Potential Pokemon Online Rock-Type Gym Leader Team

[AlexMonroe]

A friend of mine (BLAZEQUAZA) offered me a position in his upcoming pokemon league as a Rock-Type Gym Leader, and I was wondering if the team I'd put together would be a strong enough team to prevent mine from becoming the easiest gym ever.


Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Sand Stream
252 HP EVs, 252 Special Attack, and 4 Special Defense
Quiet
- Substitute
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam


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Cradily @ Leftovers
Storm Drain
252 HP EVs, 252 Defense, 4 Special Defense
Bold
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Recover
- Hidden Power (Fire)


-----


Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
Justified
4 HP EVs, 252 Attack, 252 Speed
Jolly
- Close Combat
- Earthquake
- X-Scissor
- Rock Slide


-----


Archeops @ Flying Gem
Defeatist
252 Attack EVs, 4 Special Defense, 252 Speed
Jolly
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn


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Aron @ Shell Bell
Sturdy
No EVS
Docile
- Endeavor
- Toxic
- Superpower
- Protect


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Omastar @ Life Orb
Swift Swim
104 HP EVs, 252 Special Attack, 152 Speed
Modest
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power (Grass)


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I really appreciate any advice you guys can give, and if you don't have time to write out a full review, just say something in the Poll above so I know generally what to look at (you can select as many as you feel necessary)


Thanks!
~AlexMonroe

[SkyDriver]

Will do more later, now just get rid of the focus bands, give Aero a sash, and Archeops a flight gem and: Acrobatics/Stone Edge/Earthquake/filler
Aero max speed and attack.
Add SDrain Cradily to deal with water types.
Shuckle is ... just not good in OU. Put Cradily here.

Full review coming soon.

[loco1234]

Biggest thing I can see is that it's better to work in multiples of 4 for the EVs. Instead of 255/255, go 252/252/4. The extra 1 point can be game-changing, believe it or not.

To be honest though, Rock is a really easy type to deal with.... Nearly every team carries something Grass-type and usually has a Water-type with Ice moves to boot. You'd do well to try and shore up those weaknesses. I've found that with a Monotype team (as this would be, regardless of tier) it's a really good idea to pick your Pokemon so that their secondary types shore up their shared type's weaknesses, as well as each other's. Pure types are of course usable, but you don't want too many per team.

Since you're using this for a Rock gym, I'd recommend a Sandstorm team centering around Tyranitar. Rock-types get an extra boost from the sand in the form of 1.5x SpD, so your team'll be somewhat bulkier Specially, although many Rocks have pitiful SpD to begin with. I'd use a lineup of something like:

Tyranitar / Cradily / Terrakion / Aerodactyl / Rhyperior / Omastar

I haven't gotten around to Mono-Rock yet, so this is pretty much brainstorming, but some sets I'd recommend:


Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
Quiet Nature (+SpA, -Spe)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Substitute
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam

This is a Tyranitar set I kinda just made up. I know T-Tar is more physically-inclined, but its SpA peaks at a nice 317, which is certainly usable. The reason it's Special is because Rock HAS no decent Special attackers outside Tyranitar and Omastar. And having 1 leaves you at the mercy of physical walls. Anyway, 101-subs are achieved with 252 HP EVs so Chansey and Blissey aren't breaking them with Seismic Toss. Dark Pulse does barely more than Crunch on this set, but barely more is still more. It's your STAB move and Ghost killer. Fire Blast is for Steels and Ice Beam handles Dragons and Gliscor. Gliscor laughs at Rock's physical attackers, so Omastar and Tyranitar are pretty much necessary to beat it. Feel free to change this all you want, it's just a basis. I haven't used it myself so I can't claim it works.


Cradily @ Leftovers
Trait: Storm Drain
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Recover
- Hidden Power Fire

Cradily is meh, but it does add a valuable Water immunity. Its defenses are respectable, but it has pitiful Spe. It's here more or less for the Water immunity, but it can take hits well with the Sandstorm boost and Recover. It's weak to common Ice moves though.


Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Justified
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Close Combat
- Earthquake
- X-Scissor
- Rock Slide

It's a pretty simple Scarfed revenge-killer, but Scarf Terrakion is a huge threat to be sure. There isn't much to explain here. Sorry, I get a bit lazy on descriptions when I'm rating xD


Archeops @ Flying Gem
Trait: Defeatist
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn

I'm suggesting Archeops because you don't need Aero to set Rocks with that T-Tar set. It can't run LO because of Defeatist and I don't really like 2 Choice users with redundant coverage, so the Acrobatics set is about Archeops's only good one here. It's also very straightforward, with the Flying Gem boosting the first Acrobatics and doubling the base power of all subsequent Acrobatics, which also get STAB. EQ and Stone Edge get great coverage and U-Turn is for scouting and because Archeops and Head Smash is a bad idea. Come to think of it, Archeops might be pretty good in Hackmons... I'll have to try that.


Rhyperior @ Leftovers
Trait: Solid Rock
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
EVs: 248 HP / 16 Atk / 244 SpD
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Tail
- Megahorn

This is a standard Rhyperior in UU with one change - Megahorn over Rocks. You have T-Tar for Rocks, so you don't need them here. EQ and Stone Edge, again, exist for coverage. Dragon Tail phazes and racks up Rocks damae. Megahorn was pretty much the best filler option I could find. Rhyperior can actually be really bulky in the sand, even Specially. And Solid Rock helps too by softening super-effective hits a bit. They do 75% of what they would normally, so Grass and Water are 3x instead of 4x xD still, every bit helps.


Omastar @ Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
Modest Nature
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Grass

It's a Shell Smash sweeper and also your Rain counter. Hydro Pump is really strong off doubled SpA with STAB in the rain, Ice Beam gets good coverage in OU and HP Grass deals with opposing bulky waters like Gastrodon.

[AlexMonroe]

I see that both of you are recommending Cradily, and eliminating Shuckle, so I'm going to trust that's a really good choice. Just curious, though. If I were to keep Shuckle, what would you suggest I do with it to make it better? It's kind of assigned as my "star pokemon", so to speak, in the league.

Also, is there a reason that you've only suggested 508 total EVs? Could I add 2 to the lowest of the three stats you told me?

I also see that Cradily, while designated as my anti-water pokemon, has no attacks super-effective against water. I know I can just wear it down while it suffers a lack of type effectiveness, but since most water types can have ice moves, shouldn't I have to way to get rid of them quickly WITH my anti-water pokemon?

Lastly, were you still saying you think Tyranitar should be my leading pokemon? I'm just worried that a pokemon with a dual weakness to fighting might be a little dangerous as a starter.

Thanks for all the advice, though, really
~AlexMonroe

[silverangel]

Tyrannitar would be great, as residual damage to your opponent is nice to have, as well as a 1.5 times special defense boost to all your pokes. Replace Gigalith with Tyrannitar, using Leftovers. Attacks may be Stealth Rock, Crunch, Stone Edge, and some filler.

You know a great sand pokemon? Level 1 FEAR Aron. No explanation, just use it. Item has to be Shell bell, ability Sturdy. And should have Endeavor/Toxic/filler/filler. Really, all the little guy needs is endeavor. Tyrannitar is a great team player, as he sets up sand and can kill all the ghosts that dare switch in on Aron.

That's all for now.

[loco1234]

I've suggested 508-spreads because the remaining 2 don't do anything. 4 EVs = 1 point. That's also why only 252 instead of 255, it's a waste of a point that could be placed elsewhere.

Attacks from Cradily won't do squat really. It's not a great choice, but it's the only Rock-type that takes Water moves well so it's basically mandatory. You can use Giga Drain if you want to but you'l need a Storm Drain boost to do much with it. HP Fire deals with Steels that wall you otherwise, so that's why I used it. All of these sets besides T-Tar's were taken straight from Smogon's site, their sets are well-known to work well. Not necessarily in OU/Monotype, but they work in their respective tiers.

Every Sandstorm team leads T-Tar (unless they run Hippowdon). You're playing Mono-Rock, you're going to have a Fighting problem anyway xD. Mono-Rock is at its best with Sandstorm. Tyranitar works fine as a lead, and Sand often packs Reuniclus as a Fighting answer. I understand that Mono-Rock can't do that of course, but you're probably best off with a Sand team for the SpD boost.

[AlexMonroe]

Thanks for the explanation on the 508, like I said, I'm new, I didn't know that it took 4 EVs for one stat boost

Also, I'm afraid Aron might need explanation. Sure, the whole endeavor / quick attack thing, but that doesn't really benefit me in the long run, unless I'm against a pokemon that's too tough to handle normally, but then I'm still one pokemon short. Also, what pokemon would you have me replace it with?

~AlexMonroe

[silverangel]

With sandstorm in place, and Aron taking damage so the enemy has 1 HP if they attack. As they have huge amounts of HP compared to level 1 Aron, and shell bell heals 1/8 of damage done, Aron will recover back 12 HP, and the sandstorm damage will kill them off, provided they are not immune. Still, it deal staggering damage to opponent's and each opponent taken down, Aron can face another at full health. Tyrannitar is the bane of all ghost types and kills them all for Aron.

Aron>Archeops
Tyrannitar>Gigalith

A Cradily can also help, as most of your team doesn't have reliable recovery, and Cradily can use Leech Seed (can it?)

Cradily>Aerodactyl (I think)

[AlexMonroe]

OH, okay, that explanation did help, and that actually is a brilliant idea

Thanks,
~AlexMonroe

[Ghosts of the Forums]

All the pokemn are bad. Every 4 Evs = +1 to a stat.

Full rate later

[silverangel]

^ why about half of them need to be replaced. Terrakion can replace Rhyperior as a physical sweeper

[Divine Retribution]

Biggest thing I can see is that it's better to work in multiples of 4 for the EVs. Instead of 255/255, go 252/252/4. The extra 1 point can be game-changing, believe it or not.

To be honest though, Rock is a really easy type to deal with.... Nearly every team carries something Grass-type and usually has a Water-type with Ice moves to boot. You'd do well to try and shore up those weaknesses. I've found that with a Monotype team (as this would be, regardless of tier) it's a really good idea to pick your Pokemon so that their secondary types shore up their shared type's weaknesses, as well as each other's. Pure types are of course usable, but you don't want too many per team.

Since you're using this for a Rock gym, I'd recommend a Sandstorm team centering around Tyranitar. Rock-types get an extra boost from the sand in the form of 1.5x SpD, so your team'll be somewhat bulkier Specially, although many Rocks have pitiful SpD to begin with. I'd use a lineup of something like:

Tyranitar / Cradily / Terrakion / Aerodactyl / Rhyperior / Omastar

I haven't gotten around to Mono-Rock yet, so this is pretty much brainstorming, but some sets I'd recommend:


Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
Quiet Nature (+SpA, -Spe)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
- Substitute
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam

This is a Tyranitar set I kinda just made up. I know T-Tar is more physically-inclined, but its SpA peaks at a nice 317, which is certainly usable. The reason it's Special is because Rock HAS no decent Special attackers outside Tyranitar and Omastar. And having 1 leaves you at the mercy of physical walls. Anyway, 101-subs are achieved with 252 HP EVs so Chansey and Blissey aren't breaking them with Seismic Toss. Dark Pulse does barely more than Crunch on this set, but barely more is still more. It's your STAB move and Ghost killer. Fire Blast is for Steels and Ice Beam handles Dragons and Gliscor. Gliscor laughs at Rock's physical attackers, so Omastar and Tyranitar are pretty much necessary to beat it. Feel free to change this all you want, it's just a basis. I haven't used it myself so I can't claim it works.


Cradily @ Leftovers
Trait: Storm Drain
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Recover
- Hidden Power Fire

Cradily is meh, but it does add a valuable Water immunity. Its defenses are respectable, but it has pitiful Spe. It's here more or less for the Water immunity, but it can take hits well with the Sandstorm boost and Recover. It's weak to common Ice moves though.


Terrakion @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Justified
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Close Combat
- Earthquake
- X-Scissor
- Rock Slide

It's a pretty simple Scarfed revenge-killer, but Scarf Terrakion is a huge threat to be sure. There isn't much to explain here. Sorry, I get a bit lazy on descriptions when I'm rating xD


Archeops @ Flying Gem
Trait: Defeatist
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-Turn

I'm suggesting Archeops because you don't need Aero to set Rocks with that T-Tar set. It can't run LO because of Defeatist and I don't really like 2 Choice users with redundant coverage, so the Acrobatics set is about Archeops's only good one here. It's also very straightforward, with the Flying Gem boosting the first Acrobatics and doubling the base power of all subsequent Acrobatics, which also get STAB. EQ and Stone Edge get great coverage and U-Turn is for scouting and because Archeops and Head Smash is a bad idea. Come to think of it, Archeops might be pretty good in Hackmons... I'll have to try that.


Rhyperior @ Leftovers
Trait: Solid Rock
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
EVs: 248 HP / 16 Atk / 244 SpD
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Tail
- Megahorn

This is a standard Rhyperior in UU with one change - Megahorn over Rocks. You have T-Tar for Rocks, so you don't need them here. EQ and Stone Edge, again, exist for coverage. Dragon Tail phazes and racks up Rocks damae. Megahorn was pretty much the best filler option I could find. Rhyperior can actually be really bulky in the sand, even Specially. And Solid Rock helps too by softening super-effective hits a bit. They do 75% of what they would normally, so Grass and Water are 3x instead of 4x xD still, every bit helps.


Omastar @ Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
Modest Nature
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Grass

It's a Shell Smash sweeper and also your Rain counter. Hydro Pump is really strong off doubled SpA with STAB in the rain, Ice Beam gets good coverage in OU and HP Grass deals with opposing bulky waters like Gastrodon.

He knows what he's talking about, really, so I'd back up everything he's said this far. However, I'm going to recommend another Rock type I've met huge success with before, Double Dancer Rhydon.

Rhydon @ Eviolite
Jolly - Rock Head
252 Speed, 252 Attack, 4 HP
-Sword's Dance
-Rock Polish
-Earthquake
-Stone Edge

In the Sand with an Eviolite equipped, this thing becomes ridiculously bulky. Like, easily survives Water and Grass attacks bulky. This makes it easy to set up a Rock Polish, and if necessary a Sword's Dance, and then sweep with Earthquake and Stone Edge.

[azeem40]

Use Swords Dance for defensive teams and Rock Polish for offensive teams, btw.

[Divine Retribution]

Use Swords Dance for defensive teams and Rock Polish for offensive teams, btw.

No, Double Dancer trumps both.

[silverangel]

But you still need to use one boosting move to trump a certain team. In this case, use Swords Dance, then attack on defensive teams. For offensive teams, use Rock Polish, then attack.

Anyone still think that Aron is a good pick for this team, even if it is a bit of a gimmick?

Yeah, Omastar counters rain. Kabutops also works, but it is more frail. Stick with Omastar.

Rhydon should go over Rhyperior, although I think a Rhyperior running the same set would also suffice, just with Leftovers over Eviolite.

If you do go for Aron, replace Archeops for it.

Ninetales and Abomasnow woulda not want to face Tyrannitar, and with Omastar and Cradily walling rain teams, you can get up sandstorm all you want.

Tyrannitar should run a mixed set. It can use Stone Edge and Crunch on one side, and Fire Blast on the other, as Omastar has Ice Beam for Gliscor.

Cradily could run a nice Subseed set, it really helps recovering your other team members, as well.

[Divine Retribution]

But you still need to use one boosting move to trump a certain team. In this case, use Swords Dance, then attack on defensive teams. For offensive teams, use Rock Polish, then attack.

Anyone still think that Aron is a good pick for this team, even if it is a bit of a gimmick?

Yeah, Omastar counters rain. Kabutops also works, but it is more frail. Stick with Omastar.

Rhydon should go over Rhyperior, although I think a Rhyperior running the same set would also suffice, just with Leftovers over Eviolite.

If you do go for Aron, replace Archeops for it.

Ninetales and Abomasnow woulda not want to face Tyrannitar, and with Omastar and Cradily walling rain teams, you can get up sandstorm all you want.

Tyrannitar should run a mixed set. It can use Stone Edge and Crunch on one side, and Fire Blast on the other, as Omastar has Ice Beam for Gliscor.

Cradily could run a nice Subseed set, it really helps recovering your other team members, as well.

Using Rhyperior over Rhydon means sacrificing Rhydon's reasonable Special bulk after the Eviolite boost. Even in the Sand, Rhyperior's Special Defense is still pretty crappy.

[azeem40]

No, Double Dancer trumps both.

I AM talking about on a Double Dancer set...

[silverangel]

Using Rhyperior over Rhydon means sacrificing Rhydon's reasonable Special bulk after the Eviolite boost. Even in the Sand, Rhyperior's Special Defense is still pretty crappy.

Yeah, but you get leftovers recovery, better HP, speed, and attack. Not much, it's still a gamble.

[Divine Retribution]

I AM talking about on a Double Dancer set...

Oh, sorry, I misinterpreted that. I thought you meant carrying either Rock Polish OR Sword's Dance.

[Dangerous36m]

Why not a trick room rock type team