major Smogon and PO ladder and mostly did so with bad teams. Did this guy actually reach #1 and #2? I don't know, maybe. The PO ladder is full of bad players and the PS ladder recently reset so getting #1 is easy. I believe a good enough player could ladder with this team but in the end it doesn't matter.

    He posted a team. Offer him advice. If you can't say anything useful get out of rate my team forum.


    I'll add something useful about the team later. I would now but... it's 5:30 in the morning.

  11. #11
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    How does a team with spikes, cb terrakion, and cro cune lose to stall wtf?

    Btw so this post isn't complete spam you could try offensive suicune with calm mind / hp electric / ice beam / hydro pump. It fits the tempo of this team a lot better anyways. Actually, you may even want to try out dual screens deo-d as that helps suicune a lot better, although spikes helps the rest of the team a lot more. You could also try sub split gengar or something and then run scarf terrak or even swtich genesect to scarf if you wanted to. It's slightly less pursuit bait and terrakion is really a more threatening scarfer anyways. gl!
    Last edited by AB2; 23rd October 2012 at 9:47 PM.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by _-_Blaze_-_ View Post
    Not a rate, but just posting to say that I own this exact Terrakion figurine, which I bought from Sogo in Hong Kong.

    Anyway, nice team.
    This is a battle. Of course it's gonna be unfair. That which is called 'battle' was a monster originally born of unfairness and intolerance. I can't stand that guy. I can beat that guy. I can't forgive that guy. We make enemies for all sorts of reasons, and from the moment you make an enemy, until one of you draws his last breath - you're in a battle.

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