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Thread: Pokemon X and Y's Effect on the Anime

  1. #1926
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    Quote Originally Posted by s2daam View Post
    I just don't think Cilan has the likeability across the whole fanbase to continue. Although really it's my personal choice, I just don't like Cilan and his personality.
    Cilan's very popular in Japan, which is the only country that really matters in terms of the anime.

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    Not to mention we don't need a third male sidekick who conveniently knows how to cook (At least not yet). Cilan is way too underdeveloped to just drop for someone who's probably gonna become underdeveloped like him.

    I say keep him for one more gen and then he can leave at the end of gen 6. This also works because Iris will have two friends to visit next gen during her cameo.

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    Or we have the novel idea of ash learning to cook for himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pokemonsquared View Post
    Or we have the novel idea of ash learning to cook for himself.
    I lol'd. xD pretty hard.
    When refering to learning..."In other words, groups are not where ideas are born. Groups are where ideas are evaluated."
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    Such a sexy song. Urgh.

  5. #1930

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    I am hoping they keep Cilan on the main cast, he has no real reason to leave by his own choice unless the brothers need his help at the gym but it does not look like they will, he definitely has the popularity in Japan at least and his story has not been truly resolved,where is the explanation for his fear of purloin, promotion to S rank connoisseur etc. ? Although they could possibly resolve his story in the last months of the Unova Saga. I am kind of hoping that Ash not have all three starters, but only 1 or 2, preferably the least marketable of the 3 as it seems that the more starters Ash has and the more marketable they are, the less their chance of evolving to their final form by the league. it would be nice if Ash's traveling companions received starters as they could market those starters while allowing Ash a more diverse team, this might allow increased potential for having at least 3 members of the permanent team fully evolved eventually
    And that day the entire Pokémon community exploded with rage...

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    There will not be any old characters in the X and Y anime. If TR leave at BW's end it will be Ash/Pikachu and that's it.

    Each generation has purged the older cast more and more. Only Dawn appeared in BW, only May appeared in DP, and Misty hasn't appeared since mid-AG. The cycle will continue.
    Just because something has higher probability to happen, doesn't mean how it will necessarily happen.

    In inductive reasoning there will always be present bias with people predicting outcomes based on past patterns, but outcome isn't always possible to accurately predict sometimes deriving from patterns established in past.

    For example people based on past two regions(AG and DP)how from now on we will always have female protagonists in cast as well contests. But that norm was broke with BW going back to OS formula.

    People based on Brock long stay how he will never leave cast, but that changed in BW.
    Same applies to generalization fandom created of main characters not being able to get too powerful fully evolved pokemon like Dragonite causing "dis balance in cast", but that was changed with Iris who has indeed received Dragonite.

    To lesser degree same can be applied to previous minor characters like Jessibelle , Gary, Jasmine or Giovanni in BW who got returned crushing down established theory among fans how "long absence proves we wont be seeing them again".

    So while probability ratio is on your side supporting thesis how older characters wont come back to main cast in 6th generation, there always exists chance that writers break pattern in forming cast as well deciding to capitalize on already established characters which proven to posses appeal and popularity to hook people onto show.

    Anime follows same predictable formula for too long turning people away and this becomes clearer than ever with constant decline in popularity emphasizing on said issue. As disappointment and negative fan reception increases this starts to reflect negatively on sales, ratings and show reputation accelerating process toward changes with attempt of restoring people faith in certain show and popularity required to keep things running smoothly.

    Something which is especially noticeable lately with all those overly hyped returns like Dawn, classic pokemon like Charizard, inclusion of N in Team Plasma arc etc. seeming like attempt to bring boost to ratings and make watchers more interested toward anime.

    So sooner or later we cannot exclude possibility of writers reconsidering reuse of popular older companions(like Misty, May, Brock, Max etc) at some point as well.
    With incentive of taking advantage of those which already have established popularity guaranteeing flux of older age demographic toward show while giving to new generations opportunity to get familiar with past characters which influenced Ash life and better comprehend show history. As well bringing breeze of fresh air by providing something new in form of doing continuation on already established, experienced companion taking him forward through more substantial growth.

    As opposite to cliched, overused formula or constantly adding new girls going through basic, relatively simplified routine which is anything but exciting and fresh at this point.
    Judging by hype older characters create attracting different age groups toward show, utilizing them in more notable manner could show to be good move for writers and producers to take.
    Last edited by pokemon fan 132; 21st February 2013 at 12:13 PM.

  7. #1932
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    There will not be any old characters in the X and Y anime. If TR leave at BW's end it will be Ash/Pikachu and that's it.

    Each generation has purged the older cast more and more. Only Dawn appeared in BW, only May appeared in DP, and Misty hasn't appeared since mid-AG. The cycle will continue.
    Dawn, Cynthia, Looker, Ash's Charizard and Muk appeared in BW.
    Jasmine, Growlie, Jessibelle, May, and even the Jenny of Viridian City appeared in DP .

    There will still be older characters.

    If Cilan stays with Ash, then Burgundy is a very likely candidate to continue to show up. Iris will get her mandatory girl return. If it's PokeFrance, then Fantina is likely to return especially if they bring back contests into the anime. Stop saying things as fact. Ash sure did win the Sinnoh League and entered the Champion League right? As well as own the Unova League and won the Champion league right?


    Quote Originally Posted by HatersGonnaHate View Post
    Not to mention we don't need a third male sidekick who conveniently knows how to cook (At least not yet). Cilan is way too underdeveloped to just drop for someone who's probably gonna become underdeveloped like him.

    I say keep him for one more gen and then he can leave at the end of gen 6. This also works because Iris will have two friends to visit next gen during her cameo.
    I agree. Also with two friends it doesn't feel as bland as Dawn's visit. At least Misty and May had both Ash and Brock to reminisce.



  8. #1933
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Taidow_ View Post

    I agree. Also with two friends it doesn't feel as bland as Dawn's visit. At least Misty and May had both Ash and Brock to reminisce.
    LOL, what? Neither Misty nor May interacted with Brock much during their cameos.

  9. #1934

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    LOL, what? Neither Misty nor May interacted with Brock much during their cameos.
    Right off the back i remember May giving first returning and giving Brock a wooden Teddiursa doll. There was definetly more interactions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    Right off the back i remember May giving first returning and giving Brock a wooden Teddiursa doll. There was definetly more interactions.
    Yeah, but that was about it. In Misty's Togetic episodes did she interact with Brock at all?

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    I really don't want Cilan to stay. It just screams DP trio to me if they do bring in a new girl. Just have Iris and Cilan both visit at the same time. Sorry but I don't want either Cilan or Iris being on the main cast past Gen 5. They both can get cameos, no problem, but main cast wise, I do not want.

    But if they do keep Cilan and bring in a new girl who is active, do not blame her when Cilan begins to fail. It won't be her fault.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    Yeah, but that was about it. In Misty's Togetic episodes did she interact with Brock at all?
    As far as i recall Brock asked her how are things back at gym and Cerulean , Misty also teased him about girls dragging him of from princess Sarah multiple times which unfortunately influenced Max starting to copy it in more lame way. I also remember Misty being worried about Ash and Brock safety when they battled Hanson and there was some small interacting at goodbye scene when departing of again.

    So yes, there were definitely some interactions going on between Misty and Brock in her cameo.

  13. #1938

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    Yeah, but that was about it. In Misty's Togetic episodes did she interact with Brock at all?
    I can't remember if she went out her way specifically to have a conversation only they could have, but i do remember her talking to both Ash and Brock, mentioning both of their names whenever she asked a question such as how are you. I think she mentioned to him to lay down on chasing after the girls if i remember right.

    I'll have to rewatch at some point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    I really don't want Cilan to stay. It just screams DP trio to me if they do bring in a new girl. Just have Iris and Cilan both visit at the same time. Sorry but I don't want either Cilan or Iris being on the main cast past Gen 5. They both can get cameos, no problem, but main cast wise, I do not want.

    But if they do keep Cilan and bring in a new girl who is active, do not blame her when Cilan begins to fail. It won't be her fault.
    Cilan shouldn't fail in another saga considering the writers don't purposely ignore him like they did with Brock in DP. The writers MADE the fans want to get rid of Brock in DP because they refused to give him barely any development episodes or team change since the beginning of the saga. Ridiculous.

    Brock was entertaining in Kanto, Johto and Hoenn, it's during the end of Battle Frontier and the rest of Diamond and Pearl that he got boring because of the writers (notice how i'm stressing it's the writers fault?).

    Cilan will be fine for another saga, possibly a third if need be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    I can't remember if she went out her way specifically to have a conversation only they could have, but i do remember her talking to both Ash and Brock, mentioning both of their names whenever she asked a question such as how are you. I think she mentioned to him to lay down on chasing after the girls if i remember right.

    I'll have to rewatch at some point.



    Cilan shouldn't fail in another saga considering the writers don't purposely ignore him like they did with Brock in DP. The writers MADE the fans want to get rid of Brock in DP because they refused to give him barely any development episodes or team change since the beginning of the saga. Ridiculous.

    Brock was entertaining in Kanto, Johto and Hoenn, it's during the end of Battle Frontier and the rest of Diamond and Pearl that he got boring because of the writers (notice how i'm stressing it's the writers fault?).

    Cilan will be fine for another saga, possibly a third if need be.
    Another reason Brock stopped working is because he was already a established character in the show who didn't need all the focus because they already gave him a backstory on who he is and what he does. This is why it was easy to ignore him and give new characters focus. Cilan will fall into that category if he goes to gen 6. If you think they won't shaft him for marketable new shiny gen 6 characters, think again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    Another reason Brock stopped working is because he was already a established character in the show who didn't need all the focus because they already gave him a backstory on who he is and what he does. This is why it was easy to ignore him and give new characters focus. Cilan will fall into that category if he goes to gen 6. If you think they won't shaft him for marketable new shiny gen 6 characters, think again.
    You say that as if it gives you ground to stand on. Brock wasn't boring in Kanto, Johto or Hoenn. If his character was already established in Kanto then why did he still get development, captures and evolutions in those regions? The writers didn't do anything with Brock in DP and THAT is why he felt boring, stale and had run his course. Exactly what the writers wanted.

    It won't happen to Cilan in the following saga or any other saga for that matter as long as the writers interact him in the plots more, give him development and captures/evolutions. Brock didn't get any of this in DP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    You say that as if it gives you ground to stand on. Brock wasn't boring in Kanto, Johto or Hoenn. If his character was already established in Kanto then why did he still get development, captures and evolutions in those regions? The writers didn't do anything with Brock in DP and THAT is why he felt boring, stale and had run his course. Exactly what the writers wanted.

    It won't happen to Cilan in the following saga or any other saga for that matter as long as the writers interact him in the plots more, give him development and captures/evolutions. Brock didn't get any of this in DP.
    I don't know why you think Cilan will be treated better then Brock. Nothing points to it. Pokemon is all about marketing. Just because the next region has France elements doesn't mean Cilan has a high chance of staying. Contest made it to gen 4, but May didn't follow as a main character. I don't believe the writers purposely tried to screw Brock, if they wanted to they could have dropped him without bringing him to Sinnoh. And what makes you think Cilan will be involved in plots when we have new characters for that?

    XY is going to be on a new system in a new era. They are not going to advertise it with a old character who's probably not even going to be in the game. And don't bring up Ash, because that situation is different. I'm not saying Cilan won't make it to the next region because he could, heck Iris could stay. I'm saying IMO, it would be a mistake if we have Ash, Cilan, new girl. It's funny because many of the people who suggest it don't like the DP cast, yet you are more then likely going to have a cast just like that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    Just because the next region has France elements doesn't mean Cilan has a high chance of staying.
    Huh? I never said Cilan would stay because of that. I WANT him to stay because he's been a short lived character, he's entertaining as a character and if he is really Brock's reincarnation then he'll be around for longer than one small saga.

    Contest made it to gen 4, but May didn't follow as a main character.
    So how is this related to Cilan staying?

    I don't believe the writers purposely tried to screw Brock, if they wanted to they could have dropped him without bringing him to Sinnoh.
    Eh, maybe they didn't purposely do it. But if they didn't, then they really are terrible writers because no character deserves that sort of treatment.

    And what makes you think Cilan will be involved in plots when we have new characters for that?
    Because Brock had new plots in Johto and Hoenn despite their being new characters for them.

    XY is going to be on a new system in a new era. They are not going to advertise it with a old character who's probably not even going to be in the game.
    Are you aware of how stupid this statement is? Brock was in Johto, Hoenn, Sinnoh, he only appeared in Gold, Silver and Crystal during he time of Johto, yet he was in Hoenn and Sinnoh despite no game appearance. Did Misty, May and Dawn's return mean nothing? They weren't in the games either.

    And don't bring up Ash, because that situation is different.
    It's not different.

    What you're arguing is that new characters can replace the old characters for each saga because of the new in-game characters and elements. In that case we should of had a new main character every saga.

    I'm not saying Cilan won't make it to the next region because he could, heck Iris could stay.
    I'm not saying he will stay either since he couldn't, it's just what i want to happen.

    I'm saying IMO, it would be a mistake if we have Ash, Cilan, new girl. It's funny because many of the people who suggest it don't like the DP cast, yet you are more then likely going to have a cast just like that.
    Brock in DP was bad, in Johto and Hoenn he was fine. It could work again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    II don't believe the writers purposely tried to screw Brock, if they wanted to they could have dropped him without bringing him to Sinnoh. And what makes you think Cilan will be involved in plots when we have new characters for that?
    I don't believe that either, its more fact how DP unlike previous series had two instead of one main star with most focus being distributed among them causing other characters like Brock to fall in obscurity. Because of unbalanced division of focus this caused several rivals and pokemon to suffer from lack of focus as well.

    In Hoenn we had two new character and Brock worked just fine receiving more screen time, pokemon captures and development than he did in Johto.

    So in case next girl wont have role of co-star like Dawn did more likely than not this wont affect amount of focus Cilan as character would receive getting just as much as he did in BW, if not even more. Due to writers having additional region on their hands to develop more character and do something with him.

    XY is going to be on a new system in a new era. They are not going to advertise it with a old character who's probably not even going to be in the game. And don't bring up Ash, because that situation is different. I'm not saying Cilan won't make it to the next region because he could, heck Iris could stay. I'm saying IMO, it would be a mistake if we have Ash, Cilan, new girl. It's funny because many of the people who suggest it don't like the DP cast, yet you are more then likely going to have a cast just like that.
    Usually when character from previous generation goes on next generation writers use him along with new ones to promote new games. For same reason Ash and Brock received new pokemon with starters from 3rd gen being divided among main cast, tried out new features like contests, pokeringer, pokemon maze etc, with writers making sure that they have marketing value going in accordance with message new generation tried to promote.

    Needless to say its in writers interest to make all, not only new characters appealing and well accepted among new generation of viewers putting effort into their growth, story, pokemon etc.

    Working under presumption how Cilan in case of staying will deliberately be shafted and "demolished" as character just to show new companion down people troth as much as possible is ridiculous and rather naive in my opinion. Especially if there exists more than enough space and time to give everyone in cast reasonable amount of focus.

    Their aim is in capturing viewers interest for characters they introduce

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    Huh? I never said Cilan would stay because of that. I WANT him to stay because he's been a short lived character, he's entertaining as a character and if he is really Brock's reincarnation then he'll be around for longer than one small saga.



    So how is this related to Cilan staying?



    Eh, maybe they didn't purposely do it. But if they didn't, then they really are terrible writers because no character deserves that sort of treatment.



    Because Brock had new plots in Johto and Hoenn despite their being new characters for them.



    Are you aware of how stupid this statement is? Brock was in Johto, Hoenn, Sinnoh, he only appeared in Gold, Silver and Crystal during he time of Johto, yet he was in Hoenn and Sinnoh despite no game appearance. Did Misty, May and Dawn's return mean nothing? They weren't in the games either.



    It's not different.

    What you're arguing is that new characters can replace the old characters for each saga because of the new in-game characters and elements. In that case we should of had a new main character every saga.



    I'm not saying he will stay either since he couldn't, it's just what i want to happen.



    Brock in DP was bad, in Johto and Hoenn he was fine. It could work again.
    Brock didn't have new plots in Johto and Hoenn, they were the same plots he always had. Hoenn had a 4 person group so there was always someone there for Brock to play off of, whether it was May or Max it didn't matter. A four person group helped the AG cast and it's a reason why they were so popular. Take away Max, and get May into her contest and Brock could have easily gone the way of DP Brock. By the way Brock did stuff in DP. The Croagunk festival, changing his goals to be a doctor, being more involved with Team Galactic then he ever was Magma and Aqua. So don't say they didn't do anything with Brock in DP.

    As far as Brock in Johto and Hoenn being fine. I personally thought Brock was flat in Johto as well, Hoenn was half and half I only liked him more in that because he had Max to interact with. But again if you think Cilan will be as marketable as new characters, he won't be. Cilan's lack of Pokemon is no different then DP Brock's. I don't care if Cilan stays or goes. If he is the reincarnated Brock as you said, then he'll run out of steam like the real Brock and people will grow bored of him like the real one. Then the new character on the main cast will take the heat for it as will the main cast. I think Pokemon should keep what they are doing and just bring in new cast members so we never get to the point of Brock ever again.
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  20. #1945

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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    Brock didn't have new plots in Johto and Hoenn, they were the same plots he always had. Hoenn had a 4 person group so there was always someone there for Brock to play off of, whether it was May or Max it didn't matter. A four person group helped the AG cast and it's a reason why they were so popular. Take away Max, and get May into her contest and Brock could have easily gone the way of DP Brock. By the way Brock did stuff in DP. The Croagunk festival, changing his goals to be a doctor, being more involved with Team Galactic then he ever was Magma and Aqua. So don't say they didn't do anything with Brock in DP.

    As far as Brock in Johto and Hoenn being fine. I personally thought Brock was flat in Johto as well, Hoenn was half and half I only liked him more in that because he had Max to interact with. But again if you think Cilan will be as marketable as new characters, he won't be. Cilan's lack of Pokemon is no different then DP Brock's. I don't care if Cilan stays or goes. If he is the reincarnated Brock as you said, then he'll run out of steam like the real Brock and people will grow bored of him like the real one. Then the new character on the main cast will take the heat for it as will the main cast. I think Pokemon should keep what they are doing and just bring in new cast members so we never get to the point of Brock ever again.
    Ugh, we really are going around in circles with this.

    Brock only got stale in DP. He had a few plots in the 191 episodes, it wasn't enough to make him entertaining unfortunately as a tonne of people grew tired of him and wanted him to leave. In Johto and Hoenn, he was still entertaining and this can evidently be seen from the fact not everybody wanted him to leave at that point.

    Cilan could last another saga i can almost guarantee it considering he isn't treated how Brock was in DP.

    Anyhow, i want Cilan to stay, he might or he might not. Neither of us know.

    I'm done now, that's all i have to say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pokemonsquared View Post
    Or we have the novel idea of ash learning to cook for himself.
    Or they can just always make a robot travel around with Ash and the girl to be able to cook for them. Cooking can be done by anything and anyone. It is not a means to justify anyone for staying on the show.

    You say that as if it gives you ground to stand on. Brock wasn't boring in Kanto, Johto or Hoenn. If his character was already established in Kanto then why did he still get development, captures and evolutions in those regions? The writers didn't do anything with Brock in DP and THAT is why he felt boring, stale and had run his course. Exactly what the writers wanted.

    It won't happen to Cilan in the following saga or any other saga for that matter as long as the writers interact him in the plots more, give him development and captures/evolutions. Brock didn't get any of this in DP.
    Uh, Brock was boring in Johto as well. The reason why no one cares in Kanto is because everyone thought that no one other than Ash had a reason to do something back then. Doesn't mean Cilan should suffer like Brock did.

    Brock only got stale in DP. He had a few plots in the 191 episodes, it wasn't enough to make him entertaining unfortunately as a tonne of people grew tired of him and wanted him to leave. In Johto and Hoenn, he was still entertaining and this can evidently be seen from the fact not everybody wanted him to leave at that point.
    No he was stale in Hoenn too. The only reason the group worked was because Max was a little kid with no pokemon. but if he had gotten one or if Max was older than he would be just as bad as in DP.

    But let me stop talking about characters that have nothing to do with XY. I hope they just have a new cast so that this can all stop. I'm tired of the same thing each year. I'm glad that the cast changes from time to time because since Ash isn't going anywhere, it makes you atleast want to keep watching it.
    Last edited by Caseydia; 21st February 2013 at 5:16 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Caseydia View Post
    Or they can just always make a robot travel around with Ash and the girl to be able to cook for them. Cooking can be done by anything and anyone. It is not a means to justify anyone for staying on the show.



    Uh, Brock was boring in Johto as well. The reason why no one cares in Kanto is because everyone thought that no one other than Ash had a reason to do something back then. Doesn't mean Cilan should suffer like Brock did.



    No he was stale in Hoenn too. The only reason the group worked was because Max was a little kid with no pokemon. but if he had gotten one or if Max was older than he would be just as bad as in DP.

    But let me stop talking about characters that have nothing to do with XY. I hope they just have a new cast so that this can all stop. I'm tired of the same thing each year. I'm glad that the cast changes from time to time because since Ash isn't going anywhere, it makes you atleast want to keep watching it.
    I also don't want to talk about anyone not involved with XY on this thread. The only thing is Cilan and Iris may very well return on the cast in XY. I don't want that, but it could happen. I personally want a clean slate. I know Ash is staying but as long as the new characters are likable, active with a quest to actually raise, train, and battle with Pokemon and keep me interested I can live with him still there. New characters are all I have to look forward to in Pokemon anymore.

    As far as the cook goes, let a Pokemon on the main cast cook. Why not? We had Croagunk take over the tired old gag of dealing with Brock when he flirts and it worked. Let Froakie be the team's chef and make it love cooking and when it first cooks for the group the food sucks and they order out. Froakie get's it's feelings hurt and thus gets better at cooking food as the series progresses rather then being a excellent chef at the start like Brock and Cilan.
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    I'd rather have N be the 3rd companion instead of Cilan tbh. If Cilan stays he will start to feel like Brock, if he just stays in the background again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    I also don't want to talk about anyone not involved with XY on this thread. The only thing is Cilan and Iris may very well return on the cast in XY. I don't want that, but it could happen. I personally want a clean slate. I know Ash is staying but as long as the new characters are likable, active with a quest to actually raise, train, and battle with Pokemon and keep me interested I can live with him still there. New characters are all I have to look forward to in Pokemon anymore.

    As far as the cook goes, let a Pokemon on the main cast cook. Why not? We had Croagunk take over the tired old gag of dealing with Brock when he flirts and it worked. Let Froakie be the team's chef and make it love cooking and when it first cooks for the group the food sucks and they order out. Froakie get's it's feelings hurt and thus gets better at cooking food as the series progresses rather then being a excellent chef at the start like Brock and Cilan.
    I don't want either to be in XY at all. They need to start fresh. I mean the writing. Plus, there is Iris's Dragonite, that would not work on the cast. I just want something different. Maybe have a pokemon that can cook or maybe have Ash just make peanut butter and honey sandwiches or something so that the writers can make a decent second main boy for a change.

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    Jeez people, the only reason for CIlan to stay is for the fangirls to get more of his voice. Nothing else besides inference suggests otherwise.

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